22 major reasons to abandon the Premil doctrine

[Truther]

As every argument you present is addressed and exposed you move onto another lie. This sums up your theology.

This will be enlightening reading for a new-be. They will see who has the truth and who is talking nonsense.

Bloviating.

 

[Truther]

There were saints in

The woman is Israel,as pointed out in Josephs dream. Gen 37:9
The child Israel brings forth is Christ.
When has Christ ruled with a rod of iron?
Not until he rules in the millennium.

Exactly!!!

 

[WPM]

Bingo.

Now I got you.

You teach replacement theology.

Here is your only way out of it now....

Hebrews 10:15-17​

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King James Version​

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15 Whereof the Holy Ghost also is a witness to us: for after that he had said before,
16 This is the covenant that I will make with them after those days, saith the Lord, I will put my laws into their hearts, and in their minds will I write them;
17 And their sins and iniquities will I remember no more.


This is all the church gets included into per the promise to the fathers.

That's it.

This is exactly why gifts of the Spirit are partial and we see through a "welders mask" today.

It is the Word that is your greatest enemy. You seem unable to exegete Scripture. All we have is your fly-by insults. The New Testament clearly and repeatedly shows that we (the Church of Jesus Christ throughout the world) are the true Jews, the true circumcision (Romans 2:25-29; Philippians 3:3 and Colossians 2:11) and the true Israel (Romans 11:17; 11:24-25 and Ephesians 2:10-19) and the true children of Abraham (Romans 4:11; 4:13-15; 4:16-18; 9:6-8; Galatians 3:7-9; 3:12-14; 3:16 and 3:26-29) today. We have been grafted in! Scripture makes clear that upon salvation we become citizens of the heavenly Jerusalem (true Jerusalem), which is also called Mount Zion (or God’s Sion). We see this in Matthew 21:42-46; John 3:3; Romans 9:33; 11:26; Ephesians 1:3; Ephesians 2:4-6; Philippians 3:20; Hebrews 12:22 and 1 Peter 2:5-10. These unambiguous, explicit and repeated Scriptures make that abundantly clear.

 

[Truther]

Is that what I said? No. You clearly have a very serious reading comprehension problem. You keep asking me questions like this that don't apply to what I had said.

What is the point of this question? Are you trying to say that you think the parables Jesus told were of true stories that actually happened? You think the parable of the sower really happened as if it's talking a real event where a sower literally sowed seed, etc.? If so....LOL.

Okay, so you admit that the parable of the sower Jesus spoke of was an actual historic event?

 

[Spiritual Israelite]

Bingo.

Now I got you.

Stop playing games, kid. You didn't get me. I have nothing to hide.

You teach replacement theology.

How do you define that? Who is being replaced and who is replacing them?

Here is your only way out of it now....

I'm not trying to get out of anything. My goodness, you are such an immature child.

Hebrews 10:15-17​

​

King James Version​

​

​

15 Whereof the Holy Ghost also is a witness to us: for after that he had said before,
16 This is the covenant that I will make with them after those days, saith the Lord, I will put my laws into their hearts, and in their minds will I write them;
17 And their sins and iniquities will I remember no more.


This is all the church gets included into per the promise to the fathers.

That's it.

This is exactly why gifts of the Spirit are partial and we see through a "welders mask" today.

What is your point here? Yes, we get included in the promises God made originally to Israel. So, why do you act as if we're not included in those promises? No one is being replaced. We (Gentile believers) are being added to Israelite believers and together we are one body in Christ.

 

[Truther]

It is the Word that is your greatest enemy. You seem unable to exegete Scripture. All we have is your fly-by insults. The New Testament clearly and repeatedly shows that we (the Church of Jesus Christ throughout the world) are the true Jews, the true circumcision (Romans 2:25-29; Philippians 3:3 and Colossians 2:11) and the true Israel (Romans 11:17; 11:24-25 and Ephesians 2:10-19) and the true children of Abraham (Romans 4:11; 4:13-15; 4:16-18; 9:6-8; Galatians 3:7-9; 3:12-14; 3:16 and 3:26-29) today. We have been grafted in! Scripture makes clear that upon salvation we become citizens of the heavenly Jerusalem (true Jerusalem), which is also called Mount Zion (or God’s Sion). We see this in Matthew 21:42-46; John 3:3; Romans 9:33; 11:26; Ephesians 1:3; Ephesians 2:4-6; Philippians 3:20; Hebrews 12:22 and 1 Peter 2:5-10. These unambiguous, explicit and repeated Scriptures make that abundantly clear.

You missed it.

We cannot replace future national Israel.

We are only included in their future promise, in a partial way.

This is why folks leave our services in most cases, not healed.

In the 1000 year reign of Christ, all will be healed and all mankind will know Him.

Even per Jer 31, witnessing "know the Lord" will cease, for every human being will know him.

And you thought God was teasing and it would not really happen?

 

[WPM]

Nearly all of Christendom teaches replacement theology, wittingly or unwittingly.

If you search the NT you will see that the true children of Abraham are only those of the household of faith (Romans 4:11, Romans 4:16-18, Romans 4:13-15, Romans 9:6-8, Galatians 3:7-9, Galatians 3:12-14, Galatians 3:16 and Galatians 3:26-29) today.

The teaching of the Church for most of its history has rejected the idea that there is any theologically distinction between Jews and Gentiles in Christ during the new covenant era. They believe there has only ever been one spiritual people from the start. These believers do not claim to hold to “Replacement Theology,” but rather ‘Expansion Theology’ meaning there is a continuity between God’s people in the Old and New Testament. Other terms describe the same position like ‘Continuity Theology’, ‘Inclusion Theology’ and ‘Remnant Theology’. Some use comparable expressions like ‘Addition Theology’ or ‘Fulfilment Theology’. Another lesser-used expression is ‘Messianic Fulfillment Theology’. Regardless of which one of these phrases is preferred, its advocates believe that the New Testament Church (assembly) is not a replacement of Israel, neither is it a new Israel, but it is an extension and continuation of true faithful Israel. This is supported by the fact that the inception of the new covenant didn’t mark the end of the Abrahamic lineage of faith but rather the enlargement of the same.

 

[WPM]

You missed it.

We cannot replace future national Israel.

We are only included in their future promise, in a partial way.

This is why folks leave our services in most cases, not healed.

In the 1000 year reign of Christ, all will be healed and all mankind will know Him.

Even per Jer 31, witnessing "know the Lord" will cease, for every human being will know him.

And you thought God was teasing and it would not really happen?

Romans 9:6-13: “For they are not all Israel, which are of Israel: Neither, because they are the seed of Abraham, are they all children: but, In Isaac shall thy seed be called. That is, they which are the children of the flesh, these are not the children of God: but the children of the promise are counted for the seed.”

What this is saying is, those who are not saved have no right to consider themselves as true Israel. The apostle here identifies two Israels; one elect and believing, the other lost and unbelieving. One is true spiritual Israel (“the children of God”/“the children of the promise”), the other is unbelieving and merely “children of the flesh.” Basically: national theocratic Israel was a political entity in which a believing spiritual remnant – true Israel – abode. It is only those Jews who belong to the remnant that are true Israelis in God’s eyes.

Jesus also exposed those who boast that they are Jews but who are not. He exposed them as those “which say they are Jews, and are not, but are the synagogue of Satan” (Revelation 2:9, 3:9). This demonstrates that biology alone is insufficient to class one as a real Jew. Natural Jews must be followers of Jesus Christ to be legitimate and acceptable spiritual Jews in God’s eyes. It is important that believers recognize the difference between national Israel and true Israel in both testaments or they may become confused with the unfolding of God’s plan in the New Testament.

 

[Truther]

Stop playing games, kid. You didn't get me. I have nothing to hide.


How do you define that? Who is being replaced and who is replacing them?


I'm not trying to get out of anything. My goodness, you are such an immature child.


What is your point here? Yes, we get included in the promises God made originally to Israel. So, why do you act as if we're not included in those promises? No one is being replaced. We (Gentile believers) are being added to Israelite believers and together we are one body in Christ.

So, do you think that God will save every last person in Israel when he returns per this?...

31 Behold, the days come, saith the Lord, that I will make a new covenant with the house of Israel, and with the house of Judah:

32 Not according to the covenant that I made with their fathers in the day that I took them by the hand to bring them out of the land of Egypt; which my covenant they brake, although I was an husband unto them, saith the Lord:

33 But this shall be the covenant that I will make with the house of Israel; After those days, saith the Lord, I will put my law in their inward parts, and write it in their hearts; and will be their God, and they shall be my people.

34 And they shall teach no more every man his neighbour, and every man his brother, saying, Know the Lord: for they shall all know me, from the least of them unto the greatest of them, saith the Lord: for I will forgive their iniquity, and I will remember their sin no more.

 

[St. Joseph]

You missed it.

We cannot replace future national Israel.

We are only included in their future promise, in a partial way.

This is why folks leave our services in most cases, not healed.

In the 1000 year reign of Christ, all will be healed and all mankind will know Him.

Even per Jer 31, witnessing "know the Lord" will cease, for every human being will know him.

And you thought God was teasing and it would not really happen?

Why are you arguing with a child? Just let him run and play.

 

[Spiritual Israelite]

Okay, so you admit that the parable of the sower Jesus spoke of was an actual historic event?

LOL! No, I'm going to admit something that isn't true. It's a made up story to illustrate the different types of responses there are to the preaching of the gospel in a way that can be understood. Are you really this dense or are you putting me on?

Let's take this parable for instance:

Matthew 13:47 Again, the kingdom of heaven is like unto a net, that was cast into the sea, and gathered of every kind: 48 Which, when it was full, they drew to shore, and sat down, and gathered the good into vessels, but cast the bad away. 49 So shall it be at the end of the world: the angels shall come forth, and sever the wicked from among the just, 50 And shall cast them into the furnace of fire: there shall be wailing and gnashing of teeth.

Do you think this is talking about someone literally casting a fishing net that literally gathers "every kind" of fish in it? That would have to be the biggest fishing net imaginable if this was talking about a real event. LOL.

 

[Truther]

Romans 9:6-13: “For they are not all Israel, which are of Israel: Neither, because they are the seed of Abraham, are they all children: but, In Isaac shall thy seed be called. That is, they which are the children of the flesh, these are not the children of God: but the children of the promise are counted for the seed.”

What this is saying is, those who are not saved have no right to consider themselves as true Israel. The apostle here identifies two Israels; one elect and believing, the other lost and unbelieving. One is true spiritual Israel (“the children of God”/“the children of the promise”), the other is unbelieving and merely “children of the flesh.” Basically: national theocratic Israel was a political entity in which a believing spiritual remnant – true Israel – abode. It is only those Jews who belong to the remnant that are true Israelis in God’s eyes.

Jesus also exposed those who boast that they are Jews but who are not. He exposed them as those “which say they are Jews, and are not, but are the synagogue of Satan” (Revelation 2:9, 3:9). This demonstrates that biology alone is insufficient to class one as a real Jew. Natural Jews must be followers of Jesus Christ to be legitimate and acceptable spiritual Jews in God’s eyes. It is important that believers recognize the difference between national Israel and true Israel in both testaments or they may become confused with the unfolding of God’s plan in the New Testament.

You still missed it.

Now, I am speaking of the return of Christ causing this event to future national Israel...


31 Behold, the days come, saith the Lord, that I will make a new covenant with the house of Israel, and with the house of Judah:

32 Not according to the covenant that I made with their fathers in the day that I took them by the hand to bring them out of the land of Egypt; which my covenant they brake, although I was an husband unto them, saith the Lord:

33 But this shall be the covenant that I will make with the house of Israel; After those days, saith the Lord, I will put my law in their inward parts, and write it in their hearts; and will be their God, and they shall be my people.

34 And they shall teach no more every man his neighbour, and every man his brother, saying, Know the Lord: for they shall all know me, from the least of them unto the greatest of them, saith the Lord: for I will forgive their iniquity, and I will remember their sin no more.


Read it carefully and tell me which part cannot happen to them.

 

[WPM]

You missed it.

We cannot replace future national Israel.

We are only included in their future promise, in a partial way.

This is why folks leave our services in most cases, not healed.

In the 1000 year reign of Christ, all will be healed and all mankind will know Him.

Even per Jer 31, witnessing "know the Lord" will cease, for every human being will know him.

And you thought God was teasing and it would not really happen?

You are all over the place! You are unable to think outside of what you have been taught. Your posts are devoid of depth and truth. There is no doubt that the Jews were the main focus of Christ’s earthly ministry. That situation continued on for a while throughout the book of Acts. But redemption didn’t stop there. His sheep were not limited to the house of Israel. His heart for Israel did not in any way diminish His intention to reach the Gentile nations with salvation. Jesus said prior to the cross, speaking to His Jewish converts, in John 10:14-16, “I am the good shepherd, and know my sheep, and am known of mine. As the Father knoweth me, even so know I the Father: and I lay down my life for the sheep. And other sheep I have, which are not of this fold: them also I must bring, and they shall hear my voice; and there shall be one fold, and one shepherd.”

The continuation of the believing Israeli flock, and its morphing into the New Testament congregation, confirmed the expansion of faithful Israel in the new covenant period. It also explains the Israeli identify of the new covenant people of God and demonstrates the sense of continuity that existed between both covenant eras. Gentiles were now to be corralled into faithful Israel in extraordinary numbers. They trusted in Israel’s Messiah, they joined the old covenant flock, and became the New Testament people of God. This was a radical overhaul for even the most open-minded of Christ’s disciples. We saw that in their parochial response to Christ’s kingdom teaching in Acts 1:6 and with their struggle in the book of Acts to come to terms with accommodating Gentiles joining the congregation (ekklesia) on an equal basis to that of Jews.

Jesus brought a radical revolutionary message to the early Jewish disciples. He told them that there are others that are not of this flock (namely not of the Jewish race) that belong to Him, who will be integrated into His sheepfold. He was talking here of the Gentiles. What is more, He describes how these two peoples (both Jews and Gentiles) would be united together in Him and become one flock! Jesus is here acknowledging that salvation would not be limited to the Jewish race. He was predicting that the Gospel would expand out and embrace the nations. He explains that there would then be a fusion of the believing element of both ethnic groups into one cohesive believing sheepfold – with Him as a Shepherd. This indeed happened 2000 years ago.

 

[Truther]

Why are you arguing with a child? Just let him run and play.

I am trying to show folks something they never understood, because of modern theology poisoning our minds.

 

[Truther]

You are all over the place! You are unable to think outside of what you have been taught. Your posts are devoid of depth and truth. There is no doubt that the Jews were the main focus of Christ’s earthly ministry. That situation continued on for a while throughout the book of Acts. But redemption didn’t stop there. His sheep were not limited to the house of Israel. His heart for Israel did not in any way diminish His intention to reach the Gentile nations with salvation. Jesus said prior to the cross, speaking to His Jewish converts, in John 10:14-16, “I am the good shepherd, and know my sheep, and am known of mine. As the Father knoweth me, even so know I the Father: and I lay down my life for the sheep. And other sheep I have, which are not of this fold: them also I must bring, and they shall hear my voice; and there shall be one fold, and one shepherd.”

The continuation of the believing Israeli flock, and its morphing into the New Testament congregation, confirmed the expansion of faithful Israel in the new covenant period. It also explains the Israeli identify of the new covenant people of God and demonstrates the sense of continuity that existed between both covenant eras. Gentiles were now to be corralled into faithful Israel in extraordinary numbers. They trusted in Israel’s Messiah, they joined the old covenant flock, and became the New Testament people of God. This was a radical overhaul for even the most open-minded of Christ’s disciples. We saw that in their parochial response to Christ’s kingdom teaching in Acts 1:6 and with their struggle in the book of Acts to come to terms with accommodating Gentiles joining the congregation (ekklesia) on an equal basis to that of Jews.

Jesus brought a radical revolutionary message to the early Jewish disciples. He told them that there are others that are not of this flock (namely not of the Jewish race) that belong to Him, who will be integrated into His sheepfold. He was talking here of the Gentiles. What is more, He describes how these two peoples (both Jews and Gentiles) would be united together in Him and become one flock! Jesus is here acknowledging that salvation would not be limited to the Jewish race. He was predicting that the Gospel would expand out and embrace the nations. He explains that there would then be a fusion of the believing element of both ethnic groups into one cohesive believing sheepfold – with Him as a Shepherd. This indeed happened 2000 years ago.

You missed it again.

The fold is FUTURE NATIONAL ISRAEL, not us!!!

We are included in THEIR promise.

Now, calm down with me and see what I just told you, then all the prophecies will make perfect sense.

 

[Truth7t7]

Rev 11 and the great whore of Rev 18 are 2 separate cities.

Rev 11 is Jerusalem and Rev 18 is the RCC.

I Disagree, Jerusalem Is Mystery Babylon The Great, Not Rome As Many Falsely Teach

 

[WPM]

You still missed it.

Now, I am speaking of the return of Christ causing this event to future national Israel...


31 Behold, the days come, saith the Lord, that I will make a new covenant with the house of Israel, and with the house of Judah:

32 Not according to the covenant that I made with their fathers in the day that I took them by the hand to bring them out of the land of Egypt; which my covenant they brake, although I was an husband unto them, saith the Lord:

33 But this shall be the covenant that I will make with the house of Israel; After those days, saith the Lord, I will put my law in their inward parts, and write it in their hearts; and will be their God, and they shall be my people.

34 And they shall teach no more every man his neighbour, and every man his brother, saying, Know the Lord: for they shall all know me, from the least of them unto the greatest of them, saith the Lord: for I will forgive their iniquity, and I will remember their sin no more.


Read it carefully and tell me which part cannot happen to them.

Sorry? So, the new covenant has not been instituted? What are you going to claim next? You now deny the atoning cross-work of Christ. You haven't a clue what you are talking about. God forgive you.

 

[Truther]

LOL! No, I'm going to admit something that isn't true. It's a made up story to illustrate the different types of responses there are to the preaching of the gospel in a way that can be understood. Are you really this dense or are you putting me on?

Let's take this parable for instance:

Matthew 13:47 Again, the kingdom of heaven is like unto a net, that was cast into the sea, and gathered of every kind: 48 Which, when it was full, they drew to shore, and sat down, and gathered the good into vessels, but cast the bad away. 49 So shall it be at the end of the world: the angels shall come forth, and sever the wicked from among the just, 50 And shall cast them into the furnace of fire: there shall be wailing and gnashing of teeth.

Do you think this is talking about someone literally casting a fishing net that literally gathers "every kind" of fish in it? That would have to be the biggest fishing net imaginable if this was talking about a real event. LOL.

A net was never cast into the sea prior to Jesus saying this?

Really?

 

[Truther]

I Disagree, Jerusalem Is Mystery Babylon The Great, Not Rome As Many Falsely Teach

There are 2 cities.

the city in Rev 11(earthquake scene) is not the city in Rev 8(completely destroyed never to be inhabited for the entire 1000 year reign).

Jesus saves Jerusalem per Zech 14 to be safely inhabited at His return, Rome not so lucky.

Why?

God HATES the great whore(RCC).

Billions of souls had Acts 2:38 stolen from her.

 

[St. Joseph]

I am trying to show folks something they never understood, because of modern theology poisoning our minds.

That is admirable,but first they have to be willing to learn. Wanting to learn. That guy things he knows it all already and you cant reach him. You're just casting pearls before swine. Maybe he will come around one day. Remember the parable of the sower. Sometimes the seed falls on pavement.