22 major reasons to abandon the Premil doctrine

[covenantee]

Daniel 9:24-27, Seventy Literal Weeks Explained "Future"?

Daniel's 70 weeks are literal 7 day periods, or 490 literal days.

If Daniel meant 490 years he would have written

(Four Hundred Ninety Years)

There is no recognized Bible scholar past or present who interprets the weeks of Daniel 9:24 as days.

All are unanimous in interpreting the weeks as years.

7620 [e]
šā·ḇu·‘îm
שָׁבֻעִ֨ים
Weeks
N‑mp

"heptad or seven of years, late, Daniel 9:24,25,26,27 (twice in verse). — שֻׁבֻעוֺת Ezekiel 21:28 see שָׁבַע]."

"seven, week
Or shabuan {shaw-boo'-ah}; also (feminine) shbu.ah {sheb-oo-aw'}; properly, passive participle of shaba' as a denominative of sheba'; literal, sevened, i.e. A week (specifically, of years) -- seven, week."

 

[Truth7t7]

He confirmed the covenant at Calvary.
He caused sacrifice and oblation to cease at Calvary.
He desolated the nation of Israel for rejecting Him.

What is hard to believe about confirmed historical reality and fulfillment?

Yes, the desolation of Israel was sad. But it is nonetheless confirmed historical reality and fulfillment.

And not by the "little horn". Stop being a dispendupe.

Sorry your claims are "Error", as Daniel 11:31 gives additional information regarding Daniel 9:27 that you disregard

Arms will stand on his part, they place that abomination that makes desolate

A far cry from the "He" "His" seen below being Jesus Christ as your preterist reformed eschatology claims, the biblical truth presented silences your claims made "Next"!

Jesus Christ doesn't make abomination or desolation, your claims are silenced, it's that simple

"He Shall Make It Desolate" and the "he" isn't Jesus Christ making desolation as you falsely claim

More "Preterist" reformed eschatology blunder

Daniel 9:27KJV
27 And he shall confirm the covenant with many for one week: and in the midst of the week he shall cause the sacrifice and the oblation to cease, and for the overspreading of abominations he shall make it desolate, even until the consummation, and that determined shall be poured upon the desolate.

Daniel 11:31KJV
31 And arms shall stand on his part, and they shall pollute the sanctuary of strength, and shall take away the daily sacrifice, and they shall place the abomination that maketh desolate.

 

[covenantee]

Daniel 11:31KJV
31 And arms shall stand on his part, and they shall pollute the sanctuary of strength, and shall take away the daily sacrifice, and they shall place the abomination that maketh desolate.

Nothing to do with Daniel 9:27.

"Antiochus IV's army desecrated the Temple and stopped the daily sacrifices. On the 15th of Kislev, in December 168 BCE, the Syrians built a pagan altar over the altar of burnt offering in the Temple and placed an image of Zeus Olympius upon it. Ten days later, on the 25th of Kislev, swine's flesh was offered on the altar to Zeus."

Appreciation to Bryan T. Huie

 

[CadyandZoe]

This doesn't seem to be an accurate summary...,
The DOTL comes like a thief also.

1. 1 Thessalonians 5:1
   The Day of the Lord
   Now as to the times and dates, brothers and sisters, you have no need for anything to be written to you.
   
   
2. 1 Thessalonians 5:2
   For you yourselves know perfectly well that the day of the [return of the] Lord is coming just as a thief [comes unexpectedly and suddenly] in the night.

2 Peter 3:10

But the day of the Lord will come like a thief, and then the heavens will vanish with a [mighty and thunderous] roar, and the [material] elements will be destroyed with intense heat, and the earth and the works that are on it will be burned up.


How does a coming of a thief have a beginning a middle and an end?

The Thessalonians had no need of anything to be written to them regarding the DOTL, yet you believe they were expecting a letter from an Apostle about it.

The whole idea of coming like a thief belonged to the Lords own word regarding his coming. So, there was no need for anything to be written to them for this reason.

Matt 24
Be Ready for His Coming
42 “So be alert [give strict attention, be cautious and active in faith], for you do not know which day [whether near or far] your Lord is coming. 43 But understand this: If the head of the house had known what time of the night the thief was coming, he would have been on the alert and would not have allowed his house to be broken into. 44 Therefore, you [who follow Me] must also be ready; because the Son of Man is coming at an hour when you do not expect Him.

I like to see more of the context. Let's consider 1 Thessalonians 5:1-7

Now as to the times and the epochs, brethren, you have no need of anything to be written to you. For you yourselves know full well that the day of the Lord will come just like a thief in the night. While they are saying, “Peace and safety!” then destruction will come upon them suddenly like labor pains upon a woman with child, and they will not escape. But you, brethren, are not in darkness, that the day would overtake you like a thief; for you are all sons of light and sons of day. We are not of night nor of darkness; so then let us not sleep as others do, but let us be alert and sober. For those who sleep do their sleeping at night, and those who get drunk get drunk at night. But since we are of the day, let us be sober, having put on the breastplate of faith and love, and as a helmet, the hope of salvation. For God has not destined us for wrath, but for obtaining salvation through our Lord Jesus Christ, who died for us, so that whether we are awake or asleep, we will live together with Him. Therefore encourage one another and build up one another, just as you also are doing. ​

I highlighted two phrases in the text above in order to clarify the dual nature of the DOL. The day does not affect everyone the same way.

First group:
They
Day is a surprise
destruction comes suddenly
like a thief in the night
they will not escape

Second Group:
You
Day is not a surprise
Not overtake you like a thief.
Not destined for wrath
Obtaining salvation

Conclusion:
From this passage we can see that the DOL is NOT a quick, sudden, eschaton, but an extended period of time. The day lasts at least long enough for those who walk in the light to see what is happening and act accordingly. The day comes "suddenly" for some but not for others. For some, the day is unforeseen, and abrupt, while for others the day is foreseen and it comes slow enough that those walking in the light can see it and recognize it.

The day will experience destruction for some, but not for others. The day will witness wrath for some but not for others. Some will not escape the destruction but others will escape.

Jesus repeats this idea in the book of Revelation:

Revelation 3:2-3

Wake up, and strengthen the things that remain, which were about to die; for I have not found your deeds completed in the sight of My God. So remember what you have received and heard; and keep it, and repent. Therefore if you do not wake up, I will come like a thief, and you will not know at what hour I will come to you.​

Jesus, speaking to the church in Sardis, exhorts them to wake up and if they don't wake up, he will come like a thief, and they will not know at what hour he will come. This implies that if the church of Sardis wakes up, Jesus' coming will not overtake them like a thief; they will be sober and ready for his return. Just as Paul said, Jesus' coming will be like a thief for those who are asleep, but not for others who are awake, they will know the hour he is coming.

The Day of the Lord is NOT a sudden, quick, climactic, surprise, eschaton as we see above. For those that are awake, alert, walking in the light both the Day of the Lord and the Second Advent will be anticipated, foreseen, and gradual. It only comes suddenly for those whom it remains "unforeseen", for those walking in the darkness and not in the light.

 

[WPM]

Daniel 9:24-27, Seventy Literal Weeks Explained "Future"?

Daniel's 70 weeks are literal 7 day periods, or 490 literal days.

If Daniel meant 490 years he would have written

(Four Hundred Ninety Years)

Daniel had no restrictions in "Writing" exact numerology as seen below.

Daniel 6:1KJV
It pleased Darius to set over the kingdom an hundred and twenty princes, which should be over the whole kingdom;

Daniel 8:14KJV
And he said unto me, Unto two thousand and three hundred days; then shall the sanctuary be cleansed.

Daniel 12:11KJV
And from the time that the daily sacrifice shall be taken away, and the abomination that maketh desolate set up, there shall be a thousand two hundred and ninety days.

Below in Daniel 10:2-3 we see just another example of Daniel's literal weeks, as Daniel mourned and fasted for 3 literal weeks or 21 days.

Daniel 10:2-3KJV
2 In those days I Daniel was mourning three full weeks.
3 I ate no pleasant bread, neither came flesh nor wine in my mouth, neither did I anoint myself at all, till three whole weeks were fulfilled.

Below in Daniel 9:24-27 we see 70 literal "Future" weeks or 490 days.

When the "Future" call/commandment goes out in Jerusalem to build unto the Jewish Meshiach/Messiah that they wait for (They Denied Jesus Christ) this will start the 7 week period in preparing to build.

62 literal weeks will be in building, and Meshiach/Messiah will be cut off by the armies surrounding Jerusalem, this stops the building.

The 70th literal week will see (The Antichrist) revealed in making a covenant, and in the middle of this literal week he proclaims to be Meshiach/Messiah God to the Jews, and Jesus returned to the apostate church, to start a Millennium on earth.

The 3.5 year tribulation starts at this time.

Daniel 9:24-27KJV
24 Seventy weeks are determined upon thy people and upon thy holy city, to finish the transgression, and to make an end of sins, and to make reconciliation for iniquity, and to bring in everlasting righteousness, and to seal up the vision and prophecy, and to anoint the most Holy.
25 Know therefore and understand, that from the going forth of the commandment to restore and to build Jerusalem unto the Messiah the Prince shall be seven weeks, and threescore and two weeks: the street shall be built again, and the wall, even in troublous times.
26 And after threescore and two weeks shall Messiah be cut off, but not for himself: and the people of the prince that shall come shall destroy the city and the sanctuary; and the end thereof shall be with a flood, and unto the end of the war desolations are determined.
27 And he shall confirm the covenant with many for one week: and in the midst of the week he shall cause the sacrifice and the oblation to cease, and for the overspreading of abominations he shall make it desolate, even until the consummation, and that determined shall be poured upon the desolate.

Your ongoing refusal (or inability) to directly address other posters rebuttals exposes the various contractions in your position.

 

[WPM]

I like to see more of the context. Let's consider 1 Thessalonians 5:1-7

Now as to the times and the epochs, brethren, you have no need of anything to be written to you. For you yourselves know full well that the day of the Lord will come just like a thief in the night. While they are saying, “Peace and safety!” then destruction will come upon them suddenly like labor pains upon a woman with child, and they will not escape. But you, brethren, are not in darkness, that the day would overtake you like a thief; for you are all sons of light and sons of day. We are not of night nor of darkness; so then let us not sleep as others do, but let us be alert and sober. For those who sleep do their sleeping at night, and those who get drunk get drunk at night. But since we are of the day, let us be sober, having put on the breastplate of faith and love, and as a helmet, the hope of salvation. For God has not destined us for wrath, but for obtaining salvation through our Lord Jesus Christ, who died for us, so that whether we are awake or asleep, we will live together with Him. Therefore encourage one another and build up one another, just as you also are doing. ​

I highlighted two phrases in the text above in order to clarify the dual nature of the DOL. The day does not affect everyone the same way.

First group:
They
Day is a surprise
destruction comes suddenly
like a thief in the night
they will not escape

Second Group:
You
Day is not a surprise
Not overtake you like a thief.
Not destined for wrath
Obtaining salvation

Conclusion:
From this passage we can see that the DOL is NOT a quick, sudden, eschaton, but an extended period of time. The day lasts at least long enough for those who walk in the light to see what is happening and act accordingly. The day comes "suddenly" for some but not for others. For some, the day is unforeseen, and abrupt, while for others the day is foreseen and it comes slow enough that those walking in the light can see it and recognize it.

The day will experience destruction for some, but not for others. The day will witness wrath for some but not for others. Some will not escape the destruction but others will escape.

Jesus repeats this idea in the book of Revelation:

Revelation 3:2-3

Wake up, and strengthen the things that remain, which were about to die; for I have not found your deeds completed in the sight of My God. So remember what you have received and heard; and keep it, and repent. Therefore if you do not wake up, I will come like a thief, and you will not know at what hour I will come to you.​

Jesus, speaking to the church in Sardis, exhorts them to wake up and if they don't wake up, he will come like a thief, and they will not know at what hour he will come. This implies that if the church of Sardis wakes up, Jesus' coming will not overtake them like a thief; they will be sober and ready for his return. Just as Paul said, Jesus' coming will be like a thief for those who are asleep, but not for others who are awake, they will know the hour he is coming.

The Day of the Lord is NOT a sudden, quick, climactic, surprise, eschaton as we see above. For those that are awake, alert, walking in the light both the Day of the Lord and the Second Advent will be anticipated, foreseen, and gradual. It only comes suddenly for those whom it remains "unforeseen", for those walking in the darkness and not in the light.

Hello! 1 Thessalonians 5:1-7 and 2 Peter 3:3-13 are talking about what happens at the coming of Christ, not some imaginary time 1000+ years after the second coming. What they describe is sudden. It is climactic. It involves wholesale destruction. To deny that is to deny the actual wording of the text, which couldn't be clearer (to the indoctrinated mind).

There are two distinct groups who experience two completely different outcomes when Jesus comes. The fact is: there has only ever been two types of people upon the earth. Why would you be shocked that their expectation and experience are diametrically diverse? I am not sure why you would think that that in any way proves Premil. It doesn't.

The apathy or mocking of the wicked relates to this all-consummating coming. The hope of Christians relates to this same coming. The writers are reassuring believers of their final deliverance and instant glorification when Jesus comes. They are also warning the ungodly that this appearance will catch them unexpectedly. It will involve the complete destruction of them and the old arrangement, and the complete rescue of the redeemed and the complete replacement with a new perfect arrangement.

II Thessalonians 1:4-10 records: “we ourselves glory in you in the churches of God for your patience and faith in all your persecutions and tribulations that ye endure: Which is a manifest token of the righteous judgment of God, that ye may be counted worthy of the kingdom of God, for which ye also suffer: Seeing it is a righteous thing with God to recompense tribulation to them that trouble you; And to you who are troubled rest with us, when the Lord Jesus shall be revealed from heaven with his mighty angels, in flaming fire taking vengeance on them that know not God, and that obey not the gospel of our Lord Jesus Christ: who shall be punished with everlasting destruction from the presence of the Lord, and from the glory of his power; When he shall come to be glorified in his saints, and to be admired in all them that believe (because our testimony among you was believed) in that day.”

2 Peter 3:3-13: “there shall come in the last days scoffers, walking after their own lusts, And saying, Where is the promise of His coming? for since the fathers fell asleep, all things continue as they were from the beginning of the creation. For this they willingly are ignorant of, that by the word of God the heavens were of old, and the earth standing out of the water and in the water: Whereby the world that then was, being overflowed with water, perished: But the heavens and the earth, which are now, by the same word are kept in store, reserved unto fire against the day of judgment and perdition of ungodly men. But, beloved, be not ignorant of this one thing, that one day is with the Lord as a thousand years, and a thousand years as one day. The Lord is not slack concerning his promise, as some men count slackness; but is longsuffering to us-ward, not willing that any should perish, but that all should come to repentance. But the day of the Lord will come as a thief in the night; in the which the heavens shall pass away with a great noise, and the elements shall melt with fervent heat, the earth also and the works that are therein shall be burned up. Seeing then that all these things shall be dissolved, what manner of persons ought ye to be in all holy conversation and godliness, Looking for and hasting unto the coming of the day of God, wherein the heavens being on fire shall be dissolved, and the elements shall melt with fervent heat? Nevertheless we, according to his promise, look for new heavens and a new earth, wherein dwelleth righteousness.”

 

[Spiritual Israelite]

John's "The Beast" is future, and will be living at the second coming and final Judgement as you have been shown several times

I have never said otherwise. According to Revelation 17:8, the beast "was" in the past, was in the bottomless pit at the time John wrote the book, and will ascend from the bottomless pit/abyss in the future. You are apparently unable to answer the question of what it means when it says the beast "was, and is not". That shows a major weakness in your understanding of the beast.

 

[Spiritual Israelite]

Your ongoing refusal (or inability) to directly address other posters rebuttals exposes the various contractions in your position.

Exactly. He just blatantly ignores our questions and points and never addresses them. He knows he has no answers, but just repeats the same rhetoric over and over again without addressing the holes in his view.

 

[Spiritual Israelite]

When He rules, we will also. Satan will be bound. Many people will be judged. The tribulation will be over and the AntiChrist disposed of..etc etc. There is no possibility any of that has already happened.

No possibility of Jesus already ruling and us ruling with Him? Really? Have you never read this:

Revelation 1:5 and from Jesus Christ, who is the faithful witness, the firstborn from the dead, and the ruler of the kings of the earth.To him who loves us and has freed us from our sins by his blood, 6 and has made us to be a kingdom and priests to serve his God and Father—to him be glory and power for ever and ever! Amen.

 

[WPM]

I have never said otherwise. According to Revelation 17:8, the beast "was" in the past, was in the bottomless pit at the time John wrote the book, and will ascend from the bottomless pit/abyss in the future. You are apparently unable to answer the question of what it means when it says the beast "was, and is not". That shows a major weakness in your understanding of the beast.

I have never seen anyone who blatantly ignores posters points and robotically cuts-and-pastes evasive replies. Does he not see how this looks to others?

 

[jeffweeder]

Hello! 1 Thessalonians 5:1-7 and 2 Peter 3:3-13 are talking about what happens at the coming of Christ, not some imaginary time 1000+ years after the second coming. What they describe is sudden. It is climactic. It involves wholesale destruction. To deny that is to deny the actual wording of the text. They couldn't be clearer.

There are two distinct groups who experience two completely different outcomes when Jesus comes. The fact is: there has only ever been two types of people upon the earth. Why would you be shocked that their expectation and experience are diametrically diverse? I am not sure why you would think that that in any way proves Premil. It doesn't.

The apathy or mocking of the wicked relates to this all-consummating coming. The hope of Christians relates to this same coming. The writers are reassuring believers of their final deliverance and instant glorification when Jesus comes. They are also warning the ungodly that this appearance will catch them unexpectedly. It will involve the complete destruction of them and the old arrangement, and the complete rescue of the redeemed and the complete replacement with a new perfect arrangement.

II Thessalonians 1:4-10 records: “we ourselves glory in you in the churches of God for your patience and faith in all your persecutions and tribulations that ye endure: Which is a manifest token of the righteous judgment of God, that ye may be counted worthy of the kingdom of God, for which ye also suffer: Seeing it is a righteous thing with God to recompense tribulation to them that trouble you; And to you who are troubled rest with us, when the Lord Jesus shall be revealed from heaven with his mighty angels, in flaming fire taking vengeance on them that know not God, and that obey not the gospel of our Lord Jesus Christ: who shall be punished with everlasting destruction from the presence of the Lord, and from the glory of his power; When he shall come to be glorified in his saints, and to be admired in all them that believe (because our testimony among you was believed) in that day.”

2 Peter 3:3-13: “there shall come in the last days scoffers, walking after their own lusts, And saying, Where is the promise of His coming? for since the fathers fell asleep, all things continue as they were from the beginning of the creation. For this they willingly are ignorant of, that by the word of God the heavens were of old, and the earth standing out of the water and in the water: Whereby the world that then was, being overflowed with water, perished: But the heavens and the earth, which are now, by the same word are kept in store, reserved unto fire against the day of judgment and perdition of ungodly men. But, beloved, be not ignorant of this one thing, that one day is with the Lord as a thousand years, and a thousand years as one day. The Lord is not slack concerning his promise, as some men count slackness; but is longsuffering to us-ward, not willing that any should perish, but that all should come to repentance. But the day of the Lord will come as a thief in the night; in the which the heavens shall pass away with a great noise, and the elements shall melt with fervent heat, the earth also and the works that are therein shall be burned up. Seeing then that all these things shall be dissolved, what manner of persons ought ye to be in all holy conversation and godliness, Looking for and hasting unto the coming of the day of God, wherein the heavens being on fire shall be dissolved, and the elements shall melt with fervent heat? Nevertheless we, according to his promise, look for new heavens and a new earth, wherein dwelleth righteousness.”

Thanks WPM for pointing these things out to Cady.

 

[WPM]

Thanks WPM for pointing these things out to Cady.

Years of engagement on this subject reveals that Premils are not the true literalists. They explain away so much simple straightforward Scripture.

 

[Timtofly]

I find it to be incredibly sad that any Amil would not recognize that Daniel 9:27 is talking about Jesus confirming the new covenant and putting an end to the need for animal sacrifices and offerings and not about some imaginary bad guy. I know dispensationalists interpret it that way, but you should know better.

Because that would mean there is a 1992 year abomination of desolation upon all humanity. This is about the removal of the Atonement, not the removal of the OT Law.

You fail to see the historical fulfillment of the AoD with Antiochus Epiphanes per Daniel. The Jews call it Hanukkah. This future AoD is the total disregard of the Cross and the Atonement of the Lamb. When God removes grace and His free gift of Salvation, that will be the fulfillment of Daniel 9:27. Not just the act of Antiochus Epiphanes against the temple in Jerusalem. That was not Daniel 9:27.

When you equate the Cross as the AoD that ended the use of the temple as the daily sacrifice, that is blasphemy against the Cross. The Cross was not the fulfillment of Daniel 9:27. The Cross was the fulfillment of Daniel 9:26.

Daniel 9:27 happens during the sounding of the 7th Trumpet. Read Revelation 10:5-7 carefully. This is not the end of time. This is the end of Adam's punishment from disobeying God. But if this week is split in half, God will remove the Atonement, and Satan will be given 42 months of complete and utter abomination and desolation, until the wrath of God, the 7 vials, ends this AoD. The last act being Armageddon.

The beast that was, was not, and is for 42 months is this authority allowed by Satan and his Babylonian Kingdom. For amil to base their whole theory on the binding of Satan, I am surprised you all don't see that beast as Satan's authority. Satan has not been bound in the pit, as you all present in your thesis. He has been stripped of his authority. The authority is the beast that was, is not, but may have one last 42 month stronghold. The worse of all history.

That is why the church is not on earth at this time. No Holy Spirit working either. You all want a church on earth without even the Holy Spirit. Not sure if that is plain dumb or insane to prove you are more powerful than God or Satan, by being the lone maverick. The church left at the Second Coming in the 5th and 6th Seals.

Jesus and His angels along with the 144k are on earth during the final harvest, the 6 Trumpets and 7 Thunders. If Satan is allowed 42 months even Jesus and the angels leave Jerusalem for a place called mount zion. The only people left during this last 42 months are those who take the mark and those beheaded, who don't take the mark. That should be clear by reading chapters 13 to 19. Even you claim all are dead at Armageddon. Of course they are all dead. The church, the sheep, and the wheat were removed from the earth way before the 7th Trumpet.

The consuming cleansing fire of 2 Peter 3 happened at the 6th Seal. An ongoing phenomenon during the Trumpets and Thunders. Billions of souls removed from Adam's dead corruptible flesh even before the 7th Trumpet. But you all refuse to see Jesus on earth with His angels, even though that is what Jesus taught in Matthew 13 and Matthew 25:31. You all are great at making up your own inspired words instead of just reading what is already written. Then clap each other on the back for being so clever.

 

[covenantee]

I have never seen anyone who blatantly ignores posters points and robotically cuts-and-pastes evasive replies. Does he not see how this looks to others?

Incurable irrationality.

 

[dad]

No possibility of Jesus already ruling and us ruling with Him? Really? Have you never read this:

Revelation 1:5 and from Jesus Christ, who is the faithful witness, the firstborn from the dead, and the ruler of the kings of the earth.To him who loves us and has freed us from our sins by his blood, 6 and has made us to be a kingdom and priests to serve his God and Father—to him be glory and power for ever and ever! Amen.

The kingdom we are part of does not rule earth now. We are part of it yes. However, only when He returns will, as Revelation says,,

Revelation 11:15

And the seventh angel sounded; and there were great voices in heaven, saying, The kingdoms of this world are become the kingdoms of our Lord, and of his Christ; and he shall reign for ever and ever.

Only when He returns does He rule with His saints. If you claim that is now, then you are claiming He returned!

 

[WPM]

The kingdom we are part of does not rule earth now. We are part of it yes. However, only when He returns will, as Revelation says,,

Revelation 11:15

And the seventh angel sounded; and there were great voices in heaven, saying, The kingdoms of this world are become the kingdoms of our Lord, and of his Christ; and he shall reign for ever and ever.

Only when He returns does He rule with His saints. If you claim that is now, then you are claiming He returned!

Yes. But not for 1000 years, but, "for ever and ever.."

 

[dad]

Yes. But not for 1000 years, but, "for ever and ever.."

What does that mean? When Jesus returns He does rule forever, starting with that millennium period. He does not rule the kingdoms of this world now. They are not yet become His kingdoms.
Revelation 11:15

And the seventh angel sounded; and there were great voices in heaven, saying, The kingdoms of this world are become the kingdoms of our Lord, and of his Christ; and he shall reign for ever and ever

 

[WPM]

What does that mean? When Jesus returns He does rule forever, starting with that millennium period. He does not rule the kingdoms of this world now. They are not yet become His kingdoms.
Revelation 11:15

And the seventh angel sounded; and there were great voices in heaven, saying, The kingdoms of this world are become the kingdoms of our Lord, and of his Christ; and he shall reign for ever and ever

No millennium mentioned here. You need to force it into the text. Premils have to do that with countless Scriptures. It is called adding unto Scripture, something forbidden by the Holy Ghost.

 

[Truth7t7]

Nothing to do with Daniel 9:27.

"Antiochus IV's army desecrated the Temple and stopped the daily sacrifices. On the 15th of Kislev, in December 168 BCE, the Syrians built a pagan altar over the altar of burnt offering in the Temple and placed an image of Zeus Olympius upon it. Ten days later, on the 25th of Kislev, swine's flesh was offered on the altar to Zeus."

Appreciation to Bryan T. Huie

Future Unfulfilled

Daniel 11:40KJV
40 And at the time of the end shall the king of the south push at him: and the king of the north shall come against him like a whirlwind, with chariots, and with horsemen, and with many ships; and he shall enter into the countries, and shall overflow and pass over.

 

[Spiritual Israelite]

Negative. Think about the logic and flow of the passage.

I did and I showed you how it should be understood. As usual, you did not specifically address anything I said. If you think just responding with "Negative" is a case of addressing what I said, you are fooling yourself.

In chapter one Paul tells them that Jesus' coming will be hard to miss, since it is accompanied by angels and fire. If the Day of the Lord was synonymous with the coming of Jesus, then his readers should have NO doubt as to when the Day of the Lord has started. Let me repeat that. If the Day of the Lord and the coming of Jesus are coterminous, happening at the same time, then his readers should have no doubt as to when the day of the Lord is here.

There will be no doubt when He comes. I don't know what you're talking about. You're not making any sense.

But the Day of the Lord is not coterminous with the coming of the Lord, which is why Paul provides his readers clues and signs to observe as to when the Day of the Lord is imminent.

Summary:
Coming of the Lord -- No signs. Comes as a thief in the night.
Day of the Lord -- Signs. Watch for the man of lawlessness and hatred for the truth.

You're not taking other scripture into account. Jesus said we need to watch for signs of His coming as well. Remember, He comes unexpectedly to unbelievers, not to believers. No one knows the day or hour of His coming, but we believers are expecting Him to come. So, even though we don't know exactly when He's coming, we are expecting Him to come. So, it won't catch us completely off guard like it will unbelievers.

Matthew 24:42 “Therefore keep watch, because you do not know on what day your Lord will come. 43 But understand this: If the owner of the house had known at what time of night the thief was coming, he would have kept watch and would not have let his house be broken into. 44 So you also must be ready, because the Son of Man will come at an hour when you do not expect him.

You say there are no signs of His coming? Where are you getting that from? You say we need to watch for signs of the day of the Lord such as a hatred for the truth. Isn't that what Jesus talked about in relation to His second coming as well?

Matthew 24:9 “Then you will be handed over to be persecuted and put to death, and you will be hated by all nations because of me. 10 At that time many will turn away from the faith and will betray and hate each other, 11 and many false prophets will appear and deceive many people. 12 Because of the increase of wickedness, the love of most will grow cold, 13 but the one who stands firm to the end will be saved.

Is the many turning away from the faith and the increase of wickedness that Jesus talked about that would occur before His coming something different than the increase in wickedness and falling away from the faith that Paul wrote about in 2nd Thessalonians 2 that would occur just before the day of the Lord? I don't believe so. Paul indicated that Jesus would come on the day of the Lord. There is no basis whatsoever for differentiating between the day He returns and the day of the Lord. They are the same thing.

In my view, the Day of the Lord has three parts: a beginning, a middle and an end. As Paul says, the Day of the Lord can't begin until we see the man of lawlessness and hatred for the truth.

Jesus said His coming at the end of the age doesn't happen until an increase in wickedness and false prophets occurs first. That's the same thing.

The Second Advent takes place in the middle portion of the DOL. Because of this, his readers can look for signs that the Day of the Lord is about to arrive, while knowing that the day and the hour of the Second Advent is unknowable.

This idea of the day of the Lord being in 3 parts is not taught anywhere in scripture. It doesn't fit with what is described in passages like 1 Thess 4:13-5:11, 2 Thess 2:3-12 and 2 Peter 3:10-13.