The Reality of the Millennial Kingdom

[VictoryinJesus]

"workers of iniquity",

Workers of iniquity call Him Lord but won’t do what He says in: Matthew 22:36-40 Master, which is the great commandment in the law? [37] Jesus said unto him, Thou shalt love the Lord thy God with all thy heart, and with all thy soul, and with all thy mind. [38] This is the first and great commandment. [39] And the second is like unto it, Thou shalt love thy neighbour as thyself. [40] On these two commandments hang all the law and the prophets.

 

[CoreIssue]

Daniel 8:13-14
[13] Then I heard one saint speaking, and another saint said unto that certain saint which spake, How long shall be the vision concerning the daily sacrifice , and the transgression of desolation, to give both the sanctuary and the host to be trodden under foot? [14] And he said unto me, Unto two thousand and three hundred days; then shall the sanctuary be cleansed.

Matthew 3:11-12
[11] I indeed baptize you with water unto repentance: but he that cometh after me is mightier than I, whose shoes I am not worthy to bear: he shall baptize you with the Holy Ghost, and with fire: [12] Whose fan is in his hand, and he will throughly purge his floor, and gather his wheat into the garner; but he will burn up the chaff with unquenchable fire.

Luke 3:16-18
[16] John answered, saying unto them all, I indeed baptize you with water; but one mightier than I cometh, the latchet of whose shoes I am not worthy to unloose: he shall baptize you with the Holy Ghost and with fire: [17] Whose fan is in his hand, and he will throughly purge his floor, and will gather the wheat into his garner; but the chaff he will burn with fire unquenchable. [18] And many other things in his exhortation preached he unto the people.

Daniel 8:13-14 New International Version (NIV)
13 Then I heard a holy one speaking, and another holy one said to him, “How long will it take for the vision to be fulfilled—the vision concerning the daily sacrifice, the rebellion that causes desolation, the surrender of the sanctuary and the trampling underfoot of the Lord’s people?”

14 He said to me, “It will take 2,300 evenings and mornings; then the sanctuary will be reconsecrated.”

Holy one, not saint. Saints are human.

 

[Trekson]

Because the man who goes away is Satan and not Jesus.

I think it's just the opposite.

 

[Trekson]

Jesus showed that on the day of His return the resurrection will include the wicked to their own resurrection, what He called the "resurrection of damnation". He is not speaking of a thousand year gap between those two types of resurrection either. Both... occur in that same "hour".

There is nothing within the context that speaks of His return here. Both at the same time,, yes but that time is the post-millennial GWTJ.

 

[Trekson]

I would ask what sanctuary shall be cleansed?

I would say it will be the one that is here during the 70th week. The same one as Dan. 9:27.

 

[Trekson]

And is maybe the next thing you'll be saying is some crazy doctrine of men like how we all were guilty in having our Lord Jesus crucified??? Some Churches on men's doctrines actually preach that lie.

It saddens me to think so many brethren lack understanding in identifying the "workers of iniquity", nor do they grasp when God's Word is pointing to them and not to His people.

Considering that is the whole basis for Christianity, it is most certainly not a lie. Jesus died for my sins along with everyone else's. If we can't apply it on a personal level than His sacrifice becomes meaningless! For clarity's sake, we are responsible for why he was crucified, not the physical act of the crucifixion. His whole reason for coming was to purchase the world's gift of salvation, if we only accept it.

 

[VictoryinJesus]

I would say it will be the one that is here during the 70th week. The same one as Dan. 9:27.

I believe you are right. The sanctuary spoken of is a people, not a building made with hands. Cause let’s face it, the consummation ‘poured out’ is on a people and not a building or Definition of sanctuary. 1 : a consecrated place: such as. a : the ancient Hebrew temple at Jerusalem or its holy of holies. b(1) : the most sacred part of a religious building (such as the part of a Christian church in which the altar is placed).

Daniel 9:27
[27] And he shall confirm the covenant with many for one week: and in the midst of the week he shall cause the sacrifice and the oblation to cease, and for the overspreading of abominations he shall make it desolate, even until the consummation, and that determined shall be poured upon the desolate.


Definition of consummation. 1 : the act of consummating the consummation of a contract by mutual signature specifically : the consummating of a marriage. 2 : the ultimate end : finish.

Isaiah 54:1
[1] Sing, O barren, thou that didst not bear; break forth into singing, and cry aloud, thou that didst not travail with child: for more are the children of the desolate than the children of the married wife, saith the Lord .

Galatians 4:27-28
[27] For it is written, Rejoice, thou barren that bearest not; break forth and cry, thou that travailest not: for the desolate hath many more children than she which hath an husband. [28] Now we, brethren, as Isaac was, are the children of promise.

 

[CoreIssue]

I believe you are right. The sanctuary spoken of is a people, not a building made with hands. Cause let’s face it, the consummation ‘poured out’ is on a people and not a building or Definition of sanctuary. 1 : a consecrated place: such as. a : the ancient Hebrew temple at Jerusalem or its holy of holies. b(1) : the most sacred part of a religious building (such as the part of a Christian church in which the altar is placed).

Daniel 9:27
[27] And he shall confirm the covenant with many for one week: and in the midst of the week he shall cause the sacrifice and the oblation to cease, and for the overspreading of abominations he shall make it desolate, even until the consummation, and that determined shall be poured upon the desolate.


Definition of consummation. 1 : the act of consummating the consummation of a contract by mutual signature specifically : the consummating of a marriage. 2 : the ultimate end : finish.

Isaiah 54:1

Again the KJV proves misleading and confusing. Not to get into containing errors such as Easter for Passover, was instead of became and saints instead of holy ones.

Daniel 9:27 New International Version (NIV)
27 He will confirm a covenant with many for one week In the middle of the ‘seven' he will put an end to sacrifice and offering. And at the temple he will set up an abomination that causes desolation, until the end that is decreed is poured out on him.
[1] Sing, O barren, thou that didst not bear; break forth into singing, and cry aloud, thou that didst not travail with child: for more are the children of the desolate than the children of the married wife, saith the Lord .

Galatians 4:27-28
[27] For it is written, Rejoice, thou barren that bearest not; break forth and cry, thou that travailest not: for the desolate hath many more children than she which hath an husband. [28] Now we, brethren, as Isaac was, are the children of promise.

 

[Hidden In Him]

In the parable about the Minas, the "good and faithful servants" are elevated above their station because they are good at oppressing the people around them. The servants do not have a servant's heart like Christ taught and demonstrated.

Jay, I already knew what your interpretation was. I asked why the Lord would dedicate 3/4 of this parable to discussing how and why Satan will reward his servants.

In the Parable of the Talents, the "Good and Faithful servants" are to join Satan in his joy of becoming a deity. In effect, the servants become like deity as well.

And you now appear to be doubling down on this position with a new parable. Again, WHY would the Lord Jesus Christ be devoting so much teaching to glorifying Satan and those who serve him? Your position is disturbing, not because it holds water theologically but because I find your sympathies... rather unnerving. The Spirit of God doesn't witness to the glorification your interpretations give to the prince of this world.

 

[VictoryinJesus]

@CoreIssue
Not sure where your quote went.

Don’t know why the kjv says consummation. We were discussing what sanctuary is cleansed. But ok...completion, consumption. To cut, sharpen, decide. Isaiah 10:22 For though thy people Israel be as the sand of the sea, yet a remnant of them shall return: the consumption decreed shall overflow with righteousness.

It is still through desolation. When man is weakest, God is strong. Look around. Look at the obvious. Haven’t you lived this? It is when man can do nothing, when God works.

 

[Jay Ross]

Jay, I already knew what your interpretation was. I asked why the Lord would dedicate 3/4 of this parable to discussing how and why Satan will reward his servants.


And you now appear to be doubling down on this position with a new parable. Again, WHY would the Lord Jesus Christ be devoting so much teaching to glorifying Satan and those who serve him? Your position is disturbing, not because it holds water theologically but because I find your sympathies... rather unnerving. The Spirit of God doesn't witness to the glorification your interpretations give to the prince of this world.

Jesus is telling us that when the Everlasting kingdom of God is first established, that during its first age, Satan's Good and Faithful human servants will be working against people wanting to respond favourably to the God News of the Kingdom of God.

Both the Parable of the Minas and the Talents are telling us the same thing about Satan's Good and faithful servants working hard against the establishment of the Everlasting Kingdom while Satan is imprisoned in the Bottomless pit.

The Parable of the Minas, I label the Good and faithful servants as being secular in character, whereas in the Parable of the Talents, I label the Good and Faithful Servants as being religious in character in line with the audience that Jesus was with at the time of telling the respective parables.

Shalom

 

[Jay Ross]

I think it's just the opposite.

I do not think that I know like you because I know, without a doubt, that the
main character in both the Parable of the Minas and the Talents is Satan.

 

[CoreIssue]

@CoreIssue
Not sure where your quote went.

Don’t know why the kjv says consummation. We were discussing what sanctuary is cleansed. But ok...completion, consumption. To cut, sharpen, decide. Isaiah 10:22 For though thy people Israel be as the sand of the sea, yet a remnant of them shall return: the consumption decreed shall overflow with righteousness.

It is still through desolation. When man is weakest, God is strong. Look around. Look at the obvious. Haven’t you lived this? It is when man can do nothing, when God works.

Post 68

I will repeat it here

Again the KJV proves misleading and confusing. Not to get into containing errors such as Easter for Passover, was instead of became and saints instead of holy ones.

Daniel 9:27 New International Version (NIV)
27 He will confirm a covenant with many for one week In the middle of the ‘seven' he will put an end to sacrifice and offering. And at the temple he will set up an abomination that causes desolation, until the end that is decreed is poured out on him.

KJV It's archaic English that we just don't use anymore.

Plus, the original was written 418 years ago and was heavily influenced by Catholicism. The manuscript they used, the textus receptus was written in the 1500s by a Catholic.
Yet the KJV Only crowd claim it is more accurate versions written using manuscripts from 100 AD will and earlier.

It is very difficult to read for most and easy to misunderstand.

The most used Bible now is the NIV.

Hard-core theologians and linguists say the NIV and NASB are the most accurate.

I was saved KJV and when the NIV came out in early 70s I did serious study about it, including reviews from linguists very serious biblical theologians, such as Walter Martin.

And I use Interlinear Bible - Greek and Hebrew with Concordance to ensure I get word meanings correct.

King James Bible

Hope that helps.

 

[Trekson]

I believe you are right. The sanctuary spoken of is a people, not a building made with hands. Cause let’s face it, the consummation ‘poured out’ is on a people and not a building or Definition of sanctuary. 1 : a consecrated place: such as. a : the ancient Hebrew temple at Jerusalem or its holy of holies. b(1) : the most sacred part of a religious building (such as the part of a Christian church in which the altar is placed).

Daniel 9:27
[27] And he shall confirm the covenant with many for one week: and in the midst of the week he shall cause the sacrifice and the oblation to cease, and for the overspreading of abominations he shall make it desolate, even until the consummation, and that determined shall be poured upon the desolate.


Definition of consummation. 1 : the act of consummating the consummation of a contract by mutual signature specifically : the consummating of a marriage. 2 : the ultimate end : finish.

Isaiah 54:1
[1] Sing, O barren, thou that didst not bear; break forth into singing, and cry aloud, thou that didst not travail with child: for more are the children of the desolate than the children of the married wife, saith the Lord .

Galatians 4:27-28
[27] For it is written, Rejoice, thou barren that bearest not; break forth and cry, thou that travailest not: for the desolate hath many more children than she which hath an husband. [28] Now we, brethren, as Isaac was, are the children of promise.

No, I think it will be an actual temple. The temple will be desolated by the a/c, it will be destroyed and a new one erected for the millennium, imo.

 

[VictoryinJesus]

Post 68

I will repeat it here



KJV It's archaic English that we just don't use anymore.

Plus, the original was written 418 years ago and was heavily influenced by Catholicism. The manuscript they used, the textus receptus was written in the 1500s by a Catholic.
Yet the KJV Only crowd claim it is more accurate versions written using manuscripts from 100 AD will and earlier.

It is very difficult to read for most and easy to misunderstand.

The most used Bible now is the NIV.

Hard-core theologians and linguists say the NIV and NASB are the most accurate.

I was saved KJV and when the NIV came out in early 70s I did serious study about it, including reviews from linguists very serious biblical theologians, such as Walter Martin.

And I use Interlinear Bible - Greek and Hebrew with Concordance to ensure I get word meanings correct.

King James Bible

Hope that helps.

Thank you. It does help.

 

[CoreIssue]

No, I think it will be an actual temple. The temple will be desolated by the a/c, it will be destroyed and a new one erected for the millennium, imo.

It will be rendered unclean, not destroyed. From day 1260 from mid to 1335 it will be cleansed and rededicated.

I believe it will be expanded during the MK per the plans given to Ezekiel.

 

[VictoryinJesus]

No, I think it will be an actual temple. The temple will be desolated by the a/c, it will be destroyed and a new one erected for the millennium, imo.

Then what is God building up now then, in Christ?

 

[Enoch111]

No, I think it will be an actual temple. The temple will be desolated by the a/c, it will be destroyed and a new one erected for the millennium, imo.

Correct. There is a great earthquake which takes place in Jerusalem during the reign of the Antichrist, and it is entirely possible that the desecrated temple is destroyed at that time. It is also reasonable to infer that the two prophets during that reign are Moses and Elijah, based on the miracles that are performed at that time.

And they heard a great voice from heaven saying unto them, Come up hither. And they [Moses and Elijah] ascended up to heaven in a cloud; and their enemies beheld them. And the same hour was there a great earthquake, and the tenth part of the city fell, and in the earthquake were slain of men seven thousand: and the remnant were affrighted, and gave glory to the God of heaven. (Rev 11:12,13)

 

[Enoch111]

Then what is God building up now then, in Christ?

What God is doing right now is preparing a Bride for His Son. The Church is the Body, the Bride, and the Building (Temple) of Christ. Since these are metaphors for spiritual realities, we need to simply accept what Scripture says.

At the same time, after the Second Coming of Christ an eternal temple will be built in Jerusalem with the dimensions and location detailed in the book of Ezekiel.

 

[VictoryinJesus]

What God is doing right now is preparing a Bride for His Son. The Church is the Body, the Bride, and the Building (Temple) of Christ. Since these are metaphors for spiritual realities, we need to simply accept what Scripture says.

At the same time, after the Second Coming of Christ an eternal temple will be built in Jerusalem with the dimensions and location detailed in the book of Ezekiel.

1 Corinthians 3:9-17
[9] For we are labourers together with God: ye are God's husbandry, ye are God's building. [10] According to the grace of God which is given unto me, as a wise masterbuilder, I have laid the foundation, and another buildeth thereon. But let every man take heed how he buildeth thereupon. [11] For other foundation can no man lay than that is laid, which is Jesus Christ. [12] Now if any man build upon this foundation gold, silver, precious stones, wood, hay, stubble; [13] Every man's work shall be made manifest: for the day shall declare it, because it shall be revealed by fire; and the fire shall try every man's work of what sort it is. [14] If any man's work abide which he hath built thereupon, he shall receive a reward. [15] If any man's work shall be burned, he shall suffer loss: but he himself shall be saved; yet so as by fire. [16] Know ye not that ye are the temple of God, and that the Spirit of God dwelleth in you? [17] If any man defile the temple of God, him shall God destroy; for the temple of God is holy, which temple ye are.