The Root question of Amillenial vs Premillenial

[WPM]

You always only give scripture interpreted by yourself in such a way as to comply with your own doctrines and misinterpretation of other scriptures - and that shows that you do not believe scripture.

That's why I disengage from arguing with you. Otherwise we end up just swimming in the whirlpool of your polluted water.

You are describing yourself again.

 

[WPM]

You have never refuted anything in scripture. You cannot refute scripture. Your many failed attempts only expose your false doctrines.

I have refuted your false teaching.

 

[Zao is life]

I have refuted your false teaching.

There are probably thousands of fantasy computer games more interesting than your above fantasy.

So ..

 

[Spiritual Israelite]

The M.O of the team on the opposite side of the field has been very obvious again in all the topics and responses to you by those who disagree with you:

1. Team up against the opponent, and continue to work as a team.
2. Falsely accuse him of saying things he did not say.
3. Repeatedly tell him he does not know what he's talking about regarding things he did in fact say.
4. Begin with mild ad hominem arrogance and rudeness against him, and steadily increase it until hopefully he eventually lashes back - then tell him how bad HE is.

Sometimes I do suspect that some are here just to troll. Just to attempt to cause any topic or discussion they disagree with to unravel into a degraded unedifying mess. The tactics used are always very subtle but always the same.

Maybe they see the Word of God as a football to be sported with. Their M.O certainly treats God's Word that way.

LOL. You are paranoid.

 

[charity]

I was referring to the Eternal state, that will come as described in Revelation 21 to 22
The new heavens and earth will be spiritual entities, not physical, as they will exist forever.

But the time of the Millennium reign of King Jesus, will still be physical, as there will still be death, Isaiah 65:20, and procreation.
It will be as it was in the beginning, a perfect world of God's Creation.

Thank you for responding, @Keraz,

When our Lord made Himself known to His disciples after His quickening and resurrection He was not spirit, but flesh and bones, but with the ability to disappear and appear at will: At one time He is recorded to have cooked a meal for the disciples (John 21:9-14) during that period, and ate and drank with them. He also taught them concerning the Kingdom of God for forty days, prior to His ascension. The Father having committed all judgment unto the Son, He will also reign with a rod of iron, which sounds far from being ethereal or insubstantial. I have always assumed that our spiritual bodies will be like unto His own, and that the New Heavens and New Earth will be equally as real and substantial.

In Christ Jesus
Chris

 

[Keraz]

When our Lord made Himself known to His disciples after His quickening and resurrection He was not spirit, but flesh and bones, but with the ability to disappear and appear at will: At one time He is recorded to have cooked a meal for the disciples (John 21:9-14) during that period, and ate and drank with them. He also taught them concerning the Kingdom of God for forty days, prior to His ascension. The Father having committed all judgment unto the Son, He will also reign with a rod of iron, which sounds far from being ethereal or insubstantial. I have always assumed that our spiritual bodies will be like unto His own, and that the New Heavens and New Earth will be equally as real and substantial.

Yes; in the New heavens and the New Earth, it will be a Spiritual existence. Death will be no more, or procreation.
But; prior to that, during the thousand years when King Jesus reigns over the world, Isaiah 2:2-4, +, there will still be procreation and death.

I see the Millennium period, as similar to how it was during the first thousand years since Adam. People seemed to be healthier and lived for much longer. Possibly; a higher percentage of oxygen in the atmosphere.

 

[Spiritual Israelite]

Yes; in the New heavens and the New Earth, it will be a Spiritual existence. Death will be no more, or procreation.
But; prior to that, during the thousand years when King Jesus reigns over the world, Isaiah 2:2-4, +, there will still be procreation and death.

I see the Millennium period, as similar to how it was during the first thousand years since Adam. People seemed to be healthier and lived for much longer. Possibly; a higher percentage of oxygen in the atmosphere.

You continue to try to claim that Isaiah 2:2-4 refers to a time period after Christ returns even though it is clearly in relation to "the last days". According to scripture, the last days spans the New Testament era up to the second coming of Christ. The day of Pentecost long ago marked the beginning of the fulfillment of the prophecy in Joel 2:28-32 which relates to the last days, as can be seen in Acts 2:16-21. And Peter taught that the last days would be a time before the return of Christ and leading up to the return of Christ because he pointed out how in the last days scoffers would be scoffing at the promise of the second coming of Christ (2 Peter 3:3-4). So, you are contradicting what the NT says about the timing of the last days in your interpretation of Isaiah 2:2-4.

 

[The Light]

You always only give scripture interpreted by yourself in such a way as to comply with your own doctrines and misinterpretation of other scriptures - and that shows that you do not believe scripture.

That's why I disengage from arguing with you. Otherwise we end up just swimming in the whirlpool of your polluted water.

BINGO

 

[Keraz]

You continue to try to claim that Isaiah 2:2-4 refers to a time period after Christ returns even though it is clearly in relation to "the last days". According to scripture, the last days spans the New Testament era up to the second coming of Christ. The day of Pentecost long ago marked the beginning of the fulfillment of the prophecy in Joel 2:28-32 which relates to the last days, as can be seen in Acts 2:16-21. And Peter taught that the last days would be a time before the return of Christ and leading up to the return of Christ because he pointed out how in the last days scoffers would be scoffing at the promise of the second coming of Christ (2 Peter 3:3-4). So, you are contradicting what the NT says about the timing of the last days in your interpretation of Isaiah 2:2-4.

Saying that Isaiah 2:2-4, Zechariah 14:16-21, are the current situation, is a delusion, a sad case of mental separation from reality.
For yourself, having a belief that contradicts scripture, is up to you, but when a false theory is promoted, somewhat forcefully as you and others do, then a stand must be made against it.
The 'last days' of this Christian age, are now, not in the first Century.

 

[Spiritual Israelite]

Saying that Isaiah 2:2-4, Zechariah 14:16-21, are the current situation, is a delusion, a sad case of mental separation from reality.

Using scripture to interpret scripture is clearly not something you care about. I used scripture to back up my understanding of the timing of the last days. You use your imagination to make scripture say what you want it to say. You don't care if you interpret passages in such a way that contradicts other scripture. You are reckless with scripture and that always leads to false interpretations.

For yourself, having a belief that contradicts scripture, is up to you, but when a false theory is promoted, somewhat forcefully as you and others do, then a stand must be made against it.
The 'last days' of this Christian age, are now, not in the first Century.

They have been ongoing since the first century until now, according to Peter in Acts 2:16-21, which you ignore. And they lead up to the second coming of Christ, according to Peter in 2 Peter 3:3-4, which you also ignore. You instead put the timing of the last days after Christ returns which contradicts what Peter clearly taught about the timing of the last days. You make scripture say whatever you want it to say, which is shameful.

 

[Keraz]

Using scripture to interpret scripture is clearly not something you care about. I used scripture to back up my understanding of the timing of the last days. You use your imagination to make scripture say what you want it to say. You don't care if you interpret passages in such a way that contradicts other scripture. You are reckless with scripture and that always leads to false interpretations.


They have been ongoing since the first century until now, according to Peter in Acts 2:16-21, which you ignore. And they lead up to the second coming of Christ, according to Peter in 2 Peter 3:3-4, which you also ignore. You instead put the timing of the last days after Christ returns which contradicts what Peter clearly taught about the timing of the last days. You make scripture say whatever you want it to say, which is shameful.

A reply so loaded with false accusations and rude criticism. that for me to respond to it is a waste of my time. People can see for themselves how nasty and foolish your replies are.

 

[Spiritual Israelite]

A reply so loaded with false accusations and rude criticism. that for me to respond to it is a waste of my time.

You are an expert on false accusations and rude criticism, that's for sure.

People can see for themselves how nasty and foolish your replies are.

LOL. Look in the mirror, hypocrite.

 

[Keraz]

. Look in the mirror, hypocrite.

Look at the Bible, foolish people.
Your belief of a general resurrection of the Christian dead when Jesus Returns, is a flat out contradiction of scripture.
Your belief that we are in the Millennium now, is a total contradiction of present reality.

 

[Spiritual Israelite]

Look at the Bible, foolish people.

Please take your own advice.

Your belief of a general resurrection of the Christian dead when Jesus Returns, is a flat out contradiction of scripture.

So, you don't accept what Paul taught in 1 Cor 15:22-23 and what Jesus taught in John 5:28-29. Noted.

Your belief that we are in the Millennium now, is a total contradiction of present reality.

It's in agreement with scripture which teaches that Jesus began reigning after His resurrection. Too bad for you that He doesn't reign the way you want Him to. You want Him to reign exactly the same way that the Pharisees expected the Messiah to reign.

 

[WPM]

You always only give scripture interpreted by yourself in such a way as to comply with your own doctrines and misinterpretation of other scriptures - and that shows that you do not believe scripture.

That's why I disengage from arguing with you. Otherwise we end up just swimming in the whirlpool of your polluted water.

This sums up your position. It is redundant. The only tactic to Premillennialist have is to constantly avoid, insult and then run.

 

[Keraz]

So, you don't accept what Paul taught in 1 Cor 15:22-23 and what Jesus taught in John 5:28-29. Noted.

I accept it and I correctly place when any one will receive immortality.
Thinking it comes when Jesus Return, is the real contradiction of Bible Prophecy.

You want Him to reign exactly the same way that the Pharisees expected the Messiah to reign.

Sure I do, it will be His reward.
The Pharisees were not wrong, they just missed the prophesies of His First Advent; the Jews still reject Isaiah 53.

I think an admission of error from you is in order, You deny much scripture to hold the belief of Jesus ruling the world now and on the issue of people receiving Eternal Life, you demand God to give immortality before the final Judgment and the new heavens and earth.

 

[Spiritual Israelite]

The Pharisees were not wrong,

This says it all about what you believe.

I think an admission of error from you is in order,

LOL! You are a comedian. You need to prove that I made an error first. You don't realize how weak your arguments are. You have proved nothing.

You deny much scripture to hold the belief of Jesus ruling the world now and on the issue of people receiving Eternal Life, you demand God to give immortality before the final Judgment and the new heavens and earth.

I accept the scriptures which explicitly state that Jesus rules over the world now (Matt 28:18, Eph 1:19-23, Rev 1:5-6) and you don't. He just doesn't rule the way you want Him to, just like the foolish Pharisees.

 

[Spiritual Israelite]

The Pharisees were not wrong,

This comment needed to be posted again. LOL! Says it all.

 

[TribulationSigns]

The Pharisees were not wrong, they just missed the prophesies of His First Advent; the Jews still reject Isaiah 53.

Total nonsense!

John 5:46-47

• "For had ye believed Moses, ye would have believed me: for he wrote of me.
• But if ye believe not his writings, how shall ye believe my words?

Moses's writings were actually the divinely inspired written word of God, and Christ standing there was the actual living WORD of God (the WORD made flesh). By not having faith or belief in Christ's words proved they did NOT believe/have faith in what Moses wrote (the Law). The Priests, Scribes, and Pharisees had NO REAL SAVING FAITH in the law of Moses, their humanistic faith was in their own words, laws, and traditions. True faith in the written word would necessarily mean they would have had faith in Christ, the living Word. But they didn't really recognize/accept its authority over them, and thus they couldn't receive Christ's word as authoritative. By contrast, like today, when the elect read the written word, they receive it as authoritative because they have the Spirit of truth in them, and thus they receive His witness as of one of authority. In other words, the authority is God's truth, rather than of man's vain personal/private interpretations, imaginations, or traditions. For example:

Matthew 7:28-19

• "And it came to pass, when Jesus had ended these sayings, the people were astonished at his doctrine:
• For he taught them as one having authority, and not as the scribes."

Christ taught them as the authority of the WORD of God. The evidence in mankind? One group of people receive God's word as authoritative, while another group will not receive what is said as the truth while reading the SAME SCRIPTURE, they will try and twist it, cast it away as simply someone's opinion, or believe man's word over what is written. So the question in exegesis or methodology is resolved in understanding what is the truth by what authority one has. Whose authority is it? God's word or man's word. The evidence of being a true Christian is receiving God's word witnessed to you, versus not receiving it and twisting it to fit your own will, agenda, or the doctrines you've already been taught.

Therefore, the admission of error from you is in order!

 

[Keraz]

This comment needed to be posted again. LOL! Says it all.

Total nonsense!

What is your problem?
Do you think the leading Jews didn't know their scriptures? They knew, and still do today; that the Messiah will come as a conquering King.
The fact of Him coming first, as a suffering servant, threw them right off and made them kill Him.

Therefore, the admission of error from you is in order!

On past experience, people like you and SI, have no moral fortitude to apologise for your obvious errors and nasty criticism of anyone who posts the truths of history and scripture.
God will judge and those who teach will receive a more severe Judgement. James 3:1