The Israel Of God Is The Church

[Keraz]

So are we going to need medicine?

Yes. Because all of Ezekiel 40 to 48 refers to the Millennium period, BEFORE Eternity and immortality id given to those whose names are found in the Book of Life. Rev 20:11-15

 

[Truth7t7]

So are we going to need medicine?

I dont fully understand the leaves from the tree of life being used for healing/medicine, but it clearly states the fruit is used for meat/food also

You dont have to worry Marty, your gonna be a fish, if I catch you in my net I'll let you go

 

[Naomi25]

You miss out the clearly stated prophesies about the Millennium.

Prophecies like what? Like this?

Isaiah 65:19-20
I will rejoice in Jerusalem
and be glad in my people;
no more shall be heard in it the sound of weeping
and the cry of distress.
No more shall there be in it
an infant who lives but a few days,
or an old man who does not fill out his days,
for the young man shall die a hundred years old,
and the sinner a hundred years old shall be accursed.

How can I ignore that this prophecy BEGINS with:

Isaiah 65:17
“For behold, I create new heavens
and a new earth,
and the former things shall not be remembered
or come into mind.

Or how can I fail to consider this, when I read Is 65:

1 Corinthians 15:23-26, 54
But each in his own order: Christ the firstfruits, then at his coming those who belong to Christ. Then comes the end, when he delivers the kingdom to God the Father after destroying every rule and every authority and power. For he must reign until he has put all his enemies under his feet. The last enemy to be destroyed is death…
When the perishable puts on the imperishable, and the mortal puts on immortality, then shall come to pass the saying that is written:
“Death is swallowed up in victory.”

You may see a gap appearing in this text, but I simply do not. The most straightforward reading of this text is that Christ returns and ‘then’ comes the end, when those who ‘belong to him’ are resurrected and ‘death is defeated’. When reading Is 65 and assuming, as you do, that it refers to a Millennium, we must infer that death is only ‘somewhat’ defeated. That is NOT what 1 Cor 15 rejoices!

.
God's Plan for the redemption of mankind is in stages. We are now at the end of the Christian era and many dramatic things must happen before Jesus Returns and commences the final age to demonstrate the proper way to live under His divine rule.
THEN comes Eternity, Revelation 21 to 22

I know you see many interesting things in the OT, but I have trouble aligning some of them with the NT. And the NT ought to, I believe, be the Rosetta Stone, in many regards. What was in shadow and type in the OT, has been revealed in the NT through the revelation of Christ and God’s plan of salvation. If we cannot harmonise things with the NT, then I believe we have an issue with our doctrine.
And I’m afraid, I do not see a Millennial period. We see repeatedly that when Christ returns, events occur that do not allow for certain ‘conditions’ that many claim must take place within this earthly Millennium. We have the unrighteous being judged into eternal torment (2 Thess 1:7-10; Matt 25:41), the righteous being raised into resurrected bodies (1 Cor 15:23-26,54; 1 Thess 4:16-17)….this two facts will mean that neither just nor unjust will be available to go into the Millenium in natural bodies. It will also mean that death has been defeated and sin is no more, since sin is the sting of death and deaths sting is no more (1 Cor 15:56).
We also know that when Christ comes, the cosmos will burn (7,10-12), and it speaks of the earth in the same passages (v5, v10). So…if the heavens and earth pass away and are ‘made new’…then doesn’t it stand to reason that any time or…’age’ after that becomes the ‘new age’ or the ‘age to come’? And ANY time in the NT the ‘age to come’ is talked about, it is ALWAYS talked about in ways of ‘things eternal’.

So…I guess I’d just really like those questions answered. How do you explain all those ^^^ facts with what you see in the OT. Because with the NT being later revelation that very often EXPLAINS much of the OT, I’d rather base my understanding on the clear texts in the NT, then on some of the unclearer ones in the OT.

I mean. If it really comes down to it, I don’t suppose I’ll be super disappointed if I’m wrong. If Christ shows up and announces he’s here for a 1000 years of a paradise-like reign on earth, I’m hardly likely to complain, now am I?

 

[Naomi25]

Yes you clearly suggest in post #33 that "National" Israel will be grafted back in and saved

Ah. BACK in.
BACK…clearly implies that they are currently NOT in. Which would mean they are NOT currently children of God.

 

[Naomi25]

Luke 18:19KJV
19 And Jesus said unto him, Why callest thou me good? none is good, save one, that is, God.

Oh. Are. You. Entirely. Serious?
Please. Let me allay your fears. I was not calling you ‘good’, as in, using the word because I was attempting to explain how I viewed your characteristic. Which was clearly the case when the man called Christ ‘good teacher’.
I was merely using the phrase as one does to be polite.
I do not know you enough to know if you are ‘good’ or ‘bad’…whether you are ‘smart’ or ‘dumber than a bag of hammers’.
And you are clearly not God. And I am not delusional.

 

[Naomi25]

They are saved by faith just like we are

John 14:16
Jesus answered, “I am the way and the truth and the life. No one comes to the Father except through me.

Yes, I agree…did I not explain that well enough?

 

[Truth7t7]

Prophecies like what? Like this?

Isaiah 65:19-20
I will rejoice in Jerusalem
and be glad in my people;
no more shall be heard in it the sound of weeping
and the cry of distress.
No more shall there be in it
an infant who lives but a few days,
or an old man who does not fill out his days,
for the young man shall die a hundred years old,
and the sinner a hundred years old shall be accursed.

How can I ignore that this prophecy BEGINS with:

Isaiah 65:17
“For behold, I create new heavens
and a new earth,
and the former things shall not be remembered
or come into mind.

Or how can I fail to consider this, when I read Is 65:

1 Corinthians 15:23-26, 54
But each in his own order: Christ the firstfruits, then at his coming those who belong to Christ. Then comes the end, when he delivers the kingdom to God the Father after destroying every rule and every authority and power. For he must reign until he has put all his enemies under his feet. The last enemy to be destroyed is death…
When the perishable puts on the imperishable, and the mortal puts on immortality, then shall come to pass the saying that is written:
“Death is swallowed up in victory.”

You may see a gap appearing in this text, but I simply do not. The most straightforward reading of this text is that Christ returns and ‘then’ comes the end, when those who ‘belong to him’ are resurrected and ‘death is defeated’. When reading Is 65 and assuming, as you do, that it refers to a Millennium, we must infer that death is only ‘somewhat’ defeated. That is NOT what 1 Cor 15 rejoices!



I know you see many interesting things in the OT, but I have trouble aligning some of them with the NT. And the NT ought to, I believe, be the Rosetta Stone, in many regards. What was in shadow and type in the OT, has been revealed in the NT through the revelation of Christ and God’s plan of salvation. If we cannot harmonise things with the NT, then I believe we have an issue with our doctrine.
And I’m afraid, I do not see a Millennial period. We see repeatedly that when Christ returns, events occur that do not allow for certain ‘conditions’ that many claim must take place within this earthly Millennium. We have the unrighteous being judged into eternal torment (2 Thess 1:7-10; Matt 25:41), the righteous being raised into resurrected bodies (1 Cor 15:23-26,54; 1 Thess 4:16-17)….this two facts will mean that neither just nor unjust will be available to go into the Millenium in natural bodies. It will also mean that death has been defeated and sin is no more, since sin is the sting of death and deaths sting is no more (1 Cor 15:56).
We also know that when Christ comes, the cosmos will burn (7,10-12), and it speaks of the earth in the same passages (v5, v10). So…if the heavens and earth pass away and are ‘made new’…then doesn’t it stand to reason that any time or…’age’ after that becomes the ‘new age’ or the ‘age to come’? And ANY time in the NT the ‘age to come’ is talked about, it is ALWAYS talked about in ways of ‘things eternal’.

So…I guess I’d just really like those questions answered. How do you explain all those ^^^ facts with what you see in the OT. Because with the NT being later revelation that very often EXPLAINS much of the OT, I’d rather base my understanding on the clear texts in the NT, then on some of the unclearer ones in the OT.

I mean. If it really comes down to it, I don’t suppose I’ll be super disappointed if I’m wrong. If Christ shows up and announces he’s here for a 1000 years of a paradise-like reign on earth, I’m hardly likely to complain, now am I?

Hey we agree!

PS, Isaiah 65:17-20 and Revelation 21:1-4 are "Parallel" readings explaining the New Heaven, Earth, Jerusalem

Jesus Is The Lord

Isaiah 65:17-20KJV
17 For, behold, I create new heavens and a new earth: and the former shall not be remembered, nor come into mind.
18 But be ye glad and rejoice for ever in that which I create: for, behold, I create Jerusalem a rejoicing, and her people a joy.
19 And I will rejoice in Jerusalem, and joy in my people: and the voice of weeping shall be no more heard in her, nor the voice of crying.
20 There shall be no more thence an infant of days, nor an old man that hath not filled his days: for the child shall die an hundred years old; but the sinner being an hundred years old shall be accursed.

Revelation 21:1-4KJV
And I saw a new heaven and a new earth: for the first heaven and the first earth were passed away; and there was no more sea.
2 And I John saw the holy city, new Jerusalem, coming down from God out of heaven, prepared as a bride adorned for her husband.
3 And I heard a great voice out of heaven saying, Behold, the tabernacle of God is with men, and he will dwell with them, and they shall be his people, and God himself shall be with them, and be their God.
4 And God shall wipe away all tears from their eyes; and there shall be no more death, neither sorrow, nor crying, neither shall there be any more pain: for the former things are passed away.

 

[Keraz]

How can I ignore that this prophecy BEGINS with:

Nobody who reads their Bible ignores Prophecy, they just misapply it. And keep in mind that all the Prophesies excepting the sequence of Revelation is; a little here, a little there.
Isaiah 66:17 does prophecy the future New heavens and earth. When? Revelation 21:1 makes it clear: AFTER the Millennium.
Isaiah 66:18-25 then describes how it will be during the Millennium. Obviously NOT the Eternal state, proved by verse 23, where they have children.

There IS a gap of a thousand years between 1 Corinthians 15:23 to 24-25
verse 23 describes the Return, when Jesus will resurrect the GT martyrs. Revelation 20:4
After the thousand years as stated six times in Rev 20, has passed; when all of His enemies are disposed of; Revelation 19:1 and 20:9 THEN comes the end, when Jesus will hand the Kingdom back to the Father and everyone who has ever lived, will stand in Judgment and those worthy will receive immortality.

I mean. If it really comes down to it, I don’t suppose I’ll be super disappointed if I’m wrong. If Christ shows up and announces he’s here for a 1000 years of a paradise-like reign on earth, I’m hardly likely to complain, now am I?

Right. After all this is not a Salvation issue.
However, those who have failed to understand God plans for our future, may be disadvantaged and those who teach and promote false theories, will suffer a loss of rewards. 1 Corinthians 3:13-15

 

[Marty fox]

Yes. Because all of Ezekiel 40 to 48 refers to the Millennium period, BEFORE Eternity and immortality id given to those whose names are found in the Book of Life. Rev 20:11-15

We have discussed this before on the other site but what would be the reason for a literal millennium which only reverts back to Old Testament rituals which only pointed to Jesus?

The millennium is symbolic for the church age. Jesus already sits on a throne in heaven which is greater than any earthly throne.

The Jews had the messiahs kingdom wrong at the first advent and I believe that a lot of the church still have Jesus reigning wrong today

 

[Naomi25]

Nobody who reads their Bible ignores Prophecy, they just misapply it. And keep in mind that all the Prophesies excepting the sequence of Revelation is; a little here, a little there.
Isaiah 66:17 does prophecy the future New heavens and earth. When? Revelation 21:1 makes it clear: AFTER the Millennium.
Isaiah 66:18-25 then describes how it will be during the Millennium. Obviously NOT the Eternal state, proved by verse 23, where they have children.

yeah….you see. I have a problem with that. Because, while I accept that some OT prophecy, about Christ, for example, was indeed “a little here, a little there”, I have a bit of a hard time believing that a passage that begins with “i make a new heavens and a new earth” and then goes on to talk about certain things has just jumped backwards to a different age. Especially in light of the NT.
The REASON the prophecies of Christ were cut up ‘here and there’ was because he was, more or less, on a stealth mission. Paul said in 1 Cor 2:8 that if Satan and his ‘rulers’ had understood God’s ‘game plan’, they never would have “crucified the Lord of Glory”. Had God trotted out his plan in the OT, not only would the Jews have known the specs of their Messiah and his plan of salvation, so too would have the enemy.
Since the NT has come to us, no such hidden purpose has been necessary, and so the gospel plan has been spoken outwardly, the things hidden in the OT made plain. So…my question still remains…IF Isaiah 65 is speaking about an extra ‘age’, why don’t we SEE it in the NT at all?

.
There IS a gap of a thousand years between 1 Corinthians 15:23 to 24-25
verse 23 describes the Return, when Jesus will resurrect the GT martyrs. Revelation 20:4
After the thousand years as stated six times in Rev 20, when all of His enemies are disposed of; Revelation 19:1 and 20:9
THEN comes the end, when Jesus will hand the Kingdom back to the Father and everyone who has ever lived, will stand in Judgment and those worthy will receive immortality.

You keep claiming that, but you have no authority to. It does not SAY it! It does not SUGGEST it.

“But each in his own order: Christ the firstfruits, then at his coming those who belong to Christ. Then comes the end, when he delivers the kingdom to God the Father after destroying every rule and every authority and power. For he must reign until he has put all his enemies under his feet. The last enemy to be destroyed is death…”

Christ the first fruits. That is clearly his own resurrection/ascension, which was about 2000 years ago, give or take. We can agree on that, I think.
THEN AT his coming, those who belong to to Christ. This is the resurrection event for Christians at his coming. The “behold, I tell you a mystery” (1 Cor 15:50-55, 1 Thess 4:15-17).
You claim that there is a 1000 year gap between the next ‘THEN’ which is ‘the end’. But, what if we can find other verses that LINK Christ’s COMING and the RESURRECTION…with THE END (Matt 13:39,43; Matt 24:30-31; 1 Thess 4:15-16; 2 Pet 3:4,10)? That almost forces the issue, does it not, and takes away any chance of a gap being there?

And…what about the fact that the text above storms on and says that the Kingdom is handed over WHEN ‘the end comes’, AFTER all powers are defeated, the last one being death. The powers are being ruled over NOW (Eph 1:20) and their defeat and Death’s defeat happens AT his return, which is also AT the resurrection…which is WHAT defeats death. It’s all tied together! You cannot separate them, not with 1000 years. I just cannot see how you can biblically pry them apart.

Right. After all this is not a Salvation issue.
However, those who have failed to understand God plans for our future, may be disadvantaged and those who teach and promote false theories, will suffer a loss of rewards. 1 Corinthians 3:13-15
.

Perhaps.
There’s a lot of people out there claiming to have the only true interpretation of God’s holy writ.
A person has to do their level best to read the bible with an open heart and wrestle in prayer with it and be in faith that God will either open their eyes or be understanding that they tried their best.
Either way, I’m not looking for ‘being right’…I’m looking for ‘God’s truth’, and that’s all I really care about.

 

[Truth7t7]

Nobody who reads their Bible ignores Prophecy, they just misapply it. And keep in mind that all the Prophesies excepting the sequence of Revelation is; a little here, a little there.
Isaiah 66:17 does prophecy the future New heavens and earth. When? Revelation 21:1 makes it clear: AFTER the Millennium.
Isaiah 66:18-25 then describes how it will be during the Millennium. Obviously NOT the Eternal state, proved by verse 23, where they have children.

There IS a gap of a thousand years between 1 Corinthians 15:23 to 24-25
verse 23 describes the Return, when Jesus will resurrect the GT martyrs. Revelation 20:4
After the thousand years as stated six times in Rev 20, has passed; when all of His enemies are disposed of; Revelation 19:1 and 20:9 THEN comes the end, when Jesus will hand the Kingdom back to the Father and everyone who has ever lived, will stand in Judgment and those worthy will receive immortality.


Right. After all this is not a Salvation issue.
However, those who have failed to understand God plans for our future, may be disadvantaged and those who teach and promote false theories, will suffer a loss of rewards. 1 Corinthians 3:13-15

The words seen below are of the New Heaven and Earth, not a Millennial Kingdom as you claim, no wool is pulled over this believers eyes

Isaiah 66:18-23KJV
18 For I know their works and their thoughts: it shall come, that I will gather all nations and tongues; and they shall come, and see my glory.
19 And I will set a sign among them, and I will send those that escape of them unto the nations, to Tarshish, Pul, and Lud, that draw the bow, to Tubal, and Javan, to the isles afar off, that have not heard my fame, neither have seen my glory; and they shall declare my glory among the Gentiles.
20 And they shall bring all your brethren for an offering unto the Lord out of all nations upon horses, and in chariots, and in litters, and upon mules, and upon swift beasts, to my holy mountain Jerusalem, saith the Lord, as the children of Israel bring an offering in a clean vessel into the house of the Lord.
21 And I will also take of them for priests and for Levites, saith the Lord.
22 For as the new heavens and the new earth, which I will make, shall remain before me, saith the Lord, so shall your seed and your name remain.
23 And it shall come to pass, that from one new moon to another, and from one sabbath to another, shall all flesh come to worship before me, saith the Lord.

There isnt a 1,000 year gap between verses 23/24 below as you claim, that would be adding something to scripture not seen "Beware"!

1 Corinthians 15:23-26KJV
23 But every man in his own order: Christ the firstfruits; afterward they that are Christ's at his coming.
24 Then cometh the end, when he shall have delivered up the kingdom to God, even the Father; when he shall have put down all rule and all authority and power.
25 For he must reign, till he hath put all enemies under his feet.
26 The last enemy that shall be destroyed is death.

 

[Keraz]

IF Isaiah 65 is speaking about an extra ‘age’, why don’t we SEE it in the NT at all?

But the NT does and very plainly; in Revelation 20.
Jesus also prophesied His reward of Kingship in Luke 13:32. 2 'days' of the Christian era, then the final 'day' of the Millennium.
Also as stated in Psalms 2 and in other prophesies.

their defeat and Death’s defeat happens AT his return, which is also AT the resurrection…which is WHAT defeats death. It’s all tied together! You cannot separate them, not with 1000 years. I just cannot see how you can biblically pry them apart.

Revelation 21:4 is crystal clear: Death is finally no more AFTER the Millennium.
Jesus demonstrated His power over Death, but the plain fact is; we humans have kept on dying and will continue to die in the Millennium. Albeit; we will live for much longer. Isaiah 65:20

The words seen below are of the New Heaven and Earth, not a Millennial Kingdom as you claim, no wool is pulled over this believers eyes

Actually; Isaiah 66:18b-21 refers to the time before Jesus Returns. When all the faithful Christian peoples go to live in all of the holy Land. Isaiah 62:1-5 As detailed in Ezekiel 40 to 48. Their travel is described in Psalms 107.

There isnt a 1,000 year gap between verses 23/24 below as you claim, that would be adding something to scripture not seen "Beware"!

Yes; people need to beware of your forcefully promoted beliefs and opinions.
Just posting scripture without any proof of what you believe, is just a waste of space and I for one simply scroll over all your posts.

 

[Truth7t7]

Just posting scripture without any proof of what you believe, is just a waste of space and I for one simply scroll over all your posts.

From a poster that claims a 1,000 year Kingdom on this earth, is seen between verses 23-24 below

1 Corinthians 15:23-26KJV
23 But every man in his own order: Christ the firstfruits; afterward they that are Christ's at his coming.
24 Then cometh the end, when he shall have delivered up the kingdom to God, even the Father; when he shall have put down all rule and all authority and power.
25 For he must reign, till he hath put all enemies under his feet.
26 The last enemy that shall be destroyed is death.

 

[Marty fox]

But the NT does and very plainly; in Revelation 20.
Jesus also prophesied His reward of Kingship in Luke 13:32. 2 'days' of the Christian era, then the final 'day' of the Millennium.
Also as stated in Psalms 2 and in other prophesies.

Revelation 21:4 is crystal clear: Death is finally no more AFTER the Millennium.
Jesus demonstrated His power over Death, but the plain fact is; we humans have kept on dying and will continue to die in the Millennium. Albeit; we will live for much longer. Isaiah 65:20

Actually; Isaiah 66:18b-21 refers to the time before Jesus Returns. When all the faithful Christian peoples go to live in all of the holy Land. Isaiah 62:1-5 As detailed in Ezekiel 40 to 48. Their travel is described in Psalms 107.

Yes; people need to beware of your forcefully promoted beliefs and opinions.
Just posting scripture without any proof of what you believe, is just a waste of space and I for one simply scroll over all your posts.

What revelation chapter 20 doesn’t say is that it’s a time of peace and on the earth or even Jesus being on the earth.

Also it says that satan and his people surround the city God loves it doesn’t mention that it surrounds Jesus and the city God loves

 

[Marty fox]

I dont fully understand the leaves from the tree of life being used for healing/medicine, but it clearly states the fruit is used for meat/food also

You dont have to worry Marty, your gonna be a fish, if I catch you in my net I'll let you go

Spiritual food

So if we are in our new bodies do we still need healing?

If it doesn’t fit then there must be another proper interpretation

 

[Keraz]

What revelation chapter 20 doesn’t say is that it’s a time of peace and on the earth or even Jesus being on the earth.

We are informed about how it will be elsewhere in the Bible. Zechariah 14:16-21 for example.
Your comment is typical of those who don't read ALL of the prophesies.

Also it says that satan and his people surround the city God loves it doesn’t mention that it surrounds Jesus and the city God loves

That will happen after the Millennium. Revelation 20:7-10
Jesus will be there. Psalms 110:2

 

[ScottA]

Gods words clearly show (Two Israel's) below

1.) Israel of the flesh (Jews)

2.) Israel of the promised seed (Church)

Scripture clearly teaches Israel of the flesh, they aren't the children of God, it's that simple

Romans 9:6-8KJV

6 Not as though the word of God hath taken none effect. For they are not all Israel, which are of Israel: 7 Neither, because they are the seed of Abraham, are they all children: but, In Isaac shall thy seed be called. 8 That is, They which are the children of the flesh, these are not the children of God: but the children of the promise are counted for the seed.

Yes the Kingdom of God has been taken from National Ethnic Israel, And Given To The Church, a "Holy Nation" as clearly seen below

Matthew 21:43KJV

3 Therefore say I unto you, The kingdom of God shall be taken from you, and given to a nation bringing forth the fruits thereof.

1 Peter 2:9KJV

9 But ye are a chosen generation, a royal priesthood, an holy nation, a peculiar people; that ye should shew forth the praises of him who hath called you out of darkness into his marvellous light;

Your Original Post is great. But there is another distinction that should be noted:

The Israel of the Old Testament are Gods "chosen people", a people who were not a people, chosen out of the nations to be His people, His servants, and a light unto the [other] nations.

But the distinction is this: Old Testament Israel were those who received the promises of God regarding salvation. As such, however, having lived before salvation came through Christ Jesus (the Last of Israel), they died in their sins, and therefore are "the dead in Christ."

To the contrary, "the living in Christ" are those who have been born [again] of the Spirit, whom Christ did not send until after His ascension to the Father. These are the church, built according to Jesus' explanation to Peter, who received the knowledge of who Jesus was from the Father-- which was how His church would be built... "The Lord is my rock." 2 Samuel 22:2​

 

[Truth7t7]

Spiritual food

So if we are in our new bodies do we still need healing?

If it doesn’t fit then there must be another proper interpretation

A descriptive picture of Gods house in New Jerusalem, will you symbolize this also?

Revelation 21:1-27KJV
1 And I saw a new heaven and a new earth: for the first heaven and the first earth were passed away; and there was no more sea.
2 And I John saw the holy city, new Jerusalem, coming down from God out of heaven, prepared as a bride adorned for her husband.
3 And I heard a great voice out of heaven saying, Behold, the tabernacle of God is with men, and he will dwell with them, and they shall be his people, and God himself shall be with them, and be their God.
4 And God shall wipe away all tears from their eyes; and there shall be no more death, neither sorrow, nor crying, neither shall there be any more pain: for the former things are passed away.
5 And he that sat upon the throne said, Behold, I make all things new. And he said unto me, Write: for these words are true and faithful.
6 And he said unto me, It is done. I am Alpha and Omega, the beginning and the end. I will give unto him that is athirst of the fountain of the water of life freely.
7 He that overcometh shall inherit all things; and I will be his God, and he shall be my son.
8 But the fearful, and unbelieving, and the abominable, and murderers, and whoremongers, and sorcerers, and idolaters, and all liars, shall have their part in the lake which burneth with fire and brimstone: which is the second death.
9 And there came unto me one of the seven angels which had the seven vials full of the seven last plagues, and talked with me, saying, Come hither, I will shew thee the bride, the Lamb's wife.
10 And he carried me away in the spirit to a great and high mountain, and shewed me that great city, the holy Jerusalem, descending out of heaven from God,
11 Having the glory of God: and her light was like unto a stone most precious, even like a jasper stone, clear as crystal;
12 And had a wall great and high, and had twelve gates, and at the gates twelve angels, and names written thereon, which are the names of the twelve tribes of the children of Israel:
13 On the east three gates; on the north three gates; on the south three gates; and on the west three gates.
14 And the wall of the city had twelve foundations, and in them the names of the twelve apostles of the Lamb.
15 And he that talked with me had a golden reed to measure the city, and the gates thereof, and the wall thereof.
16 And the city lieth foursquare, and the length is as large as the breadth: and he measured the city with the reed, twelve thousand furlongs. The length and the breadth and the height of it are equal.
17 And he measured the wall thereof, an hundred and forty and four cubits, according to the measure of a man, that is, of the angel.
18 And the building of the wall of it was of jasper: and the city was pure gold, like unto clear glass.
19 And the foundations of the wall of the city were garnished with all manner of precious stones. The first foundation was jasper; the second, sapphire; the third, a chalcedony; the fourth, an emerald;
20 The fifth, sardonyx; the sixth, sardius; the seventh, chrysolyte; the eighth, beryl; the ninth, a topaz; the tenth, a chrysoprasus; the eleventh, a jacinth; the twelfth, an amethyst.
21 And the twelve gates were twelve pearls: every several gate was of one pearl: and the street of the city was pure gold, as it were transparent glass.
22 And I saw no temple therein: for the Lord God Almighty and the Lamb are the temple of it.
23 And the city had no need of the sun, neither of the moon, to shine in it: for the glory of God did lighten it, and the Lamb is the light thereof.
24 And the nations of them which are saved shall walk in the light of it: and the kings of the earth do bring their glory and honour into it.
25 And the gates of it shall not be shut at all by day: for there shall be no night there.
26 And they shall bring the glory and honour of the nations into it.
27 And there shall in no wise enter into it any thing that defileth, neither whatsoever worketh abomination, or maketh a lie: but they which are written in the Lamb's book of life.

 

[Naomi25]

But the NT does and very plainly; in Revelation 20.

Plainly? Revelation is many things, plain is not one of them. And there are several, valid, I believe, reasons for viewing the 1000 years mentioned in Chapter 20 to be viewed with caution when measuring it against a ‘separate age’.
The first is obvious and I’ve mentioned it before; the rest of the NT only speaks of two ages: this and the next - the temporal and the eternal, the sinful and the perfect. As well as the obvious events that happen when Christ returns that make the usual teachings of life within the Millennium hard to swallow.
Then there is the fact that Rev 20 places this ’Millennium’ BEFORE the final defeat of death. But we know death is defeated AT Christ’s return and the resurrection of the faithful in him. Hardly an ‘end of Millennium’ event. So that just doesn’t make sense, timeline wise.
And then, of course, we can point to the fact that numbers are often, or even always, used in symbolic ways in Revelation.
All together, and, like I said, I hesitate greatly to say that the NT ‘plainly’ speaks of a Millennium. I wouldn’t say that at all.

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Jesus also prophesied His reward of Kingship in Luke 13:32. 2 'days' of the Christian era, then the final 'day' of the Millennium.

Again…hardly a ‘plain’ reference to a Millennium. I would think anyone reading that verse would be more inclined to see the three days Christ mentioned to be a ‘plain’ reference to the 3 days he was in the grave…the third the one he rose on.

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Also as stated in Psalms 2 and in other prophesies.

Sorry. But, I just don’t see it. I see promises referring to a glorious, inevitable future, eternal King, one who will destroy all enemies and nations who reject him upon his coming…but nothing that points ‘clearly or plainly’ to an ‘age’ between ‘this age’ and ‘the age to come’….which, might I remind you, is the stated progress of the future laid out by scripture…not by myself.

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Revelation 21:4 is crystal clear: Death is finally no more AFTER the Millennium.
Jesus demonstrated His power over Death, but the plain fact is; we humans have kept on dying and will continue to die in the Millennium. Albeit; we will live for much longer. Isaiah 65:20

Yes…Rev 20-21 is fairly clear…death is defeated AFTER the ‘millennium’. But…instead of then, therefore, letting yourself be guided somewhat when you come to 1 Cor 15 which also CLEARLY tells us that death is defeated AT Christ’s coming and the resurrection of his believers, you are forced, instead, to insert a gap into that passage in order to continue to validate your system.
The ONLY reason I have arrived where I am at a quasi-Amillennial stance, is because I could NOT ignore 1 Cor 15 in light of Rev 20 and vice versa.

 

[farouk]

According to 1 Corinthians 10.32, Israel (Jews) seems definitely to be distinct from the church.