Is anyone else a Seer?

[VictoryinJesus]

2co 3:14	But their minds were blinded: for until this day remaineth the same veil untaken away in the reading of the old testament; which veil is done away in Christ.
2co 3:15	But even unto this day, when Moses is read, the veil is upon their heart.
2co 3:16	Nevertheless when it shall turn to the Lord, the veil shall be taken away.
2co 3:17	Now the Lord is that Spirit: and where the Spirit of the Lord is, there is liberty.

Makes me think too of Paul speaking to the Corinthians. I think that is one reason it stood out


Hithpael) to look at each other, face

How he tells them they do not yet see they( Paul and those helping in the ministry) are not those who fail or are not reprobates. He tells them that “even though” we still appear unto you as reprobate…do no wrong. Do what is right. To me Paul is telling them the vail remains and they cant yet look and see Christ speaks in Paul. I don’t know how to put it into words but it stands out to me with what you posted even between brothers where the vain remains and they can’t look, face to face. All the times of “I long to see you face to face.” “We will gladly be weak that you be made strong, this we hope, even your perfection, be made complete.” To me Paul keeps urging them the vail remains where they still see him as reprobate. Even when brother turns to brother face to face, the vail taken away.

 

[Peterlag]

This is one of applications provided by my Strongs. Perhaps for a moment, the moment when the Seer sees something, he is in effect close to being face to face with God. Is that not what the "then" is here?

1co 13:12

For now we see through a glass, darkly; but then face to face: now I know in part; but then shall I know even as also I am known.

The Seer [or Prophet] would "then" for moment be where all of us want to be finally? Consider Solomon's word here:

Pr 29:18

Where there is no vision, the people perish...

All of us need to have a vision... and if we are really serving God, I believe that we do.

I think the word "vision" in Proverbs 29:18 is not really a good translation for our currant English understanding of how we use the word today. Vision could be better translated as Revelation or the Word of God that came from the Prophet.

 

[Wrangler]

When you received your vision you received the Lord's spirit giving you information.

Yup. What semantic point are you trying to make in comparison to receiving a prophecy?

One frequent criticism against seers is a claim that the final word to the world from God has already been spoken. That may be true. The prophecy I received was not a general truth the whole world needs to know about. It was only meant for an audience of one, my doctor.

 

[Peterlag]

Yup. What semantic point are you trying to make in comparison to receiving a prophecy?

One frequent criticism against seers is a claim that the final word to the world from God has already been spoken. That may be true. The prophecy I received was not a general truth the whole world needs to know about. It was only meant for an audience of one, my doctor.

This conversation started when I said nobody's seeing into the future. They are only having God show them what He plans on doing. You came in with my vision was not God telling me what He planed on doing. My response to you was your vision is God giving you information. Information about what He plans on doing or information about your doctor is my semantic point.

 

[Peterlag]

On a little different note we have this...

 

[Behold]

This is excellent!!! He provides, you receive without asking!!!!!!! thanks!

If God calls you to a specific ministry, or to a specific ministering, ...say........... you are called to give the next 10 yrs of your life, to street orphans, in some secluded village on the backside in France..
Well, lets say you dont speak "French". You dont possess the ability to speak their native "Tongue".

Yet you agreed to go.......>"yes God, i will".......and now you are in France..

What does God have to do so that His ministry through you.... is a success..?????
He has to empower you with His Spirit, to be able to do it........and then He has to give you a "Gift of tongues".. the French Language, and probably a few dialects, also, so that you can do what God sent you to do.

All The "spiritual gifts" have a purpose.......just like that.

 

[amadeus]

Makes me think too of Paul speaking to the Corinthians. I think that is one reason it stood out


Hithpael) to look at each other, face

How he tells them they do not yet see they( Paul and those helping in the ministry) are not those who fail or are not reprobates. He tells them that “even though” we still appear unto you as reprobate…do no wrong. Do what is right. To me Paul is telling them the vail remains and they cant yet look and see Christ speaks in Paul. I don’t know how to put it into words but it stands out to me with what you posted even between brothers where the vain remains and they can’t look, face to face. All the times of “I long to see you face to face.” “We will gladly be weak that you be made strong, this we hope, even your perfection, be made complete.” To me Paul keeps urging them the vail remains where they still see him as reprobate. Even when brother turns to brother face to face, the vail taken away.

Those in the OT could not bear to look on the face of Moses, so he covered himself. Moses, led by God, was leading the Way, but the people rebelled against him and effectively against God himself.

Nu 14:22	Because all those men which have seen my glory, and my miracles, which I did in Egypt and in the wilderness, and have tempted me now these ten times, and have not hearkened to my voice;
Nu 14:23	Surely they shall not see the land which I sware unto their fathers, neither shall any of them that provoked me see it:

The heathen or gentile is unable to see things of God at all, but how many believers are still seeing through darkened glass? Does following the ways of men or our own ways keep us in darker areas or even cause to fall into a ditch where some leader leads us? Who is my brother, or who should he be?

Mt 12:47	Then one said unto him, Behold, thy mother and thy brethren stand without, desiring to speak with thee.
Mt 12:48	But he answered and said unto him that told him, Who is my mother? and who are my brethren?
Mt 12:49	And he stretched forth his hand toward his disciples, and said, Behold my mother and my brethren!
Mt 12:50	For whosoever shall do the will of my Father which is in heaven, the same is my brother, and sister, and mother.

 

[amadeus]

I think the word "vision" in Proverbs 29:18 is not really a good translation for our currant English understanding of how we use the word today. Vision could be better translated as Revelation or the Word of God that came from the Prophet.

This may indeed hold true for some people. How well do we see or understand the things of God?

Re 3:18

I counsel thee to buy of me gold tried in the fire, that thou mayest be rich; and white raiment, that thou mayest be clothed, and that the shame of thy nakedness do not appear; and anoint thine eyes with eyesalve, that thou mayest see.

What is this "eyesalve" if not the Holy Spirit?

 

[VictoryinJesus]

Those in the OT could not bear to look on the face of Moses, so he covered himself. Moses, led by God, was leading the Way, but the people rebelled against him and effectively against God himself.

Nu 14:22	Because all those men which have seen my glory, and my miracles, which I did in Egypt and in the wilderness, and have tempted me now these ten times, and have not hearkened to my voice;
Nu 14:23	Surely they shall not see the land which I sware unto their fathers, neither shall any of them that provoked me see it:

The heathen or gentile is unable to see things of God at all, but how many believers are still seeing through darkened glass? Does following the ways of men or our own ways keep us in darker areas or even cause to fall into a ditch where some leader leads us? Who is my brother, or who should he be?

Mt 12:47	Then one said unto him, Behold, thy mother and thy brethren stand without, desiring to speak with thee.
Mt 12:48	But he answered and said unto him that told him, Who is my mother? and who are my brethren?
Mt 12:49	And he stretched forth his hand toward his disciples, and said, Behold my mother and my brethren!
Mt 12:50	For whosoever shall do the will of my Father which is in heaven, the same is my brother, and sister, and mother.

Yes …but honestly that one confuses me. I get His saying whosoever shall do the Will of my Father which is in heaven, the same is my brother, and sister, and mother.

But that leaves questions about His mother and brother “without” (my bold isn’t working) desiring to speak to Him. Considering He was about to go without and suffer without the gate to make ready a people. Where even Paul mentioned going “without the gate” to bear His reproach with Him. To me it’s like when they cried Lazarus was dead and he took His time getting there …personally I don’t think He left them without desiring to speak with Him but knew He was going without the gate. Then spoke to those going without the gate with Him. Just an opinion.

 

[amadeus]

Yes …but honestly that one confuses me. I get His saying whosoever shall do the Will of my Father which is in heaven, the same is my brother, and sister, and mother.

But that leaves questions about His mother and brother “without” (my bold isn’t working) desiring to speak to Him. Considering He was about to go without and suffer without the gate to make ready a people. Where even Paul mentioned going “without the gate” to bear His reproach with Him. To me it’s like when they cried Lazarus was dead and he took His time getting there …personally I don’t think He left them without desiring to speak with Him but knew He was going without the gate. Then spoke to those going without the gate with Him. Just an opinion.

Did Jesus know who would be a brother or sister? Were they only among the physical Jews [Israelites or children of Jacob]? Why did Jesus engage the Samaritan woman by the well even speaking to her about Living Water? [John 4:9] Why did he first ignore seemingly test the Syrophenecian woman and then after effectively calling her a dog, heal her child? [Mark 7:26]

Who are the ignorant heathens who would be Israelites?

Ro 9:6

Not as though the word of God hath taken none effect. For they are not all Israel, which are of Israel:

Who are the knowledgeable Jews who are really children of the devil?

Joh 8:43	Why do ye not understand my speech? even because ye cannot hear my word.
Joh 8:44	Ye are of your father the devil, and the lusts of your father ye will do. He was a murderer from the beginning, and abode not in the truth, because there is no truth in him. When he speaketh a lie, he speaketh of his own: for he is a liar, and the father of it.

 

[Cassandra]

If God calls you to a specific ministry, or to a specific ministering, ...say........... you are called to give the next 10 yrs of your life, to street orphans, in some secluded village on the backside in France..
Well, lets say you dont speak "French". You dont possess the ability to speak their native "Tongue".

Yet you agreed to go.......>"yes God, i will".......and now you are in France..

What does God have to do so that His ministry through you.... is a success..?????
He has to empower you with His Spirit, to be able to do it........and then He has to give you a "Gift of tongues".. the French Language, and probably a few dialects, also, so that you can do what God sent you to do.

All The "spiritual gifts" have a purpose.......just like that.

Wonderful! I believe I have been given the gift of "helps" and serve in the church's kitchen feeding others. It is an honor. I am so thankful that I can share Christ through helps.

 

[Behold]

Wonderful! I believe I have been given the gift of "helps" and serve in the church's kitchen feeding others. It is an honor. I am so thankful that I can share Christ through helps.

That's a wonderful gift.

That gift to a believer is given to people who have a heart to learn, and they tend to have the 2 most important abilities that a Christian can ever possess.

1.) Availability

2.) Dependability


Born again Nuns, often have that core gift, and that is why they are so "charitable".. They tend to see everything as a "way to serve someone"., and that is the very Heart of Christ, Himself.

Christ's heart is a "servant's heart" and the gift of "Helps" is the gift of " a servant's heart".

 

[Carl Emerson]

I never thought about this!!!!

This is excellent!!! He provides, you receive without asking!!!!!!! thanks!

1 Corinthians 14:1
Pursue love, yet earnestly desire spiritual gifts, but especially that you may prophesy.

 

[Cassandra]

1 Corinthians 14:1
Pursue love, yet earnestly desire spiritual gifts, but especially that you may prophesy.

I dont think you mean to tell the future. You mean to explain things so they will be understood and to edify the church, right?

 

[Behold]

I dont think you mean to tell the future. You mean to explain things so they will be understood and to edify the church, right?

Give Him some time to go to Google and Wikipedia, and look it up, so that he can come and try to explain it... as if he could, he would have explained it, vs just posting a verse.

But you are correct....

That "gift" is not some idea that religious fakers have that would define it as "prophetic utterance".

Its not some spiritual trance you fall into so that you can predict the price of tea in China, in the year... '2345

Its not St Bernadette literally seeing "The Lady" appear 18 times, in a Grotto, in Lourdes France

Actually its the gift, spiritual, whereby God causes a Preacher-Teacher, to open your heart to receive from God.

You'll find it sometimes, in a Church Service, where you "feel that the message was just for me"..

Or you'll realize that you were thinking about that, and the Preacher just gave a sermon on what you had been thinking about last week, or this morning...

Or some Teacher, can open verses, and the hearer has this reaction.......>"I SEE THAT, and i never saw that before".... In other words they can make a verse come alive inside your inner understanding......and never is that done by using this false method...

=:"""""Well, here in the Greek, or in the HEBREW... we see that the word means, and the verse is not correct in the bible, but, here in the Greek or Hebrew, we find the understanding."""""

No you dont.

You find the Translators understanding that you are reading, or is being read to you by that faker, who wants to try to use Greek or Hebrew, to fool you into perceiving them as a "man-woman of God"...
Its a con Job.

 

[Carl Emerson]

I dont think you mean to tell the future. You mean to explain things so they will be understood and to edify the church, right?

I tend to let scripture speak for itself.

I simply pointed out that to earnestly desire the Spiritual gifts is taught by Paul.

 

[Wrangler]

This conversation started when I said nobody's seeing into the future. They are only having God show them what He plans on doing.

is my semantic point.

A distinction without a difference.

And it’s sad you ignored my experience, which was not God’s plan!

 

[Behold]

I simply pointed out that to earnestly desire the Spiritual gifts is taught by Paul.

Paul actually said to "earnestly desire the BEST or Greater = Gifts"... not just "desire spiritual Gifts". 1 Cor 12:31,

And here is something interesting..

The most Carnal body of believers in the entire New Testament, are the Corinthian Christians.
They were spiritually ignorant, mean spirited, full of gossip and strife.... and "picked sides" against each other..>"no i LIKE THIS ONE"... vs.. "NO I LIKE THAT ONE"..
Paul was amazed that this carnal group, had no idea that """Jesus is in them... """"

So, these are the classic ... Hebrews 6:1, failures to develop..........and so, this is the "baby Christian" who never changed into anything beyond that situation.
And what do Babies desire? Little children?
They want GIFTS... "give me a Gift"... ....""""mama, we are in the store, what can i have, can i have that and that and that".

And So, its not just Ironic that the Baby Christians of the NT, were worried about "tongues" and "gifts.....more then anything else.

 

[Carl Emerson]

English Standard Version
Pursue love, and earnestly desire the spiritual gifts, especially that you may prophesy.

Berean Standard Bible
Earnestly pursue love and eagerly desire spiritual gifts, especially the gift of prophecy.

Berean Literal Bible
Earnestly pursue love, and earnestly desire spiritual gifts, and especially that you might prophesy.

King James Bible
Follow after charity, and desire spiritual gifts, but rather that ye may prophesy.

New King James Version
Pursue love, and desire spiritual gifts, but especially that you may prophesy.

New American Standard Bible
Pursue love, yet earnestly desire spiritual gifts, but especially that you may prophesy.

NASB 1995
Pursue love, yet desire earnestly spiritual gifts, but especially that you may prophesy.

NASB 1977
Pursue love, yet desire earnestly spiritual gifts, but especially that you may prophesy.

Legacy Standard Bible
Pursue love, yet earnestly desire spiritual gifts, but especially that you may prophesy.

Amplified Bible
Pursue [this] love [with eagerness, make it your goal], yet earnestly desire and cultivate the spiritual gifts [to be used by believers for the benefit of the church], but especially that you may prophesy [to foretell the future, to speak a new message from God to the people].

Christian Standard Bible
Pursue love and desire spiritual gifts, and especially that you may prophesy.

Holman Christian Standard Bible
Pursue love and desire spiritual gifts, and above all that you may prophesy.

American Standard Version
Follow after love; yet desire earnestly spiritual gifts, but rather that ye may prophesy.

 

[Hillsage]

Sorry Carl, I didn't see your post until after I posted mine. We were answering at the same time. Mine was just longer.

And here is the main issue...
When a person starts trying to pursue spiritual Gifts, they dont realize that The Devil will give you one, and if He does, you wont know its from Him.
See, Demonic Power counterfeits Gifts of the Spirit, just like Ministers of the Devil, (counterfeit)... behave and "sound like". real Christians.

You are influencing too many, time for me to speak up. Do you have a scripture for the above? Well I do.

1CO 12:31 But earnestly desire the higher gifts. And I will show you a still more excellent way.

The "higher gifts" are the spiritual gifts/charisma. And one of those "gifts" is the "discerning of spirits".

And the greater threat to being deceived by a false counterfeit spirit from the devil is going to more likely happen to those who are a Cessationist or a Fundamentalist. Those who don't even pursue the gifts based on bad teaching and fear IMO.

Why are we more spiritually covered? We had a sister get a false prayer 'tongue' language, supposedly her spirit.'s prayer tongue. And it was the gift of discernment that gave her brother the POWER to identify that false tongue spirit. And it was the gift of knowledge which allowed him to find out her problem came from still playing with a Ouija board as a Christian when she was seeking the baptism from the Holy Spirit. He cast out the evil spirit and re-baptized her with holy spirit power from the Holy Spirit of God and she received a different sounding tongue which bore witness with the brother's spirit.

A cessationist or Fundamentalist would be the more likely group to 'think' they had a true spiritual gift than a Charismatic or Pentecostal IMO.

So, if anyone here is going to chase the Gifts of the Spirit, for personal gain, or to come to a forum and have this compulsion to tell everyone .. I have this "gift". (look at me)... . .then there could be a problem.

The best thing to do, is serve God faithfully,, and if God needs you to have a Spiritual Gift, for a particular work, then He'll provide it to you reader., you won't even have to ask.., exactly as Peter didnt have to ask for Gift #9, on the day of Pentecost, as God provided it, as NEEDED, to Peter.

Yes, personal gain is not giving God the glory. And not seeking the spiritual tongue from our spirit praying to God in its 'heavenly, angelic spirit language' is mocking God's provision for having a spiritual gift God has given to ALL believers for personal prayer language from their spirit.

1CO 14:4 He who speaks in a (prayer) tongue edifies himself, but he who prophesies edifies the church.
5 Now I want you all to speak in tongues,

1CO 14:14 For if I pray in a tongue, my spirit prays...


Those who think God doesn't know best concerning who needs 'self edification' just may be thinking more highly of themselves than they ought.