Elect or Not Elect: Why ALL Should Be Alarmed

[Earburner]

Dear Earburner,

I have never deny it.

Hos 6:3 Then shall we know, if we follow on to know the LORD: his going forth is prepared as the morning; and he shall come unto us as the RAIN, as the latter and former RAIN unto the earth.

John 14:17 Even the Spirit of Truth (the Latter Rain); whom the world cannot receive, because it seeth him not, neither knoweth him: but ye know him; for he dwelleth with you, and shall be in you. 18 I will not leave you comfortless: I will come to you.

And the verse you like to quoted:

Rev 3:30 Behold, I stand at the door, and knock: if any man hear my voice, and open the door, I will come in to him (Latter Rain), and will sup with him, and he with me.

Christ is Spirit now and not flesh. He comes to us as the Early and Latter Rains.

Joe

You may not have denied it, but I don't believe that you have said it.

Do you not see/perceive that Jesus, who is the Spirit of truth is the symbolic Latter Rain. Therefore to receive Him, Himself, is the ONLY WAY THAT ONE HAS CHRIST.
Everyone who is only stirred by the "former rain", and remains to be "lukewarm"- indecisive, HATH NOT CHRIST!

 

[Earburner]

The flaw in mankind's heart is in its lack of strength. Because it is weak, our heart allows our flesh to govern it. This makes our heart have a carnal nature, which, in turn, makes our mind carnal as well. With a carnal mind, mankind puts the needs of the flesh ahead of the commandments of God. When we do that, we sin.

Which is to say, in man's mortal flesh, he has
self will, governed by the mind (brain) of their "natural man".

 

[One 2 question]

Which is to say, in man's mortal flesh, he has
self will, governed by the mind (brain) of their "natural man".

Isn't it comforting and reassuring to know that when we zoom in to a particular event we see the outworking of human will, then when we zoom out we see a sovereign Being Who is governing the human (and their will) in accordance with His divine will.

No wonder God encourages us to spend time with Him in heaven so we can see from His perspective and appreciate the exercising of His sovereignty in carrying out His script exactly as He first imagined it.

This is truly awesome! All glory to the Designers, Creators and Owners of all things.

 

[Earburner]

Isn't it comforting and reassuring to know that when we zoom in to a particular event we see the outworking of human will, then when we zoom out we see a sovereign Being Who is governing the human (and their will) in accordance with His divine will.

No wonder God encourages us to spend time with Him in heaven so we can see from His perspective and appreciate the exercising of His sovereignty in carrying out His script exactly as He first imagined it.

This is truly awesome! All glory to the Designers, Creators and Owners of all things.

So then, you agree that human self will is outside the Divine will of God. But, if it's not, then why did Jesus have to be "the Lamb of God", to be "The Savior" for us, as well as become "The Living House for God", who is a Spirit only, which no one but Jesus can see?

Do you not know that through Jesus, God the Father has been and still is "calling" us all back to Himself?

By your "self will" of your "natural man", have you heard His "knocking" on your heart, your innermost being? If so, then you have three choices:
1. Answer His knocking, and INVITE Him in.
2. Ignore His knocking, and let Him pass by.
3. Remain lukewarm, (aka indecisive), and do the best you can by your own good deeds.
Rev. 3:14-22.

 

[One 2 question]

So then, you agree that human self will is outside the Divine will of God.

Never could be and never can ever be. The Creators script is set. We fit within Their eternal story. Never has and never will They fit into our story. I'm so glad about that.

As someone quoted, The Creators ways are not the ways of those They created. The Creators see and know all things, we see and know so little. We are born thinking of ourself, we are self serving, doing things for our pleasure and glory in this temporary life. They think of what's best for Them, doing everything for Their pleasure and glory in the never ending eternity.

Nothing is outside Them, Their will and script.

 

[One 2 question]

According to Their script.

 

[One 2 question]

?

 

[One 2 question]

Yes absolutely, all according to Their will and Their story. Forever choosing to do with Their own creation as They please.

 

[One 2 question]

By your "self will" of your "natural man", have you heard His "knocking" on your heart, your innermost being? If so, then you have three choices:
1. Answer His knocking, and INVITE Him in.
2. Ignore His knocking, and let Him pass by.
3. Remain lukewarm, (aka indecisive), and do the best you can by your own good deeds.
Rev. 3:14-22

Yes absolutely, all according to Their will and Their story. Forever choosing to do with Their own creation as They please.

 

[Earburner]

Yes absolutely, all according to Their will and Their story. Forever choosing to do with Their own creation as They please.

A covenant is a contract BETWEEN two or more parties, which in God's mind is now His New covenant/contract for all people, to have faith in the mediating work of His Son Jesus, for the forgiveness and removal of their sins.
However, though the Atonement for sin is applied to all of mankind, is it not true that for those who are not willingly agreeable to the requirement TO HAVE FAITH IN God's New Covenant, through the blood of Jesus, they are NOT allowed to enter into the KoG, or "partake" (participate) in the benefits of His New Covenant of Atonement for their sins?
John 3:3-8.

 

[One 2 question]

However, though the Atonement for sin is applied to all of mankind, is it not true that for those who are not willingly agreeable to the requirement TO HAVE FAITH IN God's New Covenant, through the blood of Jesus, they are NOT allowed to enter into or participate with the benefits of His New Covenant of Atonement for their sins?

Yes I agree.

 

[One 2 question]

So then, you agree that human self will is outside the Divine will of God. But, if it's not, then why did Jesus have to be "the Lamb of God", to be "The Savior" for us

Because this is what They imagined at some stage in eternity, then brought it to pass. It was always Their plan for an offence to take place. As it was always within Their plan to produce a Sacrificial Lamb, a Saviour and Redeemer.

There will never be free radicals which would go outside of Their script. And what is pretty cool is that all that has and will ever will come to pass all exists with the Creators. I love this fact. It is super comforting knowing this.

I can do whatever I want and it will be simply the manifesting of Their predetermined storyline.

Are there consequences/benefits for my choices and actions? Absolutely! I experience them every day.

Lastly, to respond to the 'why' question. Many of the characteristics of the Creators would've remained hidden within Them if there was no sin, no offence.

 

[Earburner]

It was always Their plan for an offence to take place. As it was always within Their plan to produce a Sacrificial Lamb, a Saviour and Redeemer.

Do I Agree? Maybe,.... pending your reply:
It was Their PLAN to produce a Sacrificial Lamb, because Their PLAN was for an offense to take place.

Q. Now please, according to your thinking, HOW could there be "an offense to take place", if man never had FREE WILL to CHOOSE to OFFEND?

 

[One 2 question]

Do I Agree? Maybe,.... pending your reply:
It was Their PLAN to produce a Sacrificial Lamb, because Their PLAN was for an offense to take place.

Q. Now please, according to your thinking, HOW could there be "an offense to take place", if man never had FREE WILL to CHOOSE to OFFEND?

The Creators' plan was always to make (manipulate) the first humans so an offence took place. They designed and programmed them so that they would offend. And that they did.

It wasn't a random act that took Them by surprise, as some have conclude.

 

[Kabone]

Sorry, but not one of your finer responses.
The people asked why are we being judged for actions that are not ours? Paul says don’t ask the creator why he created you that way. Couple things. A) why not? I intend to for the purpose of seeking wisdom. 2) if my thoughts are not my own, my feelings are not my own, and my actions are not my own, all of which Paul knows, then how could I ask unless the creator made me ask? Third, that didn’t answer the question. The question was why are we judged for things we didn’t do? I think it’s in the Bible not to confess, or repent, or pay for someone else’s sins. But nevermind about any of that.
The part about why god tests us is more about how would things be different if he didn’t test. Jesus tests me and tells me I’m a bad person. Now what? It’s not like I can do anything to change that. Let’s say jesus told me I’m a good person, I can’t continue to do what I’ve been doing. Jesus doesn’t test me. Now what? Nothing changes.
Same with knowing what a sin is. I can’t do anything about that. I have instructions that I can’t follow. The lessons, the parables, the flood, all of it becomes trivial. It just doesn’t make any sense.
I don’t think anyone feels that they’re being controlled even with the knowledge they are. Without free will the Bible doesn’t need to exist. With free will everything in the Bible lines up. With scientific observation and experimentation, we find that the simplest explanation is usually correct. In this case the simplest explanation is we have free will.
I think you need to revisit all those verses and come up with a spirit interpretation that makes free will also true. For example, man makes plans, but god directs his steps. That could mean god provided him with the will to carry out his plans. And so on.

 

[Earburner]

The Creators' plan was always to make (manipulate) the first humans so an offence took place. They designed and programmed them so that they would offend. And that they did.

It wasn't a random act that took Them by surprise, as some have conclude.

Wouldn't that be called "a set up" for malicious intent towards Adam & Eve, who were created  having innocence?

By the way, who exactly are you calling, "they", "them" and "their", being the "Creators"?

 

[One 2 question]

By the way, who exactly are you calling, "they", "them" and "their", being the "Creators"?

And God said, Let us make man in our image, after our likeness Gen 1:26

 

[One 2 question]

Wouldn't that be called "a set up" for malicious intent towards Adam & Eve, who were created  having innocence?

Therefore hath he mercy on whom he will have mercy, and whom he will he hardeneth.
Hath not the potter power over the clay, of the same lump to make one vessel unto honour, and another unto dishonour?
What if God, willing to shew his wrath, and to make his power known, endured with much longsuffering the vessels of wrath fitted to destruction
Rom 9:21&22

I guess the truth that the Creators have done what They want with Their own possessions is evident from history.

Some prophecies reveal Their intent to destroy Their planet earth on a massive scale. Including a third of the sea creatures, land dwelling animals and humans.

Within Their plan is to destroy planet earth at least twice. First by flooding it with water and again burning it with fire.

We are told God deceives and has others deceive on His behalf. God kills and commands others to kill. He tears down. He blinds people. He curses people. He moves people to murder children and rape women.

But overshadowing all these not good acts of God, are His healing, rebuilding, restoring, redeeming, blessing, enlightening and giving new life.

I guess the good and the not good acts of the Creators are with good intent, with the purpose of working it all together for a good outcome.

If God, willing to shew his wrath, and to make his power known, endured with much longsuffering the vessels of wrath fitted to destruction that he might make known the riches of his glory on the vessels of mercy, which he had afore prepared unto glory. Rom 9:22&23.

 

[Earburner]

Therefore hath he mercy on whom he will have mercy, and whom he will he hardeneth.
Hath not the potter power over the clay, of the same lump to make one vessel unto honour, and another unto dishonour?
What if God, willing to shew his wrath, and to make his power known, endured with much longsuffering the vessels of wrath fitted to destruction
Rom 9:21&22

I guess the truth that the Creators have done what They want with Their own possessions is evident from history.

Some prophecies reveal Their intent to destroy Their planet earth on a massive scale. Including a third of the sea creatures, land dwelling animals and humans.

Within Their plan is to destroy planet earth at least twice. First by flooding it with water and again burning it with fire.

We are told God deceives and has others deceive on His behalf. God kills and commands others to kill. He tears down. He blinds people. He curses people. He moves people to murder children and rape women.

But overshadowing all these not good acts of God, are His healing, rebuilding, restoring, redeeming, blessing, enlightening and giving new life.

I guess the good and the not good acts of the Creators are with good intent, with the purpose of working it all together for a good outcome.

If God, willing to shew his wrath, and to make his power known, endured with much longsuffering the vessels of wrath fitted to destruction that he might make known the riches of his glory on the vessels of mercy, which he had afore prepared unto glory. Rom 9:22&23.

I am not talking about the aftermath, being after the fact of them making their choice to partake of the tree of the knowledge of good and evil FIRST, instead of the Tree of Life.
A&E were created, having innocence and free will wiithin the mortal flesh of their being, but never having any kind of eternal existence within them. They were indeed subject to eternal death, but not for any other reason, except that they had NOT partaken of the Tree of Life FIRST.

But, since they chose to partake of the wrong tree first, "their eyes were opened", which is to say that they were no longer innocent, thus having the knowledge of Good and Evil instead.

 

[One 2 question]

Ju

I am not talking about the aftermath, being after the fact of them making their choice to partake of the tree of the knowledge of good and evil FIRST, instead of the Tree of Life.
A&E were created, having innocence in the mortal flesh of their being, never having any kind of eternal existence within them. They were indeed subject to eternal death.

Just a side note or question. Who said Adam or Eve hadn't eaten from the tree of life? That's the first tree I would've checked out. I guess it would've been hard to miss, being placed in the middle of the garden. It was pleasing to the eye and good for food.