Christians and Jews are both anti Acts 2:38.

[Ronald David Bruno]

Yes christians can lose their faith and be lost.
Hebrews 3:12
Beware brethren, lest there be in any of you an evil heart of unbelief in departing from the living God.

A warning is given to believers that there may be unbelievers (tares) among you with an evil heart.
You are using scriptures to defend your point that are actually proving mine. Lol.
I'm sorry, I'm done.

 

[Titus]

James 2:14 What doth it profit, my brethren, though a man say he hath faith, and have not works? can faith save him? 15 If a brother or sister be naked, and destitute of daily food, 16 And one of you say unto them, Depart in peace, be ye warmed and filled; notwithstanding ye give them not those things which are needful to the body; what doth it profit? 17 Even so faith, if it hath not works, is dead, being alone.

Once again this is about a church voicing faith in God's Providence to the poor to get out of helping the poor. That is what is meant by what does it profit the poor when the church refuse to lead by example by meeting their immediate needs.

It is not about faith in Jesus Christ for salvation but how that church's verbalizing their faith in God's Providence to the poor that will not profit the poor nor save the poor from the elements and starvation. In the eyes of the poor, the church's faith in God's providence is dead.

James referred to Abraham and Isaac as to what kind of faith he waa stalking about that requires works as leading by example.

Genesis 22:7 And Isaac spake unto Abraham his father, and said, My father: and he said, Here am I, my son. And he said, Behold the fire and the wood: but where is the lamb for a burnt offering? 8 And Abraham said, My son, God will provide himself a lamb for a burnt offering: so they went both of them together.

13 And Abraham lifted up his eyes, and looked, and behold behind him a ram caught in a thicket by his horns: and Abraham went and took the ram, and offered him up for a burnt offering in the stead of his son. 14 And Abraham called the name of that place Jehovahjireh: as it is said to this day, In the mount of the Lord it shall be seen.

The name of the place is the moral lesson from real life about having Abraham's faith in Gd to provide for him to spare him from offering his son.



And yet you just referred to the promise from the Father for when any one believes in Him. You do not see it as an automatic thing wen someone believes and thus is baptized and in contrast, it is only those who do not believe that are not saved.

Look at John 3:18 for how those who believe are saved without mentioning water baptism and those who do not believe were condemned already. The reason the baptism with the Holy Ghost is not mentioned here is because Jesus was answering Nicodemus question as to when and how one is born again of the Spirit which was to be after His ascension which is after His crucifixion for whenever any one that believes in him gets eternal life.

John 3:13 And no man hath ascended up to heaven, but he that came down from heaven, even the Son of man which is in heaven. 14 And as Moses lifted up the serpent in the wilderness, even so must the Son of man be lifted up: 15 That whosoever believeth in him should not perish, but have eternal life. 16 For God so loved the world, that he gave his only begotten Son, that whosoever believeth in him should not perish, but have everlasting life. 17 For God sent not his Son into the world to condemn the world; but that the world through him might be saved. 18 He that believeth on him is not condemned: but he that believeth not is condemned already, because he hath not believed in the name of the only begotten Son of God.

So you are only assuming the baptism in Mark 16:16 is water baptism when it is really the baptism with the Holy Ghost as in born again.



Right and the act that the Gentiles had received the remission of sins by believing in Jesus Christ and thus had received the baptism with the holy Ghost way before water baptism proves it is not necessary for salvation.

Acts 10:43 To him give all the prophets witness, that through his name whosoever believeth in him shall receive remission of sins. 44 While Peter yet spake these words, the Holy Ghost fell on all them which heard the word. 45 And they of the circumcision which believed were astonished, as many as came with Peter, because that on the Gentiles also was poured out the gift of the Holy Ghost. 46 For they heard them speak with tongues, and magnify God. Then answered Peter, 47 Can any man forbid water, that these should not be baptized, which have received the Holy Ghost as well as we? 48 And he commanded them to be baptized in the name of the Lord. Then prayed they him to tarry certain days.



Thank you for sharing that but not all cross references mean the same thing as one can preach the gospel and those who hear can believe and be saved as born again without water baptism.

Paul himself deferred from water baptism as he emphasized the preaching of the cross and those believing in Him are saved as that is the power of God in salvation to save those that believe.

1 Corinthians 1:17 For Christ sent me not to baptize, but to preach the gospel: not with wisdom of words, lest the cross of Christ should be made of none effect. 18 For the preaching of the cross is to them that perish foolishness; but unto us which are saved it is the power of God..... 21 For after that in the wisdom of God the world by wisdom knew not God, it pleased God by the foolishness of preaching to save them that believe.

Paul again emphasize how faith comes by hearing the gospel as believing in Him is how we are saved.

Romans 10:8 But what saith it? The word is nigh thee, even in thy mouth, and in thy heart: that is, the word of faith, which we preach; 9 That if thou shalt confess with thy mouth the Lord Jesus, and shalt believe in thine heart that God hath raised him from the dead, thou shalt be saved. 10 For with the heart man believeth unto righteousness; and with the mouth confession is made unto salvation. 11 For the scripture saith, Whosoever believeth on him shall not be ashamed. 12 For there is no difference between the Jew and the Greek: for the same Lord over all is rich unto all that call upon him. 13 For whosoever shall call upon the name of the Lord shall be saved.

14 How then shall they call on him in whom they have not believed? and how shall they believe in him of whom they have not heard? and how shall they hear without a preacher? 15 And how shall they preach, except they be sent? as it is written, How beautiful are the feet of them that preach the gospel of peace, and bring glad tidings of good things! 16 But they have not all obeyed the gospel. For Esaias saith, Lord, who hath believed our report? 17 So then faith cometh by hearing, and hearing by the word of God.

Jesus is the Savior for why having believed in Him is how God is pleased in having saved us.

Water baptism is for new believers in taking the first step in identifying as His disciples publicly. It is an ordinance as well as a commandment for new believers to follow as His disciple. His disciples are to teach them everything He has taught them after water baptizing them in His name per Matthew 28:18-20. May God cause the increase.

Why did you ignore Paul's conversion? He believed and was not saved until three days later when water baptism washed away his sins, Acts 22:16

Nothing we have to do(obey)?

Paul was not saved without being told what to do. Paul had to do something.
Acts 9:6-7
So he trembling and astonished said, Lord, what do You want me to DO? Then the Lord said to him.
Arise and go into the city, and you will be told what you must DO.
Jesus told Saul/Paul, he had to Do something. You say Paul did not.
Who should I believe? You or Jesus?
Paul in three days is going to get the Holy Spirit.
He is already a believer, but he is not saved nor does he have Holy Spirit baptism yet.
Acts 9:9 And he was three days without sight, and nethier ate nor drank.
Jesus commands Ananias to preach the gospel to Paul.
Ananias goes to Paul, and guess what he tells him?
He tells Paul, to be water baptized just as Jesus commands in His gospel, Mark 16:15-16.
Acts 9:17-18
...Brother Saul(Jews call themselves brothers) the Lord Jesus who appeared to you on the road as you came, has sent me that you may receive your sight and be filled with the Holy Spirit.
Three days later after Paul was a believer in Jesus he gets Holy Spirit baptized!!! Wow
That does not fit your gospel of salvation the moment you believe and Holy Spirit baptism instantaneously at all!
Sounds like your gospel is not found in the actual conversions that take place in the new testament during the time Christ's gospel was in effect. But it does sound like Mark 16:15-16. Hmmm?
Acts 9:18
Immediately there fell from his eyes something like scales, and he received his sight at once, and he arose and was baptized.
Paul was not saved by faith alone.
It is obvious he did not know your gospel!
Paul said his sins were washed away not when he believed but when he was water immersed.
Acts 22:16
And now why are you waiting? Arise and be baptized, and wash away your sins, calling on the name of the lord.
Explain how three days after Paul comes to faith in Christ he still had his sins until he was baptized?
Sounds like Jesus meant what He said and says what He means, Mark 16:15-16.

 

[Titus]

A warning is given to believers that there may be unbelievers (tares) among you with an evil heart.
You are using scriptures to defend your point that are actually proving mine. Lol.
I'm sorry, I'm done.

You just added to Hebrews 3:12 unbelievers and tares
Nowhere does it speak of unbelievers.
It is only speaking to saved Christian believers.

Unbelievers cannot, depart from the living God
Unbelievers never were with God. Only saved believers have been in Christ.
Therefore only saved believers can depart from God because of an evil heart of unbelief
Hebrews 3:12
Beware , brethren, brethren, brethren, brethren, lest there be any of you(brethren) with an evil heart of unbelief in departing (unbelievers cannot depart only those already with God)from the living God.

Your interpretation,
Hebrews 3:12
Beware brethren, lest there be UNBELIEVERS AMONG YOU with an evil heart of unbelief in departing from the living God.
Explain how unbelievers who have never been with God are warned not to depart from God?
Not good exegesis friend.
Why would believers be warned not to depart like unbelievers if they cannot be lost?

 

[mailmandan]

Danthemailman, is it your practise to avoid, ignore elephants? Pretend their not there? Because you taught me a while back that NO OBEDIENCE is required to be saved in Jesus' gospel. Yet you then contradicted yourself and said there was when I pointed out to you, 1John 3:23-24
And this is His COMMANDMENT that we should BELIEVE on the name of His Son Jesus Christ and love one another, as He gave us commandment. Commandment keeping is a part of salvation. To deny this Biblical fact is to deny the word of God, 1John 3:23-24.

In Jesus' gospel unto salvation. Jesus never required all commandments to be obeyed to receive salvation.
Some commandments are for the saved Christian only. Jesus' apostles teaching in the book of Acts,
Where all the conversion examples occur. Never commanded a lost person to give of their means on the first day of the week to be saved,
1Corinthians 16:2 On the first day of the week let each one of you lay something aside, storing up as he may prosper, that there be no collections when I come.

This commandment is only for after one is a saved christian.
Jesus's gospel does Have commandments that are requirements in His gospel unto salvation.
You can learn them by studying the book of Acts.
They are:
Faith, Acts 16:31 ; 1John 3:23-24
Repentance , Acts 3:19 ; Acts 17:30
Confession, Acts 8: 37 ; Romans 10:9-10 ; Matthew 10:32-33 ; 1John 4:2-3 ; 4:15
Water immersion, Acts 2:38 ; Acts 10:47-48 ; Acts 16:33 ; Mark 16:15-16

These are the gospels essential requirements ordained of God to be saved.

After salvation a new born christian is then given more commandments that must be obeyed,
Revelation 22:14
Blessed are those who DO His commandments, that they may have the right to the tree of life and may enter through the gates into the city.

True saving faith is trust in Jesus that you will do these things because you believe what
Jesus says will save you.
If you do not have saving faith, you will refuse to obey Jesus' gospel.

Latter part of Mark 16:16,
....he that believeth not shall be damned.
Why not mention baptism? Obviously no one who believes will be baptized! It is redundant to say believeth not and baptizeth not will be danmed.
John 3:18
He who believes in Him is not condemned; but he who does not believe is condemned already, because he has not believed in the name of the only begotten Son of God.
Water baptizing a non believer only gets one wet.

Your 4 step plan of salvation sounds like the gospel of Campbellism, which is the result of bad semantics and flawed hermeneutics. No contradiction on my part. Repentance actually “precedes” believe him/believe the gospel/faith in Christ (Matthew 20:21; Mark 1:15; Acts 20:21) and belief/faith and confession are not two separate steps to salvation, but are chronologically together. (Romans 10:8-10) Water baptism follows saving belief in Christ. (Acts 10:43-47)

So we obey the gospel by choosing to believe the gospel (Romans 10:16) by trusting in the death, burial and resurrection of Christ as the ALL-sufficient means of our salvation. (1 Corinthians 15:1-4; Romans 1:16) Teaching that we must obey multiple commandments as an “additional requirement” for salvation after we have been saved through faith further demonstrates that you teach salvation by works.

In regards to keeping commandments, those who are born of God “keep” (Greek word “tereo”) - guard, observe, watch over His commandments (1 John 3:23-24; 5:2-3) in the New Testament and are not under the law under the old covenant. Love comes from God and everyone who loves has been born of God and knows God. (1 John 4:7-8)

In regards to Revelation 22:14, multiple translations read, "Blessed are those who wash their robes" (Revelation 22:14) - https://www.biblegateway.com/verse/en/Revelation 22:14 which symbolizes those who have been forgiven of their sins through the blood of the Lamb (Romans 3:24-26). Also see Revelation 7:14. Revelation 22:15 which is descriptive of unbelievers.

 

[Titus]

Your 4 step plan of salvation sounds like the gospel of Campbellism, which is the result of bad semantics and flawed hermeneutics. No contradiction on my part. Repentance actually “precedes” believe him/believe the gospel/faith in Christ (Matthew 20:21; Mark 1:15; Acts 20:21) and belief/faith and confession are not two separate steps to salvation, but are chronologically together. (Romans 10:8-10) Water baptism follows saving belief in Christ. (Acts 10:43-47)

So we obey the gospel by choosing to believe the gospel (Romans 10:16) by trusting in the death, burial and resurrection of Christ as the ALL-sufficient means of our salvation. (1 Corinthians 15:1-4; Romans 1:16) Teaching that we must obey multiple commandments as an “additional requirement” for salvation after we have been saved through faith further demonstrates that you teach salvation by works.

In regards to keeping commandments, those who are born of God “keep” (Greek word “tereo”) - guard, observe, watch over His commandments (1 John 3:23-24; 5:2-3) in the New Testament and are not under the law under the old covenant. Love comes from God and everyone who loves has been born of God and knows God. (1 John 4:7-8)

In regards to Revelation 22:14, multiple translations read, "Blessed are those who wash their robes" (Revelation 22:14) - https://www.biblegateway.com/verse/en/Revelation 22:14 which symbolizes those who have been forgiven of their sins through the blood of the Lamb (Romans 3:24-26). Also see Revelation 7:14. Revelation 22:15 which is descriptive of unbelievers.

You have misrepresented me. I'm not a "Campbellite"
Are You following a man named John Smyth? He is the founder of the sect you are married to, aka the Baptist church.

Also, why are you spreading misinformation after I already taught you, your misunderstanding that the planting of the church of Christ began in 33 A.D.?
Where is the Baptist church in the Bible? Show it to me with book, chapter and verse!
Show me where God authorizes sectarian divisions in His ONE church, Ephesians 4:4 There is ONE BODY(CHURCH) and one Spirit, just as you were called in one hope of your calling.

Denominationalism i.e. division is condemned by God,
1Corinthians 1:10
Now I plead with you, brethren, by the name of our Lord Jesus Christ, that you all speak the same thing and that there be no DIVISIONS among you, but you be perfectly joined together in the same mind and in the same judgment. Baptist church is sectarian division, divided up the Lords church teaching different doctrines that are not of the same mind. Why does this not bother your conscience?
Baptist divisions among Baptists:
Free will Baptist
Fundamental Baptist
Evangelical Baptist
General six principle Baptist
Independent Baptist
Institutional missionary Baptist
Landmark Baptist
Free will Baptist
Primitive Baptist
Progressive Baptist
Reformed Baptist
Seperate Baptist
Seventh Day Baptist
Southern Baptist
Predestinarian Baptist
United Baptist
etc.
In the first century Danthemailman, how many churches were there? Heres a hint,
Matthew 16:18-19
...and on this rock I will build My church and the gates of Hades shall not prevail against it.
Did Jesus say He will build church(es)? Or My church?

The body I am married to is right here,
Romans 16:16, Great one another with a holy kiss. The churches of Christ greet you.
I cannot find this sectarian church known as the Baptist church in my KJV Bible. Or any other translation.

Are you aware that John the Baptist did not have, establish His own church?
If John the baptizer was alive today he would not be married to your church.
He would be married to the church of Christ.

Are you aware that we are not to wear the names of Men?
Did John the Baptist die for you on the cross?
Is he what you are baptized into?
Galatians 3:26-27
For you are all sons of God through faith in Christ Jesus.
For as many of you as were baptized into Christ have put on Christ.

Did not Paul condemn the church of Christ at Corinth for wearing mens names other than their Saviour Jesus Christ? If so you are guilty of the same heresy.
1Corinthians 1:11-13
For it has been declared to me concerning you, my brethren, by those of Ce's household, that there are contentions among you.
Now I say this, that each of you says, I am of Paul, or I am of Apollos, or I am of Christ.
Is Christ divided? Was Paul crucified for you? Or were you baptized in the name of Paul?

Is Christ divided Mr. Dan? Was John the Baptist the church Jesus Christ built, bought, purchased with His own blood, died for, established in the first century? No
Then why are you in a church named after a man that never had any thing to do with establishing a church.

I'm not in a church named after a man, i.e. Alexander Campbell.
The church I am wedding to is named after God! Church of Christ, Romans 16:16.
Matthew 15:13
But He answered and said, Every plant which My heavenly Father has not planted will be uprooted.
Did God plant the church of Christ
Or
Did He plant a mans church named after John the Baptist in the 1600's?

 

[mailmandan]

You have misrepresented me. I'm not a "Campbellite"
Are You following a man named John Smyth? He is the founder of the sect you are married to, aka the Baptist church.

Also, why are you spreading misinformation after I already taught you, your misunderstanding that the planting of the church of Christ began in 33 A.D.?
Where is the Baptist church in the Bible? Show it to me with book, chapter and verse!
Show me where God authorizes sectarian divisions in His ONE church, Ephesians 4:4 There is ONE BODY(CHURCH) and one Spirit, just as you were called in one hope of your calling.

Denominationalism i.e. division is condemned by God,
1Corinthians 1:10
Now I plead with you, brethren, by the name of our Lord Jesus Christ, that you all speak the same thing and that there be no DIVISIONS among you, but you be perfectly joined together in the same mind and in the same judgment. Baptist church is sectarian division, divided up the Lords church teaching different doctrines that are not of the same mind. Why does this not bother your conscience?
Baptist divisions among Baptists:
Free will Baptist
Fundamental Baptist
Evangelical Baptist
General six principle Baptist
Independent Baptist
Institutional missionary Baptist
Landmark Baptist
Free will Baptist
Primitive Baptist
Progressive Baptist
Reformed Baptist
Seperate Baptist
Seventh Day Baptist
Southern Baptist
Predestinarian Baptist
United Baptist
etc.
In the first century Danthemailman, how many churches were there? Heres a hint,
Matthew 16:18-19
...and on this rock I will build My church and the gates of Hades shall not prevail against it.
Did Jesus say He will build church(es)? Or My church?

The body I am married to is right here,
Romans 16:16, Great one another with a holy kiss. The churches of Christ greet you.
I cannot find this sectarian church known as the Baptist church in my KJV Bible. Or any other translation.

Are you aware that John the Baptist did not have, establish His own church?
If John the baptizer was alive today he would not be married to your church.
He would be married to the church of Christ.

Are you aware that we are not to wear the names of Men?
Did John the Baptist die for you on the cross?
Is he what you are baptized into?
Galatians 3:26-27
For you are all sons of God through faith in Christ Jesus.
For as many of you as were baptized into Christ have put on Christ.

Did not Paul condemn the church of Christ at Corinth for wearing mens names other than their Saviour Jesus Christ? If so you are guilty of the same heresy.
1Corinthians 1:11-13
For it has been declared to me concerning you, my brethren, by those of Ce's household, that there are contentions among you.
Now I say this, that each of you says, I am of Paul, or I am of Apollos, or I am of Christ.
Is Christ divided? Was Paul crucified for you? Or were you baptized in the name of Paul?

Is Christ divided Mr. Dan? Was John the Baptist the church Jesus Christ built, bought, purchased with His own blood, died for, established in the first century? No
Then why are you in a church named after a man that never had any thing to do with establishing a church.

I'm not in a church named after a man, i.e. Alexander Campbell.
The church I am wedding to is named after God! Church of Christ, Romans 16:16.
Matthew 15:13
But He answered and said, Every plant which My heavenly Father has not planted will be uprooted.
Did God plant the church of Christ
Or
Did He plant a mans church named after John the Baptist in the 1600's?

Who said I was a Baptist? I actually attend a non-denominational church. Your multi step plan of salvation comes straight out of Campbellism. Your theology has originated with men, namely THOMAS CAMPBELL, ALEXANDER CAMPBELL, WALTER SCOTT, and BARTON W. STONE. Did these men actually "restore" the gospel, the church, and true New Testament worship, as they claim, or did they simply create another sect bent on a more dogmatic sectarianism than others they renounced? I at one time had temporarily attended the so called church of Christ several years ago so I understand how they try to "shoe horn" works "into" salvation through faith and none of your arguments are anything new or enlightening.

In regards to Romans 16:16, so you believe this verse proves that your church which goes by the name “church of Christ” must be the true church simply because of it’s name? Paul is talking about the body of Christ which is made up of all born again believers and not simply a church building with a name stamped on the front of it. The Bible also mentions the church of God in scripture. (1 Corinthians 1:2; 11:16; 11:22) Now there is a church today that goes by the name “church of God” so are we to believe that it is the true church simply because of it’s name? Of course not.

 

[Truther]

Baptism into the "name" of the Father and of the Sin and if the Hily Spirit.
It means beung immersed into God.
We are in Christ - not in water. The water is symbolic for washing away sins, a spiritual cleansing. It is a spiritual cleansing. Baptism by the Holy Spirit immerses us into a relationship with God. Water does not do that. Even John's water baptism was a preparation, to get people in that mindset for something greater, Jesus baptism of the Holy Spirit.

Water alone does not cause our baptism into Christ's death.

Saying the name of Jesus while in the water creates the like figure of it.

You need to denounce the name of Jesus too in your debunking of baptism.

 

[Truther]

How do you identify which humans need to be told about Acts 2:38 KJV?

You just preach the exact same thing to all sinner mankind as Peter did per Acts 2:38 and let God do the arranging.

That's a God thing.

 

[Truther]

That would mean 2 gospels, one for the Jews in how they got the remission of sins by water baptism and one for the Gentiles for how they got the remission of sins just by believing in Him with nary a mention of water baptism for that effect for the remission of sins.

Acts 10:43 To him give all the prophets witness, that through his name whosoever believeth in him shall receive remission of sins. 44 While Peter yet spake these words, the Holy Ghost fell on all them which heard the word.

So you are not actually harmonizing scripture since there is only one gospel.

No, 1 message....Acts 2:38.

Obey it like BOTH groups did and be baptized for the remission of your sins in Jesus name.

It does not matter what anyone thinks. whether they are saved or not, as long as they all are baptized in the name of Jesus Christ.

Refusing baptism is the deal breaker with Jesus.

He died so you would be baptized in his name.

 

[Truther]

I have denounced the Catholic Church, but I'm still baptized, you only need be baptized once
even if you change denominations.

So, the RCC cursed you to their baptism?

If so, why were the disciples of John REbaptized in Acts 19 in the name of Jesus Christ?

Is the RCC baptism of infants more powerful than John's(whom baptized Jesus)?

 

[Christ4Me]

Believers in Jesus, Jews had faith in Jesus but still were lost,
John 12:42-43
Nevertheless even among the rulers many believed in Him, but because of the Pharisees they did not confess Him, lest they should be put out of the synagogue; for they loved the praise of men more than the praise of God.
They had faith alone with no love for Jesus. Faith alone cannot save,

No one that believed in Him before His crucifixion and before His ascension were save yet till afterwards for when they believed in Him. They do not get born again for believing in Him until He was no longer present and had ascended to God the Father in heaven for when believing in Him is when & how they get saved.

Romans 10:9-10
That if you confess with your mouth the Lord Jesus and believe in your heart that God raised Him from the dead, you will be saved.
Faith without confession will save no one.
Faith alone is dead, James 2:24.
Faith with obedience to Jesus' commandments, Romans 10:9-10 saves,

It is also written;

Romans 10:8 But what saith it? The word is nigh thee, even in thy mouth, and in thy heart: that is, the word of faith, which we preach; 9 That if thou shalt confess with thy mouth the Lord Jesus, and shalt believe in thine heart that God hath raised him from the dead, thou shalt be saved. 10 For with the heart man believeth unto righteousness; and with the mouth confession is made unto salvation. 11 For the scripture saith, Whosoever believeth on him shall not be ashamed.

It explains how the Gentiles were saved simply by believing in Him before confessing him with their mouths and even before coming forward to be water baptized in Jesus's name.

Acts 10:43 To him give all the prophets witness, that through his name whosoever believeth in him shall receive remission of sins. 44 While Peter yet spake these words, the Holy Ghost fell on all them which heard the word.

That is the power of God in salvation as our believing in Him pleases God to save us for that reason alone.

1 Corinthians 1:17 For Christ sent me not to baptize, but to preach the gospel: not with wisdom of words, lest the cross of Christ should be made of none effect. 18 For the preaching of the cross is to them that perish foolishness; but unto us which are saved it is the power of God.... 21 For after that in the wisdom of God the world by wisdom knew not God, it pleased God by the foolishness of preaching to save them that believe.

 

[Christ4Me]

No, 1 message....Acts 2:38.

Obey it like BOTH groups did and be baptized for the remission of your sins in Jesus name.

It does not matter what anyone thinks. whether they are saved or not, as long as they all are baptized in the name of Jesus Christ.

Refusing baptism is the deal breaker with Jesus.

He died so you would be baptized in his name.

Remember this?

John 3:14 And as Moses lifted up the serpent in the wilderness, even so must the Son of man be lifted up: 15 That whosoever believeth in him should not perish, but have eternal life. 16 For God so loved the world, that he gave his only begotten Son, that whosoever believeth in him should not perish, but have everlasting life.

Whenever someone gets bitten by a poisonous viper, they were to look at that crafted serpent on that pole in the wilderness to believe they will be saved from that poisonous bite & they are saved. So that is the analogy of looking to Jesus Christ for that because by believing in Him, we are saved. No water baptism is required. For discipleship , yes, but for salvation, no, les we deny the power of God in salvation to save those that believe.

It is also written;

Romans 10:8 But what saith it? The word is nigh thee, even in thy mouth, and in thy heart: that is, the word of faith, which we preach; 9 That if thou shalt confess with thy mouth the Lord Jesus, and shalt believe in thine heart that God hath raised him from the dead, thou shalt be saved. 10 For with the heart man believeth unto righteousness; and with the mouth confession is made unto salvation. 11 For the scripture saith, Whosoever believeth on him shall not be ashamed.

It explains how the Gentiles were saved simply by believing in Him before confessing him with their mouths and even before coming forward to be water baptized in Jesus's name.

Acts 10:43 To him give all the prophets witness, that through his name whosoever believeth in him shall receive remission of sins. 44 While Peter yet spake these words, the Holy Ghost fell on all them which heard the word.

That is the power of God in salvation as our believing in Him pleases God to save us for that reason alone.

1 Corinthians 1:17 For Christ sent me not to baptize, but to preach the gospel: not with wisdom of words, lest the cross of Christ should be made of none effect. 18 For the preaching of the cross is to them that perish foolishness; but unto us which are saved it is the power of God.... 21 For after that in the wisdom of God the world by wisdom knew not God, it pleased God by the foolishness of preaching to save them that believe.

 

[Ronald David Bruno]

You just added to Hebrews 3:12 unbelievers and tares
Nowhere does it speak of unbelievers.
It is only speaking to saved Christian believers.

Unbelievers cannot, depart from the living God
Unbelievers never were with God. Only saved believers have been in Christ.
Therefore only saved believers can depart from God because of an evil heart of unbelief
Hebrews 3:12
Beware , brethren, brethren, brethren, brethren, lest there be any of you(brethren) with an evil heart of unbelief in departing (unbelievers cannot depart only those already with God)from the living God.

Your interpretation,
Hebrews 3:12
Beware brethren, lest there be UNBELIEVERS AMONG YOU with an evil heart of unbelief in departing from the living God.
Explain how unbelievers who have never been with God are warned not to depart from God?
Not good exegesis friend.
Why would believers be warned not to depart like unbelievers if they cannot be lost?

If a Pastor addresses congregation and says, "Brothers amd sisters, I have an anouncement to make. There are tares in our midst, beware." He is addressing the majority, warning them of evil doers.
Capisce?
I'm really sorry that Christians on this board do not believe that their salvation is secure and sealed, that OSAS is the truth. This negative view gies against the Author of our faith. He either begins a work in us and finishes it or He us not an Author at all.
"For I am convinced that neither death, nor life, nor angels, nor principalities, nor things present, nor things to come, nor powers, nor height, nor depth, nor any other created thing will be able to separate us from the love of God that is in Christ Jesus our Lord." Rom. 8:38, 39

 

[Christ4Me]

Jesus taught and commanded more than just faith to be saved. He commanded faith and obedience to His gospel. Romans 10:9-10 is belief and confession. Not faith only. The confession is an act of obedience. You are obeying a direct command. Therefore confession is a work of faith.
Acts 8:37.

There is a difference between Jesus commanding us to believe in Him to be saved from commanding us in how we follow Him as His disciples.

Remember this?

John 3:14 And as Moses lifted up the serpent in the wilderness, even so must the Son of man be lifted up: 15 That whosoever believeth in him should not perish, but have eternal life. 16 For God so loved the world, that he gave his only begotten Son, that whosoever believeth in him should not perish, but have everlasting life.

Whenever someone gets bitten by a poisonous viper, they were to look at that crafted serpent on that pole in the wilderness to believe they will be saved from that poisonous bite & they are saved. So that is the analogy of looking to Jesus Christ for that because by believing in Him, we are saved. No water baptism is required. For discipleship , yes, but for salvation, no, les we deny the power of God in salvation to save those that believe.

It is also written;

Romans 10:8 But what saith it? The word is nigh thee, even in thy mouth, and in thy heart: that is, the word of faith, which we preach; 9 That if thou shalt confess with thy mouth the Lord Jesus, and shalt believe in thine heart that God hath raised him from the dead, thou shalt be saved. 10 For with the heart man believeth unto righteousness; and with the mouth confession is made unto salvation. 11 For the scripture saith, Whosoever believeth on him shall not be ashamed.

It explains how the Gentiles were saved simply by believing in Him before confessing him with their mouths and even before coming forward to be water baptized in Jesus's name.

Acts 10:43 To him give all the prophets witness, that through his name whosoever believeth in him shall receive remission of sins. 44 While Peter yet spake these words, the Holy Ghost fell on all them which heard the word.

That is the power of God in salvation as our believing in Him pleases God to save us for that reason alone.

1 Corinthians 1:17 For Christ sent me not to baptize, but to preach the gospel: not with wisdom of words, lest the cross of Christ should be made of none effect. 18 For the preaching of the cross is to them that perish foolishness; but unto us which are saved it is the power of God.... 21 For after that in the wisdom of God the world by wisdom knew not God, it pleased God by the foolishness of preaching to save them that believe.

So there is a big difference in obeying the gospel by believing in Him for salvation and from all His commandments that He told His disciples to teach new believers everything He has taught them. They are not one and the same, otherwise you would never get the Holy Ghost at your salvation moment. We need Jesus Christ in us so we can follow Him as His disciples.

To believe that following Him as His disciples is a means to save oneself is to deny the Lord that bought you since having believed in Him. The only reason you are in that race is because He has saved you so you can follow Him. Do not deny the Good News in Jesus Christ to men or else you are robbing other believers of the joy of their salvation. Do ask Jesus for help in seeing the truth in His words so you may repent from church's errors.

 

[Ronald David Bruno]

You need to denounce the name of Jesus too in your debunking of baptism

I am not debunking water baptism. I got water baptized as a symbolic outward expression, a public testiment to my identity in Christ, of His inward spiritual cleansing. I was already born again long befire that. It's ceremonial. Communion is also symbolic. We are to remember His sacrifice regualarly.

 

[Truther]

Remember this?

John 3:14 And as Moses lifted up the serpent in the wilderness, even so must the Son of man be lifted up: 15 That whosoever believeth in him should not perish, but have eternal life. 16 For God so loved the world, that he gave his only begotten Son, that whosoever believeth in him should not perish, but have everlasting life.

Whenever someone gets bitten by a poisonous viper, they were to look at that crafted serpent on that pole in the wilderness to believe they will be saved from that poisonous bite & they are saved. So that is the analogy of looking to Jesus Christ for that because by believing in Him, we are saved. No water baptism is required. For discipleship , yes, but for salvation, no, les we deny the power of God in salvation to save those that believe.

It is also written;

Romans 10:8 But what saith it? The word is nigh thee, even in thy mouth, and in thy heart: that is, the word of faith, which we preach; 9 That if thou shalt confess with thy mouth the Lord Jesus, and shalt believe in thine heart that God hath raised him from the dead, thou shalt be saved. 10 For with the heart man believeth unto righteousness; and with the mouth confession is made unto salvation. 11 For the scripture saith, Whosoever believeth on him shall not be ashamed.

It explains how the Gentiles were saved simply by believing in Him before confessing him with their mouths and even before coming forward to be water baptized in Jesus's name.

Acts 10:43 To him give all the prophets witness, that through his name whosoever believeth in him shall receive remission of sins. 44 While Peter yet spake these words, the Holy Ghost fell on all them which heard the word.

That is the power of God in salvation as our believing in Him pleases God to save us for that reason alone.

1 Corinthians 1:17 For Christ sent me not to baptize, but to preach the gospel: not with wisdom of words, lest the cross of Christ should be made of none effect. 18 For the preaching of the cross is to them that perish foolishness; but unto us which are saved it is the power of God.... 21 For after that in the wisdom of God the world by wisdom knew not God, it pleased God by the foolishness of preaching to save them that believe.

Remember this?....

16 He that believeth and is baptized shall be saved; but he that believeth not shall be damned.

Did Jesus misspeak or did he elaborate on believing here?

Also, Romans 10 was an affirmation to the saints, not a canceling of their former water baptism in the name of Jesus Christ per all of Acts.

Also, Paul had assistants to do his baptizing for him, obeying the great commission in the process.

By the way, Jesus did not say "he that believeth and is saved...", as the modern scripture twisters have interpreted him as saying.

 

[Titus]

Who said I was a Baptist? I actually attend a non-denominational church. Your multi step plan of salvation comes straight out of Campbellism. Your theology has originated with men, namely THOMAS CAMPBELL, ALEXANDER CAMPBELL, WALTER SCOTT, and BARTON W. STONE. Did these men actually "restore" the gospel, the church, and true New Testament worship, as they claim, or did they simply create another sect bent on a more dogmatic sectarianism than others they renounced? I at one time had temporarily attended the so called church of Christ several years ago so I understand how they try to "shoe horn" works "into" salvation through faith and none of your arguments are anything new or enlightening.

In regards to Romans 16:16, so you believe this verse proves that your church which goes by the name “church of Christ” must be the true church simply because of it’s name? Paul is talking about the body of Christ which is made up of all born again believers and not simply a church building with a name stamped on the front of it. The Bible also mentions the church of God in scripture. (1 Corinthians 1:2; 11:16; 11:22) Now there is a church today that goes by the name “church of God” so are we to believe that it is the true church simply because of it’s name? Of course not.

Who said you are a Baptist? Did you not tell me you were a Baptist on the Christianity forums?
If not what church are you a member of. Give name, description. Don't be vague or I cannot trust you. Did you leave the Baptist church? I know you used to be Catholic.

 

[Truther]

I am not debunking water baptism. I got water baptized as a symbolic outward expression, a public testiment to my identity in Christ, of His inward spiritual cleansing. I was already born again long befire that. It's ceremonial. Communion is also symbolic. We are to remember His sacrifice regualarly.

Was your water baptism like this?...


38 Then Peter said unto them, Repent, and be baptized every one of you in the name of Jesus Christ for the remission of sins, and ye shall receive the gift of the Holy Ghost.


....or, was it about something else?

 

[Titus]

Who said I was a Baptist? I actually attend a non-denominational church. Your multi step plan of salvation comes straight out of Campbellism. Your theology has originated with men, namely THOMAS CAMPBELL, ALEXANDER CAMPBELL, WALTER SCOTT, and BARTON W. STONE. Did these men actually "restore" the gospel, the church, and true New Testament worship, as they claim, or did they simply create another sect bent on a more dogmatic sectarianism than others they renounced? I at one time had temporarily attended the so called church of Christ several years ago so I understand how they try to "shoe horn" works "into" salvation through faith and none of your arguments are anything new or enlightening.

In regards to Romans 16:16, so you believe this verse proves that your church which goes by the name “church of Christ” must be the true church simply because of it’s name? Paul is talking about the body of Christ which is made up of all born again believers and not simply a church building with a name stamped on the front of it. The Bible also mentions the church of God in scripture. (1 Corinthians 1:2; 11:16; 11:22) Now there is a church today that goes by the name “church of God” so are we to believe that it is the true church simply because of it’s name? Of course not.

No not simply because of its name. Ever heard of the church of God? They are a denomination. Yet there name is biblical.
Give the name of the church you attend today.
I know I'm in the only church you read about in scripture because of the doctrine is the doctrine of Christ.
That is how you know if your in the Lords church.
I know you sre not in the Lords church because Christ never taught salvation by faith and no obedience, Mark 16:15-16.

 

[mailmandan]

No not simply because of its name. Ever heard of the church of God? They are a denomination. Yet there name is biblical.
Give the name of the church you attend today.
I know I'm in the only church you read about in scripture because of the doctrine is the doctrine of Christ.
That is how you know if your in the Lords church.
I no you sre not in the Lords church because Christ never taught salvation by faith and no obedience, Mark 16:15-16.

You continue to misinterpret those verses and teach salvation by works. John 3:18 - He who believes in Him is not condemned; but he who (is not water baptized? - NO) does not believe is condemned already, because he has not (been water baptized? - NO) because he has not believed in the name of the only begotten Son of God. You are in the wrong church.