Gog and Magog and The Flaming Fire

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Earburner

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The following are the thoughts of a hybrid view in Amillenialism. By using the whole of the KJV biblical context, Rev. 20 should be interpreted by Paul's recommendation of "comparing spiritual things with spiritual".

Please read the following non-stop, so that you may perceive the fluidity of Rev. 20.
>All words from the KJV, are in "bold" letters.
>All words in [brackets] are the suggested interpretations.
Rev. 20
[1] And I saw an angel come down from heaven, having the key of the bottomless pit and a great chain in his hand.
[2] And he laid hold on the dragon, that old serpent, which is the Devil, and Satan, and
bound him a thousand years ["in chains of darkness"- 2 Peter 2:4, during this present Age of God's Grace and longsuffering],
[3] And cast him [permanently out of the way of God's own presence] into the bottomless pit [this earth, the place of satan's endless grave], and shut him up [having no more access into heaven, God's Light, or anyone of God's ownership 1 John 5:18],
and set a seal upon him, that he should deceive the nations no more [as he did do in the past concerning Job 1:7, 11; 1 John 5:18], till the [figurative] thousand years [of God's Grace and His longsuffering] should be fulfilled: and after that he must be loosed a little season [which began in the mid-1800's and onward. At that time, the "increase of knowledge" is very visible of satan's release, who is "the prince of the power of the AIR", being that of this earth's atmosphere, aka the first heaven.
What are "microwaves"?


[4] And I saw [symbolic] thrones [Luke 22:29-30], and they [of Christ's kingdom] sat upon them, and judgment was GIVEN unto them [as Ambassadors of the Lord's judgment- 2 Cor. 5:20; John 3:18; Rom. 8:9, judging also the 12 tribes of Israel- Mat. 19:28; Luke 22:30; John 3:18]:

and I saw the souls of them that were
1. beheaded for the witness of Jesus, and
2. [those beheaded] for the word of God, and
3. [those beheaded] which had not worshipped the beast, neither his image, neither had received his mark upon their foreheads, or in their hands;
4. and [during their life times] they lived and reigned with Christ a [figurative] thousand years [during the Age of God's Grace and longsuffering].
1. The Early church.
2. The Mid church.
3. The End church.
4. All born again Christians,
during their lifetimes, have been reigning with Christ as his ambassadors, during the figurative 1000 years of God's Grace and His longsuffering. 2 Peter 3:9, 15

[5] But the rest of the dead [who died in faith of Christ] lived not again [in Immortally] until the [figurative] thousand years were finished [expired].
This is the first resurrection [to be born again, spritually risen with Christ, by the Holy Spirit, being a NEW creature/creation after Christ's resurrection, who is literally Himself the very First resurrection]. John 3:3-8; Col. 2:12, Col. 3:1; 2 Peter 5:17.

[6] Blessed and holy is he that hath part [as "partakers of the divine nature"- 2Peter 1:4] in the first resurrection [being Christ Himself]: on such the second death hath no power, but they [who are in Christ, who have been on the earth, and those of us who are now here on the earth] shall be priests of God and of Christ, and [each who are born again] shall reign with him [during] a [figurative] thousand years [during this present Age of God's Grace and His longsuffering. See also 1 Peter 2:9]

[7] And when the [figurative] thousand years [of God's Grace] are expired, Satan shall be loosed out of his prison [ever since the 1800's AD to this present day].
[8] And [satan] shall go out to deceive the nations which are in the four quarters of the earth, [symbolic of] Gog and Magog, being all the living unsaved], to gather them together ["in bundles"] to battle ["to be burned"]: the number of whom is as the sand of the sea. [being all the living unsaved, who will be found to have taken "the mark of the beast", upon Jesus' fiery and Glorious return-] Mat. 13:30; Luke 17:28-30; 2 Thes. 1:7-10; 1Rev..13:16-17.

[9] And they went up on the breadth [entirety] of the earth, and compassed the "camp" of the saints about [to lead each saint into captivity, being they who are God's dwelling places, His individual mortal "tabernacles"**, aka temporary shelters, "booths", a "camp", aka Christ's invisible church of born again Christians on earth].
and [also known as] the beloved city [the entire mortal, breathing body of Christ, the living temple of God, which is now temporarily on this old earth]: and fire came down from God out of heaven [Jesus' return "in flaming fire"], and devoured them. Luke 17:28-30; 2 Thes. 1:7-10.
**Note: the "Feast of Tabernacles", is not about the Jews living in temporary booths/shelters, but rather it is about God dwelling within our temporary mortal bodies.
2 Cor. 4[7] But we have this treasure [of God Himself] in earthen vessels [our temporary mortal bodies] that the excellency of the power may be of God, and not of us.

[10] And the devil that deceived them was cast into the lake of fire and brimstone [the burning lava of the earth's rocks and soil], [2 Peter 3] where the beast and the false prophet are [dwelling and shall die a fiery death], and [satan and all the fallen angels only] shall be tormented day and night for ever and ever.

[11] And I saw a great white throne, and him that sat on it, from whose face the [old] earth and the heaven fled away; and there was found no place for them [being the old heaven and earth].
[12] And I saw the dead, small and great, [symbolically] stand before God; and the [symbolic] books were opened: and another book was opened [which is Christ Himself], the book of life: and the [unsaved] dead were judged out of those things which were written in the [symbolic] books, according to their works ["the work of God": belief or unbelief in Christ, is predetermined by John 3:18; aka "the work of God" to be the ONLY work of God for our salvation. John 6:29. There are no other works that a person can do to gain entrance into the kingdom of God].

[13] And the sea gave up the dead which were in it; and death and hell [the graves] delivered up the dead which were in them: and they were judged every man according to their works [belief or unbelief in Christ]
[14] And death and hell [the graves] were cast into the lake of fire [whereby none of the living unsaved shall be left alive to procreate human life. And so, since there will be no more births, there will be "no more death", which equals no more graves].
This is the second death.
[Flesh and blood can not inherit the KoG- 1 Cor. 15:50]


[15] And [for all of that symbolic, supposed appearance of judging at a White Throne judgment, in their supposed resurrected(?) mortal flesh, the simple conclusion of God's Judgment is:]
whosoever was not found written in the book of life was cast into the lake of fire. [All of which was PREdetermined by God's words in John 3:18; Rom. 8:9, and 1 Cor. 15:50].
 
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Keraz

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Please read the following non-stop, so that you may perceive the fluidity of Rev. 20.
>All words from the KJV, are in "bold" letters.
>All words in [brackets] are the suggested interpretations.
Revelation 20:1-6, read in a modern version and without the AMill premise, makes it clear there will be a time, of an actual thousand years, when the world will be governed by a benevolent King and Satan will not be able to deceive anyone.

Any other 'interpretation', is a direct adding to and taking away from the Book of Revelation. Not advisable!
 
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Earburner

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Revelation 20:1-6, read in a modern version and without the AMill premise, makes it clear there will be a time, of an actual thousand years, when the world will be governed by a benevolent King and Satan will not be able to deceive anyone.

Any other 'interpretation', is a direct adding to and taking away from the Book of Revelation. Not advisable!
Make no mistake. Those of us who are of the Amil. view are not saying that there is no prophetic event of one thousand years in scripture. We are just saying that a thousand years is not to be understood as being literal, because God has not assigned a date for the end of His Grace and longsuffering.

What you consider as being "not advisable", is that you believe that no one should ever think beyond the literal words of God, even though the Holy Spirit through Paul says that through reading the scriptures, we are to "compare spiritual things with spiritual".

Amil, Premil and Postmil, are all interpretations of literal scripture.
I am sure that you do hold to one of them.
 

Earburner

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Revelation 20:1-6, read in a modern version and without the AMill premise, makes it clear there will be a time, of an actual thousand years, when the world will be governed by a benevolent King and Satan will not be able to deceive anyone.

Any other 'interpretation', is a direct adding to and taking away from the Book of Revelation. Not advisable!
Rev. 20[14] And death and hell [the graves] were cast into the lake of fire [whereby none of the living unsaved shall be left alive to procreate human life.
And so, since there will be no more births, there will be "no more death", which equals to no more graves].
This is the second death.
Flesh and blood can not inherit the KoG.
1 Cor. 15:50


Edit: do...you...understand??
When the last person comes to repentance towards God through faith in Jesus, and is born again of the Holy Spirit, that person will be the LAST "New creature" of the New creation of God.
It will be at that time (Luke 17:28-30; 2 Thes. 1:7-10) that God the Father will send His Son, the former "sin bearer", "without sin" to Redeem ALL His born again Saints unto Himself. Heb. 9:28.

Now, think on this:
The OLD mortal flesh and blood human race will be no more!! 1 Cor. 15:50
 
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Earburner

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Where in the KJV NT scriptures does it literally say that the Glorified Jesus will literally reign on this old earth for 1000 literal years, with the saved and the unsaved?
Waiting......
Q. Hmm....no answer?
A. It doesn't, unless the Premil and Postmil believers want to add or take away the words of Rev.
 
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Jay Ross

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Revelation 20:1-6, read in a modern version and without the AMill premise, makes it clear there will be a time, of an actual thousand years, when the world will be governed by a benevolent King and Satan will not be able to deceive anyone.

Any other 'interpretation', is a direct adding to and taking away from the Book of Revelation. Not advisable!

Revelation 20 makes that quite clear.
Why anyone should dispute it, is unfathomable.

The question is what type of rule will Christ exercise?

For me it will be a Priestly Rule and Christ will conduct that rule from Heaven.

Christ has been given dominion over all of the peoples of the earth such that they should worship Him.

Shalom
 

Keraz

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The question is what type of rule will Christ exercise?

For me it will be a Priestly Rule and Christ will conduct that rule from Heaven.

Christ has been given dominion over all of the peoples of the earth such that they should worship Him.

Shalom
Acts 1:11, Zechariah 14:16-21, Isaiah 2:1-4, + all make it perfectly clear that King Jesus will rule on earth; from Jerusalem for the thousand years.
 

Earburner

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Acts 1:11, Zechariah 14:16-21, Isaiah 2:1-4, + all make it perfectly clear that King Jesus will rule on earth; from Jerusalem for the thousand years.
You should know by now that the OT prophets could not differentiate between the three comings of Jesus**:
1. He came to us in mortal flesh.
2. He is still coming to us by His Holy Spirit.
3. He shall come again in all His Immortal Glory.

**That is why I requested NT scriptures for evidence of a 1000 year millennial reign of
Christ on earth.
Rev. 20 shows no evidence for that, but rather that of the end of the old flesh and blood human race.

Surely you do agree that Jesus is the FIRST resurrection. But if not, then please explain how it is that you are "a partaker of the divine nature", if you haven't been risen WITH Christ (born again of His Spirit)?
Col.2
[12] Buried with him in baptism, wherein also ye are risen with him through the faith of the operation of God, who hath raised him from the dead.
Col.3
[1] If ye then be risen with Christ, seek those things which are above, where Christ sitteth on the right hand of God.
 
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Keraz

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You should know by now that the OT prophets could not differentiate between the three comings of Jesus**:
1. He came to us in mortal flesh.
2. He is still coming to us by His Holy Spirit.
3. He shall come again in all His Immortal Glory.

**That is why I requested NT scriptures for evidence of a 1000 year millennial reign of
Christ on earth.
Rev. 20 shows no evidence for that, but rather that of the end of the old flesh and blood human race.
Surely you do agree that Jesus is the FIRST resurrection. But if not, then please explain how it is that you are "a partaker of the divine nature", if you haven't been risen WITH Christ (born again of His Spirit)?
Col.2
[12] Buried with him in baptism, wherein also ye are risen with him through the faith of the operation of God, who hath raised him from the dead.
Col.3
[1] If ye then be risen with Christ, seek those things which are above, where Christ sitteth on the right hand of God.
You are obviously a theological wizz kid.
I view that kind of convoluted theology, as airy-fairy and is resorted to in order to promote false ideas.

Mortal humans will live on a physical earth until the end of the Millennium. Isaiah 65:18-25
 

David in NJ

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The following are the thoughts of a hybrid view in Amillenialism. By using the whole of the KJV biblical context, Rev. 20 should be interpreted by Paul's recommendation of "comparing spiritual things with spiritual".

Please read the following non-stop, so that you may perceive the fluidity of Rev. 20.
>All words from the KJV, are in "bold" letters.
>All words in [brackets] are the suggested interpretations.
Rev. 20
[1] And I saw an angel come down from heaven, having the key of the bottomless pit and a great chain in his hand.
[2] And he laid hold on the dragon, that old serpent, which is the Devil, and Satan, and
bound him a thousand years ["in chains of darkness"- 2 Peter 2:4, during this present Age of God's Grace and longsuffering],
[3] And cast him [permanently out of the way of God's own presence] into the bottomless pit [this earth, the place of satan's endless grave], and shut him up [having no more access into heaven, God's Light, or anyone of God's ownership 1 John 5:18],
and set a seal upon him, that he should deceive the nations no more [as he did do in the past concerning Job 1:7, 11; 1 John 5:18], till the [figurative] thousand years [of God's Grace and His longsuffering] should be fulfilled: and after that he must be loosed a little season [which began in the mid-1800's and onward. At that time, the "increase of knowledge" is very visible of satan's release, who is "the prince of the power of the AIR", being that of this earth's atmosphere, aka the first heaven.
What are "microwaves"?


[4] And I saw [symbolic] thrones [Luke 22:29-30], and they [of Christ's kingdom] sat upon them, and judgment was GIVEN unto them [as Ambassadors of the Lord's judgment- 2 Cor. 5:20; John 3:18; Rom. 8:9, judging also the 12 tribes of Israel- Mat. 19:28; Luke 22:30; John 3:18]:

and I saw the souls of them that were
1. beheaded for the witness of Jesus, and
2. [those beheaded] for the word of God, and
3. [those beheaded] which had not worshipped the beast, neither his image, neither had received his mark upon their foreheads, or in their hands;
4. and [during their life times] they lived and reigned with Christ a [figurative] thousand years [during the Age of God's Grace and longsuffering].
1. The Early church.
2. The Mid church.
3. The End church.
4. All born again Christians,
during their lifetimes, have been reigning with Christ as his ambassadors, during the figurative 1000 years of God's Grace and His longsuffering. 2 Peter 3:9, 15

[5] But the rest of the dead [who died in faith of Christ] lived not again [in Immortally] until the [figurative] thousand years were finished [expired].
This is the first resurrection [to be born again, spritually risen with Christ, by the Holy Spirit, being a NEW creature/creation after Christ's resurrection, who is literally Himself the very First resurrection]. John 3:3-8; Col. 2:12, Col. 3:1; 2 Peter 5:17.

[6] Blessed and holy is he that hath part [as "partakers of the divine nature"- 2Peter 1:4] in the first resurrection [being Christ Himself]: on such the second death hath no power, but they [who are in Christ, who have been on the earth, and those of us who are now here on the earth] shall be priests of God and of Christ, and [each who are born again] shall reign with him [during] a [figurative] thousand years [during this present Age of God's Grace and His longsuffering. See also 1 Peter 2:9]

[7] And when the [figurative] thousand years [of God's Grace] are expired, Satan shall be loosed out of his prison [ever since the 1800's AD to this present day].
[8] And [satan] shall go out to deceive the nations which are in the four quarters of the earth, [symbolic of] Gog and Magog, being all the living unsaved], to gather them together ["in bundles"] to battle ["to be burned"]: the number of whom is as the sand of the sea. [being all the living unsaved, who will be found to have taken "the mark of the beast", upon Jesus' fiery and Glorious return-] Mat. 13:30; Luke 17:28-30; 2 Thes. 1:7-10; 1Rev..13:16-17.

[9] And they went up on the breadth [entirety] of the earth, and compassed the "camp" of the saints about [to lead each saint into captivity, being they who are God's dwelling places, His individual mortal "tabernacles"**, aka temporary shelters, "booths", a "camp", aka Christ's invisible church of born again Christians on earth].
and [also known as] the beloved city [the entire mortal, breathing body of Christ, the living temple of God, which is now temporarily on this old earth]: and fire came down from God out of heaven [Jesus' return "in flaming fire"], and devoured them. Luke 17:28-30; 2 Thes. 1:7-10.
**Note: the "Feast of Tabernacles", is not about the Jews living in temporary booths/shelters, but rather it is about God dwelling within our temporary mortal bodies.
2 Cor. 4[7] But we have this treasure [of God Himself] in earthen vessels [our temporary mortal bodies] that the excellency of the power may be of God, and not of us.

[10] And the devil that deceived them was cast into the lake of fire and brimstone [the burning lava of the earth's rocks and soil], [2 Peter 3] where the beast and the false prophet are [dwelling and shall die a fiery death], and [satan and all the fallen angels only] shall be tormented day and night for ever and ever.

[11] And I saw a great white throne, and him that sat on it, from whose face the [old] earth and the heaven fled away; and there was found no place for them [being the old heaven and earth].
[12] And I saw the dead, small and great, [symbolically] stand before God; and the [symbolic] books were opened: and another book was opened [which is Christ Himself], the book of life: and the [unsaved] dead were judged out of those things which were written in the [symbolic] books, according to their works ["the work of God": belief or unbelief in Christ, is predetermined by John 3:18; aka "the work of God" to be the ONLY work of God for our salvation. John 6:29. There are no other works that a person can do to gain entrance into the kingdom of God].

[13] And the sea gave up the dead which were in it; and death and hell [the graves] delivered up the dead which were in them: and they were judged every man according to their works [belief or unbelief in Christ]
[14] And death and hell [the graves] were cast into the lake of fire [whereby none of the living unsaved shall be left alive to procreate human life. And so, since there will be no more births, there will be "no more death", which equals no more graves].
This is the second death.
[Flesh and blood can not inherit the KoG- 1 Cor. 15:50]


[15] And [for all of that symbolic, supposed appearance of judging at a White Throne judgment, in their supposed resurrected(?) mortal flesh, the simple conclusion of God's Judgment is:]
whosoever was not found written in the book of life was cast into the lake of fire. [All of which was PREdetermined by God's words in John 3:18; Rom. 8:9, and 1 Cor. 15:50].
Instead of writing a long list of your own words mixed into the Scriptures, should you not be believing the Gospel FIRST?
 

David in NJ

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You should know by now that the OT prophets could not differentiate between the three comings of Jesus**:
1. He came to us in mortal flesh.
2. He is still coming to us by His Holy Spirit.
3. He shall come again in all His Immortal Glory.
The OT Prophets only speak of His First and Second Comings to earth.
The Outpouring of the Holy Spirit are separate OT Prophecies.

With that said, the Holy Spirit is the Second Promise of the FATHER and if you believe in the Lord Jesus Christ you should be praying to Him to be Baptized in the Holy Spirit.

1. The FATHERS's First Promise is the LORD coming in the flesh as Savior/Redeemer = the Lamb that takes away the sins of the world
2. The FATHER's Second Promise is the Baptism of the Holy Spirit
3. The FATHER's Third Promise is the Resurrection of the Saints at the Second Coming of CHRIST
 
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Earburner

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You are obviously a theological wizz kid.
I view that kind of convoluted theology, as airy-fairy and is resorted to in order to promote false ideas.

Mortal humans will live on a physical earth until the end of the Millennium. Isaiah 65:18-25
Not a Wizz kid! Just someone who KNOWS which Jerusalem is being safely inhabited, ever since Pentecost! Please study and digest all of Gal. ch. 4.
 

Earburner

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Instead of writing a long list of your own words mixed into the Scriptures, should you not be believing the Gospel FIRST?
If you will notice I reference much of the NT scriptures. Please read them. By His Holy Spirit within you, they will help you to understand better about Rev. 20.
 

David in NJ

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If you will notice I reference much of the NT scriptures. Please read them. By His Holy Spirit within you, they will help you to understand better about Rev. 20.
The Holy Spirit is the Spirit of Truth so HE will only speak Truth and HE will never add to the Scriptures or take away from them.

This is from the Holy Spirit and you can verify this from the Holy Scriptures

1. The FATHERS's First Promise is the LORD coming in the flesh as Savior/Redeemer = the Lamb that takes away the sins of the world
2. The FATHER's Second Promise is the Baptism of the Holy Spirit
3. The FATHER's Third Promise is the Resurrection of the Saints at the Second Coming of CHRIST

You will NEVER understand Revelation chapter 20 if you do not understand the THREE Promises of the FATHER
 
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Earburner

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1. He came to us in mortal flesh.
2. He is still coming to us by His Holy Spirit.
3. He shall come again in all His Immortal Glory.

Well, the OT Prophets only speak of His First and Second Comings to earth.

The Outpouring of the Holy Spirit are separate OT Prophecies.

With that said, the Holy Spirit is the Second Promise of the FATHER and if you believe in the Lord Jesus Christ you should be praying to Him to be Baptized in the Holy Spirit.

1. The FATHERS's First Promise is the LORD coming in the flesh as Savior/Redeemer = the Lamb that takes away the sins of the world
2. The FATHER's Second Promise is the Baptism of the Holy Spirit
3. The FATHER's Third Promise is the Resurrection of the Saints at the Second Coming of CHRIST
Yes, the prophets could not differentiate as to how or when the words of God spoken through them, would be manifested.
However, now that 2 of 3 Promises by the Father have surely come to pass, by His Holy Spirit we can KNOW what has been fulfilled, and what has not!!
One must never over look or forget that through Jesus, God has been building His 3rd temple with "lively stones" ever since Pentecost. We know of it as Heavenly Jerusalem which is above, is free, and is the mother of us all [who are of faith in Jesus].
Gal. ch. 4
 
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David in NJ

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Yes, the prophets could not differentiate as to how or when the words of God spoken through them, would be manifested.
However, now that 2 of 3 Promises by the Father have surely come to pass, by His Holy Spirit we can KNOW what has been fulfilled, and what has not!!
One must never over look or forget that through Jesus, God has been building His 3rd temple with "lively stones" ever since Pentecost. We know of it as Heavenly Jerusalem which is above, is free, and is the mother of us all [who are of faith in Jesus].
Gal. ch. 4
GREAT Post of Truth - thank you and SHALOM
 
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