Those verses agree 100% with the pretrib rapture doctrine.
But you make Jesus a liar, because he described the meeting in heaven, and said he was going there to receive us.
You were duped into that dominion baloney.
MORE PROOF OF THE PRETRIB RAPTURE
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But you make Jesus a liar, because he described the meeting in heaven, and said he was going there to receive us.
You were duped into that dominion baloney.
Jesus said in Luke 17:24-34: “For as the lightning, that lighteneth out of the one part under heaven, shineth unto the other part under heaven; so shall also the Son of man be in his day. But first must he suffer many things, and be rejected of this generation. And as it was in the days of Noe, so shall it be also in the days of the Son of man. They did eat, they drank, they married wives, they were given in marriage, until the day that Noe entered into the ark, and the flood came, and destroyed them all. Likewise also as it was in the days of Lot; they did eat, they drank, they bought, they sold, they planted, they builded; But the same day that Lot went out of Sodom it rained fire and brimstone from heaven, and destroyed them all. Even thus shall it be in the day when the Son of man is revealed. In that day, he which shall be upon the housetop, and his stuff in the house, let him not come down to take it away: and he that is in the field, let him likewise not return back. Remember Lot's wife. Whosoever shall seek to save his life shall lose it; and whosoever shall lose his life shall preserve it. I tell you, in that night there shall be two men in one bed; the one shall be taken, and the other shall be left. Two women shall be grinding together; the one shall be taken, and the other left. Two men shall be in the field; the one shall be taken, and the other left. And they answered and said unto him, Where, Lord? And he said unto them, Wheresoever the body is, thither will the eagles be gathered together.”
We note three particular characteristics of this day, which will be repeated at the second coming of the Lord Jesus Christ. (1) The wicked lived as if there was no judgement coming, verse 38 says, “they were eating and drinking, marrying and giving in marriage.” (2) The wicked were caught unexpected, verse 39 says, they “knew not until the flood came.” And finally, (3) the wicked were ALL destroyed, verse 39 says, “the flood came, and took them all away.”
The days before the coming of Christ will see the wicked at ease living in pleasure, sin and carelessness, with no thought of eternity. The everyday occurrences of life (like eating, drinking and marriage) will continue as normal right up until Jesus comes. Christ's coming is going to catch the wicked unexpectedly. His arrival will surprise only those who are not prepared for it. The wrath of God is sudden and totally destructive. No one survives as this passage tells us.
I Thessalonians 5:2-7 the enormity of this climactic event: “the day of the Lord will come as a thief in the night. For when they shall say, Peace and safety; then sudden destruction cometh upon them, as travail upon a woman with child; and they shall not escape. But ye, brethren, are not in darkness, that that day should overtake you as a thief. Ye are all the children of light, and the children of the day: we are not of the night, nor of darkness. Therefore let us not sleep, as do others; but let us watch and be sober. For they that sleep sleep in the night; and they that be drunken are drunken in the night. But let us, who are of the day, be sober, putting on the breastplate of faith and love; and for an helmet, the hope of salvation. For God hath not appointed us to wrath, but to obtain salvation by our Lord Jesus Christ.”
The peace and safety occurs just before Jesus comes at His one final future coming. Any way, if the day of the Lord in 1 Thessalonians 5:3 relates to a third coming of Christ, as some Pretribbers argue, and if they relate this to the event of Revelation 19, which they say is the end of a great 7 years tribulation, how can the wicked be crying “peace and safety”? Surely, according to Pretrib, this is a period of the wrath of God being poured out on all those left behind according to Pretrib theology?
We can see then: normal life continues on right up until Christ comes. They are eating, drinking and marrying as usual, they are claiming "peace and safety," then utter destruction strikes them unexpectedly. As in the time of the flood, all the unbelievers are destroyed.
There is no space for your tribulation period and a 2nd rapture and a 3rd coming. There is no space for some future millennium. All those that are left behind are destroyed. All the wicked are dead. All the mortals are dead. All the saints are glorified and the earth is glorified. We're now into the eternal state.
Typical response. Avoid the texts before you. Refuse to acknowledge the detail that forbids your error and then distract unto another text that forbids your error. When that is refuted, you keep this cycle of avoidance going. You convince yourself that you are right by this tactic. How sad and how foolish.
This is your MO.
You are on the run from the truth.
ChristinaL
Active Member
The 144000 are those who are called to evangelize the world. And I do not go by man made doctrine. Not now not ever. Revelation is more than clear (Rev 19) that the marriage and marriage supper is at the END of the Trib. Not before
Give a verse that says that the 144k evangelize.The 144000 are those who are called to evangelize the world. And I do not go by man made doctrine. Not now not ever. Revelation is more than clear (Rev 19) that the marriage and marriage supper is at the END of the Trib. Not before
Then one that says the marriage feast is after the trib ( which would be in direct contention with Jesus words)
The 144000 are those who are called to evangelize the world. And I do not go by man made doctrine. Not now not ever. Revelation is more than clear (Rev 19) that the marriage and marriage supper is at the END of the Trib. Not before
Take a look at your link:
"Revelation 19:7–9 prompts two major questions: When and where will the marriage and marriage supper of the Lamb take place? At least three answers to these questions have been proposed. First, the marriage will occur when the Church is raptured to meet Christ in the air at His Second Coming and the marriage supper will take place on earth during the Millennium. Second, the marriage will occur in Heaven when the Church is raptured before the 70th week (Tribulation period), and the marriage supper will take place on earth during the Millennium. Third, the marriage will occur in Heaven when the Church is raptured before the 70th week (Tribulation period), and the marriage supper will take place in Heaven during the seven years of the 70th week.:
PURE CONJECTURE.
A grand canyon leap claiming the rapture at the white horses.
That is debunked easily by anyone with a Bible.
All the rapture verses are preteib. EVERY SINGLE ONE.
NO POSTRIB RAPTURE VERSES ANYWHERE IN THE BIBLE.
ZIP
NADA.
See, this is what I an talking about. The postrib rapture doctrine is purely conjecture.
You have no verses.
Listen to the way you talk. Listen to the language you use. You seem totally incapable of having a normal Christian conversation with others.
Who said "the Holy Spirit botched" anything?
Then explain Rev 14:14 , and agree the Holy Spirit did NOT botch anything in the Bible.
You will focus on some non issue in my post and somehow think you are on the same page.
I am saying HE DID NOT BOTCH ANYTHING (It is your doctrine that insists HE DID).
You need to ask yourself and do a soul search, to address why you twist things and divert and avoid.
Then get away from those teachers twisting God's word.
Psssst...we both know you will NEVER address rev 14:14.
Way too painful to agree with the Holy Spirit who VIVIDLY declared more than one coming.
Just keep repeating "only one coming on white horses".
Revelation 14:14-20, “And I looked, and behold a white cloud, and upon the cloud one sat like unto the Son of man (Christ), having on his head a golden crown, and in his hand a sharp sickle. And another angel (angel 1) came out of the temple, crying with a loud voice to him that sat on the cloud, Thrust in thy sickle, and reap: for the time is come for thee to reap; for the harvest of the earth is ripe. And he that sat on the cloud (Christ) thrust in his sickle on the earth; and the earth was reaped. And another angel (angel 2) came out of the temple which is in heaven, he also having a sharp sickle. And another angel (angel 3) came out from the altar, which had power over fire; and cried with a loud cry to him that had the sharp sickle, saying, Thrust in thy sharp sickle, and gather the clusters of the vine of the earth; for her grapes are fully ripe. And the angel (angel 3) thrust in his sickle into the earth, and gathered the vine of the earth, and cast it into the great winepress of the wrath of God. And the winepress was trodden without the city, and blood came out of the winepress, even unto the horse bridles, by the space of a thousand and six hundred furlongs.”
This narrative reveals a vivid account of the harvest that accompanies the second coming at the end of this age. We see “the Son of man” appearing upon “a white cloud” with “a golden crown” upon His head and “a sharp sickle” in His hand to reap that final crop “for the harvest of the earth is ripe.” As is seen in other Scripture, it is at the second coming that the wicked are finally cast “into the great winepress of the wrath of God.” The wicked will not survive this awful concluding day of destruction. We should state, the symbolism here should not be confused with Christ’s illustration of the vine in John 15. The earth is depicted as one overall symbolic ripe vine that is ready for harvesting. This is indeed “the harvest of the earth” of which the figurative sickle “thrust in” to in order to perfect the harvest.
That harvest of vs14 FOLLOWS the 144k firstfruits.
It is the main Jewish harvest spoken of in romans..
No white horses.
The Bible is not confusion of Jesus sitting on a cloud holding a sickle, while at the same time returning with million of white horses with a sword into warfare.
Such folly attempting to remake the Bible into "0ne coming"
It is folly and a definate impossibility.
It gets worse because the fulfillment of the Jews grafted back in ,is in fact Rev 14. And the postrib doctrine does not even understand the PURPOSE of the trib.
Pssssst...it is Jacob's trouble...ISRAELS TROUBLE.
How far,far, far, that postrib doctrine has removed its followers from the Bible and the purposes of God.
You guys can not see a Jewish harvest in Rev 14, nor the grafting back in of the Jews, nor do you understand the PURPOSE of the trib.
All pointing to the horrible gross error of some ignorant man that formulated that postrib rapture doctrine , AS YOU GUYS CLAIM, A MAN MADE DOCTRINE OF ANCIENT, DEAD CHURCH FATHERS (AHEM....MEN WITH LIMITED REVELATION), and then the Catholics emerge with you guy's false doctrine.
You guys admit it is birthed in Men, and in error.
Mental and way way off...as you have demonstrated in not being able to agree with Rev 14.
You literally changed the one book that carries a curse for changing it.
IOW...YES ALL OF YOU WILL GO THROUGH THE GT. As is promised for changing the book.
Where does it mention the 144,000 there?
Nowhere!
You force it into the text to support what you have been taught.
This is called adding unto Scripture.
No. Jacob's trouble is long gone. The 144k are in heaven before this - before the throne. They have already been raised from the earth. These are the firstfruits of the great commission 2000 years ago. The Gospel is then preached to the nations. There is no mention of the 144k in the final harvest. That is an invention of your own imagination, and you know it.
Once again, you manipulate Scripture to support your Pretrib error.
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ChristinaL
Active Member
Another silly twit who wont bloody listen. I BELIEVE IN THE PRE TRIB RAPTURE
Ok.
Great?!
You never answered my 2 questions asking you to defend your theory
You just went postal and freaked out on me.
14 And I looked, and, lo, a Lamb stood on the mount Sion, and with him an hundred forty and four thousand, having his Father's name written in their foreheads.
2 And I heard a voice from heaven, as the voice of many waters, and as the voice of a great thunder: and I heard the voice of harpers harping with their harps:
3 And they sung as it were a new song before the throne, and before the four beasts
Of course you can not see it plainly written.
Nothing of your sentences rebuttals anything I posted.
You have debunked nothing but your own invented doctrine, that you are incapable of defending. That is why you cannot engage with Posttribbers. If you would listen rather than running off your mouth you would learn what the Bible teaches.
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