POSTRIB RAPTURE. A BIBLE ONLY VIEW

[Spiritual Israelite]

When I debunked your " one coming"
I did it with acts1, rev14:14, the virgin parable, mat 24:38, and 1 thes 4., and the one taken/one left.

ALL OF WHICH YOU ARE UNAWARE OF.

You think you can just list verses, claim they support your view and then you've won the debate. I've never seen anything more ridiculous in my life.

Here's how you debate....

I'm going to prove post-trib to you once and for all and you will have no choice but to become a post-trib...

1 Thess 4:14-17
Matthew 24:29-31
2 Thess 1:7-10
Luke 17:26-37
Matt 25:1-13
etc.

All teach post-trib.
Everyone either taken up to Christ or left and killed
Wise virgins raptured, foolish virgins cast out where there is weeping and gnashing of teeth
All left out of ark and all left in Sodom killed just like when Jesus comes all not raptured killed
You're wrong. I'm right.
Debate is over.
Sorry, fella. I just destroyed pre-trib.
Pretrib is officially dead.

 

[The Light]

OK - good work but let's check this together in the Scriptures.

#1 - We KNOW we are NOT appointed to God's Wrath = 1 Thess 1:10 , 1 Thess 5:9

So we do not have to rehash what we already KNOW is TRUTH and the SURE FOUNDATION upon which we stand.

RIGHT - so in Rev ch6 we SEE the Saints Martyrs under the Altar of God with God saying:
"Many more Saints must DIE this way" BEFORE the Second Coming of Christ

When He opened the fifth seal, I saw under the altar the souls of those who had been slain for the word of God and for the testimony which they held. And they cried with a loud voice, saying, “How long, O Lord, holy and true, until You judge and avenge our blood on those who dwell on the earth?” Then a white robe was given to each of them; and it was said to them that they should rest a little while longer, until both the number of their fellow servants and their brethren, who would be killed as they were, was completed.

The opening of the 6th Seal( Rev ch6 ) we SEE the Second Coming of Christ:
looked when He opened the sixth seal, and behold, there was a great earthquake; and the sun became black as sackcloth of hair, and the moon became like blood. And the stars of heaven fell to the earth, as a fig tree drops its late figs when it is shaken by a mighty wind. Then the sky receded as a scroll when it is rolled up, and every mountain and island was moved out of its place. And the kings of the earth, the great men, the rich men, the commanders, the mighty men, every slave and every free man, hid themselves in the caves and in the rocks of the mountains, and said to the mountains and rocks, “Fall on us and hide us from the face of Him who sits on the throne and from the wrath of the Lamb! For the great day of His wrath has come, and who is able to stand?”

There it is, no adding or taking away from the words of God.

Next Post we can look at chapter 7 and the 7th Seal and keep going until we reach ch22

SHALOM

I am not understanding the point you are making.

Yes, we are not appointed to wrath and yet doesn't your view have the Church on earth during the trumpets of wrath?

 

[David in NJ]

I am not understanding the point you are making.

Yes, we are not appointed to wrath and yet doesn't your view have the Church on earth during the trumpets of wrath?

Brother, we are together on TRUTH

We are NOT appointed to God's Wrath

i have not reviewed the 7th Seal as yet for my son had an eye injury that we just came back from the ER

Thankfully all is Good.

Tomorrow i am busy and may not come back to you on this for a couple of days.

During that time we can pray and seek Guidance from the Holy Spirit.

SHALOM

 

[David in NJ]

I am not understanding the point you are making.

Yes, we are not appointed to wrath and yet doesn't your view have the Church on earth during the trumpets of wrath?

For now we can look at the next chapter = chapter 7

After these things I looked, and behold, a great multitude which no one could number, of all nations, tribes, peoples, and tongues, standing before the throne and before the Lamb, clothed with white robes, with palm branches in their hands, and crying out with a loud voice, saying, “Salvation belongs to our God who sits on the throne, and to the Lamb!” All the angels stood around the throne and the elders and the four living creatures, and fell on their faces before the throne and worshiped God, saying:

“Amen! Blessing and glory and wisdom,
Thanksgiving and honor and power and might,
Be to our God forever and ever.
Amen.”
Then one of the elders answered, saying to me, “Who are these arrayed in white robes, and where did they come from?”

And I said to him, “Sir, you know.”

So he said to me, “These are the ones who come out of the great tribulation, and washed their robes and made them white in the blood of the Lamb. Therefore they are before the throne of God, and serve Him day and night in His temple. And He who sits on the throne will dwell among them. They shall neither hunger anymore nor thirst anymore; the sun shall not strike them, nor any heat; for the Lamb who is in the midst of the throne will shepherd them and lead them to living fountains of waters. And God will wipe away every tear from their eyes.”

DIRECT Statement from the LORD that the Saints GO THRU the Great Tribulation.

 

[rebuilder 454]

I am not the only post trib who has been opening his Bible and posting the scriptures.
I see you didn't open your Bible to find OT scriptures about when the raising of the dead occurs.

Allow me,

JOB 14
10
“But [the brave, strong] man must die and lie face down;
Man breathes his last, and where is he?
11
“As water evaporates from the sea,
And a river drains and dries up,
12
So man lies down and does not rise [again].
Until the heavens are no longer,
The dead will not awake nor be raised from their sleep.
13
“Oh, that You would hide me in Sheol (the nether world, the place of the dead),
That You would conceal me until Your wrath is past,


Jesus believed it and so should you.

33 Heaven and earth will pass away, but My words will not pass away.
34 “But be on guard, so that your hearts are not weighed down and depressed with the giddiness of debauchery and the nausea of self-indulgence and the worldly worries of life, and then that day [when the Messiah returns] will not come on you suddenly like a trap; 35 for it will come upon all those who live on the face of all the earth. 36 But keep alert at all times [be attentive and ready], praying that you may have the strength and ability [to be found worthy and] to escape all these things that are going to take place, and to stand in the presence of the Son of Man [at His coming].”

1Thess 5
2Thess1

Maybe God owes Job and the baby Jesus an apology?
He was supposed to leave them there and instead chose the evil way out?
God was unaware of the correct doctrine that prohibits ANY removal of his people pretrib?

Concerning the resurrection Paul said the dead in Christ shall rise first.
You have the dead rising AFTER the gathering of rev14:14 which is during the GT.
You have the Jewish gathering happening BEFORE the resurrection.

But it gets worse.
Remember, your doctrine has a foundation and cornerstone of "one coming "
So no matter what, you will NEVER be able to reconcile the 3 comings.
You will skip it, shy away from It, and if necessary change the bible.

Another thing you can not address is the FACT that all on the planet take the mark (this YOU CAN NOT ANSWER, and is where ALL OF you rely on pure conjecture).

You will face the AC just like your faith dictates. You will chose life or death. Many of your colleagues will take the mark.

 

[rebuilder 454]

For now we can look at the next chapter = chapter 7

After these things I looked, and behold, a great multitude which no one could number, of all nations, tribes, peoples, and tongues, standing before the throne and before the Lamb, clothed with white robes, with palm branches in their hands, and crying out with a loud voice, saying, “Salvation belongs to our God who sits on the throne, and to the Lamb!” All the angels stood around the throne and the elders and the four living creatures, and fell on their faces before the throne and worshiped God, saying:

“Amen! Blessing and glory and wisdom,
Thanksgiving and honor and power and might,
Be to our God forever and ever.
Amen.”
Then one of the elders answered, saying to me, “Who are these arrayed in white robes, and where did they come from?”

And I said to him, “Sir, you know.”

So he said to me, “These are the ones who come out of the great tribulation, and washed their robes and made them white in the blood of the Lamb. Therefore they are before the throne of God, and serve Him day and night in His temple. And He who sits on the throne will dwell among them. They shall neither hunger anymore nor thirst anymore; the sun shall not strike them, nor any heat; for the Lamb who is in the midst of the throne will shepherd them and lead them to living fountains of waters. And God will wipe away every tear from their eyes.”

DIRECT Statement from the LORD that the Saints GO THRU the Great Tribulation.

Wow.
You posted that they DIED IN THE TRIB.
NO CHRISTIAN SAINT makes it THROUGH.
You just showed us they all are martyred.

It CLEARLY SAYS POWER IS GIVEN THE AC TO OVERCOME THE SAINTS.
IT SAYS ALL TAKE THE MARK.
ALL ON THE PLANET NOT WRITTEN IN THE BOOK.
ALL DIE THAT REFUSE.
COMPLETE ANIHALATION OF BELIEVERS DURING THE TRIB.

Yes..it is most definitely a pretrib rapture as you just UNWITTINGLY Showed us.

 

[David in NJ]

Wow.
You posted that they DIED IN THE TRIB.
NO CHRISTIAN SAINT makes it THROUGH.
You just showed us they all are martyred.

It CLEARLY SAYS POWER IS GIVEN THE AC TO OVERCOME THE SAINTS.
IT SAYS ALL TAKE THE MARK.
ALL ON THE PLANET NOT WRITTEN IN THE BOOK.
ALL DIE THAT REFUSE.
COMPLETE ANIHALATION OF BELIEVERS DURING THE TRIB.

Yes..it is most definitely a pretrib rapture as you just UNWITTINGLY Showed us.

NOT all die!!!

How do i KNOW = GOD said SO
why are you a NO-NO
when you should be a GO-GO

not dancing on stage
but Dancing with PRAISE
like David did before the Ark
you better FILL UP on oil
BEFORE it gets DARK

 

[rebuilder 454]

NOT all die!!!

How do i KNOW = GOD said SO
why are you a NO-NO
when you should be a GO-GO

not dancing on stage
but Dancing with PRAISE
like David did before the Ark
you better FILL UP on oil
BEFORE it gets DARK

Scripture please.
Post my verses that say they do.
Then the counter verses from the postrib work book that void out the book of Revelation.
Keep in mind I have 2 places THAT SAY they all die.

 

[David in NJ]

Scripture please.
Post my verses that say they do.
Then the counter verses from the postrib work book that void out the book of Revelation.
Keep in mind I have 2 places THAT SAY they all die.

KEEP in your mind ALL of the WORD of GOD = and SUBMIT to HIM and HE will OPEN your eyes!

But I do not want you to be ignorant, brethren, concerning those who have fallen asleep, lest you sorrow as others who have no hope. 1For if we believe that Jesus died and rose again, even so God will bring with Him those who sleep in Jesus.

For this we say to you by the word of the Lord, that we who are alive and remain until the coming of the Lord will by no means precede those who are asleep. For the Lord Himself will descend from heaven with a shout, with the voice of an archangel, and with the trumpet of God.
And the dead in Christ will rise first.
Then we who are alive and remain shall be caught up together with them in the clouds to meet the Lord in the air. And thus we shall always be with the Lord. Therefore comfort one another with these words.


REVELATION
“And to the angel of the church in Philadelphia write,

‘These things says He who is holy, He who is true, “He who has the key of David, He who opens and no one shuts, and shuts and no one opens”: “I know your works. See, I have set before you an open door, and no one can shut it; for you have a little strength, have kept My word, and have not denied My name. Indeed I will make those of the synagogue of Satan, who say they are Jews and are not, but lie—indeed I will make them come and worship before your feet, and to know that I have loved you. Because you have kept My command to persevere, I also will keep you from the hour of trial which shall come upon the whole world, to test those who dwell on the earth. Behold, I am coming quickly! Hold fast what you have, that no one may take your crown. He who overcomes, I will make him a pillar in the temple of My God, and he shall go out no more. I will write on him the name of My God and the name of the city of My God, the New Jerusalem, which comes down out of heaven from My God. And I will write on him My new name.

“He who has an ear, let him hear what the Spirit says to the churches.” ’

 

[rebuilder 454]

Why don't you ever do that?


Then show it. Stop just saying things like this and do something to back up what you're saying for once.


Impossible to see that. It does not have 2 gatherings. But, you are welcome to show that and back up what you're saying. If you want to be taken seriously, that is. Otherwise, just keep making claims like this while doing nothing to back them up. It's up to you.

I usually skip your trolling.
I peeked in to see if by some slight chance you brought a Bible to the table.
Nope
Just safe generalized put downs as usual.
You got nothing else to do than muddy up verses?

 

[rebuilder 454]

KEEP in your mind ALL of the WORD of GOD = and SUBMIT to HIM and HE will OPEN your eyes!

But I do not want you to be ignorant, brethren, concerning those who have fallen asleep, lest you sorrow as others who have no hope. 1For if we believe that Jesus died and rose again, even so God will bring with Him those who sleep in Jesus.

For this we say to you by the word of the Lord, that we who are alive and remain until the coming of the Lord will by no means precede those who are asleep. For the Lord Himself will descend from heaven with a shout, with the voice of an archangel, and with the trumpet of God.
And the dead in Christ will rise first.
Then we who are alive and remain shall be caught up together with them in the clouds to meet the Lord in the air. And thus we shall always be with the Lord. Therefore comfort one another with these words.


REVELATION
“And to the angel of the church in Philadelphia write,

‘These things says He who is holy, He who is true, “He who has the key of David, He who opens and no one shuts, and shuts and no one opens”: “I know your works. See, I have set before you an open door, and no one can shut it; for you have a little strength, have kept My word, and have not denied My name. Indeed I will make those of the synagogue of Satan, who say they are Jews and are not, but lie—indeed I will make them come and worship before your feet, and to know that I have loved you. Because you have kept My command to persevere, I also will keep you from the hour of trial which shall come upon the whole world, to test those who dwell on the earth. Behold, I am coming quickly! Hold fast what you have, that no one may take your crown. He who overcomes, I will make him a pillar in the temple of My God, and he shall go out no more. I will write on him the name of My God and the name of the city of My God, the New Jerusalem, which comes down out of heaven from My God. And I will write on him My new name.

“He who has an ear, let him hear what the Spirit says to the churches.” ’

Lol
Now you are talking.
Those are pretrib talking points.
Again, you UNWITTINGLY point us to the pretrib rapture.

Amen!
He keeps us FROM.
Glad you are now in truth.
Those postribbers need it to say " ...he keeps us in"

Nope ,the AC kills all refusing the mark.
Glad you are now agreeing with God's word.

 

[The Light]

Brother, we are together on TRUTH

We are NOT appointed to God's Wrath

i have not reviewed the 7th Seal as yet for my son had an eye injury that we just came back from the ER

Thankfully all is Good.

Tomorrow i am busy and may not come back to you on this for a couple of days.

During that time we can pray and seek Guidance from the Holy Spirit.

SHALOM

We haven't finished Revelation 6.

Where is the Church during the trumpets of wrath?

 

[WPM]

I usually skip your trolling.
I peeked in to see if by some slight chance you brought a Bible to the table.
Nope
Just safe generalized put downs as usual.
You got nothing else to do than muddy up verses?

More projection. You are describing yourself every time. All you have is avoidance and insults.

 

[WPM]

Wow.
You posted that they DIED IN THE TRIB.
NO CHRISTIAN SAINT makes it THROUGH.
You just showed us they all are martyred.

It CLEARLY SAYS POWER IS GIVEN THE AC TO OVERCOME THE SAINTS.
IT SAYS ALL TAKE THE MARK.
ALL ON THE PLANET NOT WRITTEN IN THE BOOK.
ALL DIE THAT REFUSE.
COMPLETE ANIHALATION OF BELIEVERS DURING THE TRIB.

Yes..it is most definitely a pretrib rapture as you just UNWITTINGLY Showed us.

Really? Who are all the supposed mortals that inherit your supposed future millennium then?

 

[David in NJ]

We haven't finished Revelation 6.

Where is the Church during the trumpets of wrath?

What did God say to the the Martyrs under the Altar?

 

[rebuilder 454]

Really? Who are all the supposed mortals that inherit your supposed future millennium then?

The ones in heaven that Jesus rides with in Rev 19.
Billions of them blackening the sky to destroy the AC and his army.

 

[The Light]

What did God say to the the Martyrs under the Altar?

He told them to wait until the tribulation of those days is over. That will occur at the 6th seal. ............immediately after the tribulation of those days.

After that, the 7th seal is opened, and trumpets and vials of wrath occur. So where is the Church during the trumpets and vials of wrath?

 

[rebuilder 454]

What did God say to the the Martyrs under the Altar?

To rest and go back until their number is fulfilled.
It gets fulfilled right away.
Note that the innumerable number in heaven are martyrs out of the great tribulation, and the martyrs population is no longer confined to "under the altar".
Easy to see their number is fulfilled at that point.
Martyrs are, at that point,in the general population.

 

[rebuilder 454]

More projection. You are describing yourself every time. All you have is avoidance and insults.

You do a tiny bit better than SI.
Some of your stuff is thoughtful.
I think SI is working through some issues.
That is possibly why he brings all the chatter to the table.

 

[The Light]

I am not the only post trib who has been opening his Bible and posting the scriptures.
I see you didn't open your Bible to find OT scriptures about when the raising of the dead occurs.

Allow me,

JOB 14
10
“But [the brave, strong] man must die and lie face down;
Man breathes his last, and where is he?
11
“As water evaporates from the sea,
And a river drains and dries up,
12
So man lies down and does not rise [again].
Until the heavens are no longer,
The dead will not awake nor be raised from their sleep.
13
“Oh, that You would hide me in Sheol (the nether world, the place of the dead),
That You would conceal me until Your wrath is past,


Jesus believed it and so should you.

33 Heaven and earth will pass away, but My words will not pass away.
34 “But be on guard, so that your hearts are not weighed down and depressed with the giddiness of debauchery and the nausea of self-indulgence and the worldly worries of life, and then that day [when the Messiah returns] will not come on you suddenly like a trap; 35 for it will come upon all those who live on the face of all the earth. 36 But keep alert at all times [be attentive and ready], praying that you may have the strength and ability [to be found worthy and] to escape all these things that are going to take place, and to stand in the presence of the Son of Man [at His coming].”

1Thess 5
2Thess1

Allow me.

The time that Job speaks of is AFTER the wrath of God.............until thy wrath be past.

Job 14
13 O that thou wouldest hide me in the grave, that thou wouldest keep me secret, until thy wrath be past, that thou wouldest appoint me a set time, and remember me!

However we can see that many of the people of Daniel are raised at the end of the great tribulation. The great tribulation is OVER at the 6th seal. Then the wrath of God begins after the 7th seal is opened.

The time in the book of Daniel when many are raised, occurs at the end of the tribulation. Tribulation is not the wrath of God.

Daniel 12
And at that time shall Michael stand up, the great prince which standeth for the children of thy people: and there shall be a time of trouble, such as never was since there was a nation even to that same time: and at that time thy people shall be delivered, every one that shall be found written in the book.

2 And many of them that sleep in the dust of the earth shall awake, some to everlasting life, and some to shame and everlasting contempt.