Why do you not quote God's Word? Are you ashamed of it? Are you sheepish because to do so would expose your theological position?
22 major reasons to abandon the Premil doctrine
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LOL, no. All you do in your posts is talk and attempt to dodge bullets. You seem to know what the rest of us know: you have zero corroboration to support Premil. We are therefore looking at a private interpretation.
What are you talking about? How can he be a man?
1. The beast has been around for over 2000 years (Revelation 17:8, Revelation 17:11-13, 1 John 2:18-23, 1 John 4:1-3, 5-6, 2 John 1:7, and 2 Thessalonians 2:3-13). No man has lived that long on earth. Only a wicked spirit or an evil empire could possibly fulfil that portrayal.
2. How can a literal human being be literally “in them that perish” (2 Thessalonians 2:10)? This would suggest him being in every single unsaved person. Only a spirit can do that.
3. The beast carries the allegiance of all the non-elect. No single human being has or ever or will possess that wholesale allegiance. Only a broader worldly spirit enjoys all the loyalty of the wicked.
4. There is nowhere in Scripture that shows human beings in the abyss (Luke 8:31, Romans 10:7, Revelation 9:1, 2, 11, 11:7, 17:8, and 20:1, 3). Any time it is mentioned, it is shown to be the exclusive abode of Satan and his demons.
5. What man possesses 7 heads? These describe 7 wicked kingdoms in history with 7 kings ruling over them. No man can possibly satisfy that.
6. According to the original Greek, and in contrast to what many people teach, 666 is the number of “man,” not the number of “a man.”
7. Finally, what human being in history lives in, and rises up out of, the sea at the end? Such an idea is nonsensical.
Amils are all about private interpretation as I agree perfectly with every word in this passage....
20 And I saw an angel come down from heaven, having the key of the bottomless pit and a great chain in his hand.
2 And he laid hold on the dragon, that old serpent, which is the Devil, and Satan, and bound him a thousand years,
3 And cast him into the bottomless pit, and shut him up, and set a seal upon him, that he should deceive the nations no more, till the thousand years should be fulfilled: and after that he must be loosed a little season.
4 And I saw thrones, and they sat upon them, and judgment was given unto them: and I saw the souls of them that were beheaded for the witness of Jesus, and for the word of God, and which had not worshipped the beast, neither his image, neither had received his mark upon their foreheads, or in their hands; and they lived and reigned with Christ a thousand years.
5 But the rest of the dead lived not again until the thousand years were finished. This is the first resurrection.
6 Blessed and holy is he that hath part in the first resurrection: on such the second death hath no power, but they shall be priests of God and of Christ, and shall reign with him a thousand years.
....As Amils get squeamish over the passage as it appears.
Moses employs `a thousand' in Deuteronomy 7:9 saying, "Know therefore that the LORD thy God, he is God, the faithful God, which keepeth covenant and mercy with them that love him and keep his commandments to a thousand generations."
Is this a literal or figurative thousand?
1 Chronicles 16:13-17 also states, "O ye seed of Israel his servant, ye children of Jacob, his chosen ones. He is the LORD our God; his judgments are in all the earth. Be ye mindful always of his covenant; the word which he commanded to a thousand generations; Even of the covenant which he made with Abraham, and of his oath unto Isaac; And hath confirmed the same to Jacob for a law, and to Israel for an everlasting covenant."
Is this a literal or figurative thousand?
A thousand and ten thousand are used together in Psalm 91, saying, "Thou shalt not be afraid for the terror by night; nor for the arrow that flieth by day; Nor for the pestilence that walketh in darkness; nor for the destruction that wasteth at noonday. A thousand shall fall at thy side, and ten thousand at thy right hand; but it shall not come nigh thee" (vv 5-7).
Is this a literal or figurative thousand?
A similar contrast between these two numbers or ideas is seen in Deuteronomy 32:30, where a rhetorical question is asked, "How should one chase a thousand, and two put ten thousand to flight, except their Rock had sold them, and the Lord had shut them up?"
Is this a literal or figurative thousand?
Joshua affirms, on the same vein, in chapter 23, "One man of you shall chase a thousand: for the LORD your God, he it is that fighteth for you, as he hath promised you" (v 10).
Is this a literal or figurative thousand?
Isaiah the prophet similarly declares in Isaiah 30:17, "one thousand shall flee at the rebuke of one."
This incidentally is the only passage in Scripture that makes mention of the actual number "one thousand," albeit, the term is used to impress a spiritual truth.
Is this a literal or figurative thousand?
Psalm 84:9-10 says, "Behold, O God our shield, and look upon the face of thine anointed. For a day in thy courts is better than a thousand. I had rather be a doorkeeper in the house of my God, than to dwell in the tents of wickedness."
Is this a literal or figurative thousand?
The figure a thousand is also employed in Psalm 50:10-11 saying, "For every beast of the forest is mine, and the cattle upon a thousand hills. I know all the fowls of the mountains: and the wild beasts of the field are mine."
Is this a literal or figurative thousand?
Ecclesiastes 7:27-28 succinctly says, "one man among a thousand have I found."
Is this a literal or figurative thousand?
In the same vein, Job 33:23 declares, "If there be a messenger with him, an interpreter, one among a thousand, to shew unto man his uprightness."
Is this a literal or figurative thousand?
Your hold of interpretation is hypocritical. You cherry pick what you argue.
If you are adamant in interpreting 1,000 years hyper-literally, how long is the “one hour” that the beast reigns with the “ten kings” in Revelation 17:12 is? i.e. is it sixty minutes?
This is the most figurative book in the Bible. The beast is mentioned over 30 times in the book of Revelation. Does that make it a literal beast? There are 10 horns mentioned 6 time in Revelation. That does not make them literal horns. No, they represent rulers. There are 7 heads mentioned 5 time in Revelation. That does not make them literal. They represent kingdoms. Babylon is mentioned 6 time in Revelation. That does not make her literal. It is mystery spiritual Babylon. The dragon is mentioned 12 time in Revelation. That does not make it literal. It is symbol of the devil.
You do not seem to understand apocalyptic language. That is why your theology is messed up.
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You forgot to also quote Shakespeare to attempt do away with this....
20 And I saw an angel come down from heaven, having the key of the bottomless pit and a great chain in his hand.
2 And he laid hold on the dragon, that old serpent, which is the Devil, and Satan, and bound him a thousand years,
3 And cast him into the bottomless pit, and shut him up, and set a seal upon him, that he should deceive the nations no more, till the thousand years should be fulfilled: and after that he must be loosed a little season.
4 And I saw thrones, and they sat upon them, and judgment was given unto them: and I saw the souls of them that were beheaded for the witness of Jesus, and for the word of God, and which had not worshipped the beast, neither his image, neither had received his mark upon their foreheads, or in their hands; and they lived and reigned with Christ a thousand years.
5 But the rest of the dead lived not again until the thousand years were finished. This is the first resurrection.
6 Blessed and holy is he that hath part in the first resurrection: on such the second death hath no power, but they shall be priests of God and of Christ, and shall reign with him a thousand years.
Would you rather see the pronouns "they/them" in front of the thousand years instead?
Avoidance is your MO. You are clearly out of your depth here. You are incapable of addressing any counter-arguments and are unwilling or unable to quote any other Scripture apart from Rev 20 and exegete it. Everything you argue is interpreted through the lens of Revelation 20. Amils do the opposite. They interpret Revelation 20 by the rest of Scripture. You are obsessed with Rev 20. Sad!
More avoidance. This is who you are and this is what you do. You cannot interact in simple discussions. To do so would force you to admit Amil is biblical. All you are left with is avoidance and Ad Hominem.
You seem to think: if you repeat a lie enough that it suddenly becomes truth. That is not the way it works. Quite the opposite!
The Amil get's a concordance and finds random words to match words to redefine it.
It works both ways for them also.
The Amil says 1thousand can mean 1 billion in OT verbage...LOL.
They are concordance interpreters.
It works both ways for them also.
The Amil says 1thousand can mean 1 billion in OT verbage...LOL.
They are concordance interpreters.
1. The beast has been around for over 2000 years (Revelation 17:8, Revelation 17:11-13, 1 John 2:18-23, 1 John 4:1-3, 5-6, 2 John 1:7, and 2 Thessalonians 2:3-13). No man has lived that long on earth. Only a wicked spirit or an evil empire could possibly fulfil that portrayal.
2. How can a literal human being be literally “in them that perish” (2 Thessalonians 2:10)? This would suggest him being in every single unsaved person. Only a spirit can do that.
3. The beast carries the allegiance of all the non-elect. No single human being has or ever or will possess that wholesale allegiance. Only a broader worldly spirit enjoys all the loyalty of the wicked.
4. There is nowhere in Scripture that shows human beings in the abyss (Luke 8:31, Romans 10:7, Revelation 9:1, 2, 11, 11:7, 17:8, and 20:1, 3). Any time it is mentioned, it is shown to be the exclusive abode of Satan and his demons.
5. What man possesses 7 heads? These describe 7 wicked kingdoms in history with 7 kings ruling over them. No man can possibly satisfy that.
6. According to the original Greek, and in contrast to what many people teach, 666 is the number of “man,” not the number of “a man.”
7. Finally, what human being in history lives in, and rises up out of, the sea at the end? Such an idea is nonsensical.
If you are adamant in interpreting 1,000 years hyper-literally, how long is the “one hour” that the beast reigns with the “ten kings” in Revelation 17:12 is? i.e. is it sixty minutes?
This is the most figurative book in the Bible. The beast is mentioned over 30 times in the book of Revelation. Does that make it a literal beast? There are 10 horns mentioned 6 time in Revelation. That does not make them literal horns. No, they represent rulers. There are 7 heads mentioned 5 time in Revelation. That does not make them literal. They represent kingdoms. Babylon is mentioned 6 time in Revelation. That does not make her literal. It is mystery spiritual Babylon. The dragon is mentioned 12 time in Revelation. That does not make it literal. It is symbol of the devil.
You do not seem to understand apocalyptic language. That is why your theology is messed up.
It is worth reminding ourselves that the expression a ‘thousand years’ comes up six times in the book of Revelation, which is two more time than the whole of Scripture put together. Of the four other references in Scripture, two are in the Old and two are in the New Testament. Significantly, in ALL the other four previous occasions, the term is figuratively used to denote ‘a long time period’. This finding, as we have discovered, is in complete accord with the consistent use of the general expression ‘a thousand’ in Scripture. Such is repeatedly employed to denote ‘a large number’ or ‘an untold amount.’ Also, of the four previous mentions of a ‘thousand years,’ we have found none to explicitly or implicitly teach that there is going to be a literal ‘thousand years’ reign of Christ on earth nor a coinciding literal ‘thousand years’ binding of the devil. Neither is there any other passage in Scripture that indicates such a teaching.
Of the six mentions of a ‘thousand years’ in Revelation, all are found together in the same chapter – the one currently under examination – Revelation 20; and at that, in six consecutive verses of 2, 3, 4, 5, 6 and 7. Quite frankly, and in particular reference to the actual figure, this chapter is the sole source for arguing for a literal ‘thousand years’ reign of Christ on earth and a literal ‘thousand years’ binding of the devil. Therefore, nobody involved in this overall debate can downplay the significance of this important chapter.
In addition to the undoubted pattern already established, we must also remind ourselves of the chapter’s setting. Revelation 20 sits in the most symbolic book of the Bible; a book that is saturated in numerology and the most figurative language in Scripture. We must therefore examine the chapter in such a manner and interpret it in such a figurative context less error would arise in its overall interpretation.
William E. Cox in his book ‘Biblical Studies in Final Things’ says,
“It is self-evident that this lone passage dealing with the millennium is couched in a book of the Bible literally filled with symbols, numerology, figures of speech, poetic language, spiritual lessons couched in Old Testament terminology, etc. Although this is true the very word ‘revelation’ in verse 1 of chapter 1 means ‘unveiling.’ This verse of the Revelation also informs us that this unveiling was “signified” to John. This word means that the message, or unveiling, was given in symbols, or figures. So, there is something amiss when a symbol which was given to unveil God’s plan becomes a veil of obscurity” (p.158).
We have no reason therefore to interpret ‘a thousand years’ any different than the consistent pattern already seen or to take it as anything other than a symbolic figure used to describe a long period of time. We must therefore conclude that the ‘thousand years’ expression employed in this chapter is not a literal period of time or a future millennial kingdom but a figurative term and a spiritual reign which is currently in progress in the lives of all those who love, the Lord Jesus Christ as their Saviour and Lord – whether in heaven or in earth. THIS is in keeping with the rest of Scripture.
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