Post the prophecy

[Randy Kluth]

So are you saying that the Jews that reject the new covenant, which means they reject Jesus Christ, are the Israel of God?

If your wife cheats on you is she still your wife?

 

[Timtofly]

No. You only offered a verse OUT OF CONTEXT. The context I quoted clearly stated who Christ talked about. Gentiles! The Church! Not national Israel nor literal temple in the Middle East. It is a spiritual temple made up of Gentiles (and Jews who heard the Gospel). You remain refuted. Selah!

From your post:

• Simeon hath declared how God at the first did visit the Gentiles, to take out of them a people for his name.And to this agree the words of the prophets; as it is written,
• After this I will return, and will build again the tabernacle of David, which is fallen down; and I will build again the ruins thereof, and I will set it up:
• That the residue of men might seek after the Lord, and all the Gentiles

James points out that what Peter said included the Gentiles and agrees with the OT, but is not instead of Israel.

The remnant of Israel, and all the Gentiles, yes, but after the return.

You have placed all your emphasis on the first century. Jesus came in the first century. Jesus did not return in the first century.

The residue is not first century humanity. The residue is post the Second Coming, and Jesus sitting in Judgment on the throne of David, meaning in Jerusalem.

The tabernacle of David has not been rebuilt and restored at this point in time, and certainly not in the first century, when near the end, Jerusalem was utterly laid waste. The promise was about a time when it would never be destroyed again, not just a spiritual application that you insist.

Jesus also said the kingdom was without observation, so not a fulfillment of the restoration of David's tabernacle. David never set up a spiritual church that was without observation, that was some how destroyed in spiritual unbelief.

You have an interpretation that you have forced onto the text. Then accuse dispensational futurists of placing an interpretation that is already plain to read, and not forced at all.

I agree that there can be a spiritual application, but you cannot just replace the text with your own thought out opinion. You say it takes a deeper study of the Word. I agree. Even Paul states the Second Coming is when Israel is restored, not the first coming that literally restored nothing about Israel. In fact, the first century led to the complete dispersion of Israel. And the fulness of the Gentiles did not replace nor restore Israel. It was God allowing an easier access into His Heavenly Kingdom, which is not based on the earth but has always been in Heaven.

Jesus taught in parables about that Heavenly Kingdom, so it was already in existence even prior to Daniel. Israel was the earthly ethnicity that was filling that Heavenly Kingdom one soul at a time, except they had to wait in Abraham's bosom, before they could even enjoy Paradise.

The Cross opened Paradise for earthly Israel. Now post the Cross, the Gospel went to the Gentiles via Peter way before Paul even started his missionary trips. The Gospel, placed Israel at enmity with this NT church, but did not exclude Israel. The issue was over doctrine, not entrance into the Heavenly Kingdom. It was Israel who was cut off as natural branches, not the Gentiles. It was Israel that had to learn a whole different paradigm, not the church.

 

[tailgator]

Just to make sure I understand what you are presenting, you are saying that the beast at the end of the age will be ruling over the kingdom of heaven, is that correct?

Much love!

Think of it this way.Before the saints in the following verses are given the kingdom of heaven to reign with Christ in ,who governed the land in which they are killed?
Who would they not worship and who's mark would they not take?


Revelation 20
4 And I saw thrones, and they sat upon them, and judgment was given unto them: and I saw the souls of them that were beheaded for the witness of Jesus, and for the word of God, and which had not worshipped the beast, neither his image, neither had received his mark upon their foreheads, or in their hands; and they lived and reigned with Christ a thousand years.

5 But the rest of the dead lived not again until the thousand years were finished. This is the first resurrection.

6 Blessed and holy is he that hath part in the first resurrection: on such the second death hath no power, but they shall be priests of God and of Christ, and shall reign with him a thousand years.



The beast is reigning in that kingdom today.
But he has not started persecuting these saints yet.That begins when the second beast arrives.

 

[tailgator]

Jesus is returning to rescue Israel, and all Israel will believe in Jesus when He comes, and so all Israel will be saved. No matter what you think of Israel right now, or it's leadership or government, even so, this is true.

Zechariah 14, Matthew 24, Ezekiel 36, 39, many more make this very clear.

So to determine that Israel is the fourth beast conflicts with a number of clearly stated passages of what happens when Jesus comes. Jesus doesn't come to destroy Israel, He comes to save Israel.

Much love!

Jesus doesn't save the Israelis who choose the beast.They have a choice.

Before the land is given to Messiah to reign ,who governs the land and kills the saints?

Ezekiel 37
24 And David my servant shall be king over them; and they all shall have one shepherd: they shall also walk in my judgments, and observe my statutes, and do them.

25 And they shall dwell in the land that I have given unto Jacob my servant, wherein your fathers have dwelt; and they shall dwell therein, even they, and their children, and their children's children for ever: and my servant David shall be their prince for ever.



According to the word of God,Israel is God's first born son.If you believe the beast is the son of God ,then you have been decieved