Once Saved, Always Saved?

[Bible Highlighter]

Peter was not saved when he denied the Lord Jesus.

Yes. Peter temporarily lost his salvation by denying Jesus, but he was able to restore it through confessing these sins to the Lord.
Before Peter denied the Lord, he was saved. For he was called a sheep.

These twelve Jesus sent forth, and commanded them, saying .... go rather to the lost sheep of the house of Israel. ...Behold, I send you forth as sheep in the midst of wolves...” (Matthew 10:16).

And the sheep of Jesus that follow Him have been given eternal life.

My sheep hear my voice, and I know them, and they follow me: And I give unto them eternal life” (John 10:27-28).

 

[Bible Highlighter]

Many Born Again and Evangelical members believe that in order to be saved, the only thing which we should do is to accept Jesus Christ as Lord and personal Savior by faith. And once you accepted Him through faith, you have now an assured salvation in heaven. No need of good works or following the commandments of God, but through faith alone, we will be saved according to them.

Sorry to say this, but I think this kind of belief is not just unbiblical but shameful, careless and dirty in its entire content. Imagine a person who thinks he was already saved and destined to heaven no matter what he will do, whether he do evil or not. Remember what happened in LA Fitness Gym in Pennsylvania on August 4, 2009? When a man named George Sodini fired 50 rounds into an aerobic class before turning the gun on himself. The shooting resulted four deaths (including Sodini himself) and nine injured. George Sodini was a member of the Tetelestai Church where he sat quietly for many years, listening to the deceptions of his preacher. Talking about the pastor of his Church, Sodini wrote in his blog dated Dec. 31, 2008,

“this guy” (Alan “Rick” Knapp) “teaches (and convinced me) you can commit mass murder then still go to heaven. Ask him.“

And in a post dated August 3, 2009, Sodini said;

“Maybe soon, I will see God and Jesus. At least that is what I was told. Eternal life does NOT depend on works. If it did, we will all be in hell. Christ paid for every sin, so how can I or you be judged by GOD for a sin when the penalty was already paid. People judge but that does not matter. I was reading the Bible and The Integrity of God beginning yesterday, because soon I will see them.”

After the horrible incident in Pennsylvania, Pastor Knapp’s deacon, Jack Rickard commented on Sodini’s death and said,

“George is going to heaven, but he’s not going to get his rewards,” (SOURCE )​

Kenneth Nally, another believer of this unscrupulous doctrine, committed suicide in 1980 after he was taught that even self-murder would not stop a person once saved from going to heaven. Definitely! This kind of belief would reclaim many people to Satan, the author of all lies and abominations.

I also remembered a certain time when I tried to ask a Born Again pastor who preaches about the assured salvation. I asked him, “Pastor. If doing good works is unnecessary for salvation so that I decided to cease from giving my tithes, am I still saved?” The pastor answered and said, “Definitely not, son. If you will cease from giving your tithes and offerings, you will become a robber, because the Bible said, ‘ye rob God’.” See??? Born Again and many Baptist and Evangelical pastors who hold this kind of shameful doctrine are just after to our tithes! They don’t care about our salvation. They don’t care whether we will become evil or not, but what matters most is our money. They telling their members that in salvation, good works are unnecessary things, except the giving of tithes and donations!

Source:
O.S.A.S. – THE WATCHMAN'S CRY

 

[BloodBought 1953]

It would be comforting to believe I cannot loose my salvation even if I lost my faith and denied God.
But there is overwhelming evidence to the contrary, in believing such tomfoolery.

Is it “ tomfoolery” to believe a Promise Of God?

God said that “ Anybody that ASKS to be Saved WILL be Saved”..... I “Asked” a long, long time ago....the Onus is on God to now keep His promise...If There is anything additional that MUST be done to get and stay Saved , or if there is anything that must NOT be done to get and stay Saved, it is up to God to see that it comes to pass.....

If I ever “ deny God” and it’s a damnable offense, it is up to God to see that it never happens or if it “does” happen ,it will be up to Him to bring me out of Error and set me right before I die , or He can decide to cover that sin with His Grace....

I don't worry about this stuff....I Trust the Promise of God ( that being what Faith truly is) To “ Finish the Good Work That He started” .....I am in His Loving and Forgiving hands...all because I asked Him save me....God keeps His Word....

 

[Bible Highlighter]

Adding false accusations, are also on you. Woe, and woe.

It’s not my first rodeo discussing this topic. I am only giving you my honest assessment of what I believe is true. If you disagree, that’s of course your choice, but I have confidence in being able to stand before the Lord Jesus at the Judgment by what I said because it is backed by Scripture. You said things like… Paul is speaking hypothetically in a particular verse and yet, you gave no proof of this in Scripture. It was just your opinion. This is the kind of things I was dealing with when discussing the verses with you.

In any event, I think we should agree to disagree in love and respect.

Blessings be unto you in the Lord.

 

[Bible Highlighter]

Is it “ tomfoolery” to believe a Promise Of God?

God said that “ Anybody that ASKS to be Saved WILL be Saved”..... I “Asked” a long, long time ago....the Onus is on God to now keep His promise...If There is anything additional that MUST be done to get and stay Saved , or if there is anything that must NOT be done to get and stay Saved, it is up to God to see that it comes to pass.....

If I ever “ deny God” and it’s a damnable offense, it is up to God to see that it never happens or if it “does” happen ,it will be up to Him to bring me out of Error and set me right before I die , or He can decide to cover that sin with His Grace....

I don't worry about this stuff....I Trust the Promise of God ( that being what Faith truly is) To “ Finish the Good Work That He started” .....I am in His Loving and Forgiving hands...all because I asked Him save me....God keeps His Word....

Promises come with conditions.

For example: Most in your camp love to quote John 10:28, but they fail to look at the condition of that promise in verse 27 in that the kind of sheep that applies to this promise are the sheep that FOLLOW Jesus. Seeing, God is not putting a gun to your head or mind wiping you to be a certain way, logic dictates that you have to choose to follow Jesus. God is not going to force you to follow Him or remove your will to do that. So it’s a condition you have to meet if you want the promise of John 10:28. But I find most in the OSAS crowd tend to just skate around this one like they do many verses.

 

[BloodBought 1953]

I do believe in Jesus and His gospel. You believe in a "different" gospel of "water and works" salvation.

Why do you reject His words? (John 3:15,16,18; 5:24; 6:29,40,47; 11:25,26)

The word of faith was in my mouth and in my heart upon my conversion. You are preaching to the choir son. You turn everything into a work for salvation.

So instead of confessing that Jesus is Lord BY the Holy Spirit (1 Corinthians 12:3) you turn confession into a work for salvation AFTER we believe the gospel. Got it.

I'm not the one who turns believing the gospel into a 4 step check list of works salvation. I have done as Jesus commands to be saved and just not according to your biased church doctrine.

I confessed Jesus Christ as the Son of God upon my conversion and continue to confess Him. And? What's the problem?

Over the years I have confessed the good confession to many witnesses as well. So how many witnesses is enough in order to satisfy step 3 in your 4 step plan of salvation "confession is made unto salvation" - whoops! Still need to get water baptized afterwards in order to become saved, right? Notice how your 4 step plan of salvation that culminates in salvation by water baptism is in contradiction to Romans 10:8-10 and is also in contradiction to multiple passages of scripture that make it clear we are saved through belief/faith "apart from additions or modifications." (Luke 7:50; 8:12; John 1:12; 3:15,16,18; 5:24; 6:29,40,47; 11:25,26; 20:31; Acts 10:43; 11:17; 13:39; 15:8,9; 16:31; Romans 1:16; 3:24-28; 4:5-6; 5:1; Galatians 2:16; Ephesians 2:8,9; Philippians 3:9; 2 Timothy 3:15; 1 John 5:13 etc..).

Believe and be saved means that Christ saves us through believing in Him based on the merits of His finished work of redemption alone and not based on the merits of our works. Perverting the gospel and teaching salvation by works is not obedience. You clearly trust in your works for salvation and not in Jesus Christ alone.

Peter had a temporary weak moment when he denied Christ 3 times and Peter also had a temporary weak moment when he temporarily did not believe those who had seen Him after He had risen. That's not the same as saying that Peter no longer believed in Christ and permanently turned his back on Him. Peter went on to preach the gospel and continued in the faith.

Temporary, weak moment. In Matthew 16:15, Jesus Christ asked His disciples, “But who do you say that I am?” 16 Simon Peter answered and said, “You are the Christ, the Son of the living God.” 17 Jesus answered and said to him, “Blessed are you, Simon Bar-Jonah, for flesh and blood has not revealed this to you, but My Father who is in heaven.

Now Peter had no clue that Jesus Christ would be crucified and resurrected. He only believed that Jesus was the Messiah. This is obvious when, only moments later, Peter rebukes Jesus Christ for saying he will be killed, and be raised again the third day" (Matthew 16:21). In verse 22, "..Peter took him and began to rebuke him, saying, "Far be it from You, Lord; this shall not happen to You!"

Before his death, Jesus told the twelve that he had to die and that he would rise on the third day. However, it is unquestionable that the disciples were ignorant of its meaning. "Then he took unto him the twelve, and said unto them, Behold, we go up to Jerusalem,…And they shall scourge him, and put him to death: and the third day he shall rise again. And they understood none of these things: and this saying was hid from them, neither knew they the things which were spoken. – Luke 18:31-34.

After his crucifixion, instead of anxiously awaiting His resurrection, the apostles were still ignorant, disheartened at the death of their redeemer, and did not even at first believe the testimony of his resurrection (Mark 16:14, Luke 24:19-24) but that quickly changed.

It's one thing to not believe eye witnesses who claimed to have seen the Lord after His resurrection and it's yet another thing for Peter to go back and completely reject Jesus as the Christ, the Son of the living God. (Matthew 16:16; John 20:31) His faith in Jesus was not gone and his salvation was not in jeopardy. Since you teach salvation by works and mental assent belief in Jesus, I don't expect you to understand this.

Where do the scriptures say that Peter no longer believes Jesus is the Christ, the Son of the living God? Peter temporarily did not believe eye witnesses who saw Jesus. That's not the same as, "he who does not believe is condemned already.." (John 3:18) Peter still believed in Christ unto salvation and went on to boldly preach the gospel at Pentecost and beyond. Saving faith in Christ is not a revolving door.

All true, of course.....it might be the case that When Peter denied Jesus it was all a lie.....he still believed in his heart what he always believed since the day that Holy Spirit revealed to him that “ Jesus was the Christ” .....he still Believed it but he knew that at that time if he “ admitted” it, he could very well find “ himself” being beaten beyond recognition and hanging from a Cross...

Poor Peter catches a lot of flack for his denial of Jesus that day....and us? Why , of course “ WE” would NEVER do such a thing would we ? Lol.....yeah, right.......Try to put yourself in “ his” shoes.....we ain’t no better or Braver than him—- we are probably a lot worse...

Flawed Peter may have had a bout of Cowardness that day, but never forget that he once had the Faith to walk on water( albeit, not for long) .....have any of “ US” done that lately? We need to cut this guy a LOT of slack...

 

[Bible Highlighter]

If a person just tells a child that they are saved by believing in the finished work of the cross or in the blood of Jesus to be saved alone and it is nothing that they do and you never see them again, they could potentially grow up to think they can live an excessively sinful lifestyle while under God's grace by this kind of message.

So this is why Sanctification (holy living by the Spirit) plays a part in God's plan of salvation after we are saved by God's grace. In fact, this is what the Bible teaches (See: 2 Thessalonians 2:13-14, Romans 8:13, Hebrews 12:14).

If one don’t believe the plain verses of the Bible (like the ones above), then that is one’s choice.

 

[BloodBought 1953]

In regards to Hebrews 10:26, to "sin willfully" carries the idea of deliberate intention that is habitual, which stems from rejecting Christ deliberately. This is continuous action, a matter of practice. Now we don't walk along our daily life and "accidentally" fall into a pit called sin. We exercise our will but, the use of the participle clearly shows a ongoing, willful, continuous action. *The unrighteous practice sin (1 Corinthians 6:9-10; Galatians 5:19-21); not the righteous, who are born of God. (1 Corinthians 6:11; 1 John 3:9)

Yes.....these types are Gospel Rejectors their entire lives..... Akin to those that Jesus was referring to when he discussed the Fate of those that would “Deny” Him, or essentially Reject Him and the Gospel That Saves That He gave to Paul to reveal....

 

[Bible Highlighter]

Yes.....these types are Gospel Rejectors their entire lives..... Akin to those that Jesus was referring to when he discussed the Fate of those that would “Deny” Him, or essentially Reject Him and the Gospel That Saves That He gave to Paul to reveal....

In OSAS, there are different degrees of justifying sin. There is the Hyper Grace crowd. However, I really don’t see much difference between what the Hyper Grace camp believes vs. the other camp who holds to the lighter version of OSAS who say you cannot practice sin in order to be saved. For when I talk with those OSAS folk who say they do not practice sin (Which can be defined differently by each person), they justify sin by their false OSAS interpretation on 1 John 1:8, and Isaiah 64:6. They say that 1 John 1:8 is talking about how we cannot stop sinning this side of Heaven (But they will not practice sin). But Galatians 5:24 says they that are Christ’s have crucified the affections and lusts. So they are not in agreement with Galatians 5:24, 1 Peter 4:1-2, and 2 Corinthians 7:1. When I put forth verses about how we need to live holy as a part of salvation (like 2 Thessalonians 2:13, Romans 8:13, Hebrews 12:14), they will say that this is works salvation and they mindlessly quote Isaiah 64:6 (ripping the verse out of it’s context of verse 5). So yes. Both versions are justifying sin and evil. All versions of OSAS justify sin (Unless there is an OSAS Proponent who believes in Sinless Perfection - which I have not seen yet).

The issue is sin. When we sin we abide in spiritual death or unforgiveness UNITL we confess of our sins (with the intention we will forsake them and never do them again). 1 John 1:9 does not make any sense in OSAS. Many in OSAS say you are forgiven of future sin (Which means a person can sin and still be saved). But if your future sin is forgiven, then 1 John 1:9 does not make sense because it is telling us that we have to confess our sins to be forgiven of our sins. Some OSASers I have encountered will say this is dealing with Initial Salvation but this would be ripping this verse out of it’s context to do that because John continues to say to “sin not” in John 2:1 and if one does sin, they have an advocate named Jesus Christ that they can go to. Also, one does not have to confess of every single sin of their past life when they first come to the Lord Jesus for salvation, either. There would be too many to confess. So 1 John 1:9 is dealing with our Continued Salvation and not Initial Salvation.

 

[BloodBought 1953]

Promises come with conditions.

For example: Most in your camp love to quote John 10:28, but they fail to look at the condition of that promise in verse 27 in that the kind of sheep that applies to this promise are the sheep that FOLLOW Jesus. Seeing, God is not putting a gun to your head or mind wiping you to be a certain way, logic dictates that you have to choose to follow Jesus. God is not going to force you to follow Him or remove your will to do that. So it’s a condition you have to meet if you want the promise of John 10:28. But I find most in the OSAS crowd tend to just skate around this one like they do many verses.

As YOU “skate around” John 5:24—- the Nuclear Bomb That NONE of you Blind Guides will ever address....now is your chance....?I’ll get to your confused “ Doctrine” later.....

 

[Bible Highlighter]

As YOU “skate around” John 5:24—- the Nuclear Bomb That NONE of you Blind Guides will ever address....now is your chance....?I’ll get to your confused “ Doctrine” later.....

Actually John 5:24 is teaching how you need both God’s grace, and holy living as a part of salvation.

According to my current knowledge of God’s Word: God revealed to me that there are 3 verses that teach that we are saved by both God’s grace through faith, and Sanctification (Note: The red letters are in reference to Sanctification, and the letters in blue, are in reference to being saved by God’s grace through faith.).

Verse #1.

"...God has from the beginning chosen you to salvation through sanctification of the Spirit and belief of the truth" (2 Thessalonians 2:13).​

(Note: Verse 12, says that there are those who are damned who believed not the truth and had pleasure in unrighteousness. Verses 16-17 in 2 Thessalonians 2 mentions faith and works in context, as well). (Note 2: Verse 14 says that this sanctification of the Spirit is a call of the gospel. But I believe the “belief of the truth” can refer to doctrines we must hold to like believing the Trinity, but it can refer to believing the gospel message in 1 Corinthians 15:1-4 (as a part of being saved by God’s grace without works in our Initial Salvation; But we continue to believe in the gospel message in 1 Corinthians 15:1-4 our entire lives).

Verse #2.

"Verily, verily, I say unto you, He that hears my word, and believes on him that sent me, has everlasting life, and shall not come into condemnation; but is passed from death unto life." (John 5:24).​

(Note on John 5:24: The EXB Translation explains that the word "hear" is to: "obey."; Meaning, we have to believe in Jesus and obey Him to not perish. Acts of the Apostles 3:23 confirms this. It says that if anyone does not hear that prophet (JESUS), they shall be destroyed).

Verse #3.

"You see then how that by works a man is justified, and not by faith only."
(James 2:24).​

(Note: Most Christians believe that the phrase "justified by faith" is dealing with salvation (Romans 3:28); If this is what they believe, they must then also be consistent with the use of this word “justified,” and they should use this one word in the same way in relation to works as James says in James 2:24.).

 

[Ferris Bueller]

Here is a testimony of a woman named Catherine involving OSAS:

Hypocritical Christianity
Was All I Knew
Catherine​

I grew up in an once saved always saved (OSAS) home. Lukewarm, worldly, hypocritical Christianity was all I knew. When I wanted more of "real Christianity," my Mom called me "legalistic" and other not so nice names. I found it impossible to have deep, spiritual conversations with her. When I pointed out to my Dad that my brother was living in drunkenness and fornication (pornography) like the world, my Dad said that I "didn't understand true grace" like my brother. (Almost a decade later, my brother finally became saved and acknowledged-- to my parents' surprise-- that he wasn't saved like they thought as a kid.)

At age __, right after I was determined to "live for God" as His disciple, a fellow "missionary" and "Christian" brother date raped me. I didn't know what to do. (I always wanted to be with only one man my entire life), so I gave into his request for more sex the next three days, making me a fornicator. (I thought that I had to "submit" to him, since he was now "my headcovering". I hated the sex, but didn't think I was allowed to say "no" as a "loving" wife would always do what her husband wants"--according to all those Christian self-help books.) When I came to my senses and realized what had really happened-- I had been deceived like Eve-- I began two years of crying non-stop. Literally. It became like a full-time job.

In between crying bouts, I began to ask God "Why?" and "What was going on?" I was very, very confused. When I challenged this man over our sin, his response was "There are no consequences. Grace covers it." At first, I believed him. Why would he lie to me? He was a Christian, in love with God, right?... However, over time, it became apparent that he was a liar, a swindler, and a "murderer" in his heart.

As I pressed further, it became apparent that we believed in two different gospels. Though he called Jesus his "Lord," it was obviously lip service. He was still living for himself. He told me that I was going to hell for believing a works gospel. He also told me that he would "trample all over me," if he could, especially if he married me. Knowing I only wanted to be with one person my entire life did not deter him from taking my virginity and then trying to boot me away from him when I was no longer willing to have sex anymore with him. I remembered the verses in Scripture about "trampling on Jesus' blood" and wondered if he treated Jesus' body (me, a fellow believer) this way, could he be saved?

I got into the Bible and started looking for answers. I was very scared that maybe I was not going to inherit the kingdom because I was a fornicator. I read many opinions. I was very confused. Things did not make sense. Most "teachers" with PhDs from seminary contradicted themselves. During this time, at one Sunday School class, the teacher made us very confused about salvation. At the end, he shrugged his shoulders and said, "Now that I have thoroughly confused you, you are dismissed!" (Yes, his exact words!) I was indignant, but no one seemed to notice how strange it was that man with a PhD didn't know what the Bible said about salvation. That made me realize that something wasn't right with this version of Christianity, even though my parents told me my entire life that we were "right" and everyone else was "wrong."

I taught myself Greek as I read the New Testament interlinear Bible, and also I learned Hebrew from friends. (God had told me not to go to seminary when I had graduated from college, though I didn't understand why at the time.) God slowly but surely brought the puzzle pieces together. I understand now how these "false gospels" came about, and what the true gospel is.

And I am living it out. No more depression or suicidal thoughts. My heart is pure. I don't crave things of the flesh or things of the world-- not only is sin not an issue, but selfishness has also been defeated. It's all about God.

After considering the implications of different "frameworks" for reading the Bible, I am convinced OSAS is a doctrine of demons. I have read The Believer’s Conditional Security, and agree with it. The Bible does not make sense any other way. I have looked at different interpretations, and all of them fall short except conditional security. The framework we believe will influence how we live and what we do. That's why it's important to have the proper framework. In the past, when I believed in OSAS, I would skip over any verses in the Bible that didn't make sense to me. I understand God better-- His unchanging character, His personality, His values, His love. Things make sense now. No more confusion!

How I wish that I knew this as a kid. It would have saved me much heartache and pain! I could have spent 20 plus years living for God, not wasted on selfish pursuits. How much time I lost! I regret it! Moreover, the sins I sowed have reaped mental illness, heartache, and pain which I could have spared myself if someone had shown me the power in the Cross for overcoming sin, self, and Satan. I am still healing, and perhaps may not be completely healed until I die-- how I long for that day to come!

@BloodBought 1953 , looking forward to your commentary on this testimony.

 

[BloodBought 1953]

Now if a person just tells a child that they are saved by believing in the finished work of the cross or in the blood of Jesus to be saved alone and it is nothing that they do and you never see them again, they could potentially grow up to think they can live an excessively sinful lifestyle while under God's grace by this kind of message.



Poor, poor unknowing God .....I guess He got caught “off - guard” in the possibility that somebody might actually take His Amazing Grace and use it as a “ License to Sin”....

I’m sure God is in favor of “ lying” to our Children ....I’m sure He desires our Children to see Him as that “ mean old man in the sky” who longs to send us to Hell every time we “ stumble” .....after all, Jesus came to “ condemn the World” and NOT save it, right? Baloney.


You are not telling the entire story....people “ ARE” free to live lives of exceeding sinfulness....the question is, can they do this and “ get away” with it. Children need to be told the entire Truth....Salvation * IS*obtained by putting your entire Faith and Trust in Nothing But The Blood—— it’s by putting your Faith in “ HIS” Performance —— NOT yours!

I’m squarely with Charles Stanley on this matter....wanna go out and take advantage Of a Free Gift that cost God His Son and cost His Son His life ? Go ahead! Have at it! See what happens, Fool......If you simply Believe the Good News Of The Gospel , you’ll make it to Heaven alright.....But your life will be cursed, full of God’s Chastisement without any blessings and come Judgement Day you are going to be scared to death, “ shrinking back” , ashamed of yourself and if you look at your rear -end you will be seeing whip- marks galore.... if that is what you want, give it a whirl .....see what happens if you think you can Mock God and His Grace.....

Only a Fool would not fear God , and children need to be taught that God Willful punish their sins.... but Love is what God is looking for.....as I keep saying , Love for God is the Engine that drives Obedience ....that us why the #1 Commandment is to Love God with all of your heart, mind and soul....anything that “ counts” in this life that please God must stem from our Love for Bim

In His Earthly appearance, there were times that the disciples simply could NOT keep the children from crawling all over Jesus...... and Jesus loved it and heartily approved of it, saying that such was the Kingdom Of Heaven.....Do you think these kids couldn’t resist Jesus because he was always scolding them and wagging his finger at them? Or maybe they could not resist the Love That they saw in Jesus and wanted to be near it....I go with the latter....maybe Love begets Love....understanding THAT is what we must know....it's what our Children need to know....what kind of world are you talking about that is based on a lie? Never be afraid of the Truth—- especially GOD’S TRUTH —- He knows What He is Doing...He knew the risks of Grace when he invented it....it turns out to be the thing that saved Anybody that ever got saved—- don’t try to hide it...

 

[BloodBought 1953]

@BloodBought 1953 , looking forward to your commentary on this testimony.

Lol—- I just BET you are!

It’s getting late and after a typical
day of the wanton Sinning that I live for ,quite frankly I am just worn out! I just kinda glanced at the Post and I will comment on it later....However, I can immediately see one Glaring mistake! It seems to be concerned with “ Hyper Grace”——- close, but no cigar —— it’s “SUPER” HYPER Grace that I subscribe to.....we need to know where we are starting from....you remember how God said that wherever Sin abounded, Grace abounded that much MORE? Boy, I bet God wishes that He could take “ THAT” one back! “ Mama Mia!” , God Must be saying, “ What was I THINKING ?” And as a “ Topper ” to that, God even said That If we Sin , what are
we supposed to do about it? Not just” go “ to His Throne Of Grace .....we are to go BOLDLY to that Throne of Grace......I go quite often to that Throne .....God hates it when I sin, but He loves it when I take-His remedy for it.....and the “ bolder” the better—— that Boldness is in direct proportion to my Faith in His Shed Blood....

 

[Ferris Bueller]

Actually John 5:24 is teaching how you need both God’s grace, and holy living as a part of salvation.

According to my current knowledge of God’s Word: God revealed to me that there are 3 verses that teach that we are saved by both God’s grace through faith, and Sanctification (Note: The red letters are in reference to Sanctification, and the letters in blue, are in reference to being saved by God’s grace through faith.).

Verse #1.

"...God has from the beginning chosen you to salvation through sanctification of the Spirit and belief of the truth" (2 Thessalonians 2:13).

This will instantly be understood as you claiming that works earn salvation. So you'll have to explain how it does not mean that.

 

[BloodBought 1953]

Promises come with conditions.



True.....one has to BELIVE them....it’s what is known as “Faith”

 

[Ferris Bueller]

Verse #3.

"You see then how that by works a man is justified, and not by faith only."
(James 2:24).
(Note: Most Christians believe that the phrase "justified by faith" is dealing with salvation (Romans 3:28); If this is what they believe, they must then also be consistent with the use of this word “justified,” and they should use this one word in the same way in relation to works as James says in James 2:24.).

This is probably the crux of the whole problem. You can not separate Paul's justification from James' justification. But that is exactly what many in the church have done. You can't be justified according to how Paul talks about justification without also being justified according to how James talks about it. We have separated the two. The Bible does not.

 

[BloodBought 1953]

you have to choose to follow Jesus



So true! We are told by Jesus to “ Follow Paul”..... do you obey the latest command of Jesus? Not likely...you fail to “ Rightly Divide” God's Word...

 

[Ferris Bueller]

Promises come with conditions.



True.....one has to BELIVE them....it’s what is known as “Faith”

But does one believe the promise if they hear the promise and then just continue on their merry way in their sin? No. Their actions show they only heard the promise, not believed and received it.

 

[Ferris Bueller]

As YOU “skate around” John 5:24—- the Nuclear Bomb That NONE of you Blind Guides will ever address....now is your chance....?I’ll get to your confused “ Doctrine” later.....

Does carelessly living in your sin in the name of grace describe the one who hears and believes in John 5:24?

24“Very truly I tell you, whoever hears my word and believes him who sent me has eternal life and will not be judged but has crossed over from death to life." John 5:24​

No. The Bible itself says, no, it does not:

"9No one who is born of God will continue to sin, because God’s seed remains in them; they cannot go on sinning, because they have been born of God." 1 John 3:9
​

The promise of God in salvation is for the person who "hears my word and believes", not for the person who is still living in his sin in unbelief thinking he's living in the grace of God in salvation.