No mortals will survive the second coming of Christ
- Thread starter Spiritual Israelite
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Ok, thanks for sharing your view on this. I actually agree with many of the things you’ve mentioned but I apply them to first century events vs your view of them taking place in the future.
tailgator
Well-Known Member
I already have.
The beast and the ten horns in revelation 19 are in Christs kingdom.That beast and those ten horns are destroyed when the kingdom is given to Christ.Then the saints reign with Christ for 1000 years years after which the mortals outside of Christs kingdom surround the saints and then those mortals are destroyed .
The fact that the nations outside of Christs kingdom can be destroyed by fire coming down from heaven from God is proof they are mortals.
The only people claiming Gog and all his horde are immortals are people who reject the word of God.
The Kingdom of God, through the Words of Christ:
Luke 17:20-21 (KJV) And when he was demanded of the Pharisees, when the kingdom of God should come, he answered them and said, The kingdom of God cometh not with observation: Neither shall they say, Lo here! or, lo there! for, behold, the kingdom of God is within you.
According to Christ the Kingdom of God being within you cannot be visibly seen. Christ says in another passage:
John 3:3 (KJV) Jesus answered and said unto him, Verily, verily, I say unto thee, Except a man be born again, he cannot see the kingdom of God.
John 3:5-7 (KJV) Jesus answered, Verily, verily, I say unto thee, Except a man be born of water and of the Spirit, he cannot enter into the kingdom of God. That which is born of the flesh is flesh; and that which is born of the Spirit is spirit. Marvel not that I said unto thee, Ye must be born again.
The only way man can see the Kingdom of God and enter the Kingdom of God is through Christ's Spirit in you, "Ye must be born again." Since the Kingdom of God is within you, the way we both see and enter the Kingdom of God is to be born again through the Spirit sent from Christ, the Kingdom of God is not NOW a physical Kingdom on this earth, destined to destruction, it is therefore the spiritual Kingdom of God.
Paul helps us to understand how we become the body of Christ through the Spirit that dwells IN you. And if the same Spirit that raised up Jesus from the dead dwells IN you, He shall also quicken your mortal body by His Spirit.
Romans 8:9-11 (KJV) But ye are not in the flesh, but in the Spirit, if so be that the Spirit of God dwell in you. Now if any man have not the Spirit of Christ, he is none of his. And if Christ be in you, the body is dead because of sin; but the Spirit is life because of righteousness. But if the Spirit of him that raised up Jesus from the dead dwell in you, he that raised up Christ from the dead shall also quicken your mortal bodies by his Spirit that dwelleth in you.
The church is the outward manifestation of the spiritual Kingdom of God within you, the body of Christ through Christ's Spirit. The church, the body of Christ, His bride being prepared for the marriage supper of the Lamb, when we will be arrayed in fine linen, clean and white.
Revelation 19:7-9 (KJV) Let us be glad and rejoice, and give honour to him: for the marriage of the Lamb is come, and his wife hath made herself ready. And to her was granted that she should be arrayed in fine linen, clean and white: for the fine linen is the righteousness of saints. And he saith unto me, Write, Blessed are they which are called unto the marriage supper of the Lamb. And he saith unto me, These are the true sayings of God.
Where is the bride of Christ after this heaven and earth have passed away? Residing, as justified spirits, (spiritually the body of Christ) not flesh, in the holy city, new Jerusalem that is now in heaven but shall come down with Christ prepared as a bride adorned for her husband.
Hebrews 12:22-23 (KJV) But ye are come unto mount Sion, and unto the city of the living God, the heavenly Jerusalem, and to an innumerable company of angels, To the general assembly and church of the firstborn, which are written in heaven, and to God the Judge of all, and to the spirits of just men made perfect,
Revelation 21:1-5 (KJV) And I saw a new heaven and a new earth: for the first heaven and the first earth were passed away; and there was no more sea. And I John saw the holy city, new Jerusalem, coming down from God out of heaven, prepared as a bride adorned for her husband. And I heard a great voice out of heaven saying, Behold, the tabernacle of God is with men, and he will dwell with them, and they shall be his people, and God himself shall be with them, and be their God. And God shall wipe away all tears from their eyes; and there shall be no more death, neither sorrow, nor crying, neither shall there be any more pain: for the former things are passed away. And he that sat upon the throne said, Behold, I make all things new. And he said unto me, Write: for these words are true and faithful.
Where in the Kingdom of God that cannot NOW, in this world be seen or entered through flesh & blood be found after the first earth has passed away?
Where is Christ's Kingdom found if not in the world? Where will the angels be sent to gather out of His Kingdom all who do not belong there? I agree that the angels shall gather 'out' those who do not belong in His Kingdom to be cast into the furnace of fire, but gathered out from where? Where is the Kingdom of God found and entered now in this age?
tailgator
Well-Known Member
The kingdom of this world is not given to Christ till the ,7th Trump.
Revelation 11
15 The seventh angel sounded his trumpet, and there were loud voices in heaven, which said:
“The kingdom of the world has become
the kingdom of our Lord and of his Messiah,
and he will reign for ever and ever.”
The 7th Trump did not sound when you was born again nor did Christ recieved the kingdom of this world at that time.
When you say something like that are you basically meaning something like this?
The thousand years are applying to this age and at the beginning of the thousand years the NHNE become accessible, but spiritually speaking, not literally speaking. Then at the end of the GWTJ the NHNE is then completed. IOW, making the NHNE a process involving time to get from point A to point B, point B meaning it's completed state rather than that happening in a split second, where the previous second it was not the NHNE, but the very next second it is. I guess 'instantaneous' would be the word I'm looking for here.
And if so, on the surface I can see that making sense if you are meaning something along those lines. Yet, I don't see how it could fit Zechariah 14, for instance. Because in my mind Zechariah 14:16-19 can't come to pass until all nations have come against Jerusalem and then Zechariah 14:12 is applied to them. No way has Zechariah 14:12 already been fulfilled. There is not one single event during the past 2000 years that could possibly explain verse 12.
If Zechariah 14:16-19 can't be fulfilled until verse 12 is fulfilled first, but that Amil is the correct view, this would mean verses 16-19 fit after the time of the GWTJ rather than prior to it. Which then creates another problem since there would be no time period preventing verses 16-19 from continuing forever. Therefore, we have to apply verses 16-19 to all of eternity.
As if it makes sense, that if only the saved remain after the GWTJ and they are all in immortal bodies, that there is this threat hanging over everyone's head throughout eternity, that if you refuse to come up, you will be punished. Obviously then, what is recorded in Zechariah 14:16-19 can't fit after the GWTJ has been completed. Nor can it fit before Christ returns if it can't even fit until verse 12 is fulfilled first. And if it fits after Christ returns, it certainly can't fit 24 hours or less since it would be impossible to fit--must come up year to year--in a single day. Therefore, a thousand years post the 2nd coming would be the only thing that could explain it per this scenario.
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Mortals, or unsaved human beings are invading the Kingdom of God now in this age of time when they join in membership with human beings who have been born again and have eternal life through Christ's Spirit in them. IOW both goats and sheep outwardly in membership together. It is AFTER the thousand years expires that they shall gather together against the Kingdom of God as She exists on this earth, and then they will ALL be consumed by the fire of God's wrath that shall come down from God out of heaven.
tailgator
Well-Known Member
The kingdom of heaven was promised to Abraham and his seed long long ago for an everlasting possession.That is where the kingdom of heaven is.The promised land.
It is where the resurrected saints dwell when the mortal nations come against them in revelation 20.
Genesis 17:8
And I will give unto thee, and to thy seed after thee, the land wherein thou art a stranger, all the land of Canaan, for an everlasting possession; and I will be their God.
God's promise to Abraham has never changed.Abraham shall dwell in the land God promised him.That is where he is in this verse.
Mathew 8:11
I say to you that many will come from the east and the west, and will take their places at the feast with Abraham, Isaac and Jacob in the kingdom of heaven.
As for Abraham seed ,to whom that land is promised forever.
Galatians 3:16
The promises were spoken to Abraham and to his seed. Scripture does not say “and to seeds,” meaning many people, but “and to your seed,” meaning one person, who is Christ.
As of today,Abraham and his seed has not yet inherited the land promised to Abrahams seed.That land is presently at this time governed by a beast who will soon persecute and kill the saints in that kingdom.
You didn't answer the question. I didn't ask when the kingdoms (plural not one as you change the verse) of this world would become the kingdoms of Christ. I asked: "Where is the Kingdom of God that cannot NOW, in this world be seen or entered through flesh & blood be found after the first earth has passed away?"
Show a single verse that says the physical promised land of Caanan given to the seeds of Abraham is the Kingdom of heaven???
tailgator
Well-Known Member
The resurrection has not even taken place yet.
These saints in revelation 20 have not put on immortality yet.
They become immortal when they are resurected.They do not suffer a second death.
Revelation 20
6 Blessed and holy is he that hath part in the first resurrection: on such the second death hath no power, but they shall be priests of God and of Christ, and shall reign with him a thousand years.
But the nations who surround these resurected saints are mortal.They can still suffer death.They can be burnt to a crisp.
Revelation 20
8 And shall go out to deceive the nations which are in the four quarters of the earth, Gog, and Magog, to gather them together to battle: the number of whom is as the sand of the sea.
9 And they went up on the breadth of the earth, and compassed the camp of the saints about, and the beloved city: and fire came down from God out of heaven, and devoured them.
You're not reading the same Bible that I am if you think that ALL the promises God gave to Abraham's seeds (many) have not already been fulfilled when they took possession of the Promised Land in the days of Joshua. The promise to Abraham regarding his SEED (Christ) has been and is being fulfilled as believers inherit the eternal promise for everlasting life as they are being saved during this age of time symbolized a/the thousand years.
You have never used Revelation 3:8 to support that God hates Jews like that, that they are all going to hell since they are synagogue of satan? To be fair then to you, provide your interpretation of that verse so it is clearly on record for all to see. Meaning that maybe I was misunderstanding you initially. One way to get that ironed out is to go on record here and give your interpretation of that verse. And if I see that your interpretation is reasonable and that it can fit what Isaiah 60:14 records, I will then apologize for misunderstanding what you were meaning at the time. What I seem to recall is that when unbelieving Jews were brought up, that some of you were using Revelation 3:8 to support what you were arguing, except you weren't using all of that verse to support it. Therefore, if it was simply a misunderstanding on my part, it doesn't make it an intentional lie on my part. It just means I unfortunately misunderstood you is all.
You know not what you speak of! If no resurrection has yet taken place, what would you call Jesus being raised from the dead? If there is no resurrection yet taken place, why does Christ say, "I am the resurrection and the life"? Christ is the "first resurrection" and when we have part in Him, we have part in resurrection life through His Spirit in us. We don't have to wait to be physically resurrected from the grave to overcome the second death. We overcome the second death by having part in the resurrection life of Christ.
tailgator
Well-Known Member
Stop lying
You are falsely accusing me of doing something I'm not .I am copy and pasting verses as they are written.The singular translation is correct as I know and understand what kingdom .is being spoken of.
Kingdom -26 translations
Kingdoms-5 traslations
New International Version
The seventh angel sounded his trumpet, and there were loud voices in heaven, which said: “The kingdom of the world has become the kingdom of our Lord and of his Messiah, and he will reign for ever and ever.”
New Living Translation
Then the seventh angel blew his trumpet, and there were loud voices shouting in heaven: “The world has now become the Kingdom of our Lord and of his Christ, and he will reign forever and ever.”
English Standard Version
Then the seventh angel blew his trumpet, and there were loud voices in heaven, saying, “The kingdom of the world has become the kingdom of our Lord and of his Christ, and he shall reign forever and ever.”
Berean Standard Bible
Then the seventh angel sounded his trumpet, and loud voices called out in heaven: “The kingdom of the world has become the kingdom of our Lord and of His Christ, and He will reign forever and ever.”
Berean Literal Bible
And the seventh angel sounded his trumpet, and there were great voices in heaven, saying: "The kingdom of the world has become that of our Lord and of His Christ, and He will reign to the ages of the ages."
King James Bible
And the seventh angel sounded; and there were great voices in heaven, saying, The kingdoms of this world are become the kingdoms of our Lord, and of his Christ; and he shall reign for ever and ever.
New King James Version
Then the seventh angel sounded: And there were loud voices in heaven, saying, “The kingdoms of this world have become the kingdoms of our Lord and of His Christ, and He shall reign forever and ever!”
New American Standard Bible
Then the seventh angel sounded; and there were loud voices in heaven, saying, “The kingdom of the world has become the kingdom of our Lord and of His Christ; and He will reign forever and ever.”
NASB 1995
Then the seventh angel sounded; and there were loud voices in heaven, saying, “The kingdom of the world has become the kingdom of our Lord and of His Christ; and He will reign forever and ever.”
NASB 1977
And the seventh angel sounded; and there arose loud voices in heaven, saying, “The kingdom of the world has become the kingdom of our Lord, and of His Christ; and He will reign forever and ever.”
Legacy Standard Bible
Then the seventh angel sounded, and there were loud voices in heaven, saying, “The kingdom of the world has become the kingdom of our Lord and of His Christ, and He will reign forever and ever.”
Amplified Bible
Then the seventh angel sounded [his trumpet]; and there were loud voices in heaven, saying, “The kingdom (dominion, rule) of the world has become the kingdom of our Lord and of His Christ; and He will reign forever and ever.”
tailgator
Well-Known Member
Christian Standard Bible
The seventh angel blew his trumpet, and there were loud voices in heaven saying, The kingdom of the world has become the kingdom of our Lord and of his Christ, and he will reign forever and ever.
Holman Christian Standard Bible
The seventh angel blew his trumpet, and there were loud voices in heaven saying: The kingdom of the world has become the kingdom of our Lord and of His Messiah, and He will reign forever and ever!
American Standard Version
And the seventh angel sounded; and there followed great voices in heaven, and they said, The kingdom of the world is become the kingdom of our Lord, and of his Christ: and he shall reign for ever and ever.
Aramaic Bible in Plain English
And the seventh Angel sounded, and there were great voices in Heaven that said, “The Kingdom of the world has become our God's and his Messiah's, and he shall reign to the eternity of eternities.”
Contemporary English Version
At the sound of the seventh trumpet, loud voices were heard in heaven. They said, "Now the kingdom of this world belongs to our Lord and to his Chosen One! And he will rule forever and ever!"
Douay-Rheims Bible
And the seventh angel sounded the trumpet: and there were great voices in heaven, saying: The kingdom of this world is become our Lord's and his Christ's, and he shall reign for ever and ever. Amen.
English Revised Version
And the seventh angel sounded; and there followed great voices in heaven, and they said, The kingdom of the world is become the kingdom of our Lord, and of his Christ: and he shall reign for ever and ever.
GOD'S WORD® Translation
When the seventh angel blew his trumpet, there were loud voices in heaven, saying, "The kingdom of the world has become the kingdom of our Lord and of his Messiah, and he will rule as king forever and ever."
Good News Translation
Then the seventh angel blew his trumpet, and there were loud voices in heaven, saying, "The power to rule over the world belongs now to our Lord and his Messiah, and he will rule forever and ever!"
International Standard Version
When the seventh angel blew his trumpet, there were loud voices in heaven, saying, "The world's kingdom has become the kingdom of our Lord and of his Messiah, and he will rule forever and ever."
Literal Standard Version
And the seventh messenger sounded the trumpet, and there came great voices in Heaven, saying, “The kingdoms of the world became [those] of our Lord and of His Christ, and He will reign through the ages of the ages!”
Majority Standard Bible
Then the seventh angel sounded his trumpet, and loud voices called out in heaven: “The kingdom of the world has become the kingdom of our Lord and of His Christ, and He will reign forever and ever.”
New American Bible
Then the seventh angel blew his trumpet. There were loud voices in heaven, saying, “The kingdom of the world now belongs to our Lord and to his Anointed, and he will reign forever and ever.”
NET Bible
Then the seventh angel blew his trumpet, and there were loud voices in heaven saying: "The kingdom of the world has become the kingdom of our Lord and of his Christ, and he will reign for ever and ever."
New Revised Standard Version
Then the seventh angel blew his trumpet, and there were loud voices in heaven, saying, “The kingdom of the world has become the kingdom of our Lord and of his Messiah, and he will reign forever and ever.”
New Heart English Bible
The seventh angel sounded, and great voices in heaven followed, saying, "The kingdom of the world now belongs to our Lord and to his Christ, and he will reign forever and ever."
Webster's Bible Translation
And the seventh angel sounded; and there were great voices in heaven, saying, The kingdoms of this world are become the kingdoms of our Lord, and of his Christ; and he will reign for ever and ever.
Weymouth New Testament
The seventh angel blew his trumpet; and there followed loud voices in Heaven which said, "The sovereignty of the world now belongs to our Lord and His Christ; and He will be King until the Ages of the Ages."
World English Bible
The seventh angel sounded, and great voices in heaven followed, saying, “The kingdom of the world has become the Kingdom of our Lord and of his Christ. He will reign forever and ever!”
Weymouth New Testament
The seventh angel blew his trumpet; and there followed loud voices in Heaven which said, "The sovereignty of the world now belongs to our Lord and His Christ; and He will be King until the Ages of the Ages."
World English Bible
The seventh angel sounded, and great voices in heaven followed, saying, “The kingdom of the world has become the Kingdom of our Lord and of his Christ. He will reign forever and ever!”
Young's Literal Translation
And the seventh messenger did sound, and there came great voices in the heaven, saying, 'The kingdoms of the world did become those of our Lord and of His Christ, and he shall reign to the ages of the ages!'
The seventh angel blew his trumpet, and there were loud voices in heaven saying, The kingdom of the world has become the kingdom of our Lord and of his Christ, and he will reign forever and ever.
Holman Christian Standard Bible
The seventh angel blew his trumpet, and there were loud voices in heaven saying: The kingdom of the world has become the kingdom of our Lord and of His Messiah, and He will reign forever and ever!
American Standard Version
And the seventh angel sounded; and there followed great voices in heaven, and they said, The kingdom of the world is become the kingdom of our Lord, and of his Christ: and he shall reign for ever and ever.
Aramaic Bible in Plain English
And the seventh Angel sounded, and there were great voices in Heaven that said, “The Kingdom of the world has become our God's and his Messiah's, and he shall reign to the eternity of eternities.”
Contemporary English Version
At the sound of the seventh trumpet, loud voices were heard in heaven. They said, "Now the kingdom of this world belongs to our Lord and to his Chosen One! And he will rule forever and ever!"
Douay-Rheims Bible
And the seventh angel sounded the trumpet: and there were great voices in heaven, saying: The kingdom of this world is become our Lord's and his Christ's, and he shall reign for ever and ever. Amen.
English Revised Version
And the seventh angel sounded; and there followed great voices in heaven, and they said, The kingdom of the world is become the kingdom of our Lord, and of his Christ: and he shall reign for ever and ever.
GOD'S WORD® Translation
When the seventh angel blew his trumpet, there were loud voices in heaven, saying, "The kingdom of the world has become the kingdom of our Lord and of his Messiah, and he will rule as king forever and ever."
Good News Translation
Then the seventh angel blew his trumpet, and there were loud voices in heaven, saying, "The power to rule over the world belongs now to our Lord and his Messiah, and he will rule forever and ever!"
International Standard Version
When the seventh angel blew his trumpet, there were loud voices in heaven, saying, "The world's kingdom has become the kingdom of our Lord and of his Messiah, and he will rule forever and ever."
Literal Standard Version
And the seventh messenger sounded the trumpet, and there came great voices in Heaven, saying, “The kingdoms of the world became [those] of our Lord and of His Christ, and He will reign through the ages of the ages!”
Majority Standard Bible
Then the seventh angel sounded his trumpet, and loud voices called out in heaven: “The kingdom of the world has become the kingdom of our Lord and of His Christ, and He will reign forever and ever.”
New American Bible
Then the seventh angel blew his trumpet. There were loud voices in heaven, saying, “The kingdom of the world now belongs to our Lord and to his Anointed, and he will reign forever and ever.”
NET Bible
Then the seventh angel blew his trumpet, and there were loud voices in heaven saying: "The kingdom of the world has become the kingdom of our Lord and of his Christ, and he will reign for ever and ever."
New Revised Standard Version
Then the seventh angel blew his trumpet, and there were loud voices in heaven, saying, “The kingdom of the world has become the kingdom of our Lord and of his Messiah, and he will reign forever and ever.”
New Heart English Bible
The seventh angel sounded, and great voices in heaven followed, saying, "The kingdom of the world now belongs to our Lord and to his Christ, and he will reign forever and ever."
Webster's Bible Translation
And the seventh angel sounded; and there were great voices in heaven, saying, The kingdoms of this world are become the kingdoms of our Lord, and of his Christ; and he will reign for ever and ever.
Weymouth New Testament
The seventh angel blew his trumpet; and there followed loud voices in Heaven which said, "The sovereignty of the world now belongs to our Lord and His Christ; and He will be King until the Ages of the Ages."
World English Bible
The seventh angel sounded, and great voices in heaven followed, saying, “The kingdom of the world has become the Kingdom of our Lord and of his Christ. He will reign forever and ever!”
Weymouth New Testament
The seventh angel blew his trumpet; and there followed loud voices in Heaven which said, "The sovereignty of the world now belongs to our Lord and His Christ; and He will be King until the Ages of the Ages."
World English Bible
The seventh angel sounded, and great voices in heaven followed, saying, “The kingdom of the world has become the Kingdom of our Lord and of his Christ. He will reign forever and ever!”
Young's Literal Translation
And the seventh messenger did sound, and there came great voices in the heaven, saying, 'The kingdoms of the world did become those of our Lord and of His Christ, and he shall reign to the ages of the ages!'
tailgator
Well-Known Member
I said these saints who do not worship the beast or it's image or recieve it's mark have not been resurected yet.
Can you not tell the difference between Jesus and these saints,?
Revelation 20
6 Blessed and holy is he that hath part in the first resurrection: on such the second death hath no power, but they shall be priests of God and of Christ, and shall reign with him a thousand years.
7 And when the thousand years are expired, Satan shall be loosed out of his prison,
8 And shall go out to deceive the nations which are in the four quarters of the earth, Gog, and Magog, to gather them together to battle: the number of whom is as the sand of the sea.
9 And they went up on the breadth of the earth, and compassed the camp of the saints about, and the beloved city: and fire came down from God out of heaven, and devoured them.
tailgator
Well-Known Member
This is speaking of saints who have been killed and are resurected.
You have not been beheaded for preaching the gospel.
6 Blessed and holy is he that hath part in the first resurrection: on such the second death hath no power, but they shall be priests of God and of Christ, and shall reign with him a thousand years.
7 And when the thousand years are expired, Satan shall be loosed out of his prison,
8 And shall go out to deceive the nations which are in the four quarters of the earth, Gog, and Magog, to gather them together to battle: the number of whom is as the sand of the sea.
9 And they went up on the breadth of the earth, and compassed the camp of the saints about, and the beloved city: and fire came down from God out of heaven, and devoured them.
tailgator
Well-Known Member
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