CALVINISM IS SIMPLY THE GOSPEL BELIEVED

[RedFan]

lol.. How can the Holy Spirit be everywhere?

Ask David. He authored Psalm 139:7, not me.

 

[Eternally Grateful]

I see no arrogance. I reject your "prayers" because they are insulting "prayers." It's like my saying I'm praying for you to see "the truth," as I see it.

You just proved your arrogance. You reject my prayers. You above me, so you do not need my prayers.

lol. What a joke. Sorry man, But your pride is DEEP

Funny you can't deal with 1 John 2? I quoted it for you. It says just what I've been saying, that if you choose to accept Christ you simultaneously choose to live in Christ. And you would deny that?

I dealt with it. But you can not see it. Because your blinded by your religion.

Go ahead and trust your pope.. I wash my hands

If you don't belong to a church,

Who said I did not belong to a church, now you an accuser.

Typical of those who are stuck in religion they have to look for little things then spew them as if they are true.

you're likely more of a renegade Christian who is all about yourself. You learn how to get along with Christians by being among them, and not by considering them "beneath you."

Luke 18.13 “But the tax collector stood at a distance. He would not even look up to heaven, but beat his breast and said, ‘God, have mercy on me, a sinner.’
14 “I tell you that this man, rather than the other, went home justified before God. For all those who exalt themselves will be humbled, and those who humble themselves will be exalted.”

So when will you humble yourself? You can not even humble yourself here

As I said, our Works do not self-atone. Rather, they are part and parcel with our choice to follow Christ.

Contradiction

No matter how you slice it. You can not even get your own story straight.

It’s like saying the care drives itself. But you have to push the gas pedal and stear.

yeah.. Your not fooling anyone.

When we choose to follow Christ we also choose to produce his works. If we say we are justified apart from his works, then we fail James 2, "Faith without Deeds is dead."

No. We WILL produce works.

you have to much faith in self..

Funny, you seem unable to address either 1 John 2 or James 2??

I did both, multiple times. You may not agree with what I said, but to accuse me of not adressing it is a flat out LIE!!

funny you just sit there and accuse.

You know what. I am done.. If you’re going to false accuse and act like this. You’re not even worth talking to. You just prove my accusation that you are arrogant

 

[Eternally Grateful]

Ask David. He authored Psalm 139:7, not me.

Yep

David said where ever he went, there was God.

 

[VictoryinJesus]

I do not get into the mystical or philosophical discussions which try to read the mind of God.

"O the depth of the riches and wisdom and knowledge of God! How unsearchable are his judgments and how inscrutable his ways! 'For who has known the mind of the Lord? Or who has been his counselor?'” (Rom 11:33-34 NRSV)

I find trying to read God's mind is like the fruitless discussions about supralapsarianism and infralapsarianism. I take the words of God seriously in His statement:

"The secret things belong to the LORD our God, but the revealed things belong to us and to our children forever, to observe all the words of this law." (Deut 29:29 NRSV)

I just take the word of God as it is written and limit and content myself with that. This is one reason I began to move away from systematic theology into a more Bible theology.

With all due respect to me it’s the opposite. You said trying to read the Mind of God is fruitless…comparing it to other fruitless things? Did I understand correctly? …yet do we not read the Mind of God anytime we read the Word that come out from God? Fruitless “I find trying to read God's mind is like the fruitless discussions about supralapsarianism and infralapsarianism. I take the words of God seriously in His statement:” why compare His Mind to Fruitless discussions? “let this Mind be in you that was in Christ.” And where they said “We have the Mind of Christ” is it Fruitless to desire to know the Mind of God? Consider we seek to know His Mind anytime we turn to Him concerning a situation and ask to know His Mind concerning the situation? This is not Fruitless I don’t think. Our whole life is the study of not this Mind…a spirit of fear unto bondage again. but instead seeking to know the Mind which God has given unto us, a the Spirit of peace, of love and of a Sound Mind. It isn’t Fruitless to read or seek after a Sound Mind. Even when reading God’s Word where He says “My Ways are higher than your ways. My Thoughts are Higher than your thoughts.” What I read is His desire is for us to have Knowledge of His Ways and Thoughts. To me that is not something to be ashamed of for desiring to Know the Mind of God. But the opposite of …what is needful is to seek after His Mind and His Thoughts. He even says men perish for the lack of Knowledge of His Mind and His Ways. “Be not conformed unto the world but be you transformed by the renewing of your mind” how? If it’s a shame to seek after knowing the Mind of God?

To me it is the opposite…it being fruitless in trying to read the mind of fear unto bondage again, the spirit the world gives unto you…it is this mind which trying to know or understand this mind…is fruitless…not giving unto you the Spirit of Power, of love and a Sound Mind.

 

[Johann]

lol.. How can the Holy Spirit be everywhere?

I am sorry you can not grasp the concept that the father is in charge, and both the son and the spirit take their guidance from him..

it does not make them less of a God than the other.

PS. Trinity is a banned subject..

Yes, the Holy Spirit is considered to be both omniscient (all-knowing) and omnipresent (present everywhere) according to Christian theology. These attributes are traditionally ascribed to God, and because the Holy Spirit is understood to be fully divine and part of the Holy Trinity, these characteristics apply to the Spirit as well.

Omniscience of the Holy Spirit:
Scriptural Evidence:

1 Corinthians 2:10-11: "The Spirit searches all things, even the deep things of God. For who knows a person's thoughts except their own spirit within them? In the same way, no one knows the thoughts of God except the Spirit of God."

This passage suggests that the Holy Spirit has complete knowledge, even of the deepest aspects of God’s nature, indicating omniscience.

John 14:26: Jesus says, "But the Advocate, the Holy Spirit, whom the Father will send in my name, will teach you all things and will remind you of everything I have said to you." This implies that the Holy Spirit possesses comprehensive knowledge to teach and remind the disciples of all that Jesus taught.

Omnipresence of the Holy Spirit:
Scriptural Evidence:
Psalm 139:7-8: "Where can I go from your Spirit? Where can I flee from your presence? If I go up to the heavens, you are there; if I make my bed in the depths, you are there." This psalm directly attributes omnipresence to God’s Spirit, indicating that the Holy Spirit is present everywhere.

John 14:16-17: Jesus promises that the Holy Spirit, the "Advocate," will be with the believers forever and will dwell with them. The indwelling of the Holy Spirit in all believers across the world is a reflection of the Spirit’s omnipresence.

Theological Understanding:
Nicene Creed: The Holy Spirit is described as "the Lord, the giver of life, who proceeds from the Father [and the Son], who with the Father and the Son is worshiped and glorified." The attributes of omniscience and omnipresence are understood to be inherent to the Holy Spirit as part of the Godhead.

Psalm 139:7-10: This passage is one of the clearest biblical affirmations of the omnipresence of the Spirit. The psalmist asks, "Where can I go from your Spirit? Where can I flee from your presence?" The rhetorical questions imply that there is no place where God's Spirit is not present. The verses continue to describe God's presence in heaven, in the depths, and even to the farthest reaches of the sea.

Jeremiah 23:23-24: God declares, "Am I only a God nearby, and not a God far away?... Do I not fill heaven and earth?" While this passage refers to God in general, it includes the Holy Spirit as part of the divine nature that fills all of creation.

Acts 17:24-28: In his speech at the Areopagus, Paul speaks about God’s omnipresence, saying that "He is not far from any one of us. 'For in Him we live and move and have our being.'" Although this passage is more general, it aligns with the understanding that God's Spirit is universally present.

2. Theological Reflections
Church Fathers: Early Church Fathers like Augustine and Gregory of Nazianzus discussed the omnipresence of the Holy Spirit. Augustine, in his work On the Trinity, elaborates on the Holy Spirit’s presence everywhere as being inseparable from the Father and the Son.
Thomas Aquinas: In his Summa Theologica, Aquinas argues that the Holy Spirit, as God, must be omnipresent because all of God’s attributes are shared by the persons of the Trinity. He emphasizes that the Holy Spirit's presence is not limited by space and time.
John Calvin: In his Institutes of the Christian Religion, Calvin asserts that the Holy Spirit, like God, is present in all places. He views the Spirit's omnipresence as essential for the Spirit’s work of regeneration and sanctification, which occurs in believers everywhere.

3. The Holy Spirit in Creation and Sustenance
Creation: The Holy Spirit’s presence in creation is seen in Genesis 1:2, where the Spirit of God is "hovering over the waters." This indicates the Spirit's active involvement in and presence throughout the entirety of creation.
Sustenance: The Holy Spirit is also understood to be present in sustaining the universe. In Job 33:4, it says, "The Spirit of God has made me; the breath of the Almighty gives me life," which implies the Spirit's ongoing role in the sustenance and life of all things.

4. Mystical and Devotional Writings
Brother Lawrence: In his classic work, The Practice of the Presence of God, Brother Lawrence speaks to the experiential awareness of God’s presence, which includes the Holy Spirit. He emphasizes that believers can cultivate an awareness of the Spirit’s presence in all aspects of life, underscoring the omnipresence of the Spirit in a practical, lived experience.
Modern Theologians: Contemporary theologians like Jürgen Moltmann have also discussed the omnipresence of the Spirit in the context of God’s immanence in the world. Moltmann’s work often explores how the Holy Spirit pervades all aspects of life and creation, reflecting a deepening understanding of the Spirit's universal presence.

J.

 

[Randy Kluth]

You just proved your arrogance. You reject my prayers. You above me, so you do not need my prayers.

lol. What a joke. Sorry man, But your pride is DEEP

Why don't we try to make this a *respectful* conversation, rather than a "gotcha" contest? We're here to discuss the issues, and the matters just get clouded with an atmosphere of personal attack.

I dealt with it. But you can not see it. Because your blinded by your religion.
Go ahead and trust your pope.. I wash my hands

I don't have a pope.

Who said I did not belong to a church, now you an accuser.

If you're having a bad day, start over.

Typical of those who are stuck in religion they have to look for little things then spew them as if they are true.

So when will you humble yourself? You can not even humble yourself here

I humble myself before God--not before those who accuse me.

Contradiction

No matter how you slice it. You can not even get your own story straight.

It’s like saying the care drives itself. But you have to push the gas pedal and stear.

yeah.. Your not fooling anyone.

No. We WILL produce works.

you have to much faith in self..

I did both, multiple times. You may not agree with what I said, but to accuse me of not adressing it is a flat out LIE!!

I proposed you explain 1 John 2 and James 2 in light of my argument.

funny you just sit there and accuse.

You know what. I am done.. If you’re going to false accuse and act like this. You’re not even worth talking to. You just prove my accusation that you are arrogant

1 John 2 and James 2 suggest that those who put their faith in Christ as our Redeemer simultaneously commit to living in him as our Redeemer. This means we choose to produce Works in him at the moment we choose his Salvation.

So you're done with this? You don't think you have to do any Christian Works when you choose Christ as Savior?

You don't have to answer. Your temperature has to come down.

 

[Behold]

"as it is written: 'There is no one who is righteous

Calvinism is a teaching by John Calvin.
Nothing more.
And many are deceived by it, and once you are, its nearly impossible for you to escape it, as Calvinism is empowered by demonic power, that so blinds the mind, that a person feels an unction, a inner obsession, to want to talk about Calvinism.

Answer..?

God is not a Calvinist
Jesus is not a Calvinist
Paul the Apostle is not a Calvinist.
The NT does not teach Calvinism.

Calvinism is a doctrine of Devils, and its perhaps the Devil's most perfected theological deception, regarding denying the Cross of Christ.

 

[RedFan]

Calvinism is a teaching by John Calvin.
Nothing more.
And many are deceived by it, and once you are, its nearly impossible for you to escape it, as Calvinism is empowered by demonic power, that so blinds the mind, that a person feels an unction, a inner obsession, to want to talk about Calvinism.

Answer..?

God is not a Calvinist
Jesus is not a Calvinist
Paul the Apostle is not a Calvinist.
The NT does not teach Calvinism.

Calvinism is a doctrine of Devils, and its perhaps the Devil's most perfected theological deception, regarding denying the Cross of Christ.

If you'll permit a mild dissent here -- I don't see Calvinism as the work of the Devil at all. I just see it as incredibly stupid. Not every idiotic theological musing is of the Devil. Those who hold to Calvinism aren't duped by the Devil, they are duped by a stupid man.

 

[Ronald Nolette]

Calvinism is just Calvin's personal interpretation of Scripture.

Well the five points are vastly validated by numerous Scriptures so it is not his opinion, but him putting together the necessary verses to show why the five points are true!

There is a huge difference between offering ones opinion and one stating facts and showing them from Scripture.

 

[Augustin56]

Sorry Bro. No church will be held accountable if they get somethign wrong. YOU WILL be held accountable.

If you think the Catholic Church will bail you out if they are wrong,, you have another thing coming.

So, did you take Galatians 1:8 out of your Bible?

But even if we or an angel from heaven should preach to you a gospel other than the one that we preached to you, let that one be accursed! Gal. 1:8

 

[Ronald Nolette]

Calvinism is a teaching by John Calvin.
Nothing more.
And many are deceived by it, and once you are, its nearly impossible for you to escape it, as Calvinism is empowered by demonic power, that so blinds the mind, that a person feels an unction, a inner obsession, to want to talk about Calvinism.

Answer..?

God is not a Calvinist
Jesus is not a Calvinist
Paul the Apostle is not a Calvinist.
The NT does not teach Calvinism.

Calvinism is a doctrine of Devils, and its perhaps the Devil's most perfected theological deception, regarding denying the Cross of Christ.

Straining at gnats while swallowing camels. You are so hung up on teh labels you cannot see the truth behind the five points because of a mere label.

God inspired the five points as Scripture elucidates them

Jesus inspired the apostles to write the verses from which the five points are derived


The NT liatsa teh verses from which the five points are drawn.

You lose every time.
Paul the Apostle was used by god to write down what Calvin would organize from Scripture as the five points

 

[Augustin56]

Well the five points are vastly validated by numerous Scriptures so it is not his opinion, but him putting together the necessary verses to show why the five points are true!

There is a huge difference between offering ones opinion and one stating facts and showing them from Scripture.

More accurately stated, "Well the five points are vastly validated by the personal interpretation by Calvin and his followers of numerous Scriptures, but him putting together the necessary verses to show why the five points are true!"

Without the authority given by Christ to His Church, anything that is interpreted that is contrary to what was always taught by Christ's Church is error. Plain and simple. It doesn't matter how you interpret Scripture, if it contradicts anything taught from the beginning, it is error.

 

[Ronald Nolette]

More accurately stated, "Well the five points are vastly validated by the personal interpretation by Calvin and his followers of numerous Scriptures, but him putting together the necessary verses to show why the five points are true!"

Without the authority given by Christ to His Church, anything that is interpreted that is contrary to what was always taught by Christ's Church is error. Plain and simple. It doesn't matter how you interpret Scripture, if it contradicts anything taught from the beginning, it is error.

Maybe you should read a treatise on teh five points and teh vast array of verses used to show they are all true according to Gods Word. As fdor the rest of "Institutes of christian Religion"? It has been so long since I read it, I can neither condone or condemn its writings.

 

[Augustin56]

Straining at gnats while swallowing camels. You are so hung up on teh labels you cannot see the truth behind the five points because of a mere label.

God inspired the five points as Scripture elucidates them

Jesus inspired the apostles to write the verses from which the five points are derived


The NT liatsa teh verses from which the five points are drawn.

You lose every time.
Paul the Apostle was used by god to write down what Calvin would organize from Scripture as the five points

Ronald, are you claiming that Calvin's personal interpretation of Scripture is "God inspired?" Show me where, in Scripture, it says Calvin is infallible, and therefore, his doctrines based on personal interpretation of Scripture is "God inspired."

I can point you to 2 Peter 1:20, however, that says there is to be no personal interpretation of Scripture.

"Know this first of all, that there is no prophecy of scripture that is a matter of personal interpretation" 2 Peter 1:20

 

[Ronald Nolette]

Without the authority given by Christ to His Church, anything that is interpreted that is contrary to what was always taught by Christ's Church is error. Plain and simple. It doesn't matter how you interpret Scripture, if it contradicts anything taught from the beginning, it is error.

Well as all 5 points were taught by Jesus and the Apostles, we are on safe ground.

Remember Scripture is not open to interpretation. God inspired the very words used. God knew what He was doing.

But I can say the same for your remarks. All you are doing is giving you ropinions and interpretations.

And jsut to make sure, what do you mean by "Christ's Church".

 

[Augustin56]

Maybe you should read a treatise on teh five points and teh vast array of verses used to show they are all true according to Gods Word. As fdor the rest of "Institutes of christian Religion"? It has been so long since I read it, I can neither condone or condemn its writings.

So, you want me to read a treatise created by the person/organization using personal interpretation of Scripture to make up their own doctrines contrary to what was always taught by Christ, the Apostles, and His Church, that justifies their actions in their minds? Do I understand that right?

 

[Ronald Nolette]

"as it is written: 'There is no one who is righteous, not even one; there is no one who has understanding, there is no one who seeks God.'" (Rom 3:10-11)

"You were dead through the trespasses and sins...But God, who is rich in mercy, out of the great love with which he loved us even when we were dead through our trespasses, made us alive together with Christ—by grace you have been saved—" (Eph 2:1, 4-5)

"Indeed, just as the Father raises the dead and gives them life, so also the Son gives life to whomever he wishes." (John 5:21)

"Blessed be the God and Father of our Lord Jesus Christ, who has blessed us in Christ with every spiritual blessing in the heavenly places, just as he chose us in Christ before the foundation of the world to be holy and blameless before him in love." (Eph 1:3-4)

"God, who saved us and called us with a holy calling, not according to our works but according to his own purpose and grace. This grace was given to us in Christ Jesus before the ages began" (2Tim 1:9)

"We are always bound to thank God for you, my friends beloved by the Lord. From the beginning of time God chose you to find salvation in the Spirit who consecrates you and in the truth you believe." (2Thess 2:13)

"and all who dwell on earth will worship it, every one whose name has not been written before the foundation of the world in the book of life of the Lamb that was slain." (Rev 13:8)

"Keep watch over yourselves and over all the flock, of which the Holy Spirit has made you overseers, to shepherd the church of God that he obtained with the blood of his own Son." (Acts 20:28)

"And now they sing a new song. "It is fitting," they say, "that Thou shouldst be the One to take the book And break its seals; Because Thou hast been offered in sacrifice, And hast purchased for God with Thine own blood Some out of every tribe and language and people and nation," (Rev 5:9)

"Jesus Christ, who gave himself for our sins to set us free from the present evil age, according to the will of our God and Father" (Gal 1:4)

"...for it is God who is at work in you, enabling you both to will and to work for his good pleasure." (Phil 2:13)

"A certain woman named Lydia, a worshiper of God, was listening to us; she was from the city of Thyatira and a dealer in purple cloth. The Lord opened her heart to listen eagerly to what was said by Paul." (Acts 16:14)

"...and what if he has done so in order to make known the riches of his glory for the objects of mercy, which he has prepared beforehand for glory— including us whom he has called, not from the Jews only but also from the Gentiles?" (Rom 9:23-24)

"My sheep hear my voice. I know them, and they follow me. I give them eternal life, and they will never perish. No one will snatch them out of my hand." (John 10:27-28)

"Much more surely then, now that we have been justified by his blood, will we be saved through him from the wrath of God." (Rom 5:9)

"For I am convinced that neither death, nor life, nor angels, nor rulers, nor things present, nor things to come, nor powers, nor height, nor depth, nor anything else in all creation, will be able to separate us from the love of God in Christ Jesus our Lord." (Rom 8:38-39)

"But the Lord is faithful; he will strengthen you and guard you from the evil one." (2Thess 3:3)

"Blessed be the God and Father of our Lord Jesus Christ! By his great mercy he has given us a new birth into a living hope through the resurrection of Jesus Christ from the dead, and into an inheritance that is imperishable, undefiled, and unfading, kept in heaven for you, who are being protected by the power of God through faith for a salvation ready to be revealed in the last time." (1Pet 1:3-5)

If you sincerely and honestly believe those Scriptures, you ARE a Calvinist! If you deny those clear statements of Scripture, what are you?
When you hear/read people use "all", "every" & "world" etc. to say it means all individuals: ask them to show why those words mean that in the context. Look the words up in a dictionary and see if that is automatically the meaning of those words.

I am stunned Behold has only written one response! He is so obsessed with Calvin and Calvinists, He usually fills the pages with his diatribes against Calvin.

 

[Ronald Nolette]

So, you want me to read a treatise created by the person/organization using personal interpretation of Scripture to make up their own doctrines contrary to what was always taught by Christ, the Apostles, and His Church, that justifies their actions in their minds? Do I understand that right?

Well if you haven't read it, how can you even make any kind of intelligent defense against it?

Why don't you see if his conclusions are opinion or the end result of enormous scriptures to support them.

Do you believe in the trinity? If you do , you have to show it by bringing verses to bear and then showing the result of those verses. we all do thisd, sometime faithfully and sometime- not so much. so stop berating someone you may have not even studied their writings .

 

[Augustin56]

Well as all 5 points were taught by Jesus and the Apostles, we are on safe ground.

Remember Scripture is not open to interpretation. God inspired the very words used. God knew what He was doing.

But I can say the same for your remarks. All you are doing is giving you ropinions and interpretations.

And jsut to make sure, what do you mean by "Christ's Church".

If the 5 points were taught by Jesus and the Apostles, they would be part of Catholic doctrine. There were no Protestants until the 16th century, and no 5 points.

Everyone interprets everything they read, without exception. But, one can interpret it according to their personal interpretation, with no guidelines whatsoever, other than their own light. Or, they can interpret it within the context of what was always taught, from the beginning.

I don't have to bother with creating my own doctrines through personal interpretation. I have the Church founded by Christ, which St. Paul refers to as the "pillar and foundation of truth" in 1 Tim 3:15. Historically, there was NO OTHER CHURCH at the time Paul wrote this than the Catholic Church. The Orthodox didn't splinter off until 1054 A.D. and Protestantism didn't begin until the 1517 A.D.

 

[Ronald Nolette]

If the 5 points were taught by Jesus and the Apostles, they would be part of Catholic doctrine. There were no Protestants until the 16th century, and no 5 points.

Everyone interprets everything they read, without exception. But, one can interpret it according to their personal interpretation, with no guidelines whatsoever, other than their own light. Or, they can interpret it within the context of what was always taught, from the beginning.

I don't have to bother with creating my own doctrines through personal interpretation. I have the Church founded by Christ, which St. Paul refers to as the "pillar and foundation of truth" in 1 Tim 3:15. Historically, there was NO OTHER CHURCH at the time Paul wrote this than the Catholic Church. The Orthodox didn't splinter off until 1054 A.D. and Protestantism didn't begin until the 1517 A.D.

So you are a member of the RCC ?