Ronald David Bruno
Well-Known Member
But now, it is no longer I who do it, but sin that dwells in me. ROM. 7:17
I agree!
Are You Dead to Self?
- Thread starter Episkopos
- Start date
-
Welcome to Christian Forums, a Christian Forum that recognizes that all Christians are a work in progress.
You will need to register to be able to join in fellowship with Christians all over the world.
We hope to see you as a part of our community soon and God Bless!
I agree!
It's too bad we cannot all be in a circle with our Bibles in our laps, singing some hymns, and reading the Scriptures together!!
Much love!
There's no lusting after the flesh when we are in Christ. You can lust after the flesh because you walk in your flesh. I do not. I walk in the spirit...
Galatians 5:16
This I say then, Walk in the Spirit, and ye shall not fulfil the lust of the flesh.
I have my trusty ol' guitar at ready-what hymns would you prefer?
"Behold, how good and how pleasant it is for brethren to dwell together in unity!"
This verse highlights the joy and blessing that comes from harmonious and unified relationships among people, particularly within the context of a community of believers or family. Living in unity fosters peace, cooperation, and mutual support, creating a positive and uplifting environment for everyone involved.
In real time-seeking for THIS kind of fellowship in South Africa brother marks.
Johann.
Behold
Well-Known Member
"""We're pilgrims on the journey
of the narrow road,
and those who've gone before us
line the way.
cheering on the faithful,
encouraging the weary,
their lives a stirring testament
to god's sustaining GRACE.
o may all who come behind us
find us faithful,
may the fire of our devotion
light their way.
may the footprints that we leave,
lead them to believe,
and the lives we live
inspire them to obey.
o may all who come behind us
find us faithful.
Surrounded by so great
a cloud of witnesses,
let us run the race
not only for the prize,
but as those who've gone before us.
let us leave to those behind us,
the heritage of faithfulness
passed on thru godly lives.
After all our hopes and dreams
have come and gone,
and our children sift thru all
we've left behind,
may the clues that they discover,
and the mem'ries they uncover,
become the light that leads them,
to the road we each must find.
o may all who come behind us
find us faithful,
may the fire of our devotion
light their way.
may the footprints that we leave,
lead them to believe,
and the lives we live
inspire them to obey.
o may all who come behind us = find us faithful. ""
- Steve Greene
Ronald David Bruno
Well-Known Member
When you actually do that, but how often?
Romans 8:5-13
This passage says that those who live according to the flesh are concerned with the things of the flesh, but those who live according to the spirit are concerned with the things of the spirit.
So, the big question is: Are we not at times concerned about fleshly things?
>> If Christians consistantly walked in the Spirit 100% of the time, we would outwardly behave perfectly= lovingly ALL THE TIME.<< The world would see the dramatic change: " Look, they have all become perfect, loving and unselfish!" Do they see that? No, they see us doing the same things they do ( sometimes, but for certain _ and to be fair _ less than we did), which is why they pick out the hypocrites out of the bunch. I wonder if that phrase, " Do as I say, not as I do", came from a Christian parent?
Are you concerned about money, wealth, material things, worldly things? Sometimes?
Are you selfish at times? Yes.
Do you love your neighbor AS YOU DO YOURSELF ALL THE TIME? No, I doubt that most who claim they walk on the high road do either.
There are not many Mother Teresa's around, but yes there are many servants and unselfish people making an effort to walk in the Spirit most of the time.
Don't know about you, but I get selfish sometimes, don't feel like the love is continously flowing through me into the world. I say no sometimes and just don't feel like extending myself. I'm retired, don't have the energy any more. God is merciful.
If we are honest, we still admit that we choose at times to not love when the opportunity presents itself. Unless you claim to be just like Jesus? Watch out for those who do.
1 Corinthians 3:1-3
This passage says that people are still of the flesh if there is jealousy and strife among them.
Is there strife among us? Arrogance? Pride?
There is a place of peace and rest, near to the heart of God.
I'm always reminded of @Jay Ross , as he would pray for others, that they would be drawn into the love of God, ever closer, ever deeper into Him. He used different words, but surely this is the heart of the matter!
Nearer, still nearer, close to Thy heart, draw me, my Savior, so precious Thou art; fold me, O fold me close to Thy breast; shelter me safe in that Haven of Rest!
Because you are far from me, we are nearer each other being near to the Lord.
Much love my brother!
Behold
Well-Known Member
What you tried to teach was that Paul had not attained His spiritual perfection,. by claiming as people like you always do, that Paul was stuck in Romans 7, were you live.
So, you misused... you abused... you twisted the verse you posted that says that He had not obtained the Resurrection, to try to teach that He had not attained spiritual perfection on earth.
Zao is life
Well-Known Member
2 Peter 1:4-8:
-- "For this very reason, make every effort to ADD to your faith:
(1) Excellence, to excellence, (2) knowledge; to knowledge, (3) self-control; to self-control, (4) perseverance; to perseverance, (5) godliness; to godliness, (6) brotherly affection; to brotherly affection, (7) unselfish love."
Why ADD this to your faith?
"Because if these things are really yours and are continually increasing, they will keep you from becoming ineffective and unproductive in your pursuit of knowing our Lord Jesus Christ more intimately." -- 2 Peter 1:4-8.
Something always needs to be added - by our own effort.
Paul did not contradict Peter:
Philippians 3
9 and be found in Him; not having my OWN righteousness, which is of (obedience to) the Law, but through the faith of Christ, the righteousness of God by faith,
10 that I may know Him and the power of His resurrection and the fellowship of His sufferings, being made conformable to His death;
11 if by any means I might attain to the resurrection of the dead.
12 Not as though I had already attained, EITHER WERE ALREADY PERFECT, but I am pressing on, if I may lay hold of that for which I also was taken hold of by Christ Jesus.
13 My brothers, I do not count myself to have taken possession, but one thing I do, forgetting the things behind and reaching forward to the things before,
14 I press toward the mark for the prize of the high calling of God in Christ Jesus.
IMO Paul was not claiming sinless perfection, and Peter was not teaching us that we are already perfect. @marks will tell you I'm not perfect. Just recently I accused him of ignoring a certain word in a certain verse of scripture so as to hold onto and push another belief - which is what you did above in different words, showing your hypocrisy. At least I'm not claiming to have already achieved what you claim to have already achieved - and then proceed to prove that I do not have it, as you do in the above post.
Neither have a I ever claimed to have achieved it. So no one can accuse me of hypocrisy in this regard. Plus I'm able to admit that I was wrong because I jumped to the conclusion that marks was about to attempt to prove a theology and so opened his post in the way he did for that reason, but I was totally wrong.
All of which proves that I have not obtained, though I take seriously what Peter said because I know he meant what he said when he said, "Make every effort.."
Your post above betrays the falsehood of your entire argument, IMO, because you're certainly not practicing what you preach.
Last edited:
yes, I agree. But you were saying that there is no old sin nature left in us and that this is a literal thing. And I was just arguing that it is a spiritual reality but not necessarily literal since any time a believer isn't walking in the Spirit we still have the flesh and spirit in conflict with one another, desiring different things contrary one to the other. Bible says we are to "reckon" ourselves to be dead to sin, our old man crucified.......that is not speaking in a literal sense...but is a matter of faith...walking by faith not by sight.
Behold
Well-Known Member
Because that is what discipleship is created to do.
However, When the person is trying to do that,= to try to stay saved, or be accepted by God, .....then they have placed themselves on the Cross That Jesus has already been sacrificed upon for them, already.
Words of Warning (Php_3:1 to Php_4:3).
(1) AGAINST THE JUDAISERS.
(a) Warning against confidence “in the flesh,” illustrated by his own renunciation of all Jewish privileges and hopes, in order to have “the righteousness of Christ” (Php_3:1-9).
(b) Warning against confidence in perfection as already attained, again illustrated by his own sense of imperfection and hope of continual progress (Php_3:10-16).
(2) AGAINST THE ANTINOMIAN PARTY.
Contrast of the sensual and corrupt life of the flesh with the spirituality and hope of future perfection which become citizens of heaven (Php_3:17-21).
(3) AGAINST ALL TENDENCY TO SCHISM (Php_4:1-3).
(10, 11) The order of these verses is notable and instructive. (1) First comes the knowledge of “the power of the Resurrection.” What this is we see by examining it as historically the main subject of the first apostolic preaching. There it is considered, as in St. Peter’s first sermons, as giving the earnest of “forgiveness,” or “blotting out of sins,” and the “gift of the Holy Ghost” (Act_2:38; Act_3:13; Act_3:26), or, as St. Paul expresses it, of “justification from all things” (Act_13:38-39).
This same idea is wrought out fully in his Epistles. Thus, for example, without it (1Co_15:17) “we are still in our sins.” It is the pledge of our justification (Rom_5:1), and the means of our being “alive unto God” (Rom_6:11). Hence “the power,” or efficacy, “of His resurrection” is the justification, and regeneration inseparable from it, which lie at the entrance of Christian life. (2) Next comes the “partaking of His sufferings” and “conformity to His death,” which are the “taking up the cross, and following Him,” in the obedience even unto death. This “fellowship of sufferings,” coming partly from the sin of others, partly from our own, is the constant theme of the New Testament.
(See 1Pe_4:13; Rom_8:17; 2Co_1:5; Col_1:24; 2Ti_2:11.) The “conformity to His death” is the completion of the death unto sin, described as “mortification” of sin (Col_3:5); “as bearing about in the body the dying (or, properly, mortification) of the Lord Jesus” (2Co_4:10); or more frequently as being “crucified with Christ,” “the world to us and we to the world” (Gal_2:20; Gal_5:24; Gal_6:14). (3)
Lastly comes the “attainment to the resurrection of the dead,” properly, “the resurrection from the dead,” which is (see Luk_20:35) the resurrection unto life and the glorification in Him, so nobly described below (Php_3:20-21). “If we have been planted together in the likeness of His death, we shall be also in the likeness of His resurrection” (Rom_6:5). For of our resurrection (see 1Co_15:12-23) His resurrection is not only the pledge, but the earnest. Note how in 1Th_4:14-18, and 1Co_15:51-57, the whole description is only of the resurrection unto life, and compare the first resurrection of Rev_20:6. This is the completion of all; St. Paul dared not as yet anticipate it with the confidence which hereafter soothed his dying hour (2Ti_4:7-8).
Php_3:12-16 lead us from the warning against trust in human merit to deprecate the supposition of a perfection here attained even in Christ. The transition is natural. The same spirit which shows itself undisguisedly in the one pretension, comes out half-concealed in the other.
Everett
You have much, much to learn before you can teach me.
"Attah" (אַתָּה) "Maggid" (מַגִּיד) "Atzmi" (עַצְמִי) "Be'eretz Yisrael"
J.
Behold
Well-Known Member
What you originally tried to teach was that Paul had not attained His spiritual perfection,. by claiming as people like you always do, that Paul was stuck in Romans 7, were you live.
So, you misused... you abused... you twisted the verse you posted that says that He had not obtained the Resurrection, to try to teach that He had not attained spiritual perfection on earth.
Unfortunately there is no love lost here as most are vying to overreach for that which is not obtainable in THIS life brother, that, and different denominations with different complications.
Reminds me of Alexander the Great.
Johann.
Leave him be brother-he is safely "Hu batuach be'mistor be'Yisrael"
Johann.
Behold
Well-Known Member
Every born again believer has become "The Righteousness of GOD... IN CHRIST" = the very instant they were "born again".
Its unfortunate that you dont understand this spiritual reality. @Johann
See, becoming "ONE with God".. has nothing to do with trying to be good and do right.
How do you know?
Its because "while you were YET SINNERS, Christ died for you".. Its because "GOD justifies the UNGODLY"..
This is based on The finished work of JESUS on The Cross.
John 14:6
See that?
That is for all SINNERs, who have received something "by Faith".... that now makes them "Christ's Righteousness", for as long as they are "in Christ" and that will be for as long as Christ exists.
Welcome to : SALVATION
Its a GIFT that never ENDS.
"The GIFT of Righteousness"...
Unfortunately so-
The Parable of the Weeds
Matthew 13:24-30 (NIV):
Jesus told them another parable: “The kingdom of heaven is like a man who sowed good seed in his field. But while everyone was sleeping, his enemy came and sowed weeds among the wheat, and went away. When the wheat sprouted and formed heads, then the weeds also appeared.
“The owner’s servants came to him and said, ‘Sir, didn’t you sow good seed in your field? Where then did the weeds come from?’
“‘An enemy did this,’ he replied.
“The servants asked him, ‘Do you want us to go and pull them up?’
“‘No,’ he answered, ‘because while you are pulling the weeds, you may uproot the wheat with them. Let both grow together until the harvest. At that time I will tell the harvesters: First collect the weeds and tie them in bundles to be burned; then gather the wheat and bring it into my barn.’”
Explanation of the Parable
Matthew 13:36-43 (NIV):
Then he left the crowd and went into the house. His disciples came to him and said, “Explain to us the parable of the weeds in the field.”
He answered, “The one who sowed the good seed is the Son of Man. The field is the world, and the good seed stands for the people of the kingdom. The weeds are the people of the evil one, and the enemy who sows them is the devil. The harvest is the end of the age, and the harvesters are angels.
“As the weeds are pulled up and burned in the fire, so it will be at the end of the age. The Son of Man will send out his angels, and they will weed out of his kingdom everything that causes sin and all who do evil. They will throw them into the blazing furnace, where there will be weeping and gnashing of teeth. Then the righteous will shine like the sun in the kingdom of their Father. Whoever has ears, let them hear.”
Summary
The parable teaches that both the righteous (the wheat) and the wicked (the weeds) will coexist in the world until the end of the age. At that time, God will separate the righteous from the wicked, rewarding the former and punishing the latter. This illustrates the patience required in dealing with the presence of evil and the assurance that divine justice will ultimately prevail.
While the metaphor of chaff and wheat is not exactly the same as wheat and weeds, a similar concept is found in other biblical passages where the wicked are compared to chaff.
Additional References to Chaff and Wheat
Psalm 1:4 (NIV):
"Not so the wicked! They are like chaff that the wind blows away."
Isaiah 5:24 (NIV):
"Therefore, as tongues of fire lick up straw and as dry grass sinks down in the flames, so their roots will decay and their flowers blow away like dust; for they have rejected the law of the LORD Almighty and spurned the word of the Holy One of Israel."
Luke 3:17 (NIV):
"His winnowing fork is in his hand to clear his threshing floor and to gather the wheat into his barn, but he will burn up the chaff with unquenchable fire."
In summary, the idea of the wheat and the weeds (or tares) growing together until the time of harvest, as described in the Parable of the Weeds, aligns closely with the concept of good and evil coexisting until the final judgment.
I wish we could speak face to face but I don't have a microphone nor a "Blackberry cellphone" Marks. You are growing by leaps and bounds in Christ Jesus and I have a LOT of catching up to do! Man, you and Lizbeth are inspiring me.
Johann.
We experience a death to our old sin nature once we are baptized into Christ. It’s dead and gone because it does not exist anymore. We become totally new in our spirit when we are born again, and this is how our old nature has been completely changed. Our minds are similar to computers in the sense they can be programmed, and once programmed, they will continue to function as programmed until we reprogram them. And this is what Romans is talking about when it states we should renew our minds. Our old sin nature programmed our minds how to walk by the flesh when we were born in sin.
Similar threads
