More on the deity of Christ

“1. The one God. (a) theos is the most frequent designation of God in the NT. Belief in the one, only, and unique God (Matt. 23:9; Rom. 3:30; 1 Cor. 8:4-6; Gal. 3:20; 1 Tim. 2:5; Jas. 2:19) is an established part of Christian tradition. Jesus himself made the fundamental confession of Jud. his own and expressly quoted the Shema (Deut. 6:4-5; see Mk. 12:29-30; cf. Matt. 22:37; Lk. 10:27). This guaranteed continuity between the old and new covenants. The God whom Christians worship is the God of the fathers (Acts 3:13; 5:30; 22:14), the God of Abraham, Isaac and Jacob (Acts 3:13; 7:32; cf. Matt. 22:32; Mk. 12:26; Lk. 20:37), the God of Israel (Matt. 15:31; Lk. 1:68; Acts 13:17), and the God of Jesus Christ (2 Cor. 1:3; Eph. 1:3; 1 Pet. 1:3).”

(New International Dictionary of New Testament Theology, Abridged Edition, p. 244)

This is an accurate description of the one God whom I believe in @KUWN. This, not the Trinity, is the one God of Jewish monotheism.

Jesus of Nazareth himself is a Jewish monotheist. His creed (the creed of Judaism) is my creed. This is why I cannot with a clear conscience be registered as “Christian” on Christianity Board, with the stance it has taken on its faith statement.

What is your objection to believing only in the one, only and unique God whom the Messiah himself believes in?

“The NT rests firmly on the OT foundation in its doctrine of God, but its emphases are new. God is now near, the Father of Jesus Christ, who justifies freely by his grace (cf. Paul’s concept of the righteousness of God.) His action in election bursts all claims to exclusiveness. But it is the same God who reveals himself in the OT and whose plan of salvation, there promised, comes to fulfillment.”

(Ibid.)

Bold is mine.

Trinitarianism goes beyond this.

“… the differentiation made between ho theos as the one who speaks in both eras and huios as his final means of speaking shows that in the author’s mind it was not the Triune God of Christian theology who spoke to the forefathers by the prophets. That is to say, for the author of Hebrews (as for all NT writers, one may suggest) ‘the God of our fathers,’ Yahweh, was no other than ‘the God and Father of our Lord Jesus Christ’ (compare Acts 2:30 and 2:33; 3:13; and 3:18; 3:25 and 3:26; note also 5:30). Such a conclusion is entirely consistent with the regular NT usage of ho theos. It would be inappropriate for elohim or YHWH ever to refer to the Trinity in the OT when in the NT theos regularly refers to the Father alone and apparently never to the Trinity.”

(Murray J. Harris, Jesus As God: The New Testament Use of Theos in Reference to Jesus, p. 47, fn. 112)

I agree with what this trinitarian scholar wrote in the quote @KUWN. It obviously doesn’t prevent him from being a trinitarian, but it contributes in a major way to me not being a trinitarian.

As I will document, not all trinitarians believe Jesus is Yahweh. For a Jewish monotheist, however, there is no God besides Yahweh.

KUWN said:

As more and more revelation was being passed down, more and more doctrines were better understood. This is known as progressive revelation, which simply means Gen 1.1 was a start but not complete.

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My position as a Jewish monotheist who believes Jesus of Nazareth is the Messiah and that his God and Father is my God and Father is that the doctrine concerning who God is was fully known and confirmed by Jesus.

KUWN said:

I believe in one Godhead, not 1 person/being. Yes, we worship the God of Israel, but now, we worship both God the Father, and God the Son. How many times in the NT does THEOS refer to Jesus Christ? Let's see who can find the most.

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The God of Israel is, as I demonstrated from scripture in post #40 and 41, is only one person / being -> the Messiah’s own God.

Trinitarianism proposes a different idea, and one which stands opposed to the Messiah’s religion.

KUWN said:

sorry, I dont follow your reasoning here.

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Thanks. I don’t want to misunderstand nor to misrepresent what you believe.

You wrote “G, G, and G”. Is that not “God, God and God”? Is it not your belief that ”G,G, and G” is the Godhead?

KUWN said:

but how can God be distinct from God?

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In the theology of Jewish monotheism, elohim is used a description for Yahweh and for persons who are not Yahweh.

KUWN said:

The Father alone is Almighty. The Son is the Mediator between God and man, meaning that He is distinct from God. Polycarp never mentioned “substance” or that Jesus has both a divine and a human nature. These concepts were developed much later.

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Why did you write this if you’re unsure how God can be distinct from God?

Or is it that you know how God can be distinct from God and it doesn’t align with how I know God can be distinct from God?

Perhaps, though, you don’t believe God can be distinct from God.

Please let me know so we can discuss it.

KUWN said:

The Father alone is Almighty.

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Who is this? In Jewish monotheism, this is Yahweh, the God of Israel -> the God and Father of our lord Jesus Messiah. There is no one else who can be the Messiah’s God.

KUWN said:

The Son is the Mediator between God and man, meaning that He is distinct from God.

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Who is this? In Jewish monotheism, among those of us who believe Jesus of Nazareth is the Messiah, the Son of Yahweh, this is Jesus of Nazareth.

Yahweh is distinct from Jesus of Nazareth.

Both Yahweh and Jesus of Nazareth are identified with the Hebrew word elohim (“God”) in scripture.

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You are registered here as “Christian”. I’m registered here as “Other Faith”. Currently, you and I can discuss this with one another in accordance with the Board rules, but only in a forum (such as this one) not identified as “Christian Only”.

Matthias said:

I like your point but you’re registered as a “Christian” member and so is @KUWN. I’m neither the theology police nor the forum police. Are you aware your post is a violation of the rules? (I’m just trying to keep you out of trouble.)

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I believe debating the trinity, rather than affirming it is against the rules. Still, we may have to take it to the "non-christian" forums.

KUWN said:

That's Trinitarian theology.

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It is not specifically trinitarian. You are just wrong.

MonoBiblical said:

I believe debating the trinity, rather than affirming it is against the rules. Still, we may have to take it to the "non-christian" forums.

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The policy was changed on February 25, 2025. Christians aren’t supposed to discuss the Trinity with other Christians. Christians are allowed to discuss the Trinity with those who are not registered as “Christian”, but only in forums which are not designated “Christians Only”.

Matthias said:

The policy was changed on February 25, 2025. Christians aren’t supposed to discuss the Trinity with other Christians. Christians are allowed to discuss the Trinity with those who are not registered as “Christian”, but only in forums which are not designated “Christians Only”.

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Limited theological talk or discussion?

MonoBiblical said:

It is not specifically trinitarian. You are just wrong.

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I don’t disagree but this kind of exchange between Christians (you are both registered as “Christian”) is what the moderators changed the rules to prevent from happening.

MonoBiblical said:

Limited theological talk or discussion?

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They’re dealing with a behavioral problem. Rather than approach the problem by dealing with the behavior, they’re eliminating discussion of the doctrine that causes the behavioral problem. Christians can’t discuss it, except with non-Christians. That should quiet things down a bit in the “Christians Only” forums.

The rules, as I understand them, don’t currently allow for Christians to discuss the Trinity with other Christians in the forums non-Christians are allowed to post in. (If it did, that would just transfer the behavior problem from one area of the Board to another. That wouldn’t accomplish anything particularly meaningful.)

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A rough summary:

Discussion between Christians about the doctrine of the Trinity. Out.

Discussions between Christians and non-Christians about the doctrine of the Trinity. In, but in a restricted and prescribed manner.

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Personally, I’d rather they hadn’t changed the rules. Nevertheless, I’ll continue striving to post in accordance with the new rules.

Would you consider changing your registration from “Christian” to “Other Faith”? (I did, over two years ago.)