It is time to give Pretrib a decent burial

[marks]

Where is there any indication in the prophecy itself that the 70 determined weeks would not all be continuous from beginning to end? Why would just the first 69 weeks be continuous and then a large gap?


Not to me it isn't. When week 1 ended, week 2 began. When week 2 ended, week 3 began. And so on up until week 69. When that time period ended, week 70 began.


You make it ambiguous, not me. It's not ambiguous at all to me.


Why does it all have to be explicitly spelled out to you in order for you to discern what it means? There is no basis whatsoever for putting any gaps in the 70 weeks.

The six things listed in the following verse had to all be fulfilled within the 70 weeks. Do you think Christ's death was not necessary for these things to be fulfilled?

Daniel 9:24 Seventy weeks are determined upon thy people and upon thy holy city, to finish the transgression, and to make an end of sins, and to make reconciliation for iniquity, and to bring in everlasting righteousness, and to seal up the vision and prophecy, and to anoint the most Holy.

For example, how else can reconciliation for iniquity be made apart from the shed blood of Christ?

Hebrews 2:17 Wherefore in all things it behoved him to be made like unto his brethren, that he might be a merciful and faithful high priest in things pertaining to God, to make reconciliation for the sins of the people.

Why did he say, after the 62 weeks? What is your clear and simple answer?

Much love!

 

[Spiritual Israelite]

Why did he say, after the 69 weeks? What is your clear and simple answer?

To show that it wouldn't happen until after the first 69 weeks ended first, showing that it would be a major event during the last of the 70 weeks. An event without which the things listed in Daniel 9:24 could not be fulfilled.

What is the basis for putting a large gap between the end of the 69th week and beginning of the 70th week? Please give a clear and simple answer to that question.

 

[marks]

To show that it wouldn't happen until after the first 69 weeks ended first, showing that it would be a major event during the last of the 70 weeks. An event without which the things listed in Daniel 9:24 could not be fulfilled.

You are saying to show it as a major part of the 70th week, yet without naming the 70th week. Interesting! Thank you!

What is the basis for putting a large gap between the end of the 69th week and beginning of the 70th week? Please give a clear and simple answer to that question.

The 70th week is not clearly placed in this prophecy. It is only alluded to, if in fact that's what it it, in the part, he shall confirm a covenant for 1 week, and in the midst of the week stop the sacrifices (I'm not trying to quote exactly, I'm certain you know the passage).

The prophecy specifies when in these weeks certain things would happen, but does not for the final 70th week, only giving a possible allusion, which, if that's what it is, gives a sequential narrative that includes events after the 69th week, and possibly before the 70th.

As I'm sure you know, the lack of specific clarity in this passage about this week in which the covenant is confirmed has led people to conclude that the first half of the week is Jesus' ministry (70th week began at Jesus' baptism), the second half being the great tribulation, after a long gap. I think someone wrote recently that the 70th week began at Jesus' birth.

Sir Robert Anderson, a very smart fellow, worked out that these weeks of years, converted to days, pointed to the day that Jesus rode the donkey into Jerusalem to be received as their Messiah and King.

For myself, what I see to be the solution is that the angel said, "after the sixty nine weeks" because there was a separation between the 69 weeks and the 70th week, though that could be in nature/content, not necessarily in time. I think it's in time because of the many parallels between this prophecy and many others in the Bible which discribe apparently the same thing at the end of this age.

I'm sorry this may not have been simple, I'm hoping it's clear.

Much love!

 

[David in NJ]

After the 69th week Messiah is cut off, but not for Himself. After the 69th week. Ponder that. The 70th week is yet future.

Much love!

After the 69th means it is behind, PAST.
This means the prophecy continues immediately, without delay, without a 'Gap', into the 70th week where MESSIAH is cut-off:

ONLY by MESSIAH being "cut-off" on the Cross/the LAMB that takes away the sins of the world,
which is FIRST and FOREMOST to Israel and then to all nations and ALL of mankind created in the image of God = Genesis ch3

ONLY by the Sacrifice of MESSIAH on the Cross, His Resurrection and His Ascension back to the FATHER is Daniel 9:24

“Seventy weeks are determined
For your people and for your holy city, = John 1:10 "HE came to His own = ISRAEL and JERUSALEM
To finish the transgression, = on the CROSS = "IT IS FINISHED"
To make an end of sins, = on the CROSS = "IT IS FINISHED"
To make reconciliation for iniquity, = on the CROSS = "IT IS FINISHED"
To bring in everlasting righteousness, = HIS RESURRECTION = Salvation by HIS RIGHTEOUSENSS = Eternal LIFE to all who Believe
To seal up vision and prophecy, = Book of Revelation
And to anoint the Most Holy. = Hebrews 9:12 = FULFILLED

Hebrews 9:12
But Christ came as High Priest of the good things to come, with the greater and more perfect tabernacle not made with hands,
that is, not of this creation.
Not with the blood of goats and calves,
but with His own Blood He entered the Most Holy Place once for all,
having obtained eternal redemption.

 

[David in NJ]

@ewq1938 @amigo de christo @marks @MA2444 @The Light

Isael is under attack from Iran = Zechariah 14:1-3 is beginning before our very eyes

Behold, the day of the Lord is coming,
And your spoil will be divided in your midst.
For I will gather all the nations to battle against Jerusalem;

this will only continue to build = False prophet and Antichrist to the rescue???

 

[marks]

@ewq1938 @amigo de christo @marks @MA2444 @The Light

Isael is under attack from Iran = Zechariah 14:1-3 is beginning before our very eyes

Behold, the day of the Lord is coming,
And your spoil will be divided in your midst.
For I will gather all the nations to battle against Jerusalem;

this will only continue to build = False prophet and Antichrist to the rescue???

That's not until the final battle when the Lord returns. "All nations". First comes Gog and Magog et al. Some contemplate a battle prior to that involving the peoples named in Psalm 83.

Obadiah will also be fulfilled, I think prior to Gog/Magog, but I wouldn't be dogmatic about that. Maybe after, or at the same time.

Much love!

 

[Spiritual Israelite]

You are saying to show it as a major part of the 70th week, yet without naming the 70th week. Interesting! Thank you!


The 70th week is not clearly placed in this prophecy. It is only alluded to, if in fact that's what it it, in the part, he shall confirm a covenant for 1 week, and in the midst of the week stop the sacrifices (I'm not trying to quote exactly, I'm certain you know the passage).

I don't know of anyone who tries to say that the one week of Daniel 9:27 is anything but the 70th week. Not everything has to be spelled out for us in order to be able to discern what something means.

The prophecy specifies when in these weeks certain things would happen, but does not for the final 70th week, only giving a possible allusion, which, if that's what it is, gives a sequential narrative that includes events after the 69th week, and possibly before the 70th.

The last thing mentioned is something happening after the end of the 69th week so it's quite safe to assume that any mention of a week after that would be a reference to the 70th week. If you can't draw any conclusions from scripture except for the parts that are explicitly spelled out for you then you're not going to understand much scripture.

As I'm sure you know, the lack of specific clarity in this passage about this week in which the covenant is confirmed has led people to conclude that the first half of the week is Jesus' ministry (70th week began at Jesus' baptism), the second half being the great tribulation, after a long gap. I think someone wrote recently that the 70th week began at Jesus' birth.

It's quite clear to me that Daniel 9:27 refers to the 70th week. A vast majority who study that passage believe the same thing. That shouldn't even be a question as far as I'm concerned.

Sir Robert Anderson, a very smart fellow, worked out that these weeks of years, converted to days, pointed to the day that Jesus rode the donkey into Jerusalem to be received as their Messiah and King.

For myself, what I see to be the solution is that the angel said, "after the sixty nine weeks" because there was a separation between the 69 weeks and the 70th week, though that could be in nature/content, not necessarily in time. I think it's in time because of the many parallels between this prophecy and many others in the Bible which discribe apparently the same thing at the end of this age.

I'm sorry this may not have been simple, I'm hoping it's clear.

It's not clear to me as to why you would put a gap between the end of the 69th week and beginning of the 70th week. I see no basis for that whatsoever. You don't have any gaps between any of the other weeks, right? So, why put one there?

Do you believe that Christ's death was necessary in order for any of the things listed in Daniel 9:24 to be fulfilled?

 

[David in NJ]

That's not until the final battle when the Lord returns. "All nations". First comes Gog and Magog et al. Some contemplate a battle prior to that involving the peoples named in Psalm 83.

Obadiah will also be fulfilled, I think prior to Gog/Magog, but I wouldn't be dogmatic about that. Maybe after, or at the same time.

Much love!

Much love!

First God gathers the nations against Israel
GOD allows the nations to invade Jerusalem = she will be overrun
While this is BEGINNING the false prophet and Antichrist make their debut


Gog & Magog is after the 1,000 year Reign = Revelation 20:7 When the thousand years are complete, Satan will be released from his prison, and will go out to deceive the nations in the four corners of the earth—Gog and Magog—to assemble them for battle.

 

[The Light]

Gog & Magog is after the 1,000 year Reign = Revelation 20:7 When the thousand years are complete, Satan will be released from his prison, and will go out to deceive the nations in the four corners of the earth—Gog and Magog—to assemble them for battle.

Absolutely

 

[marks]

I don't know of anyone who tries to say that the one week of Daniel 9:27 is anything but the 70th week. Not everything has to be spelled out for us in order to be able to discern what something means.

I don't know anyone either, just the same, I'm of the habit of seeing both what is, and what is not, written. I prefer to note any assumptions I'm making, no matter how well founded they seem. If it doesn't actually say it, then that's what is.

Much love!

 

[marks]

First God gathers the nations against Israel
GOD allows the nations to invade Jerusalem = she will be overrun
While this is BEGINNING the false prophet and Antichrist make their debut


Gog & Magog is after the 1,000 year Reign = Revelation 20:7 When the thousand years are complete, Satan will be released from his prison, and will go out to deceive the nations in the four corners of the earth—Gog and Magog—to assemble them for battle.

Ezekiel 38 and 39 spell out a Gog/Magog invasion followed by a 7 year stretch, followed by all nations against Israel, followed by Isreal being completely regathered to the promised land, when Jesus comes.

Much love!

 

[Spiritual Israelite]

I don't know anyone either, just the same, I'm of the habit of seeing both what is, and what is not, written. I prefer to note any assumptions I'm making, no matter how well founded they seem. If it doesn't actually say it, then that's what is.

Nothing wrong with being careful in your interpretation of scripture, but there's probably such thing as being too careful which can result in you not feeling sure about anything you believe. Anyway, enough about that. Back to Daniel 9:24-27.

Do you believe that Christ's death was necessary in order for any of the things listed in Daniel 9:24 to be fulfilled?

 

[amigo de christo]

What I'm referring to are those who claim faith in Jesus, and act towards others like young children in the school yard who have not yet been socialized. As if they have no regard for their behavior, or how it does or does not conform to the fruit of the Spirit, and the Law of Love. The conduct of quite a few members on this forum is in my opinion shameful, though not so much if people are actually wanting to do better.

But what I see speaks more towards a self-justified "I can talk this way if I want to!" attitude.

Much love!

always remember that DOCTRINE still matters .
Cause i am witnessing the worlds largest social club forming . its about good works and etc
Only the god they follow is NOT THE GOD who created .
While we are to be kind and etc , remember DOCTRINE matters .
This is just a reminder and not an accusation against you or anyone else .
Remember this too my friend .
Many often worry about offending folks , but sure seem to allow pratices and messages that WOULD OFFEND GOD .
Me thinks we should rather PUT GOD first , CHRIST first , from that comes the way to love one another .
again this is not an accusation against you or anyone else , but just a dire dire dire necessary reminder .

 

[amigo de christo]

@ewq1938 @amigo de christo @marks @MA2444 @The Light

Isael is under attack from Iran = Zechariah 14:1-3 is beginning before our very eyes

Behold, the day of the Lord is coming,
And your spoil will be divided in your midst.
For I will gather all the nations to battle against Jerusalem;

this will only continue to build = False prophet and Antichrist to the rescue???

These attacks will only encourage the world and all to run to sie false solution for peace n safety .
Guess what the false solution is , merge the religoins as one under the guise they all serve the same God .
beware for the work of the Spirit of anti christ can be seen in even the abraham peace accords
and the religious tolerance act . IT sure can be seen my friend . and many a conservative runs to those options .
Watch out and beware for the peace of man is a snare to the soul of all whose hope and trust was and is in man .
THEY GONNA GET YA . i been watching my friend . Shhh , they are always out there and they are always
watching . Fear them not . But do beware for the spirit of anti christ is selling its message
to all now , to the liberal to the conservative and to all on this planet .
SOON people like me who dont even believe in self defense
will be seen as naught but a deadly danger to society . just wait and see .

 

[amigo de christo]

@ewq1938 @amigo de christo @marks @MA2444 @The Light

Isael is under attack from Iran = Zechariah 14:1-3 is beginning before our very eyes

Behold, the day of the Lord is coming,
And your spoil will be divided in your midst.
For I will gather all the nations to battle against Jerusalem;

this will only continue to build = False prophet and Antichrist to the rescue???

Something very strange indeed is going on and it has been foretold .
The time wherein the trangressors have come to the full is at hand
and a king understanding dark sentences shall arise and shall decieve by and through PEACE .
This king being made mention of
is a king that also seems to do something
that i seem to see in the plans .
What does the king do that many have overlooked and perhaps not noticed .
First what is the plan to do with Israel and even within Jerusalem . TO divide the land for a peace pact .
You all have heard of this plan . You have seen the news speak of dividing up land to give to the palestines and etc .
And now a word from long long long ago and from a book that collects dust on many a shelf .
And by peace shall he destroy many .
HE shall DIVIDE the land for gain . YEAH IT SAYS THAT . IT SAYS HE SHALL DIVIDE THE LAND .

 

[amigo de christo]

First God gathers the nations against Israel
GOD allows the nations to invade Jerusalem = she will be overrun
While this is BEGINNING the false prophet and Antichrist make their debut


Gog & Magog is after the 1,000 year Reign = Revelation 20:7 When the thousand years are complete, Satan will be released from his prison, and will go out to deceive the nations in the four corners of the earth—Gog and Magog—to assemble them for battle.

And he shall divide the land for gain . its in daniel chapter eleven . this same one who by peace Destroys many .
An image to RUN the digital world and currencies , a system wherein if one does not conform they no buy and sell
and this image speaks . ARE WE SEEING PROPHECY COMING TO PASS . YOU BET WE ARE .
and most folks are so in love with this crap and see it as a solution to all the worlds ills , for world peace n safety .
EVER get the feeling a STRONG DELUSION is going on RIGHT NOW .
DO you ever get the feeling that we are MUCH father ahead than most even think .
DO you ever get the feeling that this SPIRIT of anti christ is merging all these religoins
and it DENIES THE DIRE NEED TO BELEIVE ON JESUS THE CHRIST .
SIGNS ARE ALL AROUND and most folks just go with the flow of the direction of ANTI CHRIST and think ITS LOVE , ITS LOVE
and its OF GOD . this is a real bad sign . a heavy spirit of stupor and of reprobation has been poured out
unto an unrepentant world an worse an unrepentant christendom . THE GREAT TRIBULATION
can begin at any time . THIS WORLD IS RIPE and ready , christendom and the merged religoins are ripe and ready
FOR he who cometh and has come IN HIS OWN NAME , to lead them into the final hour of all out rebellion and war
against GOD , CHRIST and the saints . THEY gonna think we the haters who do not know GOD and they DO KNOW GOD .
ITS ALL A DELUSION . and its growing fast now .

 

[amigo de christo]

First God gathers the nations against Israel
GOD allows the nations to invade Jerusalem = she will be overrun
While this is BEGINNING the false prophet and Antichrist make their debut


Gog & Magog is after the 1,000 year Reign = Revelation 20:7 When the thousand years are complete, Satan will be released from his prison, and will go out to deceive the nations in the four corners of the earth—Gog and Magog—to assemble them for battle.

What else were these great leaders of the call of unity crying . HEAL THE WOUND . HEAL THE WOUND .
i watched them david . healing the wound .
WHOSE DEADLY WOUND WAS HEALED . HEAL THE WOUND they cried as they MERGE ALL RELIGOINS TOBE AS ONE
and to sit in and under the SHADE of the HARLOT from whence this came . SIgns are all around us
and as i wrote afore , MOST RUN RIGHT TO THIS UNITY CRAP to merge as one with A HARLOT .
they see us as the non confomers who hate and themselves as lovers of GOD and humanity . ITS A DEADLY DELUSION david .
IT WILL END IN PERDITION .

 

[marks]

Nothing wrong with being careful in your interpretation of scripture, but there's probably such thing as being too careful which can result in you not feeling sure about anything you believe.

Actually, I find the opposite is true. This is how I have certainty, by seeing whether or not certain things are actually stated, or not. It can be a real eye opener to realize how much of various views are build on assumptions of things not actually stated.

Or another culprit is when someone says, "It says THIS, but means THAT."

Do you believe that Christ's death was necessary in order for any of the things listed in Daniel 9:24 to be fulfilled?

Daniel 9:24-26 KJV
24) Seventy weeks are determined upon thy people and upon thy holy city, to finish the transgression, and to make an end of sins, and to make reconciliation for iniquity, and to bring in everlasting righteousness, and to seal up the vision and prophecy, and to anoint the most Holy.
25) Know therefore and understand, that from the going forth of the commandment to restore and to build Jerusalem unto the Messiah the Prince shall be seven weeks, and threescore and two weeks: the street shall be built again, and the wall, even in troublous times.
26) And after threescore and two weeks shall Messiah be cut off, but not for himself: and the people of the prince that shall come shall destroy the city and the sanctuary; and the end thereof shall be with a flood, and unto the end of the war desolations are determined.

Romans 5:10 KJV
For if, when we were enemies, we were reconciled to God by the death of his Son, much more, being reconciled, we shall be saved by his life.

Yes.

Do you?

Much love!

 

[marks]

always remember that DOCTRINE still matters .
Cause i am witnessing the worlds largest social club forming . its about good works and etc
Only the god they follow is NOT THE GOD who created .
While we are to be kind and etc , remember DOCTRINE matters .
This is just a reminder and not an accusation against you or anyone else .
Remember this too my friend .
Many often worry about offending folks , but sure seem to allow pratices and messages that WOULD OFFEND GOD .
Me thinks we should rather PUT GOD first , CHRIST first , from that comes the way to love one another .
again this is not an accusation against you or anyone else , but just a dire dire dire necessary reminder .

We stand in truth. Amen!

Much love!

 

[David in NJ]

Ezekiel 38 and 39 spell out a Gog/Magog invasion followed by a 7 year stretch, followed by all nations against Israel, followed by Isreal being completely regathered to the promised land, when Jesus comes.

Much love!

Repeating prophecy