No mortals will survive the second coming of Christ

[tailgator]

Now back to the topic.

The mortals who come against the resurected saints in the kingdom of heaven.

Where do those mortals come from,,?


6 Blessed and holy is he that hath part in the first resurrection: on such the second death hath no power, but they shall be priests of God and of Christ, and shall reign with him a thousand years.

7 And when the thousand years are expired, Satan shall be loosed out of his prison,

8 And shall go out to deceive the nations which are in the four quarters of the earth, Gog, and Magog, to gather them together to battle: the number of whom is as the sand of the sea.

9 And they went up on the breadth of the earth, and compassed the camp of the saints about, and the beloved city: and fire came down from God out of heaven, and devoured them.

 

[CadyandZoe]

Scripture repeatedly teaches that all unbelievers will be killed when Jesus returns.

No scripture teaches that all unbelievers will be killed when Jesus returns.

Here are the passages which clearly teach that no mortals will survive the second coming of Christ.

Matthew 24:35

Does this passage speak about a universal destruction of the entire planet? I don't think so. The topic of his discussion is the coming of the "son of man" and it is critical to our understanding that we pay attention to Jesus' terminology. What does it mean, "Son of Man?" The phrase "son of man" comes from two main sources: Psalm 8, and Daniel 7.

If all mortals are destroyed when Jesus returns, then who are the sheep and the goats? (Matthew 25)
Why does Jesus tell the twelve that they will be ruling over the 12 tribes of Israel? Why them only? Why not the whole world?
Why does Daniel say that the Son of Man and the Saints of the one most high will rule over the nations under heaven?
If Jesus rules his kingdom from heaven, why return to the earth?
If Heaven and Earth pass away at his return, Why does Ezekiel say the king will come through the East Gate?

 

[jeffweeder]

You answered all.incorrectly.
Jesus is not saying all nations.He said from the east and west.If you keep changing what Jesus says then you will never know the truth.

Mathew 8:11
I say to you that many will come from the east and the west, and will take their places at the feast with Abraham, Isaac and Jacob in the kingdom of heaven.

As if people will not come from the north or south. The redeemed come from all nations.

Revelation 5:9
And they sang a new song [of glorious redemption], saying, “Worthy and deserving are You to take the scroll and to break its seals; for You were slain (sacrificed), and with Your blood You purchased people for God from every tribe and language and people and nation.

Abraham was promised the land of Canaan for an everlasting possession.

8 By faith Abraham, when he was called [by God], obeyed by going to a place which he was to receive as an inheritance; and he went, not knowing where he was going. 9 By faith he lived as a foreigner in the promised land, as in a strange land, living in tents [as nomads] with Isaac and Jacob, who were fellow heirs of the same promise. 10 For he was [waiting expectantly and confidently] looking forward to the city which has foundations, [an eternal, heavenly city] whose architect and builder is God.


But the truth is that they were longing for a better country, that is, a heavenly one. For that reason God is not ashamed [of them or] to be called their God [even to be surnamed their God—the God of Abraham, Isaac, and Jacob]; for He has prepared a city for them.

 

[Spiritual Israelite]

You said that I said.
Those were not my words.They were Jesus's words.


If you have a problem with Jesus words,take it up with Jesus

LOL. You won't even address what I said. Never did I say that Matthew 8:11-12 are your words and not Jesus' words. I pointed out how there are added details about what He said in Luke 13:28-29 and you have chosen to completely ignore that.

 

[tailgator]

As if people will not come from the north or south. The redeemed come from all nations.

Revelation 5:9
And they sang a new song [of glorious redemption], saying, “Worthy and deserving are You to take the scroll and to break its seals; for You were slain (sacrificed), and with Your blood You purchased people for God from every tribe and language and people and nation.


8 By faith Abraham, when he was called [by God], obeyed by going to a place which he was to receive as an inheritance; and he went, not knowing where he was going. 9 By faith he lived as a foreigner in the promised land, as in a strange land, living in tents [as nomads] with Isaac and Jacob, who were fellow heirs of the same promise. 10 For he was [waiting expectantly and confidently] looking forward to the city which has foundations, [an eternal, heavenly city] whose architect and builder is God.


But the truth is that they were longing for a better country, that is, a heavenly one. For that reason God is not ashamed [of them or] to be called their God [even to be surnamed their God—the God of Abraham, Isaac, and Jacob]; for He has prepared a city for them.

Well ,the city which comes down from heaven from God is not New York.
It's new Jerusalem and Jerusalem is where it shall be.


It's not going up into heaven.Its going to come down out of heaven.

2 And I John saw the holy city, new Jerusalem, coming down from God out of heaven, prepared as a bride adorned for her husband.


Abraham was promised the land of Canaan for an everlasting possession.If God wants to decorate the place then God can do it.

 

[Spiritual Israelite]

No scripture teaches that all unbelievers will be killed when Jesus returns.

There is plenty of scripture which teaches that which you can find in the original post of this thread. Please address what I said in the original post instead of just making claims that you can't back up. If you think I misinterpreted the passages I used to back up my claim in the original post, then show me how you interpret them. Your opinions mean nothing to me without any scriptural support being offered to back them up. I'm not going to specifically address your points without you specifically addressing any of mine. I have no interest in that type of discussion.

 

[tailgator]

LOL. You won't even address what I said. Never did I say that Matthew 8:11-12 are your words and not Jesus' words. I pointed out how there are added details about what He said in Luke 13:28-29 and you have chosen to completely ignore that.

I didn't say it was. It's a parallel passage to Matthew 8:11-12. The reason I brought it up was just to expose your ridiculous thing about people traveling only from the east and west to the kingdom of heaven even though Luke recorded Jesus as referencing people from the north and south as well, which Matthew did not record.

You said it was my rediculous thing about people traveling only from the east and the west to the kingdom of heaven.

As I said.Its not my words ,they are Jesus's words.

Mathew 8:11
I say to you that many will come from the east and the west, and will take their places at the feast with Abraham, Isaac and Jacob in the kingdom of heaven.


Your the only one who thinks Jesus words are ridiculous.

 

[Spiritual Israelite]

As if people will not come from the north or south. The redeemed come from all nations.

Revelation 5:9
And they sang a new song [of glorious redemption], saying, “Worthy and deserving are You to take the scroll and to break its seals; for You were slain (sacrificed), and with Your blood You purchased people for God from every tribe and language and people and nation.

I showed him the following passage multiple times and he just ignores it. He just believes what he wants to believe.

Luke 13:28 There shall be weeping and gnashing of teeth, when ye shall see Abraham, and Isaac, and Jacob, and all the prophets, in the kingdom of God, and you yourselves thrust out. 29 And they shall come from the east, and from the west, and from the north, and from the south, and shall sit down in the kingdom of God.

8 By faith Abraham, when he was called [by God], obeyed by going to a place which he was to receive as an inheritance; and he went, not knowing where he was going. 9 By faith he lived as a foreigner in the promised land, as in a strange land, living in tents [as nomads] with Isaac and Jacob, who were fellow heirs of the same promise. 10 For he was [waiting expectantly and confidently] looking forward to the city which has foundations, [an eternal, heavenly city] whose architect and builder is God.


But the truth is that they were longing for a better country, that is, a heavenly one. For that reason God is not ashamed [of them or] to be called their God [even to be surnamed their God—the God of Abraham, Isaac, and Jacob]; for He has prepared a city for them.

He ignores this passage as well. He's cherry picking certain scriptures while ignoring the rest just like the cults do.

 

[Spiritual Israelite]

You said it was my rediculous thing about people traveling only from the east and the west to the kingdom of heaven.

As I said.Its not my words ,they are Jesus's words.

Mathew 8:11
I say to you that many will come from the east and the west, and will take their places at the feast with Abraham, Isaac and Jacob in the kingdom of heaven.


Your the only one who thinks Jesus words are ridiculous.

Stop lying. I would never think that about Jesus's words, but I do think that about most of yours. You're not even paying attention to what I'm actually saying. Why not? You are clearly avoiding what it says in the following passage because it doesn't line up with your false doctrine:

Luke 13:28 There shall be weeping and gnashing of teeth, when ye shall see Abraham, and Isaac, and Jacob, and all the prophets, in the kingdom of God, and you yourselves thrust out. 29 And they shall come from the east, and from the west, and from the north, and from the south, and shall sit down in the kingdom of God.

Is this passage missing from your Bible?

 

[tailgator]

I showed him the following passage multiple times and he just ignores it. He just believes what he wants to believe.

Luke 13:28 There shall be weeping and gnashing of teeth, when ye shall see Abraham, and Isaac, and Jacob, and all the prophets, in the kingdom of God, and you yourselves thrust out. 29 And they shall come from the east, and from the west, and from the north, and from the south, and shall sit down in the kingdom of God.


He ignores this passage as well. He's cherry picking certain scriptures while ignoring the rest just like the cults do.

I never said no one will travel north or south to take their place at the feast.Infact,Egypt will need to travel north to the feast.
The Egyptians will travel north every year to keep the feast.That is after the Lord comes on the day of the Lord.

Zech 14
9 And the Lord shall be king over all the earth: in that day shall there be one Lord, and his name one.

10 All the land shall be turned as a plain from Geba to Rimmon south of Jerusalem: and it shall be lifted up, and inhabited in her place, from Benjamin's gate unto the place of the first gate, unto the corner gate, and from the tower of Hananeel unto the king's winepresses.

11 And men shall dwell in it, and there shall be no more utter destruction; but Jerusalem shall be safely inhabited.


Zech 14
16 And it shall come to pass, that every one that is left of all the nations which came against Jerusalem shall even go up from year to year to worship the King, the Lord of hosts, and to keep the feast of tabernacles.

 

[tailgator]

Stop lying. I would never think that about Jesus's words, but I do think that about most of yours. You're not even paying attention to what I'm actually saying. Why not? You are clearly avoiding what it says in the following passage because it doesn't line up with your false doctrine:

Luke 13:28 There shall be weeping and gnashing of teeth, when ye shall see Abraham, and Isaac, and Jacob, and all the prophets, in the kingdom of God, and you yourselves thrust out. 29 And they shall come from the east, and from the west, and from the north, and from the south, and shall sit down in the kingdom of God.

Is this passage missing from your Bible?

You said it and I quoted you
You knew I was quoting Jesus and yet you said it is ridiculous.

Your ridiculous.You don't even know the Lord is coming to Jerusalem.

Zech 14
5 And ye shall flee to the valley of the mountains; for the valley of the mountains shall reach unto Azal: yea, ye shall flee, like as ye fled from before the earthquake in the days of Uzziah king of Judah: and the Lord my God shall come, and all the saints with thee.

6 And it shall come to pass in that day, that the light shall not be clear, nor dark:

7 But it shall be one day which shall be known to the Lord, not day, nor night: but it shall come to pass, that at evening time it shall be light.

8 And it shall be in that day, that living waters shall go out from Jerusalem; half of them toward the former sea, and half of them toward the hinder sea: in summer and in winter shall it be.

9 And the Lord shall be king over all the earth: in that day shall there be one Lord, and his name one.

 

[Spiritual Israelite]

I never said no one will travel north or south to take their place at the feast.Infact,Egypt will need to travel north to the feast.

Why did it take you this long to acknowledge that it also talks about people from the north and the south after I showed you Luke 13:28-29 at least 3 or 4 times? You kept acting like you disagreed with me every other time I pointed that out. What a waste of time.

 

[Spiritual Israelite]

You said it and I quoted you
You knew I was quoting Jesus and yet you said it is ridiculous.

Get a clue. You know I'm only saying your interpretation of His words is ridiculous. Don't be a child and claim that I'm saying Jesus Himself was ridiculous. You know darn well that no one here, including me, would ever claim that.

Your ridiculous.You don't even know the Lord is coming to Jerusalem.

Zech 14
5 And ye shall flee to the valley of the mountains; for the valley of the mountains shall reach unto Azal: yea, ye shall flee, like as ye fled from before the earthquake in the days of Uzziah king of Judah: and the Lord my God shall come, and all the saints with thee.

6 And it shall come to pass in that day, that the light shall not be clear, nor dark:

7 But it shall be one day which shall be known to the Lord, not day, nor night: but it shall come to pass, that at evening time it shall be light.

8 And it shall be in that day, that living waters shall go out from Jerusalem; half of them toward the former sea, and half of them toward the hinder sea: in summer and in winter shall it be.

9 And the Lord shall be king over all the earth: in that day shall there be one Lord, and his name one.

Address the scriptures I posted in the original post if you want to be taken seriously. Show how you reconcile them with your view. There are multiple problems with interpreting Zechariah 14 as referring to a time after Christ returns because it contradicts other scripture. I will go into that if you would just specifically address how you interpret the passages I referenced in the original post. Don't just quote them and say they don't say all unbelievers are killed when Jesus returns and leave it at that. That's useless and proves nothing. Exegete them like I did so I can see exactly how you interpret them.

 

[tailgator]

Why did it take you this long to acknowledge that it also talks about people from the north and the south after I showed you Luke 13:28-29 at least 3 or 4 times? You kept acting like you disagreed with me every other time I pointed that out. What a waste of time.

I didn't need to say anything.
I knew the egyptians would travel north every year to keep the feast .Jesus even talked about this gathering and I quoted Jesus.
But you say no one will travel in any direction.


From.year to year.

16 And it shall come to pass, that every one that is left of all the nations which came against Jerusalem shall even go up from year to year to worship the King, the Lord of hosts, and to keep the feast of tabernacles.

 

[tailgator]

Get a clue. You know I'm only saying your interpretation of His words is ridiculous. Don't be a child and claim that I'm saying Jesus Himself was ridiculous. You know darn well that no one here, including me, would ever claim that.


Address the scriptures I posted in the original post if you want to be taken seriously. Show how you reconcile them with your view. There are multiple problems with interpreting Zechariah 14 as referring to a time after Christ returns because it contradicts other scripture. I will go into that if you would just specifically address how you interpret the passages I referenced in the original post. Don't just quote them and say they don't say all unbelievers are killed when Jesus returns and leave it at that. That's useless and proves nothing. Exegete them like I did so I can see exactly how you interpret them.

My interpretation of Jesus word is his actual word.

I have addressed the destruction of the beast in revelation 19 when Christ comes and the resurected saints who dwell in the kingdom of heaven in revelation 20.Also the mortals who invade the kingdom in revelation 20.

The same resurected saints,Christs coming ,and the same Gog in revelation 20 are all in Ezekiel 37-38.

 

[Spiritual Israelite]

I didn't need to say anything.

You could have not acted like you were disagreeing with me when I brought up Luke 13:28-29 to support what I was saying. Instead of doing that, you posted Matthew 8:11-12 in response as if you were disagreeing that Luke 13:28-29 is about the same thing as Matthew 8:11-12 except that it has an added detail about people in the kingdom not only being from the east and west, but also the north and south.

I knew the egyptians would travel north every year to keep the feast .Jesus even talked about this gathering and I quoted Jesus.
But you say no one will travel in any direction.


From.year to year.

16 And it shall come to pass, that every one that is left of all the nations which came against Jerusalem shall even go up from year to year to worship the King, the Lord of hosts, and to keep the feast of tabernacles.

So, you think what Jesus said in the following passage was only supposed to occur until He returns and then it will no longer be true anymore at that point?

John 4:19 The woman saith unto him, Sir, I perceive that thou art a prophet. 20 Our fathers worshipped in this mountain; and ye say, that in Jerusalem is the place where men ought to worship. 21 Jesus saith unto her, Woman, believe me, the hour cometh, when ye shall neither in this mountain, nor yet at Jerusalem, worship the Father. 22 Ye worship ye know not what: we know what we worship: for salvation is of the Jews. 23 But the hour cometh, and now is, when the true worshippers shall worship the Father in spirit and in truth: for the Father seeketh such to worship him. 24 God is a Spirit: and they that worship him must worship him in spirit and in truth.

Jesus indicated that at that point God was not requiring people to go to Jerusalem to worship Him any longer and instead required "they that worship him must worship him in spirit and in truth". Why would this no longer be true when Jesus returns? What would be the reason to go back to the old way of doing things, including making animal sacrifices, as is required when keeping the feast of tabernacles? Why would God go back to the inferior old covenant ways when Jesus returns after His sacrifice established the better new covenant long ago (Heb 8:6-7)?

 

[Spiritual Israelite]

My interpretation of Jesus word is his actual word.

I have addressed the destruction of the beast in revelation 19 when Christ comes and the resurected saints who dwell in the kingdom of heaven in revelation 20.Also the mortals who invade the kingdom in revelation 20.

The same resurected saints,Christs coming ,and the same Gog in revelation 20 are all in Ezekiel 37-38.

That isn't addressing anything. All you're doing is sharing your assumptions while doing zero exegesis. Where is Satan's binding and loosing in Ezekiel 37-38? How does your interpretation of those passages agree with what is written in passages like these:

Matthew 24:35 Heaven and earth shall pass away, but my words shall not pass away. 36 But of that day and hour knoweth no man, no, not the angels of heaven, but my Father only. 37 But as the days of Noah were, so shall also the coming of the Son of man be. 38 For as in the days that were before the flood they were eating and drinking, marrying and giving in marriage, until the day that Noe entered into the ark,
39 And knew not until the flood came, and took them all away; so shall also the coming of the Son of man be.

2 Thessalonians 1:7 And to you who are troubled rest with us, when the Lord Jesus shall be revealed from heaven with his mighty angels,
8 In flaming fire taking vengeance on them that know not God, and that obey not the gospel of our Lord Jesus Christ: 9 Who shall be punished with everlasting destruction from the presence of the Lord, and from the glory of his power; 10 When he shall come to be glorified in his saints, and to be admired in all them that believe (because our testimony among you was believed) in that day.

2 Peter 3:10 But the day of the Lord will come as a thief in the night; in the which the heavens shall pass away with a great noise, and the elements shall melt with fervent heat, the earth also and the works that are therein shall be burned up. 11 Seeing then that all these things shall be dissolved, what manner of persons ought ye to be in all holy conversation and godliness, 12 Looking for and hasting unto the coming of the day of God, wherein the heavens being on fire shall be dissolved, and the elements shall melt with fervent heat? 13 Nevertheless we, according to his promise, look for new heavens and a new earth, wherein dwelleth righteousness.

Please show me how these passages allow for any unbelievers to survive the return of Christ.

 

[jeffweeder]

It's not going up into heaven.Its going to come down out of heaven.

2 And I John saw the holy city, new Jerusalem, coming down from God out of heaven, prepared as a bride adorned for her husband.

The redeemed are the NJ, caught up in the air to possess the place prepared which is the NHNE.
Rev 21
Then I saw a new heaven and a new earth; for the first heaven and the first earth had passed away (vanished), and there is no longer any sea. 2 And I saw the holy city, new Jerusalem, coming down out of heaven from God, arrayed like a bride adorned for her husband; 3 and then I heard a loud voice from the throne, saying, “See! The tabernacle of God is among men, and He will live among them, and they will be His people, and God Himself will be with them [as their God,] 4 and He will wipe away every tear from their eyes; and there will no longer be death; there will no longer be sorrow and anguish, or crying, or pain; for the former order of things has passed away.”

No deathly mortals on it.

The New Jerusalem​

9 Then one of the seven angels who had the seven bowls filled with the seven final plagues came and spoke with me, saying, “Come here, I will show you the bride, the wife of the Lamb.” 10 And he carried me away in the Spirit to a vast and lofty mountain, and showed me the holy (sanctified) city of Jerusalem coming down out of heaven from God, 11 having God’s glory [filled with His radiant light].

 

[tailgator]

You could have not acted like you were disagreeing with me when I brought up Luke 13:28-29 to support what I was saying. Instead of doing that, you posted Matthew 8:11-12 in response as if you were disagreeing that Luke 13:28-29 is about the same thing as Matthew 8:11-12 except that it has an added detail about people in the kingdom not only being from the east and west, but also the north and south.


So, you think what Jesus said in the following passage was only supposed to occur until He returns and then it will no longer be true anymore at that point?

John 4:19 The woman saith unto him, Sir, I perceive that thou art a prophet. 20 Our fathers worshipped in this mountain; and ye say, that in Jerusalem is the place where men ought to worship. 21 Jesus saith unto her, Woman, believe me, the hour cometh, when ye shall neither in this mountain, nor yet at Jerusalem, worship the Father. 22 Ye worship ye know not what: we know what we worship: for salvation is of the Jews. 23 But the hour cometh, and now is, when the true worshippers shall worship the Father in spirit and in truth: for the Father seeketh such to worship him. 24 God is a Spirit: and they that worship him must worship him in spirit and in truth.

Jesus indicated that at that point God was not requiring people to go to Jerusalem to worship Him any longer and instead required "they that worship him must worship him in spirit and in truth". Why would this no longer be true when Jesus returns? What would be the reason to go back to the old way of doing things, including making animal sacrifices, as is required when keeping the feast of tabernacles? Why would God go back to the inferior old covenant ways when Jesus returns after His sacrifice established the better new covenant long ago (Heb 8:6-7)?

If you don't want to attend the feast in the kingdom of heaven with Abraham,your not forced to.

You already said no one will travel to the feast.

Zech 14
16 And it shall come to pass, that every one that is left of all the nations which came against Jerusalem shall even go up from year to year to worship the King, the Lord of hosts, and to keep the feast of tabernacles.

 

[tailgator]

The redeemed are the NJ, caught up in the air to possess the place prepared which is the NHNE.
Rev 21
Then I saw a new heaven and a new earth; for the first heaven and the first earth had passed away (vanished), and there is no longer any sea. 2 And I saw the holy city, new Jerusalem, coming down out of heaven from God, arrayed like a bride adorned for her husband; 3 and then I heard a loud voice from the throne, saying, “See! The tabernacle of God is among men, and He will live among them, and they will be His people, and God Himself will be with them [as their God,] 4 and He will wipe away every tear from their eyes; and there will no longer be death; there will no longer be sorrow and anguish, or crying, or pain; for the former order of things has passed away.”

No deathly mortals on it.

The New Jerusalem​

9 Then one of the seven angels who had the seven bowls filled with the seven final plagues came and spoke with me, saying, “Come here, I will show you the bride, the wife of the Lamb.” 10 And he carried me away in the Spirit to a vast and lofty mountain, and showed me the holy (sanctified) city of Jerusalem coming down out of heaven from God, 11 having God’s glory [filled with His radiant light].

No.New Jerusalem does not go up to heaven.

It only comes down out of heaven.

It comes down out of heaven a thousand years after the resurected saints of God receive the promised land