Some key points pertaining to the parable per Luke 19:11-27.

[face2face]

Yes, some Jews entered the land that all of the Old Testament talks about. The Promise Land, the land flowing with milk and honey, the kingdom of heaven, heavenly Jerusalem that Jesus brought in.

Will bring - it's coming!

 

[Johann]

It’s speaking of the harvest coming in faster than the planters can plant.

Abundant Harvest: The imagery of the plowman catching up to the reaper and the treader of grapes overtaking the planter symbolizes an extraordinarily productive and fruitful time. Normally, the sequence of agricultural activities—plowing, planting, reaping, and harvesting—occurs in a specific order and time frame. The statement that the plowman will catch up to the reaper indicates an abundance where the cycle of agricultural work is so accelerated that the process seems out of order. This could suggest that the land is so fruitful that crops are harvested at an unprecedented rate, and the growth is so abundant that planting and harvesting cycles overlap.

Divine Blessing: The verse indicates a time of divine blessing and favor. Such an abundant harvest where agricultural activities overlap implies a period of great prosperity and blessing from God. It reflects a time when God’s blessings will overflow, surpassing normal expectations and resulting in material and spiritual abundance.

Transformation and Restoration: This passage is also seen as part of a broader prophetic message about the restoration of Israel. In the context of Amos, it follows a period of judgment and calamity. The promise of such incredible agricultural success symbolizes the restoration of the nation and a reversal of past misfortunes. It points to a time when God's people will experience not only restoration but also a flourishing of their land and lives.

Symbol of Spiritual Prosperity: While the immediate reference is to physical abundance, there’s also a symbolic or spiritual dimension to this imagery. The abundance of wine and the overflowing of blessings can symbolize spiritual richness and renewal. In a broader context, it can indicate a time of spiritual revival and growth where the outpouring of God’s blessings is not just material but also deeply spiritual.

Eschatological View: In some interpretations, this verse is seen as an eschatological prophecy, referring to a future age of peace and prosperity in the Messianic Kingdom. The imagery of abundance is often associated with future promises of a new age when God’s reign will bring about a transformed world where the effects of sin and scarcity are no more.

Shalom @IndianaRob
J.

 

[IndianaRob]

Correct a time of great security and prosperity for Israel = Kingdom age!

I disagree, it talks about the harvest into the kingdom of God where the laborers are few and the harvest is great. Jesus was quoting that verse here:

Luk 10:2 Therefore said he unto them, The harvest truly is great, but the labourers are few: pray ye therefore the Lord of the harvest, that he would send forth labourers into his harvest.

 

[IndianaRob]

Will bring - it's coming!

Are you telling me that born again Christians aren’t living in the promise land right now?

 

[IndianaRob]

Abundant Harvest: The imagery of the plowman catching up to the reaper and the treader of grapes overtaking the planter symbolizes an extraordinarily productive and fruitful time. Normally, the sequence of agricultural activities—plowing, planting, reaping, and harvesting—occurs in a specific order and time frame. The statement that the plowman will catch up to the reaper indicates an abundance where the cycle of agricultural work is so accelerated that the process seems out of order. This could suggest that the land is so fruitful that crops are harvested at an unprecedented rate, and the growth is so abundant that planting and harvesting cycles overlap.

Divine Blessing: The verse indicates a time of divine blessing and favor. Such an abundant harvest where agricultural activities overlap implies a period of great prosperity and blessing from God. It reflects a time when God’s blessings will overflow, surpassing normal expectations and resulting in material and spiritual abundance.

Transformation and Restoration: This passage is also seen as part of a broader prophetic message about the restoration of Israel. In the context of Amos, it follows a period of judgment and calamity. The promise of such incredible agricultural success symbolizes the restoration of the nation and a reversal of past misfortunes. It points to a time when God's people will experience not only restoration but also a flourishing of their land and lives.

Symbol of Spiritual Prosperity: While the immediate reference is to physical abundance, there’s also a symbolic or spiritual dimension to this imagery. The abundance of wine and the overflowing of blessings can symbolize spiritual richness and renewal. In a broader context, it can indicate a time of spiritual revival and growth where the outpouring of God’s blessings is not just material but also deeply spiritual.

Eschatological View: In some interpretations, this verse is seen as an eschatological prophecy, referring to a future age of peace and prosperity in the Messianic Kingdom. The imagery of abundance is often associated with future promises of a new age when God’s reign will bring about a transformed world where the effects of sin and scarcity are no more.

Shalom @IndianaRob
J.

Jesus was quoting Amos 9:13 when he said:

Luk 10:2 Therefore said he unto them, The harvest truly is great, but the labourers are few: pray ye therefore the Lord of the harvest, that he would send forth labourers into his harvest.

 

[face2face]

I disagree, it talks about the harvest into the kingdom of God where the laborers are few and the harvest is great. Jesus was quoting that verse here:

Luk 10:2 Therefore said he unto them, The harvest truly is great, but the labourers are few: pray ye therefore the Lord of the harvest, that he would send forth labourers into his harvest.

True, like John the Baptist started the work Elijah would finish in restoring all things.

Unsuccessful as this harvest was, Zech is talking about the complete harvest! Israel planted NEVER to be removed from the land!

Nice try though

F2F

 

[IndianaRob]

True, like John the Baptist started the work Elijah would finish in restoring all things.

Unsuccessful as this harvest was, Zech is talking about the complete harvest! Israel planted NEVER to be removed from the land!

Nice try though

F2F

I have to go with what the Bible says. If God wasn’t done with nation of Israel forever then he wouldn’t have said he was done with the nation of Israel forever. How can you expect me to believe otherwise?

 

[Johann]

Jesus was quoting Amos 9:13 when he said:

Luk 10:2 Therefore said he unto them, The harvest truly is great, but the labourers are few: pray ye therefore the Lord of the harvest, that he would send forth labourers into his harvest.

No-this is what is called as proof texting.



Luke 10:2 (NKJV):
"Therefore He said to them, 'The harvest truly is great, but the laborers are few; therefore pray the Lord of the harvest to send out laborers into His harvest.'"

Amos 9:13 (NKJV):
"Behold, the days are coming," says the Lord, "When the plowman shall overtake the reaper, And the treader of grapes him who sows seed; The mountains shall drip with sweet wine, And all the hills shall flow with it."

Comparison and Context
Imagery of Harvest:

Luke 10:2 uses the metaphor of a harvest to describe the work needed to spread the Gospel and the lack of workers to accomplish it. This metaphor signifies the abundance of souls ready to receive the message of the Kingdom of God and the need for more laborers to reach them.

Amos 9:13 speaks of a time of such great agricultural abundance that the plowman overtakes the reaper, indicating an overwhelming and abundant harvest. This passage is a prophetic vision of prosperity and restoration for Israel, depicting a time of blessing and abundance in the land.

Different Contexts and Purposes:

Amos 9:13 is a prophetic statement concerning the restoration and blessing of Israel, using the imagery of abundant harvest and prosperity as a sign of divine favor and restoration.

Luke 10:2 is a call for more workers to engage in the spiritual harvest of souls. Jesus uses the harvest metaphor to highlight the urgency and necessity of laborers in the mission of spreading the Gospel, rather than focusing on physical abundance or restoration.
Biblical Metaphors:

The metaphor of harvest is used throughout the Bible to represent both physical and spiritual abundance. For example, in the Old Testament, harvest imagery often relates to agricultural prosperity and divine blessing, while in the New Testament, it frequently represents the gathering of people into the Kingdom of God (e.g., Matthew 9:37-38; John 4:35).

While Jesus' use of the harvest metaphor in Luke 10:2 and the imagery of abundant harvest in Amos 9:13 share thematic similarities, Jesus does not directly quote Amos 9:13.

Instead, Jesus employs the metaphor of harvest within the context of His mission to emphasize the need for laborers to spread the Gospel, while Amos' prophecy concerns a future time of abundant blessing and restoration for Israel.

The connection lies more in the shared use of agricultural imagery rather than a direct quotation or explicit reference.

J.

 

[IndianaRob]

No-this is what is called as proof texting.



Luke 10:2 (NKJV):
"Therefore He said to them, 'The harvest truly is great, but the laborers are few; therefore pray the Lord of the harvest to send out laborers into His harvest.'"

Amos 9:13 (NKJV):
"Behold, the days are coming," says the Lord, "When the plowman shall overtake the reaper, And the treader of grapes him who sows seed; The mountains shall drip with sweet wine, And all the hills shall flow with it."

Comparison and Context
Imagery of Harvest:

Luke 10:2 uses the metaphor of a harvest to describe the work needed to spread the Gospel and the lack of workers to accomplish it. This metaphor signifies the abundance of souls ready to receive the message of the Kingdom of God and the need for more laborers to reach them.

Amos 9:13 speaks of a time of such great agricultural abundance that the plowman overtakes the reaper, indicating an overwhelming and abundant harvest. This passage is a prophetic vision of prosperity and restoration for Israel, depicting a time of blessing and abundance in the land.

Different Contexts and Purposes:

Amos 9:13 is a prophetic statement concerning the restoration and blessing of Israel, using the imagery of abundant harvest and prosperity as a sign of divine favor and restoration.

Luke 10:2 is a call for more workers to engage in the spiritual harvest of souls. Jesus uses the harvest metaphor to highlight the urgency and necessity of laborers in the mission of spreading the Gospel, rather than focusing on physical abundance or restoration.
Biblical Metaphors:

The metaphor of harvest is used throughout the Bible to represent both physical and spiritual abundance. For example, in the Old Testament, harvest imagery often relates to agricultural prosperity and divine blessing, while in the New Testament, it frequently represents the gathering of people into the Kingdom of God (e.g., Matthew 9:37-38; John 4:35).

While Jesus' use of the harvest metaphor in Luke 10:2 and the imagery of abundant harvest in Amos 9:13 share thematic similarities, Jesus does not directly quote Amos 9:13.

Instead, Jesus employs the metaphor of harvest within the context of His mission to emphasize the need for laborers to spread the Gospel, while Amos' prophecy concerns a future time of abundant blessing and restoration for Israel.

The connection lies more in the shared use of agricultural imagery rather than a direct quotation or explicit reference.

J.

But both passages are talking about a time when the harvest is great and the laborers are few aren’t they?

 

[Johann]

But both passages are talking about a time when the harvest is great and the laborers are few aren’t they?

I'll get back to you tomorrow-12.46 AM
J.

 

[face2face]

Are you telling me that born again Christians aren’t living in the promise land right now?

13:28 There will be weeping and gnashing of teeth when you see Abraham, Isaac, Jacob, and all the prophets in the kingdom of God but you yourselves thrown out. 13:29 Then people will come from east and west, and from north and south, and take their places at the banquet table in the kingdom of God. 13:30 But indeed, some are last who will be first, and some are first who will be last.” Lk 13:28–30.

Have you seen Abraham yet?

 

[IndianaRob]

I'll get back to you tomorrow-12.46 AM
J.

Have a good night!

 

[face2face]

I have to go with what the Bible says. If God wasn’t done with nation of Israel forever then he wouldn’t have said he was done with the nation of Israel forever. How can you expect me to believe otherwise?

You have been shown.

 

[Johann]

You have been shown.

An aside-what OT Bible commentaries would you recommend brother?
J.

 

[IndianaRob]

13:28 There will be weeping and gnashing of teeth when you see Abraham, Isaac, Jacob, and all the prophets in the kingdom of God but you yourselves thrown out. 13:29 Then people will come from east and west, and from north and south, and take their places at the banquet table in the kingdom of God. 13:30 But indeed, some are last who will be first, and some are first who will be last.” Lk 13:28–30.

Have you seen Abraham yet?

You do realize that verse is referring to the wicked Jews being kick out of the kingdom and the kingdom being given to the righteous Jews and Gentiles from the east and west.

This is not a literal meal, it’s feasting on the word of God.

 

[IndianaRob]

You have been shown.

Let’s just agree to disagree and move on.

 

[face2face]

You do realize that verse is referring to the wicked Jews being kick out of the kingdom and the kingdom being given to the righteous Jews and Gentiles from the east and west.

This is not a literal meal, it’s feasting on the word of God.

The man who was promised the Land is not yet walking on it.

Has Abraham received the promises?

The answer is no...yet to be fulfilled.

Can you think of an NT quote which states that?

F2F

 

[Johann]

Has Abraham received the promises?

The answer is no...yet to be fulfilled.

Blessings

The blessings promised to Abraham are seen as fulfilled through Jesus Christ. Christians believe that Jesus, being a descendant of Abraham, is the ultimate fulfillment of the promise that “in you all the families of the earth shall be blessed.”

Galatians 3:16 (NKJV): “Now to Abraham and his Seed were the promises made. He does not say, ‘And to seeds,’ as of many, but as of one, ‘And to your Seed,’ who is Christ.”

Galatians 3:29 (NKJV): “And if you are Christ’s, then you are Abraham’s seed, and heirs according to the promise.”

So- summary, the promises made to Abraham regarding land, descendants, and blessings have seen partial fulfillment but are also understood to have ongoing and future aspects. The land promise was partially fulfilled in the historical settlement of Israel but awaits further eschatological fulfillment. The promise of descendants has been realized in a broad sense, including spiritual descendants through faith. The blessing to all nations is seen as fulfilled through Christ, according to Christian theology.

J.

 

[IndianaRob]

Blessings

The blessings promised to Abraham are seen as fulfilled through Jesus Christ. Christians believe that Jesus, being a descendant of Abraham, is the ultimate fulfillment of the promise that “in you all the families of the earth shall be blessed.”

Galatians 3:16 (NKJV): “Now to Abraham and his Seed were the promises made. He does not say, ‘And to seeds,’ as of many, but as of one, ‘And to your Seed,’ who is Christ.”

Galatians 3:29 (NKJV): “And if you are Christ’s, then you are Abraham’s seed, and heirs according to the promise.”

So- summary, the promises made to Abraham regarding land, descendants, and blessings have seen partial fulfillment but are also understood to have ongoing and future aspects. The land promise was partially fulfilled in the historical settlement of Israel but awaits further eschatological fulfillment. The promise of descendants has been realized in a broad sense, including spiritual descendants through faith. The blessing to all nations is seen as fulfilled through Christ, according to Christian theology.

J.

You’re gonna regret this in the morning… go get some sleep!

 

[face2face]

You’re gonna regret this in the morning… go get some sleep!

And these all were commended for their faith, yet they did not receive what was promised. 11:40 For God had provided something better for us, so that they would be made perfect together with us. Heb 11:39–40.

Can you see it?