Elect or Not Elect: Why ALL Should Be Alarmed

[FaithWillDo]

dude.

Youhave accused him multiples times

multiple times he has denied your accusations or that he believes what you say he believes/

yet you keep comming at him as if you know what he believes more than he does.

now you attack him.

Get real man, if your not going to listen to him, I suggest you move on. Your making a fool of yourself.

Dear Eternally Grateful,
I never accused him of anything. I pointed out that the pathway to salvation goes through the apostate church. Everyone will experience it. To deny that truth is to deny the truth of God's Word.

As for knowing what He believes, I do. I have had several discussions with Him in the past. His beliefs are in line with the primary teachings of the apostate church. This is not an accusation, it is simply the truth.

I have only met ONE converted believer on this forum. Everyone else I've met is still in an apostate condition and waiting for the second coming of the Lord to convert them. But as this thread title mentions, everyone should be alarmed because no one knows if they are one of the Elect before their conversion takes place. Only after Christ comes to the person a second time can they know. That is why Paul said to work out your own salvation with fear and trembling.

As for the beliefs of apostate believers, they can't accept that Christ causes the Elect to travel the same pathway to salvation because apostate believers mix in their own works with faith. They falsely believe that they direct their steps. And as the Apostle John said, apostate believers reject the concept of the Early Rain of the Spirit. Most apostate believers think they were converted at their moment of belief and/or water baptism. But scripture says that is only when they receive the Early Rain of the Spirit. The Early Rain of the Spirit will give them faith and certain spiritual gifts but it does not convert them. They will remain carnally minded and spiritually blind. In that condition, Satan will deceive them. It happens to everyone because it is God's "will" for it to happen.

As for your comments, they are insulting and disrespectful. You should reflect on that the next time you pray.

Joe

 

[GodsGrace]

@GodsGrace you say

Why are you so afraid of the word WORKS when that's all Jesus taught?


The word says.

Ephesians 2​

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King James Version​

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​

2 And you hath he quickened, who were dead in trespasses and sins;
2 Wherein in time past ye walked according to the course of this world, according to the prince of the power of the air, the spirit that now worketh in the children of disobedience:
3 Among whom also we all had our conversation in times past in the lusts of our flesh, fulfilling the desires of the flesh and of the mind; and were by nature the children of wrath, even as others.
4 But God, who is rich in mercy, for his great love wherewith he loved us,
5 Even when we were dead in sins, hath quickened us together with Christ, (by grace ye are saved;)
6 And hath raised us up together, and made us sit together in heavenly places in Christ Jesus:
7 That in the ages to come he might shew the exceeding riches of his grace in his kindness toward us through Christ Jesus.
8 For by grace are ye saved through faith; and that not of yourselves: it is the gift of God:
9 Not of works, lest any man should boast.
10 For we are his workmanship, created in Christ Jesus unto good works, which God hath before ordained that we should walk in them.
11 Wherefore remember, that ye being in time past Gentiles in the flesh, who are called Uncircumcision by that which is called the Circumcision in the flesh made by hands;
12 That at that time ye were without Christ, being aliens from the commonwealth of Israel, and strangers from the covenants of promise, having no hope, and without God in the world:
13 But now in Christ Jesus ye who sometimes were far off are made nigh by the blood of Christ.
14 For he is our peace, who hath made both one, and hath broken down the middle wall of partition between us;
15 Having abolished in his flesh the enmity, even the law of commandments contained in ordinances; for to make in himself of twain one new man, so making peace;
16 And that he might reconcile both unto God in one body by the cross, having slain the enmity thereby:
17 And came and preached peace to you which were afar off, and to them that were nigh.
18 For through him we both have access by one Spirit unto the Father.
19 Now therefore ye are no more strangers and foreigners, but fellowcitizens with the saints, and of the household of God;
20 And are built upon the foundation of the apostles and prophets, Jesus Christ himself being the chief corner stone;
21 In whom all the building fitly framed together groweth unto an holy temple in the Lord:
22 In whom ye also are builded together for an habitation of God through the Spirit.

The above is by Paul....who agrees with Jesus.
Could you imagine if he didn't !
But I've posted MANY verses that state that we are to do good and they're by JESUS....
Our Lord, of Whom we are disciples. This means that we learn from Him and follow Him.

 

[Ritajanice]

The above is by Paul....who agrees with Jesus.
Could you imagine if he didn't !
But I've posted MANY verses that state that we are to do good and they're by JESUS....
Our Lord, of Whom we are disciples. This means that we learn from Him and follow Him.

How do you learn by him?
how do you even know that Jesus existed?

 

[Ritajanice]

I don't know ANY Christian that believes we are saved by works.
We are saved by faith.

We are given faith a gift from God, when we become Born Again....how can you have faith in God without knowing him first in our spirit?

He doesn’t even recognise us without being Born Of The Spirit.

However, look at verse 10.....we are created unto good works.

So,,,,are works good or bad?

Are good deeds works or are they necessary because we were created for them?

Did Jesus teach that we are to engage in good deeds, or did He say it's a sin?
(which some do claim - that doing good is sinful because we're not depending on God).

Did you read the scripture I posted?

 

[Ritajanice]

This is a weird concept Rita,
I mean that anyone can read scripture and come to their very own conclusion as to what it states.

What is weird?

Do you realize that this means there is NO TRUTH?
If we can make up our own truths, then we have no truth available to us.

Please explain?

The comment made to the other member sounded very innocent to me and l thought I'd point out that the other member's post and you're liking it means that you agree on Calvinism.

I agree with the penned word.

A man-made religion that came about more or less at 1,500 years after the church was established after Jesus ascended and the Apostles taught others, and so on.

What has that got to do with what I posted?

What Calvinism teaches was NEVER taught in the early church.

You want verses?
Look up my posts here and you'll find plenty if you care to respond to them.

Nothing about Calvinism is biblical.
So you're going by Calvin's word....not God's word.

Show me where I’m going by Calvin’s word...you keep telling me that now show me please?

And what I post is not opinion....

You have posted your opinion that I follow Calvin...where is your back up?

I back up everything I state with verses and exegesis.

I don't see Calvinists doing that.
They just throw verses back at me.
Because they CANNOT explain plain, simple to understand verses,
because their theology is incorrect and an affront to God.

Then show me and discuss instead of throwing accusations around about other members.
.
What aren’t you understanding what I post?

 

[FaithWillDo]

I have learnt that when we start forcing others to believe as “ we” believe...you’re / were on rocky ground, the Lord speaks to his children in ways that they understand..imo....you’re way / my way belong to us....just as the way God teaches others...belongs to them.....everyone here is being brought to understand God’s word His way..,

Not your way!...not my way!...

You’re telling her that God has not made her receptive to his truth.....”says you” ...not God...not looking for confrontation...just trying a pointer that is all...note to self also....

Dear Ritajanice,
I have no power to force anyone to believe as I do. I merely do as God's Word commands and present the truth of what Christ teaches. It is SOLELY up to Christ if He will cause the person to accept it. Mankind has no say in the matter even though they think they do.

There is only one truth and Christ leads a believer to it in only one way. It is that one truth that sanctifies a believer and judges them to make their ways righteous. Without the knowledge of the truth, a person cannot be saved. Truth is only given to a believer by Christ after they have received both the Early and Latter Rains of the Spirit. This is what God's Word teaches and that is why I teach it, too.

Eph 4:13 Till we all come in the unity of the faith, and of the knowledge of the Son of God, unto a perfect man, unto the measure of the stature of the fulness of Christ:

Only the Elect will come unto the knowledge of the Son of God and that occurs after they are converted. Until that time, the unconverted Elect will experience the "confusion of languages" in the apostate church just like the "many" who are not chosen experience it. Man does not direct their own steps.

Joe

 

[Ritajanice]

Dear Ritajanice,
I have no power to force anyone to believe as I do. I merely do as God's Word commands and present the truth of what Christ teaches. It is SOLELY up to Christ if He will cause the person to accept it. Mankind has no say in the matter even though they think they do.

There is only one truth and Christ leads a believer to it in only one way. It is that one truth that sanctifies a believer and judges them to make their ways righteous. Without the knowledge of the truth, a person cannot be saved. Truth is only given to a believer by Christ after they have received both the Early and Latter Rains of the Spirit. This is what God's Word teaches and that is why I teach it, too.

I believe truth is only given to us when we become Born Again , only the Holy Spirit by divine revelation can witness that truth to our hearts / spirit...when he testifies with our spirit that we are Gods children/ Born Again.

Eph 4:13 Till we all come in the unity of the faith, and of the knowledge of the Son of God, unto a perfect man, unto the measure of the stature of the fulness of Christ:

Only the Elect will come unto the knowledge of the Son of God and that occurs after they are converted. Until that time, the unconverted Elect will experience the "confusion of languages" in the apostate church just like the "many" who are not chosen experience it. Man does not direct their own steps.

Joe

Yes, I believe the elect are chosen for Gods purpose and plan...a Born Again Glorifies the Father through the Spirit that indwells our spirit , only he can reveal Gods truth to our heart/ spirit.

Because we are Born Again we crave the teachings from the Spirit....remember God loved us first in our heart/ spirit, when we were Born Again of imperishable seed that liveth and abideth forever.

In our spirit/ heart...we know the Love Of God , because we have Gods Witness His Living Holy Spirit witnessing Gods love to our heart/ spirit all day every day.

Only He can witness Gods truth to our heart/ spirit...only He can teach, we listen to no other.

 

[Taken]

Dear Taken,
Your foul language and insulting posts show your "denial".

LOL…
Boo hoo…Pointing out your own rubbish has insulted you. Too bad. You own it.

I have presented …

You are a false accuser and gaslighter…

 

[Eternally Grateful]

Dear Eternally Grateful,
I never accused him of anything. I pointed out that the pathway to salvation goes through the apostate church. Everyone will experience it. To deny that truth is to deny the truth of God's Word.

As for knowing what He believes, I do. I have had several discussions with Him in the past. His beliefs are in line with the primary teachings of the apostate church. This is not an accusation, it is simply the truth.

I have only met ONE converted believer on this forum. Everyone else I've met is still in an apostate condition and waiting for the second coming of the Lord to convert them. But as this thread title mentions, everyone should be alarmed because no one knows if they are one of the Elect before their conversion takes place. Only after Christ comes to the person a second time can they know. That is why Paul said to work out your own salvation with fear and trembling.

As for the beliefs of apostate believers, they can't accept that Christ causes the Elect to travel the same pathway to salvation because apostate believers mix in their own works with faith. They falsely believe that they direct their steps. And as the Apostle John said, apostate believers reject the concept of the Early Rain of the Spirit. Most apostate believers think they were converted at their moment of belief and/or water baptism. But scripture says that is only when they receive the Early Rain of the Spirit. The Early Rain of the Spirit will give them faith and certain spiritual gifts but it does not convert them. They will remain carnally minded and spiritually blind. In that condition, Satan will deceive them. It happens to everyone because it is God's "will" for it to happen.

As for your comments, they are insulting and disrespectful. You should reflect on that the next time you pray.

Joe

Read your own posts..

 

[Ritajanice]

I have only met ONE converted believer on this forum. Everyone else I've met is still in an apostate condition and waiting for the second coming of the Lord to convert them

That is your own opinion and with respect, makes no sense to my spirit, neither does it have to...I wait on the Lord to reveal all spirit knowledge to my spirit ,by Gods Living witness His Living Holy Spirit who indwells my spirit.

You accuse the brethren of apostasy...which means...short commentary.

What is the condition of apostasy?
Apostasy is the rejection of Christ by one who has been a Christian. …" "Apostasy is a theological category describing those who have voluntarily and consciously abandoned their faith in the God of the covenant, who manifests himself most completely in Jesus Christ." "Apostasy is the antonym of conversion; it is ...





We must be Born Again to see the Kingdom Of God....

I have no understanding of the rains of the Spirit you keep talking about..

Our spirit is Born Again...by Gods Witness His Living Holy Spirit?

The Spirit testifies with our spirit that we are Gods children/ Born Again...we’re all on a journey with the Lord.

 

[PinSeeker]

2 of 3

That's not what Jesus said. Jesus said we DO save ourselves and become a part of God's elect:

John 3:16-18
16“For God so loved the world, that He gave His only begotten Son, that whoever believes in Him shall not perish, but have eternal life.
17“For God did not send the Son into the world to judge the world, but that the world might be saved through Him.
18“He who believes in Him is not judged; he who does not believe has been judged already, because he has not believed in the name of the only begotten Son of God.

As you well, know, this is a continuation of Jesus's conversation with Nicodemus, and He has just said, "unless one is born of water and the Spirit, he cannot enter the kingdom of God. That which is born of the flesh is flesh, and that which is born of the Spirit is spirit. Do not marvel that I said to you, ‘You must be born again.’ The wind blows where it wishes, and you hear its sound, but you do not know where it comes from or where it goes. So it is with everyone who is born of the Spirit.”

So then comes John 3:16, where He says to Nicodemus (yes...), "whoever believes in him..." So let's look at that 'whoever.' It can be applied accurately in two ways, and both are correct:

1. All are eligible; there is no one excluded from eligibility of being born of the Spirit, and thus able to enter the kingdom of God... and thus saved

2. Those that do come to believe will be (and are) the ones whom God has called, which we can clearly see... yet again... from what Ezekiel says in Ezekiel 11:19-20 and Ezekiel 36:26-27...

"I will give you a new heart, and a new spirit I will put within you. And I will remove the heart of stone from your flesh and give you a heart of flesh. And I will put my Spirit within you, and cause you to walk in my statutes and be careful to obey my rules"​

...and from what Joel says in Joel 2:32...

"it shall come to pass that everyone who calls on the name of the LORD shall be saved. For in Mount Zion and in Jerusalem there shall be those who escape, as the LORD has said, and among the survivors shall be those whom the LORD calls"​

...and also from what Jesus Himself says in John 15:16...

"You did not choose Me, but I chose you and appointed you that you should go and bear fruit and that your fruit should abide"​

Is God Almighty or not? Is your God Almighty and Sovereign or isn't He?

That's the very question I'm asking you, GodsGrace. Actually, is God Almighty or are we? Is God Almighty and Sovereign or are we almighty and sovereign over Him? And as I put it before, does God's will depend on ours?

Is the Almighty God who created the heavens and the earth and all that is seen and unseen so weak as to fear giving us free will? Because it would take away HIS free will?

What I'm stating to you, GodsGrace... don't spin it... is that in stomping so fervently for our free will, your unmistakable implication ~ even though unintended ~ is that God's free will depends on ours, and really that our free will obligates His, even dictates His, thereby revoking it altogether.

Man cannot save himself. God must save him. Every Christian agrees with this.

Ah, but you just said, in this very post, that "Jesus said we DO save ourselves and become a part of God's elect..." That's a curious thing... And again, Jesus did say, "You did not choose Me, but I chose you and appointed you that you should go and bear fruit and that your fruit should abide"...

And besides that, in Romans 9, Paul is specifically talking about God's purpose of election... not "our purpose of God's election" or even "our election of ourselves to God's elect"... and says, in succession:

1) "it depends not on human will or exertion, but on God, Who has mercy,"​

​

2) "(God) has mercy on whomever He wills,"​

and

3) "the potter (has) right over the clay, to make out of the same lump one vessel for honorable use and another for dishonorable use; God, desiring to show His wrath and to make known His power, has endured with much patience vessels of wrath prepared for destruction, in order to make known the riches of his glory for vessels of mercy, which He has prepared beforehand for glory ~ even us whom He has called, not from the Jews only but also from the Gentiles."​

And this is right after he has said:

"And we know that for those who love God all things work together for good, for those who are called according to His purpose. For those whom He foreknew He also predestined to be conformed to the image of His Son, in order that He might be the firstborn among many brothers. And those whom He predestined He also called, and those whom He called He also justified, and those whom He justified He also glorified" (Romans 8:28-30).​

So, I certainly join with Paul and echo his words, that "If God is for us, who can be against us? ... Who shall separate us from the love of Christ? Shall tribulation, or distress, or persecution, or famine, or nakedness, or danger, or sword? ... No, in all these things we are more than conquerors through Him Who loved us. For I am sure that neither death nor life, nor angels nor rulers, nor things present nor things to come, nor powers, nor height nor depth, nor anything else in all creation, will be able to separate us from the love of God in Christ Jesus our Lord" (Romans 8:37-39).

But as to the question of
WHO can be saved....
Paul answered that question....

Acts 16:30-31 The jailor asked Paul.
30and after he brought them out, he said, “Sirs, what must I do to be saved?”
31They said, “Believe in the Lord Jesus, and you will be saved, you and your household.”

And the jailor was converted.
Paul taught him HOW....

Very true, but... yet again... Jesus, in response to His disciples asking Him, "Who then can be saved?" said in reply, "With man this is impossible, but with God all things are possible", "With man it is impossible, but not with God. For all things are possible with God", and "What is impossible with man is possible with God", (Matthew 19:26, Mark 10:27, and Luke 18:27, respectively). So that leaves us with three possibilities:

1. Paul was wrong in Acts 16:31​

2. Jesus was wrong in Matthew 19:26, Mark 10:27, and Luke 18:27​

3. Both were right.​

In case you're puzzled, GodsGrace, numbers 1 and 2 above are... not right... :)

Paul did not tell him he had to wait and see IF God would pick him to be an elect.

LOL! Hey, GodsGrace, this jailer. Where is he from? Philippi, right? Yes, see Acts 16:12 and following:

"...from there to Philippi, which is a leading city of the district of Macedonia and a Roman colony. We remained in this city some days... As we were going to the place of prayer..."​

And you remember, I'm sure... at least because I've told you about three times now, if not more... what Paul wrote to the Philippians, that they... and we, by extension... should... I seem to remember saying this a couple of times already... :) "...work out your own salvation with fear and trembling, for it is God who works in you, both to will and to work for his good pleasure..." (Philippians 2:13).

Yes, Paul said do it, right away. He certainly did. For sure. :)

Grace and peace to you.

 

[PinSeeker]

You don't even post your source.

LOL! Well that would be quoted from Calvin's Institutes... Goodness gracious.

I have gone through all 4 books, but I certainly would not use CALVIN for support.

Well, you've clearly misunderstood what he said in that very passage you brought up, so maybe you should go through them again. :) But hey, you can use what you want, just... you know... use it well. And that applies regarding the Bible, too...

Do you think one of the Confessions should be used as support?

I think we can use a lot of things for support, GodsGrace, but none of it is ~ or takes the place of ~ inspired Scripture.

ONLY scripture could be used for support of a doctrine and it's really difficult for a Calvinist to do this...

Because Calvin himself used the Scriptures extensively to support himself? LOL! And also used the Scriptures to refute Arminius? LOL! No, it's not "difficult" at all... Again, Calvin was a Reformer, and one of the chief tenets of the Reformation was Scripture Alone, Sola Scriptura, meaning having to do with the sufficiency of Scripture as our supreme authority in all spiritual matters, that all truth necessary for our salvation and spiritual life is taught either explicitly or implicitly in Scripture, that Scripture is the highest and supreme authority on any matter on which it speaks.

they must change words and meanings or verses would not align with their doctrine.

Rubbish.

And, as I've stated and posted Book 3, Chapter 24, Paragraph 8
it is IMPOSSIBLE for a calvinist to know for sure that God has chosen him
UNTIL the end of his life.

And again, here is the text:

The expression of our Savior, “Many are called, but few are chosen,” (Mt. 22:14), is also very improperly interpreted (see Book 3, chap. 2, sec. 11, 12). There will be no ambiguity in it, if we attend to what our former remarks ought to have made clear—viz. that there are two species of calling: for there is an universal call, by which God, through the external preaching of the word, invites all men alike, even those for whom he designs the call to be a savor of death, and the ground of a severer condemnation. Besides this there is a special call which, for the most part, God bestows on believers only, when by the internal illumination of the Spirit he causes the word preached to take deep root in their hearts. Sometimes, however, he communicates it also to those whom he enlightens only for a time, and whom afterwards, in just punishment for their ingratitude, he abandons and smites with greater blindness. Now, our Lord seeing that the gospel was published far and wide, was despised by multitudes, and justly valued by few, describes God under the character of a King, who, preparing a great feast, sends his servants all around to invite a great multitude, but can only obtain the presence of a very few, because almost all allege causes of excuse; at length, in consequence of their refusal, he is obliged to send his servants out into the highways to invite every one they meet. It is perfectly clear, that thus far the parable is to be understood of external calling. He afterwards adds, that God acts the part of a kind entertainer, who goes round his table and affably receives his guests; but still if he finds any one not adorned with the nuptial garment, he will by no means allow him to insult the festivity by his sordid dress. I admit that this branch of the parable is to be understood of those who, by a profession of faith, enter the Church, but are not at all invested with the sanctification of Christ. Such disgraces to his Church, such cankers God will not always tolerate, but will cast them forth as their turpitude deserves. Few, then, out of the great number of called are chosen; the calling, however, not being of that kind which enables believers to judge of their election. The former call is common to the wicked, the latter brings with it the spirit of regeneration, which is the earnest and seal of the future inheritance by which our hearts are sealed unto the day of the Lord (Eph. 1:13, 14). In one word, while hypocrites pretend to piety, just as if they were true worshipers of God, Christ declares that they will ultimately be ejected from the place which they improperly occupy, as it is said in the psalm, “Lord, who shall abide in thy tabernacle? who shall dwell in thy holy hill? He that walketh uprightly, and worketh righteousness, and speaketh the truth in his heart,” (Psalm 15:1, 2). Again in another passage, “This is the generation of them that seek him, that seek thy face, O Jacob,” (Psalm 24:6). And thus the Spirit exhorts believers to patience, and not to murmur because Ishmaelites are mingled with them in the Church since the mask will at length be torn off, and they will be ejected with disgrace.

...as if this is really necessary... LINK

I challenge you, GodsGrace, what, in what John Calvin writes there, gives you cause to say that per John Calvin himself says or even infers, that "it is impossible for a Calvinist to know for sure that God has chosen him until the end of his life."

I, OTOH, KNOW that I have chosen to love and obey God, who is my Father and loves me and all those that FREELY CHOOSE Him.

Well, good. Me too. And I'm one of those nasty Calvinists. <chuckles>

Reformed theology is of man.

Everyone is welcome to his opinion. :) You know hey that's free will... LOL!

Began in 1,500AD

Just because the Reformation began in the 1500s does not mean the understandings of Scripture championed during the Reformation were first propagated or somehow "began" then... :) We could say the same thing regarding Arminianism... :)

Was abandoned by all denominations, except the reformed, because of its incorrect teachings that are impossible to adhere to...

Hmm, well certainly not "all denominations," or even close to that. But, you know, like Paul said two millennia ago, "the time is coming when people will not endure sound teaching, but having itching ears they will accumulate for themselves teachers to suit their own passions, and will turn away from listening to the truth and wander off into myths..." He was right...

It comes and goes....and will go again eventually.

Ah, I wouldn't be so sure. But you know that's worth thinking about; we can talk about Christianity in that same context, somewhat. You know, we see article after article about how Christianity is dying and will soon be no more, how young people are leaving the church in droves... Well, I would say there are two things happening:

1.) God is growing His kingdom. New believers are coming to Christ daily, and His Church is growing.
2.) But yes, Christ's Church is losing folks; people are "going out from us, proving they are not of us," even as John said 2000 years ago.

So, I would call it a "shakedown" of sorts... if you understand what I mean. I do think the ratio of born again Christians to those who just profess belief in Christ is... There's a pretty big gap there. How big we cannot know, but I think it's pretty big. But steadily getting narrower, and much narrower than just shortly ago. Yeah, a shakedown. People are showing their true colors, which they themselves might not even have been aware of until recently.

And I would say the same thing ~ in a lesser sense, certainly, but in concept the same ~ with people coming to understand the Scriptures in the ways Augustine, Calvin, Jonathan Edwards, Cornelius Van Til and many others even up to the present day did and do. But of course this is surely not to say that those that follow in the footsteps of Pelagius, Arminius, and others even up to the present day were or are "lesser Christians," or "not as saved," or anything so ridiculous.

You know, this is neither here nor there, really, but your moniker... GodsGrace... There's just something really, really ironic about that... I mean, I don't mean to offend, for sure. But still... Ah. Well... Sorry.

Grace and peace to you.

 

[FaithWillDo]

I believe truth is only given to us when we become Born Again , only the Holy Spirit by divine revelation can witness that truth to our hearts / spirit...when he testifies with our spirit that we are Gods children/ Born Again.

Yes, I believe the elect are chosen for Gods purpose and plan...a Born Again Glorifies the Father through the Spirit that indwells our spirit , only he can reveal Gods truth to our heart/ spirit.

Because we are Born Again we crave the teachings from the Spirit....remember God loved us first in our heart/ spirit, when we were Born Again of imperishable seed that liveth and abideth forever.

In our spirit/ heart...we know the Love Of God , because we have Gods Witness His Living Holy Spirit witnessing Gods love to our heart/ spirit all day every day.

Only He can witness Gods truth to our heart/ spirit...only He can teach, we listen to no other.

Dear Ritajanice,
You said:
I believe truth is only given to us when we become Born Again , only the Holy Spirit by divine revelation can witness that truth to our hearts / spirit...when he testifies with our spirit that we are Gods children/ Born Again.

Truth is given to us in TWO parts at two different times.

Part 1

1Cor 12:3 Wherefore I give you to understand, that no man speaking by the Spirit of God calleth Jesus accursed: and that no man can say that Jesus is the Lord, but by the Holy Spirit.

Prov 16:1 The preparations of the heart in man, and the answer of the tongue, is from the LORD.

When the Lord is ready to call an unbeliever to be a saint, He will come to them without their asking or permission and give them the Early Rain of the Spirit. With the Spirit, their heart will be prepared to make a confession of faith when they are presented the Gospel by the foolishness of preaching. After they do, they will enter the church. This is the ONLY way it happens. Christ is the one who makes the decision on who is given the Early Rain of the Spirit. Without this gift, a person has no choice but to remain an unbeliever until they die.

Because the Early Rain of the Spirit leaves the new believer unconverted, carnally minded and spiritually blind, they CANNOT understand or receive the spiritual teachings of Christ that He does under the New Covenant. However, they will have the ability to understand "Christ and Him crucified" as Paul said of the unconverted Corinthian church. The reason for this is because "Christ and Him crucified" was under the Old Covenant. The Old Covenant is outward and physical which the carnal mind has no problem understanding.

The apostate church (which is made up of believers who have only been given the Early Rain of the Spirit) has no problem understanding the teachings of the Old Covenant. But the teachings of the New Covenant remain confusing to them. The tower of Babel is a "type" for the apostate church. The confusion of languages is why the apostate church has no unity of truth in it and why it is divided into more than a thousand denominations/sects.

Part 2

For only the Elect, Christ will come to them a second time and give them the Latter Rain of the Spirit. This happens while they are under Satan's influence in the apostate church. After the believer receives the Latter Rain of the Spirit, their spiritual blindness will be healed. After it is, Christ will feed them His spiritual truth of the New Covenant. This event is symbolized by the Lord's Supper and by the Marriage Supper of the Lamb. After the believer has received sufficient nourishment, Christ will "appear" and gather the newly born again believer to heaven (spiritually speaking). Because of this new knowledge of the truth, the believer will realize that they have been under Satan's deceptions in the apostate church. This is when they "see" the Abomination of Desolation and when the man of sin (themselves) is revealed. From this knowledge, judgment will fall on the believer and Christ will remove the spirit of anti-Christ and the Great Harlot (the believer's marred spirit/wicked heart/carnal nature). The believer is now a child of God and is converted.

Mat 18:3 And said, Verily I say unto you, Except ye be converted, and become as little children, ye shall not enter into the kingdom of heaven.

After an Elect believer receives the Early Rain of the Spirit, they become a "babe in Christ" who is destine to fallen away back to works (religion) under Satan's deceptions. After they are given the Latter Rain of the Spirit and are converted, they will draw from the breasts (Isa 28:9-12) and become a little child. At this point, Christ will continue feeding the child His spiritual truth (along with chastisement) to mature them into a perfect man full of age.

All apostate believers believe that they are saved for a few reasons. One is that the teachings of the apostate church are pleasing to their carnal mind so they readily accept them. Secondly, Satan masquerades as an angel of light (Christ) to the new believer and his spirit which has indwelt them will also come with "great signs and wonders" (Mat 24:24 and Rev 13:11-18). In case you are not aware, the second beast shown in Rev 13:11-18 represents the spirit of anti-Christ that governs the Seven Headed beast (an apostate believer). A new believer has no ability to avoid coming under Satan's deceptions. The only thing that can pull them out of that deception is the second coming of Christ with the Latter Rain of the Spirit. But since the Latter Rain of the Spirit is reserved for only the Elect, the Elect are the only members of the apostate church that will be saved before they die. This is the pathway that Christ causes His Elect to travel to their salvation. It happens no other way.

If a believer has not seen the Abomination of Desolation and know that they have been under Satan's deceptions in the apostate church, then they are still unconverted and not saved. The spirit of anti-Christ is still deceiving them.

Joe

 

[Ritajanice]

Dear Ritajanice,
You said:
I believe truth is only given to us when we become Born Again , only the Holy Spirit by divine revelation can witness that truth to our hearts / spirit...when he testifies with our spirit that we are Gods children/ Born Again.

Truth is given to us in TWO parts at two different times.

Don’t agree...Gods word says you must be Born Again to see the Kingdom Of God.

I see the Kingdom Of God..my eyes can see, my ears can hear...spiritual eyes and ears, that continue to grow in the spirit once Born of Gods seed.

Part 1

1Cor 12:3 Wherefore I give you to understand, that no man speaking by the Spirit of God calleth Jesus accursed: and that no man can say that Jesus is the Lord, but by the Holy Spirit.

Prov 16:1 The preparations of the heart in man, and the answer of the tongue, is from the LORD.

When the Lord is ready to call an unbeliever to be a saint, He will come to them without their asking or permission and give them the Early Rain of the Spirit

Don’t agree, the Spirit will make there spirit Born Again....we must be Born Again to see the Kingdom Of God....our spirit must be Born Again...has nothing to do with early rain of the Spirit, that is not how God says we are Born Again.

. With the Spirit, their heart will be prepared to make a confession of faith when they are presented the Gospel by the foolishness of preaching. After they do, they will enter the church. This is the ONLY way it happens. Christ is the one who makes the decision on who is given the Early Rain of the Spirit. Without this gift, a person has no choice but to remain an unbeliever until they die.

We are given the gift of faith , our spirit is Born Again, without God’s gift of faith , becoming Born Again by the Spirit Of God I would never know that he exists.....I have the witness ,witnessing Gods truth to my heart/ spirit all day every day.

Because the Early Rain of the Spirit leaves the new believer unconverted, carnally minded and spiritually blind, they CANNOT understand or receive the spiritual teachings of Christ that He does under the New Covenant. However, they will have the ability to understand "Christ and Him crucified" as Paul said of the unconverted Corinthian church. The reason for this is because "Christ and Him crucified" was under the Old Covenant. The Old Covenant is outward and physical which the carnal mind has no problem understanding.

The apostate church (which is made up of believers who have only been given the Early Rain of the Spirit) has no problem understanding the teachings of the Old Covenant. But the teachings of the New Covenant remain confusing to them. The tower of Babel is a "type" for the apostate church. The confusion of languages is why the apostate church has no unity of truth in it and why it is divided into more than a thousand denominations/sects.

Part 2

For only the Elect, Christ will come to them a second time and give them the Latter Rain of the Spirit. This happens while they are under Satan's influence in the apostate church. After the believer receives the Latter Rain of the Spirit, their spiritual blindness will be healed. After it is, Christ will feed them His spiritual truth of the New Covenant. This event is symbolized by the Lord's Supper and by the Marriage Supper of the Lamb. After the believer has received sufficient nourishment, Christ will "appear" and gather the newly born again believer to heaven (spiritually speaking). Because of this new knowledge of the truth, the believer will realize that they have been under Satan's deceptions in the apostate church. This is when they "see" the Abomination of Desolation and when the man of sin (themselves) is revealed. From this knowledge, judgment will fall on the believer and Christ will remove the spirit of anti-Christ and the Great Harlot (the believer's marred spirit/wicked heart/carnal nature). The believer is now a child of God and is converted.

Mat 18:3 And said, Verily I say unto you, Except ye be converted, and become as little children, ye shall not enter into the kingdom of heaven.

After an Elect believer receives the Early Rain of the Spirit, they become a "babe in Christ" who is destine to fallen away back to works (religion) under Satan's deceptions. After they are given the Latter Rain of the Spirit and are converted, they will draw from the breasts (Isa 28:9-12) and become a little child. At this point, Christ will continue feeding the child His spiritual truth (along with chastisement) to mature them into a perfect man full of age.

All apostate believers believe that they are saved for a few reasons. One is that the teachings of the apostate church are pleasing to their carnal mind so they readily accept them. Secondly, Satan masquerades as an angel of light (Christ) to the new believer and his spirit which has indwelt them will also come with "great signs and wonders" (Mat 24:24 and Rev 13:11-18). In case you are not aware, the second beast shown in Rev 13:11-18 represents the spirit of anti-Christ that governs the Seven Headed beast (an apostate believer). A new believer has no ability to avoid coming under Satan's deceptions. The only thing that can pull them out of that deception is the second coming of Christ with the Latter Rain of the Spirit. But since the Latter Rain of the Spirit is reserved for only the Elect, the Elect are the only members of the apostate church that will be saved before they die. This is the pathway that Christ causes His Elect to travel to their salvation. It happens no other way.

If a believer has not seen the Abomination of Desolation and know that they have been under Satan's deceptions in the apostate church, then they are still unconverted and not saved. The spirit of anti-Christ is still deceiving them.

Joe

You have posted what you believe to be God’s truth same as me....your truth is no more valid than mine or anyone else’s.....you like me have posted your truth.

Posting reams and reams of scripture ,is what you believe the word of God to be saying by your own interpretation,imo...

 

[Christian Soldier]

This is what you posted CS.
Yes, it's stunning, odd and unorthodox.
You should try reading the bible without bringing your own ideas to it.

You wrote:

Why are you trying to defend the error which I already corrected. The other member falsely claimed that Christ gave a commandment, which He never ever gave at all.

The other member accepted the correction and moved on, yet you are persisting in the error and still trying to defend false doctrine.

You need to learn what the word "if" means. "If" cannot be translated to mean "you must", That's what the other member was trying to push until I exposed them.

"If you abide in Me" is not saying "you must abide in Me", it's very simple to understand. I don't know why you're struggling with it.

 

[Christian Soldier]

HOW is post 2 verses and NOT EVEN COMMENTING ON THEM....
twisting them to make them say what he wants them to say?

Why are you so afraid of the word WORKS when that's all Jesus taught?

What do you think Jesus came here to do?
To die on a cross so you could be saved and then do NOTHING to belong in the kingdom here on earth?

Jesus taught that if we want to belong to His Kingdom, and be subjects to the King --- Jesus --- we are to BEHAVE in a certain manner.

This is not WORKS,,,,this is following Jesus and being a disciple of His.

The NT teaches:

Be not only HEARERS of the word, BUT DOERS of the word.
James 1:22
22But prove yourselves doers of the word, and not merely hearers who delude themselves.

James 1:23
23For if anyone is a hearer of the word and not a doer, he is like a man who looks at his natural face in a mirror; 24for once he has looked at himself and gone away, he has immediately forgotten what kind of person he was.

We are clearly warned to be a DOER of the word.
What about this do you not agree with?

I don't agree with anything you said, it's all based on the false Arminian works based gospel.

God said we are saved by grace, but you say we are saved by works. One of you is lying and I think I know who it is.

Why do you, just push works as your only way to inherit the Kingdom of God. Why do you ignore, the other 99% of the Bible. Your works are dead without faith.

Regarding the other member, who tried to use those verses to push false doctrine. You should go back to see, how he kept misapplying them in previous posts, then you will understand why he didn't add any comment to his reply. I can dump a truck load of verses a his feet and leave him with them, but that would be pointless unless I explained what they mean.

If you give the Bible to 50 people, and ask them to explain what all the verses are saying. You will get 50 different interpretations. We don't have any right to add or take away from anything God said, whoever does this is cursed and God wrath abides on them.

Your opinion doesn't matter at all, the only thing that matters is the truth. Let every man be a liar and let God be true. if you want to know the truth, then embrace the whole counsel of God and stop cherry picking only the bits you like and trashing the parts you don't like. The other member was doing that, and I exposed him for it

 

[FaithWillDo]

Don’t agree...Gods word says you must be Born Again to see the Kingdom Of God.

Dear Ritajanice,
You said:
Don’t agree, the Spirit will make there spirit Born Again....we must be Born Again to see the Kingdom Of God....our spirit must be Born Again...has nothing to do with early rain of the Spirit, that is not how God says we are Born Again.

Your statement is not supported by scripture.

Here are some verses you need to consider concerning the farming analogy that Christ uses to teach His truth of the pathway to salvation:

Hos 6:3 Then shall we know, if we follow on to know the LORD: his going forth is prepared as the morning; and he (Christ) shall come unto us as the RAIN, as the Latter and Early RAIN unto the earth.

James 5:7 Be patient therefore, brethren, unto the coming of the Lord. Behold, the farmer waiteth for the precious fruit of the earth, and hath long patience for it, until he receives the EARLY and LATTER RAIN. 8 Be ye also patient; stablish your hearts: for the coming of the Lord draweth nigh.

In James' letter, James is teaching babes in Christ who have only received the Early Rain of the Spirit. The babes (wheat) were still waiting for the Lord to return and give them the Latter Rain of the Spirit so that they will be made ready for the harvest. In the passage, James is encouraging the new believers to be patient has the Lord is patient in returning to them at the proper time. And as Revelation says, "I come quickly" and He will to those whom He has chosen for salvation in this age.

1Sam 12:17 Is it not wheat harvest to day? (day of salvation for the Elect) I will call unto the LORD, and he shall send thunder and RAIN (the Latter Rain); that ye may perceive and see (spiritual blindness healed) that your wickedness is great (have become apostate), which ye have done in the sight of the LORD, in asking you a king.

Just like Mat 24:15 says, after a believer receives the Latter Rain, they will see the Abomination of Desolation (see that your wickedness is great).

Jer 3:3 Therefore the showers have been withholden, and there hath been no Latter Rain; and thou hadst a whore's forehead, thou refusedst to be ashamed.

The apostate church is not ashamed of their false doctrines of Free Will and Hell or of the false gospel they teach. They have a "whore's forehead". A whore's forehead is a symbol which represents the worsened carnal mind that the Great Harlot gave them.

Psa 68:9 Thou, O God, didst send a plentiful RAIN (Latter Rain), whereby thou didst confirm thine inheritance, when it was weary (in an fallen away state).

The Early Rain of the Spirit is given in "measure" (a small amount) and because of such, it only gives a measure of faith to the new believer. But when the Latter Rain of the Spirit is given, it will be poured out in great measure and with power.

Deu 32:2 My doctrine shall drop as the rain, my speech shall distil as the dew, as the small rain (Early Rain) upon the tender herb, and as the showers (Latter Rain) upon the grass:

Job 37:6 For he saith to the snow, Be thou on the earth; likewise to the small rain (Early Rain), and to the great rain (Latter Rain) of his strength.

Joel 2:23 Be glad then, ye children of Zion, and rejoice in Jehovah your God; for he giveth you the Early Rain in just measure, and he causes to come down for you the rain, the Early Rain and the Latter Rain, in the first month.

2Tim 1:7 For God hath not given us the spirit of fear; but of power, and of love, and of a sound mind.

You said:
We are given the gift of faith , our spirit is Born Again, without God’s gift of faith , becoming Born Again by the Spirit Of God I would never know that he exists.....I have the witness ,witnessing Gods truth to my heart/ spirit all day every day.

The Early Rain of the Spirit is what gives a person their measure of faith. True faith in Christ is trusting Him to do everything that He says He will do and this certainly includes providing everything we need to be made into a fully matured son of God. With this type of faith, Christ's pathway will be made straight for Him to appear to us a second time and convert us. Without this faith, Christ will not appear. But since all new believers will "fall away" and mix their own works with faith, the pathway for Christ to appear will be made crooked. Satan teaches this crooked way and that is why Satan is called the crooked serpent. To straighten the pathway, Christ will pour out the Latter Rain of the Spirit upon the fallen away believer. This will increase the believer's faith and rid them of trusting in their own works. After the pathway has been made straight, Christ will appear and convert the child of the devil into a child of God.

More on faith: Salvation requires no works from the person because Christ is the one who causes the person to "will and do of His good pleasure" (Phi 2:13). The confession of faith, loving God and loving our neighbor and every good work that we do is actually a work that Christ does from within us by the Spirit. A converted believer has nothing they can boast about concerning their salvation. They never chose Christ because it was Christ who chose them. And it was Christ who changed their heart and mind to be like His heart and mind. They are His workmanship. When a person is saved in this age, it is only because Christ chose them and performed His spiritual work within them. They had nothing to do with it. The Elect's salvation is 100% assured to occur before they die. For everyone else, it is likewise 100% certain that they will not be saved before they die. They simply were not chosen to be blessed and become a vessel of honor like the Elect were. But Christ will not forget the people He did not choose because He loves all mankind equally. In the final age, Christ will perform His saving work within each and everyone of the "lost" before they perish in the Lake of Fire.

Do you have enough faith to believe what Christ says in the scripture below?

1Tim 2:3 For this is good and acceptable in the sight of God our Savior; 4 who will have all men to be saved, and to come unto the knowledge of the truth. 5 For there is one God, and one mediator between God and men, the man Christ Jesus; 6 who gave himself a ransom for all, to be testified in due time.

Below is how Christ will save the "lost" in the final age.

When Christ judges the "lost" in the Lake of Fire, He will not omit justice, mercy or faith when He administers their judgment.

Mat 23:23 Woe unto you, scribes and Pharisees, hypocrites! for ye pay tithe of mint and anise and cummin, and have omitted the weightier matters of the law: justice, mercy, and faith: these ought ye to have done, and not to leave the other undone.

Christ will show His MERCY to the lost person by giving them BOTH the Early and Latter Rains of the Spirit. With the Spirit, the believer will then have the FAITH they need to make Christ's pathway straight for Him to appear to them and convert them. After the new child of God is born, Christ will gather them up to heaven. The child of the devil will remain in the Lake of Fire until he perishes. This death will satisfy JUSTICE. This entire spiritual process is called conversion. By the end of the final age, mankind will cease to exist but the Kingdom of Heaven will be that much fuller.

Do you have enough faith to believe that Christ will succeed in saving the world just as His Father commissioned Him to do?

1John 4:14 And we have seen and do testify that the Father sent the Son to be the Savior of the world.

You said:
Posting reams and reams of scripture ,is what you believe the word of God to be saying by your own interpretation,imo...

I have never said that you should believe me, but you should believe the verses I post. That is why I post reams and reams of scripture.

Joe

 

[Ritajanice]

Dear Ritajanice,
You said:
Don’t agree, the Spirit will make there spirit Born Again....we must be Born Again to see the Kingdom Of God....our spirit must be Born Again...has nothing to do with early rain of the Spirit, that is not how God says we are Born Again.

Your statement is not supported by scripture.

Here are some verses you need to consider concerning the farming analogy that Christ uses to teach His truth of the pathway to salvation:

Ive had to cut your post down, as it’s a 1,000 words.

Yes, my post is scriptural.....we must be Born Again to see the Kingdom Of God...we must become spirit children to have any fellowship with Gods Witness His Living Holy Spirit...

We communicate with Gods Spirit via our spirit...not by understanding the penned word from our own “ human” / “ carnal” understanding....it can and does take years for the Spirit to communicate the written word to our spirit.

We were children of the world once.....then when we become Born Again we are the spirit children of God...

Our teacher/ helper the Holy Spirit indwells our spirit , we have that new heart and spirit within...our spirit is in Christ, that’s when we start down that narrow path, we were chosen for Gods purpose and plan....everything we say and do is all about God, as we have His Living Witness the Living Holy Spirit....witnessing Gods truth to our heart/ spirit....the Spirit testifies with our spirit that we are Gods children....the Spirit of God is Alive and Active in our hearts/ spirit....who do you think is making us into the image of Jesus and producing fruit in us...the penned word or the Living Witness the Holy Spirit.

The Living Witness that we are Born Again of, leads us through the penned word which backs up what he witnesses to our heart/ spirit...reading the penned word does not make one’s spirit Born Again...that can only come by divine revelation...as in....we must be “ Born Again “ we are Born Of God’s seed....that seed is His Living seed that is Alive in us...we have been brought from death into life....our spirit has been brought from death to life, our spirit has been brought into the Kingdom Of God.

So you see...our testimonies are very different on how we believe we became Born Of The Spirit.

Therefore your testimony and my testimony is no more valid than any other members......you cannot prove that what you post is the truth of Gods word no more than I can....we post what “ WE” believe we are led to post by Gods witness His Living Holy Spirit.....we post what we believe is Gods truth......therefore we can post reams and reams of scripture reams and reams of testimonies....yet, we will only take on board what we understand the Spirit Of God to be witnessing to our spirit.

 

[Ritajanice]

The Early Rain of the Spirit is what gives a person their measure of faith. True faith in Christ is trusting Him to do everything that He says He will do and this certainly includes providing everything we need to be made into a fully matured son of God. With this type of faith, Christ's pathway will be made straight for Him to appear to us a second time and convert us. Without this faith, Christ will not appear. But since all new believers will "fall away" and mix their own works with faith, the pathway for Christ to appear will be made crooked. Satan teaches this crooked way and that is why Satan is called the crooked serpent. To straighten the pathway, Christ will pour out the Latter Rain of the Spirit upon the fallen away believer. This will increase the believer's faith and rid them of trusting in their own works. After the pathway has been made straight, Christ will appear and convert the child of the devil into a child of God.

Appear to us a second time?

All new believers will fall away?

Once we are Born Again by the Spirit Of God...thats it, we are His children to use as however is pleasing to Him.

A Born Again is “ in Love” with the Spirit Of God....Gods Spirit is “ LOVE” ...the most powerful Love there ever can be....may you know the Love Of Christ in your heart....it’s beyond our comprehension how much God Loves us.

A Born Again can NEVER be un- birthed from the Spirit of God.

We have been Born Again of imperishable seed not perishable seed “ imperishable seed “ that liveth and abideth forever....that is delivered by Gods Witness His Living Holy Spirit to our spirit, only he can witness Gods truth to our hearts / spirit...then what he witnesses to our heart/ spirit, it’s backed up by his penned word....if what we believe the Spirit witnesses to our heart/ spirit isn’t in the penned word...then it didn’t come from God’s witness His Living Holy Spirit.....everything we believe is being witnessed to our spirit by the Spirit of God must always be checked by his penned word.

I became Born Again by divine revelation not by reading the penned word...the penned word backs up Gods Living Witness His Living Holy Spirit....who testifies/ witnesses/ speaks Gods truth to our spirit.

We need to be Born Again by the Spirit Of God to understand the word of God.as the Bible was written under the influence of the Spirit of God...it’s a Spirit book full of Spiritual truth...only Gods Living witness His Living Holy Spirit can lead you through that Spirit book as it can only be understood in one’s spirit....therefore we must be a spirit child of God , as without we would just be leading ourselves through scripture and bringing it to our own human/ carnal understanding....which is void of any spiritual truth...just mumbo jumbo.

Everyone here on the forum is on their own journey with God....they are not in apostasy as you claim we are, because we don’t understand your own teachings and preachings.....

You are welcome to believe whatever you believe as I’ve already said, doesn’t make it Gods truth ..no more than what I post can be proved it’s Gods truth.
we’re on this platform by God...witnessing what “ WE” believe to be God’s truth...sowing seeds...bearing witness for our wonderful Lord and Saviour/ Glorifying His Name under the power/ influence of Gods witness His Living Holy Spirit....

My opinion/ testimony and belief...

 

[Ritajanice]

Dear Ritajanice,
You said:
Don’t agree, the Spirit will make there spirit Born Again....we must be Born Again to see the Kingdom Of God....our spirit must be Born Again...has nothing to do with early rain of the Spirit, that is not how God says we are Born Again.

Your statement is not supported by scripture.

Here are some verses you need to consider concerning the farming analogy that Christ uses to teach His truth of the pathway to salvation:

Hos 6:3 Then shall we know, if we follow on to know the LORD: his going forth is prepared as the morning; and he (Christ) shall come unto us as the RAIN, as the Latter and Early RAIN unto the earth.

James 5:7 Be patient therefore, brethren, unto the coming of the Lord. Behold, the farmer waiteth for the precious fruit of the earth, and hath long patience for it, until he receives the EARLY and LATTER RAIN. 8 Be ye also patient; stablish your hearts: for the coming of the Lord draweth nigh.

In James' letter, James is teaching babes in Christ who have only received the Early Rain of the Spirit. The babes (wheat) were still waiting for the Lord to return and give them the Latter Rain of the Spirit so that they will be made ready for the harvest. In the passage, James is encouraging the new believers to be patient has the Lord is patient in returning to them at the proper time. And as Revelation says, "I come quickly" and He will to those whom He has chosen for salvation in this age.

1Sam 12:17 Is it not wheat harvest to day? (day of salvation for the Elect) I will call unto the LORD, and he shall send thunder and RAIN (the Latter Rain); that ye may perceive and see (spiritual blindness healed) that your wickedness is great (have become apostate), which ye have done in the sight of the LORD, in asking you a king.

Just like Mat 24:15 says, after a believer receives the Latter Rain, they will see the Abomination of Desolation (see that your wickedness is great).

Jer 3:3 Therefore the showers have been withholden, and there hath been no Latter Rain; and thou hadst a whore's forehead, thou refusedst to be ashamed.

The apostate church is not ashamed of their false doctrines of Free Will and Hell or of the false gospel they teach. They have a "whore's forehead". A whore's forehead is a symbol which represents the worsened carnal mind that the Great Harlot gave them.

Psa 68:9 Thou, O God, didst send a plentiful RAIN (Latter Rain), whereby thou didst confirm thine inheritance, when it was weary (in an fallen away state).

The Early Rain of the Spirit is given in "measure" (a small amount) and because of such, it only gives a measure of faith to the new believer. But when the Latter Rain of the Spirit is given, it will be poured out in great measure and with power.

Deu 32:2 My doctrine shall drop as the rain, my speech shall distil as the dew, as the small rain (Early Rain) upon the tender herb, and as the showers (Latter Rain) upon the grass:

Job 37:6 For he saith to the snow, Be thou on the earth; likewise to the small rain (Early Rain), and to the great rain (Latter Rain) of his strength.

Joel 2:23 Be glad then, ye children of Zion, and rejoice in Jehovah your God; for he giveth you the Early Rain in just measure, and he causes to come down for you the rain, the Early Rain and the Latter Rain, in the first month.

2Tim 1:7 For God hath not given us the spirit of fear; but of power, and of love, and of a sound mind.

My statement is supported by scripture.

You have not proved that my statement isn’t supported by scripture..

You have just posted what you believe and have railroaded over my statement...without any explanation...just a commentary of your own belief system....which is no more valid than mine, vice versa...


Romans 8

​

King James Version​

​

​

8 There is therefore now no condemnation to them which are in Christ Jesus, who walk not after the flesh, but after the Spirit.
2 For the law of the Spirit of life in Christ Jesus hath made me free from the law of sin and death.
3 For what the law could not do, in that it was weak through the flesh, God sending his own Son in the likeness of sinful flesh, and for sin, condemned sin in the flesh:
4 That the righteousness of the law might be fulfilled in us, who walk not after the flesh, but after the Spirit.
5 For they that are after the flesh do mind the things of the flesh; but they that are after the Spirit the things of the Spirit.
6 For to be carnally minded is death; but to be spiritually minded is life and peace.
7 Because the carnal mind is enmity against God: for it is not subject to the law of God, neither indeed can be.
8 So then they that are in the flesh cannot please God.
9 But ye are not in the flesh, but in the Spirit, if so be that the Spirit of God dwell in you. Now if any man have not the Spirit of Christ, he is none of his.
10 And if Christ be in you, the body is dead because of sin; but the Spirit is life because of righteousness.
11 But if the Spirit of him that raised up Jesus from the dead dwell in you, he that raised up Christ from the dead shall also quicken your mortal bodies by his Spirit that dwelleth in you.
12 Therefore, brethren, we are debtors, not to the flesh, to live after the flesh.
13 For if ye live after the flesh, ye shall die: but if ye through the Spirit do mortify the deeds of the body, ye shall live.
14 For as many as are led by the Spirit of God, they are the sons of God.
15 For ye have not received the spirit of bondage again to fear; but ye have received the Spirit of adoption, whereby we cry, Abba, Father.
16 The Spirit itself beareth witness with our spirit, that we are the children of God:
17 And if children, then heirs; heirs of God, and joint-heirs with Christ; if so be that we suffer with him, that we may be also glorified together.
18 For I reckon that the sufferings of this present time are not worthy to be compared with the glory which shall be revealed in us.
19 For the earnest expectation of the creature waiteth for the manifestation of the sons of God.
20 For the creature was made subject to vanity, not willingly, but by reason of him who hath subjected the same in hope,
21 Because the creature itself also shall be delivered from the bondage of corruption into the glorious liberty of the children of God.
22 For we know that the whole creation groaneth and travaileth in pain together until now.
23 And not only they, but ourselves also, which have the firstfruits of the Spirit, even we ourselves groan within ourselves, waiting for the adoption, to wit, the redemption of our body.
24 For we are saved by hope: but hope that is seen is not hope: for what a man seeth, why doth he yet hope for?
25 But if we hope for that we see not, then do we with patience wait for it.
26 Likewise the Spirit also helpeth our infirmities: for we know not what we should pray for as we ought: but the Spirit itself maketh intercession for us with groanings which cannot be uttered.
27 And he that searcheth the hearts knoweth what is the mind of the Spirit, because he maketh intercession for the saints according to the will of God.
28 And we know that all things work together for good to them that love God, to them who are the called according to his purpose.
29 For whom he did foreknow, he also did predestinate to be conformed to the image of his Son, that he might be the firstborn among many brethren.
30 Moreover whom he did predestinate, them he also called: and whom he called, them he also justified: and whom he justified, them he also glorified.
31 What shall we then say to these things? If God be for us, who can be against us?
32 He that spared not his own Son, but delivered him up for us all, how shall he not with him also freely give us all things?
33 Who shall lay any thing to the charge of God's elect? It is God that justifieth.
34 Who is he that condemneth? It is Christ that died, yea rather, that is risen again, who is even at the right hand of God, who also maketh intercession for us.
35 Who shall separate us from the love of Christ? shall tribulation, or distress, or persecution, or famine, or nakedness, or peril, or sword?
36 As it is written, For thy sake we are killed all the day long; we are accounted as sheep for the slaughter.
37 Nay, in all these things we are more than conquerors through him that loved us.
38 For I am persuaded, that neither death, nor life, nor angels, nor principalities, nor powers, nor things present, nor things to come,
39 Nor height, nor depth, nor any other creature, shall be able to separate us from the love of God, which is in Christ Jesus our Lord.