Understanding what Sheol, Hell, Hades mean.

[Wick Stick]

Not being rude.....I want you to find the prison aspect.

Can do...

Psalms 18:

The sorrows of death compassed me, and the floods of ungodly men made me afraid. The sorrows of [sheol] compassed me about: the snares of death prevented me.

Verses 4 and 5 show the watery nature of the pit (floods), as well as an idea of restriction of movement (compassed, snares, prevented).

Jonah 2:

I cried by reason of mine affliction unto the LORD, and he heard me; out of the belly of [sheol] cried I, and thou heardest my voice.
For thou hadst cast me into the deep, in the midst of the seas; and the floods compassed me about: all thy billows and thy waves passed over me ... The waters compassed me about, even to the soul: [Tehowm] closed me round about ... I went down to the bottoms of the mountains; the earth with her bars was about me for ever: yet hast thou brought up my life from corruption, O LORD my God

Verse 2, Jonah claims to have been in sheol. Verse 3 we again have a watery place with a restriction of movement. Verse 5 Jonah equates Sheol and Tehowm (the Deep), which is elsewhere describes as having gates and windows. Verse 6 is said to have bars. (On closer inspection this word can also mean gates). Also note also the mention of corruption. Jonah didn't just have a whale ride, he DIED. His body was even beginning to rot according to this verse, before God resurrected him and sent him on his way.

Job 17:

If I wait, [Sheol] is mine house: I have made my bed in the darkness. I have said to corruption, Thou art my father: to the worm, Thou art my mother, and my sister. And where is now my hope? as for my hope, who shall see it? They shall go down to the bars of [Sheol], when our rest together is in the dust.

In verses 13-17 Job talks about corruption and the worm consuming him, and again we have BARS on Sheol. Different word than in Jonah, this one actually appears to be bars, rather than a gate.

Isaiah 38, Sheol again has gates:

The writing of Hezekiah king of Judah, when he had been sick, and was recovered of his sickness: I said in the cutting off of my days, I shall go to the gates of [Sheol]: I am deprived of the residue of my years.

Ezekiel 31:

Thus saith the Lord GOD; In the day when he went down to [Sheol] I caused a mourning: I covered [Tehowm] for him, and I restrained the floods thereof, and the great waters were stayed: and I caused Lebanon to mourn for him, and all the trees of the field fainted for him. I made the nations to shake at the sound of his fall, when I cast him down to [Sheol] with them that descend into the pit: and all the trees of Eden, the choice and best of Lebanon, all that drink water, shall be comforted in the nether parts of the earth.

Sheol again is equivalent to Tehowm, again a watery place, and here is said to be the lowest part of the earth, or below the earth.

A topic like this, if you are like me, you have to keep the biblical separate from the extra biblical information.

But the Bible itself doesn't keep them separate. The NT authors don't seem to have any problem making allusions and references to extra Biblical sources. If Paul or Jesus makes an allusion to something outside canon... are you still going to reject it for being non-canonical?

 

[Grailhunter]

Sheol again is equivalent to Tehowm, again a watery place, and here is said to be the lowest part of the earth, or below the earth.

You are getting this from the KJV.
Imaginative, it means you are thinking.....exploring.....interpreting meanings beyond the scripture.

But the Bible itself doesn't keep them separate. The NT authors don't seem to have any problem making allusions and references to extra Biblical sources. If Paul or Jesus makes an allusion to something outside canon... are you still going to reject it for being non-canonical?

I am not being critical.

The Apostles and maybe Christ were referencing texts that were lost. If the original Book of Enoch was around it would have blown their minds.

 

[Wick Stick]

You are getting this from the KJV.

Yes, when I went to school they had us memorize about a third of the Bible from the KJV. When I recall verses, it's typically in that version.

Imaginative, it means you are thinking.....exploring.....interpreting meanings beyond the scripture.

I've been at the exploring and thinking and interpreting a long time. I'm not sure it's exactly imaginative. I DO allow other sources to inform my understanding of Scripture. As regards this topic, the intertestamental book I referred to is 1Enoch. The topic itself lends itself to comparative religion studies - comparing the Greeks' conception of Hades to the Jews' Sheol and Tehowm, and the Babylonians' Absu.

I am not being critical.

The Apostles and maybe Christ were referencing texts that were lost. If the original Book of Enoch was around it would have blown their minds.

The Book of Enoch WAS around back then. There's considerable evidence internal to the Bible that John the Baptist, Jesus, and His brothers were familiar with it.

 

[Grailhunter]

The Book of Enoch WAS around back then. There's considerable evidence internal to the Bible that John the Baptist, Jesus, and His brothers were familiar with it.

I am not saying that it was not around at the time of Christ but because the early church writings after the biblical period do not have much to say about it and it was not around for the Canon.

 

[MatthewG]

You're speaking of the literal Gehenna (Hinnom's Hill)? Don't you think that it stood as an emblem for a place in the hereafter?

Definitely related.

In Greek writings, Tartarus isn't part of Hades, but the ENTRANCE to Tartarus is in Hades. Also, Tartarus is a titan in conflict with their gods, including Hades.

Not to suggest that Greek myths are particularly reliable, but the Bible uses Greek language to explain this, so that's what we got.

Hello Wick.

Just sharing, it’s all we got. Thank you for considering what I believe in faith. If a person goes through Gods fire later on in the afterlife I’m one who tend to believe they can be restored; of course that is out of hope for their betterment; and accepting truth concerning Yahweh, and his Son.

 

[MatthewG]

Hello Wick.

Just sharing, it’s all we got. Thank you for considering what I believe in faith. If a person goes through Gods fire later on in the afterlife I’m one who tend to believe they can be restored; of course that is out of hope for their betterment; and accepting truth concerning Yahweh, and his Son.

For whatever reason though; I do conclude the devil, false prophet, the beast in being done away forever because that’s what revelation 20 states. Though when it comes to everyone else, it doesn’t seem to play out that way. As life continues to exist outside of the kingdom of Yahweh, including those whom come within its gates within it. Revelation 21-22, are a complete set forth new age of things. Not the prior (Revelation 1-20.) though revelation 21,22 harkens back to those prior chapters in the fire need to be ready to be taken by Christ as his bride in that day and age which is has came and went.

Which is something only believed on in faith, and hope of promises never failing.

 

[Hobie]

All I can say is do a study on Judaism.
They definitely believe in Yahweh.
And there are different sects of Judaism today and some can get interesting.

But that's why we have the word of God, so it's not just the idea of man or private interpretation, but God's truth. All will face the judgment at the end and either gain eternal life or perish in the lake of fire, its right there in God's Word.

 

[Grailhunter]

But that's why we have the word of God, so it's not just the idea of man or private interpretation, but God's truth. All will face the judgment at the end and either gain eternal life or perish in the lake of fire, its right there in God's Word.

I am not saying that there is not a Hell. I am saying that the Jews do not believe in it. The Hebrew Bible, what we call the Old Testament is also the Word of God. And in the Old Testament the Jews were never threatened with an eternal fiery Hell. It would be a cruel joke to send them there with no warning.

Yeshua being a God and Messiah was a complete shock to them and sacrilegious to their Old Testament beliefs.

 

[Wick Stick]

For whatever reason though; I do conclude the devil, false prophet, the beast in being done away forever because that’s what revelation 20 states.

It also has Hades being thrown into the Lake of Fire. But it isn't clear to me whether Hades is full or empty at that point.

 

[MatthewG]

It also has Hades being thrown into the Lake of Fire. But it isn't clear to me whether Hades is full or empty at that point.

Doesn’t it say something like “then hades and the sea, gave up its dead” this is something I would allude to the souls being taken out from that separate state which was before sin was taken care of. There are only three to be said to be in the lake of fire, or titles or definitions? The devil, the false prophet, and the beast. Forever, and there was people who after hell being emptied would be useless if it’s thrown away (significantly revealing a much expanded state of the dead which was before explained by Jesus in the parable of the dead man and Lazarus in his discussion with the Pharisees.)

It’s interesting to know Jesus crossed over the chasm of Abraham’s bosom and the people whom were separated and seemingly not as at rest as those on the other side, with fear, dread and want, I even consider taturus being a lower than the chasm which Jesus cross and he went and preached a message to them in the after life in the same place which is done away with today “Sheol/Hades.”

Or atleast it’s interesting to have faith in these extraordinary things Jesus has been able to do by the spirit trusting that his promises are true.

It never does say people do not go into the lake of fire, but it never says forever after revelation 20, and all things are made new where there is “no more sea.”

I believe through translation periods perhaps Brazen Sea, or Molten Sea, would be a better fitting choice in description of what is new.

1 a new administration set forthright by Jesus and his bride which he had claimed,

2 abolishing material religion predicating all things by faith, spirit, truth, love and hope.

But my digressions are always unneeded! And undesired! Love to share with and be straightforward.

 

[MatthewG]

Doesn’t it say something like “then hades and the sea, gave up its dead” this is something I would allude to the souls being taken out from that separate state which was before sin was taken care of. There are only three to be said to be in the lake of fire, or titles or definitions? The devil, the false prophet, and the beast. Forever, and there was people who after hell being emptied would be useless if it’s thrown away (significantly revealing a much expanded state of the dead which was before explained by Jesus in the parable of the dead man and Lazarus in his discussion with the Pharisees.)

It’s interesting to know Jesus crossed over the chasm of Abraham’s bosom and the people whom were separated and seemingly not as at rest as those on the other side, with fear, dread and want, I even consider taturus being a lower than the chasm which Jesus cross and he went and preached a message to them in the after life in the same place which is done away with today “Sheol/Hades.”

Or atleast it’s interesting to have faith in these extraordinary things Jesus has been able to do by the spirit trusting that his promises are true.

It never does say people do not go into the lake of fire, but it never says forever after revelation 20, and all things are made new where there is “no more sea.”

I believe through translation periods perhaps Brazen Sea, or Molten Sea, would be a better fitting choice in description of what is new.

1 a new administration set forthright by Jesus and his bride which he had claimed,

2 abolishing material religion predicating all things by faith, spirit, truth, love and hope.

But my digressions are always unneeded! And undesired! Love to share with and be straightforward.

To just expand a bit more on the normally perceived notions through image sharing which depicts human beings being marred in this living pool of lava, which is a modern day way of how “hell” can be taught to be. Even going as to far as to suggest that “God” loves this, and he reciprocates glory from all of these people who were not chosen and on top of this, he knew that from the beginning however created them anyway, and makes the choice to be glorified in them remaining in this “scene” described above.

“Hell/Sheol” (Abraham’s Bosom / Prisoner(restless), and further away in Tartus, was the chained angels of that time who were also held for judgment, that judgment is merged into the overall context of what played out concerning when Yeshua spoke concerning the end times, and how he to them, explained the current state of the day by the “Rich man and Lazarus” parable which all of us should be reminded that what Jesus speaks is spiritual, not always talking about material, so do pray and ask for guidance by the spirit which Yahavah/Yahweh displays by giving you his spirit on your heart to love in the way he desires us to love which is in spirit and in truth; and while in some situations one may find themselves lying through; it doesn’t disconnect a person from a relationship with Yahweh.

If they become faithless in renouncing their prior standing and they become unbelieving, sometimes falling back into their flesh and when a person starts to lie, and love to make lies for the sake of doing so; is in danger and in need of help to guiding them to the path where safety can be found being set in stone planted next to the chief cornerstone and let him be our light in this life to help give light and life to others by giving up ourselves in merit to Yahweh and his Son Yeshua by picking up our own cross to bear while getting underneath another and helping them to bear their load coming in to them which could be anything under the sun.

Dying, with Yeshua. Buried with Him, and raised again into newness of life by the Holy Spirit of Yahweh which rose Yeshua from the dead when Yahweh sent his Spirit to raise him up from the dead.

The over all arching point to be solved here is, how is “hell” hot? Other than the pressure of anticipation of judgement, but not only that but finally being able to go and be able to feast in the kingdom of heaven, in new spiritual bodies which had not been given until returned gathered the bride and judgement was cast upon the age which Yeshua spoke of in the generation before he was killed; Israel whom said “Pilate, let his blood be on us and our children” in other terms “we will take on his blood as our punishment - so will our children” and within 40-42 years a generation past and the overview of the Oliver discourse is revealed within a (timelapsing progression, up to the final event “destruction of Israel, and the ridding of material religion as a whole, in judgment bringing forth “reconciliation, and “new earth and heavens” one where “Satan” has been cast out and now Yahweh, the Lord God Almighty, with His Son Yeshua, now sit together ruling the now “Spiritual Kingdom of Yeshua, and Yahweh, which all people come into through adoption, calling out to Yahweh, as “Father”, asking for help by the Holy Spirit in Yeshuas name to get through this hard life.

People today. Who die on their death bed or perhaps they get killed in a wreck or something. To me everyone is judged and Yahweh will give the best possible gift he ever could to them which will be there new habitat (mansion) home, a new spiritual home to live in. Whether condemned or of life or better than the normal. Yahweh is a giver of good gifts.

Even if it takes from walking in the darkness towards the consuming fire “Eternal God” and going through the lake of fire in order to be restored even save what’s little left of a person, the gates of the kingdom never close, with hell not being hot? It must be atleast like going through the belly of a whale for three days. Debilitating and frustrating making things hot.

 

[ShineTheLight]

For whatever reason though; I do conclude the devil, false prophet, the beast in being done away forever because that’s what revelation 20 states. Though when it comes to everyone else, it doesn’t seem to play out that way.

You disregard what others have told you regarding the end times. You're subscribed to a doctrine that falls in line with Preterism.

 

[MatthewG]

You disregard what others have told you regarding the end times. You're subscribed to a doctrine that falls in line with Preterism.

Your concern, is just revolting; because it’s faith which makes a person right with Yahweh. Not their doctrinal positions, silly. May the Holy Spirit of Yahweh be with you and the fellowship of his Son! For real; for real.

 

[Ronald Nolette]

By the time of Jesus, some Jews had come to believe that those in Sheol awaited the resurrection either in comfort (in the bosom of Abraham) or in torment. This belief is reflected in Jesus' story of the rich man and Lazarus which was being brought in by Hellenistic influences and had begun to make inroads. At that time most Jews believed that Sheol meant simply the grave. Although many use this account to support that the wicked go to Hades when they die, most readers forget the story is actually a parable, not an account of real events.

So over time as the Greek pagan traditions and ideas were picked up by Hellenistic Jews and mixed in with the beliefs from the Hebrew Canon, you can see where even for the Jews, Sheol began to be compared to Hades of Greek mythology to refer to the abode of the dead, when they spoke of death, the grave, or the judgement. So when the ultimate translation of the text to Greek from Hebrew came about, the Greek words were not seen as an issue, and thus the confusion we see today.

Well Hobie :

You have made many errors.

First sheol/hades/hell are not permanent abodes. They were and are temporary abodes of the souls of the dead until the great white throne judgment when they are resurrected and cast into the lake of fire to be tormented forever.

Tartarus is not a place where Satan and the 1/3 of angels who rebelled with him are. It is for the angels who left heaven in Gen. 6 and had sex with human women. Remember these angels are chained until cast into the lake of fire.

The story of Lazarus is a true account and not a parable.

ALL, I repeat ALL parables Jesus spoke made comparisons using earthly examples to describe and keep secret heavenly things. Remember in MAtt. 13 Jesus spoke in parables to hide truth from the masses.

All parables use comparative language : "likend unto" "is like", "is as", "compared to" or other terms which tell us Jesus was making a comparison.

NO parables used names.

Jesus spoke this true account by saying "there was a man", that means there was a man! Jesus was never sloppy with grammar.

 

[MatthewG]

Many people say that Lazarus and the rich man is not a parable but reading the narrative, Jesus is explaining the state of the dead to them, in this parable in a glimpse of what’s was going on in the afterlife; which reflects also his telling of the Sadducees; whom did not believe the soul continued onward. Anyone who suggest its true, it’s up to you to go and explore that entire narrative. There is no difference made even if names are mentioned, it was a telling of the truth concerning the state of the dead; prior before being done away with later on.

 

[Berean]

So please tell us about your own brotherhood so that we may scrutinize them with the same measure of scriptural correctness…..that is only fair, isn’t it?

LOL ... scriptural correctness? He didn't provide one shred of evidence for his comment, let alone a scripture

 

[Hobie]

I am not saying that there is not a Hell. I am saying that the Jews do not believe in it. The Hebrew Bible, what we call the Old Testament is also the Word of God. And in the Old Testament the Jews were never threatened with an eternal fiery Hell. It would be a cruel joke to send them there with no warning.

Yeshua being a God and Messiah was a complete shock to them and sacrilegious to their Old Testament beliefs.

They believe that there will be a time and place where God will judge and the wicked will see His justice. So same thing, Christ unveiled this even further when He was teaching..

 

[Grailhunter]

They believe that there will be a time and place where God will judge and the wicked will see His justice. So same thing, Christ unveiled this even further when He was teaching..

As a whole scholars define Old Testament Judaism as a “this world” religion….because the spirit world and afterlife is not well defined in the Old Testament.

In the Old Testament and in the 1st century the Jews did not believe in the Devil, Hell, or Heaven as a reward or even Salvation. Resurrection and judgment was believed by the Pharisees, but the scenario and events do not align with Christian beliefs and Sheol played a part of this. And Heaven was never offered as a reward.

Now centuries after the biblical period there where some changes to this but Jewish beliefs never align themselves with Christian beliefs about the afterlife.

The Babylonian Talmud (200-500 AD) includes a long passage that described Rosh HaShanah and is sometimes called a "day of judgment" but it is nothing like the Christian Judgment Day. In the Jewish version the dead are raised in the days of the messianic period. The wicked to be judged and destroyed, as in their souls reduced to ashes that are scattered under the feet of the righteous.

So what happens to the “good Jews” again it ends up in a kind of fuzzy theology depending on various Jewish sects….nothing defined even though some sects believe like the Jehovah’s Witnesses do, in a Physical Eden type earth and the destruction of the souls.. But none of this was part of Jewish Old Testament beliefs, if salvation and a Heavenly reward was part of their beliefs there would have been no reason for Christ.

Olam haBa (afterlife) is not a well defined belief, be it among Reformed, Conservative, or Orthodox Jews. Post biblical Judaism has always maintained a belief in an afterlife, but the forms of which this belief has assumed and the modes in which it has been expressed have varied greatly and differed from period to period.

Thus even today several distinct conceptions about the fate of man after death exist depending on the sect of Judaism but generally no distinct Jewish theological beliefs exists for this.

Sources….Jewish Virtual Library and Hebrew University in Jerusalem.

 

[Jack]

Matthew 25
41 Then He will also say to those on the left hand, 'Depart from Me, you cursed, into the everlasting fire prepared for the devil and his angels:
Revelation 20:10
10 The devil, who deceived them, was cast into the lake of fire and brimstone where the beast and the false prophet are. And they will be tormented day and night forever and ever.

Amen Jesus!

 

[Behold]

Another fact about Hell.

Everyone who went there today, now believes it exists, and they all now also Believe in Jesus, and this does not SAVE THEM, because you can't be born again in Hell.
Why not?
Because once you are there, you now SEE that Hell is real, and now you have proof you can SEE that leads you to believe that JESUS is Real.
And that is not FAITH.
FAITH, is TRUST, and in the case of Christianity, its TRUST IN WHAT YOU CAN'T See,... so your belief is from the HEART, and not from your EYES..
Understand?
So, once in Hell, you SEE that Hell exists, and that PROOF, shows you that JESUS is REAL, and that is not FAITH..

God requires FAITH, in, what you can't SEE....to save YOU.

2.) How long does Hell last?

It lasts until its cast into the Lake of Fire.

3.) How long does Eternal Damnation last....?

This.. JOHN 3:36

It lasts for as long as you are held accountable for dying as a Christ Rejector, never born again.

So, God will hold you accountable for as long as Christ lives.

4.) "but behold, my church believes that God is going to let everyone out of Hell".

And put you where? ????

Heaven?
Really?
God is going to put the CHRIST REJECTORS, the unforgiven SINNNERS.... who are still in their SIN, next to the BORN AGAIN who Trusted in Christ, and are FORGIVEN THEIR Sin, and are become "one with God'?

That will never happen. (There is no sin found in Heaven.. no sin found in the Kingdom of God). = No sinners found there...ever.

Hell awaits those, right now.



5.) Reader, there are 2 Types of Eternal Life.

One is found "in Christ" who Himself is Eternal Life, and ALL the born again are "IN Christ"..."one with GOD"..

The other type of Eternal life is the ""2nd Death"".. and what is that? That is the 1st Death continued for Eternity.

What is the first death ? = ITs to be spiritually separated from GOD, = never born again......So "2nd Death" is to never be able to be born again,.. You died never born again..... and you are that way now and for eternity, .. separated from GOD, separated from Heaven, separated from Christ.

= That is "Eternal Damnation". = That is the "2nd Death". That is the Eternal Life of the person who Rejected Christ all their life, and died never born again.

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You don't want to go to Hell ????????.... You are concerned about this right now?

Then turn to Christ by Faith... right now, Reader.

= BELIEVE that you need to be forgiven, because you do, and turn to Christ by FAITH... and Let God forgive you.
He will do it for "all who call on the Name of Jesus, shall be saved"
"All that Believe in JESUS< shall be forgiven, shall be saved".

Reader, .."all have sinned",....... and God knows what you've done........all of it, and He says..>"COME HOME>.. You are welcome here"..."Come HOME"...... "Trust in my Son, and i will make you MINE.. forever and ever".

= That is God's promise, and He will do it for you Today, now.... right now.

"NOW is the day, now is the time... for your Salvation"....