What is YOUR "thorn in the flesh"?

[Dan Clarkston]

in Pauls' case he was given insight and understanding as to why he was suffering chastisement in that particular way (whatever that way happened to be).

So you think God called up the devil on his cell phone (666-666-6666) and said "Yo devil... God here, I want you to go attack Paul and do all you can to stop him from fulfilling the mission I sent him to fulfill... and send me the bill for whatever it costs you and your demons to work on this project, thanks devil"

 

[Lizbeth]

So you think God called up the devil on his cell phone (666-666-6666) and said "Yo devil... God here, I want you to go attack Paul and do all you can to stop him from fulfilling the mission I sent him to fulfill... and send me the bill for whatever it costs you and your demons to work on this project, thanks devil"
View attachment 52211

Sorry I don't understand what you are trying to say. Is this a line of discussion here...?...I haven't caught up with the thread yet.

But I would like to point out that God created both good and evil, in case it is relevant to your point.

 

[Marvelloustime]

That is such a lovely reminder sister . PRAISE GOD you gave it . YOU SPOT ON RIGHT . SPOT on RIGHT SISTER .
say it again for all to hear . I agree sister .

@amigo de christo

 

[MatthewG]

I’m typically a hateful, spiteful, self serving person. For whatever reason Gods grace is still enough.

 

[amigo de christo]

Sorry I don't understand what you are trying to say. Is this a line of discussion here...?...I haven't caught up with the thread yet.

But I would like to point out that God created both good and evil, in case it is relevant to your point.

Dan dont see the reason for why paul was given the thorn . lest i should be EXALTED above measure .
Paul had recieved many revelations of the LORD .

 

[Marvelloustime]

Dan dont see the reason for why paul was given the thorn . lest i should be EXALTED above measure .
Paul had recieved many revelations of the LORD .

@amigo de christo

 

[amigo de christo]

I’m typically a hateful, spiteful, self serving person. For whatever reason Gods grace is still enough.

Good that you confessed this . Now we can pray God give you power over this .
The one thing no man ever wants to do is continue in his error . none of us wants that .
step one confess and repent . Grace teaches us to DENY wordly lusts .
But beware of one thing . If any preaches another gospel do not heed or beleive them .
For many now preach an anti christ gospel that seems loving and kind to the world
but in truth its death leading only to the second death . Satan will make something sound good for us
when in truth its meant for our destruction . So beware him and his minsitirs
for they will preach another love , another gospel and that message will
omit the VERY fact one must BELIEVE JESUS IS THE CHRIST . it is a message of death unto death .

 

[Dan Clarkston]

But I would like to point out that God created both good and evil, in case it is relevant to your point.

That is error... there is no evil in God so He's not the One responsible for evil being here.... lucifer is.
If you knew scripture you would know that lucifer perverted righteousness by choosing to be in opposition to God.... anybody that thinks God created evil does not know the Lord or His Word.

James 1:13
Let no man say when he is tempted, I am tempted of God: for God cannot be tempted with evil, neither tempteth he any man:

1 John 1:5
This then is the message which we have heard of him, and declare unto you, that God is light, and in him is no darkness at all.

Ezekiel 28:15 (speaking of lucifer)
Thou wast perfect in thy ways from the day that thou wast created, till iniquity was found in thee.

God created lucifer perfect... until lucifer decided to be in opposition to God:

Isaiah 14:13 (speaking of lucifer)
For thou hast said in thine heart, I will ascend into heaven, I will exalt my throne above the stars of God: I will sit also upon the mount of the congregation, in the sides of the north:

I’m typically a hateful, spiteful, self serving person.

You should get BORN AGAIN and become a new creature in Christ.... and stop acting like the devil!

2 Corinthians 5:17
Therefore if any man be in Christ, he is a new creature: old things are passed away; behold, all things are become new.

Ephesians 4:22,23
That ye put off concerning the former conversation the old man, which is corrupt according to the deceitful lusts;
And be renewed in the spirit of your mind;

Galatians 5:16
This I say then, Walk in the Spirit, and ye shall not fulfil the lust of the flesh.

 

[MatthewG]

Hello @Dan Clarkston,

Thank you for your assumption. I already know scripture you have no real reason to quote it to me. Thank you sir.

 

[amigo de christo]

Hello @Dan Clarkston,

Thank you for your assumption. I already know scripture you have no real reason to quote it to me. Thank you sir.

but the question is do you really know the scrips . Even you admitted you have not even read all of the new testament .
We better watch out mathew . we better watch out .
I invite us all to RETURN to the bible and to read it daily for ourselves without the influence of men .
SEE what might happen .

 

[Lizbeth]

That is error... there is no evil in God so He's not the One responsible for evil being here.... lucifer is.
If you knew scripture you would know that lucifer perverted righteousness by choosing to be in opposition to God.... anybody that thinks God created evil does not know the Lord or His Word.

James 1:13
Let no man say when he is tempted, I am tempted of God: for God cannot be tempted with evil, neither tempteth he any man:

1 John 1:5
This then is the message which we have heard of him, and declare unto you, that God is light, and in him is no darkness at all.

Ezekiel 28:15 (speaking of lucifer)
Thou wast perfect in thy ways from the day that thou wast created, till iniquity was found in thee.

God created lucifer perfect... until lucifer decided to be in opposition to God:

Isaiah 14:13 (speaking of lucifer)
For thou hast said in thine heart, I will ascend into heaven, I will exalt my throne above the stars of God: I will sit also upon the mount of the congregation, in the sides of the north:

This all has to do with the sovereignty of God. The Lord knows both good and evil. He is the one who created the Tree of Knowledge of Good and Evil. He foreknew what Lucifer would do before He even created him, just like He foreknew what Adam & Eve would do, and just as He always foreknown everything that will happen from the beginning. But I believe we can trust that He uses evil justly in His perfect wisdom. He judges justly and righteously, and also chastises those who belong to Him for our spiritual good. And notice for example how bad things are in nations that practice witchcraft and sorcery….take the situation in Haiti for example. I think that is God’s just judgment for sins….kind of the just and natural consequences for rampant witchcraft and sorcery and other sins and darkness that comes from it. The Lord sends or allows evil in an effort to cause hearts to be amenable to the gospel and repentance. Satan has to obtain God's permission as it were, to do anything....as per the example in Job, and also how Jesus said Satan desired to sift Peter. The Lord is sovereign over everything, and that is why He is the one we are to fear.......and also why He is the one we can appeal to on our own behalf or on behalf of others.

Isa 54:16

“See, it is I who created the blacksmith who fans the coals into flame and forges a weapon fit for its work. And it is I who have created the destroyer to wreak havoc;

Isa 45:7

I form the light, and create darkness: I make peace, and create evil: I the LORD do all these things.

 

[Dan Clarkston]

I already know scripture you have no real reason to quote it to me

Apparently you don't actually know the scripture concerning what it really means to be born again based on what you said.

I believe we can trust that He uses evil justly in His perfect wisdom

You.... believe wrong.

There is no darkness in God and He is NOT testing, tempting, or trying man with evil!

1 John 1:5
This then is the message which we have heard of him, and declare unto you, that God is light, and in him is no darkness at all.

James 1:13
God cannot be tempted with evil, neither tempteth he any man:

John 10:10
The thief cometh not, but for to steal, and to kill, and to destroy: I am come that they might have life, and that they might have it more abundantly.

and also chastises those who belong to Him for our spiritual good.

And sadly the devil has deceived you thru false doctrine that God is putting evil things upon His people to teach them and correct them... things such as car wrecks, cancer, loss of employment, house burning down, rape, murder, sickness and disease, etc,etc.

The Lord sends or allows evil

The problem here is you are confusing the Lord with satan.

This is prevalent among those that don't except the whole counsel of God which leads to false doctrine

satan has to obtain God's permission as it were, to do anything....as per the example in Job

You failed to understand that Job tells us that he was in FEAR... and being in FEAR is a sin which is an open do to the devil.
(What we sow is what we reap... Job sowed to the flesh and reaped corruption - see Gal 6:7,8)

And, under the New Testament the devil cannot go before the Lord because Hebrews 9:23-24 tells us Jesus has cleansed the heavenlies with His own Blood so the devil no longer addresses the Father like he could under the Old Testament which he was able to do under the authority that God gave Adam that Adam gave to satan when Adam committed high treason against God.
(Jesus reversed that thru His death, burial, and resurrection)

You'll notice in the Book of Job God told the devil that Job was already under the devil's authority (God did not give authority to the devil to attack Job), and all the Lord did was proclaim to the devil that he could not kill Job.

Jesus said the fearful will have their place in the lake that burns with fire (Revelation 21:8) which is how we know being in fear is sinful behavior.... Job tells us "For the thing which I greatly feared is come upon me" (Job 3:25)

So... those that don't accept the whole counsel of God and choose to instead believe false doctrine that teaches the devil works for the Lord and God sends the devil to go do bad things to His people.... have an open door into their lives that allow satan to bring destruction and believing this disqualifies them from God's promises of deliverance. (Notice Job received deliverance when he got back in to faith praying / doing an offering for his friends)

Job did not have God's entire written Word as we do today... if he had, he would not have walked in fear concerning his kids cursing God and dying so satan would not have had an opening in to his life.

It's really sad to hear people think so little of the Lord that they believe God and satan are the same guy!

The Lord is sovereign over everything

You must be one of those calvinists that believe God causes everything that happens to happen.... like when a child molester rapes a child... calvinists believe God CAUSED the child molester to do the dastardly deed. That's too bad for you to be walking in such lies and deceptions!

Isa 54:16

“See, it is I who created the blacksmith who fans the coals into flame and forges a weapon fit for its work. And it is I who have created the destroyer to wreak havoc;

Isa 45:7

I form the light, and create darkness: I make peace, and create evil: I the LORD do all these things.

No, the Lord created lucifer... and it is lucifer that opposed the Lord which is what brought forth sin and darkness.

Your view is that God said one day... "Hmm, I think today I'll created evil.... what fun this will be to keep everyone confused"

You calvinists are really clueless!

 

[MatthewG]

Hello @Dan Clarkston,

I am going to just place you on ignore to save me time and trouble with dealing with your own decision to demonstrate judgements concerning, who and who is not a believer in the resurrected Lord Jesus Christ. Thank you! It's much easier for me to walk away from the situation than it is to continue to engage, by the grace of the LORD GOD ALMIGHTY, may he deal with all the hearts out there whom are seeking after him in faith which pleases him.

 

[MA2444]

Are you refreshed by the Spirit daily?

The Bible can’t refresh my spirit, only the Living Spirit can do that.

5. Jeremiah 31:25``I will refresh the weary and satisfy the faint.'' God wants to refresh us when we are weary and faint. He invites us to turn to him and receive this refreshment. I like to imagine streams of living water washing over me as he refreshes my soul

No the bible cant refresh your spirit. But the Holy Spirit can and any time you crack that bible open to read you go into the presence of God and the Holy Spirit is waiting on you so He can teach you and speak to you and refresh you. He leads us into all truth.

 

[Dan Clarkston]

Hello @Dan Clarkston,

I am going to just place you on ignore to save me time and trouble with dealing with your own decision to demonstrate judgements concerning, who and who is not a believer in the resurrected Lord Jesus Christ. Thank you! It's much easier for me to walk away from the situation than it is to continue to engage, by the grace of the LORD GOD ALMIGHTY, may he deal with all the hearts out there whom are seeking after him in faith which pleases him.

Yeah, those not interested in seeing what God's Word actually says.... would want to escape the conversation.
See ya!

 

[MA2444]

Just because God may allow certain bad tribulations to come upon you doesnt mean He sent them!

God is able to turn bad into good situation for those who love God.

Romans 8:28
28 And we know that all things work together for good to them that love God, to them who are the called according to his purpose..../KJV

 

[Verily]

Considering Job, we are told tribulation "worketh patience" and Paul says,

Romans 15:4 For whatsoever things were written aforetime were written for our learning, that we "through patience" and comfort of the scriptures might have hope.

Wherein we learn of the patience of Job

James 5:11 Behold, we count them happy which endure. Ye have heard of the patience of Job, and have seen the end of the Lord; that the Lord is very pitiful, and of tender mercy.

Satan asked the LORD to touch his flesh (the LORD did not) but Job was given into Satan's hand to touch his flesh (with limitations) seeing Satan believed Job would curse God in touching his flesh.

And that particular one come with a temptation in Job (given in his flesh) by Satan to provoke Job to curse God by it. Job's own wife is also Job's own flesh also. Notice his own wife is speaking the same thing as Satan trying to provoke her husband to curse God in the same. Unlike Adam who hearkened to his wife's voice in the garden (who was listening to Serpent) Job rebukes his own wife's words encouraging him to curse God and die.

Job 2:10 But he said unto her, Thou speakest as one of the foolish women speaketh. What? shall we receive good at the hand of God, and shall we not receive evil? In all this did not Job sin with his lips.

And it says Job did not sin with his lips in what he said.

From the beginning, the LORD said to Satan that Job was a perfect and upright man that feared God and escheweth evil

Job 1:8 And the LORD said unto Satan, Hast thou considered my servant Job, that there is none like him in the earth, a perfect and an upright man, one that feareth God, and escheweth evil?

It's by the fear of the LORD men depart from evil.

The LORD also adds in Job 2:3 that Satan is moving him against him to destroy him without any cause

Job 2:3 And the LORD said unto Satan, Hast thou considered my servant Job, that there is none like him in the earth, a perfect and an upright man, one that feareth God, and escheweth evil? and still he holdeth fast his integrity, although thou movedst me against him, to destroy him "without cause".

Job also said,

Job 9:17 For he breaketh me with a tempest, and multiplieth my wounds "without cause".

Which appears more like a firey trial using Satan in it, for example the Lord says to Simon,

Luke 22:31 And the Lord said, Simon, Simon, behold, Satan hath desired to have you, that he may sift you as wheat:
Luke 22:32 But I have prayed for thee, that thy faith fail not: and when thou art converted, strengthen thy brethren.

This shows Satan seeking permission to sift Simon also, as he needed permission to touch Job. And here we see Jesus praying for Simon's faith that it fail not. Peter confirming the souls of the brethren concerning the firey trial that had come to them in respect to their own faith as well.

1 Peter 1:7 That the trial of your faith, being much more precious than of gold that perisheth, though it be tried with fire, might be found unto praise and honour and glory at the appearing of Jesus Christ

Paul at least shows us how a messenger of Satan can be used for good.

2 Cr 12:7 And lest I should be exalted above measure through the abundance of the revelations, there was given to me a thorn in the flesh, the messenger of Satan to buffet me, lest I should be exalted above measure.

Paul also delivered Hymenaeus and Alexander unto Satan, that they may learn not to blaspheme in 1 Ti 1:20

Blaspheme is not a good thing, and yet being turned over to Satan to learn not to do that does not appear to
be a bad thing in this case either.

 

[MA2444]

Considering Job, we are told tribulation "worketh patience" and Paul says,

Romans 15:4 For whatsoever things were written aforetime were written for our learning, that we "through patience" and comfort of the scriptures might have hope.

Wherein we learn of the patience of Job

James 5:11 Behold, we count them happy which endure. Ye have heard of the patience of Job, and have seen the end of the Lord; that the Lord is very pitiful, and of tender mercy.

Satan asked the LORD to touch his flesh (the LORD did not) but Job was given into Satan's hand to touch his flesh (with limitations) seeing Satan believed Job would curse God in touching his flesh.

And that particular one come with a temptation in Job (given in his flesh) by Satan to provoke Job to curse God by it. Job's own wife is also Job's own flesh also. Notice his own wife is speaking the same thing as Satan trying to provoke her husband to curse God in the same. Unlike Adam who hearkened to his wife's voice in the garden (who was listening to Serpent) Job rebukes his own wife's words encouraging him to curse God and die.

Job 2:10 But he said unto her, Thou speakest as one of the foolish women speaketh. What? shall we receive good at the hand of God, and shall we not receive evil? In all this did not Job sin with his lips.

And it says Job did not sin with his lips in what he said.

From the beginning, the LORD said to Satan that Job was a perfect and upright man that feared God and escheweth evil

Job 1:8 And the LORD said unto Satan, Hast thou considered my servant Job, that there is none like him in the earth, a perfect and an upright man, one that feareth God, and escheweth evil?

It's by the fear of the LORD men depart from evil.

The LORD also adds in Job 2:3 that Satan is moving him against him to destroy him without any cause

Job 2:3 And the LORD said unto Satan, Hast thou considered my servant Job, that there is none like him in the earth, a perfect and an upright man, one that feareth God, and escheweth evil? and still he holdeth fast his integrity, although thou movedst me against him, to destroy him "without cause".

Job also said,

Job 9:17 For he breaketh me with a tempest, and multiplieth my wounds "without cause".

Which appears more like a firey trial using Satan in it, for example the Lord says to Simon,

Luke 22:31 And the Lord said, Simon, Simon, behold, Satan hath desired to have you, that he may sift you as wheat:
Luke 22:32 But I have prayed for thee, that thy faith fail not: and when thou art converted, strengthen thy brethren.

This shows Satan seeking permission to sift Simon also, as he needed permission to touch Job. And here we see Jesus praying for Simon's faith that it fail not. Peter confirming the souls of the brethren concerning the firey trial that had come to them in respect to their own faith as well.

1 Peter 1:7 That the trial of your faith, being much more precious than of gold that perisheth, though it be tried with fire, might be found unto praise and honour and glory at the appearing of Jesus Christ

Paul at least shows us how a messenger of Satan can be used for good.

2 Cr 12:7 And lest I should be exalted above measure through the abundance of the revelations, there was given to me a thorn in the flesh, the messenger of Satan to buffet me, lest I should be exalted above measure.

Paul also delivered Hymenaeus and Alexander unto Satan, that they may learn not to blaspheme in 1 Ti 1:20

Blaspheme is not a good thing, and yet being turned over to Satan to learn not to do that does not appear to
be a bad thing in this case either.

It sounded to me when God was talking to satan and said, have you considered my servant Job? ...that God was bragging on Job! Is that possible?

 

[Verily]

It sounded to me when God was talking to satan and said, have you considered my servant Job? ...that God was bragging on Job! Is that possible?

It does appear to have a similiar tone to that doesn't it? And even before his hedge was dropped and Job was tried

Job 23:10 But he knoweth the way that I take: when he hath tried me, I shall come forth as gold.

James 1:2 My brethren, count it all joy when ye fall into divers temptations;

James 1:3 Knowing this, that the trying of your faith worketh patience.

And then there is this,

James 1:4 But let patience have her perfect work, that ye may be perfect and entire, wanting nothing.

And we are told that that which was written aforetime was written for our learning, that we ourselves through patience and the comfort of the scriptures might have hope.

James also writes,

James 5:10 Take, my brethren, the prophets, who have spoken in the name of the Lord, for an example of suffering affliction, and of patience.

Job being one of those examples who endured suffering affliction and whose tribulation apparently worked the patience in Job or just tried the quality of it.

James 5:10 Behold, we count them happy which endure. Ye have heard of the patience of Job, and have seen the end of the Lord; that the Lord is very pitiful, and of tender mercy.

Tribulation and patience are found together here as well

Revelation 1:9 I John, who also am your brother, and companion in tribulation, and in the kingdom and patience of Jesus Christ, was in the isle that is called Patmos, for the word of God, and for the testimony of Jesus Christ.

Job is also one of the three men mentioned in scripture here

Ezekiel 14:14 Though these three men, Noah, Daniel, and Job, were in it, they should deliver but their own souls by their righteousness, saith the Lord GOD.

 

[Ritajanice]

No the bible cant refresh your spirit. But the Holy Spirit can and any time you crack that bible open to read you go into the presence of God and the Holy Spirit is waiting on you so He can teach you and speak to you and refresh you. He leads us into all truth.

I’m all ready in Gods presence, the Holy Spirit indwells my heart / spirit,permanently,

No one can say Jesus is Lord except by the Holy Spirit.

I’m in the will of the Father, I do his will every day..we are Spirit led.

I do not go into the presence of God when I read the Bible, his presence has lived in my spirit for the past 33 yrs..I have been birthed in the spirit...Born Again in my spirit and then I’m saved from eternal damnation and not before, my spirit must be birthed by the Holy Spirit, before I can be saved from eternal damnation, we are brought to repentance by the Spirit, we are forgiven all sins, by the Spirit, we are brought to believe in Jesus by the Spirit...we are birthed by the Spirit, our spirit is birthed it’s reborn, it’s a Living spirit birth, only the power of the Spirit can give us the spiritual rebirth, mind Blowing.

The Spirit testifies with our spirit that we are Gods children....he never stops witnessing that truth to our heart/spirit, all day every day, I am being made into Jesus image by the Holy Spirit Power that permanently indwells my spirit.

If I never read a Bible in my life, my spirit is still alive in Christ, I will never die in my spirit as it’s been birthed by the Holy Spirit, Born Again, you never know the time or place, when by Gods will, we will be Born Of The Spirit.

Can you see the wind= No.

Can you see the Spirit= No.

Can you see the effects of the wind= Yes.

Can you see the effects of the Spirit = Yes.

We should be growing in our spirit, into the character of Jesus, we should be honouring and glorifying “HIS” Name, not our name, talking about me, me, me,24/7..

You will know them by their fruit.

The Bible hasn’t got the power to bring your spirit from death to life, the Bible hasn’t got the power to forgive your sins..the Bible is confirmation, unto the power of God almighty..He is a Living Spirit, he is everywhere and His Living Witness the Living Holy Spirit, indwells the heart of his “ spirit” Children.

Don’t limit God to a book, the Spirit of God cannot be contained ....who loved us first the Spirit of God or the Bible?

I know the Love Of God in my heart/spirit, not through the Bible, the Bible confirms just how much God loves us.

Plus he loves us that much, that he gave his own Son up, A pure sinless Lamb, slain for the world, what kind of Love is that?

Can you ever imagine what Jesus must have gone through in that garden of gethsemane ,he was sweating drops of blood, did I read that..no it came by divine heart revelation, then the Bible confirmed what the Spirit spoke to my heart/spirit.

I became Born Again by divine,heart revelation,God always speaks scripture to my heart/ spirit,I had never read a Bible in my life,I became Born Again as I explained above.

The Bible confirms what God’s Living witness the Holy Spirit witnesses to our heart...we also grow and mature in our heart/ spirit...that’s where the Spirit is busy working, all according to God’s purpose and plan.

Without God’s witness..we are Nothing and know nothing of heart knowledge/ spiritual matters.

The power of the Spirit is within us..he has the power, we have no power...I pray daily that his power continues to work in our heart, continuing to make us more like Jesus in spirt..and that ugly old man gets less and less..

If we are Born Again, then we will be made into Jesus image, by the power of the Holy Spirit who indwells our spirit.

@MA2444 ..I have copied our posts and posted them in my new topic, I thought it best we discuss matters of the heart in there, so we don’t take this thorn in the flesh topic off course..that’s if you choose to discuss, I will tag you..

Romans 8​

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King James Version​

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8 There is therefore now no condemnation to them which are in Christ Jesus, who walk not after the flesh, but after the Spirit.
2 For the law of the Spirit of life in Christ Jesus hath made me free from the law of sin and death.
3 For what the law could not do, in that it was weak through the flesh, God sending his own Son in the likeness of sinful flesh, and for sin, condemned sin in the flesh:
4 That the righteousness of the law might be fulfilled in us, who walk not after the flesh, but after the Spirit.
5 For they that are after the flesh do mind the things of the flesh; but they that are after the Spirit the things of the Spirit.
6 For to be carnally minded is death; but to be spiritually minded is life and peace.
7 Because the carnal mind is enmity against God: for it is not subject to the law of God, neither indeed can be.
8 So then they that are in the flesh cannot please God.
9 But ye are not in the flesh, but in the Spirit, if so be that the Spirit of God dwell in you. Now if any man have not the Spirit of Christ, he is none of his.
10 And if Christ be in you, the body is dead because of sin; but the Spirit is life because of righteousness.
11 But if the Spirit of him that raised up Jesus from the dead dwell in you, he that raised up Christ from the dead shall also quicken your mortal bodies by his Spirit that dwelleth in you.
12 Therefore, brethren, we are debtors, not to the flesh, to live after the flesh.
13 For if ye live after the flesh, ye shall die: but if ye through the Spirit do mortify the deeds of the body, ye shall live.
14 For as many as are led by the Spirit of God, they are the sons of God.
15 For ye have not received the spirit of bondage again to fear; but ye have received the Spirit of adoption, whereby we cry, Abba, Father.
16 The Spirit itself beareth witness with our spirit, that we are the children of God:
17 And if children, then heirs; heirs of God, and joint-heirs with Christ; if so be that we suffer with him, that we may be also glorified together.
18 For I reckon that the sufferings of this present time are not worthy to be compared with the glory which shall be revealed in us.
19 For the earnest expectation of the creature waiteth for the manifestation of the sons of God.
20 For the creature was made subject to vanity, not willingly, but by reason of him who hath subjected the same in hope,
21 Because the creature itself also shall be delivered from the bondage of corruption into the glorious liberty of the children of God.
22 For we know that the whole creation groaneth and travaileth in pain together until now.
23 And not only they, but ourselves also, which have the firstfruits of the Spirit, even we ourselves groan within ourselves, waiting for the adoption, to wit, the redemption of our body.
24 For we are saved by hope: but hope that is seen is not hope: for what a man seeth, why doth he yet hope for?
25 But if we hope for that we see not, then do we with patience wait for it.
26 Likewise the Spirit also helpeth our infirmities: for we know not what we should pray for as we ought: but the Spirit itself maketh intercession for us with groanings which cannot be uttered.
27 And he that searcheth the hearts knoweth what is the mind of the Spirit, because he maketh intercession for the saints according to the will of God.
28 And we know that all things work together for good to them that love God, to them who are the called according to his purpose.
29 For whom he did foreknow, he also did predestinate to be conformed to the image of his Son, that he might be the firstborn among many brethren.
30 Moreover whom he did predestinate, them he also called: and whom he called, them he also justified: and whom he justified, them he also glorified.
31 What shall we then say to these things? If God be for us, who can be against us?
32 He that spared not his own Son, but delivered him up for us all, how shall he not with him also freely give us all things?
33 Who shall lay any thing to the charge of God's elect? It is God that justifieth.
34 Who is he that condemneth? It is Christ that died, yea rather, that is risen again, who is even at the right hand of God, who also maketh intercession for us.
35 Who shall separate us from the love of Christ? shall tribulation, or distress, or persecution, or famine, or nakedness, or peril, or sword?
36 As it is written, For thy sake we are killed all the day long; we are accounted as sheep for the slaughter.
37 Nay, in all these things we are more than conquerors through him that loved us.
38 For I am persuaded, that neither death, nor life, nor angels, nor principalities, nor powers, nor things present, nor things to come,
39 Nor height, nor depth, nor any other creature, shall be able to separate us from the love of God, which is in Christ Jesus our Lord.