What is the 2nd resurrection after the 1000 year Millennium

[Hobie]

The Bible teaches two different resurrections. Jesus spoke of one resurrection for those who are saved, and another resurrection for those who are lost. We see here where Jesus clearly spoke of two resurrections when He said, "Marvel not at this: for the hour is coming, in the which all that are in their graves shall hear his voice, And shall come forth; they that have done good, unto the resurrection of life; and they that have done evil unto the resurrection of damnation" John 5:29.

The apostle Paul also spoke of these two resurrections when he said, "there shall be a resurrection of the dead, both of the just and the unjust" in Acts 24:15. Thus both Jesus Christ and Paul spoke of two resurrections, the first being the resurrection of life for the just, and the second being the resurrection of damnation for the unjust. We also find it in Daniel, "And at that time shall Michael stand up, the great prince which standeth for the children of thy people: and there shall be a time of trouble, such as never was since there was a nation even to that same time: and at that time thy people shall be delivered, every one that shall be found written in the book. And many of them that sleep in the dust of the earth shall awake, some to everlasting life, and some to shame and everlasting contempt." Daniel 12:1-2. This is a clear Bible teaching.

Revelation 20 also speaks of two resurrections. A careful reading of verses 4-6 reveal that one takes place at the beginning of the 1000 years, the other at the end. The Word says, "Blessed and holy is he that has part in the first resurrection: on such the second death has no power, but they shall be priests of God and of Christ, and shall reign with him a thousand years" . Here is a resurrection at the beginning of the 1000 years. This is a good and blessed resurrection. Those in it need not fear the second death. "But the rest of the dead lived not again until the thousand years where finished".

Those not in the first resurrection will be raised at the end of the 1000 years in the second resurrection. Again, Paul said this would be a resurrection of "the unjust," (Acts 24:15), while Jesus Christ called it "the resurrection of damnation" (John 5:29).

Those in the second resurrection will be deceived by Satan, will be gathered against God's City, will stand before the final great white throne judgment, will be judged by their works, will be cast into the lake of fire, and will suffer the second death .

Thus Revelation 20 teaches two resurrections - one at the beginning of the 1000 years, and the other at the end. If you die before Jesus Christ returns, what resurrection will you be in? Now is the time to make sure we are true believers in Jesus Christ and real followers of His Holy Word. Take a careful look and it becomes clear.

Revelation 20

King James Version (KJV)

1 And I saw an angel come down from heaven, having the key of the bottomless pit and a great chain in his hand.
2 And he laid hold on the dragon, that old serpent, which is the Devil, and Satan, and bound him a thousand years,
3 And cast him into the bottomless pit, and shut him up, and set a seal upon him, that he should deceive the nations no more, till the thousand years should be fulfilled: and after that he must be loosed a little season.
4 And I saw thrones, and they sat upon them, and judgment was given unto them: and I saw the souls of them that were beheaded for the witness of Jesus, and for the word of God, and which had not worshipped the beast, neither his image, neither had received his mark upon their foreheads, or in their hands; and they lived and reigned with Christ a thousand years.
5 But the rest of the dead lived not again until the thousand years were finished. This is the first resurrection.
6 Blessed and holy is he that hath part in the first resurrection: on such the second death hath no power, but they shall be priests of God and of Christ, and shall reign with him a thousand years.
7 And when the thousand years are expired, Satan shall be loosed out of his prison,
8 And shall go out to deceive the nations which are in the four quarters of the earth, Gog, and Magog, to gather them together to battle: the number of whom is as the sand of the sea.
9 And they went up on the breadth of the earth, and compassed the camp of the saints about, and the beloved city: and fire came down from God out of heaven, and devoured them.
10 And the devil that deceived them was cast into the lake of fire and brimstone, where the beast and the false prophet are, and shall be tormented day and night for ever and ever.
11 And I saw a great white throne, and him that sat on it, from whose face the earth and the heaven fled away; and there was found no place for them.
12 And I saw the dead, small and great, stand before God; and the books were opened: and another book was opened, which is the book of life: and the dead were judged out of those things which were written in the books, according to their works.
13 And the sea gave up the dead which were in it; and death and hell delivered up the dead which were in them: and they were judged every man according to their works.
14 And death and hell were cast into the lake of fire. This is the second death.
15 And whosoever was not found written in the book of life was cast into the lake of fire.

We see in verse 6 that at the end, their will be the "first resurrection: on such the second death hath no power", which is "the resurrection of life". This one is of the righteous saints who he raises up and takes with him to heaven, and are reigning in heaven with Jesus. Then we have the other resurrection, "the resurrection of damnation" that is laid out...

"But the rest of the dead lived not again until the thousand years were finished." Rev 20:5.

The wicked have been struck down by the Second Coming and are dead until the Second Resurrection, so their is no one for Satan to temp, but this changes after the 1000 years...

"And when the thousand years are expired, Satan shall be loosed out of his prison, and shall go out to deceive the nations which are in the four quarters of the earth". Rev 20:7-8.

Although not explicitly stated, it is obvious the unrighteous dead were resurrected after the 1000 years ended and Satan can now go about with his deceptions. They are now bound to the second death which is final, in which they will perish as they are consumed in the lake of fire.

We have the resurrection of life which is at the Second Coming, "Blessed and holy is he that hath part in the first resurrection". on which "the second death hath no power". And the second resurrection which is the Second Death, at the "resurrection of damnation" or as Daniel says of, "shame and everlasting contempt" in which those not found "in the book of life was cast into the lake of fire."

 

[tailgator]

There's not much there to agree with.
But I've got a question for you since you believe Israel ascends into heaven with Jesus.

How does Gog compass the camp of the resurected saints about at the end of the 1000 years if they are in the clouds with Jesus?
Wouldn't those saints need to be on earth for Gog to come against them ?

Revelation 20
7 And when the thousand years are expired, Satan shall be loosed out of his prison,
8 And shall go out to deceive the nations which are in the four quarters of the earth, Gog, and Magog, to gather them together to battle: the number of whom is as the sand of the sea.
9 And they went up on the breadth of the earth, and compassed the camp of the saints about, and the beloved city: and fire came down from God out of heaven, and devoured them.

 

[Davy]

....

Those not in the first resurrection will be raised at the end of the 1000 years in the second resurrection. Again, Paul said this would be a resurrection of "the unjust," (Acts 24:15), while Jesus Christ called it "the resurrection of damnation" (John 5:29).

Those in the second resurrection will be deceived by Satan, will be gathered against God's City, will stand before the final great white throne judgment, will be judged by their works, will be cast into the lake of fire, and will suffer the second death .

You are actually following a tradition of men about those of the second resurrection.

I shall prove it...

If you are going to quote Lord Jesus in John 5, you should at least stick to the context of what He actually said:

John 5:28-29
28 Marvel not at this: for the hour is coming, in the which all that are in the graves shall hear His voice,
29 And shall come forth; they that have done good, unto the resurrection of life; and they that have done evil, unto the resurrection of damnation.
KJV

Jesus showed above that BOTH resurrection types occur on that DAY OF HIS FUTURE COMING!

How is it you MISSED His point there about that?? I know why, it's because you were thinking of man's false tradition in the back of your mind that the wicked are only raised after... the thousand years of Rev.20.

Jesus showed in the above John 5 Scripture that BOTH the "resurrection of life" AND the "resurrection of damnation" happen on the DAY OF HIS COMING. That means BOTH groups go through His "thousand years" reign.

Thus you also apparently MISSED... the "second death" subject given in Rev.20 about this also. Those who are raised to the "resurrection of damnation" at Jesus' coming will still be subject to the "second death" casting into the "lake of fire" after the 1,000 years. That is why it is called the "resurrection of damnation".

Rev 20:5-6
5 But the rest of the dead lived not again until the thousand years were finished. This is the first resurrection.
6 Blessed and holy is he that hath part in the first resurrection: on such the second death hath no power, but they shall be priests of God and of Christ, and shall reign with Him a thousand years.
KJV

The reason for your confusion, (and the tradition of men you are following on this), is because of NOT properly understanding that first clause above in red, especially that part "the dead lived not again...".

Don't you recall Matthew 8:22 and Luke 9:60 where Jesus told one to let the dead bury their dead? And also, in Matthew 23:27 when He metaphorically said the scribes and Pharisees were like whited tombs which appear beautiful outward, but are within full of dead men's bones? That... is how "the dead" are meant in Revelation 20:5. They are not... "born again" in Christ Jesus, thus their souls are still spiritually 'dead', and thus those of them that had died in their flesh are raised to the "resurrection of damnation" at Christ's coming.

And the wicked which are still alive on earth when Jesus comes, they will be 'changed' also, and grouped with those spiritually "dead" souls that will still be subject to the "second death", which is the casting into the "lake of fire" after the 1,000 years.

How then does that phrase, "the dead LIVED NOT AGAIN" actually meant?

Did you not notice the Revelation 20:12 verse about "the dead" which appear at God's Great White Throne Judgment after the 1,000 years?

Rev 20:12
12 And I saw the dead, small and great, stand before God; and the books were opened: and another book was opened, which is the book of life: and the dead were judged out of those things which were written in the books, according to their works.
KJV

What? Those books are opened, including the Book of Life, and those "dead" are then judged out of those books? Revelation 20 already explained about the "first resurrection" whom we know already had their names written in that Book of Life from the foundation. So WHY... would there ever be another NEED after the 1,000 years to open the Book of Life to see if any of those "dead" have their names written in it? How can anyone miss this point in the Scripture?

What it all means Alfie, is that SOME of those of "the dead", i.e., spiritually dead, will CONVERT TO JESUS CHRIST during His 1,000 years reign. And those who believe will have their names FOUND in that Book of Life after the 1,000 years. It is that... simple!

This means those of the "dead" who convert to Christ during the 1,000 years will LIVE AGAIN, meaning EVERLASTING LIFE and be joined with the "resurrection of life". Again, it is that simple, because when Lord Jesus returns, He will end this present world of man in a flesh body. We all, including the wicked, will then be in our spirit bodies. But the souls of the wicked will still be spiritually 'dead', and thus be subject to the "second death" UNLESS, they LIVE AGAIN by converting to Jesus Christ during the 1,000 years.

Thus the John 5:28-29 Scripture by Lord Jesus is actual proof AGAINST... the idea that the wicked are still in some hole in the ground waiting to be resurrected after the 1,000 years.

 

[tailgator]

You are actually following a tradition of men about those of the second resurrection.

I shall prove it...

If you are going to quote Lord Jesus in John 5, you should at least stick to the context of what He actually said:

John 5:28-29
28 Marvel not at this: for the hour is coming, in the which all that are in the graves shall hear His voice,
29 And shall come forth; they that have done good, unto the resurrection of life; and they that have done evil, unto the resurrection of damnation.
KJV

Jesus showed above that BOTH resurrection types occur on that DAY OF HIS FUTURE COMING!

How is it you MISSED His point there about that?? I know why, it's because you were thinking of man's false tradition in the back of your mind that the wicked are only raised after... the thousand years of Rev.20.

Jesus showed in the above John 5 Scripture that BOTH the "resurrection of life" AND the "resurrection of damnation" happen on the DAY OF HIS COMING. That means BOTH groups go through His "thousand years" reign.

Thus you also apparently MISSED... the "second death" subject given in Rev.20 about this also. Those who are raised to the "resurrection of damnation" at Jesus' coming will still be subject to the "second death" casting into the "lake of fire" after the 1,000 years. That is why it is called the "resurrection of damnation".

Rev 20:5-6
5 But the rest of the dead lived not again until the thousand years were finished. This is the first resurrection.
6 Blessed and holy is he that hath part in the first resurrection: on such the second death hath no power, but they shall be priests of God and of Christ, and shall reign with Him a thousand years.
KJV

The reason for your confusion, (and the tradition of men you are following on this), is because of NOT properly understanding that first clause above in red, especially that part "the dead lived not again...".

Don't you recall Matthew 8:22 and Luke 9:60 where Jesus told one to let the dead bury their dead? And also, in Matthew 23:27 when He metaphorically said the scribes and Pharisees were like whited tombs which appear beautiful outward, but are within full of dead men's bones? That... is how "the dead" are meant in Revelation 20:5. They are not... "born again" in Christ Jesus, thus their souls are still spiritually 'dead', and thus those of them that had died in their flesh are raised to the "resurrection of damnation" at Christ's coming.

And the wicked which are still alive on earth when Jesus comes, they will be 'changed' also, and grouped with those spiritually "dead" souls that will still be subject to the "second death", which is the casting into the "lake of fire" after the 1,000 years.

How then does that phrase, "the dead LIVED NOT AGAIN" actually meant?

Did you not notice the Revelation 20:12 verse about "the dead" which appear at God's Great White Throne Judgment after the 1,000 years?

Rev 20:12
12 And I saw the dead, small and great, stand before God; and the books were opened: and another book was opened, which is the book of life: and the dead were judged out of those things which were written in the books, according to their works.
KJV

What? Those books are opened, including the Book of Life, and those "dead" are then judged out of those books? Revelation 20 already explained about the "first resurrection" whom we know already had their names written in that Book of Life from the foundation. So WHY... would there ever be another NEED after the 1,000 years to open the Book of Life to see if any of those "dead" have their names written in it? How can anyone miss this point in the Scripture?

What it all means Alfie, is that SOME of those of "the dead", i.e., spiritually dead, will CONVERT TO JESUS CHRIST during His 1,000 years reign. And those who believe will have their names FOUND in that Book of Life after the 1,000 years. It is that... simple!

This means those of the "dead" who convert to Christ during the 1,000 years will LIVE AGAIN, meaning EVERLASTING LIFE and be joined with the "resurrection of life". Again, it is that simple, because when Lord Jesus returns, He will end this present world of man in a flesh body. We all, including the wicked, will then be in our spirit bodies. But the souls of the wicked will still be spiritually 'dead', and thus be subject to the "second death" UNLESS, they LIVE AGAIN by converting to Jesus Christ during the 1,000 years.

Thus the John 5:28-29 Scripture by Lord Jesus is actual proof AGAINST... the idea that the wicked are still in some hole in the ground waiting to be resurrected after the 1,000 years.

Them who worship the beast,it's image and recieve it's mark are cast into the lake of fire before the1000 years.
Revelation 14
8 And there followed another angel, saying, Babylon is fallen, is fallen, that great city, because she made all nations drink of the wine of the wrath of her fornication.

9 And the third angel followed them, saying with a loud voice, If any man worship the beast and his image, and receive his mark in his forehead, or in his hand,

10 The same shall drink of the wine of the wrath of God, which is poured out without mixture into the cup of his indignation; and he shall be tormented with fire and brimstone in the presence of the holy angels, and in the presence of the Lamb:

11 And the smoke of their torment ascendeth up for ever and ever: and they have no rest day nor night, who worship the beast and his image, and whosoever receiveth the mark of his name.






Though I will not be resurrected in the first resurection (I do not reside in the beasts kingdom and am not martyred by it),I still can look forward to being resurected after the Sabbath day.

 

[tailgator]

PS
To answer the question.
The second resurection is the regular harvest
The first resurection is the first fruits harvest.

The first fruits are redeemed from the ground first.

Revelation 14
14 And I looked, and, lo, a Lamb stood on the mount Sion, and with him an hundred forty and four thousand, having his Father's name written in their foreheads.

2 And I heard a voice from heaven, as the voice of many waters, and as the voice of a great thunder: and I heard the voice of harpers harping with their harps:

3 And they sung as it were a new song before the throne, and before the four beasts, and the elders: and no man could learn that song but the hundred and forty and four thousand, which were redeemed from the earth.

4 These are they which were not defiled with women; for they are virgins. These are they which follow the Lamb whithersoever he goeth. These were redeemed from among men, being the firstfruits unto God and to the Lamb.

 

[Truth7t7]

We have the resurrection of life which is at the Second Coming, "Blessed and holy is he that hath part in the first resurrection". on which "the second death hath no power". And the second resurrection which is the Second Death, at the "resurrection of damnation" or as Daniel says of, "shame and everlasting contempt" in which those not found "in the book of life was cast into the lake of fire."

Yes there will be "Two" completely different resurrections, they both take place at the future second coming on the last day as Jesus clearly taught below in John 5:28-29, John 6:39-40

All that are in the graves will hear his voice/trump and come forth

John 5:28-29KJV
28 Marvel not at this: for the hour is coming, in the which all that are in the graves shall hear his voice,
29 And shall come forth; they that have done good, unto the resurrection of life; and they that have done evil, unto the resurrection of damnation.

The resurrection of all takes place on the last day (The End)

John 6:39-40KJV
39 And this is the Father's will which hath sent me, that of all which he hath given me I should lose nothing, but should raise it up again at the last day.
40 And this is the will of him that sent me, that every one which seeth the Son, and believeth on him, may have everlasting life: and I will raise him up at the last day.

 

[Hobie]

You are actually following a tradition of men about those of the second resurrection.

I shall prove it...

If you are going to quote Lord Jesus in John 5, you should at least stick to the context of what He actually said:

John 5:28-29
28 Marvel not at this: for the hour is coming, in the which all that are in the graves shall hear His voice,
29 And shall come forth; they that have done good, unto the resurrection of life; and they that have done evil, unto the resurrection of damnation.
KJV

Jesus showed above that BOTH resurrection types occur on that DAY OF HIS FUTURE COMING!

How is it you MISSED His point there about that?? I know why, it's because you were thinking of man's false tradition in the back of your mind that the wicked are only raised after... the thousand years of Rev.20.

Jesus showed in the above John 5 Scripture that BOTH the "resurrection of life" AND the "resurrection of damnation" happen on the DAY OF HIS COMING. That means BOTH groups go through His "thousand years" reign.

Thus you also apparently MISSED... the "second death" subject given in Rev.20 about this also. Those who are raised to the "resurrection of damnation" at Jesus' coming will still be subject to the "second death" casting into the "lake of fire" after the 1,000 years. That is why it is called the "resurrection of damnation".

Rev 20:5-6
5 But the rest of the dead lived not again until the thousand years were finished. This is the first resurrection.
6 Blessed and holy is he that hath part in the first resurrection: on such the second death hath no power, but they shall be priests of God and of Christ, and shall reign with Him a thousand years.
KJV

The reason for your confusion, (and the tradition of men you are following on this), is because of NOT properly understanding that first clause above in red, especially that part "the dead lived not again...".

Don't you recall Matthew 8:22 and Luke 9:60 where Jesus told one to let the dead bury their dead? And also, in Matthew 23:27 when He metaphorically said the scribes and Pharisees were like whited tombs which appear beautiful outward, but are within full of dead men's bones? That... is how "the dead" are meant in Revelation 20:5. They are not... "born again" in Christ Jesus, thus their souls are still spiritually 'dead', and thus those of them that had died in their flesh are raised to the "resurrection of damnation" at Christ's coming.

And the wicked which are still alive on earth when Jesus comes, they will be 'changed' also, and grouped with those spiritually "dead" souls that will still be subject to the "second death", which is the casting into the "lake of fire" after the 1,000 years.

How then does that phrase, "the dead LIVED NOT AGAIN" actually meant?

Did you not notice the Revelation 20:12 verse about "the dead" which appear at God's Great White Throne Judgment after the 1,000 years?

Rev 20:12
12 And I saw the dead, small and great, stand before God; and the books were opened: and another book was opened, which is the book of life: and the dead were judged out of those things which were written in the books, according to their works.
KJV

What? Those books are opened, including the Book of Life, and those "dead" are then judged out of those books? Revelation 20 already explained about the "first resurrection" whom we know already had their names written in that Book of Life from the foundation. So WHY... would there ever be another NEED after the 1,000 years to open the Book of Life to see if any of those "dead" have their names written in it? How can anyone miss this point in the Scripture?

What it all means Alfie, is that SOME of those of "the dead", i.e., spiritually dead, will CONVERT TO JESUS CHRIST during His 1,000 years reign. And those who believe will have their names FOUND in that Book of Life after the 1,000 years. It is that... simple!

This means those of the "dead" who convert to Christ during the 1,000 years will LIVE AGAIN, meaning EVERLASTING LIFE and be joined with the "resurrection of life". Again, it is that simple, because when Lord Jesus returns, He will end this present world of man in a flesh body. We all, including the wicked, will then be in our spirit bodies. But the souls of the wicked will still be spiritually 'dead', and thus be subject to the "second death" UNLESS, they LIVE AGAIN by converting to Jesus Christ during the 1,000 years.

Thus the John 5:28-29 Scripture by Lord Jesus is actual proof AGAINST... the idea that the wicked are still in some hole in the ground waiting to be resurrected after the 1,000 years.

No my brother, they are distinct and separate. One is of the saints and after the thousand years the wicked, remember, it is the 'revelation' of Christ, its His Word being given.

 

[tailgator]

No my brother, they are distinct and separate. One is of the saints and after the thousand years the wicked, remember, it is the 'revelation' of Christ, its His Word being given.

The first resurection is of the saints who were beheaded for their witness of Jesus and who did not worship the beast or it's image nor received its mark.

Your going to feel real funny when you are resurected after the 1000 years is fulfilled and your judged by your own words saying the wicked is resurected after the 1000 years.

 

[Davy]

No my brother, they are distinct and separate. One is of the saints and after the thousand years the wicked, remember, it is the 'revelation' of Christ, its His Word being given.

You just called Lord Jesus a liar, ...

... whether you know it or not.

Don't you recall John 5:28-29 where Jesus showed BOTH the just and the unjust are RAISED FROM THE DEAD on the SAME day of His coming?

How is it you say the wicked dead are not raised until AFTER Christ's 1,000 years reign, when Jesus said different in John 5?

 

[ewq1938]

Revelation 20 speaks of two groups of the dead that resurrect/live again.

Rev 20:4 And I saw thrones, and they sat upon them, and judgment was given unto them: and I saw the souls of them that were beheaded for the witness of Jesus, and for the word of God, and which had not worshipped the beast, neither his image, neither had received his mark upon their foreheads, or in their hands; and they lived and reigned with Christ a thousand years.
Rev 20:5 But the rest of the dead lived not again until the thousand years were finished. This is the first resurrection.
Rev 20:6 Blessed and holy is he that hath part in the first resurrection: on such the second death hath no power, but they shall be priests of God and of Christ, and shall reign with him a thousand years.

The first resurrection is the resurrection of this first group of the dead because they resurrect first. The rest of the dead have to wait for their resurrection:

"the rest of the dead lived not again until the thousand years were finished" (Rev 20:5)

This is the last resurrection of those who are dead. One group resurrected and "the rest" or the remaining ones did not resurrect when the others did.

This proves they partake of the second resurrection also known as the last resurrection because no one is still physically dead after they "live again". This also proves without a doubt that there are two separate days of resurrection separated by a thousand years and how long that actually is doesn't matter.

Part of the dead resurrect and then "the rest of the dead" will resurrect after a period of time. That's the dead resurrecting in two parts separated by a period of time.


The first group resurrects before the thousand years begins and the second/last group resurrects after the end of the thousand years.



Dan 12:2 And many of them that sleep in the dust of the earth shall awake, some to everlasting life, and some to shame and everlasting contempt.

First group resurrection: "to everlasting life"
Second group resurrection: "to shame and everlasting contempt"


Joh 5:29 And shall come forth; they that have done good, unto the resurrection of life ; and they that have done evil, unto the resurrection of damnation

First group resurrection: "resurrection of life"
Second group resurrection: "the resurrection of damnation"


Acts 24:15 And have hope toward God, which they themselves also allow, that there shall be a resurrection of the dead, both of the just and unjust.

First group resurrection: "the just"
Second group resurrection: the "unjust"

Take note that in every passage where the resurrection of the saved and unsaved are mentioned that the saved or just is always mentioned first. That's important because it is they that resurrect first! Scripture never deviates in this order. Revelation, John, Daniel and Acts all say the saved first, then the unsaved in that exact order.


Luk 14:12 Then said he also to him that bade him, When thou makest a dinner or a supper, call not thy friends, nor thy brethren, neither thy kinsmen, nor thy rich neighbours; lest they also bid thee again, and a recompence be made thee.
Luk 14:13 But when thou makest a feast, call the poor, the maimed, the lame, the blind:
Luk 14:14 And thou shalt be blessed; for they cannot recompense thee: for thou shalt be recompensed at the resurrection of the just.

He did not say the resurrection of the just and unjust. He said only the just. Again, this is evidence of two separate resurrections. The resurrection of the just is only of the just, no one else.

What we learn from these verses is that there are two resurrections. One resurrection is to life and the other resurrection is to damnation and contempt. Two resurrections! Never is there a single resurrection of both righteous and unrighteous at the same time.



We also see here that the saved/righteous are resurrected first, and at some time later the unsaved are resurrected and judged.

What these verses do not tell us is how much time is inbetween the two. For that we have to go to Revelation 20 where Christ tells John there is a thousand years inbetween. "the rest of the dead lived not again until the thousand years were finished". There we have the dead separated into two groups. One who are saved and will be resurrected and judged first, like Dan 12:2 and Joh 5:29 show, and the other group that has to wait until the thousand years are finished before they are resurrected and judged.




This is Premill through and through.

Amill errs on the first two passages because it ignores the information in Revelation 20 about the time inbetween and wrongly interprets that the saved and unsaved are resurrected and judged at the same time on the same day which simply isn't the case. This is why one needs to involve all passages that deal with the resurrections and judgments rather than focusing on some and not others, namely information found in Revelation. During the canonization process it was an Amill that did not want Revelation to be canonized. Revelation supports the Premill type of view so it's no surprise there was an effort to deny it's canonization.

The earliest identified Amillennialist is a presbyter in Rome in the third century, named Gaius, who as a Catholic opposed the canonization of the book of Revelation. After that, the Alexandrian school gave rise to several Amillennialists in the mid-third century, with its emphasis on allegorical and spiritual hermeneutics. Amillennialism is a Catholic invention! Amillennialism did not exist before the 3rd century. All the earlier church fathers were Chilastics which was Premillinialism before that term was created.


Joh 5:28 Marvel not at this: for the hour is coming, in the which all that are in the graves shall hear his voice,



There will come a time/hour that all baseball teams will play against another team but that doesn't mean all on the same day. A time will come for all the dead to be raised. First, the dead in Christ rise, then after a thousand years "the rest of the dead" will rise. That's what we find when looking at all of the related passages. Leaving the most important passage out of this is clear error.

Another analogy:

"For the hour is coming, in which all who start and complete highschool shall graduate."

No one would argue that every single person who completes highschool will all graduate the same hour, or same day, or even the same year. Obviously, freshmen don't graduate when seniors do.



To understand this even more fully the word "hour" must be understood:

"hour" can be any amount of time since it can be literal or figurative:

G5610
??´?a
ho¯ra
ho'-rah
Apparently a primary word; an “hour” (literally or figuratively): - day, hour, instant, season, X short, [even-] tide, (high) time.
Total KJV occurrences: 108

It's been translated as hour, day and even season.

Joh 5:29 And shall come forth; they that have done good, unto the resurrection of life; and they that have done evil, unto the resurrection of damnation.

So, in this unknown amount of time there will be two resurrections. First (called the first resurrection) the dead in Christ will be resurrected. Then much later in this same "hora", at it's end, will the second and last resurrection take place and that's "the rest of the dead" who did not rise with the first group

 

[Davy]

Although the Biblical evidence is PREMILL, what Lord Jesus said in John 5:28-29 still points to the wicked of the "resurrection of damnation" being raised at the SAME TIME that the "resurrection of life" are raised...

John 5:28-29
28 Marvel not at this: for the hour is coming, in the which all that are in the graves shall hear His voice,
29 And shall come forth; they that have done good, unto the resurrection of life; and they that have done evil, unto the resurrection of damnation.
KJV

"for the hour is coming" = definitely not a gap of a 1,000 years, but the SAME hour for BOTH resurrection types.

"all that are in the graves shall hear His voice" = this is about 1 Thess.4:16 with The Lord descending from Heaven "with a shout". Per 1 Cor.15:22, Paul said, "For as in Adam all die, even so in Christ shall all be made alive." That is not about some doctrine of man that thinks that "in Christ" phrase means only the saints. That is for everyone, the just and unjust like Apostle Paul assumed about both resurrection types in Acts 24:15.

"And shall come forth" = at the SAME TIME when Jesus comes.


The tradition of men that interpret Rev.20:5 to mean the wicked dead are not resurrected until after the 1,000 years is man's... tradition, simply because of their not understanding that FLESH DEATH is no more when Jesus comes and ALL the dead are resurrected. Rev.20 stating that the ONLY death remaining will be the "second death" of the casting into the "lake of fire" is just BYPASSED by those same traditions of men, revealing they do not really understand the Rev.20 Scripture about the "resurrection of damnation" nor the idea of their still being subject to the "second death" throughout Christ's 1,000 years reign period.

Looks like some brethren need to go back through 1 Corinthians 15 and 1 Thessalonians 4:13-17 where Apostle Paul taught about the future body type of the world to come, a "spiritual body". When Jesus comes, all... still alive on earth will be 'changed' at the twinkling of an eye, on the last trump, changed to the "spiritual body" type. That will end man's time in these flesh type bodies of corruption for today. But the concept of 'death' will not be destroyed yet at Christ's future return, for the "second death" of casting into the "lake of fire" will still be upon those of the "resurrection of damnation".

 

[tailgator]

A lot of people just don't get the concept of a harvest.
You don't gather all the harvest at once.It is done in stages.


First,there is the first fruits harvest where the fruit is considered holy and an offering to God.It is presented to the high priest in Jerusalem by the harvesters.There is a celebration ,a feast and then rest.Jesus was speaking in this regard when he said the angels will gather his elect.

Later comes the regular harvest.



These things were done in the old testament as a shadow of the resurrection.The first fruits harvest in revelation is the first resurection and takes place at the beginning of the Sabbath day.
The regular harvest takes place after the Sabbath rest.

 

[Hobie]

You just called Lord Jesus a liar, ...

... whether you know it or not.

Don't you recall John 5:28-29 where Jesus showed BOTH the just and the unjust are RAISED FROM THE DEAD on the SAME day of His coming?

How is it you say the wicked dead are not raised until AFTER Christ's 1,000 years reign, when Jesus said different in John 5?

Read His words in Revelation 20..

 

[Davy]

Read His words in Revelation 20..

I've read and studied what Revelation 20 says, I know what it says. You do not know, because you omit what Jesus said in John 5:28-29. And you do that in favor of following a tradition of men, just like you also do with following the false pre-trib rapture tradition of men.

 

[ewq1938]

I've read and studied what Revelation 20 says, I know what it says. You do not know, because you omit what Jesus said in John 5:28-29. And you do that in favor of following a tradition of men, just like you also do with following the false pre-trib rapture tradition of men.

You actually omit what Rev says about a thousand years happening inbetween the first and second resurrections. You wrongly misinterpret John 5 as the two resurrections happening at the same time, because you don't include what Rev 20 says.

Joh 5:28 Marvel not at this: for the hour is coming, in the which all that are in the graves shall hear his voice,

To understand this fully the word "hour" must be understood:

"hour" can be any amount of time since it can be literal or figurative:

G5610
??´?a
ho¯ra
ho'-rah
Apparently a primary word; an “hour” (literally or figuratively): - day, hour, instant, season, X short, [even-] tide, (high) time.
Total KJV occurrences: 108

It's been translated as hour, day and even season.


There will come a time/hour that all baseball teams will play against another team but that doesn't mean all on the same day. A time will come for all the dead to be raised. First, the dead in Christ rise, then after a thousand years "the rest of the dead" will rise. That's what we find when looking at all of the related passages. Leaving the most important passage out of this is clear error.

Another analogy:

"For the hour is coming, in which all who start and complete highschool shall graduate."

No one would argue that every single person who completes highschool will all graduate the same hour, or same day, or even the same year. Obviously, freshmen don't graduate when seniors do.



Joh 5:29 And shall come forth; they that have done good, unto the resurrection of life; and they that have done evil, unto the resurrection of damnation.


So, in this unknown amount of time there will be two resurrections. First (called the first resurrection) the dead in Christ will be resurrected. Then much later in this same "hora", at it's end, will the second and last resurrection take place and that's "the rest of the dead" who did not rise with the first group.

 

[tailgator]

Actually,it's the saints who were beheaded for their witness of Jesus ,and who did not worship the beast,it's image,nor receive it's mark that are resurected in the first resurection.

According to revelation 20,there is no one else resurected at that time.This would include perhaps millions or even billions of christians who died by natural causes.

I doubt Paul or Peter knew anything about this and could not have commented on it because Jesus did not give this revelation to them to write.Jesus sent them to preach the gospel.He gave the revelation to John to write .

Revelation 20:4-5
4 And I saw thrones, and they sat upon them, and judgment was given unto them: and I saw the souls of them that were beheaded for the witness of Jesus, and for the word of God, and which had not worshipped the beast, neither his image, neither had received his mark upon their foreheads, or in their hands; and they lived and reigned with Christ a thousand years.

5 But the rest of the dead lived not again until the thousand years were finished. This is the first resurrection.

 

[Spiritual Israelite]

Joh 5:29 And shall come forth; they that have done good, unto the resurrection of life ; and they that have done evil, unto the resurrection of damnation

First group resurrection: "resurrection of life"
Second group resurrection: "the resurrection of damnation"


Acts 24:15 And have hope toward God, which they themselves also allow, that there shall be a resurrection of the dead, both of the just and unjust.

First group resurrection: "the just"
Second group resurrection: the "unjust"

Take note that in every passage where the resurrection of the saved and unsaved are mentioned that the saved or just is always mentioned first. That's important because it is they that resurrect first! Scripture never deviates in this order. Revelation, John, Daniel and Acts all say the saved first, then the unsaved in that exact order.


Luk 14:12 Then said he also to him that bade him, When thou makest a dinner or a supper, call not thy friends, nor thy brethren, neither thy kinsmen, nor thy rich neighbours; lest they also bid thee again, and a recompence be made thee.
Luk 14:13 But when thou makest a feast, call the poor, the maimed, the lame, the blind:
Luk 14:14 And thou shalt be blessed; for they cannot recompense thee: for thou shalt be recompensed at the resurrection of the just.

He did not say the resurrection of the just and unjust. He said only the just. Again, this is evidence of two separate resurrections. The resurrection of the just is only of the just, no one else.

What we learn from these verses is that there are two resurrections. One resurrection is to life and the other resurrection is to damnation and contempt. Two resurrections! Never is there a single resurrection of both righteous and unrighteous at the same time.



We also see here that the saved/righteous are resurrected first, and at some time later the unsaved are resurrected and judged.

What these verses do not tell us is how much time is inbetween the two. For that we have to go to Revelation 20 where Christ tells John there is a thousand years inbetween. "the rest of the dead lived not again until the thousand years were finished". There we have the dead separated into two groups. One who are saved and will be resurrected and judged first, like Dan 12:2 and Joh 5:29 show, and the other group that has to wait until the thousand years are finished before they are resurrected and judged.




This is Premill through and through.

Amill errs on the first two passages because it ignores the information in Revelation 20 about the time inbetween and wrongly interprets that the saved and unsaved are resurrected and judged at the same time on the same day which simply isn't the case. This is why one needs to involve all passages that deal with the resurrections and judgments rather than focusing on some and not others, namely information found in Revelation. During the canonization process it was an Amill that did not want Revelation to be canonized. Revelation supports the Premill type of view so it's no surprise there was an effort to deny it's canonization.

The earliest identified Amillennialist is a presbyter in Rome in the third century, named Gaius, who as a Catholic opposed the canonization of the book of Revelation. After that, the Alexandrian school gave rise to several Amillennialists in the mid-third century, with its emphasis on allegorical and spiritual hermeneutics. Amillennialism is a Catholic invention! Amillennialism did not exist before the 3rd century. All the earlier church fathers were Chilastics which was Premillinialism before that term was created.


Joh 5:28 Marvel not at this: for the hour is coming, in the which all that are in the graves shall hear his voice,



There will come a time/hour that all baseball teams will play against another team but that doesn't mean all on the same day. A time will come for all the dead to be raised. First, the dead in Christ rise, then after a thousand years "the rest of the dead" will rise. That's what we find when looking at all of the related passages. Leaving the most important passage out of this is clear error.

Another analogy:

"For the hour is coming, in which all who start and complete highschool shall graduate."

No one would argue that every single person who completes highschool will all graduate the same hour, or same day, or even the same year. Obviously, freshmen don't graduate when seniors do.



To understand this even more fully the word "hour" must be understood:

"hour" can be any amount of time since it can be literal or figurative:

G5610
??´?a
ho¯ra
ho'-rah
Apparently a primary word; an “hour” (literally or figuratively): - day, hour, instant, season, X short, [even-] tide, (high) time.
Total KJV occurrences: 108

It's been translated as hour, day and even season.

Joh 5:29 And shall come forth; they that have done good, unto the resurrection of life; and they that have done evil, unto the resurrection of damnation.

So, in this unknown amount of time there will be two resurrections. First (called the first resurrection) the dead in Christ will be resurrected. Then much later in this same "hora", at it's end, will the second and last resurrection take place and that's "the rest of the dead" who did not rise with the first group

This is the usual biased nonsense from you. In John 5:28-29 Jesus does not give any indication that He's talking about an hour as a long period of time at the beginning of which believers are resurrected and at the end of which unbelievers are resurrected. No one in their right mind would take a statement that "the hour is coming when all who are in the graves shall come forth" to mean a long time is coming when all who in the graves will be resurrected, with some at the beginning of that long period of time and the rest at the end.

You can see from John 5:28-29 that when the dead are resurrected they are then immediately judged afterwards. That's why Jesus indicated that each of them are either resurrected unto (eternal) life or unto (eternal) damnation. So, if the hour He said is coming is referring to one general resurrection event when all of the dead are resurrected then that would mean we should expect that scripture also teaches that all people are judged at the same time. So, does scripture teach that? Yes, it absolutely does.

Jesus taught that all the righteous and the wicked will be judged at the same time (at the end of the age) in the parable of the wheat and tares. He pointed out how the wheat/good seed (righteous) would grow together with the tares (wicked) until the harvest, which represented the end of the age. The wheat/good seed would inherit "the kingdom of their Father" (Matt 13:43) at that point while the tares are cast "into a furnace of fire" where "there shall be wailing and gnashing of teeth", which is the same event written about in Revelation 20:15.

Then there is this parable Jesus told shortly after that one:

Matthew 13:47 Again, the kingdom of heaven is like unto a net, that was cast into the sea, and gathered of every kind: 48 Which, when it was full, they drew to shore, and sat down, and gathered the good into vessels, but cast the bad away. 49 So shall it be at the end of the world: the angels shall come forth, and sever the wicked from among the just, 50 And shall cast them into the furnace of fire: there shall be wailing and gnashing of teeth.

Again, we can see Jesus describing the righteous (represented by the good fish/sea creatures) and the wicked (represented by the bad fish/sea creatures) being gathered and judged at the same time at the end of the world/age. That can be clearly seen in Matthew 25:31-46 as well where Jesus indicates that He will gather and judge all people at the same time when He comes with His angels. Premil has no answer for this. Instead, Premil tries to change these scriptures to fit its false interpretation of Revelation 20.

 

[Spiritual Israelite]

Although the Biblical evidence is PREMILL, what Lord Jesus said in John 5:28-29 still points to the wicked of the "resurrection of damnation" being raised at the SAME TIME that the "resurrection of life" are raised...

John 5:28-29
28 Marvel not at this: for the hour is coming, in the which all that are in the graves shall hear His voice,
29 And shall come forth; they that have done good, unto the resurrection of life; and they that have done evil, unto the resurrection of damnation.
KJV

"for the hour is coming" = definitely not a gap of a 1,000 years, but the SAME hour for BOTH resurrection types.

"all that are in the graves shall hear His voice" = this is about 1 Thess.4:16 with The Lord descending from Heaven "with a shout". Per 1 Cor.15:22, Paul said, "For as in Adam all die, even so in Christ shall all be made alive." That is not about some doctrine of man that thinks that "in Christ" phrase means only the saints. That is for everyone, the just and unjust like Apostle Paul assumed about both resurrection types in Acts 24:15.

"And shall come forth" = at the SAME TIME when Jesus comes.


The tradition of men that interpret Rev.20:5 to mean the wicked dead are not resurrected until after the 1,000 years is man's... tradition, simply because of their not understanding that FLESH DEATH is no more when Jesus comes and ALL the dead are resurrected. Rev.20 stating that the ONLY death remaining will be the "second death" of the casting into the "lake of fire" is just BYPASSED by those same traditions of men, revealing they do not really understand the Rev.20 Scripture about the "resurrection of damnation" nor the idea of their still being subject to the "second death" throughout Christ's 1,000 years reign period.

Looks like some brethren need to go back through 1 Corinthians 15 and 1 Thessalonians 4:13-17 where Apostle Paul taught about the future body type of the world to come, a "spiritual body". When Jesus comes, all... still alive on earth will be 'changed' at the twinkling of an eye, on the last trump, changed to the "spiritual body" type. That will end man's time in these flesh type bodies of corruption for today. But the concept of 'death' will not be destroyed yet at Christ's future return, for the "second death" of casting into the "lake of fire" will still be upon those of the "resurrection of damnation".

Your version of Premill is very strange because you might be the only Premill in the world who agrees with Amill's interpretation of John 5:28-29.

So, do you not believe that anyone dies during the supposed future thousand years or during Satan's little season since you don't believe anyone is resurrected after the thousand years? Who exactly do you believe will populate the earth during the supposed future thousand years?

 

[Spiritual Israelite]

Actually,it's the saints who were beheaded for their witness of Jesus ,and who did not worship the beast,it's image,nor receive it's mark that are resurected in the first resurection.

According to revelation 20,there is no one else resurected at that time.This would include perhaps millions or even billions of christians who died by natural causes.

I doubt Paul or Peter knew anything about this and could not have commented on it because Jesus did not give this revelation to them to write.Jesus sent them to preach the gospel.He gave the revelation to John to write .

This is utterly ridiculous and shameful for you to undermine Paul and Peter like this. There is no basis for what you're saying whatsoever. Instead of making the effort to reconcile what John wrote with what Paul and Peter wrote you have decided that Paul and Peter can't be trusted to have understood much about end times prophecy, which is ludicrous. The same Holy Spirit who inspired John to write what he did also inspired Paul and Peter to write what they did. There is no basis whatsoever for thinking that John had more knowledge and understanding than Paul and Peter did since their understanding, like John's, was not their own but rather came from the Holy Spirit.

Paul wrote this, which you probably don't undertand at all:

1 Corinthians 2:9 But as it is written, Eye hath not seen, nor ear heard, neither have entered into the heart of man, the things which God hath prepared for them that love him. 10 But God hath revealed them unto us by his Spirit: for the Spirit searcheth all things, yea, the deep things of God. 11 For what man knoweth the things of a man, save the spirit of man which is in him? even so the things of God knoweth no man, but the Spirit of God. 12 Now we have received, not the spirit of the world, but the spirit which is of God; that we might know the things that are freely given to us of God. 13 Which things also we speak, not in the words which man's wisdom teacheth, but which the Holy Ghost teacheth; comparing spiritual things with spiritual. 14 But the natural man receiveth not the things of the Spirit of God: for they are foolishness unto him: neither can he know them, because they are spiritually discerned.

 

[Spiritual Israelite]

No my brother, they are distinct and separate. One is of the saints and after the thousand years the wicked, remember, it is the 'revelation' of Christ, its His Word being given.

John 6:40 And this is the will of him that sent me, that every one which seeth the Son, and believeth on him, may have everlasting life: and I will raise him up at the last day.

Can you see here that Jesus said that those who believe in Him will be resurrected when the last day comes. Why do you have the wicked being resurrected 1,000+ years after the last day? How can there be 1,000+ years of time after the last day?

Jesus indicated that unbelievers wil lbe resurrected unto damnation (John 5:28-29) and also said that unbelievers will be judged at the last day. That means when the wicked are resurrected, they are then judged and that will occur when the last day arrives.

John 12:48 He that rejecteth me, and receiveth not my words, hath one that judgeth him: the word that I have spoken, the same shall judge him in the last day.

If believers are resurrected and unbelievers are judged when the last day comes, then why do you have the believers who are resurrected unto eternal life being resurrected 1,000+ years before unbelievers are resurrected and judged? Jesus said believers will be resurrected and unbelievers judged (presumably after being resurrected) when the last day comes, not 1,000+ years apart. This must be taken into account when interpreting Revelation 20. You should not interpret Revelation 20 in such a way that contradicts what Jesus taught.