You speak of personal righteousness and God's righteousness, this is some of God's teaching through Paul regarding that.
Much love!
What does it mean to be born again?
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Much love!
No contradiction
The patriarchs died looking by faith at the distant horizon, looking forward to the day when their heavenly promises would go from faith to sight. Dear believer, you need consider the lives of these great patriarchs "so that you will not be sluggish, but imitators of those who through faith and patience inherit the promises." (Heb 6:12+)
Note that beginning in Hebrews 11:13 and going through verse 16 the writer takes a break and instead of giving examples of saints who expressed faith, he comments on the nature of the faith that he has been illustrating in this individuals. Notice that one could go from Hebrews 11:12 to Hebrews 11:17 without skipping a beat.
As Swindoll says "At this point, the writer of Hebrews sets aside the palette of paints he had been using to fill his canvas with examples of faith. He steps back, as it were, gestures at the procession of personalities he’s been painting, and makes a sweeping statement: “All these,” he says, “died in faith, without receiving the promises”. Wait . . . didn’t Abraham make it to the Promised Land? Didn’t Sarah have her promised child, Isaac? Yes, but what they experienced in this life was merely a foretaste, a shadow of things to come. Abraham didn’t receive the full promise, just a down payment. Abraham and Sarah had only one child—the promise was for descendants “innumerable as the sand which is by the seashore” (11:12). The land in which he sojourned was indeed the Promised Land, but he, Sarah, Isaac, and all their household lived there as “strangers and exiles on the earth” (11:13; cf. 1 Pet. 2:11). (Swindoll's Living Insights New Testament Commentary – Hebrews)
J.
So what are you saying @marks? You not here to correct wrong, erroneous doctrines?
It's not attacking the person, it is all about correcting and reproving, discerning error from truth--it is not even judging the person, it is how to correct a brother...as you correct me
Galatians 6:1
Brothers, if anyone is caught in any transgression, you who are spiritual should restore him in a spirit of gentleness. Keep watch on yourself, lest you too be tempted.
Matthew 18:15-17 ESV
“If your brother sins against you, go and tell him his fault, between you and him alone. If he listens to you, you have gained your brother. But if he does not listen, take one or two others along with you, that every charge may be established by the evidence of two or three witnesses. If he refuses to listen to them, tell it to the church. And if he refuses to listen even to the church, let him be to you as a Gentile and a tax collector.
Matthew 18:15 ESV
“If your brother sins against you, go and tell him his fault, between you and him alone. If he listens to you, you have gained your brother.
1 Corinthians 5:1-13 ESV
It is actually reported that there is sexual immorality among you, and of a kind that is not tolerated even among pagans, for a man has his father's wife. And you are arrogant! Ought you not rather to mourn? Let him who has done this be removed from among you. For though absent in body, I am present in spirit; and as if present, I have already pronounced judgment on the one who did such a thing. When you are assembled in the name of the Lord Jesus and my spirit is present, with the power of our Lord Jesus, you are to deliver this man to Satan for the destruction of the flesh, so that his spirit may be saved in the day of the Lord. ...
James 5:19 ESV
My brothers, if anyone among you wanders from the truth and someone brings him back,..............
2 Thessalonians 3:15 ESV
Do not regard him as an enemy, but warn him as a brother.
Titus 3:10-11 ESV
As for a person who stirs up division, after warning him once and then twice, have nothing more to do with him, knowing that such a person is warped and sinful; he is self-condemned.
1 Timothy 5:20 ESV
As for those who persist in sin, rebuke them in the presence of all, so that the rest may stand in fear.
Titus 3:10 ESV
As for a person who stirs up division, after warning him once and then twice, have nothing more to do with him.......,
........and so, now I am hopelessly confused, not knowing should I continue or not.
This has nothing to do with pride, all about our zest, zeal and pathos for the truth, as it stands written in Scriptures and for Christ and the honor that rightfully belongs to Him.
Even YHVH chastise and disciplines His sons and daughters--but Epi cannot, dare not, be corrected, and he is a mature man, twisting and perverting the gospel for all to see--we are no longer on the topic of what it means to be born again and this has turned into mud-slinging.
Guess you are going to react, so I'll hold my peace and not post again.
J.
……….what remains? I know He remains/abides in me, is faithful to remain in me and will never leave me. It’s the “and you in Me” part that regards MY remaining or not remaining.
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Do you know the difference between teaching and testimony?
Waiting on him
Well-Known Member
Isaiah 35:6 KJV
[6] Then shall the lame man leap as an hart, and the tongue of the dumb sing: for in the wilderness shall waters break out, and streams in the desert.
Maybe we are led to see we are in fact that desert land, and not so much lead out as He is entered in?
Mat_26:61 And said, This fellow said, I am able to destroy the temple of God, and to build it in three days.
Mar_14:58 We heard him say, I will destroy this temple that is made with hands, and within three days I will build another made without hands.
Joh_2:19 Jesus answered and said unto them, Destroy this temple, and in three days I will raise it up.
No geographical conquest as you so aptly put it. Which brings another question to the table--was 1948 taking land in the flesh? or is it yet to be fulfilled?
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I'm saying we need to be careful about how we act.
We see some, it's like they've got a full head of steam and are on a tear down the tracks, and there's no stopping and asking, "Is this really how I should be talking?" Yes, bring truth against error, yes, admonish and encourage and rebuke and whatever is truly appropriate, only realizing, we don't really know another's heart, and, people sometimes focus against others unfairly in their minds - cognitive bias - and, well, we should be careful, more importantly, prayerful, and then be obedient to having a loving heart and a gentle way.
People talk about their right to be harsh and whatever, but that's not the fruit of the Spirit, and that's not actually love. Mocking, needling, whatever. That's not love.
Do we really hurt when they hurt? Or do we want to sting, feeling stung? I think there's a lot of that around.
Much love!
Eternally Grateful
Well-Known Member
A child of God can not walk in sin. John made that clear
we are a new creation in Christ. While we can still sin. We will not walk in it. Our vomit, which we used to love to eat. Now tastes so bad. we can not stand it anymore.
God said he WILL change us.. He did not say we had to. or could change ourselves.
Hmm…I see that verse as speaking of Jesus coming…healing the lame and deaf…
If we are the desert land…okay…then put your hand to the plow and break up your fallow ground. And anyone who puts his hand to the plow and turns back is not fit to enter the kingdom of God…
I'm not sure how this answers the question I asked, it seemed pretty simple. The passage says that if you've been baptized into Jesus, that you've been baptized into His death, the old man being crucified, that crucifixion making you free from sin.
Do you agree that this is what the wording says?
Romans 6:3-7 KJV
3) Know ye not, that so many of us as were baptized into Jesus Christ were baptized into his death?
4) Therefore we are buried with him by baptism into death: that like as Christ was raised up from the dead by the glory of the Father, even so we also should walk in newness of life.
5) For if we have been planted together in the likeness of his death, we shall be also in the likeness of his resurrection:
6) Knowing this, that our old man is crucified with him, that the body of sin might be destroyed, that henceforth we should not serve sin.
7) For he that is dead is freed from sin.
Much love!
Are you claiming to walk without sin? See what others here make of that. I see by your attitude that you walk by the power of the flesh...or...constant sin.
Only on one level The sin of the hypocrite is against God's holiness. And that kind of sin is worse than carnal sins. So then do you see the logic of Jesus that says...prostitutes and publicans will get into the kingdom before you? Do you see that with a new birth comes the possibility of a new level of sin? Do you fear the Lord? Do you embrace humility? So what is new is not always what NEW should be.
He will change you when you cry out to Him and stop relying on your own understanding.
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Or maybe humor? or maybe sometimes humor and sometimes a mixture of humor and some added worn down patience at harassment (because we ARE still human) rather than good conversation?
Waiting on him
Well-Known Member
I see what you are saying, Paul seems to me anyhow to be saying something similar. He seems to imply he did the demolition and now God is doing the plowing?
Galatians 2:18-20 KJV
[18] For if I build again the things which I destroyed, I make myself a transgressor. [19] For I through the law am dead to the law, that I might live unto God. [20] I am crucified with Christ: nevertheless I live; yet not I, but Christ liveth in me: and the life which I now live in the flesh I live by the faith of the Son of God, who loved me, and gave himself for me.
Everybody, including hypocrites agrees with wordings. What is lacking in Romans 6 is the power to walk as Jesus walked. That is reserved for Romans 8. Do you agree with the "wordings" of the whole bible? or just Romans 6?
Waiting on him
Well-Known Member
Galatians 2:18-20 KJV
[18] For if I build again the things which I destroyed, I make myself a transgressor. [19] For I through the law am dead to the law, that I might live unto God. [20] I am crucified with Christ: nevertheless I live; yet not I, but Christ liveth in me: and the life which I now live in the flesh I live by the faith of the Son of God, who loved me, and gave himself for me.
[18] For if I build again the things which I destroyed, I make myself a transgressor. [19] For I through the law am dead to the law, that I might live unto God. [20] I am crucified with Christ: nevertheless I live; yet not I, but Christ liveth in me: and the life which I now live in the flesh I live by the faith of the Son of God, who loved me, and gave himself for me.
Who among us wasn’t?
Yes, in fact I do.
This leads into an easy example of each.
Romans 6:3-7 KJV
3) Know ye not, that so many of us as were baptized into Jesus Christ were baptized into his death?
4) Therefore we are buried with him by baptism into death: that like as Christ was raised up from the dead by the glory of the Father, even so we also should walk in newness of life.
5) For if we have been planted together in the likeness of his death, we shall be also in the likeness of his resurrection:
6) Knowing this, that our old man is crucified with him, that the body of sin might be destroyed, that henceforth we should not serve sin.
7) For he that is dead is freed from sin.
For myself, I'd call it teaching.
Then there is a parallel passage,
Galatians 2:20-21 KJV
20) I am crucified with Christ: nevertheless I live; yet not I, but Christ liveth in me: and the life which I now live in the flesh I live by the faith of the Son of God, who loved me, and gave himself for me.
21) I do not frustrate the grace of God: for if righteousness come by the law, then Christ is dead in vain.
I would say this is Paul's testimony.
What he taught in general in Romans 6, he applied to himself in Galatians 2.
Much love!
Eternal security 101? You mean that if we receive the down payment of the Holy Spirit it’s then a done deal-we WILL live forever? I agree.
But there is more to the gospel of our Lord than that. That is an elementary thing. And you seem sometimes (to me) to not want to move beyond that and to not want to allow anyone else to move beyond it or even speak past elementary things.
So you read the Scriptures selectively, missing what @marks is driving at by quoting this passage.
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