Was the Transfiguration a vision, or an actual appearance of Moses and Elijah?

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face2face

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You know what Gnosticism is-right.

The spirit of this heresy is present with us today when people turn Christianity into an exclusive intellectual eliteness.

J.
Johann, the fact that quiet is even questioning me on this garb is ridiculous. Angels can't sin - sin comes from human flesh nature (only) and not God's Holy Divine Nature.

Everyone knows this is truth but they allow themselves to be deceived.

F2F
 

quietthinker

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You know what Gnosticism is-right.

The spirit of this heresy is present with us today when people turn Christianity into an exclusive intellectual eliteness.

J.
It is not our prerogative to call others by denigrating names because their ideas/ thoughts do not align with ours
 
J

Johann

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Johann, the fact that quiet is even questioning me on this garb is ridiculous. Angels can't sin - sin comes from human flesh nature (only) and not God's Holy Divine Nature.

Everyone knows this is truth but they allow themselves to be deceived.

F2F
He is trying to get a reaction from you-we are to respond, never react.

J.
 

face2face

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It is not our prerogative to call others by denigrating names because their ideas/ thoughts do not align with ours
Depends on how emphatic they are in speaking against what is true. My prerogative is not yours to judge quiet. If an idea is ridiculous why not call it out? If a person is speaking as a fool, why not say so? Would you rather that person remain delusional?

Let me ask you this question.

Can she prove this factious being is a female? Can see even prove from the Bible this being exists?

If not, then what is the basis of such a comment?

F2F
 

quietthinker

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Everyone knows this is truth but they allow themselves to be deceived.
Again you expand your assumptions by using the word 'everyone' ......and then cobbling it to judgement with the words 'allowing themselves to be deceived' In so doing you place yourself knowingly or unknowingly in a position of superiority
 

face2face

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Again you expand your assumptions by using the word 'everyone' ......and then cobbling it to judgement with the words 'allowing themselves to be deceived' In so doing you place yourself knowingly or unknowingly in a position of superiority
What are you being now? What is your aim here? Are you deceived also?

Would you respect false teaching? If you knew it was lies would you say nothing or correct it?

Have you ever tried to correct anyone? Or are you a people pleaser?

What say you?
 

quietthinker

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What are you being now? What is your aim here? Are you deceived also?

Would you respect false teaching? If you knew it was lies would you say nothing or correct it?

Have you ever tried to correct anyone? Or are you a people pleaser?

What say you?
If you understood good news you would refrain from running them into the ground. You would instead give them hope in their hopeless situation.
 

face2face

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I still believe "crackpot" was the kindest rebuking word at my disposal. It's one thing to suggest belief in a fictitious being but to be so adamant its a female when clearly Christ states: angels do not marry and cannot procreate - Angels are always presented in Scripture as being males in appearance.
 

face2face

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Maybe-but I would rather be a fool for Christ Jesus F2F.

J.
This is true J. As you know this subject of fallen angels is a raw nerve and it causes people no end of confusion when they hold such error in their hearts. Aunty Jane is often spruiking this error and not one person can show a single verse in the Bible that states this being imitated a serpent in the Garden. I've asked many times and while they try they no they come up short every time.

I just hate seeing people deceived.

Irritates me no end!

Thanks for your council J.

F2F
 

quietthinker

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not one person can show a single verse in the Bible that states this being imitated a serpent in the Garden
Revelation 12:9 'And the great dragon was cast out, that old serpent called the devil and Satan, who deceives all the world.....'

Here is one person showing you a single verse. :)
 
J

Johann

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This is true J. As you know this subject of fallen angels is a raw nerve and it causes people no end of confusion when they hold such error in their hearts. Aunty Jane is often spruiking this error and not one person can show a single verse in the Bible that states this being imitated a serpent in the Garden. I've asked many times and while they try they no they come up short every time.

I just hate seeing people deceived.

Irritates me no end!

Thanks for your council J.

F2F
This was clever F2F-I gave you no council except to respond, never react.

Look up Nachash-

The nachash (נָחָשׁ) in Genesis 3 is traditionally understood to be the serpent that tempted Eve in the Garden of Eden, leading to the fall of humanity. The Hebrew word "nachash" has been the subject of various interpretations and theological discussions over the centuries, giving rise to different perspectives on its meaning, symbolism, and identity.

1. Literal Interpretation: The Serpent
In the most straightforward reading of Genesis 3, the nachash is simply a serpent. This is reflected in most Bible translations:

Genesis 3:1 (Lexham Bible Translation): "Now the serpent was more crafty than any other beast of the field that the Lord God had made."
The narrative describes how the serpent approached Eve, tempted her to eat the fruit from the Tree of Knowledge of Good and Evil, and subsequently led both her and Adam to disobey God’s command (Genesis 3:1-7).

2. Symbolic Interpretation: Satan or a Fallen Angel
In Christian tradition, the nachash is often associated with Satan. This interpretation is not explicitly stated in Genesis 3, but it is developed in later biblical texts and Christian theology.

Revelation 12:9 refers to Satan as "that ancient serpent" (ὁ ὄφις ὁ ἀρχαῖος), drawing a connection between the serpent in the Garden and the figure of Satan as a deceiver.

2 Corinthians 11:3 and John 8:44 also emphasize Satan's role as a liar and deceiver, implying a connection with the nachash of Genesis.
From this viewpoint, the serpent in the garden is more than just a literal animal; it is a manifestation of Satan or a fallen angel using the serpent as a vessel to carry out the deception.

3. The Word "Nachash" and Its Possible Meanings
In Hebrew, the word nachash can be interpreted in a few different ways, and some scholars believe that the word may hold deeper layers of meaning that go beyond just a serpent:

Serpent: The most basic and common meaning of nachash is "serpent" or "snake." This is how it is understood in the Genesis account, where the creature is described as a being that could communicate and deceive Eve.

Shining One: Some scholars suggest that nachash is connected to the Hebrew root meaning "to shine" or "to glisten," which could imply that the nachash was originally a radiant, shining being—perhaps even related to the angelic realm. This interpretation might align with the description of Satan as an angel of light (2 Corinthians 11:14).

Diviner/Enchanter: Another possibility is that nachash could be related to the Hebrew verb נָחַשׁ (nachash), which means "to practice divination" or "to use enchantments." This might suggest that the nachash in Genesis 3 was associated with occult wisdom or forbidden knowledge, which could tie into the serpent’s role in leading Eve to seek knowledge apart from God.

4. The Nachash as a Rebel or Agent of Chaos
In some interpretations, particularly those informed by ancient Near Eastern thought, the nachash can be seen as a symbol of chaos or a rebel against divine order. In many ancient cultures, serpents were symbols of wisdom, power, but also chaos and death. The serpent's role in Genesis could symbolize the introduction of chaos and disorder into God's creation through disobedience.

Additionally, in later Jewish tradition, the nachash is sometimes associated with Samael, an angelic figure who is considered a seducer or accuser, further linking the serpent with rebellious spiritual beings.

5. Rabbinical Interpretations
In early Jewish exegesis, the serpent is sometimes viewed as a symbol of humanity's lower nature or desires. Some rabbis interpret the serpent as a representation of the yetzer hara (the evil inclination), the part of human nature that leads to sin.

Others speculate that the serpent had originally been an upright and intelligent creature, but after the fall, it was cursed to crawl on its belly and lose its original status (Genesis 3:14).

6. Conclusion: Nachash as a Complex Figure
The identity of the nachash in Genesis 3 is complex and layered with symbolic meaning:

At a literal level, it is a serpent that tempts Eve.
In Christian theology, it is often associated with Satan, symbolizing the deception and rebellion against God.
Linguistic studies suggest that the word nachash could carry connotations of shining or divination, hinting at a more exalted or supernatural nature for the being.
It could also be understood as a symbol of chaos or rebellion against God's created order.

The serpent’s role in the fall of humanity sets the stage for the redemptive narrative that culminates in Jesus Christ, who is said to crush the serpent’s head (Genesis 3:15; Romans 16:20), defeating sin and death.

J.
 

face2face

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Revelation 12:9 'And the great dragon was cast out, that old serpent called the devil and Satan, who deceives all the world.....'

Here is one person showing you a single verse. :)
Now can you interpret the symbol?

Are the symbols in Revelation 12 literal or symbolic?

If you don't know, be honest, if you do show forth the interpretation.

F2F
 

face2face

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Jun 22, 2015
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This was clever F2F-I gave you no council except to respond, never react.

Look up Nachash-

The nachash (נָחָשׁ) in Genesis 3 is traditionally understood to be the serpent that tempted Eve in the Garden of Eden, leading to the fall of humanity. The Hebrew word "nachash" has been the subject of various interpretations and theological discussions over the centuries, giving rise to different perspectives on its meaning, symbolism, and identity.

1. Literal Interpretation: The Serpent
In the most straightforward reading of Genesis 3, the nachash is simply a serpent. This is reflected in most Bible translations:

Genesis 3:1 (Lexham Bible Translation): "Now the serpent was more crafty than any other beast of the field that the Lord God had made."
The narrative describes how the serpent approached Eve, tempted her to eat the fruit from the Tree of Knowledge of Good and Evil, and subsequently led both her and Adam to disobey God’s command (Genesis 3:1-7).

2. Symbolic Interpretation: Satan or a Fallen Angel
In Christian tradition, the nachash is often associated with Satan. This interpretation is not explicitly stated in Genesis 3, but it is developed in later biblical texts and Christian theology.

Revelation 12:9 refers to Satan as "that ancient serpent" (ὁ ὄφις ὁ ἀρχαῖος), drawing a connection between the serpent in the Garden and the figure of Satan as a deceiver.

2 Corinthians 11:3 and John 8:44 also emphasize Satan's role as a liar and deceiver, implying a connection with the nachash of Genesis.
From this viewpoint, the serpent in the garden is more than just a literal animal; it is a manifestation of Satan or a fallen angel using the serpent as a vessel to carry out the deception.

3. The Word "Nachash" and Its Possible Meanings
In Hebrew, the word nachash can be interpreted in a few different ways, and some scholars believe that the word may hold deeper layers of meaning that go beyond just a serpent:

Serpent: The most basic and common meaning of nachash is "serpent" or "snake." This is how it is understood in the Genesis account, where the creature is described as a being that could communicate and deceive Eve.

Shining One: Some scholars suggest that nachash is connected to the Hebrew root meaning "to shine" or "to glisten," which could imply that the nachash was originally a radiant, shining being—perhaps even related to the angelic realm. This interpretation might align with the description of Satan as an angel of light (2 Corinthians 11:14).

Diviner/Enchanter: Another possibility is that nachash could be related to the Hebrew verb נָחַשׁ (nachash), which means "to practice divination" or "to use enchantments." This might suggest that the nachash in Genesis 3 was associated with occult wisdom or forbidden knowledge, which could tie into the serpent’s role in leading Eve to seek knowledge apart from God.

4. The Nachash as a Rebel or Agent of Chaos
In some interpretations, particularly those informed by ancient Near Eastern thought, the nachash can be seen as a symbol of chaos or a rebel against divine order. In many ancient cultures, serpents were symbols of wisdom, power, but also chaos and death. The serpent's role in Genesis could symbolize the introduction of chaos and disorder into God's creation through disobedience.

Additionally, in later Jewish tradition, the nachash is sometimes associated with Samael, an angelic figure who is considered a seducer or accuser, further linking the serpent with rebellious spiritual beings.

5. Rabbinical Interpretations
In early Jewish exegesis, the serpent is sometimes viewed as a symbol of humanity's lower nature or desires. Some rabbis interpret the serpent as a representation of the yetzer hara (the evil inclination), the part of human nature that leads to sin.

Others speculate that the serpent had originally been an upright and intelligent creature, but after the fall, it was cursed to crawl on its belly and lose its original status (Genesis 3:14).


6. Conclusion: Nachash as a Complex Figure
The identity of the nachash in Genesis 3 is complex and layered with symbolic meaning:

At a literal level, it is a serpent that tempts Eve.
In Christian theology, it is often associated with Satan, symbolizing the deception and rebellion against God.
Linguistic studies suggest that the word nachash could carry connotations of shining or divination, hinting at a more exalted or supernatural nature for the being.
It could also be understood as a symbol of chaos or rebellion against God's created order.

The serpent’s role in the fall of humanity sets the stage for the redemptive narrative that culminates in Jesus Christ, who is said to crush the serpent’s head (Genesis 3:15; Romans 16:20), defeating sin and death.

J.
A simple question requires a simple answer.

Can you show a single verse which tells of this imitation of a fiery creature pretending to be a serpent?

Yes or no?
 
J

Johann

Guest
A simple question requires a simple answer.

Can you show a single verse which tells of this imitation of a fiery creature pretending to be a serpent?

Yes or no?
With me there is no yes or no and I will answer when I want, not under interrogation.

2 Corinthians 11:14 – "And no wonder, for Satan himself masquerades as an angel of light."

This verse indicates that Satan has the ability to disguise himself, specifically as an angel of light, which might suggest that he can take on other deceptive forms as well, though it does not mention him pretending to be a serpent.


Isaiah 14:12-15 – The fall of Lucifer, often associated with Satan, is depicted as the fall of a "shining one" or a being of light and exaltation. While this text doesn't mention a serpent, it has been linked with Satan's rebellious nature, which could be symbolized through various forms, including the serpent in Genesis.

Ezekiel 28:12-17 – This passage speaks of a being, often interpreted as Satan, described as the "anointed cherub" who was in Eden and fell from perfection. It describes this being as having been "full of wisdom and perfect in beauty," again without mentioning a serpent, but the description of the being in Eden is sometimes associated with the serpent of Genesis 3.

These verses, when read together, allow for an interpretation that Satan, in his rebellion, may have taken the form of a serpent to deceive Eve, though they do not explicitly say that he "pretended" to be a serpent.

The Bible tends to emphasize the serpent’s role in Genesis 3 as a literal creature that Satan used rather than delving into the idea of a "fiery" being in disguise. The imagery of Satan as a shining or fiery being comes from later theological interpretation rather than from a single biblical verse.


J.
 
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quietthinker

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Now can you interpret the symbol?

Are the symbols in Revelation 12 literal or symbolic?

If you don't know, be honest, if you do show forth the interpretation.

F2F
It is for you to figure out f2f. Arriving at a conclusion which synchronises and clarifies truth from fiction is the desired outcome......may it be your objective!