To the only God our Savior

[Matthias]

Its disrespectful to call even your human parent by his name.

Yahweh isn’t a human parent. He is the God of Abraham, Isaac and Jacob. As I mentioned in my last post, he is addressed by his personal name frequently in the Hebrew Bible. Would you say that those who did were being disrespect?

It saddens me to see believers getting caught up in 'clique dogma' so they can draw attention to themself when entering into a meeting of the saints.

No one should ever being drawing attention to themselves when speaking about God by name.

 

[GeneZ]

Yahweh isn’t a human parent. He is the God of Abraham, Isaac and Jacob. As I mentioned in my last post, he is addressed by his personal name frequently in the Hebrew Bible. Would you say that those who did were being disrespect?




No one should ever being drawing attention to themselves when speaking about God by name.

Yahweh is God alone.
Jesus is God and Humanity in union.
The Holy Spirit is God and Angelic spirit in union.

Jesus manifests the Father to mankind in a way that humans can relate to.


"No one has ever seen God, but the one and only Son, who is himself God
and is in closest relationship with the Father, has made him known".

John 1:18

 

[Matthias]

Yahweh is God alone.

Yes. Are you not ashamed of yourself for calling God by his personal name? I’m not chastising you. I’m just trying to make sense of it in light of what you said about it being disrespectful (post #500). I think it’s fine to use his personal name. I also think it’s fine to refrain from using his personal name.

Jesus is God and Humanity in union.

Jesus is God and man. He is Yahweh to us.

The Holy Spirit is God and Angelic spirit in union.

That’s an unusual thing for a trinitarian say. Would you care to elaborate on it?

Jesus manifests the Father to mankind in a way that humans can relate to.

Certainly.

"No one has ever seen God, but the one and only Son, who is himself God
and is in closest relationship with the Father, has made him known".

John 1:18

That’s right.

My personal opinion, which I bind on no one:

It’s just as acceptable to call God by his personal name as it is to call the Messiah by his personal name.

 

[GeneZ]

That’s an unusual thing for a trinitarian say. Would you care to elaborate on it?

I said.... "The Holy Spirit is God and Angelic spirit in union."

Well? How can Jesus have humanity (soul)?
And also be in the OT the Angel of Jehovah, when angels are not souls, but spirits?

Jesus came as God to man, as a man.
Correct?

Before man was created?
And, it was just God and the angels?
He appeared to angels as the Angel of Jehovah!

The Angel of Jehovah perfectly revealed God to angels in angelic terms.
Just like Jesus reveals himself to humans in humanity terms!

I believe before man existed the Angel of Jehovah could tell the angels...
"To see me is to see the Father."

That is one reason why the Holy Spirit is different than the Son.
Being "spirit," and not soul, like Jesus is soul and God in union.

grace and peace ...............

 

[soberxp]

The reason for so much confusion may be that there are no 仙人 in the vocabulary.

神仙

神 is god

仙 is some kind of God but human.

仙 is 人human + 山Mountain

 

[Matthias]

I said.... "The Holy Spirit is God and Angelic spirit in union."

Well? How can Jesus have humanity (soul)?

Jesus is a human person. (I understand that in trinitarian theology he isn’t a human person. I’m a Jewish monotheist, not a trinitarian.)

And also be in the OT the Angel of Jehovah, when angels are not souls, but spirits?

The angel of Yahweh in my theology is an angel. The Hebrew Bible contains prophecies about the Messiah. That, in my theology, is how Jesus is in the OT.

Jesus came as God to man, as a man.
Correct?

I endorse Moses typology. Yahweh made Jesus Yahweh to man just as Yahweh made Moses Yahweh to Pharaoh.

Before man was created?
And, it was just God and the angels?
He appeared to angels as the Angel of Jehovah!

That’s not the common trinitarian take on it.

The Angel of Jehovah perfectly revealed God to angels in angelic terms.
Just like Jesus reveals himself to humans in humanity terms!

I believe before man existed the Angel of Jehovah could tell the angels...
"To see me is to see the Father."

That is one reason why the Holy Spirit is different than the Son.
Being "spirit," and not soul, like Jesus is soul and God in union.

grace and peace ...............

Thanks for elaborating on your comment.

 

[Matthias]

The reason for so much confusion may be that there are no 仙人 in the vocabulary.

神仙

神 is god

仙 is some kind of God but human.

仙 is 人human + 山Mountain

I don’t read Chinese characters, so I’m not grasping what you’re saying. Could you clarify it for me in English?

 

[soberxp]

I don’t read Chinese characters, so I’m not grasping what you’re saying. Could you clarify it for me in English?

Xian (仙) refers to a type of immortal or transcendent being in Chinese mythology and Daoism (Taoism). They are often depicted as humans who achieved immortality through spiritual cultivation, harmony with nature, and moral purity. Unlike god (shen 神), who are divine by nature, Xian are humans who transformed into eternal beings."

 

[GeneZ]

Jesus is a human person. (I understand that in trinitarian theology he isn’t a human person. I’m a Jewish monotheist, not a trinitarian.)

I was Jewish. Found that Jesus is not make believe.
Though, with some Christians I was beginning to believe he was.

In the OT is shows that the Lord God of Israel was being two natures in union.

God is Deity.
Man is soul. Not Deity.

The Lord God of Israel was both Deity and Soul in union...

And they began to remove the foreign gods from their midst and to serve Jehovah,
so that his soul became impatient because of the trouble of Israel. Judges 10:16​

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Jehovah himself examines the righteous one as well as the wicked one,
and anyone loving violence his soul certainly hates." Ps 11:5​

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“Bring no more futile sacrifices; Incense is an abomination to Me. The New Moons, the Sabbaths,
and the calling of assemblies— I cannot endure iniquity and the sacred meeting. Your New Moons
and your appointed feasts My soul hates; They are a trouble to Me, I am weary of bearing them.. Isa 1:13-14​

Unless it is pointed out? You would never see it. The Lord God of Israel was being a union of Deity and soul!

The body supplied later by Mary's womb became the body for the Soul of Jehovah!

In a nut shell.....

 

[Matthias]

Xian (仙) refers to a type of immortal or transcendent being in Chinese mythology and Daoism (Taoism). They are often depicted as humans who achieved immortality through spiritual cultivation, harmony with nature, and moral purity. Unlike god (shen 神), who are divine by nature, Xian are humans who transformed into eternal beings."

Thanks. Mixing ideas from Chinese mythology and Taoism with Jewish writings really complicates comprehension for me.

 

[Matthias]

In the OT is shows that the Lord God of Israel was being two natures in union.

I don’t see that at all in the OT. I do see it - but only in regard to the second person of the Trinity after the posited Incarnation - in the Council of Chalcedon.

God is Deity.
Man is soul. Not Deity.

The Lord God of Israel was both Deity and Soul in union...

And they began to remove the foreign gods from their midst and to serve Jehovah,​

so that his soul became impatient because of the trouble of Israel. Judges 10:16​

​

​

​

Jehovah himself examines the righteous one as well as the wicked one, ​

and anyone loving violence his soul certainly hates." Ps 11:5​

​

​

​

“Bring no more futile sacrifices; Incense is an abomination to Me. The New Moons, the Sabbaths, ​

and the calling of assemblies— I cannot endure iniquity and the sacred meeting. Your New Moons ​

and your appointed feasts My soul hates; They are a trouble to Me, I am weary of bearing them.. Isa 1:13-14​

Unless it is pointed out? You would never see it. The Lord God of Israel was being a union of Deity and soul!

The body supplied later by Mary's womb became the body for the Soul of Jehovah!

In a nut shell.....

 

[soberxp]

Thanks. Mixing ideas from Chinese mythology and Taoism with Jewish writings really complicates comprehension for me.

Never mind, just use the word to explain something.

 

[David Lamb]

I didn’t think it was necessary for me to say that the Trinity isn’t the Messiah’s God but maybe it is. For the sake of clarity, I am.

The Messiah is a Jewish monotheist. By definition, that places him outside the category of trinitarian.

Not so. The Messiah said, "I and My Father are one." Even His enemies recognised that He was claiming to be God:

“Therefore the Jews sought all the more to kill Him, because He not only broke the Sabbath, but also said that God was His Father, making Himself equal with God.” (Joh 5:18 NKJV)

 

[Ritajanice]

No. Jesus is the Son of my great God and Savior.

Amen!...Praise God for Jesus!.

If it wasn’t for God, sending Jesus to the cross...there would be NO way back to our Father.

There is only one way back to our Spirit Father...His Name is “ JESUS “ God has given him, the Name above all names...Praise God!....

 

[Matthias]

Not so.

Me: “The Trinity isn’t the Messiah’s God.”

You: “Not so.”

”I am ascending to my Father and your Father, to my God and your God“ (John 20:17).

Who does Jesus say his God is? That should decisively settle the matter between us.

Me: “Jesus is a Jewish monotheist.”

You: ”Not so.”

Do you know who Jewish monotheists affirm their God, the one and only true God is?

The Messiah said, "I and My Father are one."

He did. He also prayed to his God and my God, saying, “I am praying not only for these disciples but also for all who will ever believe in me through their message. I pray that they will all be one, just as you and I are one …” (John 17:20-21).

Even His enemies recognised that He was claiming to be God:

“Therefore the Jews sought all the more to kill Him, because He not only broke the Sabbath, but also said that God was His Father, making Himself equal with God.” (Joh 5:18 NKJV)

”My Father is greater than I“ (John 14:28).

P.S.

Who did they say he said his God is?

The Trinity? No. God is his Father. Further confirming my simple point that the Trinity is not the Messiah’s God.

 

[Matthias]

Saying that God is your Father does not make a person God, nor does it make a person equal with God.

Every son (and daughter) of God should say that God is his (or her) Father.

***

The unbelieving Jews also said that God is their Father. They weren’t thereby claiming that they were equal with God. Jesus set them straight. Rejecting Jesus is rejecting the Father - the one, unique and only true God - who sent him. If God really were their Father, they would have believed Jesus. It’s not that Jesus is literally the Father; it’s that Jesus is functionally the Father. Jesus is the Father’s agent / representative.

Was Jesus making himself equal with God? No. Jesus is functionally equal with God; and that was his God’s doing, not his.

In his religion, the accusation would be that Jesus himself, acting on his own, by himself, was placing himself in the place of the Father - the one whom both he and they knew is the only one who is truly God. (They weren’t trinitarians, and neither was / is he. They were all, including Jesus, Jewish monotheists.)

Jesus didn’t put himself in the place of the Father / in the place of God. The Father himself put him in that place.

The Father himself, Yahweh, God, made Jesus himself Yahweh (God) to us. Most of Jesus’ contemporaries didn’t believe it. Some of them did. I’m a 21st century Jewish monotheist who does.

 

[soberxp]

@Matthias
Why don't many Jews read the Bible? But they use it as a basis. Maybe I don't know something.

 

[GeneZ]

I had been at one time unregenerated.
I was once a dumb Jew.

I know what it is like to be a Jew amongst the nice goyim.

All I could do was to repeat what religious men told me to believe.
Because, I did not have the transformational inner life that would cause me to see what spiritually dead people can not see.

No logic would suffice.
You must be born again.
Or, remain dumb and dead to the Truth that saves.

 

[Matthias]

@Matthias
Why don't many Jews read the Bible? But they use it as a basis. Maybe I don't know something.

We could ask the same thing about Christians.

But addressing your question -

Jews who don’t believe Jesus - who is also a Jew - is the Messiah typically don’t read the New Testament. Observant Jews read the Hebrew Bible, the Old Testament.

 

[GeneZ]

We could ask the same thing about Christians.

But addressing your question -

Jews who don’t believe Jesus - who is also a Jew - is the Messiah typically don’t read the New Testament. Observant Jews read the Hebrew Bible, the Old Testament.

Hate to break it to you.
Stop assuming about Jews.

Except for the very religious (mostly superstitious).
They will glance through the Bible. Not read it.

They will love the story of the Exodus and about Purim.
But it is like glorious folklore they bathe in... rather than Truth that applies to them now.