The Ones Who Are Left…

[Naomi25]

Well aware of what I see and said.

No.

It is of no matter to me, WHAT format, God “CHOSE” to reveal “HIS WORD”, in poetry, in ink on paper, in stone, in parables, in visions....SO WHAT?

Does HOW God Chose to reveal His Word, “matter to you”? WHY? Do you have some criticism, of HOW God reveals, “should have” been “according to you” ?

I am sorry. I am having a very hard time believing you are at all serious.
You. Don’t. Care. How God chose to reveal his word to us.
So. If God gives you poetry. You don’t care…you know better, you’ll take it literally.
If God gives you prophecy. You don’t care…you know better, you’ll take it literally.
If God gives you wisdom. You don’t care…you know better, you’ll take it literally.
If God gives you apocalyptic. You don’t care…you know better, you’ll take it literally.

Do you know where that leaves you?
Poetry - “The Lord is my Shepherd…”. Literally means you should expect to actually “lie down beside still waters”. That you must actually “walk through the valley of the shadow of death”…which is where, by the way? That you WILL fear no evil. Do you have NO fears?

Prophecy - “And I will turn you about and put hooks into your jaws…” Literally means waiting for an earthly leader to be dragged somewhere with a dirty great big hook in his jaw.

Wisdom - “Wisdom cries aloud in the street, in the markets she raises her voice…”. Literally means the attribute of ‘wisdom’ must now be personified as an actual woman.

Apocalyptic: “I saw a Lamb standing, as though it has been slain, with seven horns and with seven eyes, which are the seven spirits of God..” Literally would demand that Christ is actually a Lamb with seven horns and seven eyes.

Now…if you REALLY don’t care HOW God has presented scripture to us, then you surely mustn’t care that the meanings clearly change when you take into account if you read them as they’re meant, or if you force ‘Literal’ interpretation onto them.

But…I suspect you do not actually read them that way. Thus I say you proclaim a hermeneutic you cannot uphold. You recognise, I suspect, that the Lamb REPRESENTS Christ. That ‘wisdom’ is being personified as a woman in order for the Holy Spirit, through Solomon, to make a piercing point about the attribute in question. You surely recognise that no world leader will be led out to battle with an actual hook, again it is symbolic. And David is using imagery to paint emotive responses to his Lord and how essential he is to his life, the ‘still waters’ being the inner peace God brings, the ability to walk through ‘the valley’ comes with the knowledge that our God is THE God, and that because of his promises to us, we can daily look our fears in the face because…what have we to fear?

Now…if you want to disagree with me and try and argue how you still don’t give a fig about HOW God presented his word, that it doesn’t change the interpretation and that you’ll still take all these things literally, I invite you to do so, but I do wonder how you’ll wiggle around the clearly different genres. I confess I might enjoy watching you try and explain all the metaphor and imagery all the while trying to call them ‘literal’.

 

[Naomi25]

If YOU are the Forgiver of Sin...
What is the Point of the Good News Gospel and New Covenant?

Matt 18:
[15] Moreover if thy brother shall trespass against thee, go and tell him his fault between thee and him alone: if he shall hear thee, thou hast gained thy brother.
[16] But if he will not hear thee, then take with thee one or two more, that in the mouth of two or three witnesses every word may be established.
[17] And if he shall neglect to hear them, tell it unto the church: but if he neglect to hear the church, let him be unto thee as an heathen man and a publican.

Mark 2
[7] Why doth this man thus speak blasphemies? who can forgive sins but God only?

Luke.5
[21] And the scribes and the Pharisees began to reason, saying, Who is this which speaketh blasphemies? Who can forgive sins, but God alone?

Matt 6
[14] For if ye forgive men their trespasses, your heavenly Father will also forgive you:

Ok. Let me break this down for you in a way…hopefully, that you might understand.

Sin is only against God, you say?
The 10 Commandments were the ultimate in the old covenant, yes? We can say also that with perhaps the exception of keeping the Sabbath, all 9 of them still apply. And it was clearly perceived that breaking them was sinning. To keep them, was to not sin against God.
Except….what ARE some of the 10?

Honour your Mother and Father
Thou shall not murder
Thou shall not commit adultery
Thou shall not steal
Thou shall not bear false witness against thy neighbour
Thou shall not covet thy neighbours wife, house, slave or possession.

That’s 6 out of 10. And they have to do with sinning against our fellow man.

Now….I don’t want you to think I don’t understand the idea that in a very real sense SIN can only be against a holy God. This is true. But what we have scripture repeatedly telling us is that WHEN we sin against our fellow man, we ARE sinning against God. Our sin nature is so pervasive within us that our ‘transgressions’, if you want to call them that, against other people, stem from the same fountain that flows from our rebellion against God. It is because we are rebellious against God that we sin against our fellow man.
This is why, when Jesus was asked what the most important commandment was, he said “love the Lord you God with all your heart, mind and soul….and the second is to love your neighbour as yourself.” The tremendous thing about this, and the first few Commandments from the 10 if we look at them, is…when we put God first in our affections and attentions, we naturally begin to treat other better as well; love them more, serve them more. When we have no other God but him, we’re not likely to have false idols. Or to murder, or commit adultery.
We do sin against God by sinning against others…but its all still sin. The 10 shows this. The biblical text shows this.

 

[Earburner]

Sir…if you find it troublesome to differentiate between a prophecy dealing with the sins of all mankind against God…and a parable Jesus is telling to illustrate to those around him how we ourselves ought to forgive others…then may I suggest you might find it helpful branching out into other bible translations…?

Yes! It is a parable, but it is directed purposely to the "wicked servant", being the Jews. Now go find who the "fellow servants" are, and what they saw and learned.
Can you tell us what God did to the Jews in 70AD., because they neglected and rejected their only means for forgiveness, and the Gift of eternal life, in the "time of their visitation"?
It's all there in KJV Daniel 9:24-27.

Did you happen to notice to whom that prophecy specifically opens to? The angel spoke the words to Daniel- "thy people" and "thy holy city".
What happened to them and that holy city?? Again- Daniel 9:24-27

And so, the KoG was taken from that
"wicked servant" the Jews, and given to another nation WHO show forth the praises of Him who did the work for us all.

Today, ever since 70AD, who is that "nation" of fellow servants, and by what name are they called? 1 Peter 2:9.

Please study deeper than you do, and I pray it will all be done "by my Spirit" KJV Zechariah 4:6 and John 16:13.
Thanks for listening!
Earburner

 

[Earburner]

^ Now, as for Daniel 9:27, I have another bone to pick with you and all, by the KJV, in comparing it with all the erroneous suggestions of the newer bible versions.

But before I get started, I am going to provide a very bold and sharp clue, that will cause you to think beyond the dogma of popular "church-ianity". Please be aware, it will not be anything that you even dared to bring yourself to think about!

In all the bibles, that use the words: confirm, covenant, desolate, poured abomination and determined, I now ask, concerning Daniel 9:24, what six (6) works of God was God the Father "determined" to do, and through Whom?
Remember Zechariah 4:6 and John 16:13 as you RE-study, and please notice that in verses 24 and 27 that the word "determined" is used twice!!

 

[Truth7t7]

The 10 Commandments were the ultimate in the old covenant, yes? We can say also that with perhaps the exception of keeping the Sabbath, all 9 of them still apply. And it was clearly perceived that breaking them was sinning. To keep them, was to not sin against God.
Except….what ARE some of the 10?

Honour your Mother and Father
Thou shall not murder
Thou shall not commit adultery
Thou shall not steal
Thou shall not bear false witness against thy neighbour
Thou shall not covet thy neighbours wife, house, slave or possession.

That’s 6 out of 10. And they have to do with sinning against our fellow man.

Now….I don’t want you to think I don’t understand the idea that in a very real sense SIN can only be against a holy God. This is true. But what we have scripture repeatedly telling us is that WHEN we sin against our fellow man, we ARE sinning against God. Our sin nature is so pervasive within us that our ‘transgressions’, if you want to call them that, against other people, stem from the same fountain that flows from our rebellion against God. It is because we are rebellious against God that we sin against our fellow man.
This is why, when Jesus was asked what the most important commandment was, he said “love the Lord you God with all your heart, mind and soul….and the second is to love your neighbour as yourself.” The tremendous thing about this, and the first few Commandments from the 10 if we look at them, is…when we put God first in our affections and attentions, we naturally begin to treat other better as well; love them more, serve them more. When we have no other God but him, we’re not likely to have false idols. Or to murder, or commit adultery.
We do sin against God by sinning against others…but its all still sin. The 10 shows this. The biblical text shows this.

All 10 commandments apply today, including Sabbath observance under grace as Jesus taught in his ministry on earth

The Sabbath is eternal and will be observed in the New Heaven and Earth

Isaiah 66:22-23KJV
22 For as the new heavens and the new earth, which I will make, shall remain before me, saith the Lord, so shall your seed and your name remain.
23 And it shall come to pass, that from one new moon to another, and from one sabbath to another, shall all flesh come to worship before me, saith the Lord.

Revelation 14:12KJV
12 Here is the patience of the saints: here are they that keep the commandments of God, and the faith of Jesus.

John 14:15KJV
15 If ye love me, keep my commandments.

 

[Truth7t7]

Yes! It is a parable, but it is directed purposely to the "wicked servant", being the Jews. Now go find who the "fellow servants" are, and what they saw and learned.
Can you tell us what God did to the Jews in 70AD., because they neglected and rejected their only means for forgiveness, and the Gift of eternal life, in the "time of their visitation"?
It's all there in KJV Daniel 9:24-27.

Did you happen to notice to whom that prophecy specifically opens to? The angel spoke the words to Daniel- "thy people" and "thy holy city".
What happened to them and that holy city?? Again- Daniel 9:24-27

And so, the KoG was taken from that
"wicked servant" the Jews, and given to another nation WHO show forth the praises of Him who did the work for us all.

Today, ever since 70AD, who is that "nation" of fellow servants, and by what name are they called? 1 Peter 2:9.

Please study deeper than you do, and I pray it will all be done "by my Spirit" KJV Zechariah 4:6 and John 16:13.
Thanks for listening!
Earburner

Daniel's (Little Horn)

This "Future" figure will be present on earth to see the (Second Coming) of Jesus Christ and final judgement, as this figure will be slain by Jesus Christ and cast into the lake of fire (Future) unfulfilled

"Future" (Second Coming, Final Judgement) Below

Daniel 7:8-11KJV
8 I considered the horns, and, behold, there came up among them another little horn, before whom there were three of the first horns plucked up by the roots: and, behold, in this horn were eyes like the eyes of man, and a mouth speaking great things.
9 I beheld till the thrones were cast down, and the Ancient of days did sit, whose garment was white as snow, and the hair of his head like the pure wool: his throne was like the fiery flame, and his wheels as burning fire.
10 A fiery stream issued and came forth from before him: thousand thousands ministered unto him, and ten thousand times ten thousand stood before him: the judgment was set, and the books were opened.
11 I beheld then because of the voice of the great words which the horn spake: I beheld even till the beast was slain, and his body destroyed, and given to the burning flame.

This "Future" figure will be present on earth making (Abomination & Desolation) to the (Consummation) or (The Ultimate End) "Future" Event(s) Unfulfilled

Merriam-Webster
Definition of consummation

1: the act of consummating the consummation of a contract by mutual signature specifically : the consummating of a marriage
2: the ultimate end

Daniel 9:27KJV
27 And he shall confirm the covenant with many for one week: and in the midst of the week he shall cause the sacrifice and the oblation to cease, and for the overspreading of abominations he shall make it desolate, even until the consummation, and that determined shall be poured upon the desolate.

 

[Naomi25]

Yes! It is a parable, but it is directed purposely to the "wicked servant", being the Jews. Now go find who the "fellow servants" are, and what they saw and learned.
Can you tell us what God did to the Jews in 70AD., because they neglected and rejected their only means for forgiveness, and the Gift of eternal life, in the "time of their visitation"?
It's all there in KJV Daniel 9:24-27.

Did you happen to notice to whom that prophecy specifically opens to? The angel spoke the words to Daniel- "thy people" and "thy holy city".
What happened to them and that holy city?? Again- Daniel 9:24-27

And so, the KoG was taken from that
"wicked servant" the Jews, and given to another nation WHO show forth the praises of Him who did the work for us all.

Today, ever since 70AD, who is that "nation" of fellow servants, and by what name are they called? 1 Peter 2:9.

Please study deeper than you do, and I pray it will all be done "by my Spirit" KJV Zechariah 4:6 and John 16:13.
Thanks for listening!
Earburner

You are so intent on dragging Matt 18 back to Daniel’s prophecy that you continually miss the obvious…the low hanging fruit, as it were.
When we get to Matthew 18, what do we read:

Matthew 18:15
“If your brother sins against you, go and tell him his fault, between you and him alone. If he listens to you, you have gained your brother.

Matthew 18:21

Then Peter came up and said to him, “Lord, how often will my brother sin against me, and I forgive him? As many as seven times?”

“My Brother”. You say this must point to the Jewish people…but does it? Scripture itself tells us:

Matthew 12:50
For whoever does the will of my Father in heaven is my brother and sister and mother.”

Hebrews 2:11
For he who sanctifies and those who are sanctified all have one source. That is why he is not ashamed to call them brothers,

There. Those who ‘do the will of the Father’….those who are ‘sanctified’…are ‘brothers’. And of course, we can also look at passages like Gal 3:28…”there is neither Jew, nor GreeK in Christ” to support this…in Christ, we are all ‘one’…all ‘brothers’.
When we put these clear references together with the CONTEXT of Matthew 18 and the parable itself….you have no leg to stand on in your effort to link either parable or ‘70x7’ to Daniel 24.

 

[Naomi25]

All 10 commandments apply today, including Sabbath observance under grace as Jesus taught in his ministry on earth

The Sabbath is eternal and will be observed in the New Heaven and Earth

Isaiah 66:22-23KJV
22 For as the new heavens and the new earth, which I will make, shall remain before me, saith the Lord, so shall your seed and your name remain.
23 And it shall come to pass, that from one new moon to another, and from one sabbath to another, shall all flesh come to worship before me, saith the Lord.

Revelation 14:12KJV
12 Here is the patience of the saints: here are they that keep the commandments of God, and the faith of Jesus.

John 14:15KJV
15 If ye love me, keep my commandments.

Mark 2:27-28
And he said to them, “The Sabbath was made for man, not man for the Sabbath. So the Son of Man is lord even of the Sabbath.”

Colossians 2:16-17
Therefore let no one pass judgment on you in questions of food and drink, or with regard to a festival or a new moon or a Sabbath. These are a shadow of the things to come, but the substance belongs to Christ.


Jesus affirms that the Sabbath is a gift to mankind…not something for us to be bound and restricted to. And, ultimately, we see that he is both Lord of it, and the fulfilment of it. The rest and restoration man was meant to find IN Sabbath, was but a ‘shadow’ of what we find in Christ. Now that Christ has come, we have the FREEDOM (hence the command “let no one judge) to find that rest and restoration IN Christ in any way…or and DAY we choose. That most Christians choose to worship Christ on the day of his resurrection is not a surprise. And it is certainly not against scripture, or the freedom we have in him.

 

[Truth7t7]

Mark 2:27-28
And he said to them, “The Sabbath was made for man, not man for the Sabbath. So the Son of Man is lord even of the Sabbath.”

Colossians 2:16-17
Therefore let no one pass judgment on you in questions of food and drink, or with regard to a festival or a new moon or a Sabbath. These are a shadow of the things to come, but the substance belongs to Christ.


Jesus affirms that the Sabbath is a gift to mankind…not something for us to be bound and restricted to. And, ultimately, we see that he is both Lord of it, and the fulfilment of it. The rest and restoration man was meant to find IN Sabbath, was but a ‘shadow’ of what we find in Christ. Now that Christ has come, we have the FREEDOM (hence the command “let no one judge) to find that rest and restoration IN Christ in any way…or and DAY we choose. That most Christians choose to worship Christ on the day of his resurrection is not a surprise. And it is certainly not against scripture, or the freedom we have in him.

Colossians 2:16-17 below was written for those "Observing" the Sabbath days and new moons that are "Eternal"

Colossians 2:16-17KJV
16 Let no man therefore judge you in meat, or in drink, or in respect of an holyday, or of the new moon, or of the sabbath days:
17 Which are a shadow of things to come; but the body is of Christ.

The Sabbath is eternal and will be observed in the New Heaven and Earth

Isaiah 66:22-23KJV
22 For as the new heavens and the new earth, which I will make, shall remain before me, saith the Lord, so shall your seed and your name remain.
23 And it shall come to pass, that from one new moon to another, and from one sabbath to another, shall all flesh come to worship before me, saith the Lord.

 

[Naomi25]

Colossians 2:16-17 below was written for those "Observing" the Sabbath days and new moons that are "Eternal"

Colossians 2:16-17KJV
16 Let no man therefore judge you in meat, or in drink, or in respect of an holyday, or of the new moon, or of the sabbath days:
17 Which are a shadow of things to come; but the body is of Christ.

The Sabbath is eternal and will be observed in the New Heaven and Earth

Isaiah 66:22-23KJV
22 For as the new heavens and the new earth, which I will make, shall remain before me, saith the Lord, so shall your seed and your name remain.
23 And it shall come to pass, that from one new moon to another, and from one sabbath to another, shall all flesh come to worship before me, saith the Lord.

Disagree entirely with how you see and interpret that.
But nothing I am likely to say will matter a jot to you, will it? So what is the point of me trying? I certainly have better things to do with my time.

 

[Truth7t7]

Disagree entirely with how you see and interpret that.
But nothing I am likely to say will matter a jot to you, will it? So what is the point of me trying? I certainly have better things to do with my time.

Thanks for the response, we disagree no biggie

Jesus Is The Lord

 

[Earburner]

You are so intent on dragging Matt 18 back to Daniel’s prophecy that you continually miss the obvious…the low hanging fruit, as it were.
When we get to Matthew 18, what do we read:

Matthew 18:15
“If your brother sins against you, go and tell him his fault, between you and him alone. If he listens to you, you have gained your brother.

Matthew 18:21

Then Peter came up and said to him, “Lord, how often will my brother sin against me, and I forgive him? As many as seven times?”

“My Brother”. You say this must point to the Jewish people…but does it? Scripture itself tells us:

Matthew 12:50
For whoever does the will of my Father in heaven is my brother and sister and mother.”

Hebrews 2:11
For he who sanctifies and those who are sanctified all have one source. That is why he is not ashamed to call them brothers,

There. Those who ‘do the will of the Father’….those who are ‘sanctified’…are ‘brothers’. And of course, we can also look at passages like Gal 3:28…”there is neither Jew, nor GreeK in Christ” to support this…in Christ, we are all ‘one’…all ‘brothers’.
When we put these clear references together with the CONTEXT of Matthew 18 and the parable itself….you have no leg to stand on in your effort to link either parable or ‘70x7’ to Daniel 24.

My POINT, that you so muched have missed, was WHY DID Jesus point to Daniel 9:24, by His use of the words "seventy times seven"? YOU don't know, but I have shown you, being that of the six works of God in 9:24. Please read them in the KJV.
9:25-27 provides the time details and events concerning all of 9:24.

Now, am I aware of the spiritual value of His parable, following his words of "seven times seventy"? Of course I am, and to the fullest degree!!

Again- WHY the mention of the 70 weeks?
Ans. Jesus was revealing that God the Father gave to Israel His "determination" (judgment) of events, that were to take place through JESUS, TO Daniel's people and their city.

Its simple, but it's you who is over steppIng it, just so that you can rush into the parable.
Again- 9:24. WHO is it about, and WHAT did He "FINISH" ?

 

[Naomi25]

My POINT, that you so muched have missed, was WHY DID Jesus point to Daniel 9:24, by His use of the words "seventy times seven"? YOU don't know, but I have shown you, being that of the six works of God in 9:24. Please read them in the KJV.
9:25-27 provides the time details and events concerning all of 9:24.

Now, am I aware of the spiritual value of His parable, following his words of "seven times seventy"? Of course I am, and to the fullest degree!!

Again- WHY the mention of the 70 weeks?
Ans. Jesus was revealing that God the Father gave to Israel His "determination" (judgment) of events, that were to take place through JESUS, TO Daniel's people and their city.

Its simple, but it's you who is over steppIng it, just so that you can rush into the parable.
Again- 9:24. WHO is it about, and WHAT did He "FINISH" ?

This is absolutely pointless. It’s not that I have “missed” it, I just think you’re wrong.
And clearly you disagree with me.
And no…having me read the KJV won’t magically make me see your POV.
So, this is where I get off this merri-go-round. Cheers.

 

[Truth7t7]

My POINT, that you so muched have missed, was WHY DID Jesus point to Daniel 9:24, by His use of the words "seventy times seven"? YOU don't know, but I have shown you, being that of the six works of God in 9:24. Please read them in the KJV.
9:25-27 provides the time details and events concerning all of 9:24.

Now, am I aware of the spiritual value of His parable, following his words of "seven times seventy"? Of course I am, and to the fullest degree!!

Again- WHY the mention of the 70 weeks?
Ans. Jesus was revealing that God the Father gave to Israel His "determination" (judgment) of events, that were to take place through JESUS, TO Daniel's people and their city.

Its simple, but it's you who is over steppIng it, just so that you can rush into the parable.
Again- 9:24. WHO is it about, and WHAT did He "FINISH" ?

Daniel 9:24-27, Seventy Literal Weeks Explained?

Daniel's 70 weeks are literal 7 day periods, or 490 literal days.

If Daniel meant 490 years he would have written

(Four hundred and ninety years)

Daniel had no restrictions in "Writing" exact numerology as seen below.

Daniel 6:1KJV
It pleased Darius to set over the kingdom an hundred and twenty princes, which should be over the whole kingdom;

Daniel 8:14KJV
And he said unto me, Unto two thousand and three hundred days; then shall the sanctuary be cleansed.

Daniel 12:11KJV
And from the time that the daily sacrifice shall be taken away, and the abomination that maketh desolate set up, there shall be a thousand two hundred and ninety days.

Below in Daniel 10:2-3 we see just another example of Daniel's literal weeks, as Daniel mourned and fasted for 3 literal weeks or 21 days.

Daniel 10:2-3KJV
2 In those days I Daniel was mourning three full weeks.
3 I ate no pleasant bread, neither came flesh nor wine in my mouth, neither did I anoint myself at all, till three whole weeks were fulfilled.

Below in Daniel 9:24-27 we see (70 Literal Future Weeks) or 490 days.

When the (Future) call/commandment goes out in Jerusalem to build unto the Jewish Meshiach/Messiah that they wait for (They Denied Jesus Christ) this will start the 7 week period.

62 literal weeks will be in building, and Meshiach/Messiah will be cut off as Armies surrounding Jerusalem, who stop the building.

The 70th literal week will see the antichrist revealed in making a covenant, and in the middle of this literal week he proclaims to be Meshiach/Messiah God to the Jews, and Jesus returned to the apostate church, to start a Millennium on earth.

The 3.5 year tribulation now starts.

Daniel 9:24-27KJV
24 Seventy weeks are determined upon thy people and upon thy holy city, to finish the transgression, and to make an end of sins, and to make reconciliation for iniquity, and to bring in everlasting righteousness, and to seal up the vision and prophecy, and to anoint the most Holy.
25 Know therefore and understand, that from the going forth of the commandment to restore and to build Jerusalem unto the Messiah the Prince shall be seven weeks, and threescore and two weeks: the street shall be built again, and the wall, even in troublous times.
26 And after threescore and two weeks shall Messiah be cut off, but not for himself: and the people of the prince that shall come shall destroy the city and the sanctuary; and the end thereof shall be with a flood, and unto the end of the war desolations are determined.
27 And he shall confirm the covenant with many for one week: and in the midst of the week he shall cause the sacrifice and the oblation to cease, and for the overspreading of abominations he shall make it desolate, even until the consummation, and that determined shall be poured upon the desolate.

 

[farouk]

Mark 2:27-28
And he said to them, “The Sabbath was made for man, not man for the Sabbath. So the Son of Man is lord even of the Sabbath.”

Colossians 2:16-17
Therefore let no one pass judgment on you in questions of food and drink, or with regard to a festival or a new moon or a Sabbath. These are a shadow of the things to come, but the substance belongs to Christ.


Jesus affirms that the Sabbath is a gift to mankind…not something for us to be bound and restricted to. And, ultimately, we see that he is both Lord of it, and the fulfilment of it. The rest and restoration man was meant to find IN Sabbath, was but a ‘shadow’ of what we find in Christ. Now that Christ has come, we have the FREEDOM (hence the command “let no one judge) to find that rest and restoration IN Christ in any way…or and DAY we choose. That most Christians choose to worship Christ on the day of his resurrection is not a surprise. And it is certainly not against scripture, or the freedom we have in him.

@Naomi25 Now that we have the fullness of revelation in Christ, for rule-enforcers to want to go back to the types and shadows makes little sense, right?

 

[Naomi25]

@Naomi25 Now that we have the fullness of revelation in Christ, for rule-enforcers to want to go back to the types and shadows makes little sense, right?

No…it doesn’t make sense. It’s also sad. It’s like a freed slave wanting to go back into enslavement. Or someone who’s been cured of cancer to wish for that time when they had it and was simply pleased to sit in the diagnosis of it without pursuing the cure.
Knowing what is wrong with the human condition (sin) and knowing what is needed for freedom from it ( Christ) and then going back to law is like humans determinedly returning to states that they KNOW led to enslavement and death. And that is not just baffling…it is tragic.

 

[Truth7t7]

@Naomi25 Now that we have the fullness of revelation in Christ, for rule-enforcers to want to go back to the types and shadows makes little sense, right?

Fact is, the 10 commandments have never been revoked or replaced, Jesus Christ taught observance of the commandments, the Sabbath and New Moons are "Eternal"

Roman Emperor Constantine in 321 AD made Sunday observance law, he is the father of Roman Catholicism, he donated the land that Vatican City sits on, he built St. Peter's Basilica

It's this same church that has given the world their pagan celebrations in easter and christmas, with their Gregorian calendar devoted to the gods and emperors of Rome

 

[farouk]

A lot of seeds sown over the last two millennia.

Was it Admiral Mahan or someone who famously said, That's the trouble with history; you end up annoying a lot of ppl along the way...

(Similar comment for winds of doctrine by which ppl are tossed to and fro...)

 

[Earburner]

"Truth7t7, post: 1195573, member: 6093"]The 70th literal week will see the antichrist revealed in making a covenant, and in the middle of this literal week he proclaims to be Meshiach/Messiah God to the Jews, and Jesus returned to the apostate church, to start a Millennium on earth.[/QUOTE]
Although what I am about to reveal will be sounding completely obtuse to what you are accustomed to hearing, I ask that you approach it in as much neutrality of mind that you can abide in. For once you do digest it, you will find that there is nothing else to be had that justifies reality, as opposed to "church-ianity's" view in fantasy.
I trust that I have provided enough information to help settle any controversy in your mind.

> Herein lies the problem for all of church-ianity. Just by the simple misunderstanding of the two letter word of "he", it has sent a large number of professing Christians into fantasy land.

In the KJV of Daniel 9:25-27, there two different entities called "he", that seem to be spoken of at the same time. It is that situation that needs to be dealt with firmly.

Color key:
Holy Spirit of God- Blue
Historical- Green
Titus of Rome (the unsaved)- Red
Messiah/Jesus- Purple

Daniel 9[24] Seventy weeks are determined [judged by God] upon thy [Jewish] people and upon thy [Jewish] holy city,
1. to finish the transgression, and
2. to make an end of sins, and
3. to make reconciliation for iniquity, and
4. to bring in everlasting righteousness, and
5. to seal up the vision and prophecy, and 6. to anoint the most Holy.

[25] Know therefore and understand, that from the going forth** of the commandment to restore and to build Jerusalem unto the Messiah the Prince shall be seven weeks, and threescore and two [62] weeks: the street shall be built again, and the wall, even in troublous times.
> **Note: I strongly suggest that one does their due diligence in studying the Biblical and Historical records of "the going forth" of the commandment to rebuild the Temple in 2 Chronicles 36:20-23 (written in 430BC)- focussing on Artaxerxes and Cyrus, the king of Persia.
The Going Forth of Artaxerxes’ Decree Part 1 - Associates for Biblical Research

[26] And after threescore and two weeks [62] shall Messiah be cut off [crucified], but not for himself [for others]:

and the people [army] of the prince [Roman-Titus] that shall come shall destroy the city and the sanctuary; and the end thereof shall be with a flood, and unto the end of the war desolations [destructions] are determined.

[27] And HE shall confirm the [New] covenant with many [disciples] for ONE week [7 years]: and in the midst [middle] of the week [3.5 years] HE shall cause the sacrifice [animal] and the oblation [temple services] to cease, and for the overspreading [the Jew's continuation] of abominations [animal sacrifices] HE shall make it desolate [void of God], even until [upto] the consummation [completion of time], and that determined shall be poured upon*** the desolate [all those who are void of God].
> ***Note: see KJV- Acts 10:45

 

[Earburner]

For the remainder of the midst of the week (3.5 years), Jesus continued confirming the New Covenant to the Early Church, by the power of His Holy Spirit through the Apostles.