Actually have come means now have come. That does not mean some people have been saved all of a sudden. It means His kingdom has now come. The authority of Christ has come to the world now at last.
Proof of Rapture before Tribulation
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Yes I know, but that is not after or when Jesus returns. He destroys all enemies. No one will be taking hostages!
Yes I know. That is something new or surprising or unique? The bible says all that. Why would we need to study what some Jews think?
He is the Lamb and the Lion. They did not know Him or what they were looking for obviously.
Not to wise Jews or saved ones. Only to those who rejected Jesus still. And they are doomed anyhow unless they repent and believe.
No. We look for Jesus and His return in the air. Those left behind will not need to do much looking either, the final leader will be right there soon.
Zec 14:8 And it shall be in that day, that living waters shall go out from Jerusalem; half of them toward the former sea, and half of them toward the hinder sea: in summer and in winter shall it be.
Doug when did living waters begin to flow out of Jerusalem?
The living waters do not flow out of Jerusalem until after Jesus returns. The Dead Sea will be full of fish in that day.
He will deceive the world and speak lies and force worship and his mark of the beast, and put people to death who refuse, and speak great words etc. The world will say who is able to make war with the beast?
Well, if some nation(s) take captives just before Jesus returns they get free real fast
And..? Of course it is still future. Of course the tribulation has so many days....point?
Keraz
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Zech 14:1-2 will happen 3 1`/2 years before Jesus Returns.
It will be when the Anti-Christ sits in the Temple. 2 Thess 2:4
The taking to a place of safety of all the faithful Christians, has to be for the Great Trib, during the second half of the final 7 years.
A partial fulfilment when Jesus Returns, totally after the Millennium. Revelation 21:1-2
My younger brother in Christ (I am 75, you are 64, not dad to me)
You are taking from the New Testament, after the Antichrist has become the beast, the last stage of his evolution. To be the Antichrist, the person must be anointed the King of Israel, thought-to-be messiah.
You did not give the verses in that Tanach (old testament), which the Jews go by, that say the messiah will be a great politician and have military ability.
The Jews go by the Tanach (old testament).
You had wrote....
"Yes I know. That is something new or surprising or unique? The bible says all that. Why would we need to study what some Jews think?"
I had said to you that the Jews believe that the messiah will be a great politician and have military ability. And by being aware of what the Jews believe, it is helpful in identifying the person that will become the Antichrist. You dismissed what I said, saying we already know those things.
So prove it. What verses in the Tanach (old testament), which the Jews go by, says that the messiah will be a great politician and have military ability ?
If you don't want to know what the Jews believe and how that will affect things to come, that is up to you. But don't make statements without backing it up with specific verses in the bible.
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What ? Why would you possibly think that ? It has nothing to do with the time when Antichrist commits the transgression of desolation act in 2Thessalonians2:4.
In verse 4, Jesus stands on the Mt. of Olives and splits it in half. Zechariah 14 is at the end of the 7 years when Jesus returns.
Revelation 12:6 - the 1260 days (first half)
Revelation 12:7-9 - then the war in the second heaven and Satan cast down to earth.
Revelation 12:14 - a time/times/half (second half)
That is the sequence of the text.
The new earth in Revelation 21 has no sea.
Revelation 21:1 And I saw a new heaven and a new earth: for the first heaven and the first earth were passed away; and there was no more sea.
During the millennium rule of Jesus on this present earth is when the Dead sea will have fish.
Living waters started flowing out of Jerusalem when Jesus came.
Jhn 7:38 He that believeth on me, as the scripture hath said, out of his belly shall flow rivers of living water.
Douggg you’re making the same mistake the Jews made, you’re looking for a physical earthly kingdom and Jesus said his kingdom is not a physical earthly kingdom.
The rivers of living water in John 7:38 is referring to the Holy Spirit, that had not yet been given to believers in Jesus at that point. verse 39.
John 7:38 He that believeth on me, as the scripture hath said, out of his belly shall flow rivers of living water.
39 (But this spake he of the Spirit, which they that believe on him should receive: for the Holy Ghost was not yet given; because that Jesus was not yet glorified.)
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The living waters in Zechariah 14 is speaking of clear, clean, water, that will flow from Jerusalem, toward the Mediterranean Sea and toward the Dead Sea.
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No. What I am looking for is the rapture/resurrection. The redemption of the bodies of believers in Christ to take place.
You are suggesting that the final leader will first be king of Israel That seems a stretch. Israel is not exactly popular in the world and stands alone. But I don't doubt that Israel may be desperate enough for protection that they will look to some powerful leader who cons them into thinking he is their new best friend
Since they reject the real king and will not look to Him for protection, naturally they will turn to the devil (man)
Not sure that matters nuch, since they don't really. The old testament pointed clearly to Jesus. I guess you mean they pretend (some of them) to go by it.
There is zero need to identify the antichrist punk to come. The people after the rapture will have to worry about that, and I doubt it will by some big secret for long. Satan's time is short.
Not the messiah, the antichrist. As for the messiah, He will take over the world soon (after the tribulation) That is the greatest takeover by far in history. But we were not to look for His return to earth as king, we were to look for His dying and rising again, being born of a virgin etc etc. If they ignored that and rejected God when He did come, then who cares what they claim to be 'looking for' now? We know most of Israel will be killed. Whatever most of them think loses significance. What matters is the remnant in the end who actually believe in Jesus finally. By the way (stated age on an internet site aside) old men are not always wise:)
The person who becomes the beast-king of Revelation 13 for the last 42 months of the 7 year 70th week evolves through four previous stages.
1. beginning as the little horn person - leader over 10 EU leaders.
2. then as the prince that shall come into the middle east following the Gog/Magog event.
3. then anointed the King of Israel thought-to-be messiah - becoming the Antichrist.
4. then revealed as the man of sin - and not the messiah after all.
5. then becomes the beast-king - dictator over the EU, for the last 42 months of the 7 year 70th week.
Keraz
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It is obvious that the AC has to conquer the people in Jerusalem before he sits in the Temple. Daniel 7:25, Revelation 13:7
Zech 14 is a sequence of events. - Verse 3 to 21 is about the glorious Return and then the Millennium.
There is a gap of 1260 days between when the holy people are conquered and the Return. Proved in several places, like Rev 12:14 , where those faithful Christians who refused to violate the Covenant, Daniel 11:32, will be kept in a safe place for that time.
Revelation 12:6 and 14 are about the same time period. Making those two verses mean different times, is confuzion and error.
Which we are plainly told will happen AFTER the Millennium. Rev 20;11-15
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