Proof of Rapture before Tribulation

[IndianaRob]

Why would you even assume that i do not see and know and am KNOWN by???

Are you OK today?

Don’t you claim the five foolish virgins aren’t believers?

 

[David in NJ]

Don’t you claim the five foolish virgins aren’t believers?

No, i NEVER made that claim

JESUS made that statement of FACT when HE said to them: "I DO NOT KNOW you!"

Do you not UNDERSTAND that the word/term "to be known" when in the context of marriage means "the two become one"?

 

[IndianaRob]

No, i NEVER mad that claim

JESUS made that statement of FACT when HE said to them: "I DO NOT KNOW you!"

Do you not UNDERSTAND that the word/term "to be known" when in the context of marriage means "the two become one"?

No please explain it to me.

 

[David in NJ]

No please explain it to me.

Better yet, let JESUS explain it to you:

The Pharisees also came to Him, testing Him, and saying to Him, “Is it lawful for a man to divorce his wife for just any reason?”

And He answered and said to them, “Have you not read that He who made them at the beginning ‘made them male and female,’ and said, ‘For this reason a man shall leave his father and mother and be joined to his wife, and the two shall become one flesh’?
So then, they are no longer two but one flesh. Therefore what God has joined together, let not man separate.”

 

[dad]

Their car ran out of gas.
You; "of course it did, try starting a car with no gas, that means it never had any gas"

The parable states EMPHATICALLY, that the foolish had oil, but it ran out.
I understand your need for the foolish to be unbelievers.
Your need for them to never have had the Holy Spirit.
But changing the parable to suit your doctrine, tells us you are way off.
If you torture your Bible, you can make it say most anything.

Cars cannot run without gas (or power) Lamps have wicks and can burn a short while. Show us where in the passage that it states they had oil? You made claims support them

 

[dad]

Their car ran out of gas.
You; "of course it did, try starting a car with no gas, that means it never had any gas"

Bic lighters and trees and shoes and fireplaces and matches are not lamps. Cars are not lamps. You seem intent on wanting the lamps of the women who missed the Rapture to have had oil. Proof?

 

[rebuilder 454]

Bic lighters and trees and shoes and fireplaces and matches are not lamps. Cars are not lamps. You seem intent on wanting the lamps of the women who missed the Rapture to have had oil. Proof?

Ahh
Crazy me.
Whooda thought you could not see it was an analogy????
I musta thought they drove cars or something back then.

But hey thanks for the tip anyway.
( we will take all those "corrections" under advisement)

SMH

 

[rebuilder 454]

No, i NEVER made that claim

JESUS made that statement of FACT when HE said to them: "I DO NOT KNOW you!"

Do you not UNDERSTAND that the word/term "to be known" when in the context of marriage means "the two become one"?

And when THE BIBLE used that term, pointing to Marys PURITY, do you see that one also as Mary had no male friends?
Luke 1:34
Then said Mary unto the angel, How shall this be, seeing I know not a man?

 

[David in NJ]

And when THE BIBLE used that term, pointing to Marys PURITY, do you see that one also as Mary had no male friends?
Luke 1:34
Then said Mary unto the angel, How shall this be, seeing I know not a man?

Mary was sinner in need of a SAVIOR: Luke 1:47
And Mary said:
“My soul magnifies the Lord,
And my spirit has rejoiced in God my Savior.

Mary's 'purity' is only limited to her flesh in that she was a virgin, just as you stated = "Mary had no male friends"
Luke 1:27 - "The virgin’s name was Mary"

Mary had recieved Grace/Favor from the LORD: Luke 1:28
And having come in, the angel said to her, “Rejoice, highly favored one, the Lord is with you; blessed are you among women!”

 

[dad]

Ahh
Crazy me.
Whooda thought you could not see it was an analogy????
I musta thought they drove cars or something back then.

An analogy needs to work. The issue is whether the gals were saved or not. If 5 were not, then they had no oil. (if the oil represents the spirit) So that could explain why when they were found foolishly unprepared (having a little oil might not qualify as foolish) that they needed to run off trying to get some oil.

If you want to claim they all had oil, show us the proof from the bible.

 

[ewq1938]

Bic lighters and trees and shoes and fireplaces and matches are not lamps. Cars are not lamps. You seem intent on wanting the lamps of the women who missed the Rapture to have had oil. Proof?

The lamps had some oil because they were on when they went to bed but went out before they were awoken:

Mat 25:8 And the foolish said unto the wise, Give us of your oil; for our lamps are gone out.

 

[dad]

The lamps had some oil because they were on when they went to bed but went out before they were awoken:

Mat 25:8 And the foolish said unto the wise, Give us of your oil; for our lamps are gone out.

Matthew 25:3
They that were foolish took their lamps, and took no oil with them:


Matthew 25:4
But the wise took oil in their vessels with their lamps.

So the foolish took how much oil? A little? No. NO oil! Ha Case closed.

Now if some camper was not a fool we might tell them that a lamp will not burn long without oil!

 

[rwb]

The lamps had some oil because they were on when they went to bed but went out before they were awoken:

Mat 25:8 And the foolish said unto the wise, Give us of your oil; for our lamps are gone out.

Yea, it seems the foolish believed they could be saved by association, as those in the judgment believing their good deeds would be enough to save them. These fools seemed to believe they too could have eternal life just by being among Christians.

 

[David in NJ]

The lamps had some oil because they were on when they went to bed but went out before they were awoken:

Mat 25:8 And the foolish said unto the wise, Give us of your oil; for our lamps are gone out.

This brings UP very good question(s):

#1 - Did they really have oil in themselves or was it religion that masquerades as oil, thus giving off some light?

#2 - If we take verbatim the words of the foolish, what does this entail since the LORD, who is the Bridegroom, says: "I DO NOT KNOW you!"

 

[rebuilder 454]

An analogy needs to work. The issue is whether the gals were saved or not. If 5 were not, then they had no oil. (if the oil represents the spirit) So that could explain why when they were found foolishly unprepared (having a little oil might not qualify as foolish) that they needed to run off trying to get some oil.

If you want to claim they all had oil, show us the proof from the bible.

What good would it do?
Since you were shown in the word of God and my analogy.
" ...OUR LAMPS HAVE GONE OUT..."
Your reply to that is they never had any oil.
It's like you are completely oblivious that if they had been lit at one time, that means that they had oil at one time, but the FUEL/ OIL IS NO LONGER there!!
the oil that they had at one time was no longer there.

Now in the analogy I showed you where the car ran out of gas and they tell you "hey we ran out of gas"
your reply to them is;
" it's obvious you never had any gas to begin with. "
I have no idea what could be said ,that's just plain old facts out of the Bible, that you are so desperate to have it changed ?????
that's all that's going on here
you cannot accept the written word of God

you need that to have a change in it
it's your Doctrine ,that is starting place,that is completely screwed up.

your Doctrine is doing that to you and it's making a fool out of you.

Wow
SMH

 

[David in NJ]

Yea, it seems the foolish believed they could be saved by association, as those in the judgment believing their good deeds would be enough to save them. These fools seemed to believe they too could have eternal life just by being among Christians.

100% TRUE and this is VERIFIED in 1 John 2:18-19

Now OPEN UP them Spiritual EYES @ewq1938 and @rwb

Watch how the HOLY SPIRIT directly ties in Matt 23:1-13 to 1 John 2:18-19 with verse 20

verse 20 - "But you have an anointing from the Holy One, = "five wise"

 

[dad]

What good would it do?
Since you were shown in the word of God and my analogy.
" ...OUR LAMPS HAVE GONE OUT..."
Your reply to that is they never had any oil.

The verse said the foolish ones did not bring any oil. Why would we assume the word of God is wrong?

It's like you are completely oblivious that if they had been lit at one time, that means that they had oil at one time, but the FUEL/ OIL IS NO LONGER there!!

If there was oil maybe they would stay lit long enough to get Raptured! Too bad they were foolish and had no oil. At least the bible does not say they had any. It does say they did not bring any. I guess the bottom line is that some people miss the resurrection at that time. Now you apprently do not want to accept that anyone missing it would not be saved. Instead, you think what exactly? Why are some believers left behind? Jesus never even left on sheep in the hundred behind!

the oil that they had at one time was no longer there.

Except you made that up. Why? Because they lit their wicks and it went out quickly. If there was a little oil in there maybe it would go an hour or two. They brought no oil. We know that. You are saying they did bring oil inside the lamp.

Now in the analogy I showed you where the car ran out of gas and they tell you "hey we ran out of gas"
your reply to them is;
" it's obvious you never had any gas to begin with. "

No, because a car will not run by burning a seat of a visor, or something. A lamp can burn the wick with no oil. No comparison.

I have no idea what could be said ,that's just plain old facts out of the Bible, that you are so desperate to have it changed ?????
that's all that's going on here
you cannot accept the written word of God

You are the one claiming they did have oil when the bile out and states that they brought NO oil. I am changing nothing, you are totally hammering the text to fit your pet theories.

you need that to have a change in it
it's your Doctrine ,that is starting place,that is completely screwed up.

I have no doctrine on the foolish people who will not be resurrected. You have a doctrine that says they actually were believers and saved and still left behind. Face the truth.

 

[ewq1938]

Matthew 25:3
They that were foolish took their lamps, and took no oil with them:


Matthew 25:4
But the wise took oil in their vessels with their lamps.

So the foolish took how much oil? A little? No. NO oil! Ha Case closed.

Now if some camper was not a fool we might tell them that a lamp will not burn long without oil!

Then how did the lamps go out in the middle of the night? This is like taking a lawnmower but no gas can. The mower has some gas but no specific container for gas was taken. Same with the lamps. Each lamp has some oil, and you would have a separate container just for oil.

 

[rebuilder 454]

The verse said the foolish ones did not bring any oil. Why would we assume the word of God is wrong?

If there was oil maybe they would stay lit long enough to get Raptured! Too bad they were foolish and had no oil. At least the bible does not say they had any. It does say they did not bring any. I guess the bottom line is that some people miss the resurrection at that time. Now you apprently do not want to accept that anyone missing it would not be saved. Instead, you think what exactly? Why are some believers left behind? Jesus never even left on sheep in the hundred behind!

Except you made that up. Why? Because they lit their wicks and it went out quickly. If there was a little oil in there maybe it would go an hour or two. They brought no oil. We know that. You are saying they did bring oil inside the lamp.

No, because a car will not run by burning a seat of a visor, or something. A lamp can burn the wick with no oil. No comparison.

You are the one claiming they did have oil when the bile out and states that they brought NO oil. I am changing nothing, you are totally hammering the text to fit your pet theories.

I have no doctrine on the foolish people who will not be resurrected. You have a doctrine that says they actually were believers and saved and still left behind. Face the truth.

Both Jesus and Paul spoke of the 2 types of BELIEVERS.
You insist Both Paul and Jesus are wrong.
I would say face the truth, but you are ignorant of the bible, so it would do no good.
Nowhere does it say the foolish had no oil.
Nowhere.
You literally made that up. But you don't stop there. You go ahead and try to pretend something ran out ( duh...they HAD LAMPS LIT...AND EVEN EMPHATICALLY STATED IT)
Never say anything "ran out"
It is way too deep for you and Dave.
Just rework the Bible

Men such as yourself prove it can be done.
Very Ignorant strategy you have.

You are a believer and have no knowledge or concept of Paul and Jesus teaching of the 2 types of believers??????
That seems impossible any believer could be that ignorant.
Please fire all your teachers and convince Dave to do the same.

Oh wait, no don't do that.
It would be a waste of time also.
You have shown us your ignorance is invincible.

 

[dad]

Then how did the lamps go out in the middle of the night? This is like taking a lawnmower but no gas can. The mower has some gas but no specific container for gas was taken. Same with the lamps. Each lamp has some oil, and you would have a separate container just for oil.

You can light a dry wick any time of the day or night and the result is the same. The women woke from sleep in the night when they heard the cry go out. It was showtime. They knew it was finally time. The wise women (saved) had oil of the spirit in them already. They took that with them wherever they went. The foolish women had no oil at all. They had lamps that looked somewhat similar to the wise women. Yet it was just a show. They actually had no spirit of God in them, they were not saved. So what they took obviously was not sufficient to enter the feast (Rapture in this case since we are applying this to the Rapture here). There is no works or self righteousness of our own or anything we can bring except Jesus and the price He paid to redeem us. You are saying they carried some 'extra container'. Obviously that is made up entirely.
If we want to apply this parable to the return in the air of Jesus (Rapture) where believers are gathered up, then I do not see how we can say the ones left behind were saved? What some here have been trying to say is that some were sort of more saved than others, because they had a stack of accumulated good works that made them eligible to be resurrected.