Behold
Well-Known Member
Exactly TRUE.
Notice that God wants ALL to be saved, and proved it by offering Jesus to everyone.
Calvinism, denies this, because Calvinism is a Cross Denying Lie.
Once Saved, Always Saved?
- Thread starter RR144
- Start date
-
Welcome to Christian Forums, a Christian Forum that recognizes that all Christians are a work in progress.
You will need to register to be able to join in fellowship with Christians all over the world.
We hope to see you as a part of our community soon and God Bless!
Exactly TRUE.
Notice that God wants ALL to be saved, and proved it by offering Jesus to everyone.
Calvinism, denies this, because Calvinism is a Cross Denying Lie.
I'm not a Calvinist, but I'll say this. Not everybody who says to God lord lord will make it to heaven. Unless you repent you will likewise perish. These are God's words in scripture. An easy believer will reject these and other warnings from God. They don't understand the war against the flesh. Those who only pick and choose the parts about the bible that appeal to them are the ones with the itching ears.
You won't hearken to the warnings from God and other teachings from the bible that you ignore because you're an easy believer. Everyone who has told you you are wrong about stuff have pointed things out to you, even those who tried to help you, but you don't listen. It's not easy to take correction and be corrected. But that's what's you'll have to do.
Behold
Well-Known Member
Here is how you "make it to heaven" and you can take it from Him. John 14:6
Jesus said.,. "you must be born again"......
And the reason He says...>>"again"..... is because you are are already "born of water" once... (Just ask your mother).
And now, this places the person "iN Adam"., 1 Corin 15:22 is the PROBLEM.
So, to get out of "ADAM" and eternally into this.....>>."IN CHRIST">. you must be BORN.....AGAIN.... Spiritually.
If not, you will die as this one..... John 3:36, and Heaven is not for you.
And this too.
And only the elect of God whom HE chose, have faith
Now to him who works, the wages are not counted [c]as grace but as debt.
And we are saved by grace through faith not of ourselves being the gift of God.
Greeting
1 Paul, a bondservant of God and an apostle of Jesus Christ, according to the faith of God’s elect and the acknowledgment of the truth which accords with godliness, 2 in hope of eternal life which God, who cannot lie, promised before time began, 3 but has in due time manifested His word through preaching, which was committed to me according to the commandment of God our Savior;Romans 4
1 What then shall we say that Abraham our father[a] has found according to the flesh? 2 For if Abraham was justified by works, he has something to boast about, but not before God. 3 For what does the Scripture say? “Abraham believed God, and it was [b]accounted to him for righteousness.” 4 Now to him who works, the wages are not counted [c]as grace but as debt.
David Celebrates the Same Truth
5 But to him who does not work but believes on Him who justifies the ungodly, his faith is accounted for righteousness, 6 just as David also describes the blessedness of the man to whom God imputes righteousness apart from works:7 “Blessed are those whose lawless deeds are forgiven,
And whose sins are covered;
8 Blessed is the man to whom the Lord shall not impute sin.”
Abraham Justified Before Circumcision
9 Does this blessedness then come upon the circumcised only, or upon the uncircumcised also? For we say that faith was accounted to Abraham for righteousness. 10 How then was it accounted? While he was circumcised, or uncircumcised? Not while circumcised, but while uncircumcised. 11 And he received the sign of circumcision, a seal of the righteousness of the faith which he had while still uncircumcised, that he might be the father of all those who believe, though they are uncircumcised, that righteousness might be imputed to them also, 12 and the father of circumcision to those who not only are of the circumcision, but who also walk in the steps of the faith which our father Abraham had while still uncircumcised.The Promise Granted Through Faith
13 For the promise that he would be the heir of the world was not to Abraham or to his seed through the law, but through the righteousness of faith. 14 For if those who are of the law are heirs, faith is made void and the promise made of no effect, 15 because the law brings about wrath; for where there is no law there is no transgression.16 Therefore it is of faith that it might be according to grace, so that the promise might be [d]sure to all the seed, not only to those who are of the law, but also to those who are of the faith of Abraham, who is the father of us all 17 (as it is written, “I have made you a father of many nations”) in the presence of Him whom he believed—God, who gives life to the dead and calls those things which do not exist as though they did; 18 who, contrary to hope, in hope believed, so that he became the father of many nations, according to what was spoken, “So shall your descendants be.” 19 And not being weak in faith, he did not consider his own body, already dead (since he was about a hundred years old), and the deadness of Sarah’s womb. 20 He did not waver at the promise of God through unbelief, but was strengthened in faith, giving glory to God, 21 and being fully convinced that what He had promised He was also able to perform. 22 And therefore “it was accounted to him for righteousness.”
23 Now it was not written for his sake alone that it was imputed to him, 24 but also for us. It shall be imputed to us who believe in Him who raised up Jesus our Lord from the dead, 25 who was delivered up because of our offenses, and was raised because of our justification.
Taken
Well-Known Member
Once Saved, Always Saved?
Yes.
Because…(inanutshell)….
ONLY those with a DEAD BODY become MADE Saved.
Anyone ???
Scriptural Teaching to the contrary?
Glory to God,
Taken
Yes.
Because…(inanutshell)….
ONLY those with a DEAD BODY become MADE Saved.
Anyone ???
Scriptural Teaching to the contrary?
Glory to God,
Taken
Hello @Taken,
People can, and will walk away from Yahavah. It's founded in scripture. Once saved always saved, is not a biblical tenant whatsoever. You have to cut a lot of the bible up to make it so. But if people want to just argue and debate this doctrine, it's just the same as children fighting over toys in the sandbox. Pointless.
People can, and will walk away from Yahavah. It's founded in scripture. Once saved always saved, is not a biblical tenant whatsoever. You have to cut a lot of the bible up to make it so. But if people want to just argue and debate this doctrine, it's just the same as children fighting over toys in the sandbox. Pointless.
Assurance and a guarantee from God about your eternal salvation, because of Christ's shed blood and intercession, see Christ prays for the people of God to cleanse your conscience (just as He chose us in Him before the foundation of the world, that we should be holy and without blame before Him in love, having predestined us to adoption as sons by Jesus Christ to Himself, according to the good pleasure of His will, to the praise of the glory of His grace, by which He [a]made us accepted in the Beloved. ), to serve the living God.
Hebrews 9
14 how much more shall the blood of Christ, who through the eternal Spirit offered Himself without [a]spot to God, cleanse your conscience from dead works to serve the living God?
15 And for this reason He is the Mediator of the new covenant, by means of death, for the redemption of the transgressions under the first covenant, that those who are called may receive the promise of the eternal inheritance.
Hebrews 9
14 how much more shall the blood of Christ, who through the eternal Spirit offered Himself without [a]spot to God, cleanse your conscience from dead works to serve the living God?
15 And for this reason He is the Mediator of the new covenant, by means of death, for the redemption of the transgressions under the first covenant, that those who are called may receive the promise of the eternal inheritance.
Rudometkin
Active Member
If your corruption can invalidate your salvation, then you were never saved from your corruption to begin with.
Correct @Taken
John 19:30
"It is finished!" (τετέλεσται, tetelestai)
Grammatical Analysis:
Perfect passive indicative, third person singular of τελέω ("to finish, accomplish, complete").
This declaration by Jesus on the cross signifies that the work of redemption is fully accomplished, with lasting effects.
Implication for OSAS:
The completeness of Christ's atoning work supports the idea that salvation is not dependent on continued human effort but on the finished work of Christ.
2. Ephesians 2:8
"For by grace you have been saved through faith." (σεσῳσμένοι ἐστε, sesōsmenoi este)
Grammatical Analysis:
Perfect passive participle (σεσῳσμένοι) of σῴζω ("to save"), combined with the present indicative verb ἐστε ("you are").
This construction emphasizes the permanence of salvation-it was accomplished in the past with ongoing results.
Implication for OSAS:
The perfect tense highlights that salvation is a completed act of grace, not something that needs to be repeatedly achieved or maintained.
3. Romans 5:1
"Having been justified by faith, we have peace with God." (δεδικαιωμένοι, dedikaiōmenoi)
Grammatical Analysis:
Perfect passive participle of δικαιόω ("to justify"), indicating that justification was completed and remains effective.
Implication for OSAS:
The perfect tense emphasizes that justification is a one-time act with permanent consequences, reflecting the believer's secure standing before God.
4. Romans 8:1
"There is therefore now no condemnation to those who are in Christ Jesus." (κατάκριμα οὐκ ἔστιν)
Related Perfect Tense Reference:
Though not in the perfect tense itself, Romans 8:1 follows the declaration of believers being foreknown, predestined, called, justified, and glorified (Romans 8:29-30). Glorified (ἐδόξασεν, edoxasen) is in the aorist tense but reflects the certainty of the believer’s future glory as if it were already accomplished.
Implication for OSAS:
The cumulative argument in Romans 8 builds on the permanence of justification (Romans 5:1) and the completed work of salvation.
5. Hebrews 10:14
"For by one offering He has perfected forever those who are being sanctified." (τετελείωκεν, teteleiōken)
Grammatical Analysis:
Perfect active indicative of τελειόω ("to make perfect, complete").
The perfect tense conveys that Christ’s sacrifice has fully and permanently perfected believers.
Implication for OSAS:
The use of τετελείωκεν emphasizes the unrepeatable, eternal efficacy of Christ’s atonement for believers.
6. 1 John 5:18
"We know that whoever is born of God does not sin." (γεγεννημένος, gegennēmenos)
Grammatical Analysis:
Perfect passive participle of γεννάω ("to beget, to give birth").
This indicates that being "born of God" is a completed past action with enduring results.
Implication for OSAS:
Being born of God is portrayed as a definitive and permanent transformation, reinforcing the security of the believer’s relationship with God.
7. Colossians 1:13
"He has delivered us from the power of darkness and conveyed us into the kingdom of the Son of His love." (ἐρρύσατο, errhysato; μετεστησεν, metestēsen)
Grammatical Analysis:
While not in the perfect tense, these verbs are aorists emphasizing completed actions. However, they have enduring implications for the believer's status, aligning with other perfect tense assurances.
Connection to OSAS:
Though not perfect tense, this verse pairs well with perfect tense passages to depict salvation as a finished, secure work.
The use of the perfect tense in salvation-related scriptures emphasizes the permanence and completeness of God's saving work.
Passages such as John 19:30, Ephesians 2:8, and Hebrews 10:14 reflect the unchanging nature of Christ’s accomplishments, which form the theological basis for the belief in eternal security.
These verses illustrate that salvation, justification, and sanctification are actions completed in the past with ongoing results, reinforcing the doctrine of "Once Saved, Always Saved."
J.
Hello to whom it may concern,
People can and will walk away from God. Quoting the passage “they walked out cause they were not of us.” Doesn’t mean anything; in the case of a person who once was in a relationship and then abandoned it… they can always come back… but once saved always saved doesn’t exist unless you slaughter the Bible with slits and cuts to the context of what’s in it.
There is no definitive verse which says “and once you were saved you are always saved!” Even Jesus said “depart from me I never knew you!” So even faithful people aren’t sometimes in proper relationship with God.
Being faith to Yahavah is a choice one must make daily, from what I understand. Now this doesn’t mean people don’t have doubts and what not; it’s the walking away from Yahavah, which is the stand made.
People can and will walk away from God. Quoting the passage “they walked out cause they were not of us.” Doesn’t mean anything; in the case of a person who once was in a relationship and then abandoned it… they can always come back… but once saved always saved doesn’t exist unless you slaughter the Bible with slits and cuts to the context of what’s in it.
There is no definitive verse which says “and once you were saved you are always saved!” Even Jesus said “depart from me I never knew you!” So even faithful people aren’t sometimes in proper relationship with God.
Being faith to Yahavah is a choice one must make daily, from what I understand. Now this doesn’t mean people don’t have doubts and what not; it’s the walking away from Yahavah, which is the stand made.
Last edited:
Ritajanice
Born-Again
1 Corinthians 2
King James Version
2 And I, brethren, when I came to you, came not with excellency of speech or of wisdom, declaring unto you the testimony of God.2 For I determined not to know any thing among you, save Jesus Christ, and him crucified.
3 And I was with you in weakness, and in fear, and in much trembling.
4 And my speech and my preaching was not with enticing words of man's wisdom, but in demonstration of the Spirit and of power:
5 That your faith should not stand in the wisdom of men, but in the power of God.
6 Howbeit we speak wisdom among them that are perfect: yet not the wisdom of this world, nor of the princes of this world, that come to nought:
7 But we speak the wisdom of God in a mystery, even the hidden wisdom, which God ordained before the world unto our glory:
8 Which none of the princes of this world knew: for had they known it, they would not have crucified the Lord of glory.
9 But as it is written, Eye hath not seen, nor ear heard, neither have entered into the heart of man, the things which God hath prepared for them that love him.
10 But God hath revealed them unto us by his Spirit: for the Spirit searcheth all things, yea, the deep things of God.
11 For what man knoweth the things of a man, save the spirit of man which is in him? even so the things of God knoweth no man, but the Spirit of God.
12 Now we have received, not the spirit of the world, but the spirit which is of God; that we might know the things that are freely given to us of God.
13 Which things also we speak, not in the words which man's wisdom teacheth, but which the Holy Ghost teacheth; comparing spiritual things with spiritual.
14 But the natural man receiveth not the things of the Spirit of God: for they are foolishness unto him: neither can he know them, because they are spiritually discerned.
15 But he that is spiritual judgeth all things, yet he himself is judged of no man.
16 For who hath known the mind of the Lord, that he may instruct him? but we have the mind of Christ.
The Perfect Tense is against you-
Is born (ESV, HCSB = "has been born") - Once a baby is born it cannot be "unborn!" (i.e., assuming it is a real baby and not a manufactured baby made to look like the real thing). Once you are born, you are born! So just as in physical birth, so too in spiritual birth a new born believer cannot be unborn and will cease believing!
Stated another way, he or she cannot lose their salvation (new birth)! And just as a physical baby is born into a family, so too believers are born into a family, the family of God (Jn 1:12-13). And as a newborn baby has characteristic features of its parents, spiritually new born babes have characteristics of their heavenly Father (cp 2Pe 1:4). In context he or she is born with a desire to love the Father and love the children in His family.
As Paul writes in Romans "all who are being led by the Spirit of God, these are sons of God. For you have not received a spirit of slavery leading to fear again, but you have received a spirit of adoption as sons by which we cry out, “Abba! Father!”" (Ro 8:14-15)
Born of God - Notice the NET version's boldly anthropomorphical rendering "fathered by God" which carries on John's image in the Gospel - "But as many as received Him, to them He gave the right to become children of God, [even] to those who believe in His name, who were born not of blood, nor of the will of the flesh, nor of the will of man, but of God." (John 1:12-13)
As Kistemaker says "In essence, faith and love are inseparable. In God’s family, faith in God and love for him and his children are totally integrated."
Wuest adds that the perfect tense signifies that "The relationship between God and the believer as Father and child is a permanent one." (Eerdmans Publishing - used by permission)
PERFECT TENSE. This speaks of a completed action with abiding results. In some ways it was a combination of the AORIST and PRESENT TENSES. Usually the focus is on the abiding results or the completion of an act (example: Eph. 2:5 & 8, "you have been and continue to be saved").
See how many Perfect Tenses you can find re salvation @MatthewG.
J.
Hello @Johann,
Playing Bible bash isn’t a game. You might as well not believe the whole Bible. If you’re going to discard it like criminals who look at the bodies of the deceased. Let’s get rid of this, or let’s get rid of that. That’s on the person who chooses to do such things.
You may argue all you like; the truth remains as people walk away from Yahavah, they can come back. Some choose not to. I’ve talked to an atheist; I tell him I love him even so.
Playing Bible bash isn’t a game. You might as well not believe the whole Bible. If you’re going to discard it like criminals who look at the bodies of the deceased. Let’s get rid of this, or let’s get rid of that. That’s on the person who chooses to do such things.
You may argue all you like; the truth remains as people walk away from Yahavah, they can come back. Some choose not to. I’ve talked to an atheist; I tell him I love him even so.
Last edited:
"Make every effort to present yourself approved to God, a worker having no need to be ashamed, guiding the word of truth correctly."
Analysis Using Lexham Bible
"Make every effort" (σπούδασον, spoudason): This translation emphasizes diligence and effort, aligning with the idea of being intentional and focused in the study and teaching of God’s Word.
"Guiding the word of truth correctly" (ὀρθοτομοῦντα τὸν λόγον τῆς ἀληθείας): The LEB renders ὀρθοτομέω as "guiding correctly," capturing the nuance of handling scripture with precision and integrity. This term emphasizes the responsibility to interpret scripture faithfully, avoiding misrepresentation or careless teaching.
"Be diligent to present yourself" This is an AORIST ACTIVE IMPERATIVE with an AORIST ACTIVE INFINITIVE. This is a call for a decisive act of the will (cf. Rom. 6:13; Eph. 4:3).
"approved"This is a metallurgical term which became an idiom for "a test with a view toward approval," which was a way of confirming something as genuine (cf. 1 Cor. 11:19; 2 Cor. 10:18).
SPECIAL TOPIC: GREEK TERMS FOR TESTING AND THEIR CONNOTATIONS
"to God" God is the one who must approve our teaching, preaching, and our lifestyle.
"as a workman who does not need to be ashamed"
Spiritless Bible teaching and un-Christlike daily living will cause believers shame when they stand before their Lord (cf. 2 Cor. 5:10). Paul was concerned about being ashamed before the Lord, but not before humans (cf. 2 Tim. 1:8,12,16).
"accurately handling" This is a PRESENT ACTIVE PARTICIPLE meaning "to cut straight." It is found only here in the NT. This was often used of constructing a road, plowing a furrow, or a stone mason building a structure (cf. Prov. 3:6; 11:5 in the Septuagint).
This term is used metaphorically to cut a straight line. The Word of God is a straight (righteous) path to truth. The word "straight" is an OT construction term taken from the word for a "river reed" which was used to confirm the horizontal straightness of walls, streets, etc. YHWH used this term to describe His own character. It is translated "just" or "right" (and all the related forms). God is the ruler or standard by which all else is evaluated. Apostolic truth reflects God's character; Apostolic living reflects God's character. The false teachers fail at both!
Sorry you feel that way. The Perfect Tense still stands.
J.
Put me on ignore, you'll do me a favor-process of elimination.
3:12
NASB, NRSV, NJB "Take care"
NKJV "Beware"
NJB, TEV "be careful"
Peshitta "take heed"
This is a PRESENT ACTIVE IMPERATIVE; continue to be watchful! It not only is the beginning of the life of faith that is crucial, but also the finish (cf. chapter 11)!!!
SPECIAL TOPIC: PERSEVERANCE
NASB, NKJV, Peshitta "brethren"
NRSV "brothers and sisters"
NJB "brothers"
TEV "my friends"
See note at Heb. 3:1. This designation seems to refer to believing Jews, although it could denote ethnic paternity.
"an unbelieving heart" This describes a believer who deserts the living God. A believing heart is one that continues firm to the end (cf. Heb. 3:14 and chapter 11). The phrase "unbelieving heart" reflects a Hebrew idiom "heart of unbelief" (cf. Heb. 3:12), as does "fall away," which reflects the Hebrew shuv ("return" or "turn").
"that falls away from the living God" This is an AORIST ACTIVE INFINITIVE. This VERB is the source of our English word "apostasy." This is addressing a developing faithlessness (it is the opposite of Heb. 3:14). To whom does this passage relate:
believing Jews
unbelieving Jews?
The use of "brothers" in Heb. 3:1 and the added phrase "partakers of a heavenly calling" and "brothers" in Heb. 3:12 strongly suggest that it refers to believers or covenant people (i.e., a synagogue).
What then is the warning relating to: (1) salvation or (2) faithfulness? In context it seems to refer to faithfulness; Jesus was faithful, they must be faithful. The book of Hebrews views the Christian life from the end (cf. Heb. 3:14; 11), not the beginning (like Paul).
The "falling away" of Heb. 3:13 must relate to continual faith and faithfulness. The Israelites had faith, but not functioning, obedient faith. They rejected God's promise of the land flowing with milk and honey by accepting the spies' report (cf. Numbers 13-14), not their belief in God. In this context "falling away" does not mean "falling from faith," but "falling from faithfulness" (i.e., OT sense of the term)! However, both are required for a healthy faith. See note at Heb. 3:16-18.
God always comes to us in a covenant relationship. We must respond in faith and faithfulness. The Sovereign God has allowed us to participate in our initial decision and on-going discipleship. The author of Hebrews is difficult to follow because
he uses rabbinical logic and hermeneutics
he is addressing two groups
believing Jews
unbelieving Jews
he views Christian assurance and victory from the criteria of faithfulness as well as faith
he focuses on faithfulness to the end (cf. Heb. 4:14; chapter 11). He views the Christian life from its conclusion, not its beginning
The phrase "the living God" is a play on God's covenant name YHWH, which is from the Hebrew VERB "to be" (cf. Exod.3:14). These readers were not rejecting YHWH, but the irony is that rejecting the gospel of Jesus Christ is, in fact, a rejection of YHWH (cf. 1 John 5:9-12).
Just to put it in context for you-now go ahead, put me on ignore.
J.
Last edited by a moderator:
Hello to whom it may concern,
Until we become united in maturity, there will always be division. If a person wants to believe once saved always saved; by all means. It doesn’t mean it is true; but I’ll love those people none the less. I don’t believe it’s true, because even Jesus talks about people feigning or pretending to be followers of him. Some people believe God is a hateful God so they within themselves can be hateful. The truth is out there and it’s the Holy Spirit/spirit of Christ which is over the Bible. It produces fruits of love.
Until we become united in maturity, there will always be division. If a person wants to believe once saved always saved; by all means. It doesn’t mean it is true; but I’ll love those people none the less. I don’t believe it’s true, because even Jesus talks about people feigning or pretending to be followers of him. Some people believe God is a hateful God so they within themselves can be hateful. The truth is out there and it’s the Holy Spirit/spirit of Christ which is over the Bible. It produces fruits of love.
Taken
Well-Known Member
@Johann ~
Excellent post!
Thank you for your effort revealing Gods Word regarding what God restores, God perfects, God quickens, God makes anew…. can NOT be undone;
* By powerful evil spirits, By powerful wicked men, By philosophies and words of ignorant men.
* Because…Greater is He that is “IN” you than he that is “IN” the world.
God Bless you.
Glory to God,
Taken
Excellent post!
Thank you for your effort revealing Gods Word regarding what God restores, God perfects, God quickens, God makes anew…. can NOT be undone;
* By powerful evil spirits, By powerful wicked men, By philosophies and words of ignorant men.
* Because…Greater is He that is “IN” you than he that is “IN” the world.
God Bless you.
Glory to God,
Taken
Similar threads
