Lucifer AKA Satan

[Rella ~ I am a woman]

@3 Resurrections

Sorry to interject another thread into the debate but this is subject specific and came to mind upon reading something in the Holy book right now.

First... you had posted the following reply #1 to my question... at 3Rs~ A quick question about the binding of Satan.

I have made some text blue for emphasis.

SATAN'S BIOGRAPHY


4004 BC - The seven-day creation week begins the history of the created (or renovated) planet, with the man and the woman given dominion over it conjointly (Genesis 1:28).

3968 / 3967 BC - The Fall of mankind in Adam abdicated that dominion, instigated by Satan's temptation, which granted Satan the title "Prince of This World". Death entered the world, since Satan was called "a murderer from the beginning"(John 8:44). This began the total of THREE millennial ages where Satan was allowed free access to roam the world and deceive the nations at his leisure; when God "who in times past suffered all nations to walk in their own ways" (Acts 14:16). This was what Paul termed "the times of this ignorance" which God "winked at" (Acts 17:30), when idol worship and sacrifice to devils was going on.

968 / 967 BC - SATAN WAS BOUND by God at this beginning of the 4th millennium of fallen mankind's history (the Revelation 20 millennium). This was done at the time when Solomon's temple foundation stone was laid down at the beginning of this millennium composed of a stationary, physical temple worship system ordained by God, according to the pattern given to King David by the Spirit for Solomon to build. The ministry of the prophets, both spoken and written, surged greatly during this millennium, bringing the knowledge of the God of Israel to the nations. This was aided at the beginning by the fame of Solomon's reign and his wisdom which was broadcast among the nations, when Solomon was used by God to "bring low the false accuser" (Psalms 72:4 LXX). When ignorance of God and His ways was dispelled, Satan's power to deceive was chained. This binding of Satan's deception was true even when that knowledge of God and His ways was willfully disregarded by many. At least the disobedient ones could not claim deceived ignorance as an excuse.

33 AD - Satan's deception had continued to be bound during the earthly ministry of Christ and His disciples up until AD 33, as Christ was proving by "spoiling his goods" in casting out devils. But that chain on Satan's deception was removed in this AD 33 year. Christ's crucifixion, resurrection and ascension that day was responsible for casting Satan and his devils as the "accuser of the brethren" out of heaven and down to the earth and the sea, to deceive the nations again in full fury. Christ had warned about this the night of the Last Supper, saying, "...the prince of this world cometh, and hath nothing in me." (John 14:30). This was the time Christ referred to in John 12:31, "Now is the judgment of this world: now shall the prince of this world be cast out." (cast out of heaven down to the earth to deceive the nations once more). AD 33 and the "First resurrection" began the New Covenant composed of a spiritual temple not made with hands, with Christ having been laid down as the "chief cornerstone" - the true foundation stone of this temple built with "living stones".

I now am interrupting this to ask... In Luke 10:we read....

Verse 1 states "1 Now after this the Lord appointed seventy others, and sent them in pairs ahead of Him to every city and place where He Himself was going to come." He had not been crucified as yet.

But in verse 18 we are told...

17 The seventy returned with joy, saying, “Lord, even the demons are subject to us in Your name.” 18 And He said to them, “I was watching Satan fall from heaven like lightning.

FYI... The Peshitta... which I value as do you states it this way.

:18 Then he said to them, I saw him, Satana, when he fell as lightning from heaven.

(For me I was watching Satan fall carries a differing meaning tense wise then I saw him Satana, when he fell)

This was before your "that day was responsible casting Satan and his devils as the "accuser of the brethren" out of heaven and down to the earth" ....... Either Jesus was watching Satan presently falling or while he had fallen (Peshitta)

Excluding the Peshitta, I find this to be chronologically confusing..................

John 12:12 agrees with this time when Satan was loosed in AD 33, because he was warning his readers at that time that Satan had already come down unto them in great wrath, knowing he had only a "short time" left to operate deceptively in this world.

Nasb95 states John 12:12 reads 12 On the next day, when the large crowd that had come to the feast heard that Jesus was coming to Jerusalem,

Peshitta...12And the next day a great crowd which had come to the feast, when they heard that Yeshua had come to Jerusalem,

Peter agreed with this when he wrote describing Satan at that time as a "roaring lion" walking about, seeking those he could devour (1 Peter 5:8).

But it does not say for Satan has a short time... it is those who are being spoken to... vs 10

8 Be of sober spirit, be on the alert. Your adversary, the devil, prowls around like a roaring lion, seeking someone to devour. 9 But resist him, firm in your faith, knowing that the same experiences of suffering are being accomplished by your brethren who are in the world. 10 After you have suffered for a little while, the God of all grace, who called you to His eternal glory in Christ, will Himself perfect, confirm, strengthen and establish you.

Now I shall stop here because you know I do not agree with you on this... and this is just partially why.

66 - 70 AD - Satan's "short time" and "little season" of deceiving the nations (without that restricting chain) became concentrated in one location - the city of Jerusalem - where he and his devils were imprisoned until the end of that war (Isaiah 24:21-23 and Revelation 18:2). He and his devils worked their ruinous deception on the inhabitants of Jerusalem, since Christ had predicted that nation's people would be oppressed by seven-fold numbers of devils more wicked in the "last state" of that nation than in its "first state" when Christ had been casting out devils from among them (Matthew 12:43-45).

70 AD - By the close of the war, the Satanic realm was completely destroyed - even to ashes on the earth, as prophesied in Isaiah 24:21-23, Isaiah 27:1, Zechariah 13:2, Ezekiel 28:18-19, Daniel 2:35, and Daniel 7:11. From that AD 70 point forward, until the end of fallen mankind's history on this planet (in 3033 AD - the culmination of 7,000 years), any evil committed in this world has been due solely to the evil emerging from the hearts of mankind.

This list above gives us a description of several different "spiritual" environments to which mankind has been subjected over the millennia of history:
#1) 35 plus years without Satan influencing the originally sinless couple,
#2) 3,000 years with Satan allowed time to deceive the nations at his leisure,
#3) a literal 1,000 years when Satan's deception of the nations was bound, then
#4) a 37 years "little season" of an infuriated Satan working at full steam to deceive the nations,
#5) then almost 3,000 years again with absolutely no presence of the Satanic realm around to instigate deception and evil anymore.

In every one of these various "spiritual" environments, mankind has failed the test to live without committing sinful acts. This is proof that without the sustaining grace of the Spirit of God within, mankind has fallen into sin every time by exercising its fallen will to do so, regardless of the presence (or absence) of any outside influence by Satan, his devils, or unclean spirits.

 

[3 Resurrections]

17 The seventy returned with joy, saying, “Lord, even the demons are subject to us in Your name.” 18 And He said to them, “I was watching Satan fall from heaven like lightning.

FYI... The Peshitta... which I value as do you states it this way.

:18 Then he said to them, I saw him, Satana, when he fell as lightning from heaven.

(For me I was watching Satan fall carries a differing meaning tense wise then I saw him Satana, when he fell)

This was before your "that day was responsible casting Satan and his devils as the "accuser of the brethren" out of heaven and down to the earth" ....... Either Jesus was watching Satan presently falling or while he had fallen (Peshitta)

Satan falling from heaven like lightning happened in real time at Christ's resurrection-day ascension to the Father, when this "accuser of the brethren" was cast out of heaven down to earth. Christ was prophesying to His disciples of this coming event when He said "I beheld Satan as lightning fall from heaven". Or, as the Peshitta quote above, "...I saw him, Satana, when he fell as lightning from heaven."

Why does it sound like a past tense of Satan having already fallen from heaven when Christ says this to the 70 disciples? Christ was using what we today call the "prophetic perfect tense" of speaking. In other words, speaking as if something was already accomplished when that prophesied event had yet to occur.

One example of this is the prophet Micaiah predicting to King Ahab, "I saw all Israel scattered upon the hills, as sheep that have not a shepherd: and the Lord said, These have no master: let them return every man to his house in peace" (1 Kings 22:17). This prophecy was fulfilled in the coming battle where King Ahab was killed by a bowshot from one of the King of Syria's soldiers, and Ahab's army was dispersed and returned to their homes. Yet the prophet Micaiah spoke of this in the past tense as an already-accomplished fact - so certain was he of God's fulfillment of this approaching event which would come to pass as predicted beforehand.

 

[Rella ~ I am a woman]

Satan falling from heaven like lightning happened in real time at Christ's resurrection-day ascension to the Father, when this "accuser of the brethren was cast out of heaven down to earth. Christ was prophesying to His disciples of this coming event when He said "I beheld Satan as lightning fall from heaven". Or, as the Peshitta quote above, "...I saw him, Satana, when he fell as lightning from heaven."

Why does it sound like a past tense of Satan having already fallen from heaven when Christ says this to the 70 disciples? Christ was using what we today call the "prophetic perfect tense" of speaking. In other words, speaking as if something was already accomplished when that prophesied event had yet to occur.

One example of this is the prophet Micaiah predicting to King Ahab, "I saw all Israel scattered upon the hills, as sheep that have not a shepherd: and the Lord said, These have no master: let them return every man to his house in peace" (1 Kings 22:17). This prophecy was fulfilled in the coming battle where King Ahab was killed by a bowshot from one of the King of Syria's soldiers, and Ahab's army was dispersed and returned to their homes. Yet the prophet Micaiah spoke of this in the past tense as an already-accomplished fact - so certain was he of God's fulfillment of this approaching event which would come to pass as predicted beforehand.

Thanks... I understand....

 

[ShineTheLight]

Satan falling from heaven like lightning happened in real time at Christ's resurrection-day ascension to the Father, when this "accuser of the brethren" was cast out of heaven down to earth. Christ was prophesying to His disciples of this coming event when He said "I beheld Satan as lightning fall from heaven". Or, as the Peshitta quote above, "...I saw him, Satana, when he fell as lightning from heaven."

Why does it sound like a past tense of Satan having already fallen from heaven when Christ says this to the 70 disciples? Christ was using what we today call the "prophetic perfect tense" of speaking. In other words, speaking as if something was already accomplished when that prophesied event had yet to occur.

No. He is not speaking about a prophesied or coming event, or something that happened at his ascension day. Jesus is talking about when he kicked out Satan and the angels who rebelled with him against God in Revelation. From the third heaven.

 

[Rella ~ I am a woman]

No. He is not speaking about a prophesied or coming event, or something that happened at his ascension day. Jesus is talking about when he kicked out Satan and the angels who rebelled with him against God in Revelation. From the third heaven.

Alright. I am not arguing. I simply want to know when you feel this happened and if you believe Satan is out of our lives today as so many believe?

 

[3 Resurrections]

No. He is not speaking about a prophesied or coming event, or something that happened at his ascension day. Jesus is talking about when he kicked out Satan and the angels who rebelled with him against God in Revelation. From the third heaven.

Of course, Jesus was talking about the Revelation 12 description of Satan and his devils being kicked out of heaven after the war with Michael and his angels.

But that war in heaven with Satan's eviction was an event future to the time Jesus said "I beheld Satan as lightning fall from heaven...". We can know that because of the context of Revelation 12's war. The victory overcoming Satan was accomplished by the "blood of the Lamb" (Rev. 12:11), which tells us we are reading about an event which took place AFTER Christ's crucifixion and resurrection-day ascension to the Father. That was when He offered His blood sacrifice on heaven's mercy seat and "offered Himself without spot to God...".

The victorious ones in heaven announced at that point in time, "NOW HAS COME SALVATION, and strength, and the kingdom of our God, and the power of his Christ, for the accuser of our brethren is cast down..." (Rev. 12:10). At that point in time in heaven, the legal, judicial terms of our salvation had been satisfied by Christ's blood sacrifice being accepted by God on our behalf. At that point in time, Satan no longer had any grounds for accusing the saints of sin. He lost that ability to accuse the brethren, once the legal requirements for our salvation were fulfilled by God's acceptance of Christ's blood sacrifice, and by God anointing Christ as our Great High Priest intercessor forever.

Christ knew this victory over Satan in heaven was coming soon at His resurrection-day ascension. That is why He predicted Satan's future fall from heaven unto the earth to the 70 rejoicing disciples who were then being able to cast out unclean spirits by the name of Christ.

 

[georgetrew4]

Don't Let Satan Fool You: What Signs Indicate That Satan Is Influencing Your Life?

(removed)

Father Gabriele Amorth, a well-known Italian exorcist, claimed that Satan works in our lives in many ways, but his goal is always to destroy our faith and relationship with God.
Therefore, it is important that we learn to recognize when Satan is influencing our lives and how to resist him.
The first sign that Satan is influencing our lives is our relationship with God.
When we lose faith or begin to doubt God, we open the door for Satan to work in our lives.
Therefore, it is important that we exercise our faith and pray regularly that we are protected from Satan.

 

[3 Resurrections]

Therefore, it is important that we exercise our faith and pray regularly that we are protected from Satan.

Unfortunately, this is a wasted prayer, since God already got rid of that evil creature long ago. Paul wrote a promise to the Roman believers in Romans 16:20 (written around AD 60) that God was going to crush Satan under their own feet "shortly" - in their own lifetime. You are attempting to do battle with a dead foe, when mankind doesn't have to look any farther than their own hearts to find the origin of every evil thought and action ("For from within, out of the heart of men, proceed evil thoughts, adulteries, fornications, murders, thefts, covetousness, wickedness, deceit, lewdness, an evil eye, blasphemy, pride, foolishness. All these evil things come from within and defile a man." Mark 7:21-23).

 

[Rella ~ I am a woman]

Unfortunately, this is a wasted prayer, since God already got rid of that evil creature long ago. Paul wrote a promise to the Roman believers in Romans 16:20 (written around AD 60) that God was going to crush Satan under their own feet "shortly" - in their own lifetime. You are attempting to do battle with a dead foe, when mankind doesn't have to look any farther than their own hearts to find the origin of every evil thought and action ("For from within, out of the heart of men, proceed evil thoughts, adulteries, fornications, murders, thefts, covetousness, wickedness, deceit, lewdness, an evil eye, blasphemy, pride, foolishness. All these evil things come from within and defile a man." Mark 7:21-23).

when mankind doesn't have to look any farther than their own hearts to find the origin of every evil thought and action ("For from within, out of the heart of men, proceed evil thoughts, adulteries, fornications, murders, thefts, covetousness, wickedness, deceit, lewdness, an evil eye, blasphemy, pride, foolishness. All these evil things come from within and defile a man." Mark 7:21-23).

Speaking only for myself ..... So those two black things that descended onto my bed were from within me?

OKAY...

Odd how they vanished when I managed to say God, through my fear.

Could be that was wishful assumption from a lifetime of believing that be him present or being the
mob boss bound below running things that there is still some kind of evil in the world today.

Guess my mind could make me believe that.

 

[Behold]

Father Gabriele Amorth, a well-known Italian exorcist, claimed that Satan works in our lives in many ways, but his goal is always to destroy our faith and relationship with God.

The way Satan destroys faith is to lead you into a "doctrine of Devils"., that will "bewitch" you...

Satan's Theologies, like "Mary flew to heaven, in a dead body".. or Anything that Calvin teaches.... These teachings are anointed by the Devil, and they are like witchcraft....they "spellbind you.. They literally put you under their spiritual control that is what the NT defines as a "stronghold in the mind".
They literally blind your mind, so that you can't see Truth, that would instantly reveal the deception to you.

Reader, "doctrines of devils"... Hebrews 13:9, are Truth Blockers, regarding the word of God and regarding the correct understanding of Christian Spirituality.

This is to become "mind blinded by the Devil".

 

[3 Resurrections]

Could be that was wishful assumption from a lifetime of believing that be him present or being the
mob boss bound below running things that there is still some kind of evil in the world today.

But there IS evil in the world today - and by now it all comes from the hearts of fallen mankind alone, ever since God slew Satan and his devils back in AD 70. At the end of this world, mankind who has lived during these New Covenant ages will have to stand before God with the record of all the evil committed solely by their own initiation in these last ages when the Satanic realm has been completely removed from this planet. I believe God has designed history this way to show humanity just how corrupted the fallen state of mankind really is - either with or without the members of the Satanic realm influencing it.

It is a humiliating fact, but fallen humanity is just as capable as the Satanic realm at inventing evil, all by itself. In fact, fallen humanity's offenses against God are even worse, since we sin against God's grace and mercy extended to the human race. The Satanic realm never had such an opportunity extended to them. This was plainly taught in Hebrews 2:14-18, where Christ did not take up the nature of angels, but was made like unto mankind in order to be made our high priest representative.

Hebrews 12:26-27 also taught us that God had "NOW promised" in those first century days that He was going to shake, not only the earth, but also heaven (Luke 21:26), so that what was shaken could be REMOVED from this world. That meant the Satanic realm (the "powers of heaven") was shaken AND REMOVED from this planet back then.

Do I have an answer for what you firmly believe that you saw sitting on your bed that night? All I have is the different scripture accounts that tell me when God got rid of the Satanic realm for all time back in the first century. If you want to pit your experience against scripture, be my guest, but frankly, I prefer to rely on what scripture tells me instead, if it runs counter to what you believe you saw.

The human brain is a remarkable organ which no amount of science can fully understand. At the church I last attended, there were two individuals with medical issues that told me things they had heard and seen that everyone knew could not possibly be there. I have a neighbor also with bi-polar issues that (when they are off their meds) they also see things that are not really there. I'm not accusing you of being "off your rocker", Rella. But I do believe that our senses can mislead us on things like this, particularly if we are pre-disposed to believe them.

 

[Rella ~ I am a woman]

But there IS evil in the world today - and by now it all comes from the hearts of fallen mankind alone, ever since God slew Satan and his devils back in AD 70. At the end of this world, mankind who has lived during these New Covenant ages will have to stand before God with the record of all the evil committed solely by their own initiation in these last ages when the Satanic realm has been completely removed from this planet. I believe God has designed history this way to show humanity just how corrupted the fallen state of mankind really is - either with or without the members of the Satanic realm influencing it.

It is a humiliating fact, but fallen humanity is just as capable as the Satanic realm at inventing evil, all by itself. In fact, fallen humanity's offenses against God are even worse, since we sin against God's grace and mercy extended to the human race. The Satanic realm never had such an opportunity extended to them. This was plainly taught in Hebrews 2:14-18, where Christ did not take up the nature of angels, but was made like unto mankind in order to be made our high priest representative.

Hebrews 12:26-27 also taught us that God had "NOW promised" in those first century days that He was going to shake, not only the earth, but also heaven (Luke 21:26), so that what was shaken could be REMOVED from this world. That meant the Satanic realm (the "powers of heaven") was shaken AND REMOVED from this planet back then.

Do I have an answer for what you firmly believe that you saw sitting on your bed that night? All I have is the different scripture accounts that tell me when God got rid of the Satanic realm for all time back in the first century. If you want to pit your experience against scripture, be my guest, but frankly, I prefer to rely on what scripture tells me instead, if it runs counter to what you believe you saw.

The human brain is a remarkable organ which no amount of science can fully understand. At the church I last attended, there were two individuals with medical issues that told me things they had heard and seen that everyone knew could not possibly be there. I have a neighbor also with bi-polar issues that (when they are off their meds) they also see things that are not really there. I'm not accusing you of being "off your rocker", Rella. But I do believe that our senses can mislead us on things like this, particularly if we are pre-disposed to believe them.

I only know that when something lands on the bed and makes an indentation that you can feel and see
it is not from the mind.

You say pre-disposed to believe them.... I say experience.

And neither was the death of my friend in 2000 when Richard Baumhammer went on his killing spree and she was one of his victims. It was not in her mind. She did not shoot or bury herself. .. or the others that he got that day. That came from pure evil.

Maybe it was not Satan... Maybe it was not demon possession... but something evil possessed him.

 

[3 Resurrections]

And neither was the death of my friend in 2000 when Richard Baumhammer went on his killing spree and she was one of his victims. It was not in her mind. She did not shoot or bury herself. .. or the others that he got that day. That came from pure evil.

Maybe it was not Satan... Maybe it was not demon possession... but something evil possessed him.

There are no limits to what the evil in men's hearts will drive them to perform. Every ones who claims "we have no sin" John reproves for saying so. "If we say we have no sin we deceive ourselves, and the truth is not in us." (1 John 1:8-10).

The murderer of your friend was motivated solely by what was going on in his own heart - with no demonic possession whatever involved. Ever since AD 70 and God's destruction of the entire Satanic realm, mankind has continued to pass the blame to Satan for their own misdeeds, just as was true back in the Garden of Eden ("The serpent beguiled me..."). It's an old habit that has continued to be practiced, even though the Satanic villain of the story has been utterly destroyed and removed from the scene. It's an easy out for humanity to blame a dead Satan for their own sins. Less guilt involved.

 

[The Learner]

Alright. I am not arguing. I simply want to know when you feel this happened and if you believe Satan is out of our lives today as so many believe?

Satan is a creature and can not be in more than one place at a time. I think most of the stories are just that made up stories. I even had people call me the devil when they could not respond to what the Holy Spirit revealed to me to say to them.

 

[Reggie Belafonte]

The Devil himself is not a bad dude ? as one who as a carnal person would see such ?
This world is full of deceptions and delusions, if you believe Jesus in fact.

Hitler came across as a real nice dude, so did Stalin ! for they had millions idolising them in their own Countrys. not to mention nowadays some people still look up to such people in fact. Mass Murders looked up to ? that's a fact !

Look at Ukraine now, was it worth it ? is it worth it ? if one believes such is worth it, well the blood is on your hands i would think. so escalate escalate for War and hope that it leads the Nuclear War and WW3 because that is what Zelensky hopes for ! all over a little bit of land on the border of Russia, That if a Vote was alowed to take place ! in fact would of become part of Russia and no blood spilt in fact !

See the Devil in the detail ? they could of had the right to Vote ! but that was rejected in fact, so the War came about !

Them people in the lands bordering Russia were rejected their right to Vote in fact ! because if a Vote was conducted 80% in them lands would of won ! to join with Russia ! that would of been democracy ! but no ! Satan's workings are in the detail.

Typical of Socialist for they will play every dirty trick in the Book, we see such working against Trump in fact, it became a Warfare 24/7 as soon as Trump became the President, who can see that it is a warfare and who could not see it ?
We seen such Games being played by Hitler and Stalin and that's the way Biden plays it ! he is clearly a Communist ! but comes across as nice old didering fool, that just does not have a clue what he is doing ?

 

[face2face]

I now am interrupting this to ask... In Luke 10:we read....

Verse 1 states "1 Now after this the Lord appointed seventy others, and sent them in pairs ahead of Him to every city and place where He Himself was going to come." He had not been crucified as yet.

But in verse 18 we are told...

17 The seventy returned with joy, saying, “Lord, even the demons are subject to us in Your name.” 18 And He said to them, “I was watching Satan fall from heaven like lightning.

While Wrangler introduced this same in support of the fallen angel theory, he ran from it rather quickly and for good reason.

@Rella ~ I am a woman ....Do you know what a simile is?

I'm going to assume you do.

Luke who wrote the Gospel of Luke & Acts likes to use similes (“his sweat was like drops of blood,”) He uses them here Luke 3:22; Luke 10:18; Luke 11:44; Luke 22:31 and so on...

What is the comparison being made?

So he said to them, I saw Satan (adversary) fall like lightning from heaven. Lk 10:18.

Who was the adversary in Jesus' view?

Luke 10:18

In Luke using a smile the whole point of the comparison placing emphasis on the "speed of the fall" of the adversary "as" lightning falling from heaven.

The Return of the Seventy-Two


Luke 10:17 The seventy-two returned with joy, saying, “Lord, even the demons (illnesses - they didn't know the names back then!) are subject to us in your name!” 18 And he said to them, “I saw Satan fall like lightning from heaven. 19 Behold, I have given you authority to tread on serpents and scorpions, and over all the power of the enemy, and nothing shall hurt you. 20 Nevertheless, do not rejoice in this, that the spirits are subject to you, but rejoice that your names are written in heaven.”

Straight away you can see how Christ relates the fall of this adversary with them having power over the enemy.

The obvious questions is...

Who was their enemy?

Who in the record is called serpents and scorpions?

If you have identified the enemy correctly you will also know how that authority of Christ was used to overcome them.

What was their evil power and how did they exercise it over the people?

Also noted is the implied safety of having their name written in Heaven! (no evil or sin present there)

Few questions there for you to chew on.

F2F

 

[face2face]

But it does not say for Satan has a short time... it is those who are being spoken to... vs 10

8 Be of sober spirit, be on the alert. Your adversary, the devil, prowls around like a roaring lion, seeking someone to devour. 9 But resist him, firm in your faith, knowing that the same experiences of suffering are being accomplished by your brethren who are in the world. 10 After you have suffered for a little while, the God of all grace, who called you to His eternal glory in Christ, will Himself perfect, confirm, strengthen and establish you.

Now I shall stop here because you know I do not agree with you on this... and this is just partially why.

Notice how Peter defines the meaning of the word satan as being "adversary"? Big clue, if you missed that!

Who is the adversary?

Fact:

No mention of angel!
No mention of a fallen angel
Greek word "antidikos" translated "adversary" means "an adversary in law" - who was the one roaming around persecuting believers at that time? Correct! The Roman magistracy the persecution of which under Nero and Diocletian is well and truly documented (Bible & History!).

How does 1 Peter 5:9 cmp 4:12 and 1 Peter 4:16-19 affect your understanding of the adversary?

Further to this, what if you see Paul's use of the same language with a roaring lion in 2 Timothy 4:17, but this lion was not a fallen angel, but Caesar's tribunal!!!

I actually am starting to question if you are teachable, or if you just love fanciful man made stories? Maybe you are in the wrong site?

F2F

 

[face2face]

Satan is a creature and can not be in more than one place at a time.

Any quotes for this?

I think most of the stories are just that made up stories.

Like a fallen angel?

I even had people call me the devil when they could not respond to what the Holy Spirit revealed to me to say to them.

In believing in a supernatural evil being you are a devil (false accuser) as you are teaching lies - what does this say about your HS?

I know, right!

F2F

 

[face2face]

There are no limits to what the evil in men's hearts will drive them to perform. Every ones who claims "we have no sin" John reproves for saying so. "If we say we have no sin we deceive ourselves, and the truth is not in us." (1 John 1:8-10).

The murderer of your friend was motivated solely by what was going on in his own heart - with no demonic possession whatever involved. Ever since AD 70 and God's destruction of the entire Satanic realm, mankind has continued to pass the blame to Satan for their own misdeeds, just as was true back in the Garden of Eden ("The serpent beguiled me..."). It's an old habit that has continued to be practiced, even though the Satanic villain of the story has been utterly destroyed and removed from the scene. It's an easy out for humanity to blame a dead Satan for their own sins. Less guilt involved.

Hands off the Old Testament as you don't have an origin story for your fallen angel. Some Christians try to use obscure passages in Ezekiel and Isaiah but very quickly discover they have no means of proving all the fanciful notions they try to force on the text. Some may try and use Job but after three chapters the adversary is gone! Powerless as they might be - POOF nothing...who was the adversary? Well, maybe an angel wanting to know why God favored Job? Maybe a jealous believer wanting God to test Job - certainly not a fallen angel having peaceable conversations in Gods' realm - ridiculous!

Whats left? An animal God made who was more cunning that the other beasts of the field?

Problems abound everywhere - most run from the discussion, some become easily offended others try to prove the images in their mind are actually real only to find they were sold a lie! But how do they reconcile all these words in the NT and how to learn each in their own context?

And he said, “How can I, unless someone guides me?” Acts 8:31

F2F

 

[face2face]

And neither was the death of my friend in 2000 when Richard Baumhammer went on his killing spree and she was one of his victims. It was not in her mind. She did not shoot or bury herself. .. or the others that he got that day. That came from pure evil.

This is what that came from:

The heart is deceitful above all things, and desperately wicked: who can know it? I the LORD search the heart, I try the reins, even to give every man according to his ways, and according to the fruit of his doings. Jeremiah 17:9-10

Only God knows how evil that heart can be.

Maybe armed with this knowledge you can start to see why Christ was raised up in the condemned line of Adam...and taste Yahweh's Righteousness!

F2F