Leaders That Don't Support Good Works or Overcoming Sin

[GTW27]

Did she ever come back .

I saw her come back for one day but then was gone for good.

 

[amigo de christo]

Two things:

Firstly, you will always feel bad about your sin. As you said "It comforted me. I knew I would never be able to shake the sin and bouts of anger in my life."

Secondly, your desire to sin will clash, with your desire to die on your cross. As you said " But right now---my husband and I stay in Scripture daily, discussing it, praying it, practicing to obey Jesus. Yes, obey Jesus, not just believe."

Belief faith obediance love are tied into it .
Abraham BELIEVED GOD , ABRAHAM DID what GOD said .
Many can claim they beleive in JESUS the CHRIST , but many sure dont seem to believe HIS words
let alone love them and do them .
The devils beleive and do tremble my friend
but dont ya know that faith without works is dead . ITS NOT FAITH at all .
If you love me KEEP my commandments .
HE who loves me keeps my sayings
HE who loves me not does not keep my sayings .
AND , if one HAS the SPIRIT would they not have had this at work within themselves .
WORKING IN you that which is WELL pleasing IN HIS SIGHT . sin aint
your right , WE WOULD HATE our contrary flesh .
yet many justify their sins , even trying to no longer call them sins , even saying GOD IS fine
with all of it . HE made me like this , its love and etc .
Many DO NOT have the SPIRIT . and worse , worse
many now try and claim there is no need to BELEIVE ON JESUS THE CHRIST .
THAT my friend IS NOT COMING FROM THE SPIRIT .
Cause the SPIRIT testifies of JESUS THE CHRIST , it dont deny HIM as THE CHRIST .
Boy do we got problems in the house sister . many are following
another jesus , another gospel and another god all together .
recreated in the image that best serves their own hearts desires . aint looking good sister .
STAY in the bible and be in prayer . YES indeed dear sister . let us keep praying one for the other .

 

[GTW27]

Its been seven years my friend .
it was in june of twenty seventeen i had first joined CF
i met SP soon thereafter . DO you remember little davida too . she was the youngster of the group
only seventeen back then . I still see michie is there . man the RCC done run me off more than once
but i do continue to pray for them .
Seven years has flown by my friend . i am now the big fifty two .
PS , the question is , do ya really think this ol world has another seven left in it .
By the signs of the times i gotta say I DONT think so at all .
Its gotten much worse since even when i first showed up at CF . in just them last seven years
the delusion has grown massive now and it grows faster by the day and by the hour too my friend .

As for your question at least seven years but it is very close.

 

[amigo de christo]

I saw her come back for one day but then was

I remember that name too . but i dont remember much about her .

 

[amigo de christo]

As for your question at least seven years but it is very close.

It was seven years since i signed up . i think solomon left some time after that .

 

[amigo de christo]

I do not remember the others except Lilac. I did follow the quale thing. I knew she was under a lot of attacks before she left. Even when she was helping me she was under attack. It was sad to see her leave. Even today I still use what she taught me.

yes she was having some attacks i remember that . Its sad to see some leave my friend .
I lost another sister on another site right after covid had hit .
Times are changing faster now my friend . a massive end time battle is at hand and the time draws ever nigh .

 

[GTW27]

I remember that name too . but i dont remember much about her .

Do you remember the time I wrote on you profile page. That was to encourage you and was not from me. I bring not Glory to myself but I do brag upon the Name of The Lord. I never was you enemy. I agree about getting into those Bibles as not to be deceived. And yes there are false teachers. They are easy to see. I do not want to derail this thread any more.

 

[amigo de christo]

As for your question at least seven years but it is very close.

Tribulations are coming upon the true lambs and times are getting worse .
My advice to all is , we better be prepared to suffer for CHRIST .
even to die if so be that comes upon us . TIMES are rapidly changing
and soon the world as one will do all to rid this earth of all who did not conform
to the image of their love god . whose love did not rejoice in TRUTH
but rather in a lie and inquity . fear it not my friend . fear them not .

 

[Johann]

The problem with many and the reason at times they come to different conclusions
is their big hurry to look wise and seem smart . if we but read the bible for ourselves many things become quite clear in time .
Its these so called greatr scholars that seem to be the ones messing stuff up a lot .
But as i said many forget something . a lot of folks read some scrip but man did they want to look wise to folks
and always in a hurry to know it all so as they can be and appear wise unto men .
Just love the scrips and enjoy them , and as we read them and seek for wisdom
understanding , knowledge it should be for one reason . HOW I CAN BETTER SERVE GOD . but
most seek knowledge to get knowledge to have praise of men and seem ever wise . and the latter AINT gonna learn right .

Correct you are-a lot of messed up "stuff" going on these forums--"healings, signs and miracles"--when--
Believers in Christ are often forewarned about the inevitability of suffering persecutions and hardships. Several passages from the New Testament articulate this reality:

Matthew 5:10-12: "Blessed are those who are persecuted because of righteousness, for theirs is the kingdom of heaven. Blessed are you when people insult you, persecute you and falsely say all kinds of evil against you because of me. Rejoice and be glad, because great is your reward in heaven, for in the same way they persecuted the prophets who were before you."

John 15:18-20: "If the world hates you, keep in mind that it hated me first. If you belonged to the world, it would love you as its own. As it is, you do not belong to the world, but I have chosen you out of the world. That is why the world hates you. Remember what I told you: ‘A servant is not greater than his master.’ If they persecuted me, they will persecute you also. If they obeyed my teaching, they will obey yours also."

2 Timothy 3:12: "In fact, everyone who wants to live a godly life in Christ Jesus will be persecuted."

1 Peter 4:12-14: "Dear friends, do not be surprised at the fiery ordeal that has come on you to test you, as though something strange were happening to you. But rejoice inasmuch as you participate in the sufferings of Christ, so that you may be overjoyed when his glory is revealed. If you are insulted because of the name of Christ, you are blessed, for the Spirit of glory and of God rests on you."

Romans 8:17: "Now if we are children, then we are heirs—heirs of God and co-heirs with Christ, if indeed we share in his sufferings in order that we may also share in his glory."

The Deaths of the Apostles
Peter: Traditionally, Peter is believed to have been crucified upside down in Rome under Emperor Nero around AD 64-68. He felt unworthy to die in the same manner as Jesus.

Andrew: Peter's brother, Andrew, is said to have been crucified on an X-shaped cross in Patras, Greece. He continued to preach to his tormentors for two days before dying.

James the Great: The brother of John, James was the first apostle to be martyred. He was beheaded by order of King Herod Agrippa I in Jerusalem around AD 44 (Acts 12:1-2).

John: John is the only apostle believed to have died of natural causes. He was exiled to the island of Patmos, where he wrote the Book of Revelation, and later returned to Ephesus, where he died at an advanced age.

Philip: Philip is traditionally believed to have been martyred in Hierapolis (modern-day Turkey), possibly by crucifixion or being hanged.

Bartholomew (Nathaniel): According to various traditions, Bartholomew was flayed alive and beheaded in Armenia for his missionary work.

Matthew (Levi): Matthew is traditionally believed to have been martyred in Ethiopia. Accounts vary, but he may have been stabbed, burned, or beheaded.

Thomas (Didymus): Thomas is believed to have been martyred in India, possibly by being speared by four soldiers.

James the Less: James the Less, often identified as the son of Alphaeus, is said to have been martyred in Egypt, where he was crucified or stoned to death.

Thaddeus (Jude): Jude is traditionally thought to have been martyred in Persia, possibly by being clubbed to death.

Simon the Zealot: Simon the Zealot is traditionally believed to have been martyred in Persia, either by being sawed in half or crucified.

Matthias: Chosen to replace Judas Iscariot, Matthias is said to have been martyred in Ethiopia, though accounts vary on the manner of his death.

Paul (Saul of Tarsus): Although not one of the original Twelve Apostles, Paul is considered an apostle due to his significant role in the early church. He was beheaded in Rome under Emperor Nero around AD 64-67.

These accounts of the apostles' deaths are based on tradition and early Christian writings, as the New Testament itself provides limited details about their final fates.

Polycarp of Smyrna
Polycarp, a disciple of the Apostle John and bishop of Smyrna, was martyred around AD 155. When arrested, he refused to renounce Christ. The Roman proconsul threatened him with wild beasts and fire, but Polycarp remained steadfast. He was eventually burned at the stake, and when the flames didn't consume him, he was stabbed to death. His final words were, "Eighty and six years have I served him, and he never did me any injury: how then can I blaspheme my King and my Savior?"

Ignatius of Antioch
Ignatius, another early church father and bishop of Antioch, was martyred around AD 108. Condemned to death during the reign of Emperor Trajan, he was sent to Rome where he was thrown to wild beasts in the Colosseum. On his journey to Rome, Ignatius wrote several epistles to various Christian communities, encouraging them to remain faithful and not to try to rescue him. His writings are some of the earliest extant Christian documents outside the New Testament.

Justin Martyr
Justin Martyr, a notable early Christian apologist, was martyred around AD 165. A philosopher who converted to Christianity, he defended the faith through his writings and public debates. He was arrested with several of his students, and when they refused to sacrifice to the Roman gods, they were scourged and beheaded. Justin's works, especially his "Apologies" and "Dialogue with Trypho," remain significant in early Christian literature.

Perpetua and Felicity
Perpetua, a young noblewoman, and Felicity, her slave, were martyred in Carthage around AD 203 during the reign of Emperor Septimius Severus. Perpetua kept a diary of her imprisonment, which includes a powerful account of her visions and steadfast faith. Both women, along with other catechumens, were condemned to be thrown to wild beasts. Despite their hardships, they remained resolute, and their story has been a source of inspiration for Christians throughout the centuries.

Blandina
Blandina was a slave and one of the martyrs of Lyon (modern-day France) around AD 177 during the reign of Marcus Aurelius. Despite being tortured extensively, she refused to renounce her faith. Her tormentors were astonished at her endurance, as she repeatedly affirmed, "I am a Christian, and nothing wicked happens among us." Blandina was eventually killed by being gored by a bull and then stabbed.

Lawrence of Rome
Lawrence, a deacon in the Roman church, was martyred in AD 258 during the persecution of Emperor Valerian. When ordered to turn over the church's treasures, Lawrence presented the poor and the sick, declaring them the church's true treasures. He was sentenced to death by being roasted alive on a gridiron. According to tradition, he famously said, "Turn me over; I’m done on this side."

Cyprian of Carthage
Cyprian, bishop of Carthage, was martyred in AD 258 during the same Valerian persecution. He was a prominent early Christian writer and church leader. When he was arrested, he was given a chance to recant his faith but refused. He was then beheaded. Cyprian's works, especially "On the Unity of the Church," remain influential in Christian theology.

Sebastian
Sebastian, a soldier in the Roman army and a Christian, was martyred during the reign of Emperor Diocletian around AD 288. He was discovered to be a Christian and was ordered to be executed by being tied to a stake and shot with arrows. He miraculously survived this ordeal but was later beaten to death when he confronted Diocletian about his persecution of Christians.

The Forty Martyrs of Sebaste
In AD 320, forty Christian soldiers in the Roman army were martyred near Sebaste (modern-day Sivas, Turkey). They refused to renounce their faith and were condemned to freeze to death on a lake during winter. A warm bath was prepared on the shore to entice them to recant, but only one did. The others remained steadfast, and when one of the guards saw their faith, he converted and joined them, making their number forty again.

These stories of early Christian martyrs exemplify the profound commitment and unwavering faith that these individuals had, often in the face of severe persecution and death. Their legacies continue to inspire and encourage believers worldwide.

We must count the cost to follow Messiah and show the world the risen Christ Jesus by OUR lifestyles but many here have overstep the boundaries of what stands written and have added their own experiences into the mix, sounding like the Church at Corinth.

Pentecostals have taken this Age of Enlightenment by storm and the truth is perverted and twisted.

 

[Johann]

Correct you are-a lot of messed up "stuff" going on these forums--"healings, signs and miracles"--when--
Believers in Christ are often forewarned about the inevitability of suffering persecutions and hardships. Several passages from the New Testament articulate this reality:

Matthew 5:10-12: "Blessed are those who are persecuted because of righteousness, for theirs is the kingdom of heaven. Blessed are you when people insult you, persecute you and falsely say all kinds of evil against you because of me. Rejoice and be glad, because great is your reward in heaven, for in the same way they persecuted the prophets who were before you."

John 15:18-20: "If the world hates you, keep in mind that it hated me first. If you belonged to the world, it would love you as its own. As it is, you do not belong to the world, but I have chosen you out of the world. That is why the world hates you. Remember what I told you: ‘A servant is not greater than his master.’ If they persecuted me, they will persecute you also. If they obeyed my teaching, they will obey yours also."

2 Timothy 3:12: "In fact, everyone who wants to live a godly life in Christ Jesus will be persecuted."

1 Peter 4:12-14: "Dear friends, do not be surprised at the fiery ordeal that has come on you to test you, as though something strange were happening to you. But rejoice inasmuch as you participate in the sufferings of Christ, so that you may be overjoyed when his glory is revealed. If you are insulted because of the name of Christ, you are blessed, for the Spirit of glory and of God rests on you."

Romans 8:17: "Now if we are children, then we are heirs—heirs of God and co-heirs with Christ, if indeed we share in his sufferings in order that we may also share in his glory."

The Deaths of the Apostles
Peter: Traditionally, Peter is believed to have been crucified upside down in Rome under Emperor Nero around AD 64-68. He felt unworthy to die in the same manner as Jesus.

Andrew: Peter's brother, Andrew, is said to have been crucified on an X-shaped cross in Patras, Greece. He continued to preach to his tormentors for two days before dying.

James the Great: The brother of John, James was the first apostle to be martyred. He was beheaded by order of King Herod Agrippa I in Jerusalem around AD 44 (Acts 12:1-2).

John: John is the only apostle believed to have died of natural causes. He was exiled to the island of Patmos, where he wrote the Book of Revelation, and later returned to Ephesus, where he died at an advanced age.

Philip: Philip is traditionally believed to have been martyred in Hierapolis (modern-day Turkey), possibly by crucifixion or being hanged.

Bartholomew (Nathaniel): According to various traditions, Bartholomew was flayed alive and beheaded in Armenia for his missionary work.

Matthew (Levi): Matthew is traditionally believed to have been martyred in Ethiopia. Accounts vary, but he may have been stabbed, burned, or beheaded.

Thomas (Didymus): Thomas is believed to have been martyred in India, possibly by being speared by four soldiers.

James the Less: James the Less, often identified as the son of Alphaeus, is said to have been martyred in Egypt, where he was crucified or stoned to death.

Thaddeus (Jude): Jude is traditionally thought to have been martyred in Persia, possibly by being clubbed to death.

Simon the Zealot: Simon the Zealot is traditionally believed to have been martyred in Persia, either by being sawed in half or crucified.

Matthias: Chosen to replace Judas Iscariot, Matthias is said to have been martyred in Ethiopia, though accounts vary on the manner of his death.

Paul (Saul of Tarsus): Although not one of the original Twelve Apostles, Paul is considered an apostle due to his significant role in the early church. He was beheaded in Rome under Emperor Nero around AD 64-67.

These accounts of the apostles' deaths are based on tradition and early Christian writings, as the New Testament itself provides limited details about their final fates.

Polycarp of Smyrna
Polycarp, a disciple of the Apostle John and bishop of Smyrna, was martyred around AD 155. When arrested, he refused to renounce Christ. The Roman proconsul threatened him with wild beasts and fire, but Polycarp remained steadfast. He was eventually burned at the stake, and when the flames didn't consume him, he was stabbed to death. His final words were, "Eighty and six years have I served him, and he never did me any injury: how then can I blaspheme my King and my Savior?"

Ignatius of Antioch
Ignatius, another early church father and bishop of Antioch, was martyred around AD 108. Condemned to death during the reign of Emperor Trajan, he was sent to Rome where he was thrown to wild beasts in the Colosseum. On his journey to Rome, Ignatius wrote several epistles to various Christian communities, encouraging them to remain faithful and not to try to rescue him. His writings are some of the earliest extant Christian documents outside the New Testament.

Justin Martyr
Justin Martyr, a notable early Christian apologist, was martyred around AD 165. A philosopher who converted to Christianity, he defended the faith through his writings and public debates. He was arrested with several of his students, and when they refused to sacrifice to the Roman gods, they were scourged and beheaded. Justin's works, especially his "Apologies" and "Dialogue with Trypho," remain significant in early Christian literature.

Perpetua and Felicity
Perpetua, a young noblewoman, and Felicity, her slave, were martyred in Carthage around AD 203 during the reign of Emperor Septimius Severus. Perpetua kept a diary of her imprisonment, which includes a powerful account of her visions and steadfast faith. Both women, along with other catechumens, were condemned to be thrown to wild beasts. Despite their hardships, they remained resolute, and their story has been a source of inspiration for Christians throughout the centuries.

Blandina
Blandina was a slave and one of the martyrs of Lyon (modern-day France) around AD 177 during the reign of Marcus Aurelius. Despite being tortured extensively, she refused to renounce her faith. Her tormentors were astonished at her endurance, as she repeatedly affirmed, "I am a Christian, and nothing wicked happens among us." Blandina was eventually killed by being gored by a bull and then stabbed.

Lawrence of Rome
Lawrence, a deacon in the Roman church, was martyred in AD 258 during the persecution of Emperor Valerian. When ordered to turn over the church's treasures, Lawrence presented the poor and the sick, declaring them the church's true treasures. He was sentenced to death by being roasted alive on a gridiron. According to tradition, he famously said, "Turn me over; I’m done on this side."

Cyprian of Carthage
Cyprian, bishop of Carthage, was martyred in AD 258 during the same Valerian persecution. He was a prominent early Christian writer and church leader. When he was arrested, he was given a chance to recant his faith but refused. He was then beheaded. Cyprian's works, especially "On the Unity of the Church," remain influential in Christian theology.

Sebastian
Sebastian, a soldier in the Roman army and a Christian, was martyred during the reign of Emperor Diocletian around AD 288. He was discovered to be a Christian and was ordered to be executed by being tied to a stake and shot with arrows. He miraculously survived this ordeal but was later beaten to death when he confronted Diocletian about his persecution of Christians.

The Forty Martyrs of Sebaste
In AD 320, forty Christian soldiers in the Roman army were martyred near Sebaste (modern-day Sivas, Turkey). They refused to renounce their faith and were condemned to freeze to death on a lake during winter. A warm bath was prepared on the shore to entice them to recant, but only one did. The others remained steadfast, and when one of the guards saw their faith, he converted and joined them, making their number forty again.

These stories of early Christian martyrs exemplify the profound commitment and unwavering faith that these individuals had, often in the face of severe persecution and death. Their legacies continue to inspire and encourage believers worldwide.

We must count the cost to follow Messiah and show the world the risen Christ Jesus by OUR lifestyles but many here have overstep the boundaries of what stands written and have added their own experiences into the mix, sounding like the Church at Corinth.

Pentecostals have taken this Age of Enlightenment by storm and the truth is perverted and twisted.

Philippians 2:12-13 KJV
12) Wherefore, my beloved, as ye have always obeyed, not as in my presence only, but now much more in my absence, work out your own salvation with fear and trembling.
13) For it is God which worketh in you both to will and to do of his good pleasure.

 

[Johann]

Hi sister. I understand about the poor memory. Do you take b vitamins?

I agree that sanctification is also a process that begins when we come to Christ. It is a matter of being purified. It seems that once one reached a certain stage, they are then trained in walking in the Spirit but then they reach the full stature of Christ and remain in the blessing.

King James Bible Rev 3:12
Him that overcometh will I make a pillar in the temple of my God, and he shall go no more out: and I will write upon him the name of my God, and the name of the city of my God, which is new Jerusalem, which cometh down out of heaven from my God: and I will write upon him my new name.

But this is advanced teaching and one needs to get to the place first where they are entirely submitted to God. The Holy Spirit convicts us of this need if we are genuine seekers.

What is so "advanced" in this?

REVELATION—NOTE ON 3:12 one who conquers. All Christians (see note on 2:7).
a pillar. Believers will enjoy an unshakable, eternal, secure place in the presence
of God. temple. See note on 7:15. write . . . name of my God. In biblical times,
one’s name spoke of his character. Writing his name on us speaks of imprinting
his character on us and identifying us as belonging to him. new Jerusalem. The
capital city of heaven (see notes on 21:1–27). The overcomer will enjoy eternal
citizenship. my own new name. At the moment we see Christ, whatever we may
have called him and understood by that name will pale in the reality of what we
see. And he will give us a new, eternal name by which we will know him.

 

[Hepzibah]

This "less in control of their emotions" in the late 50's and older, this is the prognosis for untreated cPTSD, that by the 50's, someone is unlikely to seek help, and less likely to actually obtain any real help.

Not sure I go along with the same observation marks. I often see more of mild/worsening dementia amongst elderly believers, and a general loss of patience towards others. I have read a lot about how bad eating habits contribute a great deal to cognitive decline (and physical) and where better to see bad eating habits than the 'church teas' I have attended! If one is truly walking in the Spirit, one would expect that the believer would be obeying God in all things and be bringing organic salads to the events! I have never seen this - it is all cakes, especially from the elderly. Perhaps it is different in the US.

With cPTSD, I would tend to think that they would have dropped out of church before then. I have found church to be rather hostile to sufferers, that is speaking personally of course. The judgmentalism that is often found in churches, is damaging especially to those who beat themselves up already due to abuse from their past. Then there is the urge to isolate.

But your comment has given me plenty of fuel for further thought on just how much cPTSD has impacted my walk with Christ and my testimony so thanks for that.

As for not seeking help later on, I wonder about that. It took me 74 years! Help is certainly still available.

I've seen a mix of people in the churches I've been in. Some show that kind of advanced sanctfication we're talking about, though I've never met anyone personally who claimed sinlessness. I've only met those on-line. I've known many people who show maturing in Christ over the years I've known them. I've known a number of Christians senior to me who show an enviable character, the fruit of the Spirit maturing in them.

I have never met anyone claiming sinlessness. There was one wonderful aged Wesleyan woman who was a mentor for me and put me on the holiness pathway. I cannot say however that I have met many if any who have inspired me, but then I have tended to move around churches a lot, and isolated.

For myself, there was both a mental and spiritual onslaught from God that ripped away all my protections. I was horrified at getting a good look at myself, and was even more horrified when I came to understand my road that led there. Without that heavy hand of God in my life, I don't think I'd have changed, just continued on in my fleshy ways.

Yes the Lord stripped me of everything until all I could do was lie 'face down in the ashes' until He picked me up and showed me the road I should have been on, a road of complete and radical obedience.

And try as I might, I just can't seem to make my life fit any pattern of growth other than that which is fairly simply spelled out in the Bible.

I do see my journey in the example of the lives of the disciples.

That we mature over the course of our lives, that this is described as conducting our lives according to the changes God has made in us, and as putting off the wrong things from our old lives, and putting on the right things from our new life.

It did not happen to me like that - it was in one instance that He renewed me making it very clear that it was His work not mine. It was more profound than the change that came about when I was converted, even though that one was profound as well, but in a different way. I believe that it takes a very very deep sort of conviction and repentance for this to happen and we are not ready for it when we are new to the faith and full of ideas about how we are going to move mountains. Many failures have to take place for us to know that even with well intended religious flesh, there can be nothing of man on the spiritual pathway.

That we are a new spirit child of God, and we have to put to death the fleshy parts of us. Which to my cPTSD understanding, speaks of the corrupted flesh - brain, psyche, like that - damaged by Adam's sin, then further by my sins, and others sins that affected me.

That I am to deny them these inner perversions (wrong bents) by directing my thoughts otherwise, Godward, not allowing them access to my actions, or my emotions.

It is a pure heart that is needed. How many can claim to have a pure heart after the first flush of conversion and a gradual compromise with sin has taken place? Our hearts however will deceive us to think that this is not us but do we love the Lord our God with our whole heart soul and mind nowadays as we did at the beginning? This is not tolerated by God when the power to do this is available to us all.

That we do this by trusting in our complete reconciliation to God, thereby eliminating the working of law in us to provoke sin in our flesh. We do this by trusting in our complete renewal in rebirth, thereby freeing us from all constraint and compulsion to sin. By making a conscious choice to not allow anything wrong to remain or have any effect in us. That this faith, believing that God has promised, and so He will do it, is what allows us to stand in His grace, unhindered by fleshy or worldly or satanic things. Trusting in His ability we choose, knowing God is Who empowers, us, others, whatever is needed.

The problem here is the subtle numbing of the conscience that we do not see happening. We have to face reality.

And that we will not know for sure whether we are sinless or not, therefore don't worry about it. Let Him be the judge, and I just focus on living as best I can. Trust in Jesus to show you what He wants to show you. In all cases, that we are to walk in the light He has given to us, trusting, trusting, that He is leading us well.

How do we know that we have been converted? The Spirit witnesses it to us (hopefully). In the same manner, we have the assurance from Him that we are right with Him if we die at this moment. If we feel we have some things to sort out then we are not walking in the Light as He is in the Light.

Preaching to myself here . . .

Much love!

 

[Hepzibah]

Just add a ps, there is the mellowing in maturity of course but we can pit that against ones obedience to Christ and on small things like what we eat. actually that is not a small thing. It directly affects how efficient we will be and how long we will keep going.

When there used to be 'health food shops' which I would frequent, I often saw people in that age group looking as fit as fiddles (sorry UK idiom) and were talking about the latest mountain they had climbed (this was an 80 + year old non Christians. Go to a church tea and see the difference as the fat and unfit are terrible diets and prayed to God to heal them, in the meantime dying of cancer strokes and heart attacks, all shown to be through unhealthy lifestyle especially diet. It's a no brainer.

 

[Lizbeth]

Correct you are-a lot of messed up "stuff" going on these forums--"healings, signs and miracles"--when--
Believers in Christ are often forewarned about the inevitability of suffering persecutions and hardships. Several passages from the New Testament articulate this reality:

Matthew 5:10-12: "Blessed are those who are persecuted because of righteousness, for theirs is the kingdom of heaven. Blessed are you when people insult you, persecute you and falsely say all kinds of evil against you because of me. Rejoice and be glad, because great is your reward in heaven, for in the same way they persecuted the prophets who were before you."

John 15:18-20: "If the world hates you, keep in mind that it hated me first. If you belonged to the world, it would love you as its own. As it is, you do not belong to the world, but I have chosen you out of the world. That is why the world hates you. Remember what I told you: ‘A servant is not greater than his master.’ If they persecuted me, they will persecute you also. If they obeyed my teaching, they will obey yours also."

2 Timothy 3:12: "In fact, everyone who wants to live a godly life in Christ Jesus will be persecuted."

1 Peter 4:12-14: "Dear friends, do not be surprised at the fiery ordeal that has come on you to test you, as though something strange were happening to you. But rejoice inasmuch as you participate in the sufferings of Christ, so that you may be overjoyed when his glory is revealed. If you are insulted because of the name of Christ, you are blessed, for the Spirit of glory and of God rests on you."

Romans 8:17: "Now if we are children, then we are heirs—heirs of God and co-heirs with Christ, if indeed we share in his sufferings in order that we may also share in his glory."

The Deaths of the Apostles
Peter: Traditionally, Peter is believed to have been crucified upside down in Rome under Emperor Nero around AD 64-68. He felt unworthy to die in the same manner as Jesus.

Andrew: Peter's brother, Andrew, is said to have been crucified on an X-shaped cross in Patras, Greece. He continued to preach to his tormentors for two days before dying.

James the Great: The brother of John, James was the first apostle to be martyred. He was beheaded by order of King Herod Agrippa I in Jerusalem around AD 44 (Acts 12:1-2).

John: John is the only apostle believed to have died of natural causes. He was exiled to the island of Patmos, where he wrote the Book of Revelation, and later returned to Ephesus, where he died at an advanced age.

Philip: Philip is traditionally believed to have been martyred in Hierapolis (modern-day Turkey), possibly by crucifixion or being hanged.

Bartholomew (Nathaniel): According to various traditions, Bartholomew was flayed alive and beheaded in Armenia for his missionary work.

Matthew (Levi): Matthew is traditionally believed to have been martyred in Ethiopia. Accounts vary, but he may have been stabbed, burned, or beheaded.

Thomas (Didymus): Thomas is believed to have been martyred in India, possibly by being speared by four soldiers.

James the Less: James the Less, often identified as the son of Alphaeus, is said to have been martyred in Egypt, where he was crucified or stoned to death.

Thaddeus (Jude): Jude is traditionally thought to have been martyred in Persia, possibly by being clubbed to death.

Simon the Zealot: Simon the Zealot is traditionally believed to have been martyred in Persia, either by being sawed in half or crucified.

Matthias: Chosen to replace Judas Iscariot, Matthias is said to have been martyred in Ethiopia, though accounts vary on the manner of his death.

Paul (Saul of Tarsus): Although not one of the original Twelve Apostles, Paul is considered an apostle due to his significant role in the early church. He was beheaded in Rome under Emperor Nero around AD 64-67.

These accounts of the apostles' deaths are based on tradition and early Christian writings, as the New Testament itself provides limited details about their final fates.

Polycarp of Smyrna
Polycarp, a disciple of the Apostle John and bishop of Smyrna, was martyred around AD 155. When arrested, he refused to renounce Christ. The Roman proconsul threatened him with wild beasts and fire, but Polycarp remained steadfast. He was eventually burned at the stake, and when the flames didn't consume him, he was stabbed to death. His final words were, "Eighty and six years have I served him, and he never did me any injury: how then can I blaspheme my King and my Savior?"

Ignatius of Antioch
Ignatius, another early church father and bishop of Antioch, was martyred around AD 108. Condemned to death during the reign of Emperor Trajan, he was sent to Rome where he was thrown to wild beasts in the Colosseum. On his journey to Rome, Ignatius wrote several epistles to various Christian communities, encouraging them to remain faithful and not to try to rescue him. His writings are some of the earliest extant Christian documents outside the New Testament.

Justin Martyr
Justin Martyr, a notable early Christian apologist, was martyred around AD 165. A philosopher who converted to Christianity, he defended the faith through his writings and public debates. He was arrested with several of his students, and when they refused to sacrifice to the Roman gods, they were scourged and beheaded. Justin's works, especially his "Apologies" and "Dialogue with Trypho," remain significant in early Christian literature.

Perpetua and Felicity
Perpetua, a young noblewoman, and Felicity, her slave, were martyred in Carthage around AD 203 during the reign of Emperor Septimius Severus. Perpetua kept a diary of her imprisonment, which includes a powerful account of her visions and steadfast faith. Both women, along with other catechumens, were condemned to be thrown to wild beasts. Despite their hardships, they remained resolute, and their story has been a source of inspiration for Christians throughout the centuries.

Blandina
Blandina was a slave and one of the martyrs of Lyon (modern-day France) around AD 177 during the reign of Marcus Aurelius. Despite being tortured extensively, she refused to renounce her faith. Her tormentors were astonished at her endurance, as she repeatedly affirmed, "I am a Christian, and nothing wicked happens among us." Blandina was eventually killed by being gored by a bull and then stabbed.

Lawrence of Rome
Lawrence, a deacon in the Roman church, was martyred in AD 258 during the persecution of Emperor Valerian. When ordered to turn over the church's treasures, Lawrence presented the poor and the sick, declaring them the church's true treasures. He was sentenced to death by being roasted alive on a gridiron. According to tradition, he famously said, "Turn me over; I’m done on this side."

Cyprian of Carthage
Cyprian, bishop of Carthage, was martyred in AD 258 during the same Valerian persecution. He was a prominent early Christian writer and church leader. When he was arrested, he was given a chance to recant his faith but refused. He was then beheaded. Cyprian's works, especially "On the Unity of the Church," remain influential in Christian theology.

Sebastian
Sebastian, a soldier in the Roman army and a Christian, was martyred during the reign of Emperor Diocletian around AD 288. He was discovered to be a Christian and was ordered to be executed by being tied to a stake and shot with arrows. He miraculously survived this ordeal but was later beaten to death when he confronted Diocletian about his persecution of Christians.

The Forty Martyrs of Sebaste
In AD 320, forty Christian soldiers in the Roman army were martyred near Sebaste (modern-day Sivas, Turkey). They refused to renounce their faith and were condemned to freeze to death on a lake during winter. A warm bath was prepared on the shore to entice them to recant, but only one did. The others remained steadfast, and when one of the guards saw their faith, he converted and joined them, making their number forty again.

These stories of early Christian martyrs exemplify the profound commitment and unwavering faith that these individuals had, often in the face of severe persecution and death. Their legacies continue to inspire and encourage believers worldwide.

We must count the cost to follow Messiah and show the world the risen Christ Jesus by OUR lifestyles but many here have overstep the boundaries of what stands written and have added their own experiences into the mix, sounding like the Church at Corinth.

Pentecostals have taken this Age of Enlightenment by storm and the truth is perverted and twisted.

Brother, I ask you to kindly consider this....that it was for envy Jesus was crucified.

If Christians were to rise up in large numbers and go around healing the sick and casting out devils and seeing souls saved in large numbers, do you think the world and the god of this world would thank us....not to mention "ministers of religion"....? No, quite the opposite.........they would all feel threatened by it and react accordingly.

 

[amigo de christo]

Correct you are-a lot of messed up "stuff" going on these forums--"healings, signs and miracles"--when--
Believers in Christ are often forewarned about the inevitability of suffering persecutions and hardships. Several passages from the New Testament articulate this reality:

Matthew 5:10-12: "Blessed are those who are persecuted because of righteousness, for theirs is the kingdom of heaven. Blessed are you when people insult you, persecute you and falsely say all kinds of evil against you because of me. Rejoice and be glad, because great is your reward in heaven, for in the same way they persecuted the prophets who were before you."

John 15:18-20: "If the world hates you, keep in mind that it hated me first. If you belonged to the world, it would love you as its own. As it is, you do not belong to the world, but I have chosen you out of the world. That is why the world hates you. Remember what I told you: ‘A servant is not greater than his master.’ If they persecuted me, they will persecute you also. If they obeyed my teaching, they will obey yours also."

2 Timothy 3:12: "In fact, everyone who wants to live a godly life in Christ Jesus will be persecuted."

1 Peter 4:12-14: "Dear friends, do not be surprised at the fiery ordeal that has come on you to test you, as though something strange were happening to you. But rejoice inasmuch as you participate in the sufferings of Christ, so that you may be overjoyed when his glory is revealed. If you are insulted because of the name of Christ, you are blessed, for the Spirit of glory and of God rests on you."

Romans 8:17: "Now if we are children, then we are heirs—heirs of God and co-heirs with Christ, if indeed we share in his sufferings in order that we may also share in his glory."

The Deaths of the Apostles
Peter: Traditionally, Peter is believed to have been crucified upside down in Rome under Emperor Nero around AD 64-68. He felt unworthy to die in the same manner as Jesus.

Andrew: Peter's brother, Andrew, is said to have been crucified on an X-shaped cross in Patras, Greece. He continued to preach to his tormentors for two days before dying.

James the Great: The brother of John, James was the first apostle to be martyred. He was beheaded by order of King Herod Agrippa I in Jerusalem around AD 44 (Acts 12:1-2).

John: John is the only apostle believed to have died of natural causes. He was exiled to the island of Patmos, where he wrote the Book of Revelation, and later returned to Ephesus, where he died at an advanced age.

Philip: Philip is traditionally believed to have been martyred in Hierapolis (modern-day Turkey), possibly by crucifixion or being hanged.

Bartholomew (Nathaniel): According to various traditions, Bartholomew was flayed alive and beheaded in Armenia for his missionary work.

Matthew (Levi): Matthew is traditionally believed to have been martyred in Ethiopia. Accounts vary, but he may have been stabbed, burned, or beheaded.

Thomas (Didymus): Thomas is believed to have been martyred in India, possibly by being speared by four soldiers.

James the Less: James the Less, often identified as the son of Alphaeus, is said to have been martyred in Egypt, where he was crucified or stoned to death.

Thaddeus (Jude): Jude is traditionally thought to have been martyred in Persia, possibly by being clubbed to death.

Simon the Zealot: Simon the Zealot is traditionally believed to have been martyred in Persia, either by being sawed in half or crucified.

Matthias: Chosen to replace Judas Iscariot, Matthias is said to have been martyred in Ethiopia, though accounts vary on the manner of his death.

Paul (Saul of Tarsus): Although not one of the original Twelve Apostles, Paul is considered an apostle due to his significant role in the early church. He was beheaded in Rome under Emperor Nero around AD 64-67.

These accounts of the apostles' deaths are based on tradition and early Christian writings, as the New Testament itself provides limited details about their final fates.

Polycarp of Smyrna
Polycarp, a disciple of the Apostle John and bishop of Smyrna, was martyred around AD 155. When arrested, he refused to renounce Christ. The Roman proconsul threatened him with wild beasts and fire, but Polycarp remained steadfast. He was eventually burned at the stake, and when the flames didn't consume him, he was stabbed to death. His final words were, "Eighty and six years have I served him, and he never did me any injury: how then can I blaspheme my King and my Savior?"

Ignatius of Antioch
Ignatius, another early church father and bishop of Antioch, was martyred around AD 108. Condemned to death during the reign of Emperor Trajan, he was sent to Rome where he was thrown to wild beasts in the Colosseum. On his journey to Rome, Ignatius wrote several epistles to various Christian communities, encouraging them to remain faithful and not to try to rescue him. His writings are some of the earliest extant Christian documents outside the New Testament.

Justin Martyr
Justin Martyr, a notable early Christian apologist, was martyred around AD 165. A philosopher who converted to Christianity, he defended the faith through his writings and public debates. He was arrested with several of his students, and when they refused to sacrifice to the Roman gods, they were scourged and beheaded. Justin's works, especially his "Apologies" and "Dialogue with Trypho," remain significant in early Christian literature.

Perpetua and Felicity
Perpetua, a young noblewoman, and Felicity, her slave, were martyred in Carthage around AD 203 during the reign of Emperor Septimius Severus. Perpetua kept a diary of her imprisonment, which includes a powerful account of her visions and steadfast faith. Both women, along with other catechumens, were condemned to be thrown to wild beasts. Despite their hardships, they remained resolute, and their story has been a source of inspiration for Christians throughout the centuries.

Blandina
Blandina was a slave and one of the martyrs of Lyon (modern-day France) around AD 177 during the reign of Marcus Aurelius. Despite being tortured extensively, she refused to renounce her faith. Her tormentors were astonished at her endurance, as she repeatedly affirmed, "I am a Christian, and nothing wicked happens among us." Blandina was eventually killed by being gored by a bull and then stabbed.

Lawrence of Rome
Lawrence, a deacon in the Roman church, was martyred in AD 258 during the persecution of Emperor Valerian. When ordered to turn over the church's treasures, Lawrence presented the poor and the sick, declaring them the church's true treasures. He was sentenced to death by being roasted alive on a gridiron. According to tradition, he famously said, "Turn me over; I’m done on this side."

Cyprian of Carthage
Cyprian, bishop of Carthage, was martyred in AD 258 during the same Valerian persecution. He was a prominent early Christian writer and church leader. When he was arrested, he was given a chance to recant his faith but refused. He was then beheaded. Cyprian's works, especially "On the Unity of the Church," remain influential in Christian theology.

Sebastian
Sebastian, a soldier in the Roman army and a Christian, was martyred during the reign of Emperor Diocletian around AD 288. He was discovered to be a Christian and was ordered to be executed by being tied to a stake and shot with arrows. He miraculously survived this ordeal but was later beaten to death when he confronted Diocletian about his persecution of Christians.

The Forty Martyrs of Sebaste
In AD 320, forty Christian soldiers in the Roman army were martyred near Sebaste (modern-day Sivas, Turkey). They refused to renounce their faith and were condemned to freeze to death on a lake during winter. A warm bath was prepared on the shore to entice them to recant, but only one did. The others remained steadfast, and when one of the guards saw their faith, he converted and joined them, making their number forty again.

These stories of early Christian martyrs exemplify the profound commitment and unwavering faith that these individuals had, often in the face of severe persecution and death. Their legacies continue to inspire and encourage believers worldwide.

We must count the cost to follow Messiah and show the world the risen Christ Jesus by OUR lifestyles but many here have overstep the boundaries of what stands written and have added their own experiences into the mix, sounding like the Church at Corinth.

Pentecostals have taken this Age of Enlightenment by storm and the truth is perverted and twisted.

The problem is many have become enamored with the gifts and with self
Rather than the CREATOR who gave such gifts unto men .
WHO First did that .
WHO first did that .
He was given great gifts but became enamored with his own self
as though HE were the great power .
They focus on mainly ONE part of the minstiry . gifts and healings
but they often do not care about all things written .
This is a self glorifying problem .
And believe you me , its not just within the pentecostal charasmetic realm . Its all over the place now .
The key is , what is it they really loved . HAD it been GOD , HIS CHRIST
they would haved loved TRUTH , all things HE said and that HE inspired by the SPIRIT in that bible .
But those who often focus on one point , say like prosperity , or say even the word love , or say its etc etc
THEY will heed men who focus on said point . and omit much of the rest .
THIS IS PROOF their love is SELF centered not GOD centered .

 

[amigo de christo]

Brother, I ask you to kindly consider this....that is was for envy Jesus was crucified.

If Christians were to rise up in large numbers and go around healing the sick and casting out devils and seeing souls saved in large numbers, do you think the world and the god of this world would thank us....not to mention "ministers of religion"....? No, quite the opposite.........they would all feel threatened by it and react accordingly.

Its not the gifts that are the problem or even the signs and wonders that be the problem . ITS the heart of the man
that be the problem . many seek for all the wrong reasons . they seek
to attain their kingdom now and to be the great power of GOD . rather than simply seeking GOD
to learn of HIM so as we can better serve him
they seek for another reason , to see how we can better be served , seen , praised , accepted , seen as something great .
RATHER than simply seeing us as mere wee things who ought to be THANKING GOD every day
they seek the power to be seen as he who holds the power . Not good my dear sister .
Not good . And thus they will omit many other parts of the scrips that were written for their good
because those scrips get in the way of their most beloved god of all , THE GOD OF SELF .

 

[amigo de christo]

Brother, I ask you to kindly consider this....that is was for envy Jesus was crucified.

If Christians were to rise up in large numbers and go around healing the sick and casting out devils and seeing souls saved in large numbers, do you think the world and the god of this world would thank us....not to mention "ministers of religion"....? No, quite the opposite.........they would all feel threatened by it and react accordingly.

Envy . even pilate knew that to be the case .
ENVY . WHY did they envy ,
because JESUS was taking the very worship they so desired FOR THEMSELVES , away from them .
THEY DIDNT LIKE THAT SISTER .
just as many do not like the scrips that expose their own envy , their own desire to be seen and praised of men and
they will Rebuke and attack and even throughout history PUT TO DEATH those who do so .
the RCC , its main leaders desired the worship and control of men
THEY DIDNT Like it when men came along and actually preached the WHOLE of it to others
cause that led others away from these men . ENVY is as ENVY DOES sister .
Many are enamored and desire to be seen of men to attain power and control .
Many have done all to find a way to falsely cover their own certain sin , no matter what that sin or sins be ,
in order to serve the god they consider most holy and reverand of all , the god of SELF . this is just a plain hard fact sister .

 

[amigo de christo]

Brother, I ask you to kindly consider this....that is was for envy Jesus was crucified.

If Christians were to rise up in large numbers and go around healing the sick and casting out devils and seeing souls saved in large numbers, do you think the world and the god of this world would thank us....not to mention "ministers of religion"....? No, quite the opposite.........they would all feel threatened by it and react accordingly.

And now in the end it has grown so dark and so wicked
that we can easily see what has become of christendom in large .
What became of JERSUALEM has become of the CHRISTENDOM .
only most cannot see it . JUST like most could not see it in those days long gone .
WHY
because most love to have ears tickled and hear the smooth things
and have hollered in heart , AWAY with the HOLY ONE in that bible and His words
AWAY with that KING
make us THE KINGS of our own , give us our KINGDOM NOW and the pleasures in this life .
Away with those haters who preach these biblical reminders .
ITS ALL COMING DOWN . the great falling away is OCCURING in massive number now .
And the warners warn and so few take heed .
And the prophets of this people preach unto them a love and a means and a promise of peace .
And none does turn from His own wickedness for the prophets have promised them life
That GOD accepts them , that all is well and the only sin is , to heed biblical instruction .
WE at that point sister . IT will get worse too .

 

[Lizbeth]

With cPTSD, I would tend to think that they would have dropped out of church before then. I have found church to be rather hostile to sufferers, that is speaking personally of course. The judgmentalism that is often found in churches, is damaging especially to those who beat themselves up already due to abuse from their past. Then there is the urge to isolate.

So true unfortunately........and one of the things God has against the false shepherds in Ezekiel is that they fail to bind up the wounded sheep. Ezekiel 34 speaks to this, and judging between the lean and the fat sheep, and also how the true Shepherd undertakes to shepherd and lead and care for those sheep who are driven away and not tended to.

It did not happen to me like that - it was in one instance that He renewed me making it very clear that it was His work not mine. It was more profound than the change that came about when I was converted, even though that one was profound as well, but in a different way. I believe that it takes a very very deep sort of conviction and repentance for this to happen and we are not ready for it when we are new to the faith and full of ideas about how we are going to move mountains. Many failures have to take place for us to know that even with well intended religious flesh, there can be nothing of man on the spiritual pathway.

Amen...I believe this. The Lord speaks to us in parables.....as well as that these things happened to the Israelites as examples for us......we seem to see a parable/picture of what you are talking about in the journey of the Israelites.......they failed to enter the land at first.....then they had to "die" in the wilderness I(flesh cannot enter) in order to be ready to get across that second obstacle and washing of water, and be circumcised/consecrated a "second" time. Think we even see it alluded to in there being an outpouring of water from the Rock TWICE in the desert. And the Jordan at flood stage being held back all the way to a town called Adam......I believe speaks to apprehending a cleansing that goes deeper than the initial cleansing/baptism of the Red Sea....all the way back to the very root.

 

[Lizbeth]

The problem is many have become enamored with the gifts and with self
Rather than the CREATOR who gave such gifts unto men .
WHO First did that .
WHO first did that .
He was given great gifts but became enamored with his own self
as though HE were the great power .
They focus on mainly ONE part of the minstiry . gifts and healings
but they often do not care about all things written .
This is a self glorifying problem .
And believe you me , its not just within the pentecostal charasmetic realm . Its all over the place now .
The key is , what is it they really loved . HAD it been GOD , HIS CHRIST
they would haved loved TRUTH , all things HE said and that HE inspired by the SPIRIT in that bible .
But those who often focus on one point , say like prosperity , or say even the word love , or say its etc etc
THEY will heed men who focus on said point . and omit much of the rest .
THIS IS PROOF their love is SELF centered not GOD centered .

Amen.....Johann rightly pointed something out recently.....that the "charismatic" and other movements put something else at the centre other than the gospel of Jesus Christ. For example, Charismatic movement put signs and miracles at the centre and the gospel gets sidelined, Pentecostal put baptism of the Holy Spirit at the centre, and NAR puts kingdom now theology at the centre and the gospel kind of becomes secondary. Jesus said signs FOLLOW the preaching of the gospel.....it is the gospel that needs to take centre stage and signs/miracles are meant to be a help to the gospel. Think we need to watch out for doctrines/movements etc in general that put their pet thing at the centre instead of Christ and the gospel...that is a red flag.