DOES BELIEF THAT ONCE SAVED ALWAYS SAVED MEAN WE CAN SIN?

[Doug]

There is a lot of sentiment that refutes eternal security based on the belief that it propagates freely sinning.

The Bible teaches both eternal security and living righteously.

Let's first look at eternal security.

[Jhn 3:14-16 KJV] 14 And as Moses lifted up the serpent in the wilderness, even so must the Son of man be lifted up: 15 That whosoever believeth in him should not perish, but have eternal life. 16 For God so loved the world, that he gave his only begotten Son, that whosoever believeth in him should not perish, but have everlasting life.

While the Old Testament was primarily given to Israel to obey, we can still learn from it.

The Jews only had to believe on Jesus to have eternal life.

[Rom 3:21-22 KJV] 21 But now the righteousness of God without the law is manifested, being witnessed by the law and the prophets; 22 Even the righteousness of God [which is] by faith of Jesus Christ unto all and upon all them that believe: for there is no difference:

Now on to Paul who was given revelation from the risen Christ Jesus to preach our gospel today for Jew and Gentile.

Paul revealed that we have the righteousness of God by faith in Christ. If have been declared righteous then we can know we have eternal security.

[Rom 4:21-25 KJV] 21 And being fully persuaded that, what he had promised, he was able also to perform. 22 And therefore it was imputed to him for righteousness. 23 Now it was not written for his sake alone, that it was imputed to him; 24 But for us also, to whom it shall be imputed, if we believe on him that raised up Jesus our Lord from the dead; 25 Who was delivered for our offences, and was raised again for our justification.

Righteousness was imputed to Abraham; it was not his righteousness but the righteousness of God.

The righteousness of Christ is imputed to us as well.

Jesus died for our sins and rose for our justification unto eternal life.

[Rom 5:9-11 KJV] 9 Much more then, being now justified by his blood, we shall be saved from wrath through him. 10 For if, when we were enemies, we were reconciled to God by the death of his Son, much more, being reconciled, we shall be saved by his life. 11 And not only [so], but we also joy in God through our Lord Jesus Christ, by whom we have now received the atonement.

We are justified by his blood and are reconciled.

[Rom 5:21 KJV] 21 That as sin hath reigned unto death, even so might grace reign through righteousness unto eternal life by Jesus Christ our Lord.
[Rom 6:23 KJV] 23 For the wages of sin [is] death; but the gift of God [is] eternal life through Jesus Christ our Lord.
[Tit 1:2 KJV] 2 In hope of eternal life, which God, that cannot lie, promised before the world began;
[Tit 3:7 KJV] 7 That being justified by his grace, we should be made heirs according to the hope of eternal life.

These verses promise eternal life and security.

Being justified can we freely sin?

[Rom 6:1-2 KJV] 1 What shall we say then? Shall we continue in sin, that grace may abound? 2 God forbid. How shall we, that are dead to sin, live any longer therein?

Paul gives answer to those who would say we are free to sin.

[Rom 6:6-7 KJV] 6 Knowing this, that our old man is crucified with [him], that the body of sin might be destroyed, that henceforth we should not serve sin. 7 For he that is dead is freed from sin.

We are to reckon we are dead to sin but alive to God.

[Rom 6:12, 14-15, 22 KJV] 12 Let not sin therefore reign in your mortal body, that ye should obey it in the lusts thereof. ... 14 For sin shall not have dominion over you: for ye are not under the law, but under grace. 15 What then? shall we sin, because we are not under the law, but under grace? God forbid. ... 22 But now being made free from sin, and become servants to God, ye have your fruit unto holiness, and the end everlasting life.

Above are more verses pertaining to sin.

[Tit 2:11-12 KJV] 11 For the grace of God that bringeth salvation hath appeared to all men, 12 Teaching us that, denying ungodliness and worldly lusts, we should live soberly, righteously, and godly, in this present world;

Finaly the above passage dispels the assertion that being justified eternally by grace promotes sin.

 

[Taken]

DOES BELIEF THAT ONCE SAVED ALWAYS SAVED MEAN WE CAN SIN?

No…
Not “willingly”.
Not “unwillingly”.

Glory to God,
Taken

 

[Reggie Belafonte]

It's more about, the Power to resist such Evil, for you are not Owned by this World ? That is Full of Deceptions and Delusions in fact !

So yes one can Sin ? but one in Christ Jesus Soul is Saved, so we are still in this world that is full of stepping in dog do do from time to time, but we understand what we stood in and aviod such best we can.

I know people who are just like stepping in do do, I am not impressed with them but that's who they truly are. one just does not follow along with them and their nonsense !

My Mum will demand that she will tell me my Stars and she knows only to well I will not have a bar of such at all !
I point out that Hitler was into that crap ! it's Evil and Stop it !
I will not tollerate such nonsense at all period, so why insist that I listen to such rubbish ! such is Idolity !
Worthy Christians do not have any Idols at all. We expose all such nonsense !

 

[Bob Estey]

There is a lot of sentiment that refutes eternal security based on the belief that it propagates freely sinning.

The Bible teaches both eternal security and living righteously.

Let's first look at eternal security.

[Jhn 3:14-16 KJV] 14 And as Moses lifted up the serpent in the wilderness, even so must the Son of man be lifted up: 15 That whosoever believeth in him should not perish, but have eternal life. 16 For God so loved the world, that he gave his only begotten Son, that whosoever believeth in him should not perish, but have everlasting life.

While the Old Testament was primarily given to Israel to obey, we can still learn from it.

The Jews only had to believe on Jesus to have eternal life.

[Rom 3:21-22 KJV] 21 But now the righteousness of God without the law is manifested, being witnessed by the law and the prophets; 22 Even the righteousness of God [which is] by faith of Jesus Christ unto all and upon all them that believe: for there is no difference:

Now on to Paul who was given revelation from the risen Christ Jesus to preach our gospel today for Jew and Gentile.

Paul revealed that we have the righteousness of God by faith in Christ. If have been declared righteous then we can know we have eternal security.

[Rom 4:21-25 KJV] 21 And being fully persuaded that, what he had promised, he was able also to perform. 22 And therefore it was imputed to him for righteousness. 23 Now it was not written for his sake alone, that it was imputed to him; 24 But for us also, to whom it shall be imputed, if we believe on him that raised up Jesus our Lord from the dead; 25 Who was delivered for our offences, and was raised again for our justification.

Righteousness was imputed to Abraham; it was not his righteousness but the righteousness of God.

The righteousness of Christ is imputed to us as well.

Jesus died for our sins and rose for our justification unto eternal life.

[Rom 5:9-11 KJV] 9 Much more then, being now justified by his blood, we shall be saved from wrath through him. 10 For if, when we were enemies, we were reconciled to God by the death of his Son, much more, being reconciled, we shall be saved by his life. 11 And not only [so], but we also joy in God through our Lord Jesus Christ, by whom we have now received the atonement.

We are justified by his blood and are reconciled.

[Rom 5:21 KJV] 21 That as sin hath reigned unto death, even so might grace reign through righteousness unto eternal life by Jesus Christ our Lord.
[Rom 6:23 KJV] 23 For the wages of sin [is] death; but the gift of God [is] eternal life through Jesus Christ our Lord.
[Tit 1:2 KJV] 2 In hope of eternal life, which God, that cannot lie, promised before the world began;
[Tit 3:7 KJV] 7 That being justified by his grace, we should be made heirs according to the hope of eternal life.

These verses promise eternal life and security.

Being justified can we freely sin?

[Rom 6:1-2 KJV] 1 What shall we say then? Shall we continue in sin, that grace may abound? 2 God forbid. How shall we, that are dead to sin, live any longer therein?

Paul gives answer to those who would say we are free to sin.

[Rom 6:6-7 KJV] 6 Knowing this, that our old man is crucified with [him], that the body of sin might be destroyed, that henceforth we should not serve sin. 7 For he that is dead is freed from sin.

We are to reckon we are dead to sin but alive to God.

[Rom 6:12, 14-15, 22 KJV] 12 Let not sin therefore reign in your mortal body, that ye should obey it in the lusts thereof. ... 14 For sin shall not have dominion over you: for ye are not under the law, but under grace. 15 What then? shall we sin, because we are not under the law, but under grace? God forbid. ... 22 But now being made free from sin, and become servants to God, ye have your fruit unto holiness, and the end everlasting life.

Above are more verses pertaining to sin.

[Tit 2:11-12 KJV] 11 For the grace of God that bringeth salvation hath appeared to all men, 12 Teaching us that, denying ungodliness and worldly lusts, we should live soberly, righteously, and godly, in this present world;

Finaly the above passage dispels the assertion that being justified eternally by grace promotes sin.

Sin has unpleasant consequences - rob a bank and you'll go to prison. That's what makes it sin, I believe.

 

[PGS11]

If Jesus is your Savior and you understand he dies for each and everyone of your sins shouldn't that make you not want to sin?Its not a free pass to sin repentance is required it sounds to me a person like that would be a lukewarm soul who really thinks nothing of Jesus.In revelation they are the worse kind of souls Jesus says I spit you out.A hot soul is close to God a cold soul can still be saved but nothing can be done for a lukewarm soul the person has to wake up.

 

[TigersPaw]

To Sin is Natural, to die forever in the dirt is also.
I do think that the Heart, is key. God knows 100% we all will fall short,
I think those not wanting to sin but struggle and try and grow.
Are not in the same class as those, that sin and could careless as its just a way of life.

I truly wish that since 1977 I have been asking for more strength then I have.
I know it sounds silly but as a kid you believe God is waiting for you. Just don't sin.
I know we do but when we are young we know it all. I can't not sin. I do not want to.
But I also can not live and entire life guilty and suffering for my sins as Christ paid that.
Its a very small line we walk I think.
I am a pastor, and trained through seminary. But probably do not fit the versions most see as Pastor.
I am a Christ Follower, but I am also a realist.

Based on the Bible the whole story is not, don't sin or try not to. The story is accept Christ and he will help you resist.
You basically signa contract with God. You agree the undersigned to accept Jesus Christ as Lord and Savior, and by doing so.
You will be saved and accepted into the Kingdom of Heaven. But again the conditions are not. Don't sin, and barely say try and avoid sin.
What it does say is give these temptation to God. And he will get you through it. Does not say he will keep you free from sin.
So if giving to God doesn't remove the sin or temptation, then the Saved Always Saved seems to apply.
But I think as I said in the beginning its the Heart, the pain you suffer wanting to be with God is what he looks at.
And from a personal perspective that is not really fair. Yes Jesus died for us, yet we get to suffer even after giving to God?
I mean I never feel less guilty or bad for sinning even though I am saved. The the intent to have me feel this way is as its supposed to be. I suppose if I did not feel like crap, then it would mean I willingly sin.

I tried to give and explanation from my own perspective, I am aware of the biblical explanations.
But my thing has always been to try and compare and share analogies that help people understand.

 

[St. SteVen]

My position.

We cannot by an act of our own will undo what only God can do in the first place.
Even in the case of reprobation, it is God's decision. And the Good Shepherd goes after the lost sheep.

[

 

[ScottA]

There is a lot of sentiment that refutes eternal security based on the belief that it propagates freely sinning.

The Bible teaches both eternal security and living righteously.

Let's first look at eternal security.

[Jhn 3:14-16 KJV] 14 And as Moses lifted up the serpent in the wilderness, even so must the Son of man be lifted up: 15 That whosoever believeth in him should not perish, but have eternal life. 16 For God so loved the world, that he gave his only begotten Son, that whosoever believeth in him should not perish, but have everlasting life.

While the Old Testament was primarily given to Israel to obey, we can still learn from it.

The Jews only had to believe on Jesus to have eternal life.

[Rom 3:21-22 KJV] 21 But now the righteousness of God without the law is manifested, being witnessed by the law and the prophets; 22 Even the righteousness of God [which is] by faith of Jesus Christ unto all and upon all them that believe: for there is no difference:

Now on to Paul who was given revelation from the risen Christ Jesus to preach our gospel today for Jew and Gentile.

Paul revealed that we have the righteousness of God by faith in Christ. If have been declared righteous then we can know we have eternal security.

[Rom 4:21-25 KJV] 21 And being fully persuaded that, what he had promised, he was able also to perform. 22 And therefore it was imputed to him for righteousness. 23 Now it was not written for his sake alone, that it was imputed to him; 24 But for us also, to whom it shall be imputed, if we believe on him that raised up Jesus our Lord from the dead; 25 Who was delivered for our offences, and was raised again for our justification.

Righteousness was imputed to Abraham; it was not his righteousness but the righteousness of God.

The righteousness of Christ is imputed to us as well.

Jesus died for our sins and rose for our justification unto eternal life.

[Rom 5:9-11 KJV] 9 Much more then, being now justified by his blood, we shall be saved from wrath through him. 10 For if, when we were enemies, we were reconciled to God by the death of his Son, much more, being reconciled, we shall be saved by his life. 11 And not only [so], but we also joy in God through our Lord Jesus Christ, by whom we have now received the atonement.

We are justified by his blood and are reconciled.

[Rom 5:21 KJV] 21 That as sin hath reigned unto death, even so might grace reign through righteousness unto eternal life by Jesus Christ our Lord.
[Rom 6:23 KJV] 23 For the wages of sin [is] death; but the gift of God [is] eternal life through Jesus Christ our Lord.
[Tit 1:2 KJV] 2 In hope of eternal life, which God, that cannot lie, promised before the world began;
[Tit 3:7 KJV] 7 That being justified by his grace, we should be made heirs according to the hope of eternal life.

These verses promise eternal life and security.

Being justified can we freely sin?

[Rom 6:1-2 KJV] 1 What shall we say then? Shall we continue in sin, that grace may abound? 2 God forbid. How shall we, that are dead to sin, live any longer therein?

Paul gives answer to those who would say we are free to sin.

[Rom 6:6-7 KJV] 6 Knowing this, that our old man is crucified with [him], that the body of sin might be destroyed, that henceforth we should not serve sin. 7 For he that is dead is freed from sin.

We are to reckon we are dead to sin but alive to God.

[Rom 6:12, 14-15, 22 KJV] 12 Let not sin therefore reign in your mortal body, that ye should obey it in the lusts thereof. ... 14 For sin shall not have dominion over you: for ye are not under the law, but under grace. 15 What then? shall we sin, because we are not under the law, but under grace? God forbid. ... 22 But now being made free from sin, and become servants to God, ye have your fruit unto holiness, and the end everlasting life.

Above are more verses pertaining to sin.

[Tit 2:11-12 KJV] 11 For the grace of God that bringeth salvation hath appeared to all men, 12 Teaching us that, denying ungodliness and worldly lusts, we should live soberly, righteously, and godly, in this present world;

Finaly the above passage dispels the assertion that being justified eternally by grace promotes sin.

THIS IS ALL BASED ON A MISUNDERSTANDING of just what the world and the times are.

Contrary to the popular belief of many, we are not here, born into this world, to change our walk from sinful to righteous. We are not hear to become perfect-- That is not what the world is. The world is: What was (past tense) before the world was, made manifest. This is God insisting that we walk out our decision--just as Christ was slain before the foundation of the world, then walked it out in the flesh 40 days--we too are walking out our own salvation.

As such, to think that one can walk perfectly while remaining in the flesh--is not even biblical--for it is written, "there is only One."

Meaning, at best, we reach a point in walking out what was before the foundation of the world, where we passed from death to life, and finish our days and our walk humbly...as the admitted wounds upon the body of Christ that we are. Yes, that is better done by doing everything we can to make Christ look good. But we should not think for a minute that those wounds in His flesh that we are, simply disappear before we too ascend.

 

[TigersPaw]

THIS IS ALL BASED ON A MISUNDERSTANDING of just what the world and the times are.

Contrary to the popular belief of many, we are not here, born into this world, to change our walk from sinful to righteous.

Have you been in a Walmart Lately,? Sorry found humor in it.
But the point is a valid one.,

 

[Doug]

If Jesus is your Savior and you understand he dies for each and everyone of your sins shouldn't that make you not want to sin?Its not a free pass to sin repentance is required it sounds to me a person like that would be a lukewarm soul who really thinks nothing of Jesus.In revelation they are the worse kind of souls Jesus says I spit you out.A hot soul is close to God a cold soul can still be saved but nothing can be done for a lukewarm soul the person has to wake up.

We are to reckon ourselves dead to sin
We are to know that sin doesnt fit who we are in Christ
We are to value His sacrifice for us and live to please Him

 

[Ronald Nolette]

There is a lot of sentiment that refutes eternal security based on the belief that it propagates freely sinning.

Your thinking is of man and not God here. It is men who came up with that crazy doctrine and not Scripture.

Men can sin after they are saved, but we dhouldn't. But if we do 1 John 1:9 is for believers.

If we sin in rebellion, God will allow us to reap the wages of sin to teach us to hate sin.

Romans 6:1 is operatinve for believers.

We are not free to sin, we did that by nature, but now we are free to pursue God and lay aside the old ways and asdopt the new ways.

 

[Doug]

Your thinking is of man and not God here. It is men who came up with that crazy doctrine and not Scripture.

Men can sin after they are saved, but we dhouldn't. But if we do 1 John 1:9 is for believers.

If we sin in rebellion, God will allow us to reap the wages of sin to teach us to hate sin.

Romans 6:1 is operatinve for believers.

We are not free to sin, we did that by nature, but now we are free to pursue God and lay aside the old ways and asdopt the new ways.

In my post I never said we should sin

 

[Ronald Nolette]

In my post I never said we should sin

Then I apologize for my misunderstanding. I know we should not sin, but also we do because we still live in these bodies of sin and death and fall short from time to time.

 

[Doug]

Then I apologize for my misunderstanding. I know we should not sin, but also we do because we still live in these bodies of sin and death and fall short from time to time.

Exactly what I was saying

No need to apologize

 

[Behold]

DOES BELIEF THAT ONCE SAVED ALWAYS SAVED MEAN WE CAN SIN?

Reader,

Any time you have a "OSAS" type of Thread up and running....., you are going to find most of all..... Christians and the hyper religious.. who do not understand their Salvation, or do not have any Salvation.... coming to the Thread try to prove that the born again still have their sin.
In Fact if you have sin, then Jesus does not have your sin, and you are not saved yet, you are not forgiven yet, and you are not born again yet..

Its also a fact, that a Thread that is discussing a sinning Christian, is proving that the OP does not understand what it means to be Born again.

So, here is something you have to learn..... Hebrews 13:9........ and its something you receive as understand by revelation of the Holy Spirit.

Listen..
When you are told that you need to sin and confess and repeat, as someone like ronald nolette will tell you, then you understand that this person has no understanding of the Blood of Jesus, as the Blood Atonement. They do not understand "the finished work of Jesus on the Cross".

So, here is what you absolutey have to learn, if you are born again, or you will remain a Hebrews 6:1 baby Christian all your life., and never mature past it.

First, you have to LEARN, that your body and your mind, are not born again.... Its only your SPIRIT Man that has received the "BORN......again", Birth that is proof you have received God's "GIFT of Salvation".

So, once you get that 1st revelation, then what im going to tell you next, teach you, will become very obvious.

Now, the SON-Daughter of GOD, is the BORN. .again..., Spirit.........not your mind, and not your body, as your body is "dead because of Sin", and you'll get a new one.., and your mind has to be renewed... Paul teaches.

So, now understanding that your BORN AGAIN Spirit,= is the LITERAL "Son-Daughter" of God, who is "A Spirit"... then once you understand this, then the NT will begin to open for you, regarding many many places that ""didnt make sense before"".

Now, understanding that the BORN AGAIN Spirit, is the Child of God, is the LITERAL Son/Daughter of God, then we understand this..

A.) "The body that is dead because of sin" is going to be buried or cremated and your "old man of sin" is DEAD..."Crucified with Christ".

So, what is left is the REAL YOU... is the actual Eternal Child of God, the Eternal Son-Daughter of God...= its your Born again Spirit that is inside your body....Colossians 2:11 .. that has become BORN AGAIN...."In Christ".... as "one with God",.... and is "seated in Heavenly places"...right now.

Listen now.. carefully....

Your born again Spirit that is the Child of God......that will get a NEW BODY.........is this..

= '"" not under the LAW........but Under Grace"

And that means that every CHRISTian, exists here.....

= "Where there is no LAW........there is no TRANSGRESSION"...

Now that means that by YOU becoming Born again Spiritually.....= The Law never again, can define you, as a SINNER, or your deeds as sin.
Never again
And this is because .. """"Jesus is the ONE TIME.... ETERNAL .. Sacrifice for your sin"... so, that takes care of your sin, forever.

So, when Heretics try to tell you, that "NO, only your sin before you were saved is covered, not later sin".. then you show them the words...

"Jesus is the ONE TIME..... ETERNAL Sacrifice for sin"... = ETERNAL, ETERNAL Sacrifice for sin...and then ask them to get lost and stay lost.

Listen ....

And so... now, that you always exist where the LAW can't touch you, or define you, because you exit in the Kingdom of God were there is no Moses Law or Commandments....... you are now always "made free from sin"... having become "The righteousness of God in Christ".

That is who you are, forever, if you are Born.......again.

You are forever this one....

"As Jesus is....so are the born again.......in THIS World"..... = and Jesus has no Sin.

And one more..

Does this mean you will never want something that is not good for you, or does it mean that you wont do something that you should not do?
OF course not....as your MIND is not born again, so, its going to have to be trained by..."the renewing of your mind"... and that takes time.

Always remember...

There is no sin found "in Christ""..... and every born again CHRISTian, is "IN CHRIST""

Thre is no sin found as "one with God" and that is every Christian found, as "one with God".

There is no sin found in Heaven, and every Christian is "seated in Heavenly places, IN CHRIST".. right now. and always are you "IN CHRIST"..

Now, once you get this revelation of who you have become, as a born again Spirit, that is the "new Creation in Christ".. you are going to meet a lot of Christian who have no idea what they have become., and are not going to realize it, as they are cult trained and mind owned.
They are in their Carnal mind, and they are trying to perform for God, to try to keep what is already Eternal..
They are going to believe and tell you, that you have sin, and you have to confess it...

Ignore these Heretics, who are probably also a Calvinist.

So, just realize that once you understand who you have become "in Christ"..."born again Spiritually"... as the "new Creation"... most other Christians... will not understand what you now understand as the revelation of who you are become "in Christ".

 

[Taken]

@Behold….thank you.

God bless you.
Glory to God,

Taken

 

[MatthewG]

Hello to the original poster,

It’s a battle between the flesh and spirit every day.

“Now the works of the flesh are evident: sexual immorality, impurity, sensuality, idolatry, sorcery, enmity, strife, jealousy, fits of anger, rivalries, dissensions, divisions, envy, drunkenness, orgies, and things like these. I warn you, as I warned you before, that those who do such things will not inherit the kingdom of God. But the fruit of the Spirit is love, joy, peace, patience, kindness, goodness, faithfulness, gentleness, self-control; against such things there is no law. And those who belong to Christ Jesus have crucified the flesh with its passions and desires. If we live by the Spirit, let us also keep in step with the Spirit. Let us not become conceited, provoking one another, envying one another.”
‭‭Galatians‬ ‭5‬:‭19‬-‭26‬ ‭ESV‬‬

Galatians 5:19-26 Now the works of the flesh are evident: sexual immorality, impurity, sensuality, idolatry, sorcery, enmity, strife, jealousy, fits of anger, rivalries, dissensions, divisions, envy, drunkenness, orgie | English Standard Version 2016

Now the works of the flesh are evident: sexual immorality, impurity, sensuality, idolatry, sorcery, enmity, strife, jealousy, fits of anger, rivalries, dissensions, divisions, envy, drunkenness, orgie

bible.com

“For those who live according to the flesh set their minds on the things of the flesh, but those who live according to the Spirit set their minds on the things of the Spirit. For to set the mind on the flesh is death, but to set the mind on the Spirit is life and peace. For the mind that is set on the flesh is hostile to God, for it does not submit to God’s law; indeed, it cannot. Those who are in the flesh cannot please God. You, however, are not in the flesh but in the Spirit, if in fact the Spirit of God dwells in you. Anyone who does not have the Spirit of Christ does not belong to him. But if Christ is in you, although the body is dead because of sin, the Spirit is life because of righteousness. If the Spirit of him who raised Jesus from the dead dwells in you, he who raised Christ Jesus from the dead will also give life to your mortal bodies through his Spirit who dwells in you. So then, brothers, we are debtors, not to the flesh, to live according to the flesh. For if you live according to the flesh you will die, but if by the Spirit you put to death the deeds of the body, you will live. For all who are led by the Spirit of God are sons of God. For you did not receive the spirit of slavery to fall back into fear, but you have received the Spirit of adoption as sons, by whom we cry, “Abba! Father!” The Spirit himself bears witness with our spirit that we are children of God, and if children, then heirs—heirs of God and fellow heirs with Christ, provided we suffer with him in order that we may also be glorified with him.”
‭‭Romans‬ ‭8‬:‭5‬-‭17‬ ‭ESV‬‬

Romans 8:12 So then, brothers, we are debtors, not to the flesh, to live according to the flesh. | English Standard Version 2016 (ESV) | Download The Bible App Now

So then, brothers, we are debtors, not to the flesh, to live according to the flesh.

bible.com

 

[Ronald Nolette]

Reader,

Any time you have a "OSAS" type of Thread up and running....., you are going to find most of all..... Christians and the hyper religious.. who do not understand their Salvation, or do not have any Salvation.... coming to the Thread try to prove that the born again still have their sin.
In Fact if you have sin, then Jesus does not have your sin, and you are not saved yet, you are not forgiven yet, and you are not born again yet..

Its also a fact, that a Thread that is discussing a sinning Christian, is proving that the OP does not understand what it means to be Born again.

So, here is something you have to learn..... Hebrews 13:9........ and its something you receive as understand by revelation of the Holy Spirit.

Listen..
When you are told that you need to sin and confess and repeat, as someone like ronald nolette will tell you, then you understand that this person has no understanding of the Blood of Jesus, as the Blood Atonement. They do not understand "the finished work of Jesus on the Cross".

So, here is what you absolutey have to learn, if you are born again, or you will remain a Hebrews 6:1 baby Christian all your life., and never mature past it.

First, you have to LEARN, that your body and your mind, are not born again.... Its only your SPIRIT Man that has received the "BORN......again", Birth that is proof you have received God's "GIFT of Salvation".

So, once you get that 1st revelation, then what im going to tell you next, teach you, will become very obvious.

Now, the SON-Daughter of GOD, is the BORN. .again..., Spirit.........not your mind, and not your body, as your body is "dead because of Sin", and you'll get a new one.., and your mind has to be renewed... Paul teaches.

So, now understanding that your BORN AGAIN Spirit,= is the LITERAL "Son-Daughter" of God, who is "A Spirit"... then once you understand this, then the NT will begin to open for you, regarding many many places that ""didnt make sense before"".

Now, understanding that the BORN AGAIN Spirit, is the Child of God, is the LITERAL Son/Daughter of God, then we understand this..

A.) "The body that is dead because of sin" is going to be buried or cremated and your "old man of sin" is DEAD..."Crucified with Christ".

So, what is left is the REAL YOU... is the actual Eternal Child of God, the Eternal Son-Daughter of God...= its your Born again Spirit that is inside your body....Colossians 2:11 .. that has become BORN AGAIN...."In Christ".... as "one with God",.... and is "seated in Heavenly places"...right now.

Listen now.. carefully....

Your born again Spirit that is the Child of God......that will get a NEW BODY.........is this..

= '"" not under the LAW........but Under Grace"

And that means that every CHRISTian, exists here.....

= "Where there is no LAW........there is no TRANSGRESSION"...

Now that means that by YOU becoming Born again Spiritually.....= The Law never again, can define you, as a SINNER, or your deeds as sin.
Never again
And this is because .. """"Jesus is the ONE TIME.... ETERNAL .. Sacrifice for your sin"... so, that takes care of your sin, forever.

So, when Heretics try to tell you, that "NO, only your sin before you were saved is covered, not later sin".. then you show them the words...

"Jesus is the ONE TIME..... ETERNAL Sacrifice for sin"... = ETERNAL, ETERNAL Sacrifice for sin...and then ask them to get lost and stay lost.

Listen ....

And so... now, that you always exist where the LAW can't touch you, or define you, because you exit in the Kingdom of God were there is no Moses Law or Commandments....... you are now always "made free from sin"... having become "The righteousness of God in Christ".

That is who you are, forever, if you are Born.......again.

You are forever this one....

"As Jesus is....so are the born again.......in THIS World"..... = and Jesus has no Sin.

And one more..

Does this mean you will never want something that is not good for you, or does it mean that you wont do something that you should not do?
OF course not....as your MIND is not born again, so, its going to have to be trained by..."the renewing of your mind"... and that takes time.

Always remember...

There is no sin found "in Christ""..... and every born again CHRISTian, is "IN CHRIST""

Thre is no sin found as "one with God" and that is every Christian found, as "one with God".

There is no sin found in Heaven, and every Christian is "seated in Heavenly places, IN CHRIST".. right now. and always are you "IN CHRIST"..

Now, once you get this revelation of who you have become, as a born again Spirit, that is the "new Creation in Christ".. you are going to meet a lot of Christian who have no idea what they have become., and are not going to realize it, as they are cult trained and mind owned.
They are in their Carnal mind, and they are trying to perform for God, to try to keep what is already Eternal..
They are going to believe and tell you, that you have sin, and you have to confess it...

Ignore these Heretics, who are probably also a Calvinist.

So, just realize that once you understand who you have become "in Christ"..."born again Spiritually"... as the "new Creation"... most other Christians... will not understand what you now understand as the revelation of who you are become "in Christ".

Well, a beliver in christ cannot sin. However the flesh though declared dead by God is still alove. Paul made this very clear and at times true believers either through ignorance, weakness or being rebellious, will live in the flesh and sin.

to say once a person is born again they cannot sin, is a lie from hell.

 

[Behold]

However the flesh though declared dead by God is still alove. Paul made this very clear and at times true believers either through ignorance, weakness or being rebellious, will live in the flesh and sin.

First you state that a Christian in Christ cannot sin,......... and then you change that into they can still "live in the flesh and sin"..

So, you had it right and then you got it wrong, again.

Listen...

"the OLD MAN of sin, is DEAD".. and Paul told YOU to "reckon it dead" .. ..not teach that its alive and sins..

Just try to understand... that there is no sin found "IN Christ", and no sin found "In GOD">.

A.) = Every Christian is "IN CHRIST".. and "ONE WITH GOD">. ."made free from sin".

Where you are not understanding your salvation....is here... = "not under the Law, but under Grace".

See that?
That means that the born again exist......here...>>"where there is no LAW, there is no SIN".....

That does not mean you wont have some issues with your own behavior.......it means that there is no LAW over you, that can define you as anything, anymore.

See, "SIN" is defined by the LAW and Commandments.. and those are the same.....regarding their Dominion over the unbeliever.

And once the person becomes born again..... then "Grace and Truth, came by Jesus" and that is what we have in place of.. "the law came by moses".

We the born again, are """""not under the law, we are under Grace""""", .. and there is no LAW found there... that can define us as sinners, ever again.

This is why 2 Corin says that "God was in Christ NOT COUNTING SINS".. .against us, and Romans 4:8, says the same thing.

 

[Ronald Nolette]

First you state that a Christian in Christ cannot sin,......... and then you change that into they can still "live in the flesh and sin"..

So, you had it right and then you got it wrong, again.

Listen...

"the OLD MAN of sin, is DEAD".. and Paul told YOU to "reckon it dead" .. ..not teach that its alive and sins..

Just try to understand... that there is no sin found "IN Christ", and no sin found "In GOD">.

A.) = Every Christian is "IN CHRIST".. and "ONE WITH GOD">. ."made free from sin".

Where you are not understanding your salvation....is here... = "not under the Law, but under Grace".

See that?
That means that the born again exist......here...>>"where there is no LAW, there is no SIN".....

That does not mean you wont have some issues with your own behavior.......it means that there is no LAW over you, that can define you as anything, anymore.

See, "SIN" is defined by the LAW and Commandments.. and those are the same.....regarding their Dominion over the unbeliever.

And once the person becomes born again..... then "Grace and Truth, came by Jesus" and that is what we have in place of.. "the law came by moses".

We the born again, are """""not under the law, we are under Grace""""", .. and there is no LAW found there... that can define us as sinners, ever again.

This is why 2 Corin says that "God was in Christ NOT COUNTING SINS".. .against us, and Romans 4:8, says the same thing.

What you do not understand is what some call position and experience.

Our position is that we are in Christ. but the flesh is still alive and makes demands on teh souldof man. When we walk in the spirit we do not fulfill the lusts of the flesh and we experience our position.

But a believer can walk in the flesh. That is why Jesus purchased mercy and grace for us. He knows we remain frail even with the spirit.

This is not a license to sin. I know you convinced yourself you live a sinless life, but you rpostings betray you.