Another Premillennial absurdity

[Truth7t7]

More mantra.

If you have something new for me to respond to, I'll be glad to.

Or if you ever have a response with correction to my words, and what is taught by them.

You continue to create "Multiple" threads on the same subject "Why"

When your claims are proven wrong, you just create a new thread on the same topic, "Weak"

Jesus Is The Lord

 

[Truth7t7]

Revelation 20 takes us back to Christ's victory over sin and death at the first resurrection and depicts the enlightenment of the Gentiles.

"I Disagree" with reformed preterist eschatology on its interpretation of "First Resurrection" as it claims this represents "Jesus Christ" being the "First Resurrected"?

Scripture clearly teaches when the Non-Literal 1,000 years are "Finished" the "First Resurrection" takes place, "Future" at the second coming, when all that are in the Graves will come forth to the "Final Judgement"

The context of Revelation 20:11-15 explains the resurrections seen, that takes place at the time of "Final Judgement" (The End)

Conclusion: Reformed Preterist Eschatology's Interpretation of "First Resurrection" seen in Revelation 20:5-6 below being Jesus Christ thousands of years ago is "False"

There are "Two Resurrections" seen below "Two"

1.) First Resurrecttion, The Righteous

2.) The Second Death, The Wicked

Revelation 20:5-6KJV
5 But the rest of the dead lived not again until the thousand years were finished. This is the first resurrection.
6 Blessed and holy is he that hath part in the first resurrection: on such the second death hath no power, but they shall be priests of God and of Christ, and shall reign with him a thousand years.

 

[Truth7t7]

That is true.
It's a coming physical Millennial Kingdom. We are spiritually in Christ, in the Kingdom of Heaven.
We pray for "thy kingdom come on earth as it is in heaven".

Ron Pre-Millennialism's Foundation for its claim of a "Thousand Year" Kingdom on this earth is based in Revelation 20:1-6 below

Ron you didn't answer my claims below, no Kingdom on this earth with Mortal Humans present is seen below and you know it, as you run from this factual truth "Why"?

Revelation 20:1-6 Isnt A Millennial Kingdom On This Earth, Dont Be Deceived​

Can you find the things claimed by those teaching a Literal 1,000 year Millennial Kingdom On This Earth in Revelation 20:1-6 below?

1.) Physical Earthly Kingdom?
2.) Physical Earthly Throne?
3.) Physical Mortal Humans?

The Above Claims (Don't Exist)

Revelation 20:1-6 Is 100% In The Lords (Spiritual) Angel, Heaven, Devil, Satan, The Souls, The Dead, God, Christ

100% Spiritual Realm, No "Literal" Time

2 Peter 3:8KJV
8 But, beloved, be not ignorant of this one thing, that one day is with the Lord as a thousand years, and a thousand years as one day.

Revelation 20:1-6KJV
1 And I saw an angel come down from heaven, having the key of the bottomless pit and a great chain in his hand.
2 And he laid hold on the dragon, that old serpent, which is the Devil, and Satan, and bound him a thousand years,
3 And cast him into the bottomless pit, and shut him up, and set a seal upon him, that he should deceive the nations no more, till the thousand years should be fulfilled: and after that he must be loosed a little season.
4 And I saw thrones, and they sat upon them, and judgment was given unto them: and I saw the souls of them that were beheaded for the witness of Jesus, and for the word of God, and which had not worshipped the beast, neither his image, neither had received his mark upon their foreheads, or in their hands; and they lived and reigned with Christ a thousand years.
5 But the rest of the dead lived not again until the thousand years were finished. This is the first resurrection.
6 Blessed and holy is he that hath part in the first resurrection: on such the second death hath no power, but they shall be priests of God and of Christ, and shall reign with him a thousand years.

 

[Truth7t7]

You are full of imaginations. The earth Amils anticipate is starkly different from the Premil version that is full of the bondage of corruption and ultimately overrun by the wicked in the end. The Amil age is glorious perfect and eternal.

The very term (Amil) means there is no literal 1,000 years

It appears you need to grasp the fact "Thousand Years" in Revelation 20:4-6 is doing nothing more than explaining (The Lord's Eternal Spiritual Realm) where One Day Is A "Thousand Years" "No Literal Time"

Today in a world of inflation and big numbers, the interpretation could be seen as a "Trillion Years" Non-Literal

2 Peter 3:8KJV
8 But, beloved, be not ignorant of this one thing, that one day is with the Lord as a thousand years, and a thousand years as one day.

 

[rwb]

"I Disagree" with reformed preterist eschatology on its interpretation of "First Resurrection" as it claims this represents "Jesus Christ" being the "First Resurrected"?

Scripture clearly teaches when the Non-Literal 1,000 years are "Finished" the "First Resurrection" takes place, "Future" at the second coming, when all that are in the Graves will come forth to the "Final Judgement"

The context of Revelation 20:11-15 explains the resurrections seen, that takes place at the time of "Final Judgement" (The End)

Do you agree the non-literal thousand years equates to time? If you believe it does, when do you believe this non-literal thousand years shall begin and end?

 

[Truth7t7]

Do you agree the non-literal thousand years equates to time? If you believe it does, when do you believe this non-literal thousand years shall begin and end?

Your answer is in post #1305 above

 

[rwb]

Your answer is in post #1305 above

Reply #1305 "The very term (Amil) means there is no literal 1,000 years

It appears you need to grasp the fact "Thousand Years" in Revelation 20:4-6 is doing nothing more than explaining (The Lord's Eternal Spiritual Realm) where One Day Is A "Thousand Years" "No Literal Time"

Today in a world of inflation and big numbers, the interpretation could be seen as a "Trillion Years" Non-Literal

2 Peter 3:8KJV
8 But, beloved, be not ignorant of this one thing, that one day is with the Lord as a thousand years, and a thousand years as one day."

This reply really doesn't answer my questions: Do you agree the non-literal thousand years equates to time? If you believe it does, when do you believe this non-literal thousand years shall begin and end?

Amil doesn't deny a thousand years found in Scripture. We view a thousand years as time given this earth with Satan bound, while the Gospel is sent unto all the nations of the earth in the power of the Spirit for building the Kingdom in this time. IOW both Satan's timing and the proclaiming of the Gospel to the nations of the earth are limited to a certain amount of time, which a thousand years equates to. Do you not agree with this?

 

[Truth7t7]

Reply #1305 "The very term (Amil) means there is no literal 1,000 years

It appears you need to grasp the fact "Thousand Years" in Revelation 20:4-6 is doing nothing more than explaining (The Lord's Eternal Spiritual Realm) where One Day Is A "Thousand Years" "No Literal Time"

Today in a world of inflation and big numbers, the interpretation could be seen as a "Trillion Years" Non-Literal

2 Peter 3:8KJV
8 But, beloved, be not ignorant of this one thing, that one day is with the Lord as a thousand years, and a thousand years as one day."

This reply really doesn't answer my questions: Do you agree the non-literal thousand years equates to time? If you believe it does, when do you believe this non-literal thousand years shall begin and end?

Amil doesn't deny a thousand years found in Scripture. We view a thousand years as time given this earth with Satan bound, while the Gospel is sent unto all the nations of the earth in the power of the Spirit for building the Kingdom in this time. IOW both Satan's timing and the proclaiming of the Gospel to the nations of the earth are limited to a certain amount of time, which a thousand years equates to. Do you not agree with this?

As was clearly shown "Thousand Years" is non-literal and does nothing more than show the Lord's eternal spiritual realm of one day is a thousand years, not literal earthly time

I have already shown you that Satan is currently bound from "Deceiving The Nation's To Battle" shall I repost it for you again?

I don't follow reformed preterist eschatology, possibly you haven't figured that out yet, smiles!

Jesus Is The Lord

 

[robert derrick]

The difficulty with engaging with you is that you do not have a clue what Amils believe.

I know what you believe, though not all. I still wait for something new from you to respond to.

We have to explain the elementary basics to you on every topic. You should actually start listening before running your mouth off as some pseudo expert on Amil.

My expertise is on what you teach. Your refusal to even understand my responses shows your own insecurity in what you teach.

If you think Rev 20 is portraying a perfect earth devoid of the bondage of corruption

And your continual mistating of what I teach proves your refusal to understand it.

I don't mistate what you teach, otherwise, you would correct my words. I simply strip all teaching of fluff and scholarly words, including my own, to reveal the bare bones.

Many people don't like seeing the teaching stripped bare as it is.

You reject Christ's earthly reign on earth.
All Scripture speaking of it, is either made symbol only by you, or is transferred to the new earth.
You say the new earth is the old earth renewed, so that you can say prophecies of the Lord's earthly reign still apply, but only on the newly refurbished old earth.
You say the resurrection in Rev 20 is only spiritual and ongoing, and say nothing of them being those beheaded and killed for the testimony of Christ.
You say the devil is now shut up, and say nothing of how that means he does not tempt anyone on earth today.
You say the second coming of the Lord Jesus Christ to earth, is as the fire of God to burn all flesh and scorch the earth.
You say the Lord comes again a second time to end the earth, and say nothing of them that will be taken and them that will be left after His return.
You say the judgment of the sheep and goats is only of believers, and unbelievers, and say nothing of how neither of those sheep nor goats knew why nor how they were being judged, showing how ignorant they are of the word and righteousness of God.
You say the resurrection of the rest of the dead is of all the wicked only, and say nothing of the Lamb's book of Life there to show who is written therein or not.
You say the new earth and nations thereon are eternally perfect, and say nothing of the healing leaves of the tree of life for those nations. As well as saying nothing of the gates of the city, not allowing any unrepentant evil-doers to pass through into the city, in order to eat of those leaves.

If I've got anything wrong, then tell me. Also if you have anything new to add, I'd like to hear it.

 

[rwb]

As was clearly shown "Thousand Years" is non-literal and does nothing more than show the Lord's eternal spiritual realm of one day is a thousand years, not literal earthly time

I have already shown you that Satan is currently bound from "Deceiving The Nation's To Battle" shall I repost it for you again?

I don't follow reformed preterist eschatology, possibly you haven't figured that out yet, smiles!

Jesus Is The Lord

I don't get what you mean by reformed preterist eschatology? What do you mean by the Lord's eternal spiritual realm of time, which both one day and a thousand years equate to? How is time given earth spiritual?

 

[Truth7t7]

You say the second coming of the Lord Jesus Christ to earth, is as the fire of God to burn all flesh and scorch the earth.
You say the Lord comes again a second time to end the earth, and say nothing of them that will be taken and them that will be left after His return.

Scripture states absolutely nothing about mortal humans being left upon this earth "After" the second coming as you claim

The Lord returns in fire and final judgment dissolving this earth by fire "The End"

 

[Truth7t7]

I don't get what you mean by reformed preterist eschatology? What do you mean by the Lord's eternal spiritual realm of time, which both one day and a thousand years equate to? How is time given earth spiritual?

Reformed Preterist Eschatology, is found within reformed circles, Presbyterian, Lutheran, Dutch Reformed, etc

Their standard eschatology sees preterust 70AD fulfillment in Jerusalems destruction

Jesus Christ is outside of earthly time, he is in the eternal spiritual, where time doesn't exist, one day is a thousand years

I have bent over backwards in a very clear description of my belief, I hopeand pray you understand

Jesus Is The Lord

 

[rwb]

Reformed Preterist Eschatology, is found within reformed circles, Presbyterian, Lutheran, Dutch Reformed, etc

Their standard eschatology sees preterust 70AD fulfillment in Jerusalems destruction

Jesus Christ is outside of earthly time, he is in the eternal spiritual, where time doesn't exist, one day is a thousand years

I have bent over backwards in a very clear description of my belief, I hopeand pray you understand

Jesus Is The Lord

I know what Full Preterism and Partial Preterism teaches. What I question is what you call Reformed Preterist Eschatology, and link to Amillennialism? Perhaps it's because you view a thousand years as symbolically representing the Lord's eternal spiritual realm??? How can time exist in the eternal spiritual realm of God? Time has a beginning and an end, but eternal means perpetual and everlasting from the beginning. That's why the life we have in Christ when we are born again from above is said to be eternal, because from the time our life in Christ begins it shall never end.

 

[Truth7t7]

I know what Full Preterism and Partial Preterism teaches. What I question is what you call Reformed Preterist Eschatology, and link to Amillennialism? Perhaps it's because you view a thousand years as symbolically representing the Lord's eternal spiritual realm??? How can time exist in the eternal spiritual realm of God? Time has a beginning and an end, but eternal means perpetual and everlasting from the beginning. That's why the life we have in Christ when we are born again from above is said to be eternal, because from the time our life in Christ begins it shall never end.

No earthly time exist's in God's eternal realm,, one day Is a thousand years is a symbolic expression of God's eternal

Earthly time began at the creation when God named "The First Day"

Earthly time will cease at the second coming at the 7th Trump, when there will be "Time No Longer" eternity!

(Earthly Time Begins)

Genesis 1:5KJV
5 And God called the light Day, and the darkness he called Night. And the evening and the morning were the first day.

 (Earthly Time Ceases)

Revelation 10:5-7KJV
5 And the angel which I saw stand upon the sea and upon the earth lifted up his hand to heaven,
6 And sware by him that liveth for ever and ever, who created heaven, and the things that therein are, and the earth, and the things that therein are, and the sea, and the things which are therein, that there should be time no longer:
7 But in the days of the voice of the seventh angel, when he shall begin to sound, the mystery of God should be finished, as he hath declared to his servants the prophets.

 

[rwb]

No earthly time exist's in God's eternal realm,, one day Is a thousand years is a symbolic expression of God's eternal

Earthly time began at the creation when God named "The First Day"

Earthly time will cease at the second coming at the 7th Trump, when there will be "Time No Longer" eternity!

(Earthly Time Begins)

Genesis 1:5KJV
5 And God called the light Day, and the darkness he called Night. And the evening and the morning were the first day.

 (Earthly Time Ceases)

Revelation 10:5-7KJV
5 And the angel which I saw stand upon the sea and upon the earth lifted up his hand to heaven,
6 And sware by him that liveth for ever and ever, who created heaven, and the things that therein are, and the earth, and the things that therein are, and the sea, and the things which are therein, that there should be time no longer:
7 But in the days of the voice of the seventh angel, when he shall begin to sound, the mystery of God should be finished, as he hath declared to his servants the prophets.

Should I assume you don't have an answer for why you link Amillennialism with what you call Reformed Preterist Eschatology? I see no logic in this reply. We live in time, which is what a thousand years and one day are. Spiritual eternal life begins within believers when we are born again from above. But physically we live in time, symbolized a thousand years and will not physically live outside of time until we leave this earth at death. Once time is no more, we will physically live with Christ, not in time, but through eternity which has no end, because there is not time on the new earth. So when you say, "one day Is a thousand years is a symbolic expression of God's eternal" it makes no sense to me and is without logic...sorry.

There is much we agree about doctrine, perhaps we should focus on those things.

 

[Truth7t7]

Should I assume you don't have an answer for why you link Amillennialism with what you call Reformed Preterist Eschatology? I see no logic in this reply. We live in time, which is what a thousand years and one day are. Spiritual eternal life begins within believers when we are born again from above. But physically we live in time, symbolized a thousand years and will not physically live outside of time until we leave this earth at death. Once time is no more, we will physically live with Christ, not in time, but through eternity which has no end, because there is not time on the new earth. So when you say, "one day Is a thousand years is a symbolic expression of God's eternal" it makes no sense to me and is without logic...sorry.

There is much we agree about doctrine, perhaps we should focus on those things.

Revelation 20:4-6 and the words "Thousand Years" is doing nothing more than explaining to the human reader that God doesn't have a clock on the wall, his eternal spiritual realm where he now sits is outside of time

There isn't a Kingdom on earth seen in Revelation 20:4-6, it's 100% in the Lord's spiritual realm of "No Time" where one day is a thousand years

We Disagree

2 Peter 3:8KJV
8 But, beloved, be not ignorant of this one thing, that one day is with the Lord as a thousand years, and a thousand years as one day.

Revelation 20:1-6 Isnt A Millennial Kingdom On This Earth, Dont Be Deceived​

Can you find the things claimed by those teaching a Literal 1,000 year Millennial Kingdom On This Earth in Revelation 20:1-6 below?

1.) Physical Earthly Kingdom?
2.) Physical Earthly Throne?
3.) Physical Mortal Humans?

The Above Claims (Don't Exist)

Revelation 20:1-6 Is 100% In The Lords (Spiritual) Angel, Heaven, Devil, Satan, The Souls, The Dead, God, Christ

100% Spiritual Realm, No "Literal" Time

2 Peter 3:8KJV
8 But, beloved, be not ignorant of this one thing, that one day is with the Lord as a thousand years, and a thousand years as one day.

Revelation 20:1-6KJV
1 And I saw an angel come down from heaven, having the key of the bottomless pit and a great chain in his hand.
2 And he laid hold on the dragon, that old serpent, which is the Devil, and Satan, and bound him a thousand years,
3 And cast him into the bottomless pit, and shut him up, and set a seal upon him, that he should deceive the nations no more, till the thousand years should be fulfilled: and after that he must be loosed a little season.
4 And I saw thrones, and they sat upon them, and judgment was given unto them: and I saw the souls of them that were beheaded for the witness of Jesus, and for the word of God, and which had not worshipped the beast, neither his image, neither had received his mark upon their foreheads, or in their hands; and they lived and reigned with Christ a thousand years.
5 But the rest of the dead lived not again until the thousand years were finished. This is the first resurrection.
6 Blessed and holy is he that hath part in the first resurrection: on such the second death hath no power, but they shall be priests of God and of Christ, and shall reign with him a thousand years.

 

[robert derrick]

When you discuss scripture in forums "Please" post the

1. Book
2. Chapter
3. Verse(s)
4. Version

I will respond after you make this courtesy correction, thanks!

Sorry. Don't have time. When dealing with long studied people such as yourself, if you don't already know the Scripture, then you certainly know how to 'search engine' it.

Besides, they speak for themselves, and so do my teachings of them. You can look them up to refresh your context if you want.

You're not stalling are you? Not necessary. Take all the time you like.

 

[Timtofly]

Do you agree the non-literal thousand years equates to time? If you believe it does, when do you believe this non-literal thousand years shall begin and end?

Many Amil believe it is finite time. It is the × amount of time between the first century and the next Millennium. The next Millennium is called the Day of the Lord.

 

[robert derrick]

Scripture states absolutely nothing about mortal humans being left upon this earth "After" the second coming as you claim

The Lord returns in fire and final judgment dissolving this earth by fire "The End"

I've given the scriptures that do.

You don't take the meaning of the words plainly, because you symbolize away the plain meaning of Scripture too much.

It becomes a sloppy habit.

 

[Truth7t7]

Sorry. Don't have time. When dealing with long studied people such as yourself, if you don't already know the Scripture, then you certainly know how to 'search engine' it.

Besides, they speak for themselves, and so do my teachings of them. You can look them up to refresh your context if you want.

You're not stalling are you? Not necessary. Take all the time you like.

It's common courtesy in forum discussion

When you discuss scripture in forums "Please" post the

1. Book
2. Chapter
3. Verse(s)
4. Version