Limited atonement !

[Lizbeth]

Christs death was limited to them He actually redeemed Titus 2:14

14 who gave himself for us, that he might redeem us from all iniquity, and purify unto himself a peculiar people, zealous of good works.

The giving of Himself speaks of His death, and specifically says "for us", who are they? Why it's all that are redeemed from iniquity, and purified unto himself, who constitute a peculiar people, zealous of good works. 17

Only in a manner of speaking, from His point of view, having foreknowledge. It says we are "elect according to the foreknowledge of God". We need ears to ear what the SPIRIT is saying......reading scripture isn't like reading a novel or textbook, we need to read it or meditate on it "prayerfully", ie, in the spirit, while looking to Him for the understanding.

Oh well, in the end, we know who Jesus said He reveals things to and who things are hid from.

 

[brightfame52]

Only in a manner of speaking, from His point of view, having foreknowledge. It says we are "elect according to the foreknowledge of God". We need ears to ear what the SPIRIT is saying......reading scripture isn't like reading a novel or textbook, we need to read it or meditate on it "prayerfully", ie, in the spirit, while looking to Him for the understanding.

Oh well, in the end, we know who Jesus said He reveals things to and who things are hid from.

You promote Error, His death actually redeemed themHe died for from all iniquity Titus 2:14

14 Who gave himself for us, that he might redeem us from all iniquity, and purify unto himself a peculiar people, zealous of good works.

 

[Lizbeth]

ok let's try it again. For by Grace (you don't deserve it), you have been saved through Faith (in Jesus Christ) and that not of yourselves, it is a gift of God (faith in Jesus Christ), not of works (something you do), lest anyone should boast (saying you had something to do with your salvation).

Faith is the gift God gives you, you didn't do it, God did.

Of course....I agree! And He gives it to those who simply by grace are willing and open to receive it. Receiving is not an active thing is it.....it is passive, not something we DO but something we only ALLOW, if we will....ALLOW the Lord to have His way. That is what it means to rest in Him, to enter His rest, to be at rest, not resisting, and not trying to do anything on our own. Be STILL and know that He is God.

 

[Eternally Grateful]

If Gods love is limited.. Then God is not a God of love.

He can expect another rebellion in the future.. Because he has not shut down the lie of the evil one

 

[Lizbeth]

You promote Error, His death actually redeemed themHe died for from all iniquity Titus 2:14

14 Who gave himself for us, that he might redeem us from all iniquity, and purify unto himself a peculiar people, zealous of good works.

Yes of course. I was responding to this statement: "Christ's death was limited to them He actually redeemed".

 

[brightfame52]

Yes of course. I was responding to this statement: "Christ's death was limited to them He actually redeemed".

Yes, so He didnt die for the unredeemed segment of the world

 

[Rockerduck]

Of course....I agree! And He gives it to those who simply by grace are willing and open to receive it. Receiving is not an active thing is it.....it is passive, not something we DO but something we only ALLOW, if we will....ALLOW the Lord to have His way. That is what it means to rest in Him, to enter His rest, to be at rest, not resisting, and not trying to do anything on our own. Be STILL and know that He is God.

Not so, "we" can do nothing, "we" cannot 'allow". That is works, where 'we" have to do something. God's will be done on earth as it is in Heaven. God draws you to Him, that's it, your soul will yearn to be close to that and submit to His will who called you. Nothing in the flesh at all you can do. God has sovereign control over all aspects of your salvation. After submitting to His will, then you can enter His rest in Jesus Christ, who is our rest.

 

[Hey You!]

Scripture can’t give us faith, faith is a gift from God, a supernatural divine Living gift....Born Again of imperishable/ incorruptible seed.....a Living seed...

What do you think the Gospel is, if not Scripture?

The word of God is Living and Active...


Here's a Gospel Tract using only Verses...

 

[Hey You!]

What do you think the Gospel is, if not Scripture?

The word of God is Living and Active...


Here's a Gospel Tract using only Verses...

Scripture Alone ~ by ReverendRV * September 17

Genesis 1:1 KJV; In the beginning God created the heaven and the earth.

Through Faith we understand that the worlds were framed by the Word of God, so that things which are seen were not made of things which do appear. In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God. And God said, “Let us make man in our image, after our likeness”. So God created Man in his own image, in the image of God created him; male and female created he them. And the LORD God commanded the man, saying, Of every tree of the Garden thou may freely eat; but of the Tree of the knowledge of Good and Evil, thou shalt not eat of it: for in the day that thou eat thereof thou shalt surely die. When the woman saw that the tree was good for food, and that it was pleasant to the eyes, a tree to be desired to make them wise, she took of the fruit thereof, and did eat, and gave also to her husband with her; and he ate it. At once they saw what they had done, and they realized they were naked. Then they sewed fig leaves together to cover themselves. ~ For the wages of Sin is Death…

All that is in the world, the lust of the flesh, and the lust of the eyes, and the pride of life, is not of the Father but is of the world. ~ Now when Jesus saw the crowds, he went up on a mountainside and sat down. His disciples came to him and he began to teach them. He said: "You’ve heard the Commandment that says, 'You must not commit adultery.' but I say, anyone who even looks at a woman with lust has already committed adultery with her in his heart. You have heard that it was said to those of old, ‘You shall not murder; and whoever murders will be liable to judgment.’ But I tell you that anyone who is angry with a brother or sister will be subject to judgment. Again, anyone who says to a brother or sister, 'Raca,' is answerable to the court. Anyone who says, 'You fool!' will be in danger of the fire of hell.” ~ For whoever keeps the whole Law and yet stumbles at just one point is guilty of breaking all of it…

The wages of Sin is death; but the gift of God is eternal Life! ~ For God so loved the world that he gave his only begotten Son, that whosoever believes in him shall not perish but have everlasting Life. The Word became flesh and dwelt among us, and we have seen his glory; Grace and peace to you from God our Father and the Lord Jesus Christ in whom we have redemption, the forgiveness of sins. For by Grace you are Saved through Faith, and this not of yourselves; it is the gift of God, not by Works so that no one can boast. If you confess with your mouth that Jesus is Lord and believe in your heart that God raised him from the dead, you will be saved. ~ I’ve passed on to you what is most important and what had also been passed on to me. Christ died for our Sins, just as the Scriptures said. He was buried, and he was raised from the dead on the third day, just as the Scriptures said. The Lord will rescue us from every evil deed and will bring us safely to his Heavenly kingdom. To him be glory for ever and ever. Amen…

Revelation 22:20-21 KJV; He which testifieth these things saith, Surely I come quickly. Amen. Even so, come, Lord Jesus. The grace of our Lord Jesus Christ be with you all. Amen.

 

[Rockerduck]

Scripture Alone ~ by ReverendRV * September 17

Genesis 1:1 KJV; In the beginning God created the heaven and the earth.

Through Faith we understand that the worlds were framed by the Word of God, so that things which are seen were not made of things which do appear. In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God. And God said, “Let us make man in our image, after our likeness”. So God created Man in his own image, in the image of God created him; male and female created he them. And the LORD God commanded the man, saying, Of every tree of the Garden thou may freely eat; but of the Tree of the knowledge of Good and Evil, thou shalt not eat of it: for in the day that thou eat thereof thou shalt surely die. When the woman saw that the tree was good for food, and that it was pleasant to the eyes, a tree to be desired to make them wise, she took of the fruit thereof, and did eat, and gave also to her husband with her; and he ate it. At once they saw what they had done, and they realized they were naked. Then they sewed fig leaves together to cover themselves. ~ For the wages of Sin is Death…

All that is in the world, the lust of the flesh, and the lust of the eyes, and the pride of life, is not of the Father but is of the world. ~ Now when Jesus saw the crowds, he went up on a mountainside and sat down. His disciples came to him and he began to teach them. He said: "You’ve heard the Commandment that says, 'You must not commit adultery.' but I say, anyone who even looks at a woman with lust has already committed adultery with her in his heart. You have heard that it was said to those of old, ‘You shall not murder; and whoever murders will be liable to judgment.’ But I tell you that anyone who is angry with a brother or sister will be subject to judgment. Again, anyone who says to a brother or sister, 'Raca,' is answerable to the court. Anyone who says, 'You fool!' will be in danger of the fire of hell.” ~ For whoever keeps the whole Law and yet stumbles at just one point is guilty of breaking all of it…

The wages of Sin is death; but the gift of God is eternal Life! ~ For God so loved the world that he gave his only begotten Son, that whosoever believes in him shall not perish but have everlasting Life. The Word became flesh and dwelt among us, and we have seen his glory; Grace and peace to you from God our Father and the Lord Jesus Christ in whom we have redemption, the forgiveness of sins. For by Grace you are Saved through Faith, and this not of yourselves; it is the gift of God, not by Works so that no one can boast. If you confess with your mouth that Jesus is Lord and believe in your heart that God raised him from the dead, you will be saved. ~ I’ve passed on to you what is most important and what had also been passed on to me. Christ died for our Sins, just as the Scriptures said. He was buried, and he was raised from the dead on the third day, just as the Scriptures said. The Lord will rescue us from every evil deed and will bring us safely to his Heavenly kingdom. To him be glory for ever and ever. Amen…

Revelation 22:20-21 KJV; He which testifieth these things saith, Surely I come quickly. Amen. Even so, come, Lord Jesus. The grace of our Lord Jesus Christ be with you all. Amen.

Nice tract. Just to be sure you understand faith. It is the gift of God to have faith in Jesus Christ. It is not your faith, but the faith God gave you in Jesus Christ. I have faith in God through our savior Jesus Christ, by Grace.

 

[Runningman]

The scriptures are related, those who were chosen in Christ are also the seed of abraham Gal 3:29

29 And if ye be Christ's, then are ye Abraham's seed, and heirs according to the promise.

Faith is only for Gods elect Titus 1:1

Paul, a servant of God, and an apostle of Jesus Christ, according to the faith of God's elect, and the acknowledging of the truth which is after godliness;

Only the Chosen in Christ, which are His seed and Abrahams spiritual seed are given faith, and they only did Christ die for Heb 2:16-17


16 For verily he took not on him the nature of angels; but he took on him the seed of Abraham.

17 Wherefore in all things it behoved him to be made like unto his brethren, that he might be a merciful and faithful high priest in things pertaining to God, to make reconciliation for the sins of the people.

All humanity isnt the seed of Abraham, only an elect portion

And then after that there is no mention of anyone mentioning limited atonement. You got the cart is front of the horse; you still have not even shown an example of anyone saying or describing limited atonement as a valid path to salvation. You have not addressed all of the alternatives.

 

[Runningman]

ok let's try it again. For by Grace (you don't deserve it), you have been saved through Faith (in Jesus Christ) and that not of yourselves, it is a gift of God (faith in Jesus Christ), not of works (something you do), lest anyone should boast (saying you had something to do with your salvation).

Faith is the gift God gives you, you didn't do it, God did.

Whoever said grace is something that is unmerited? Grace is earned according to the Bible, hence why one can do something to fall from grace.

God doesn't make people sin does He?

Galatians 5
4You who are trying to be justified by the law have been severed from Christ; you have fallen away from grace.

 

[Runningman]

Yes. If a great number of Christians worldwide believe it why not. However, it is not a determination of eternal life through Jesus Christ.
Revelations 17:8 - The beast that you saw was, and is not, and will ascend out of the bottomless pit and go to perdition. And those who dwell on the earth will marvel, whose names are not written in the Book of Life from the foundation of the world, when they see the beast that was, and is not, and yet is.

See, The Book of Life from the foundation of the world has been written with the names of all the Chosen.

Jesus didn't think high numbers are significant:

Mattt 7
14For the gate is narrow and the way is hard that leads to life, and those who find it are few.

 

[Ritajanice]

What do you think the Gospel is, if not Scripture?

The gospel does not birth our spirit and NO scripture is not the gospel.....Jesus spread the good news..do you understand that Jesus was Alive on earth and that God sent him to spread the good news?.the Bible confirms this..the Bible also confirms how we are Born Of The Spirit/ Born Again of imperishable seed.


Did the Bible birth your spirit?

Did the Bible pour the Love Of God into your heart, when it was birthed?

Did the Bible give you a new heart and spirit within?

The word of God is Living and Active...

The Bible is NOT Alive and Active in Spirit, it confirms that Gods Spirit is Alive and Active....where does the Living Spirit indwell us?

Here's a Gospel Tract using only Verses...

The Living God is a Spirit, he is not a Bible.....does your spirit know that God is a Living Spirit?

The gospel never gave birth to my spirit, the Living seed of God did that, His Living testimony, the Living Spirit, ....does your spirit know that it’s Born Again?

Has your spirit been reconciled back to the Spirit Of God?

Do you know that you have a spirit?

I never knew that I had a spirit ,not until God decided to give birth to my spirit...when he testified with my spirit that I am his child.

Many may well be following the teachings of the Bible...that does not mean that their spirit is Born Again..

Who testifies with our spirit that we are Gods children, the Bible or the Spirit?

You sound extremely confused, imo according to what you post, you are all over the place....the Bible doesn’t testify with our spirit that it’s Born Again, the Living Spirit Of God does that....” Mind Blowing “...

Spirit gives birth to spirit?

Flesh gives birth to flesh?

The natural man would have no understanding of the above.

Do you understand my post...that would be a great start ...to understand where the other is coming from.

Do you understand that I became Born Again of imperishable seed.....having NEVER read a Bible?

Do you actually believe that you must read a Bible to become Born Again?

Do you understand that those who will become Born Again have already been chosen by God , they were chosen ,predestined before the foundation of the world....?

Why would I need to read a Bible, when it’s God who chooses who will become his child?

If you honestly believe that you can choose God to birth your spirit, then you have been deceived.

God does the birth...we have NO say in the matter.....All Glory goes to the Living Spirit Of God...His Living testimony, is the only one who can birth our spirit....he indwells our spirit....

I am also led through the Bible by Gods Living testimony...who brings the written word to my understanding....on how I became Born Again....

Do you actually take your time reading other members posts?

 

[Ritajanice]

Scripture Alone ~ by ReverendRV * September 17

Genesis 1:1 KJV; In the beginning God created the heaven and the earth.

Through Faith we understand that the worlds were framed by the Word of God, so that things which are seen were not made of things which do appear. In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God. And God said, “Let us make man in our image, after our likeness”. So God created Man in his own image, in the image of God created him; male and female created he them. And the LORD God commanded the man, saying, Of every tree of the Garden thou may freely eat; but of the Tree of the knowledge of Good and Evil, thou shalt not eat of it: for in the day that thou eat thereof thou shalt surely die. When the woman saw that the tree was good for food, and that it was pleasant to the eyes, a tree to be desired to make them wise, she took of the fruit thereof, and did eat, and gave also to her husband with her; and he ate it. At once they saw what they had done, and they realized they were naked. Then they sewed fig leaves together to cover themselves. ~ For the wages of Sin is Death…

All that is in the world, the lust of the flesh, and the lust of the eyes, and the pride of life, is not of the Father but is of the world. ~ Now when Jesus saw the crowds, he went up on a mountainside and sat down. His disciples came to him and he began to teach them. He said: "You’ve heard the Commandment that says, 'You must not commit adultery.' but I say, anyone who even looks at a woman with lust has already committed adultery with her in his heart. You have heard that it was said to those of old, ‘You shall not murder; and whoever murders will be liable to judgment.’ But I tell you that anyone who is angry with a brother or sister will be subject to judgment. Again, anyone who says to a brother or sister, 'Raca,' is answerable to the court. Anyone who says, 'You fool!' will be in danger of the fire of hell.” ~ For whoever keeps the whole Law and yet stumbles at just one point is guilty of breaking all of it…

The wages of Sin is death; but the gift of God is eternal Life! ~ For God so loved the world that he gave his only begotten Son, that whosoever believes in him shall not perish but have everlasting Life. The Word became flesh and dwelt among us, and we have seen his glory; Grace and peace to you from God our Father and the Lord Jesus Christ in whom we have redemption, the forgiveness of sins. For by Grace you are Saved through Faith, and this not of yourselves; it is the gift of God, not by Works so that no one can boast. If you confess with your mouth that Jesus is Lord and believe in your heart that God raised him from the dead, you will be saved. ~ I’ve passed on to you what is most important and what had also been passed on to me. Christ died for our Sins, just as the Scriptures said. He was buried, and he was raised from the dead on the third day, just as the Scriptures said. The Lord will rescue us from every evil deed and will bring us safely to his Heavenly kingdom. To him be glory for ever and ever. Amen…

Revelation 22:20-21 KJV; He which testifieth these things saith, Surely I come quickly. Amen. Even so, come, Lord Jesus. The grace of our Lord Jesus Christ be with you all. Amen.

Faith is very easy to understand providing it was God given faith...once I knew God in my spirit when it became Born Again, my spirit knew that I belong to Jesus, my whole life was about to change, from one being in the world, to one becoming Born Again and in Gods Spiritual realm...

In the world, not of the world...I would also advise to only let the Spirit to lead you through scripture, bringing you to understanding what happened to you, when your spirit became Born Again.

Reading other people’s own commentaries like reverend RJ...would only cause you confusion...I suggest that you rely 100% on the Living Spirit , to bring you to understand who you are in Christ.

Chosen by the Father and given to Jesus, who will NEVER lose one of his sheep/ children....only the Living Spirit can witness that truth to my spirit...the Bible confirms that Jesus can’t lose any that the Father has given him...my spirit believes Gods Living testimony who has birthed my spirit into his...

I understand Born Again from within my heart, as I’ve explained many times, the Bible confirms what we hear in our spirit....The Spirit testifies with our spirit that we are Gods children.....the Bible confirms what we heard in our heart/ spirit , ...the Bible does not birth our spirit...

Do you understand my posts?....as of yet, not one person that I have asked that question to...has answered my question.

There is nothing wrong in not understanding another member....a lot of what you post..I don’t understand...doesn’t make it untrue...it just means that I don’t understand your understanding of becoming a child of God...the way that you do...and quite a few others on this thread...

I had a friend who had no idea that God was a Living Spirit...she had no understanding of who God was in her heart, she would try and force me to believe what she believed....she was so confused and very controlling..God said..enough is enough and told me to end the friendship..


God is not a God Of confusion....you understand one way, I understand another way...

 

[brightfame52]

Did Christ die for every human being of mankind ? No, His Death was limited to them He died and redeemed unto God. Heb 9:12,15

12 Neither by the blood of goats and calves, but by his own blood he entered in once into the holy place, having obtained eternal redemption for us.

15 And for this cause he is the mediator of the new testament, that by means of death, for the redemption of the transgressions that were under the first testament, they which are called might receive the promise of eternal inheritance.

Now those He died for and redeemed are they which are called, to receive the promise of eternal inheritance or eternal life.

In Gods economy of Salvation, His Kingdom, them who Christ died and redeemed shall be called Isa 43:1

But now thus saith the Lord that created thee, O Jacob, and he that formed thee, O Israel, Fear not: for I have redeemed thee, I have called thee by thy name; thou art mine.

Zech 10:8

I will hiss for them, and gather them; for I have redeemed them: and they shall increase as they have increased.

That word hiss means to whistle, pipe it denotes the call of them to be gathered

So the redeemed by the death of Christ, will be effectually called, and that by name, and gathered to their Shepherd !

So the death of Christ is limited to the redeemed, and then called and gathered ! 18

 

[Lizbeth]

Whoever said grace is something that is unmerited? Grace is earned according to the Bible, hence why one can do something to fall from grace.

God doesn't make people sin does He?

Galatians 5
4You who are trying to be justified by the law have been severed from Christ; you have fallen away from grace.

Amen, in a manner of speaking. That will ruffle some feathers I'm sure. He is against the proud but gives grace to the humble. That is why the Lord speaks to us in parables.....He reveals to little children but truth is hid from the proud who are relying on themselves.

 

[Lizbeth]

Did Christ die for every human being of mankind ? No, His Death was limited to them He died and redeemed unto God. Heb 9:12,15

12 Neither by the blood of goats and calves, but by his own blood he entered in once into the holy place, having obtained eternal redemption for us.

15 And for this cause he is the mediator of the new testament, that by means of death, for the redemption of the transgressions that were under the first testament, they which are called might receive the promise of eternal inheritance.

Now those He died for and redeemed are they which are called, to receive the promise of eternal inheritance or eternal life.

In Gods economy of Salvation, His Kingdom, them who Christ died and redeemed shall be called Isa 43:1

But now thus saith the Lord that created thee, O Jacob, and he that formed thee, O Israel, Fear not: for I have redeemed thee, I have called thee by thy name; thou art mine.

Zech 10:8

I will hiss for them, and gather them; for I have redeemed them: and they shall increase as they have increased.

That word hiss means to whistle, pipe it denotes the call of them to be gathered

So the redeemed by the death of Christ, will be effectually called, and that by name, and gathered to their Shepherd !

So the death of Christ is limited to the redeemed, and then called and gathered ! 18

Only in a manner of speaking, based on the foreknowledge of God. You are drawing a wrong conclusion with your carnal mind, as so often happens. The bible doesn't teach a thing called "limited atonement". "Whosoever will" may drink of the waters of life freely.

 

[Rockerduck]

Jesus didn't think high numbers are significant:

Mattt 7
14For the gate is narrow and the way is hard that leads to life, and those who find it are few.

It is few who find it because they don't believe. If your name isn't in the Lambs book of Life, well; stop, drop, and roll, doesn't work in hell.

 

[Rockerduck]

Whoever said grace is something that is unmerited? Grace is earned according to the Bible, hence why one can do something to fall from grace.

God doesn't make people sin does He?

Galatians 5
4You who are trying to be justified by the law have been severed from Christ; you have fallen away from grace.

The Greek word used "fallen away," means to nullify, or run away from. If you try to earn your way to heaven by the law of Moses, you nullify, run away from, or fall from the grace. There is no mention of the loss of salvation which only comes by the Grace of God, which is unmerited favor. This scripture deals solely with works law.
By yourself you can run a race
If you run with God, it is Grace