Were Adam and Eve the first humans on Earth?

[Aunty Jane]

Is there proof that Neanderthals were human, I don't think so.

They were apes. Everything found about them points towards some kind of ape.

Scientists of course would love to make them out to be human because that suits them better in order to get more subsidies from the government to keep working, it's called "job security"...

Actually the opposite is true…..it suits their purpose more to suggest that they were apes on the way to being humans…..evolution works on a premise….but if the premise is flawed then so is the whole theory.
There has to be a chain, but if there are no links, there never was a chain to begin with.

Neanderthals were not ape-like at all, but were fully erect humans. Artist’s depictions of them always presented them as halfway between humans and apes. Just because some peoples in the world failed to progress in their technology, didn’t mean that they were less intelligent or sub-human…..there are many primitive peoples still in existence even today who are masters of their own domain…..a place where our technology and things of value are useless. They have tribal systems which feed and take care of one another. They share resources and have no need of currency as we do. But are their lives less successful? In our environment they would flounder but so would we in theirs. It’s all relative.

 

[Triumph1300]

Actually the opposite is true…..it suits their purpose more to suggest that they were apes on the way to being humans…..evolution works on a premise….but if the premise is flawed then so is the whole theory.
There has to be a chain, but if there are no links, there never was a chain to begin with.

Never thought about it that way, but I guess you might be right.

 

[Windmill Charge]

Just because something isn't "inspired" doesn't mean it's not useful. The Bible doesn't tell us everything. For instance, it doesn't tell us about dinosaurs, yet we know they existed

Two points,
Something that isn't inspired can be very useful, yet when that information contradicts the bible what do you do?
Evolutionists throw the bible out and believe what atheists tell them is true.

2 point dinosaurs the word is an19th century word to describe what was being found.
Why do you expect to find it in the bible?


A third point? Replenish an old English word that means to fill up.
See:-https://english.stackexchange.com/questions/398/what-is-the-etymology-of-replenish

 

[The Gospel of Christ]

@The Gospel of Christ ….FWIW….I can see that you are convicted in this, but I have quoted Scripture back to you proving that your ideas regarding the book of Enoch are false and contradictory….this is not my tradition, but reference to what the Bible says about those spirit sons who followed Satan into rebellion.

Satan has “his angels” as is plainly stated In Revelation. (Rev 12:7-12)

Satan himself is a fallen angel…a Cherub to be exact, mentioned in the book of Ezekiel.

This portion of Ezekiel’s writings, in ch 28:12-17 is a dirge or lamentation, directed to the King of Tyre, but it is a veiled description of the one whom this king emulated…

”Son of man, take up a lamentation over the king of Tyre and say to him, ‘Thus says the Lord God, “You had the seal of perfection, full of wisdom and perfect in beauty. “You were in Eden, the garden of God; Every precious stone was your covering:. . . .And the gold, the workmanship of your settings and sockets, was in you. On the day that you were created they were prepared. “You were the anointed cherub who covers, And I placed you there. You were on the holy mountain of God; You walked in the midst of the stones of fire. “You were blameless in your ways From the day you were created until unrighteousness was found in you. “By the abundance of your trade you were internally filled with violence, And you sinned; therefore I have cast you as profane from the mountain of God. And I have destroyed you, O covering cherub, from the midst of the stones of fire. Your heart was lifted up because of your beauty; you corrupted your wisdom by reason of your splendor”. (NASB)

It is not hard to see why satan wanted worship…he was magnificent, “full of wisdom and beauty”, (originally) and Ezekiel used the only terms he knew to describe his supernatural beauty…..gold and precious stones….but this Cherub got carried away with himself, and desired what did not rightfully belong to him.

He was a covering Cherub, in a position of responsibility in Eden…a guardian…..and he abused his privilege of service to God, instead, instigating a rebellion in order to snatch the newly created humans away from God so that he would receive their worship for himself by deception.
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You’re saying the Nephilim were just humans… but their fathers were interdimensional, rebellious angels.

If the “sons of God” in Genesis 6 were angels — which you admit — then their offspring cannot be regular humans. That's not how reproduction works.

You don't get "fully human air-breathers" from a divine being and a woman.
That’s not biblical logic. That’s tradition protecting a weak theology from a clear supernatural text.

You admit Satan is a cherub. A spiritual being. A divine son. An angelic rebel. And yet you deny that other spiritual rebels could also disobey, descend, and corrupt mankind?

If Satan had free will, so did the others.
If Satan left his station, so did the others.
If Satan was cast down — why is it hard to believe others fell before the Flood?

Jude and Peter both confirm that angels sinned and were chained (Jude 1:6, 2 Peter 2:4).
What sin? Eating too much manna?

No — they “left their proper dwelling” (Jude 1:6).
Genesis 6 tells you exactly what they did:

“The sons of God saw that the daughters of men were beautiful and took them as wives.” (Gen 6:2)

The result wasn’t more humans.
The result was the Nephilim — violent, 10 foot tall giants who brought judgment to the world.
Not sinners. Abominations.

“There are no contradictions in Scripture.”

Agreed. And that’s exactly why the Book of Enoch harmonizes with it.

Jesus describes demons as restless, bodiless, and host-seeking.
Enoch says the spirits of the Nephilim were cursed to wander the earth after death.
They’re not angels. They’re not human ghosts.
They’re exactly what Jesus encountered in every exorcism:
Bastard spirits — hybrid monsters, disembodied and hungry.

You say, “You cannot chain spirits.”
Jude and Peter both say otherwise.

You say, “There are no gaps.”
But you’re avoiding the massive, glaring gap in your view:
If the fallen angels are chained… and angels don’t possess people… then what are demons?

You’ve got no answer. Because your tradition doesn’t.

But Enoch does.

And Jude quotes him, word for word, and calls him a prophet.
You claim Scripture doesn’t confirm him — but Scripture literally does.

This isn’t a war over whether Satan is a fallen angel.
It’s about what the fallen angels produced.

And the Bible is clear:

They made something unnatural.
God wiped them out.
And their spirits were cursed.
And those spirits are still here.
So I’ll ask again — not to argue, but to clarify:

If demons aren’t the disembodied Nephilim… then what are they?

Because they beg to enter pigs.
They wander without rest.
And they are never once called “fallen angels” in Scripture.

So if we’re going to “let Scripture interpret Scripture”…
You’re going to have to stop ignoring the parts that prove you wrong.

 

[Jericho]

If we consult the Bible to see where this word in Hebrew (mālā… Strongs H4390) is used elsewhere, we can get a consensus as what it means elsewhere in Genesis and other Bible books.

Context is everything, isn't it? A word can mean different things depending on how it's used. The use of the word "mala" in Gen 1:28 is more similar in usage to Gen 9:1 than it would be to the other examples you cited. The point being is that filling something does not preclude it from being previously filled, as in Gen 9:1. Some Bible translators obviously thought so too, as they translated this word to "replenish," and that doesn't imply they had some hidden agenda in doing so.

If other humans existed before Adam and his wife, then that destroys the whole reason why Christ came to redeem mankind, sold under sin and death through Adam’s disobedience. (Rom 5:12)

As the first humans, Adam and his wife were the first of a unique species, who alone possessed the attributes of their Creator, the only creatures to be “made in his image”.

Not necessarily for the same reasons you pointed out. Humans are unique in that we were created in the image of God and were indwelled with a spirit. That's what really separates us from animals. Apes, for example, have a body and are soulish creatures, having a mind and emotions, but they don't have an eternal spirit. So, that wouldn't preclude other soulish creatures of higher intelligence. I only used Neanderthals as an example, but there are other possibilities in the Homo genus. To be clear, I am not espousing evolution but that there may have been other creations.

2 point dinosaurs the word is an19th century word to describe what was being found.
Why do you expect to find it in the bible?

I don't expect to find the word "dinosaurs" in the Bible, but that's not my point. The point is that the Bible is not a scientific textbook. It doesn't tell us everything, only what we need to know. To say that something isn't valid because it's not in the Bible is an argument from silence.

 

[The Gospel of Christ]

See, the problem is that one of these pictures is much closer to the actual truth — a truth many Christians don’t want to accept.

And I can assure you, it’s not the one with the rainbow.

It’s probably safe to say the fallen angels’ “wives” were not joyful brides. These weren’t unions of love — they were forced, violent, and unnatural. They shattered the boundaries between heaven and earth.

It wasn’t a fairy tale. It was the corruption of flesh, the defilement of innocence, and one of the very reasons God unleashed the Flood.

Christians have been conditioned to live in a medieval Vatican fantasy land — where men in white bathrobes fly through the sky playing harps and everything smells like incense and rose-colored stained glass.

It’s absurd. And it’s not in the Bible.

This cartoon theology has replaced the raw, terrifying, supernatural reality of scripture with Hallmark iconography and Catholic folklore — and now, when people read about giants, Watchers, cosmic rebellion, or a God who floods the earth in judgment… they think it’s "mythology."

No — what’s mythology is this sanitized, Renaissance-era, harp-plucking fairy tale.

The Bible was never tame.

Weak men tamed it — because accepting the raw truth would expose every comfortable Christian fantasy for what it is: a shield against the fear of a holy God.

 

[Aunty Jane]

You’re saying the Nephilim were just humans… but their fathers were interdimensional, rebellious angels.

I never said that the Nephilim were “just humans”…..these gigantic creatures with a violent disposition were one of the reasons why God brought the flood. If they were “just humans”, why would God have Noah go to all that trouble to build an ark, when he could have just zapped them out of existence with a wave of his hand?
The Nephilim were humans, (albeit hybrid freaks of nature) but air-breathers who perished in the flood like all other air-breathers……? (Gen 7:21-24)

And they had no “spirit” that survived their death because they were human. The fallen angels who fathered them were also in human form, capable of mating with human women and producing these monstrous offspring. There is no Scripture that says the Nephilim were capable of breeding since their size would have prevented them from the natural means without physically damaging the women. Do we really know how big these creatures were?

It was their fathers who craved the pleasures of the flesh, and angels who materialized as humans were always regular sized men. The Bible says that some have “entertained faithful angels”, unawares.

If the “sons of God” in Genesis 6 were angels — which you admit — then their offspring cannot be regular humans. That's not how reproduction works.

Where does the Bible say that they were not human? Their fathers were in human form and able to copulate and produce children, albeit freakish humanoid monsters….they were still dependent on breathing to stay alive, which is why the rebel angels had to dematerialize and return to the spirit realm, where God took away their ability to produce bodies for themselves….now all they can do is haunt us and try to masquerade as dead people to support the first lie that the devil ever told….”you surely will not die”…..are you proposing that the same lie applied to the Nephilim? That their “spirits” lived on?

Like all humans, they had no ”ghosts”…..it’s their fathers who pretend to be the spirits of dead people. You are not seeing the flaws in your own arguments.

You don't get "fully human air-breathers" from a divine being and a woman.

That’s not biblical logic. That’s tradition protecting a weak theology from a clear supernatural text.

Now you are allowing your own ideas to run amok. How do you know what “biblical logic” is, when nothing “natural” took place back then? What I propose is not “tradition”, but is actually backed up by Scripture. The demons were not the spirits of the Nephilim as they were air breathers who perished in the flood along with the humans they tormented. And no one took any notice of the “nutter” building some great structure out in the middle of a cleared field, and warning of a great catastrophe to come.

What purpose did the flood serve? Peter says it served as a warning example for us…..how is it a warning?

 

[Aunty Jane]

You admit Satan is a cherub. A spiritual being. A divine son. An angelic rebel. And yet you deny that other spiritual rebels could also disobey, descend, and corrupt mankind?

If Satan had free will, so did the others.

If Satan left his station, so did the others.

If Satan was cast down — why is it hard to believe others fell before the Flood?

When have I ever said that? Read my posts again and see that I fully concur with you on the origin of the devil, because the Bible tells me exactly who he was and why he defected.

The Bible indicates that that satan took a third of the angels into rebellion with him…..Jude speaks about “the angels” that sinned….not “the angel”……and there is no mention of the Nephilim, who were not the cause of the problems of Noah’s day, but the result of an angelic rebellion that altered normal human conduct.

2 Peter 2:4-5…
”Certainly God did not refrain from punishing the angels who sinned, but threw them into Tarʹta·rus, putting them in chains of dense darkness to be reserved for judgment. 5 And he did not refrain from punishing an ancient world, but kept Noah, a preacher of righteousness, safe with seven others when he brought a flood upon a world of ungodly people”

Any mention of the Nephilim? No…..why? Because they were part of the ”ancient world” of “ungodly” humans who perished in the flood.

What you suggest about the Nephilim contradicts the Bible, showing why we need caution when accepting as Scripture, what God did not include in his word.

Jude and Peter both confirm that angels sinned and were chained(Jude 1:6, 2 Peter 2:4).

What sin? Eating too much manna?

No — they “left their proper dwelling” (Jude 1:6).

Genesis 6 tells you exactly what they did:

“The sons of God saw that the daughters of men were beautiful and took them as wives.” (Gen 6:2)

The result wasn’t more humans.

The result was the Nephilim — violent, 10 foot tall giants who brought judgment to the world.

Not sinners. Abominations.

I have not argued with you on these points…..what I contest is that “the spirits of the Nephilim” are those that now ruin life for us here in these last days, as demonic spirits. Who are the ones who waged war with Michael and his angels in heaven? (Rev 12:7-12) Where does it say that the Nephilim ever had access to heaven?

Where did the errant fathers of the Nephilim go in your scenario? Did they just disappear? The Bible says nothing about demons being the Nephilim….not a word. But if they perished, and their fathers were sentenced to a state of confinement in spiritual darkness, unable now to materialize….who logically are the demons? The ones who begged Jesus not to sent them into the abyss……Satan’s rebel spirit “angels”.

As I have said, it’s your choice to hold to whatever you feel is the truth in your own heart, but we will all answer to the same judge when the time comes.

 

[Aunty Jane]

“There are no contradictions in Scripture.”

Agreed. And that’s exactly why the Book of Enoch harmonizes with it.

The book of Enoch has no place in the Bible, or God would have included it…..it is God’s word, not men’s. It is contradictory, not harmonious at all.

Jesus describes demons as restless, bodiless, and host-seeking.

Enoch says the spirits of the Nephilim were cursed to wander the earth after death.

They’re not angels. They’re not human ghosts.

They’re exactly what Jesus encountered in every exorcism:

Bastard spirits — hybrid monsters, disembodied and hungry.

You say, “You cannot chain spirits.”

Jude and Peter both say otherwise.

You say, “There are no gaps.”

But you’re avoiding the massive, glaring gap in your view:

If the fallen angels are chained… and angels don’t possess people… then what are demons?

Demons are fallen angels who lack the ability to materialize, and so they have to possess humans or other material things to do damage on earth……we know that the Bible has many instances where humans encountered materialized angels after the flood. Faithful angels do not need to possess people…..only demons do…..and those who succumb to their possession and influence are those who allow them to do so through ignorance, or in full knowledge of who they are. Satan has his human minions too.

So only the rebels were sentenced to a state of confinement, and kept in the dark about when God was going to deal with them in a real prison for 1000 years.

You’ve got no answer. Because your tradition doesn’t.
But Enoch does.

And Jude quotes him, word for word, and calls him a prophet.

You claim Scripture doesn’t confirm him — but Scripture literally does.

This isn’t a war over whether Satan is a fallen angel.

It’s about what the fallen angels produced.

And the Bible is clear:

They made something unnatural.

God wiped them out.

And their spirits were cursed.

And those spirits are still here.

So I’ll ask again — not to argue, but to clarify:

If demons aren’t the disembodied Nephilim… then what are they?

Because they beg to enter pigs.

They wander without rest.

And they are never once called “fallen angels” in Scripture.

So if we’re going to “let Scripture interpret Scripture”…

You’re going to have to stop ignoring the parts that prove you wrong.

I am not the one arguing with Scripture….a non-canonical book is not Scripture, and Jude could have gleaned his information from other sources…..but I can see that you are rather obsessed with it, so there is no point in arguing about it any further, except to ask who are your brotherhood and with whom do you meet for worship? Who is your sounding board as to whether what you believe is true? Who advises you on these things?

Who are those whom the apostle Paul identified in Hebrews 13:17? Who are your leaders? And with whom do you meet regularly for fellowship? (Heb 10:34-35)

It is too easy to be led astray as a lone sheep apart from the flock….who are your flock because we cannot be Christians all by ourselves with no brotherhood, who all teach and believe as we do. (1 Cor 1:10)

You are out on a limb here…..and if you are the only one sitting on that branch, then that alone proves that you cannot be promoting the Bible’s truth. Convincing yourself is not what Christianity is all about….you have to be part of a flock for whom Christ is “the Fine Shepherd”. All must share one truth because there are not many versions of it that are all acceptable to God and his Christ.

There is just one diamond in that pile of broken glass…..few will find it, but it is a shared find, as all embrace the value of that one shared diamond….one truth…..”one Lord, one faith, one baptism”.

 

[The Gospel of Christ]

For anyone seriously considering these matters:

If you'd like to engage with the Scriptural facts laid out — rather than ignoring, deflecting, or dismissing — you're welcome to chime in.

Scriptural points ignored:

Genesis 6 describes the Nephilim as the direct result of a supernatural rebellion — "sons of God" taking "daughters of men" as wives — producing beings who were not merely human.
Yet this was reduced to "air-breathers," ignoring the clear Scriptural testimony that their origin was not human-to-human reproduction, but an unnatural union involving divine beings.
If the Nephilim were normal humans, Scripture would have simply called them humans — as it does everywhere else in Genesis.
Instead, God marked them with a separate name — "Nephilim" — because they were not fully human.
Ignoring this distinction is ignoring the Word itself.

No explanation was ever given for how beings fathered by rebellious angels could be classified as "ordinary humans."
How that makes sense to anyone is absolutely mind-boggling.
Rebellious fallen angels mate with human women — and that somehow just creates "tall men"? The notion is absurd on its face.
Spirit + flesh = unnatural abomination. Period.
And again, if they were just humans, Scripture would have called them that — but it didn't. It called them Nephilim for a reason.

Scripture says the fallen angels were chained (Jude 1:6; 2 Peter 2:4) — so roaming demons cannot simply be fallen angels.
But thanks to Casper the Friendly Ghost, Ghostbusters, and 1,100 years of staring at ridiculous Vatican medieval artwork, modern Christians now think spirits are little floaty cartoons — cartoons that not even God and the archangels can chain.

Demons behave differently from angels — they seek bodies and wander restlessly (Matthew 12:43-45), unlike ministering spirits (Hebrews 1:14).
Jesus dealt with restless, roaming, host-seeking entities — never described as angels, or fallen angels in scripture.
They are always called "unclean spirits" (πνεύματα ἀκάθαρτα — pneumata akatharta) or "demons" (daimonia).
Not once are they labeled angels — fallen or otherwise — in the Gospels, Acts, or any New Testament writings dealing with exorcism.
So we are left with the same question:
If demons are not the disembodied spirits of the Nephilim, then what are they?

Jude directly quoted the Book of Enoch — word for word — and publicly recognized Enoch as a prophet (Jude 1:14-15).
This was not a casual reference:
God Himself — through the Holy Spirit — chose to include Enoch’s prophecy inside the New Testament record.
Ignoring this fact is not a theological rebuttal. It is refusing to deal honestly with what the Holy Spirit preserved in inspired Scripture.

These Scriptural realities deserve to be faced — not evaded by tradition or emotion.

Let Scripture interpret Scripture. Always.

 

[shepherdsword]

Some people place a gap here to make room for a pre-adamic civilization and an old earth theory

Gen1:1 In the beginning God created the heavens and the earth.( Gap of unknown length of Time) 2 Now the earth was(BECAME tohuw waabohuw after it was created perfect) formless and empty, darkness was over the surface of the deep, and the Spirit of God was hovering over the waters

According to the gap theory,Lucifer and the other angels dwelt on the earth and were tested in a similar way that we were. After Lucifer fell, he and the other angels that did not test true, destroyed the earth. It then became "formless and void" Therefore, Adam and Eve were charged with REplenishing the earth.(because it had once been inhabited.

 

[Windmill Charge]

The point is that the Bible is not a scientific textbook.

Yet without the bible and Christianity there is no science.
It is only Christianity that teaches that the created universe is consistent, understandable and rational.
That we can probe and investigate and as one Christian scientist said, ' think God's thoughts after him. '

Science is judged by the bible and what contradicts the Bible is false and is to be discarded.