Jesus answered, “My kingdom is not of this world. If My kingdom were of this world, My servants would fight, so a 1000 yr reign on this earth is false

[Spiritual Israelite]

I think revelation 19 follows the apocalyptic motif, and is not meant to be taken literally nor chronologically, as that is not the point of apocalyptic literature. It alludes to and combines passages like psalm 2 and Ezekiel 38/39 to display an ultra violent victory for Christ.

that being said - notice the end of the psalm 2:

Psalm 2: 9-12 (lxx) Thou shalt shepherd them with a rod of iron; thou shalt dash them in pieces as a potter’s vessel. 10 Now therefore understand, ye kings: be instructed, all ye that judge the earth. 11 Serve the Lord with fear, and rejoice in him with trembling. 12 Accept correction, lest at any time the Lord be angry, and ye should perish from the righteous way

I think this ending is the explanation of Christs authority to shepherd with a rod of iron, and to dash to pieces - serve the Lord and accept correction (shepherd) or perish (dash to pieces). This is where I think there is broader application.

• Herod, Pilate, the gentiles, and people of Israel raged and gathered together against Christ (crucifixion)
• Thou art my son whom I have begotten (resurrectection)
• Inherited the nations, has authority shepherds with a rod of iron and to dash to pieces (ascension)

So now because of this (death, resurrection, ascension) serve the Lord and accept correction or perish. With this in mind, revelation may allude to psalm 2 vs 1-2, but its main point is vs 10-12 - those who have not accepted correction, perishing.

I just completely disagree. It's obvious to me that Revelation 19:11-21 describes the future return of Jesus Christ when He will take vengeance on all of His enemies. His ascension is not in view there at all. It has Him coming down from heaven, not going to heaven. It has Him destroying His enemies, not correcting them. Since when can a description of Him smiting His enemies and treading them in the winepress of the fierceness of God's wrath relate to correction rather than destruction?

 

[Scott Downey]

Ok, after His future coming, why is the rod of iron needed? The unsaved would be in the LOF and there is no sorrow, crying, or pain in the NHNE.

Exactly, no point to whacking the wicked to pieces with iron rebar rods during a 'millennial reign'. He deals with all the wicked in flaming fiery vengeance, on the Day of Judgment. I am not pre-mill, those who are have to answer for their own selves what they believe in.
Reigning in power over them He wages war, rods are just another name for a deadly weapon.

 

[Spiritual Israelite]

It likely means in a sense such as the following.

1 John 2:15 Love not the world, neither the things that are in the world. If any man love the world, the love of the Father is not in him.


But once Jesus returns with the kingdom, one then should love this world since it will then be a new world wherein dwelleth righteousness, unlike the world currently. Maybe why He said, but now is my kingdom not from hence. But will that still be true once He returns with the kingdom, though?

In the Premil view wickedness will still exist at that point when Jesus returns, so it seems that your comment supports Amill more than Premill. Plus, it's the new heavens and new earth "wherein dwelleth righteousness" (2 Peter 3:13) and there will be no wickedness in the eternal new heavens and new earth.

 

[Scott Downey]

Christ on a White Horse​

11 Now I saw heaven opened, and behold, a white horse. And He who sat on him was called Faithful and True, and in righteousness He judges and makes war. 12 His eyes were like a flame of fire, and on His head were many crowns. He [e]had a name written that no one knew except Himself. 13 He was clothed with a robe dipped in blood, and His name is called The Word of God. 14 And the armies in heaven, clothed in [f]fine linen, white and clean, followed Him on white horses. 15 Now out of His mouth goes a [g]sharp sword, that with it He should strike the nations. And He Himself will rule them with a rod of iron. He Himself treads the winepress of the fierceness and wrath of Almighty God. 16 And He has on His robe and on His thigh a name written:

KING OF KINGS AND
LORD OF LORDS.

The Beast and His Armies Defeated​

17 Then I saw an angel standing in the sun; and he cried with a loud voice, saying to all the birds that fly in the midst of heaven, “Come and gather together for the [h]supper of the great God, 18 that you may eat the flesh of kings, the flesh of captains, the flesh of mighty men, the flesh of horses and of those who sit on them, and the flesh of all people, [i]free and slave, both small and great.”

19 And I saw the beast, the kings of the earth, and their armies, gathered together to make war against Him who sat on the horse and against His army. 20 Then the beast was captured, and with him the false prophet who worked signs in his presence, by which he deceived those who received the mark of the beast and those who worshiped his image. These two were cast alive into the lake of fire burning with brimstone. 21 And the rest were killed with the sword which proceeded from the mouth of Him who sat on the horse. And all the birds were filled with their flesh.

No survivors here of the wicked unbelieving disobedient people when Christ returns that I read about.

 

[grafted branch]

Exactly, no point to whacking the wicked to pieces with iron rebar rods during a 'millennial reign'. He deals with all the wicked in flaming fiery vengeance, on the Day of Judgment. I am not pre-mill, those who are have to answer for their own selves what they believe in.
Reigning in power over them He wages war, rods are just another name for a deadly weapon.

I’m not sure I’m following you. Are you saying the rod of iron is used at the GWTJ then after that the iron rod is not used? Or do you have the rod of iron being used for eternity?

 

[Scott Downey]

15 Now out of His mouth goes a [g]sharp sword, that with it He should strike the nations. And He Himself will rule them with a rod of iron. He Himself treads the winepress of the fierceness and wrath of Almighty God. 16 And He has on His robe and on His thigh a name written:

KING OF KINGS AND
LORD OF LORDS.

****************

And the rest were killed with the sword which proceeded from the mouth of Him who sat on the horse. And all the birds were filled with their flesh.

The above is telling us they are all going to perish at His returning. The picture in your mind formed by the words tells you that.

We read about the 'winepress' here also in the reaping of the souls on the earth

Reaping the Earth’s Harvest​

14 Then I looked, and behold, a white cloud, and on the cloud sat One like the Son of Man, having on His head a golden crown, and in His hand a sharp sickle. 15 And another angel came out of the temple, crying with a loud voice to Him who sat on the cloud, “Thrust in Your sickle and reap, for the time has come [j]for You to reap, for the harvest of the earth is ripe.” 16 So He who sat on the cloud thrust in His sickle on the earth, and the earth was reaped.

Reaping the Grapes of Wrath​

17 Then another angel came out of the temple which is in heaven, he also having a sharp sickle.

18 And another angel came out from the altar, who had power over fire, and he cried with a loud cry to him who had the sharp sickle, saying, “Thrust in your sharp sickle and gather the clusters of the vine of the earth, for her grapes are fully ripe.” 19 So the angel thrust his sickle into the earth and gathered the vine of the earth, and threw it into the great winepress of the wrath of God. 20 And the winepress was trampled outside the city, and blood came out of the winepress, up to the horses’ bridles, for one thousand six hundred [k]furlongs.

From this world, there is harvest of the grapes of wrath versus the harvest of the wheat into His barn

The spiritually dead who fight against God and Christ, and the spiritually alive whom He purchased us to God by His blood.
There is no one else remaining when He returns. Two fates await, one of salvation, and one of condemnation.

 

[Scott Downey]

I’m not sure I’m following you. Are you saying the rod of iron is used at the GWTJ then after that the iron rod is not used? Or do you have the rod of iron being used for eternity?

It is a temporary 'weapon', used to kill the wicked at His return. The words are used to form a picture in your mind of what happens on the Last Day, on the Day of Vengeance of our God. Afterwards the wicked are no more a problem ever again, they go into the fire.

 

[Scott Downey]

11 Now I saw heaven opened, and behold, a white horse. And He who sat on him was called Faithful and True, and in righteousness He judges and makes war.

15 Now out of His mouth goes a [g]sharp sword, that with it He should strike the nations. And He Himself will rule them with a rod of iron. He Himself treads the winepress of the fierceness and wrath of Almighty God. 16 And He has on His robe and on His thigh a name written:

KING OF KINGS AND
LORD OF LORDS.


The wicked get what's coming for them as they had no faith in Christ. That is what justice demands, meaning their death. He makes war against them. There is no escape.
That is what it means to RULE them, He judges them worthy of their death. Just like the heathen kings of old ruled over and held the power of life or death over the ones waged wars against at the victory of the king.

I see no evidence of anything except vengeance, no mercy in this time and place.

 

[Spiritual Israelite]

We're talking about post #4, correct?

Yes, obviously. That's the one where you said I was supposedly ignoring things.

If yes, the only thing I see that I said in regards to ignoring anything was this---I guess we just ignore the 'now' recorded in that verse, right? And then this---Unless one is a Preterist, most of the rest of us see this pertaining to His 2nd coming being close and at the door, thus right around the corner. But let's just ignore this as well, this part---the kingdom of God is nigh at hand.

Yeah, that's all. No biggie, right?

And in both cases I was simply using it as an argument in general. Why can't someone say things like this in order to simply make a point, in order to present an argument?

Because it's offensive and a lie. Do you care about lying or not? I didn't ignore anything, so why is it okay for you to lie and say that I did?

I can't help it if that's the way my mind operates. It is what is.

You cant help but tell lies? You have a serious problem if that's how your mind operates.

Therefore, I should be apologizing for simply making an argument?

Yes. Telling someone they are ignoring something when they are not ignoring anything is not acceptable. It's just unbelievable that you can't understand something so simple as this.

Obviously, the way you are seeing what I am doing it is not the way I'm seeing what I am doing. I didn't realize that anyone, no matter who they are, should need to apologize for simply making a point, thus submitting an argument.

You weren't just making a point, you were saying I was ignoring something without having any proof that I was ignoring anything. You were too lazy to find out how I actually interpret John 18:36, so you just made assumptions without finding out how I interpret it first.

Let's keep in mind though, post #4 was submitted before post #5 was submitted.

So? Is that an excuse for you accusing me of ignoring something? Why didn't you just ask me how I interpreted John 18:36 instead of making assumptions?

But now that post #5 makes your position clearer, I guess I least do owe you an apology for making some straw man arguments here and there, which you pointed out. I apologize for doing that.

Was that so hard? Good grief. You are quite a character. Apology accepted. Please make sure you know what someone believes next time before accusing them of ignoring something.

But getting back to this ignore thing. You have to keep in mind that I'm attempting to prove that there will be a thousand year reign once Jesus returns, and that parables such as Luke 19 tend to prove it.

LOL. That parable proves no such thing. Not even close.

Because, after all, no one can deny, not even Amils, that everything pertaining to that parable is meaning before 1 Corinthians 15:28 is fulfilled. And that that parable involves Jesus rewarding the faithful with authority over cities, whatever that might look like.

And that it makes zero sense, that once 1 Corinthians 15:28 is fulfilled, that the faithful followers maintain this same authority over cities for ever since there would be no time period at this point preventing them from having this authority forever. The keyword being 'authority', thus having authority over something.

What in the world are you even saying here? I truly have no idea.

Therefore, logically there has to be a period of time after Jesus gives them this authority and before 1 Corinthians 15:28 is fulfilled, in order to execute this authority, otherwise, this authority He gives them is all in vain, totally pointless, especially the fact this authority wouldn't be needed post the fulfilling of 1 Corinthians 15:28.

What?! Can you be more specific as to exactly what you are intending to say here?

That would be my position since it certainly doesn't make sense that it could be referring to this same present earth at this point. But as to you, how can you even entertain this possibility when your position appears to be that there cannot even be any NHNE until the GWTJ has concluded first?

Entertain what possibility exactly? Please be more specific as to what exactly you are saying.

If per your view you see it being a possibility that Luke 19 can be involving Jesus doing this on the NHNE, how do you reconcile your view of the following with the following?

Revelation 21:4 And God shall wipe away all tears from their eyes; and there shall be no more death , neither sorrow, nor crying, neither shall there be any more pain: for the former things are passed away.

Luke 19:27 But those mine enemies, which would not that I should reign over them, bring hither, and slay them before me

At least this time I think I understand your question. Revelation 21:4 is talking about there being no more physical death in the NHNE just as it's talking about no more physical crying and pain. Luke 19:27 is not talking about physical death because it's talking about His enemies being brought before Him at the judgment. So, that verse is referring to the second death of being cast into the lake of fire.

 

[Wick Stick]

It likely means in a sense such as the following.

1 John 2:15 Love not the world, neither the things that are in the world. If any man love the world, the love of the Father is not in him.


But once Jesus returns with the kingdom, one then should love this world since it will then be a new world wherein dwelleth righteousness, unlike the world currently. Maybe why He said, but now is my kingdom not from hence. But will that still be true once He returns with the kingdom, though?

As nearly as I can tell, it's talking about the systems of government and jurisprudence in Israel at the time. I read
John 18 like this...

Pilate: "Are you the King of the Jews?"

Jesus: "Did you come up with that yourself, or did someone tell you about Me?"

Pilate: "Am I a Jew? Your own nation and the chief priests delivered you to me. What have you done?"

Jesus: "My authority is not from that system. If my kingdom was part of that world, then my subordinates would fight, so I wouldn't be delivered to the Jews. But my rulership doesn't come from that source."

 

[Scott Downey]

As nearly as I can tell, it's talking about the systems of government and jurisprudence in Israel at the time. I read
John 18 like this...

Pilate: "Are you the King of the Jews?"

Jesus: "Did you come up with that yourself, or did someone tell you about Me?"

Pilate: "Am I a Jew? Your own nation and the chief priests delivered you to me. What have you done?"

Jesus: "My authority is not from that system. If my kingdom was part of that world, then my subordinates would fight, so I wouldn't be delivered to the Jews. But my rulership doesn't come from that source."

Jesus only cares for His sheep.
Jesus cares and prays for the ones God gave to Him as His children, taken out of the world, and only them, not those of this world that God did not give to Christ.

Not all people are of His sheep, as He told the unbelieving Jews, they were going to perish in their sins unless they believed in Christ, who HE IS. But they cannot believe in Him as they are not of His sheep, as He says to them. They belong to the Devil. The same is true today, unless you believe you are not of His sheep, and you aren't going to be with Christ in heaven. You go to hell fire to share the fate of your father the devil.

John 10

The Shepherd Knows His Sheep​

22 Now it was the Feast of Dedication in Jerusalem, and it was winter. 23 And Jesus walked in the temple, in Solomon’s porch. 24 Then the Jews surrounded Him and said to Him, “How long do You keep us in [d]doubt? If You are the Christ, tell us plainly.”

25 Jesus answered them, “I told you, and you do not believe. The works that I do in My Father’s name, they bear witness of Me. 26 But you do not believe, because you are not of My sheep, [e]as I said to you. 27 My sheep hear My voice, and I know them, and they follow Me. 28 And I give them eternal life, and they shall never perish; neither shall anyone snatch them out of My hand. 29 My Father, who has given them to Me, is greater than all; and no one is able to snatch them out of My Father’s hand. 30 I and My Father are one.”

John 10
11 “I am the good shepherd. The good shepherd gives His life for the sheep. 12 But a [b]hireling, he who is not the shepherd, one who does not own the sheep, sees the wolf coming and leaves the sheep and flees; and the wolf catches the sheep and scatters them.

13 The hireling flees because he is a hireling and does not care about the sheep. 14 I am the good shepherd; and I know My sheep, and am known by My own. 15 As the Father knows Me, even so I know the Father; and I lay down My life for the sheep. 16 And other sheep I have which are not of this fold; them also I must bring, and they will hear My voice; and there will be one flock and one shepherd.

17 “Therefore My Father loves Me, because I lay down My life that I may take it again. 18 No one takes it from Me, but I lay it down of Myself. I have power to lay it down, and I have power to take it again. This command I have received from My Father.”

19 Therefore there was a division again among the Jews because of these sayings. 20 And many of them said, “He has a demon and is [c]mad. Why do you listen to Him?”

 

[Spiritual Israelite]

Let's not talk idly. For the kingdom of God is not meat and drink; but righteousness, and peace, and joy in the Holy Ghost. -- Romans 14:17.

The kingdom of God is demonstrated not in idle talk but with power. -- 1 Corinthians 4:20:

But if I cast out demons by the Spirit of God, then the kingdom of God has already come to you. --Matthew 12:28.

For the kingdom of God is not in word, but in power. --1 Corinthians 4:20

Mark 4
26 And he said, So is the kingdom of God, as if a man should cast seed into the ground;
27 And should sleep, and rise night and day, and the seed should spring and grow up, he knoweth not how.
28 For the earth bringeth forth fruit of herself; first the blade, then the ear, after that the full grain in the head.
29 But when the fruit is brought forth, immediately he putteth in the sickle, because the harvest is come.

30 And he said, Whereunto shall we liken the kingdom of God? or with what comparison shall we compare it?
31 It is like a grain of mustard seed, which, when it is sown in the earth, is less than all the seeds that be in the earth:
32 But when it is sown, it groweth up, and becometh greater than all herbs, and shooteth out great branches; so that the fowls of the air may lodge under the shadow of it.

And he said unto them, Ye are from beneath; I am from above: ye are of this world; I am not of this world. -- John 8:23.

My kingdom is not of this world: if my kingdom were of this world, then would my servants fight, that I should not be delivered to the Jews: but now, of this present time [nyn], is my kingdom not from hence. -- John 18:36.

And the seventh angel sounded; and there were great voices in heaven, saying, The kingdoms of this world are become the kingdoms of our Lord, and of his Christ; and he shall reign to the ages of the ages.

And out of his mouth goeth a sharp sword, that with it he should smite the nations: and he shall shepherd [4165 ποιμαίνω poimaino] them with a rod of iron: and he treadeth the winepress of the fierceness and wrath of Almighty God. -- Revelation 19:15.

And he who overcomes and keeps My works to the end, to him I will give power over the nations. And he will shepherd [4165 ποιμαίνω poimaino] them with a rod of iron, as the vessels of a potter they will be broken to pieces, even as I received from My Father. And I will give him the Morning Star. He who has an ear, let him hear what the Spirit says to the churches. (Rev.2:26-29). -- Revelation 2:26-29.

-- For some reason that Amillennialists will ignore, the Revelation speaks of the nations being shepherded - both by Christ and by those who overcome - following His return described in Revelation 19, where it is said He will smite the nations with the sword that proceeds out of His mouth, and then shepherd them with a rod of iron --

You are ignoring what effect a symbolic rod of iron has. It is associated with BREAKING the heathen (Psalm 2:8-9) and with SMITING them and TREADING them in the fierceness and wrath of Almighty God (Rev 19:15). It is associated with DESTRUCTION. You have your mind on shepherding sheep, but this is not that kind of shepherding. This is the kind of shepherding that avenges the blood of innocent sheep/believers by destroying their enemies. Look what it says shortly after Revelation 19:15.

Revelation 19:17 And I saw an angel standing in the sun; and he cried with a loud voice, saying to all the fowls that fly in the midst of heaven, Come and gather yourselves together unto the supper of the great God; 18 That ye may eat the flesh of kings, and the flesh of captains, and the flesh of mighty men, and the flesh of horses, and of them that sit on them, and the flesh of all men, both free and bond, both small and great.

You would have us believe that Jesus will shepherd these people who are described as being eaten by the fowls of heaven. Unbelievable. You completely ignore the context of Revelation 19 which describes Jesus as destroying all of His enemies that you think He will shepherd and rule over instead.

To him who overcomes I will grant to sit with Me in My throne, even as I also overcame and have sat down with My Father in His throne. He who has an ear, let him hear what the Spirit says to the churches. -- Revelation 3:18-22.

And I saw thrones, and they sat upon them, and judgment was given unto them: and I saw the souls of them that were beheaded for the witness of Jesus, and for the word of God, and which had not worshipped the beast, neither his image, neither had received his mark upon their foreheads, or in their hands;

and they were alive [zao] and reigned with Christ a thousand years. But the rest of the dead lived not again until the thousand years were finished. This is the first resurrection of the body [anastasis].

For as in Adam all die, even so in Christ shall all be made alive. But every man in his own order: Christ the firstfruits; afterward they that are Christ’s at his coming. -- 1 Corinthians 15:22-23.

It's ironic that you would try to quote 1 Corinthians 15:22-23 in support of Premill when it supports Amill instead. The first resurrection in order listed there is NOT the mass bodily resurrection of the dead in Christ, but rather is the bodily resurrection of Christ Himself.

Flesh and blood cannot inherit the kingdom of God, nor does the perishable inherit the imperishable. -- 1 Corinthians 15:50.

Blessed and holy is he that hath part in the first resurrection of the body [anastasis]: on such the second death hath no power, but they shall be priests of God and of Christ, and shall reign with him a thousand years. -- Revelation 20:4-6.

Tell me, does a person need to be bodily resurrected in order for the second death to not have power over them? At what point are believers priests of God and of Christ (see 1 Peter 2:9 and Revelation 1:5-6). You are missing that what is described in Revelation 20:6 is a current reality. Jesus reigns now. We are His priests now. The second death has no power over us now.

Why Amillennialists will keep speaking about the fact that Psalm 2 says that he will break the nations with a rod of iron, ignoring the fact that after Revelation says that He will smite the nations with the sword that proceeds from His mouth, it continues to say that He and those who overcome, will then shepherd the nations with a rod of iron,

I'm not ignoring that at all. Why would you interpret the shepherding with a rod of iron differently than what Psalm 2 describes? Clearly, ruling with a rod of iron involves breaking/destroying/smiting the heathen rather than ruling over them the way you think He will.

is not something that "only Amillennialists will understand" - we can all see that Amillennialists will only see one half of biblical scripture whenever the half they don't see (or refuse to see) does not comply with Amillennial theology.

This is an absolute lie. You know you can't refute Amill, so you have to resort to lying about it instead.

You only see half the scriptures half the time.

Wrong, liar.

Scripture does not teach that the "thousand" years began 2,000 years ago and will come to a close with return of Christ. Paul speaks a lot about the kind of things that will cause someone not to inherit the Kingdom of God.

Then shall the King say unto them on his right hand, Come, ye blessed of my Father, inherit the kingdom prepared for you from the foundation of the world -- Matthew 25:34.

"Now the works of the flesh are manifest, which are these; Adultery, fornication, uncleanness, lasciviousness, Idolatry, witchcraft, hatred, variance, emulations, wrath, strife, seditions, heresies, Envyings, murders, drunkenness, revellings, and such like: of the which I tell you before, as I have also told you in time past, that they which do such things shall not inherit the kingdom of God. Galatians 5:19-21/

1 Corinthians 6:9-10
Know ye not that the unrighteous shall not inherit the kingdom of God? Be not deceived: neither fornicators, nor idolaters, nor adulterers, nor effeminate, nor abusers of themselves with mankind, Nor thieves, nor covetous, nor drunkards, nor revilers, nor extortioners, shall inherit the kingdom of God.

Then shall the King say unto them on his right hand, Come, ye blessed of my Father, inherit the kingdom prepared for you from the foundation of the world -- Matthew 25:34.

So let's not talk idly. It means the Kingdom has come and is still coming.

What do you think you're proving here, anyway? Amills do not deny that we will inherit the kingdom of God when Jesus returns. Let's talk about Matthew 25:34. I assume you agree that occurs when Jesus returns? Based on what Paul said in 1 Corinthians 15:50-54, mortal flesh and blood will not inherit the kingdom of God. Agree? So, who exactly do you have inheriting the kingdom of God when Jesus returns besides those who willl have immortal bodies? As a Premill you believe there will be mortals on the earth during the thousand years after Christ returns, right? Unless you're a SDA who thinks the earth is desolate during that time. So, who are the mortals that you think will populate the earth during the thousand years?

 

[Spiritual Israelite]

I’m not sure I’m following you. Are you saying the rod of iron is used at the GWTJ then after that the iron rod is not used? Or do you have the rod of iron being used for eternity?

Read Revelation 19:11-21. The rod of iron is used by Christ at His return to destroy His enemies as He smites them and treads them in the winepress of the fierceness and wrath of Almighty God after which His enemies all become bird food. The rod of iron is associated with destruction on the day Jesus returns to break/destroy the heathen with a rod of iron (Psam 2:8-9).

 

[claninja]

So according to your interpretation of scripture He destroyed the heathen with an iron rod at that time.

Yet Rome continued to exist. So did Judea, until 70AD, and today the Jews exist in another part of the territory and call the place Israel.

When did He destroy the heathen?

Christ has come, and is coming. The Kingdom of Christ is come, and His Kingdom is coming. But as a Preterist you have Christ as having come, and then having come in His Kingdom in 70 AD (though you may say you're a "Partial" Preterist who does not believe that He has already returned, but then contradict yourself with the way you interpret Psalm 2).

Psalm 2 is a near -and - far prophecy that has an application for more than one period in time, specifically because Messiah came but was cut off, departed (ascended into heaven) and will return, and His Kingdom likewise is now IN this world but is not OF this world. But you won't understand that because of Amillennialism + your own brand of it.

No, that’s not what I mean

 

[PGS11]

Honestly I will stay in heaven with the Father anyone can have my place to rule the earth I'm not interested if its true.If I have eternal life I will have no interest in anything here I won't need it or want it and will have no desire to rule over people.I don't want to come back I would rather stay in heaven.

 

[claninja]

Psalm 2 is a warning to the wicked they will perish, not be lovingly shepherded for eternal life.

The warning of shepherding with an iron rod and dashing those to pieces, is literally spelled out in the next 2 verses - serve the lord and accept correction (being shepherded with an iron rod) OR perish (dashed to peices as a potters vessel):

Thou shalt shepherd them with a rod of iron; thou shalt dash them in pieces as a potter’s vessel. 10 Now therefore understand, ye kings: be instructed, all ye that judge the earth. 11 Serve the Lord with fear, and rejoice in him with trembling. 12 Accept correction, lest at any time the Lord be angry, and ye should perish from the righteous way

 

[Scott Downey]

The warning of shepherding with an iron rod and dashing those to pieces, is literally spelled out in the next 2 verses - serve the lord and accept correction (being shepherded with an iron rod) OR perish (dashed to peices as a potters vessel):

Thou shalt shepherd them with a rod of iron; thou shalt dash them in pieces as a potter’s vessel. 10 Now therefore understand, ye kings: be instructed, all ye that judge the earth. 11 Serve the Lord with fear, and rejoice in him with trembling. 12 Accept correction, lest at any time the Lord be angry, and ye should perish from the righteous way

The facts are the wicked will not accept correction, they refuse to have this man to reign over them. They end up dead. Luke 19 and the parable of the Minas tells us what happens

11 Now as they heard these things, He spoke another parable, because He was near Jerusalem and because they thought the kingdom of God would appear immediately. 12 Therefore He said: “A certain nobleman went into a far country to receive for himself a kingdom and to return. 13 So he called ten of his servants, delivered to them ten [e]minas, and said to them, ‘Do business till I come.’ 14 But his citizens hated him, and sent a delegation after him, saying, ‘We will not have this man to reign over us.’

15 “And so it was that when he returned, having received the kingdom, he then commanded these servants, to whom he had given the money, to be called to him, that he might know how much every man had gained by trading.

*******************

24 “And he said to those who stood by, ‘Take the mina from him, and give it to him who has ten minas.’ 25 (But they said to him, ‘Master, he has ten minas.’) 26 ‘For I say to you, that to everyone who has will be given; and from him who does not have, even what he has will be taken away from him. 27 But bring here those enemies of mine, who did not want me to reign over them, and slay them before me.’ ”

 

[Zao is life]

As a Premill you believe there will be mortals on the earth during the thousand years after Christ returns, right?

Wrong.

I'm not a SDA either.

TRY and follow (just try):

Premil = Christ returns before the millennium.

Amil & Post-mil = Christ returns after the millennium.

Forget the fact that there is no return of Christ mentioned at the close of the millennium (only the GWT judgment and a second death).

There is only one God. (Eternal) life [zoe] is in Him and always existed in Him, before the creation of mankind:

John 1:2 & 4
The Word was in the beginning with God. In Him was life [zōḗ], and the life [zōḗ] was the light of men.

John 5:26
For as the Father hath life [zōḗ] in himself; so hath he given to the Son to have life [zōḗ] in himself.

1 John 5:11-12
God has given to us eternal life [zōḗ], and this life [zōḗ] is in His Son. He that has the Son has (eternal) life; and he that has not the Son of God has not (eternal) life [zōḗ].

In-between Adam's death and the second death came the Resurrection of the dead:

"I am the Resurrection [anastasis] and the (eternal) life [zoe]!" (John 11:25)​

The resurrection of the body; and immortality; and "no more death" go together like a hand in a glove:

"When this corruptible shall have put on incorruption, and this mortal shall have put on immortality, then shall be brought to pass the saying that is written, Death is swallowed up in victory." (1 Corinthians 15:54)

Paul was writing to the Corinthians about the resurrection of the body from the dead in the above passage.

"God will wipe away all tears from their eyes. And there will be no more death, nor mourning, nor crying out, nor will there be any more pain; for the first things passed away." (Revelation 21:4).

First death: "For as in Adam all die, even so in Christ shall all be made alive." (1 Corinthians 15:22).

Second death: "Death and hades were cast into the lake of fire. This is the second death." (Revelation 20:14).

IMMORTALITY​

The Theology of many main-stream Christian churches: It is impossible for those who are in Christ, who have been given eternal life in Christ, to die a second death following the resurrection of the body, because following the resurrection of the body, all will be immortal, "and it is impossible for immortals to die".

The Bible:

(1) "He (Christ) alone possesses immortality and lives in unapproachable light, whom no human has ever seen or is able to see. To him be honor and eternal power! Amen." (1 Timothy 6:15-16); and

(2) "God has given to us eternal life [zōḗ], and this life [zōḗ] is in His Son. He that has the Son has (eternal) life; and he that has not the Son of God has not (eternal) life [zōḗ]." (1 John 5:11-12).

THE SERPENT:

"You shall not surely die." (Genesis 3:4)

JESUS:

"The one who overcomes, that one will be clothed in white clothing. And I will not blot out his name out of the book of life, but I will confess his name before My Father and before His angels. He who has an ear, let him hear what the Spirit says to the churches." (Revelation 3:5-6).

(Do not hear what man-made theology says to the churches - hear what the Spirit says to the churches).

--- "He who has an ear, let him hear what the Spirit says to the churches. He who overcomes will not be hurt by the second death." --- (Revelation 2:11)

THE FIRST THREE AND LAST THREE CHAPTERS OF THE BIBLE​

Beginning of time: God's creation (Genesis 1:1-31)​	Christ commences reigning over the kingdoms of this world - to the ages of the ages (Revelation 11:15) Christ makes all things new (Revelation 21:5)​
Perfectly good (Genesis 1:31)​	Only righteousness dwells in it (Revelation 21:27)​
Tree of life (Genesis 2:9, 16-17)​	Tree of life (Revelation 21:6; Revelation 22:1-2, 14, 17)​
Adam given dominion (Genesis 1:26-28)​	The dominion of the last Adam (Revelation 3:21; 20:4)​
THE GARDEN OF EDEN NO DEATH until Adam sinned.​	THE RESURRECTION NO MORE DEATH until the second death. --- 1,000 years ---​
Satan's deception of Adam & Eve (Genesis 3:1-7, 11-19)​	Satan's deception of the Gog & Magog nations of the human race (Revelation 20:7-10) THESE ARE IMMORTALS ONLY THE MARTYRS AND THOSE WHO OVERCOME ARE PROMISED THAT THE SECOND DEATH WILL HAVE NO AUTHORITY OVER THEM IN SCRIPTURE​
Adam's death. Expulsion from Eden (Genesis 3:22-24)​	Second death. Lake of fire (Revelation 20:11-15; Revelation 21:8) Only the faithful remain.​

No one can die a second death unless he has already been raised from the first death (Adam's death).

IMMORTALITY​

The Theology of many main-stream Christian churches: It is impossible for those who are in Christ, who have been given eternal life in Christ, to die a second death following the resurrection of the body, because following the resurrection of the body, all will be immortal, "and it is impossible for immortals to die".

The Bible:

(1) "He (Christ) alone possesses immortality and lives in unapproachable light, whom no human has ever seen or is able to see. To him be honor and eternal power! Amen." (1 Timothy 6:15-16); and

(2) "God has given to us eternal life [zōḗ], and this life [zōḗ] is in His Son. He that has the Son has (eternal) life; and he that has not the Son of God has not (eternal) life [zōḗ]." (1 John 5:11-12).

THE SERPENT:

"You shall not surely die." (Genesis 3:4)

JESUS:

"The one who overcomes, that one will be clothed in white clothing. And I will not blot out his name out of the book of life, but I will confess his name before My Father and before His angels. He who has an ear, let him hear what the Spirit says to the churches." (Revelation 3:5-6).

(Do not hear what man-made theology says to the churches - hear what the Spirit says to the churches).

--- "He who has an ear, let him hear what the Spirit says to the churches. He who overcomes will not be hurt by the second death." --- (Revelation 2:11)

 

[Spiritual Israelite]

The warning of shepherding with an iron rod and dashing those to pieces, is literally spelled out in the next 2 verses - serve the lord and accept correction (being shepherded with an iron rod) OR perish (dashed to peices as a potters vessel):

Thou shalt shepherd them with a rod of iron; thou shalt dash them in pieces as a potter’s vessel. 10 Now therefore understand, ye kings: be instructed, all ye that judge the earth. 11 Serve the Lord with fear, and rejoice in him with trembling. 12 Accept correction, lest at any time the Lord be angry, and ye should perish from the righteous way

What translation is that where it says "shepherd" in Psalm 2:9 instead of "break"? I just looked at several translations and they all say "break" instead of "shepherd". The word "break" there is translated from the Hebrew word "rāʿa" (Strong's H7489) and it means just what it says. To break or shatter. I also don't find any translations that say "accept correction" in verse 12.

You are trying to say that the first part of verse 9 is saying something entirely different than the second part of the verse, but in reality the first part is saying he would break (destroy) them with a rod of iron and the second part of the verse simply reiterates the first part by saying Him breaking them with a rod of iron is like dashing a potter's vessel to pieces, showing the extent of the destruction being caused by the rod of iron (complete destruction).

 

[Zao is life]

Honestly I will stay in heaven with the Father anyone can have my place to rule the earth I'm not interested if its true.If I have eternal life I will have no interest in anything here I won't need it or want it and will have no desire to rule over people.I don't want to come back I would rather stay in heaven.

@PGS11 God created human beings to be alive [zao] on the created earth, each in their own created body.

The biblical concept of eternal life for created human beings is holistic (body, soul and spirit), and implies a life being lived in a human body that does not die. The quickening of the body and the resurrection of the body are integral parts of the gospel, which is the gospel of redemption from sin AND death, but many have replaced what the New Testament means by the word death, with a supposed 'spiritual' death. It's false doctrine.

Eternal life [zoe] is in Christ alone, who alone has eternal life in Himself; and He died and rose again bodily so that we - created human beings created to live [zao] in created bodies on the created earth - will rise again bodily, because until the resurrection of the body from the dead, we are dead, not zao (not living | alive in the body); and what Paul called being "away from home out of the body" = souls without limbs.

Human beings consist of body, soul & spirit (that's how we were created - one body, one soul, and one spirit). Until the resurrection of the dead, your soul will be with/in Christ, who is in the bosom of the Father - but you will have no limbs until the resurrection of the body from the dead because your body will be in the grave.

It's not "soul-sleep". You will be fully aware of yourself, but whether they imagine themselves as priests in heaven walking around swinging incense containers, or whether they imagine themselves driving around in a Ferrari fetching and dropping off angels for their missions, those whose imagination runs wild about what they will experience after death (the death of the body), are going to be sorely disappointed (there are a few in these forums), because there is absolutely no biblical scripture to suggest or imply that the souls of humans who have died will have their own limbs without their bodies:

"And when he had opened the fifth seal, I saw under the altar the souls of them that were slain for the word of God, and for the testimony which they held: And they cried with a loud voice, saying, How long, O Lord, holy and true, dost thou not judge and avenge our blood on them that dwell on the earth? And white robes were given unto every one of them; and it was said unto them, that they should rest yet for a little season, until their fellowservants also and their brethren, that should be killed as they were, should be fulfilled." (Revelation 6:9-11).