On the pre-existence of Jesus

[David in NJ]

Distrust not unbelief. What you believe means nothing to Jews?

Distrust is SAME as unbelief as we see here:

Brothers, my heart’s desire and prayer to God for the Israelites is for their salvation. 2For I testify about them that they are zealous for God, but not on the basis of knowledge. 3Because they were ignorant of God’s righteousness and sought to establish their own, they did not submit to God’s righteousness. 4For Christ is the end of the law, to bring righteousness to everyone who believes.

 

[MonoBiblical]

Distrust is SAME as unbelief as we see here:

Brothers, my heart’s desire and prayer to God for the Israelites is for their salvation. 2For I testify about them that they are zealous for God, but not on the basis of knowledge. 3Because they were ignorant of God’s righteousness and sought to establish their own, they did not submit to God’s righteousness. 4For Christ is the end of the law, to bring righteousness to everyone who believes.

Yes, but you accused me of something I don't have.

 

[David in NJ]

Yes, but you accused me of something I don't have.

Please explain as i do not want to be accusatory unless it is warranted.

 

[MonoBiblical]

Please explain as i do not want to be accusatory unless it is warranted.

Unbelief. That would be like me saying since you believe in idols, you don't believe in the ordinances against them.

 

[David in NJ]

Unbelief. That would be like me saying since you believe in idols, you don't believe in the ordinances against them.

CORRECT

 

[Behold]

Yes, who 'came down'...

Who came down?

The "Bread of Heaven", the "US"., .in "Let US make man in OUR Image".

= Him, the virgin born God-Man,,.. who""made the world."""::..according to John 1:10 and Colossians 1:16

 

[APAK]

Who came down?

The "Bread of Heaven", the "US"., .in "Let US make man in OUR Image".

= Him, the virgin born God-Man,,.. who""made the world."""::..according to John 1:10 and Colossians 1:16

....a very strange explanation of this idiom, indeed. Study idioms used in scripture.

I just as well could say 'I came down from the mountain top' to teach folks the world of God who also 'came down from heaven' to lead me. Two more idioms.

 

[Behold]

....a very strange explanation of this idiom, indeed. Study idioms used in scripture.

I just as well could say 'I came down from the mountain top' to teach folks the world of God who also 'came down from heaven' to lead me. Two more idioms.

Straining at a idom gnat, and you swallowed the wrong camel, again. @APAK


@APAK you just need to believe the NT.

Look, this isn't a complex theology,.

1.) "Let US.. .make man... in OUR image".

So, "OUR" and "US".. is 2.

That is God and pre-incarnate Jesus........or "the WORD was God"... Jn1:1

2.) Who is the "Word made flesh"?

See, this not complex......its just difficult to grab when you have been taught not to believe it.

So, as Jesus is the WORD , pre-incarnate, who "was God".. Jn 1... then that is why John ALSO teaches that Jesus "made the world", in Jn 1:10.

3.) This is why Jesus said....>>"I AM .....The Way, the Truth, and the Life"... as "before Abrham was born......I AM"..

"I AM" is......... "God what is your name" ?????????... asked Moses...... = "I AM that i Am".

So, i'll stop there, as this reality concerning the Deity of Christ ... can be proven many more times, using many more verses. but, if the reader is not open to the revelation, then the NT is not going to penetrate that mind blindness.

God does not force you to believe anything.

 

[ElieG12]

According to John 1 and Hebrews 13:8, they at least eventually did know it to be true. But the mere fact that Jesus is God (as many scriptures indicate), there should be no question.

If Jesus has a God (Rev. 3:12; John 20:17), it is evident he is not the God of gods nor the Supreme, the Most High or the Majesty.

Heb. 1:3 (...) after he had made a purification for our sins, he sat down at the right hand of the Majesty on high.
... 8:1 Now this is the main point of what we are saying: We have such a high priest as this, and he has sat down at the right hand of the throne of the Majesty in the heavens, 2 a minister of the holy place (...)

People who study the Bible without preconceived ideas can easily see the truth. Who is the Majesty in heaven, next to whom Jesus is?

 

[APAK]

Straining at a idom gnat, and you swallowed the wrong camel, again. @APAK


@APAK you just need to believe the NT.

Look, this isn't a complex theology,.

1.) "Let US.. .make man... in OUR image".

So, "OUR" and "US".. is 2.

That is God and pre-incarnate Jesus........or "the WORD was God"... Jn1:1

2.) Who is the "Word made flesh"?

See, this not complex......its just difficult to grab when you have been taught not to believe it.

So, as Jesus is the WORD , pre-incarnate, who "was God".. Jn 1... then that is why John ALSO teaches that Jesus "made the world", in Jn 1:10.

3.) This is why Jesus said....>>"I AM .....The Way, the Truth, and the Life"... as "before Abrham was born......I AM"..

"I AM" is......... "God what is your name" ?????????... asked Moses...... = "I AM that i Am".

So, i'll stop there, as this reality concerning the Deity of Christ ... can be proven many more times, using many more verses. but, if the reader is not open to the revelation, then the NT is not going to penetrate that mind blindness.

God does not force you to believe anything.

Ignorance and simpleton thinking abounds once again....needing to believe in the NT, aye, is like saying you need to believe in the all elements, down to its subatomic levels of the universe. If you mean all its contents and its scripture, unedited, unaltered and not added in later by especially Trinitarians, of course. Then if one is to believe in the NT they also need to know and understand scripture, in all its local and surrounding contextual rigors and nuisances whether they make a non-monotheistic reader uncomfortable or not. Can you agree or not is the question?

 

[MonoBiblical]

Who came down?

The "Bread of Heaven", the "US"., .in "Let US make man in OUR Image".

= Him, the virgin born God-Man,,.. who""made the world."""::..according to John 1:10 and Colossians 1:16

In the first version of the LXX, it was I shall make man in image and likeness.

Megillah 9a:12

And they wrote for him: God created in the beginning [bereshit], reversing the order of the words in the first phrase in the Torah that could be misinterpreted...

www.sefaria.org

 

[ScottA]

If Jesus has a God (Rev. 3:12; John 20:17), it is evident he is not the God of gods nor the Supreme, the Most High or the Majesty.

Heb. 1:3 (...) after he had made a purification for our sins, he sat down at the right hand of the Majesty on high.
... 8:1 Now this is the main point of what we are saying: We have such a high priest as this, and he has sat down at the right hand of the throne of the Majesty in the heavens, 2 a minister of the holy place (...)

People who study the Bible without preconceived ideas can easily see the truth. Who is the Majesty in heaven, next to whom Jesus is?

Such a belief comes from a basic misunderstanding of creation and God with us. It is correct to say that Jesus is both God and man. However from the beginning God has foretold us that man is created a mere image of God. Thus Chist confirmed, saying, "If you have seem Me, you have seen the Father...again "seen" meaning a mere "image"--eluding to our own actual existence. Which people born of flesh and blood have yet come to know. Even so, this is the truth.

 

[David in NJ]

And I trust only some of what you say. eh

Trust no one except the the Lord Jesus Christ and the Holy Scriptures

fellowship with those who do the same

 

[ElieG12]

Such a belief comes from a basic misunderstanding of creation and God with us. It is correct to say that Jesus is both God and man. However from the beginning God has foretold us that man is created a mere image of God. Thus Chist confirmed, saying, "If you have seem Me, you have seen the Father...again "seen" meaning a mere "image"--eluding to our own actual existence. Which people born of flesh and blood have yet come to know. Even so, this is the truth.

I don't know what you're trying to express, but I do know it has nothing to do with what I just asked according to what the Scripture I quoted is saying:

If Jesus has a God (Rev. 3:12; John 20:17), it is evident he is not the God of gods nor the Supreme, the Most High or the Majesty.

Heb. 1:3 (...) after he had made a purification for our sins, he sat down at the right hand of the Majesty on high.
... 8:1 Now this is the main point of what we are saying: We have such a high priest as this, and he has sat down at the right hand of the throne of the Majesty in the heavens, 2 a minister of the holy place (...)

People who study the Bible without preconceived ideas can easily see the truth. Who is the Majesty in heaven, next to whom Jesus is?

The question is: Who is THE MAJESTY in heaven, next to whom Jesus is?

 

[MonoBiblical]

Trust no one except the the Lord Jesus Christ and the Holy Scriptures

fellowship with those who do the same

I trust his Father, and I don't mean Joseph.

 

[David in NJ]

I trust his Father, and I don't mean Joseph.

You do not trust the Lord?

 

[MonoBiblical]

You do not trust the Lord?

I don't need to trust Jesus as much as I need to trust God. Same for everyone else.

 

[David in NJ]

I don't need to trust Jesus as much as I need to trust God. Same for everyone else.

What verse is that in the Bible???

 

[MonoBiblical]

What verse is that in the Bible???

"The Father is greater than I"

 

[David in NJ]

"The Father is greater than I"

Where is the verse that says you do not need to trust Jesus?