THE Trinity can Now be discussed.

[Ritajanice]

Show me where any Apostle was born again. Their baptisms are not recorded in the scriptures. Paul was converted by Christ Himself and taken to Heaven and instructed by Christ. I think that count as born again….He was definitely changed

You think it..but is not written that he was Born Again..Amigo preaches that he ain’t listening to any one who contradicts the word of God, yet here he is forcing me to believe Paul was Born Again, there is no such scripture that says he was.

Of course he was changed, but, there is no scripture saying Paul was Born Again..not any of them were, as it’s not written.....I must stand on God’s word..I cannot be swayed to stand on the words of these men on a forum.

If it’s not in the word, then it’s simply not in the word.

I won’t be arguing any more over this...I stand on God’s word.

 

[IronMaiden]

You think it..but is not written that he was Born Again..Amigo preaches that he ain’t listening to any one who contradicts the word of God, yet here he is forcing me to believe he was Born Again, there is no such scripture that says he was.

Of course he was changed, but, there is no scripture saying he was Born Again..not for any of them..I must stand on God’s word..I cannot be swayed to stand on the words of these men on a forum.

If it’s not in the word, then it’s simply not in the word.

Rita, you apparently don’t understand what it means to be chosen or what it means to be born again. You don’t believe that the OT applies to you; therefore, you lack both knowledge and wisdom. No wonder scriptures are meaningless to you, as you yourself have stated.

 

[Aunty Jane]

Do you understand that the Day of the LORD YHWH is also called the Day of Christ?


For you yourselves know perfectly that the day of the Lord so comes as a thief in the night. 1 Thessalonians 5:2


Now, brethren, concerning the coming of our Lord Jesus Christ and our gathering together to Him, we ask you, not to be soon shaken in mind or troubled, either by spirit or by word or by letter, as if from us, as though the day of Christ had come.
2 Thessalonians 2:1-2

If you do a little research, (which I see that you have not) you will realize that “the day of Yahweh” is indeed what is mentioned in Zeph 1:14 and the quote from 2 Thess 2:1-2 is speaking about the same day and the same Lord…but it isn’t Jesus.

When the Jews stopped using the divine name (in complete defiance of God’s command at Ex 3:15) then they began to use his title Adonai (Lord) and this title “Lord” also applied to Jesus because he is also identified as “the Lord Jesus Christ”. Confusion then began concerning this title and what it meant.

“Lord” (“Kyrios” in Greek) does not denote only God and Jesus, but is a title that slaves would use for their masters. It simply means one who has authority…and if that authority comes from God, then that person (human or angel) can rightly be called “theos” (god) as were the human judges in Israel, acting as God’s representatives. (John 10:31-36)

Sarah called Abraham “lord” (kyrios) but she didn’t think he was God. (1 Pet 3:6)

At Matt 1:20, “an angel of the Lord” appeared to Mary to tell her of Jesus birth…..was this “angel of the Lord” Jesus? Did he come to tell Mary that he would be born from her womb? No! He identified himself as Gabriel.

If you have done no in depth study of original language word meanings then Christendom’s biased scholars are going to convince you of a satanic lie…..leading you to break the fist Commandment….that is putting another god in the Father’s place…..so you have not one, not two, but three separate gods sitting in place of the Supreme God, Yahweh. Satan will do this as surely as he led Eve to eat of the forbidden fruit…..

At Matt 7:21-23, Jesus himself says that many will offer their excuses to him when he comes as judge, but he will say to them “I never knew you!”….and then he calls them “workers of lawlessness”. What law are they breaking? The first and most important commandment…..worshipping a false god….one manufactured by an apostate religious system that Jesus himself warned was coming…..’weedy’ imitation Christians whose doctrines are from the devil, masquerading as “an angel of light”.

Do your homework and don’t be fooled by the number of people who swallow this lie…..why did Jesus say that “few” will be found on the road to life? (Matt 7:13-14) The majority are on the wrong road…..

Think about that.

 

[GRACE ambassador]

Note: Feel free to verify ALL Scriptural references

Done and done! (KJV):

Complete Case For The Triune GodHead!

Amen.

 

[Stumpmaster]

Rita, you apparently don’t understand what it means to be chosen or what it means to be born again. You don’t believe that the OT applies to you; therefore, you lack both knowledge and wisdom. No wonder scriptures are meaningless to you, as you yourself have stated.

I don't think you should be making personal attacks on others here.

Gal 6:1 Brethren, if a man is overtaken in any trespass, you who are spiritual restore such a one in a spirit of gentleness, considering yourself lest you also be tempted.

 

[Aunty Jane]

What about when the angel came to Mary, and said she would be with child, how do you think God got her pregnant?

It says that God’s spirit overshadowed her….Yahweh implanted the life force of his firstborn son, transferred from the heavenly realm to the material realm. Angels had materialized in former times as well, appearing as men, some of whom ate and drank what was provided for them in hospitality. But Jesus would not come in that way because he had to be a human born of a human in order to pay the price of redemption.
He fulfilled every prophesy written about him so the Jews had no excuse to reject him, except for their own wickedness.

His power got her pregnant didn’t it?..that’s the part I’m trying to understand..if his power grew in her womb, wouldn’t that power have been instilled in Jesus growing in her womb?

God’s power didn’t “make” this special human being, because this was God’s only begotten son….a glorious spirit being who worked tirelessly at his Father’s side for eons before he was used to ransom the human race from Adam’s sin. He was God’s logos from “the beginning”. (One who speaks for God)

The Father had been betrayed by a rebel spirit, abusing his free will, and he in turn had set up the means for the human race to worship him as god and ruler among mankind, by getting them to also abuse their free will.
In order to ransom the human race, this one had to be also a free willed human, but one who could be trusted to remain faithful…..God’s firstborn was the only one he trusted to fulfill the task successfully.

Could Jesus have had two natures ..one divine one of human nature..just trying to make sense of How Gods Spirit got her pregnant then what he put in her grew into a baby...a very special baby..fascinating story how Jesus was Born don’t you think?

Jesus had to be 100% human in order to pay the set price of redemption….a sinless life was lost for us, and only a sinless life could be offered in atonement. The word “atonement” means “at-one-ment”….or “one for one”. God’s law reflected that ….”an eye for an eye, a tooth for a tooth, a life for a life”…

So the life Jesus had as a sinless human was sacrificed to pay the debt that Adam left to his children. He did not have two natures at once…he relinquished his spirit nature to be born into the human race, and after his death and resurrection, he regained it, God reinstating his precious son at his right hand and giving him a great reward for his efforts.

How God ‘loved the world of mankind so much that he have his only begotten son‘ is evidence of the depth of that love. A willing sacrifice that the devil made as difficult as he possibly could. He tried to get rid of Jesus as an infant, sending the magi to Herod whom he knew to be a jealous tyrant who would relinquish his kingship to no one but his own sons. That failed when God warned Joseph to take the child to safety.
The three temptations that are written about where satan tried to get Jesus to break his integrity also failed because no one was going to stop Jesus from doing what he came to do.

The story of Jesus’ life is amazing….how he came into the world and even as young child, his love for his God grew as he did, shown by his remaining at the Temple to engage the teachers there….much to the distress of his parents.
By the age of 30 (his mother obviously now a widow) he began his earthly assignment, and three and a half years later, as he was dying, he gave the care of his mother over to the apostle John, because his siblings had not yet put faith in him…..they did so after his resurrection….fully realizing who he was, and always had been.

 

[Scott Downey]

Proof of being born again is he was chosen for the ministry by Christ.
When, don't know, but it could have been on the Damascus road, an idea I prefer, as he was praying to Jesus after that and he had before that thought Christ to be false.

Or when Ananias prayed for him and things like scales fell from his eyes.

Ananias Baptizes Saul​

10 Now there was a certain disciple at Damascus named Ananias; and to him the Lord said in a vision, “Ananias.”

And he said, “Here I am, Lord.”

11 So the Lord said to him, “Arise and go to the street called Straight, and inquire at the house of Judas for one called Saul of Tarsus, for behold, he is praying. 12 And in a vision he has seen a man named Ananias coming in and putting his hand on him, so that he might receive his sight.”

13 Then Ananias answered, “Lord, I have heard from many about this man, how much [b]harm he has done to Your saints in Jerusalem. 14 And here he has authority from the chief priests to bind all who call on Your name.”

15 But the Lord said to him, “Go, for he is a chosen vessel of Mine to bear My name before Gentiles, kings, and the children[c] of Israel. 16 For I will show him how many things he must suffer for My name’s sake.”

 

[Scott Downey]

Anyone who thinks Paul was not born again, then why would you listen to what he has to say, and all the doctrine he taught?
Just tear those pages out of your bible as those are just the opinions and words coming from a man and not inspired by God to be written as scripture.

There are some today who view Paul as a false apostle, imagine that!
Cause they do not agree and really dislike or even hate the things he said in his letters teaching the church the things of God and the Christian faith.

 

[Aunty Jane]

Proof of being born again is he was chosen for the ministry by Christ.
When, don't know, but it could have been on the Damascus road, an idea I prefer, as he was praying to Jesus after that and he had before that thought Christ to be false.

Or when Ananias prayed for him and things like scales fell from his eyes.

Ananias Baptizes Saul​

10 Now there was a certain disciple at Damascus named Ananias; and to him the Lord said in a vision, “Ananias.”

And he said, “Here I am, Lord.”

11 So the Lord said to him, “Arise and go to the street called Straight, and inquire at the house of Judas for one called Saul of Tarsus, for behold, he is praying. 12 And in a vision he has seen a man named Ananias coming in and putting his hand on him, so that he might receive his sight.”

13 Then Ananias answered, “Lord, I have heard from many about this man, how much [b]harm he has done to Your saints in Jerusalem. 14 And here he has authority from the chief priests to bind all who call on Your name.”

15 But the Lord said to him, “Go, for he is a chosen vessel of Mine to bear My name before Gentiles, kings, and the children[c] of Israel. 16 For I will show him how many things he must suffer for My name’s sake.”

An interesting account of one who was chosen for a special assignment….obviously Saul was a very zealous man and actively trying to defend the religion in which he had been raised as a Pharisee. God saw that zeal and his potential to be used in a special way and redirected it……the resurrected Jesus encountered him on the road to Damascus ready to persecute more who belonged to “The Way”…..he identified himself to Saul and he was struck blind. He was given a vision of a man named Ananias who was at first suspicious of this man because of his reputation, but he obeyed the instruction.

What did Saul, who became the apostle Paul, have, that the 12 lacked?
For one, he was a Roman citizen and had privileges that were not offered to Jews generally.
He was also a highly educated Pharisee which made him a very different choice to the humble fishermen chosen before him as Jesus constant companions. Paul never knew Jesus in the flesh, but was educated by him just as he had educated the 12. Paul was not taught by the other apostles, but was accepted by them, through the operation of God’s spirit. They knew he was not an imposter, despite his jaded past.

His education and status as a former Pharisee gave him opportunities to speak with the Jewish leaders on a different level, as well as to the educated Greek philosophers when opportunity was opened up to the gentiles after Jesus’ death.
His ministry and choosing were very unique.

 

[CadyandZoe]

What about the fact that Mary came with child, that the Holy Spirit would come upon her...she didn’t conceive her child by Joseph did she.

She became pregnant by the Spirit, so imo he had to be more than human..

Yes, the baby Jesus came about through a miracle of the Holy Spirit. This does not mean that Jesus is biologically different than another man. The Holy Spirit did not contribute any genetic material to Mary.

Jesus turned water into wine, and as far as we know, the miracle wine was no biologically different from any other wine, except that it tasted exceptionally good.

 

[CadyandZoe]

I posted scripture.

I know and I appreciate it very much.

You denied the truth of the scripture.

I don't think I denied the truth of scripture. I said that a Trinitarian translated the passage you quoted, which is why it seems to support Trinitarianism. But the translation you presented contracts John's clear teaching that God created the world, not Jesus.

there is nothing more to discuss when you mistake scripture for some council.

Have you never heard of the Council of Nicaea? Were you unaware of the history of Trinitarianism? Are you curious as to why Catholicism is filled with Pagan practices?

Have a nice life.

Thanks. Marry Christmas to you. :)

 

[Grailhunter]

You think it..but is not written that he was Born Again..Amigo preaches that he ain’t listening to any one who contradicts the word of God, yet here he is forcing me to believe Paul was Born Again, there is no such scripture that says he was.

Of course he was changed, but, there is no scripture saying Paul was Born Again..not any of them were, as it’s not written.....I must stand on God’s word..I cannot be swayed to stand on the words of these men on a forum.

If it’s not in the word, then it’s simply not in the word.

I won’t be arguing any more over this...I stand on God’s word.

I already gave you the scriptures about born again.

Like I said there is no scripture that says any Apostle was born again. They were born again just like you and me. The salvation process is same…You choose to believe in Christ…You repent...You are baptized. Baptism is a miraculous thing…You are taken down in the water….you die with Christ and it is like you never existed…nothing you did, no sin will be remembered and you come out of the water a new person and sinless at that point. That is why they call it Born Again. And you will receive the Holy Spirit. At that point if you sin it is between you and Christ and if you ask forgiveness He is faithful to forgive you.

Romans 6:4 in the Bible says, "Therefore we are buried with Him by baptism into death, that just as Christ was raised up from the dead by the glory of the Father, even so we also should walk in newness of life".

1st John 1:9 If we confess our sins, He is faithful and righteous to forgive us our sins and to cleanse us from all unrighteousness.

Act 2:38 Peter said to them, “Repent, and each of you be baptized in the name of Jesus Christ for the forgiveness of your sins; and you will receive the gift of the Holy Spirit.

 

[RedFan]

I already gave you the scriptures about born again.

Like I said there is no scripture that says any Apostle was born again. They were born again just like you and me. The salvation process is same…You choose to believe in Christ…You repent...You are baptized. Baptism is a miraculous thing…You are taken down in the water….you die with Christ and it is like you never existed…nothing you did, no sin will be remembered and you come out of the water a new person and sinless at that point. That is why they call it Born Again. And you will receive the Holy Spirit. At that point if you sin it is between you and Christ and if you ask forgiveness He is faithful to forgive you.

Romans 6:4 in the Bible says, "Therefore we are buried with Him by baptism into death, that just as Christ was raised up from the dead by the glory of the Father, even so we also should walk in newness of life".

1st John 1:9 If we confess our sins, He is faithful and righteous to forgive us our sins and to cleanse us from all unrighteousness.

Act 2:38 Peter said to them, “Repent, and each of you be baptized in the name of Jesus Christ for the forgiveness of your sins; and you will receive the gift of the Holy Spirit.

Don't you think 1st John 1:9 ("If we confess our sins, He is faithful and righteous to forgive us our sins and to cleanse us from all unrighteousness") is intended for born-again Christians who thereafter lapse into sin? It is not speaking of confession or repentance that is part of the process pf being born again, is it?

 

[Grailhunter]

Don't you think 1st John 1:9 ("If we confess our sins, He is faithful and righteous to forgive us our sins and to cleanse us from all unrighteousness") is intended for born-again Christians who thereafter lapse into sin? It is not speaking of confession or repentance that is part of the process pf being born again, is it?

You see the word confess in the scripture. What good is confessing if you are not sorry for your sinning. Or if you intend to go on sinning.

We all lapse in sin. The salvation process is not designed for the perfect. The Christian status is not about the sinless. If we could be perfect there would not have been a reason for Christ to offer the perfect sacrifice on the cross. No one is perfect or sinless.

Your sins are between you and Christ. He will forgive those that honestly try not to sin. Grace…perfect before God the Father. My motto….Be good and do good. Then again if you live a life of sin, do not expect to be forgiven. You cannot test Grace or play Christ for a fool, He knows your heart.

Walk with Christ everyday….fellowship with other Christians in church raising your hands to worship Him.

 

[Scott Downey]

Paul testifies he is a child of God
So then he is born of God, as when you are born of God you are His child.

Romans 8
15 For you did not receive the spirit of bondage again to fear, but you received the Spirit of adoption by whom we cry out, “Abba,[a] Father.” 16 The Spirit Himself bears witness with our spirit that we are children of God, 17 and if children, then heirs—heirs of God and joint heirs with Christ, if indeed we suffer with Him, that we may also be glorified together.

 

[Wrangler]

Do you understand that the Day of the LORD YHWH is also called the Day of Christ?

So, if I start calling that day The Day of Wrangler, that makes me God?

 

[Wrangler]

Could Jesus have had two natures ..one divine one of human nature..just trying to make sense of How Gods Spirit got her pregnant then what he put in her grew into a baby...

In short, no. Jesus could only be 100% human, a man like Adam for sin was brought into the world by one man and the 2nd Adam took away the sins. This passage makes no sense otherwise.

Don’t fall for abdicating logic through dualism. Scripture repeatedly calls Jesus a man and never God or divine.* That’s good enough for me.


* The Scripture narrative, not fallible men.

 

[David in NJ]

She says boldly that scripture is meaningless. That’s coming close to blasphemy…

BINGO

 

[David in NJ]

You are wrong, they promote love, care for sick, poor, orphans, minister to lost spread the Gospel - always have. They founded missions all over the world. They teach Biblical principles from the Bible. They founded hospitals and orphanages all over the world. Will you go out and do what Mother Teresa did ... you won't ... Who do you love, hands on caring _ apart from any family member?
Were you ever a missionary?
Did you ever take care of orphans?
Did you vow celebacy to dedicate your entire life as a servant to people for Christ?
What have you contributed to the Body of Christ?
I doubt you've done any of that - Just a lot of talk, 27k posts in the last 4 years.


Okay, I guess I won't see you in heaven then.

So everyone who does these generous caring and beneficial works helping the poor and orphans opens the Door to Heaven for us?

 

[David in NJ]

Tell me why I must have THE DIRE NEED TO BELIEVE ON JESUS?

You cannot be SAVED without believing in the only begotten Son of God.

There was a man of the Pharisees named Nicodemus, a ruler of the Jews. 2This man came to Jesus by night and said to Him, “Rabbi, we know that You are a teacher come from God; for no one can do these signs that You do unless God is with him.”

3Jesus answered and said to him, “Most assuredly, I say to you, unless one is born again, he cannot see the kingdom of God.”

4Nicodemus said to Him, “How can a man be born when he is old? Can he enter a second time into his mother’s womb and be born?”

5Jesus answered, “Most assuredly, I say to you, unless one is born of water and the Spirit, he cannot enter the kingdom of God. 6That which is born of the flesh is flesh, and that which is born of the Spirit is spirit. 7Do not marvel that I said to you, ‘You must be born again.’ 8The wind blows where it wishes, and you hear the sound of it, but cannot tell where it comes from and where it goes. So is everyone who is born of the Spirit.”

9Nicodemus answered and said to Him, “How can these things be?”

10Jesus answered and said to him, “Are you the teacher of Israel, and do not know these things? 11Most assuredly, I say to you, We speak what We know and testify what We have seen, and you do not receive Our witness. 12If I have told you earthly things and you do not believe, how will you believe if I tell you heavenly things? 13No one has ascended to heaven but He who came down from heaven, that is, the Son of Man who is in heaven. 14And as Moses lifted up the serpent in the wilderness, even so must the Son of Man be lifted up, 15that whoever believes in Him should not perish but have eternal life. 16For God so loved the world that He gave His only begotten Son, that whoever believes in Him should not perish but have everlasting life. 17For God did not send His Son into the world to condemn the world, but that the world through Him might be saved.

18“He who believes in Him is not condemned; but he who does not believe is condemned already, because he has not believed in the name of the only begotten Son of God. 19And this is the condemnation, that the light has come into the world, and men loved darkness rather than light, because their deeds were evil. 20For everyone practicing evil hates the light and does not come to the light, lest his deeds should be exposed. 21But he who does the truth comes to the light, that his deeds may be clearly seen, that they have been done in God.”