THE Trinity can Now be discussed.

[Ritajanice]

i was raised RCC and at the age of 23 God called me out of the Harlot and chose me to belong to Him.
The FATHER, of His Good Pleasure, brought me to Christ.

When HE brought me to Christ i was overwhelmed of my sin and shame as His Word reveled the TRUTH of His Holiness and Purity.
But HE did not leave me like that, for HE poured out His Grace and covered all my sins.
GREAT JOY filled me to overflowing as HE placed me in Christ.

A few months later the Lord Baptized me in the Holy Spirit, which again left me on the floor because of the POWER that was flowing down from Heaven Above.

This LOVE of God in Christ and the Holy Spirit cannot fully be expressed in human words, other then being FILLED with Peace and Great JOY.
HE gave me great desire to know Christ and to read and FEED and be Nourished in the Holy Scriptures.

I Love God far more than I love the scriptures....I know God, through his Living witness,the Living Holy Spirit, he resides in my spirit/ heart.i am Born Of The Spirit...I am not Born Of the scriptures.

Reading and praying and reading and praying in my room, on my knees before my Savior.

Love the Lord God with all your heart, with all your mind and with all your soul..that is the highest commandment.

The second is..Love your neighbour as yourself.

That was 40 years ago and as i get older i long for the day HE takes me Home to SEE Him who died for me on that Tree on Calvary.
By the Precious Blood of Christ and His Holy Spirit i am His saint, His elect, His little stone in His Temple of Radiant Glory.
No one ever imagined that God would save such a sinner as David, but HE did - HalleluYAH

In His Great Mercy HE brought to me a wife, who i was praying for though i did not know her previously until the day we met.
My wife received Adonai Yeshua HaMashiach, her MESSIAH and Alison became a FULFILLED Jew under the Brit Chadashah.
Love the Lord God with all your heart mind soul and strength for there is no other Way then the LORD Jesus Christ.

​

◄ 1 Corinthians 12:3 ►

​

Audio Crossref Comment Greek Verse (Click for Chapter) New International Version Therefore I want you to know that no one who is speaking by the Spirit of God says, “Jesus be cursed,” and no one can say, “Jesus is Lord,” except by the Holy Spirit. New Living Translation So I want you to know that no one speaking by the Spirit of God will curse Jesus, and no one can say Jesus is Lord, except by the Holy Spirit. English Standard Version Therefore I want you to understand that no one speaking in the Spirit of God ever says “Jesus is accursed!” and no one can say “Jesus is Lord” except in the Holy Spirit. Berean Standard Bible Therefore I inform you that no one who is speaking by the Spirit of God says, “Jesus be cursed,” and no one can say, “Jesus is Lord,” except by the Holy Spirit.

No one comes to the FATHER but thru JESUS.

And no one can say that Jesus is Lord except by the Holy Spirit, who is Alive and Active in me David, my faith is Alive and Active, do you understand what that means?I

I could have no understanding of God, without His Living witness the Holy Spirit.witnessing to my spirit that I am Gods child...the Spirit resides in my spirit, understand..I am Born Of The Spirit ..birthed by the Spirit..= by supernatural divine heart revelation..

I am NOT a JW...I am a child of the most high...Born Again , right before God, clothed in the righteousness of Christ.

“And we know that the Son of God is come, and hath given us an understanding, that we may know Him that is true,
and we are in Him that is true, even in his Son Jesus Christ. This is the true God, and eternal life. ”
1 John 5:20 KJV

That is your testimony..I have a Living testimony and it’s far different to yours ok, so because I was Born Again by a Living testimony does not make me a JW, and every time that you post and quote me of being a JW, I will keep quoting you back and rebuke your ridiculous claims.

I was Born Of The Spirit exactly as Jesus explains to Nicodemus, as the Spirit was indwelling me ,The Spirit testifies with our spirit, get that David, the Spirit testifies with our spirit that we are the children of God.

Also David...no one can say that Jesus is Lord except by the Holy Spirit.

There is my Living testimony.rather than you keep accusing me of being a JW.

My living testimony also lines up with scripture..
You challenge my living testimony David..I’m waiting?

Because my living testimony is not in line with yours, makes me a JW?..then you are very much mistaken..my testimony Glorifies God, because he did it all by the mighty power of His Spirit..God is a mighty powerful living Spirit..he cannot be contained, just you remember that.

You gave your own personal testimony.

I gave my Living testimony through the only way I can possibly know that God exists...the Living Holy Spirit...only he can testify to our spirit that we are the children of God.

No one can say that Jesus is Lord except by the Holy Spirit.

Romans 8​

​

King James Version​

​

​

8 There is therefore now no condemnation to them which are in Christ Jesus, who walk not after the flesh, but after the Spirit.
2 For the law of the Spirit of life in Christ Jesus hath made me free from the law of sin and death.
3 For what the law could not do, in that it was weak through the flesh, God sending his own Son in the likeness of sinful flesh, and for sin, condemned sin in the flesh:
4 That the righteousness of the law might be fulfilled in us, who walk not after the flesh, but after the Spirit.
5 For they that are after the flesh do mind the things of the flesh; but they that are after the Spirit the things of the Spirit.
6 For to be carnally minded is death; but to be spiritually minded is life and peace.
7 Because the carnal mind is enmity against God: for it is not subject to the law of God, neither indeed can be.
8 So then they that are in the flesh cannot please God.
9 But ye are not in the flesh, but in the Spirit, if so be that the Spirit of God dwell in you. Now if any man have not the Spirit of Christ, he is none of his.
10 And if Christ be in you, the body is dead because of sin; but the Spirit is life because of righteousness.
11 But if the Spirit of him that raised up Jesus from the dead dwell in you, he that raised up Christ from the dead shall also quicken your mortal bodies by his Spirit that dwelleth in you.
12 Therefore, brethren, we are debtors, not to the flesh, to live after the flesh.
13 For if ye live after the flesh, ye shall die: but if ye through the Spirit do mortify the deeds of the body, ye shall live.
14 For as many as are led by the Spirit of God, they are the sons of God.
15 For ye have not received the spirit of bondage again to fear; but ye have received the Spirit of adoption, whereby we cry, Abba, Father.
16 The Spirit itself beareth witness with our spirit, that we are the children of God:
17 And if children, then heirs; heirs of God, and joint-heirs with Christ; if so be that we suffer with him, that we may be also glorified together.
18 For I reckon that the sufferings of this present time are not worthy to be compared with the glory which shall be revealed in us.
19 For the earnest expectation of the creature waiteth for the manifestation of the sons of God.
20 For the creature was made subject to vanity, not willingly, but by reason of him who hath subjected the same in hope,
21 Because the creature itself also shall be delivered from the bondage of corruption into the glorious liberty of the children of God.
22 For we know that the whole creation groaneth and travaileth in pain together until now.
23 And not only they, but ourselves also, which have the firstfruits of the Spirit, even we ourselves groan within ourselves, waiting for the adoption, to wit, the redemption of our body.
24 For we are saved by hope: but hope that is seen is not hope: for what a man seeth, why doth he yet hope for?
25 But if we hope for that we see not, then do we with patience wait for it.
26 Likewise the Spirit also helpeth our infirmities: for we know not what we should pray for as we ought: but the Spirit itself maketh intercession for us with groanings which cannot be uttered.
27 And he that searcheth the hearts knoweth what is the mind of the Spirit, because he maketh intercession for the saints according to the will of God.
28 And we know that all things work together for good to them that love God, to them who are the called according to his purpose.
29 For whom he did foreknow, he also did predestinate to be conformed to the image of his Son, that he might be the firstborn among many brethren.

 

[TheHC]

Since Christ is God in the flesh, they worshipped Christ as did His apostles.
As did demon infested man.

5 And always, night and day, he was in the mountains and in the tombs, crying out and cutting himself with stones.

6 When he saw Jesus from afar, he ran and worshiped Him. 7 And he cried out with a loud voice and said, “What have I to do with You, Jesus, Son of the Most High God? I implore[a] You by God that You do not torment me.”

So men, angels, worship Christ
Including His close apostles

The Great Commission​

16 Then the eleven disciples went away into Galilee, to the mountain which Jesus had appointed for them. 17 When they saw Him, they worshiped Him; but some doubted.

18 And Jesus came and spoke to them, saying, “All authority has been given to Me in heaven and on earth.

Since Christ is God's heir, Christ got all authority the Father's authority, in addition to His own authority as God, showing Christ is God.
God wont give all His authority to any man , or any angel.


God, who [a]at various times and in various ways spoke in time past to the fathers by the prophets, 2 has in these last days spoken to us by His Son, whom He has appointed heir of all things, through whom also He made the [b]worlds; 3 who being the brightness of His glory and the express image of His person, and upholding all things by the word of His power, when He had [c]by Himself [d]purged [e]our sins, sat down at the right hand of the Majesty on high, 4 having become so much better than the angels, as He has by inheritance obtained a more excellent name than they.

Are you aware of the Greek word used in these translations that render it here as “worship”? It’s “proskyneo”. Proskyneo can also be translated as bowing down, or obeisance…. as in honoring someone.

If a person insists that “proskyneo”must be translated worship, then according to the LXX (Septuagint), Abraham must have worshipped the sons of Heth.
Because proskyneo is the word used in the Greek Septuagint at Genesis 23:7,12.

No, Abraham “bowed low” out of honor, not worship.

At Matthew 18:26, the KJV (which always renders proskyneo as worship) records Jesus’ words as saying a ‘slave “worshipped” his master.’

The slave didn’t worship his master… only bowed down in token of respect or submission.

Look@ other versions of Matthew 18:26.

Matthew 18:26 - The Unforgiving Servant

Then the servant fell on his knees before him. 'Have patience with me,' he begged, 'and I will pay back everything.'

biblehub.com

 

[RLT63]

Are you aware of the Greek word used in these translations that render it here as “worship”? It’s “proskyneo”. Proskyneo can also be translated as bowing down, or obeisance…. as in honoring someone.

If a person insists that “proskyneo”must be translated worship, then according to the LXX (Septuagint), Abraham must have worshipped the sons of Heth.
Because proskyneo is the word used in the Greek Septuagint at Genesis 23:7,12.

No, Abraham “bowed low” out of honor, not worship.

At Matthew 18:26, the KJV (which always renders proskyneo as worship) records Jesus’ words as saying a ‘slave “worshipped” his master.’

The slave didn’t worship his master… only bowed down in token of respect or submission.

Look@ other versions of Matthew 18:26.

Matthew 18:26 - The Unforgiving Servant

Then the servant fell on his knees before him. 'Have patience with me,' he begged, 'and I will pay back everything.'

biblehub.com

When every knee shall bow and every tongue confess that Jesus Christ is Lord, is that worship or obeisance?

 

[TheHC]

John 8:57-59 NIV
“You are not yet fifty years old,” they said to him, “and you have seen Abraham!”
58 “Very truly I tell you,” Jesus answered, “before Abraham was born, I am!”
59 At this, they picked up stones to stone him, but Jesus hid himself,
slipping away from the temple grounds.

I’m sorry, SteVen, but this is a complete misapplication of Scripture.

Let’s reason on this…

Jesus was not claiming to be God here.
If you think so (as many do), than why didn’t they kill him there?

You say “they tried to”?
Then why didn’t they try to kill him, the next day? Or the day after that?

Was there a statute of limitations on blasphemy that was only one day long?
No.

Why didn’t they accuse him of claiming to be God at his Sanhedrin trial? (The leaders were even looking for false witnesses.) But they never did, not even once!

At John 8:58, Jesus just answered their question about his existence, “You are not yet 50 years old, and still you have seen Abraham?”

To say his words meant anything else, is twisting Scripture.

And the Comma Johanneum, is proof that some Trinitarians are more than willing to alter Scripture.
I do not believe you have this mentality.

 

[TheHC]

When every knee shall bow and every tongue confess that Jesus Christ is Lord, is that worship or obeisance?

Obeisance, the best a person can give!
Because “God highly exalted him.” — Philippians 2:9

It doesn’t change the fact that Jesus was God’s “Holy Servant.” Acts 4:27,30, a prayer of the Apostles and other 1st century Christians.

There is only ”one God” we are to worship (1 Corinthians 8:5,6), the One Jesus worshipped. (John 20:17) The One Jesus called “the only true God”. John 17:3

Have a good day, cousin!

 

[RLT63]

I’m sorry, SteVen, but this is a complete misapplication of Scripture.

Let’s reason on this…

Jesus was not claiming to be God here.
If you think so (as many do), than why didn’t they kill him there?

You say “they tried to”?
Then why didn’t they try to kill him, the next day? Or the day after that?

Was there a statute of limitations that was only one day long?
No.

Why didn’t they accuse him of claiming to be God at his Sanhedrin trial? (The leaders were even looking for false witnesses.) But they never did, not even once!

At John 8:58, Jesus just answered their question about his existence, “You are not yet 50 years old, and still you have seen Abraham?”

To say his words meant anything else, is twisting Scripture.

And the Comma Johanneum, is proof that some Trinitarians are more than willing to alter Scripture.
Are you?

Jhn 8:59 - Then took they up stones to cast at him: but Jesus hid himself, and went out of the temple, going through the midst of them, and so passed by.

 

[TheHC]

Notice here that the Jews picked up stones to stone Him when He said He was I AM!

Once again, no.
They picked up stones to throw at him, because Jesus just said he was over 1800 yrs.old.

Jesus got away from them, right? If he was claiming to be God, they would have stoned him the next day!

The Jews knew exactly what Jesus was saying.

Then why did no one accuse Him at his Sanhedrin trial? All 4 Gospel accounts record the event, but no one accused him of claiming to be God!

You’ve been misled.

 

[RLT63]

Once again, no.
They picked up stones to throw at him, because Jesus just said he was over 1800 yrs.old.

Jesus got away from them, right? If he was claiming to be God, they would have stoned him the next day!

Then why did no one accuse Him at his Sanhedrin trial? All 4 Gospel accounts record the event, but no one accused him of claiming to be God!

You’ve been misled.

Jhn 5:18 - Therefore the Jews sought the more to kill him, because he not only had broken the sabbath, but said also that God was his Father, making himself equal with God.
Jhn 10:33 - The Jews answered him, saying, For a good work we stone thee not;but for blasphemy; and because that thou, being a man, makest thyself God.

 

[IronMaiden]

This is enlightening from John Gill’s commentary of Isaiah 54:5

Isaiah 54:5​

PREVIOUSIsaiah 54:4NEXTIsaiah 54:6
Isaiah 54:5
For thy Maker [is] thine Husband
That is, Christ, the Husband of the church, and of every true believer; who secretly betrothed them to himself in eternity, having asked him of his father; and, being given to him, openly espouses them in conversion, one by one, as a chaste virgin; which he will do more publicly in a body at the last day, when the marriage of the Lamb will be come, when he will appear as the bridegroom of his people; and to which character he acts up, by loving them with a love of complacency and delight, most affectionately and constantly; by sympathizing with them in all their troubles; by nourishing and cherishing them as his own flesh, and interesting them in all he is and has. It is, in the Hebrew text F11 "thy Makers, thy Husbands", Father, Son, and Spirit; though the relation of a husband is more peculiar to Christ; and the words are a reason of the church's fruitfulness, and why she need not fear the performance of what was promised her; and which is wonderful and amazing; he who stands in such a near and endearing relation to his church and people, is the "Maker" of all things, yea, their Maker, both as creatures, and as new creatures:
the Lord of hosts is his name;
of armies above and below, in heaven, and in earth; how great therefore must this their Husband be! to what honour and dignity are they advanced! how safe must they be under his protection! nor need they fear any enemy:
thy Redeemer, the Holy One of Israel;
he who is the church's Husband is her Redeemer; and who so fit as he to redeem her from sin, Satan, and the law, and every enemy; who is of the same nature with her, so dearly loves her, and so able to save her? for which he is also abundantly qualified, being holy in both his natures, in his person and offices, in his birth, life, and death; for this seems greatly to respect him as man, as he was a descendant of the Israelitish nation, and of the seed of Abraham:
the God of the whole earth shall he be called:
not of Israel only, but of all the nations of the world, of the Gentiles as well as of the Jews; the earth was made by him; the world and all that are in it are his: he is the Governor among the nations; and in the latter day will appear to be the King over all the earth, and will be owned as such; so great and illustrious a Person is the church's Husband. These words are applied by the Jews to the times of the Messiah.

2 Corinthians 13:14 (NKJV) The grace of the Lord Jesus Christ, and the love of God, and the communion of the Holy Spirit [be] with you all. Amen.

 

[Scott Downey]

Once again, no.
They picked up stones to throw at him, because Jesus just said he was over 1800 yrs.old.

Jesus got away from them, right? If he was claiming to be God, they would have stoned him the next day!

Then why did no one accuse Him at his Sanhedrin trial? All 4 Gospel accounts record the event, but no one accused him of claiming to be God!

You’ve been misled.

It is a lot of scripture evidence that must be twisted to continue to believe as you do, sorry but it is just the way it is, especially your comment on worship. Go ahead just apply that same interpretation of the word worship to the Father as well as the Son, you do not worship God at all as you have to worship God in spirit and in truth.

John 4:24
God is spirit, and his worshipers must worship in the Spirit and in truth.”

 

[Scott Downey]

What does God call the Son His Word?

6 For unto us a Child is born,
Unto us a Son is given;
And the government will be upon His shoulder.
And His name will be called
Wonderful, Counselor, Mighty God,
Everlasting Father, Prince of Peace.

Isaiah 9
1 Nevertheless the gloom will not be upon her who is distressed,
As when at first He lightly esteemed
The land of Zebulun and the land of Naphtali,
And afterward more heavily oppressed her,
By the way of the sea, beyond the Jordan,
In Galilee of the Gentiles.
2 The people who walked in darkness
Have seen a great light;
Those who dwelt in the land of the shadow of death,
Upon them a light has shined.
3 You have multiplied the nation
And [a]increased its joy;
They rejoice before You
According to the joy of harvest,
As men rejoice when they divide the spoil.
4 For You have broken the yoke of his burden
And the staff of his shoulder,
The rod of his oppressor,
As in the day of Midian.
5 For every warrior’s [b]sandal from the noisy battle,
And garments rolled in blood,
Will be used for burning and fuel [c]of fire.

6 For unto us a Child is born,
Unto us a Son is given;
And the government will be upon His shoulder.
And His name will be called
Wonderful, Counselor, Mighty God,
Everlasting Father, Prince of Peace.

7 Of the increase of His government and peace
There will be no end,
Upon the throne of David and over His kingdom,
To order it and establish it with judgment and justice
From that time forward, even forever.
The zeal of the Lord of hosts will perform this.

 

[Hepzibah]

I would like to present what Eastern Orthodoxy teaches about the Trinity, and propose that what has happened here, on this thread, only proves that they are right.

They do not believe in the same Trinity as we find in the western world of Christians. They believe in Monarchial Trinitarianism, Monarchianism (from the Greek monarkhia, meaning "ruling of one" which says that, the Father is not the same as the Son or the Holy Spirit as He alone is uncreated, the Son and the Spirit, having their origin at the beginning of creation. They were brought forth by the Father. That is all we know about that.

The Orthodox also say that man, being of finite mind, cannot understand the Trinity and must accept that for now, it is a mystery, how the Son is able to forgive sins and save us and how God could die on the cross.

The Son and Spirit share in the divine essence, not just the energies, of which mankind is allowed to take part in, in the Spirit's sanctifying and glorifying work. So they are divine. Jesus Christ is divine.

All of this arguing just goes to show how futile it is and those who think they understand the great mystery of the Trinity are just fooling themselves.

Well it is a distraction from where mans concentration should be - on obedience. Futile arguments are already banned in scripture and it is clear where the temptation for this row comes from..

 

[Hepzibah]

https://www.reddit.com/r/OrthodoxChristianity/comments/oxuxgp

 

[Scott Downey]

I would like to present what Eastern Orthodoxy teaches about the Trinity, and propose that what has happened here, on this thread, only proves that they are right.

They do not believe in the same Trinity as we find in the western world of Christians. They believe in Monarchial Trinitarianism, Monarchianism (from the Greek monarkhia, meaning "ruling of one" which says that, the Father is not the same as the Son or the Holy Spirit as He alone is uncreated, the Son and the Spirit, having their origin at the beginning of creation. They were brought forth by the Father. That is all we know about that.

The Orthodox also say that man, being of finite mind, cannot understand the Trinity and must accept that for now, it is a mystery, how the Son is able to forgive sins and save us and how God could die on the cross.

The Son and Spirit share in the divine essence, not just the energies, of which mankind is allowed to take part in, in the Spirit's sanctifying and glorifying work. So they are divine. Jesus Christ is divine.

All of this arguing just goes to show how futile it is and those who think they understand the great mystery of the Trinity are just fooling themselves.

Well it is a distraction from where mans concentration should be - on obedience. Futile arguments are already banned in scripture and it is clear where the temptation for this row comes from..

What does God call the Son His Word?

Isaiah 9
6 For unto us a Child is born,
Unto us a Son is given;
And the government will be upon His shoulder.
And His name will be called
Wonderful, Counselor, Mighty God,
Everlasting Father, Prince of Peace.

 

[Scott Downey]

The Son is God

Hebrews 1:8
But to the Son He says: “Your throne, O God, is forever and ever; A scepter of righteousness is the scepter of Your kingdom.

 

[Ritajanice]

A few months later the Lord Baptized me in the Holy Spirit,

..plus personal baptism is not biblical ,that you speak of here, therefore I ask again ..where in you do you know thatyou are Born Again and by whose testimony.?

Anyone can say they are Born Again by their own personal testimony...only a personal testimony is NOT biblical...therefore I rebuke your personal testimony, as you have attributed yourself to glory..

Taking away all Glory from God..

which again left me on the floor because of the POWER that was flowing down from Heaven Above.

By the way this is your own personal testimony, which dose not line up with any scripture.on how we are Born Of The Spirit..

God says we must be Born Again to see the Kingdom Of God..

Spirit gives birth to spirit. = by supernatural divine heart revelation.

Many here can relate to your testimony David, because it’s personal..like theirs was.

I don’t believe your spirit is reborn....same as you don’t believe my spirit is reborn, apparently I’m a JW..yet you can’t back up your accusations using the penned word?
You can only finger point and make assumptions..

Plus I keep asking you where you know of God, how do you know that he exists, you can’t answer the question.,which seems pretty odd, if your spirit is reborn?

That’s why I don’t believe one word about the trinity that comes out of your mouth.i

You have yet to understand the Living spiritual rebirth, which is supernatural...plus the natural man has no understanding of spiritual matters as they are spiritually discerned..there’s quite a few here , who like you have personal testimonies, there are a few here who also like me who have Living testimonies.

The Hebrew word for Godis Elohim. The word Elohim is plural, but it is often used with a singular meaning. When used with a singular meaning in the Hebrew Bible, Elohim usually refers to the monotheistic Creator
God, or to the God of Israel, Yahweh.

By the way never heard of the word Elohim...neither do I have to ..to become Born Of The Spirit, that’s a Living supernatural birth.that comes by divine heart revelation.

Try and stay focused of the topic and not get personal ,then I will do the same, no one needs to read any Bible to be Born Of The Spirit / Born Again, as it’s a Living divine spirit birth.which you have no understanding of.as you can’t explain it using scripture.you just gave your own personal testimony.

Just challenge me with scripture, that’s all I’m asking m then I will do the same.

 

[Scott Downey]

I would like to present what Eastern Orthodoxy teaches about the Trinity, and propose that what has happened here, on this thread, only proves that they are right.

They do not believe in the same Trinity as we find in the western world of Christians. They believe in Monarchial Trinitarianism, Monarchianism (from the Greek monarkhia, meaning "ruling of one" which says that, the Father is not the same as the Son or the Holy Spirit as He alone is uncreated, the Son and the Spirit, having their origin at the beginning of creation. They were brought forth by the Father. That is all we know about that.

The Orthodox also say that man, being of finite mind, cannot understand the Trinity and must accept that for now, it is a mystery, how the Son is able to forgive sins and save us and how God could die on the cross.

The Son and Spirit share in the divine essence, not just the energies, of which mankind is allowed to take part in, in the Spirit's sanctifying and glorifying work. So they are divine. Jesus Christ is divine.

All of this arguing just goes to show how futile it is and those who think they understand the great mystery of the Trinity are just fooling themselves.

Well it is a distraction from where mans concentration should be - on obedience. Futile arguments are already banned in scripture and it is clear where the temptation for this row comes from..

Couple verse come to mind about 'arguing', which is supported in scripture, God decides who is right and has His approval. This will be shown at the judgement, if not in this life, if we said the things which were right. Contention as a work of the flesh is only so if the one contending is in error, as of course they are not speaking by the Spirit of God. Christ told us we would be given the words to speak. And we are told to not let many of us be teachers as they will incur a stricter judgement.

We are told to
Jude 3

Contend for the Faith​

Beloved, while I was very diligent to write to you concerning our common salvation, I found it necessary to write to you exhorting you to contend earnestly for the faith which was once for all delivered to the saints.

Give a defense for the hope that is within us
1 Peter 3
13 And who is he who will harm you if you become followers of what is good? 14 But even if you should suffer for righteousness’ sake, you are blessed. “And do not be afraid of their threats, nor be troubled.” 15 But [d]sanctify [e]the Lord God in your hearts, and always be ready to give a defense to everyone who asks you a reason for the hope that is in you, with meekness and fear; 16 having a good conscience, that when they defame you as evildoers, those who revile your good conduct in Christ may be ashamed. 17 For it is better, if it is the will of God, to suffer for doing good than for doing evil.

Acts 18
27 And when he desired to cross to Achaia, the brethren wrote, exhorting the disciples to receive him; and when he arrived, he greatly helped those who had believed through grace; 28 for he vigorously refuted the Jews publicly, showing from the Scriptures that Jesus is the Christ.

Acts 9
21 Then all who heard were amazed, and said, “Is this not he who destroyed those who called on this name in Jerusalem, and has come here for that purpose, so that he might bring them bound to the chief priests?”

22 But Saul increased all the more in strength, and confounded the Jews who dwelt in Damascus, proving that this Jesus is the Christ.

 

[Hepzibah]

always be ready to give a defense to everyone who asks you a reason for the hope that is in you, with meekness and fear

 

[Scott Downey]

Still the discussion has to take place, as a testimony to what is true.

Matthew 12:32
Anyone who speaks a word against the Son of Man, it will be forgiven him; but whoever speaks against the Holy Spirit, it will not be forgiven him, either in this age or in the age to come.

 

[Hepzibah]

Still the discussion has to take place, as a testimony to what is true.

Yes discussion with love, not the arguing we have seen. And no recognition that it is ultimately a mystery.