Revelation 7: 4-8 The 144000

[Galgal]

Well, maybe you missed the obvious Third Temple being built right now as we speak!!!

I turned to Jesus Christ 34 years ago, and during that time I managed to read the New Testament. I know what is written there. And I know that when the Apostle Paul spoke of the "man of sin," he was talking about the "temple of the living God," where now, instead of God, there stands the idol of Jesus Christ - not the Jesus Christ who really was, but an idol invented by the prodigal religion, a false Jesus, supposedly born on December 25, the birthday of the Roman god of the sun:

And he brought me into the inner court of the Lord's house, and, behold, at the door of the temple of the Lord, between the porch and the altar, were about five and twenty men, with their backs toward the temple of the Lord, and their faces toward the east; and they worshipped the sun toward the east. (Ezekiel 8:16)

25 men - December 25, they stand with their backs to God, bowing to the idol of the sun. This is what the "temple of the living God" looks like now. In order to remove this abomination of desolation from there, a Temple will be built, given by the word of God, written in the Bible. Those who are faithful to the real God and the real Jesus Christ will come to this Third Temple. Then it will be determined who is who. Then everyone will see that this current religion should have been called anti-Christianity, because it is Babylon, the mother of harlots and abominations of the earth.

 

[ewq1938]

Okay, I am currently reading / considering / studying chapter 7 of Revelation and came across the 144,000. Are there any thoughts on who these folks are and their mission? Thanks.

The mission isn't stated but they are sealed before the trib starts which IMO protects them from Apostasy, deception and taking the MoB.. Who they are is given, they are Israelite men from 12 tribes. They follow Christ so they are Christians. Gentile Christians are not part of them but all are part of one church. This passage just focuses upon one group.

 

[David in NJ]

I turned to Jesus Christ 34 years ago, and during that time I managed to read the New Testament. I know what is written there. And I know that when the Apostle Paul spoke of the "man of sin," he was talking about the "temple of the living God," where now, instead of God, there stands the idol of Jesus Christ - not the Jesus Christ who really was, but an idol invented by the prodigal religion, a false Jesus, supposedly born on December 25, the birthday of the Roman god of the sun:

And he brought me into the inner court of the Lord's house, and, behold, at the door of the temple of the Lord, between the porch and the altar, were about five and twenty men, with their backs toward the temple of the Lord, and their faces toward the east; and they worshipped the sun toward the east. (Ezekiel 8:16)

25 men - December 25, they stand with their backs to God, bowing to the idol of the sun. This is what the "temple of the living God" looks like now. In order to remove this abomination of desolation from there, a Temple will be built, given by the word of God, written in the Bible. Those who are faithful to the real God and the real Jesus Christ will come to this Third Temple. Then it will be determined who is who. Then everyone will see that this current religion should have been called anti-Christianity, because it is Babylon, the mother of harlots and abominations of the earth.

I give you a BIG HEART of Love on the Dec 25th idolatry and on the idol of 'modern christianity'.

i believe YAHshua HaMashiach was born in the month Nissan/April - Exodus 12:1-3
Now the Lord spoke to Moses and Aaron in the land of Egypt, saying, “This month shall be your beginning of months; it shall be the first month of the year to you. Speak to all the congregation of Israel, saying: ‘On the tenth of this month every man shall take for himself a lamb, according to the house of his father, a lamb for a household.

Let us look at the Eternal Third Temple - John 2:18-21

So the Jews answered and said to Him, “What sign do You show to us, since You do these things?”

19Jesus answered and said to them, “Destroy this temple, and in three days I will raise it up.”

20Then the Jews said, “It has taken forty-six years to build this temple, and will You raise it up in three days?”

21But He was speaking of the temple of His body. 22Therefore, when He had risen from the dead, His disciples remembered that He had said this to them; and they believed the Scripture and the word which Jesus had said.

SHALOM

 

[Galgal]

I give you a BIG HEART of Love on the Dec 25th idolatry and on the idol of 'modern christianity'.

i believe YAHshua HaMashiach was born in the month Nissan/April - Exodus 12:1-3
Now the Lord spoke to Moses and Aaron in the land of Egypt, saying, “This month shall be your beginning of months; it shall be the first month of the year to you. Speak to all the congregation of Israel, saying: ‘On the tenth of this month every man shall take for himself a lamb, according to the house of his father, a lamb for a household.

Let us look at the Eternal Third Temple - John 2:18-21

So the Jews answered and said to Him, “What sign do You show to us, since You do these things?”

19Jesus answered and said to them, “Destroy this temple, and in three days I will raise it up.”

20Then the Jews said, “It has taken forty-six years to build this temple, and will You raise it up in three days?”

21But He was speaking of the temple of His body. 22Therefore, when He had risen from the dead, His disciples remembered that He had said this to them; and they believed the Scripture and the word which Jesus had said.

SHALOM

According to Scripture, Jesus was born in the fall, on the 8th day of the 7th month of Tishrei. People first heard the name Jesus on the 15th day of the 7th month, on the first day of Sukkot. This explains the meaning of the holiday of Sukkot, and why all nations will celebrate Sukkot together with the Jews: Sukkot (Tabernacles) is the name day of Jesus Christ.

The conception of Jesus by Mary occurred on the 8th day of Hanukkah.

The Temple of Corpus Christi will be built for three thousand years. "Three days" are three millennia. Two have passed, the Millennial Kingdom of Israel remains. The construction of the Third Temple does not cancel the construction of the temple of Corpus Christi, but cleanses the temple of the Body of the Gentiles who trample the outer court of this temple.

 

[David in NJ]

According to Scripture, Jesus was born in the fall, on the 8th day of the 7th month of Tishrei. People first heard the name Jesus on the 15th day of the 7th month, on the first day of Sukkot. This explains the meaning of the holiday of Sukkot, and why all nations will celebrate Sukkot together with the Jews: Sukkot (Tabernacles) is the name day of Jesus Christ.

The conception of Jesus by Mary occurred on the 8th day of Hanukkah.

The Temple of Corpus Christi will be built for three thousand years. "Three days" are three millennia. Two have passed, the Millennial Kingdom of Israel remains. The construction of the Third Temple does not cancel the construction of the temple of Corpus Christi, but cleanses the temple of the Body of the pagans who trample the outer court of this temple.

According to Scripture, Jesus was born in the fall

Please post the scripture - thank you

 

[Galgal]

Please post the scripture - thank you

Forum topic:

Jesus Christ, according to Scripture, was born on the 8th day of the 7th month of Tishrei.

Let no man therefore judge you in meat, or in drink, or in respect of an holyday, or of the new moon, or of the sabbath days:
Which are a shadow of things to come; but the body is of Christ.
(Colossians 2:16,17)

Here it says that the earthly feasts of the Lord are a "shadow" of the Body of Christ. Passover, the annual feast, when lambs were slaughtered, was a "shadow" from the future crucifixion of Jesus Christ, the Lamb of God. The Feast of the First Sheaf was a "shadow" from Jesus' resurrection on that same day, Nisan 16.

The question arises, what feast or significant event of the Old Testament is a “shadow” from the birth of the Word of God in the flesh?

This significant event is the bringing of the stone tablets by Moses to the people of Israel. The embodiment of the word of God in stone. We will not look to Jewish tradition for the date of this event, we will turn directly to the text of the Bible. We will accept the length of odd months of the Jewish calendar as 30 days, and even months as 29 days. The unspecified periods, according to the rules of interpretation of the Torah, we will accept as minimal, that is, one day.

1st of the 3rd month the Israelites entered the Sinai desert (see Exodus 19:1)
3rd day of the 3rd month - the Lord came down with a trumpet blast (see Exodus 19:11)
4th day of the 3rd month Moses went up the mountain for the first time in 40 days and 40 nights (see Exodus 24:4-18, Deuteronomy 9:9-11)
On the 14th day of the 4th month Moses came down from the mountain, broke the tablets, and destroyed the golden calf (see Exodus 32:15-29, Deuteronomy 9:17)
15th day of the 4th month Moses went up to the Lord to pray for the sins of the people for 40 days and 40 nights (see Exodus 32:30-32, Deuteronomy 9:18)
26th day of the 5th month Moses went down to make two new tablets, his tent was outside the camp (see Exodus 32:34, 33:1-23)
27th day of the 5th month Moses went up the mountain for the 3rd time, with the descent of the Lord and the proclamation of the name of Yahweh (see Exodus 34:1-5, Deuteronomy 10:10)
8th day of the 7th month Moses came down from the mountain with the tablets, which were later placed in the ark (see Exodus 34:28-29)

The "shadow" from the bringing of the tablets of the covenant testifies:

Jesus Christ was born in autumn, on the 8th day of the 7th month of Tishrei.

The Jews did not have the pagan custom of somehow celebrating birthdays. Two righteous men of the Bible, Jeremiah and Job, cursed their birthdays. Two sinners of the Bible, Herod and Pharaoh, celebrated their birthdays, and each of them killed another person on his birthday: Herod killed John the Baptist, Pharaoh executed his baker.

A newborn baby was named on the 8th day after birth, on the day of circumcision. For Jesus, this was the 15th day of the 7th month of Tishrei, the first day of the Feast of Tabernacles (Sukkot).

People first heard the name Jesus on the first day of the Feast of Tabernacles. It is the name Jesus that is important to us:

The name of the Lord is a strong tower: the righteous runneth into it, and is safe. (Proverbs 18:10)

The name Jesus became the "tabernacles", the "booths" where we live in His name, having come out of the "Egypt" of this world. Now it should be clear to us why in the future all nations will celebrate the Feast of Tabernacles together with the Jews: Tabernacles is the name day of Jesus Christ.

And it shall come to pass, that every one that is left of all the nations which came against Jerusalem shall even go up from year to year to worship the King, the LORD of hosts, and to keep the feast of tabernacles. (Zechariah 14:16)

Now let us read the Gospel carefully:

Now all this was done, that it might be fulfilled which was spoken of the Lord by the prophet, saying,
Behold, a virgin shall be with child, and shall bring forth a son, and they shall call his name Emmanuel, which being interpreted is, God with us.
Then Joseph being raised from sleep did as the angel of the Lord had bidden him, and took unto him his wife:
And knew her not till she had brought forth her firstborn son: and he called his name Jesus.
(Matthew 1:22-25)

How is that possible? In Isaiah's prophecy the name Emmanuel was mentioned, but the baby was named Jesus - was the prophecy fulfilled?

"Emmanuel " means "God is with us." This is not Jesus himself, but the whole society of people who believe in the name of Jesus. This society was born on the day when Jesus was named, on the first day of the Feast of Tabernacles. The first day of the Feast of Tabernacles is the birthday of Emmanuel.

The baby Emmanuel, who unites all believers in the name of Jesus, has already been born, but this name, Emmanuel, has not yet been called upon all of us. The name Emmanuel will be called on the eighth day of the Feast of Tabernacles, a day the Jews call Simchat Torah, which means the Joy of the Torah or the Triumph of the Law. This day in the future should correspond to the appearance in Israel of the city of Yahweh Shammah, and this will become the "circumcision" for all who are in Christ.

Since we now know that Jesus Christ was born on the 8th day of the 7th month, we can calculate when Mary conceived by the Holy Spirit.

The normal period of human pregnancy is 266-270 days. From the 8th day of the 7th month of Tishrei back to the 8th day of Hanukkah, the 2nd day of the 10th month of Tevet, 271 days. What is the eighth day of Hanukkah, the 2nd day of the 10th month, famous for in the Bible?

On the 2nd day of the 10th month, King Artaxerxes placed the royal crown on Esther's head after spending the night with her on the bed.

So Esther was taken unto king Ahasuerus into his house royal in the tenth month, which is the month Tebeth, in the seventh year of his reign.
And the king loved Esther above all the women, and she obtained grace and favour in his sight more than all the virgins; so that he set the royal crown upon her head, and made her queen instead of Vashti.
(Esther 2:16,17)

So, the date of Jesus' birth in the fall is confirmed from all sides: both by the explanation of the meaning of the Feast of Tabernacles and by the connection with the women's holiday of Hanukkah.

 

[David in NJ]

Forum topic:

Let no man therefore judge you in meat, or in drink, or in respect of an holyday, or of the new moon, or of the sabbath days:
Which are a shadow of things to come; but the body is of Christ.
(Colossians 2:16,17)

This is where you derive Tishrei from???

 

[Galgal]

Let no man therefore judge you in meat, or in drink, or in respect of an holyday, or of the new moon, or of the sabbath days:
Which are a shadow of things to come; but the body is of Christ.
(Colossians 2:16,17)

This is where you derive Tishrei from???

Click to expand... - expand and read the previous message to the end.

 

[David in NJ]

Click to expand... - expand and read the previous message to the end.

ty

Will do so later - errands i must attend to

 

[3 Resurrections]

Okay, I am currently reading / considering / studying chapter 7 of Revelation and came across the 144,000. Are there any thoughts on who these folks are and their mission? Thank you.

This is actually quite simple. John told us exactly who those 144,000 of Rev. 7 & 14 were. The 144,000 were called "the FIRST-FRUITS unto God and to the Lamb" in Revelation 14:4.

This title of the 144,000 being the "First-fruits" is also a title shared by "Christ the First-fruits" (1 Cor. 15:20 & 23). This is a specific term for the first bodily-resurrection event, which included both Christ and the Matthew 27:52-53 saints raised from their broken-open graves around Jerusalem back in AD 33. These all shared the same "First-fruits" title because they shared the same bodily-resurrection event.

Scripture gives us the list of tribes which were represented by this number of 12,000 coming from each of those tribes. These 144,000 were all Israelite bodily-resurrected individuals. God used those indestructible, incorruptible and immortal Matthew 27:52-53 resurrected Jewish saints to serve for a time in the early church, and all the language of Revelation 7:1-8 and Revelation 14:1-5 is descriptive of them.

 

[CTK]

This is actually quite simple. John told us exactly who those 144,000 of Rev. 7 & 14 were. The 144,000 were called "the FIRST-FRUITS unto God and to the Lamb" in Revelation 14:4.

This title of the 144,000 being the "First-fruits" is also a title shared by "Christ the First-fruits" (1 Cor. 15:20 & 23). This is a specific term for the first bodily-resurrection event, which included both Christ and the Matthew 27:52-53 saints raised from their broken-open graves around Jerusalem back in AD 33. These all shared the same "First-fruits" title because they shared the same bodily-resurrection event.

Scripture gives us the list of tribes which were represented by this number of 12,000 coming from each of those tribes. These 144,000 were all Israelite bodily-resurrected individuals. God used those indestructible, incorruptible and immortal Matthew 27:52-53 resurrected Jewish saints to serve for a time in the early church, and all the language of Revelation 7:1-8 and Revelation 14:1-5 is descriptive of them.

So you do not think these 144000 might represent those Jews at the end time that will have their eyes opened by God and will go out to preach the Good News for 3.5 years?
If not, have you identified those that will have their eyes opened before His return? Thanks

 

[ewq1938]

So you do not think these 144000 might represent those Jews at the end time that will have their eyes opened by God and will go out to preach the Good News for 3.5 years?

I don't recall Rev saying anything about them preaching the gospel. They are sealed, and later it says they follow Christ but nothing about preaching, the gospel or even 3.5 years. That comes from Rev 11 and the two witnesses in the form of 1260 days.

 

[David in NJ]

I don't recall Rev saying anything about them preaching the gospel. They are sealed, and later it says they follow Christ but nothing about preaching, the gospel or even 3.5 years. That comes from Rev 11 and the two witnesses in the form of 1260 days.

SHALOM
How was your Thanksgiving

 

[ewq1938]

SHALOM
How was your Thanksgiving

Still eating leftovers. How was yours?

 

[CTK]

I don't recall Rev saying anything about them preaching the gospel. They are sealed, and later it says they follow Christ but nothing about preaching, the gospel or even 3.5 years. That comes from Rev 11 and the two witnesses in the form of 1260 days.

It is not in Revelation but there are other verses that connect to the end times that are applicable - in Daniel, in Zechariah, and in Isaiah. The 144000 will be sealed so they cannot be harmed by either those on the earth who do not want their "religious"system to end and their power gone or the powerful powers that are alllowed to come forth as noted in the 5th trumpet. There mission is to go forth and preach the Gosple just as Paul did after his Damascus experience. God is going to repeat that event on a much larger scale and this will cause the tribulation. God's Word verses the false teachings of the little horn. Pick a side - it will get nasty. Anyway, that is what I see from Daniel, Isaiah and Revelation so far. But I still need to understand the 5 month thing in the 5th trumpet... this is a real stumper!

 

[David in NJ]

Still eating leftovers. How was yours?

My wife made a Turkey and all the Good Stuff for three days in a row = My FAVORITE Meal

3 Turkeys = AWESOME

 

[ewq1938]

It is not in Revelation but there are other verses that connect to the end times that are applicable

The 144k are only mentioned in Rev so nothing else can be positively said to be directly about them. It protects them from the 5 months of poison injections but possibly other harmful things of the trib as well.

Rev 9:4 And it was commanded them that they should not hurt the grass of the earth, neither any green thing, neither any tree; but only those men which have not the seal of God in their foreheads.

From this we know the sealing of the 144k happened prior to the 5th trump.

But I still need to understand the 5 month thing in the 5th trumpet... this is a real stumper!

The scorpions inject poison into the unsealed. This prepares them for the events of the 6th trump which IMO is the tribulation.

 

[3 Resurrections]

So you do not think these 144000 might represent those Jews at the end time that will have their eyes opened by God and will go out to preach the Good News for 3.5 years?

If the 144,000 were to be Jews at the end times in the future, then that would make them the "LAST-fruits", wouldn't it? But that isn't what they were called.

"First-fruits" is a Jewish harvest term that was used for the barley harvest at Passover. Back under Mosaic law, there was a sheaf handful of the first-fruits of the barley harvest at Passover that was waved by the priest before the Lord, along with the offering of a single he-lamb without blemish (Leviticus 23:10-12). Together, both of these "First-fruits" offerings at Passover provided a symbol of Christ the Lamb of God and the Matthew 27:52-53 saints who shared that first bodily resurrection event on the same day.

Those 144,000 Matthew 27:52-53 first-fruits saints who were "redeemed from the earth" (by being resurrected out of the ground) went out to serve in the early church as prophets, evangelists, apostles (not the original 12), pastors, and teachers, as Ephesians 4:11-12 described their mission.

If not, have you identified those that will have their eyes opened before His return? Thanks

We are shown from Daniel 2 that Christ's "stone" kingdom would strike the feet of that image and reduce the entire statue to dust with a single blow. After that, His kingdom would continue to increase in size until the whole world will be filled with its effects. This blow was struck by Christ long ago in the first century. (This does not teach universal salvation, but it does prove that the kingdom of heaven will continue to steadily increase just like leaven and the mustard seed before Christ's final return.) In this case, a more fitting question would be "Who will be the limited number of those who do NOT have their eyes opened by then?" All nations will increasingly experience the effects of Christ's ongoing reign in this world up until the final judgment, as the prophets predicted long ago.

 

[Timtofly]

So you do not think these 144000 might represent those Jews at the end time that will have their eyes opened by God and will go out to preach the Good News for 3.5 years?
If not, have you identified those that will have their eyes opened before His return? Thanks

Go out alone by themselves? You have not read the rest of the story, in chapter 14:4

"These are they which follow the Lamb whithersoever he goeth."

Jesus was on the earth when He sent out the original 12 disciples. These 144,000; 12,000 from each tribe, cannot even be chosen, and sent out until after the Second Coming, and Israel is restored. Yes, Jesus is on the earth, and these are His Second Coming disciples. But they go wherever Jesus goes.

 

[CTK]

Go out alone by themselves? You have not read the rest of the story, in chapter 14:4

"These are they which follow the Lamb whithersoever he goeth."

Jesus was on the earth when He sent out the original 12 disciples. These 144,000; 12,000 from each tribe, cannot even be chosen, and sent out until after the Second Coming, and Israel is restored. Yes, Jesus is on the earth, and these are His Second Coming disciples. But they go wherever Jesus goes.

Thanks for your reply! I look at it a little differently. The 144000 are to come before Jesus can return.

This connects with the 4th and final Great Jubilee cycle. Each of the cycles are 490 years in length. The 4th began the same time as the beginning of the 70 weeks of years prophecy in 456 BC. Thus, it was supposed to end 490 years later but the counting of it stopped exactly at the time of the cross or 3.5 years before its end date. Meaning, Jesus cannot return until the Great Jubilee is completed. So, after He opens their eyes and they recognize Jesus as the one they pierced, they will go out into the world just as Paul did for those remaining 3.5 years. Only the Jews can complete the Jubilee and bring in the Messiah.

The phrase “they will go wherever Jesus goes” is symbolic and it means they will essentially have a single purpose, entirely dedicated to the Word of God and do exactly what He has asked of them for the remaining 3.5 years. That is my take on this end time.