Dear Jack,
The Greek phrase "aion aion" means age of the ages. It can be scripturally proven that "forever and ever" is incorrect.
Joe
Why Hell is not a place of eternal conscious torment.
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The Greek phrase "aion aion" means age of the ages. It can be scripturally proven that "forever and ever" is incorrect.
Joe
I have to follow Jesus on this one he spoke about it the most.He spoke about it as a place he even spoke about the eternal worms of hell.
The Bible teaches not only the resurrection of the body of the saints but also the resurrection of the bodies of the damned, that they may be fit to receive their everlasting punishment in hell where the worm never dies, where nobody ever pours water on the flames, and the fires never go out.Then there's the lake of fire which comes at the end.
I think JW believe they only they will be raised up and the rest of us stay in the ground unraised until the second judgement.
You will be raised up at death going one way or the other the Gates of Heaven were opened when Jesus entered.
The Bible teaches not only the resurrection of the body of the saints but also the resurrection of the bodies of the damned, that they may be fit to receive their everlasting punishment in hell where the worm never dies, where nobody ever pours water on the flames, and the fires never go out.Then there's the lake of fire which comes at the end.
I think JW believe they only they will be raised up and the rest of us stay in the ground unraised until the second judgement.
You will be raised up at death going one way or the other the Gates of Heaven were opened when Jesus entered.
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What are your credentials for declaring our English Bibles wrong? None maybe?
Hell will be filled with people who don't believe in Hell!
I think the modern world cannot accept heaven and hell and have rationalized both to state of being in order to believe.Eternal life which is what God offers is not a state of being
Dear PGS11,
When the Old and New Testaments were written, there was not a Hebrew or Greek word that meant eternal, everlasting or forever and ever. When scripture needed to communicate the idea of something being eternal, it always says that it "has no end" or is "immortal" or other words to that effect.
The Greek word "aion" means age and should ALWAYS be translated as such. It's adjective form "aionios" should ALWAYS be translated as pertaining to the age (age-during).
Paul says in 1Cor 15:20-28 that Christ's reign will come to an end after He destroys the last enemy of death.
Now look at this verse:
Rev 11:15 And the seventh angel sounded; and there were great voices in heaven, saying, The kingdoms of this world are become the kingdoms of our Lord, and of his Christ; and he shall reign for ever and ever (aion aion).
So which is it? Is Christ's reign "for ever and ever" or does Christ's reign come to an end someday? Is Paul wrong in 1Cor 15:20-28 or is the translation of Rev 11:15 wrong?
Here is the correct translation:
Rev 11:15 And the seventh angel sounded; and there were great voices in heaven, saying, The kingdoms of this world are become the kingdoms of our Lord, and of his Christ; and he shall reign for the age of the ages (aion aion).
Below is an example of where the adjective form of "aion" is used incorrectly:
Mat 25:46 And these shall go away into everlasting (aionios) punishment: but the righteous into life eternal (aionios).
Here is the correct translation:
Mat 25:46 And these shall go away into age-during (aionios) punishment: but the righteous into life age-during (aionios).
In the verse above, Christ is contrasting what happens to the sheep and the goats during the final age. In other words, the sheep will have "life" while the goats will be punished.
Below is another example of when "aion" is translated incorrectly:
1Tim 1:17 Now unto the King eternal (aion), immortal, invisible, the only wise God, be honor and glory for ever and ever (aion aion). Amen.
In this translation, there are a couple of obvious flaws.
Firstly, in 1Tim 1:17, the word "aion" is translated as eternal. But in Mat 25:46, it is the word "aionios" that is translated as eternal. Which is it? Both cannot be right.
Secondly, why would 1Tim 1:17 say that the King (Christ is only a king when He reigns) is "eternal" and then immediately say that He is also "immortal"? It makes no sense. Isn't being eternal and immortal the same thing? So why would the verse repeat it twice? It wouldn't and it doesn't.
The verse only makes since when you realize that the word "aion" does not mean eternal. It means a age of time.
Here is the correct translation:
1Tim 1:17 Now unto the King of the ages (aion), immortal, invisible, the only wise God, be honor and glory for the age of the ages (aion aion). Amen.
Here is what the verse is communicating: Christ is the King of the ages. He is also immortal and the only wise God. He receives honor and glory during the final age when He reigns over mankind.
Also, if "aion aion" means for ever and ever, why say the word "ever" twice? It makes no sense. What can be longer than just "for ever"?
One last point: After Paul's death, the church became apostate. The men who translated the words "aion" and "aionios" are apostate believers. They translated the two Greek words the way they did to support their belief in the false doctrine of eternal hell.
Joe
Doesn't that fit more in Buddhism a state of being rather than eternal life. I can't accept Buddhism because I am not me I have a higher self.I do understand the concept that life is all about experience Good or Bad but I am not willing to go there.
Dear PGS11,
Anything that is not "in Christ" does not have life.
The "life" the sheep (Elect) will experience in the final age is described below:
John 10:10 The thief cometh not, but for to steal, and to kill, and to destroy: I am come that they might have life, and that they might have it more abundantly.
The goats will not have a more abundant life during the final age but will instead receive punishment - but it is only until they have paid the "last penny".
Luke 12:59 I tell you, you will not get out UNTIL you have paid the last penny.”
Punishment is not eternal and it will end after it has served its purpose:
Isa 1:27 Zion shall be redeemed with judgment, and her converts with righteousness.
Jer 4:2 And thou shalt swear, The LORD liveth, in truth, IN JUDGMENT, and in righteousness; and the nations shall bless themselves in him, and in him shall they glory.
By the end of the final age, all mankind will be saved:
1Tim 2:3 For this is good and acceptable in the sight of God our Savior; 4 who will have all men to be saved, and to come unto the knowledge of the truth. 5 For there is one God, and one mediator between God and men, the man Christ Jesus; 6 who gave himself a ransom for all, to be testified in due time.
Rom 5:18 so then as it was by one offence towards all men to condemnation, so by one righteousness towards all men for justification of life. 19 For as indeed by the disobedience of the one man the many have been constituted sinners, so also by the obedience of the one the many will be constituted righteous.
1Cor 3:13 Every man's work shall be made manifest: for the day shall declare it, because it shall be revealed by fire; and the fire shall try every man's work of what sort it is. 14 If any man's work abide which he hath built thereupon, he (the sheep) shall receive a reward (life during the final age). 15 If any man's work shall be burned, he shall suffer loss (no life during the final age): but he himself shall be saved; yet so as by fire.
Joe
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Dear Beebster,
I'm happy that you are seeing the same Christ that I see. We are blessed.
Christ is truly loving & merciful and will not pervert judgment as mankind does.
Prov 28:5 Evil men understand not judgment: but they that seek the LORD understand all things.
Job 34:12 Yea, surely God will not do wickedly, neither will the Almighty pervert judgment.
Joe
I would push against this notion--
Ignatius of Antioch (c. 35-107 AD)
Writings: Ignatius, in his epistles, touched on the consequences of rejecting Christ and the eternal nature of punishment for the ungodly.
Key Insight: In his letter to the Ephesians, Ignatius warned against the dangers of heresy and false teachings, suggesting that those who abandon Christ will face "unquenchable fire." Although brief, his references to eternal punishment align with the broader Christian doctrine of eternal damnation.
2. Justin Martyr (c. 100-165 AD)
Writings: Justin Martyr, in his works such as "Dialogue with Trypho" and "First Apology," discussed the eternal consequences of sin.
Key Insight: Justin emphasized that the wicked, after resurrection, will be consigned to everlasting fire, where they will be punished eternally. He argued that this eternal punishment is just, as it corresponds to the eternal nature of the soul, which continues after death. For Justin, the eternity of punishment in hell serves as a contrast to the eternal life promised to the righteous.
3. Irenaeus of Lyons (c. 130-202 AD)
Writings: Irenaeus, in his seminal work "Against Heresies," addressed the doctrine of eternal punishment in detail.
Key Insight: Irenaeus upheld the belief that the wicked would face eternal punishment in hell. He argued against heretical views that denied the eternity of punishment, emphasizing that just as eternal life is a gift to the righteous, eternal fire is the just recompense for the wicked. Irenaeus described hell as a place of unending torment for those who reject God, reflecting a belief in the eternal nature of hell.
4. Tertullian (c. 160-225 AD)
Writings: Tertullian wrote extensively on the nature of the soul, the resurrection, and the final judgment in works such as "Apology" and "On the Resurrection of the Flesh."
Key Insight: Tertullian was explicit in his belief in the eternity of hell. He described hell as a place where the wicked would suffer unceasing torment. In "Apology," he emphasized that the punishment in hell is eternal and that the fire is unquenchable. Tertullian also refuted the idea that the soul could be annihilated, asserting instead that it would endure eternal punishment if condemned.
5. Clement of Alexandria (c. 150-215 AD)
Writings: Clement of Alexandria explored eschatological themes in his work "The Stromata," discussing the fate of the soul and the nature of divine judgment.
Key Insight: While Clement focused more on the concept of divine pedagogy and the possibility of correction, he acknowledged the existence of eternal punishment for the unrepentant. He maintained that for those who persist in wickedness, eternal fire serves as a just consequence of their actions, although his views sometimes hinted at the possibility of eventual purification for some souls.
6. Origen (c. 184-253 AD)
Writings: Origen is a more complex figure, particularly in his work "On First Principles," where he speculated on various aspects of the afterlife and divine justice.
Key Insight: Origen is known for his controversial view of apokatastasis (universal restoration), suggesting that all souls might eventually be restored to God. However, it’s important to note that this view was later condemned as heretical by the Church. Despite his speculations, Origen also acknowledged the severity of divine punishment and did not deny the reality of eternal fire for those who persist in sin.
7. Cyprian of Carthage (c. 200-258 AD)
Writings: Cyprian addressed the issue of eternal punishment in his epistles and treatises, focusing on the importance of remaining faithful to avoid eternal damnation.
Key Insight: Cyprian clearly taught the doctrine of eternal punishment, urging believers to persevere in faith to avoid the "eternal fire" prepared for the devil and his angels. He emphasized that hell is an everlasting punishment for those who turn away from Christ and the Church.
8. Augustine of Hippo (c. 354-430 AD)
Writings: Augustine’s works, particularly "The City of God" and "Enchiridion," are foundational for understanding the doctrine of eternal punishment in the Western Christian tradition.
Key Insight: Augustine was one of the most influential proponents of the doctrine of eternal hell. He argued that the punishment of the damned is as eternal as the life of the blessed. In "The City of God," Augustine asserted that the torments of hell are everlasting and that the wicked will be subjected to unending fire as a result of their sins. He strongly opposed any notion of universal salvation or the annihilation of the soul.
The early Church Fathers, with the exception of Origen’s speculative views, largely upheld the doctrine of eternal punishment in hell. They taught that hell is a place of unending torment for the wicked, a doctrine rooted in their interpretation of Scripture and the belief in the eternal consequences of rejecting God. Their writings have significantly influenced the development of Christian eschatology, particularly the understanding of the afterlife and divine justice.
Primary Sources:
Ignatius of Antioch:
Letter to the Ephesians (Chapter 16)
Letter to the Smyrnaeans (Chapter 7)
Justin Martyr:
First Apology (Chapter 8, Chapter 21)
Dialogue with Trypho (Chapter 117)
Irenaeus of Lyons:
Against Heresies (Book 2, Chapter 28, Section 7; Book 4, Chapter 28, Section 2; Book 5, Chapter 27, Section 2)
Tertullian:
Apology (Chapter 48)
On the Resurrection of the Flesh (Chapter 35)
Against Marcion (Book 1, Chapter 22; Book 4, Chapter 34)
Clement of Alexandria:
The Stromata (Book 4, Chapter 24; Book 7, Chapter 6)
Exhortation to the Greeks (Chapter 10)
Origen:
On First Principles (Book 1, Chapter 6, Section 3; Book 2, Chapter 10)
Against Celsus (Book 6, Chapter 26)
Cyprian of Carthage:
Epistle 55 (To the People of Thibaris, Chapter 9)
On the Mortality (Chapter 26)
Augustine of Hippo:
The City of God (Book 21, Chapters 10-23)
Enchiridion (Chapters 103-112)
Secondary Sources:
J.N.D. Kelly, Early Christian Doctrines – A comprehensive study of the doctrines held by the early Church Fathers, including their views on eternal punishment.
William R. Crockett and Zondervan, Four Views on Hell – This book provides an overview of different perspectives on hell, including the traditional view held by the Church Fathers.
Henry Bettenson and Chris Maunder, Documents of the Christian Church – A collection of essential writings from the early Church, including passages related to the doctrine of hell.
Worth reading.
J.
Dear Johann,
The church became apostate shortly after Paul's death. Using church history and church leaders as a guide to understanding God's Word should never be done. Scripture is sufficient.
Joe
I appreciate the response-
One question.
Eternal Life (ζωὴ αἰώνιος)
Greek Word: ζωὴ αἰώνιος (zōē aiōnios)
Scripture References:
John 3:16: "For God so loved the world that He gave His only begotten Son, that whoever believes in Him should not perish but have everlasting life (ζωὴν αἰώνιον)." (NKJV)
John 17:3: "And this is eternal life (ζωὴ αἰώνιος), that they may know You, the only true God, and Jesus Christ whom You have sent." (NKJV)
Romans 6:23: "For the wages of sin is death, but the gift of God is eternal life (ζωὴ αἰώνιος) in Christ Jesus our Lord." (NKJV)
Eternal Death (often referred to as the "second death" or "eternal punishment")
Greek Words:
θάνατος αἰώνιος (thanatos aiōnios) - Eternal death
αἰώνιος κόλασις (aiōnios kolasis) - Eternal punishment
δεύτερος θάνατος (deuteros thanatos) - Second death
Scripture References:
Matthew 25:46: "And these will go away into everlasting punishment (αἰώνιος κόλασις), but the righteous into eternal life (ζωὴ αἰώνιος)." (NKJV)
2 Thessalonians 1:9: "These shall be punished with everlasting destruction (αἰώνιος ὄλεθρος) from the presence of the Lord and from the glory of His power." (NKJV)
Revelation 20:14: "Then Death and Hades were cast into the lake of fire. This is the second death (δεύτερος θάνατος)." (NKJV)
Revelation 21:8: "But the cowardly, unbelieving, abominable, murderers, sexually immoral, sorcerers, idolaters, and all liars shall have their part in the lake which burns with fire and brimstone, which is the second death (δεύτερος θάνατος)." (NKJV)
EVERL`ASTING, a. [ever and lasting.] Lasting or enduring for ever; eternal; existing or continuing without end; immortal.
The everlasting God, or Jehovah. Gen 21.
Everlasting fire; everlasting punishment. Mat 18:25.
1. Perpetual; continuing indefinitely, or during the present state of things.
I will give thee, and thy seed after thee, the land of Canaan, for an everlasting possession. Gen 17.
The everlasting hills or mountains. Genesis. Habakkuk.
2. In popular usage, endless; continual; unintermitted; as, the family is disturbed with everlasting disputes.
EVERL`ASTING, n. Eternity; eternal duration, past and future.
From everlasting to everlasting, thou art God. Psa 90.
Webster
So is "eternal life temporal?" Yes or no?
Aunty Jane
Well-Known Member
Nowhere does the Bible say this.....
A very well known Scripture is John 3:16....but emphasis is always given to the first part of that verse, but it is the latter part that tells the story.....
“For God so loved the world, that he gave his only begotten Son, that whosoever believeth in him should not perish, but have everlasting life.”
What is the flip side to “everlasting life”....what is the contrast here? What does it mean to “perish”....look up that word in Strongs Concordance....those who “perish” are not saved.....there is no universal salvation, as much as many wish there was.
There is no way to dodge the bullet if you are found on the wrong side of Jehovah…..there is only one road that leads to life…and it is cramped and narrow for a reason. (Matt 7:13-14; 21-23)
It is the responsibility of every individual....otherwise, what is the point of preaching the Kingdom message?
Jesus sent out his disciples to search for the “worthy” ones, (Matt 10:11-14) and if they were well received, they were to stay and impart the Christian message to those people......those who rejected the disciples were left to their own beliefs, which were never going to save them.....Jesus never told his disciples to do anything to force them to “believe”....it was up to the individual to respond, one way or the other.
Nonsense.....the new covenant was a dispensing of the old system of worship with its priesthood and Temple, where sacrifices were offered regularly for the sins of the people......so, when Christ came and offered the ultimate sacrifice “once for all time”....there was no longer a need for an earthly priesthood or Temple....they were done away with. Which is why a third Temple was never built.
James tells us that “faith without works is dead”....our faith is demonstrated by our works....neither on their own is of any value, unless they are practiced together. (James 2:14-126)
ETERNAL (aiōnios)
Robert B. Girdlestone, in his book Synonyms of the Old Testament, has an interesting comment on the word "eternal":
"The adjective aiōnios is used more than forty times in the N.T. with respect to eternal life, which is regarded partly as a present gift, partly as a promise for the future. It is also applied to God's endless existence in Rom. 16.26; to the endless efficacy of Christ's atonement in Heb. 9.12; 13.20; and to past ages in Rom. 16.25; 2 Tim. 1.9; Titus 1.2.
This word is used with reference to eternal fire, Matt. 18.8; 25.41; Jude 1:7; eternal punishment, Matt. 25.46; eternal judgment or condemnation, Mark 3.29; Heb. 6.2; eternal destruction, 2 Thess. 1:9. The word in these passages implies finality, and apparently signifies that when these judgments shall be inflicted, the time of probation, change, or the chance of retrieving one's fortune, will have gone by absolutely and for ever. We understand very little about the future, about the relation of human life to the rest of existence, and about the moral weight of unbelief, as viewed in the light of eternity. If, on the one hand, it is wrong to add to God's word, on the other we must not take away from it; and if we stagger under the doctrine of eternal punishment as it is set forth in Scripture, we must be content to wait, cleaving to the Gospel of God's love in Christ, while acknowledging that there is a dark background which we are unable to comprehend" (pp. 318-319).
Utley.
Dear Johann,
Eternal life never ends but there are no verses that say "eternal".
Scripture primarily teaches about the things which happen during the ages. Christ is the God of the ages, the Elect receive life during the ages, the Day of the Lord occurs during the ages and so forth. That does not mean that Christ and His children won't have life outside of the ages.
To teach the truth of eternal life, scripture will say "immortal" or "no end" or "never perish" or "never die".
Look at these examples:
Psa 102:27 But thou art the same, and thy years shall have no end (eternal/immortal).
Isa 9:7 Of the increase of his government and peace there shall be no end (eternal), upon the throne of David, and upon his kingdom, to order it, and to establish it with judgment and with justice from henceforth even for ever (for the ages). The zeal of the LORD of hosts will perform this.
Luke 1:33 And he shall reign over the house of Jacob for ever (for the ages); and of his kingdom there shall be no end (eternal).
Christ will reign only for the ages but His kingdom has no end (eternal).
John 10:28 And I give unto them eternal life (life in the ages); and they shall never perish (eternal/immortal), neither shall any man pluck them out of my hand.
John 10:28 (like 1Tim 1:17) makes no sense if "aion" means eternal. It says that Christ will give them life in the ages PLUS they will never perish. If "aion" meant eternal, why would the verse still have to add "they shall never perish"?
John 11:26 And whosoever liveth and believeth in me shall never die (eternal/immortal). Believest thou this?
As I said earlier, "aion" should always be translated as "ages", it never means eternal.
The definitions that you listed for "aion" and "aionios" are not accurate when they say the word can mean eternal or everlasting. The usage of "aion" in scripture proves that it can only means "ages".
Joe
Dear AuntyJane,
You are still using your carnal reasoning to determine what is truth. You need to let scripture teach you because the ways of man are not the ways of God.
And yes, the New Covenant replaced the Old Covenant. But the Old Covenant is based upon the works of man to make man acceptable to God. Under the New Covenant, all the works of making mankind acceptable to God are performed by Christ.
Christ's physical works lead Him to the cross because it was required by the Old Covenant. Christ's spiritual works under the New Covenant changes mankind spiritually into a new creation. Only the Old Covenant requires works from mankind - the New Covenant doesn't.
When a believer mixes man's works with faith, they are mixing the Old Covenant with the New Covenant. This will make the believer "lukewarm". Because they are lukewarm, Christ will spit them out of Him mouth.
Rev 3:16 So then because thou art lukewarm, and neither cold nor hot, I will spue thee out of my mouth.
This truth is also taught with the wine analogy.
Prov 23:29 Who hath woe? who hath sorrow? who hath contentions? who hath babbling? who hath wounds without cause? who hath redness of eyes? 30 They that tarry long at the wine; they that go to seek mixed wine. 31 Look not thou upon the wine when it is red, when it giveth his color in the cup, when it moveth itself aright. 32 At the last it biteth like a serpent, and stingeth like an adder (this is how Satan kills the saints).
The Old Covenant is the crooked way and is called religion. It is the Old Wine. The way taught by the Old Covenant is the same way that the carnal mind of man prefers and it is the same way that Satan teaches in his false gospel.
Luke 5:39 No man also having drunk old wine straightway desireth new: for he saith, The old is better.
For this reason, scripture calls Satan the "crooked serpent". When a believer mixes the crooked way of Satan with the straight way of Christ, they are committing the sin that leads to death. This is how Satan kills the saints and builds his apostate church.
One more comment. Works of faith are the evidence of a person's conversion. Those works are caused by Christ's spiritual work that He does within them. Christ deserves all the credit for them.
Phil 2:13 For it is God which worketh in you both to will and to do of his good pleasure.
Joe
Are you a universalist? Believing the whole human race shall be saved?
Eternal life in Christ is Chayyei Olam
Eternal fire is Eish Olam--question stands-in Christ we have Chayyei Olam who Himself inhabits Olam-this , with the Grammar, denotes eternal/endless-
Hence my question-Eish Olam cannot mean temporary.
INDEX FOR
EL OLAM
Note that the topics exhibit some overlap:
(I) El Olam is the God of History
(II) El Olam is Self Existent
(III) El Olam has Everlasting "Energy"
(IV) El Olam Lives Forever
(V) El Olam Knows the Beginning from the End
(VI) El Olam's Ways are Everlasting
(VII) El Olam Never Changes
(VIII) El Olam's Covenant is Everlasting
(IX) El Olam's Lovingkindness is Forever
(X) El Olam is Jesus Christ
(XI) El Olam is Our Protector
SYNONYMS FOR
"EL OLAM"
God's Name El Olam is His self-revelation. Neither Abraham, nor we would not have come to know on our own that God is everlasting had He not taught this truth in this great Name! El Olam sums up this attribute of His being. God is the...
Everlasting God
Eternal God
God of All Time
God of Ages
The Unchangeable God
The God of Perpetuity
In short, God's Names are all that by which He makes Himself known to men and all that He shows Himself to be. To know God's Name is to know Him in a "supernaturally intimate" way! (cp Jn 17:3) In the ancient world it was especially important to know the name of the deities in order to invoke their presence and obtain help from them (albeit a deceptively futile practice for pagans for there is only One True God Who is able to help!) One of the most famous Biblical encounters is when Moses was confronted by God at the burning bush, and given a commission to deliver Israel from bondage. Moses argued with God, saying that no one would believe him.
Then Moses said to God, "Behold, I am going to the sons of Israel, and I shall say to them, 'The God of your fathers has sent me to you.' Now they may say to me, 'What is His name?' What shall I say to them?" And God said to Moses, "I AM WHO I AM"; and He said, "Thus you shall say to the sons of Israel, 'I AM has sent me to you.'" And God, furthermore, said to Moses, "Thus you shall say to the sons of Israel, 'The LORD, the God of your fathers, the God of Abraham, the God of Isaac, and the God of Jacob, has sent me to you.' This is My name forever, and this is My memorial-name to all generations. (Exodus 3:13-15)
God is eternal, and must needs be so.
1. This is evident by the name God gives Himself (Ex 3:14). The eternity of God is opposed to the volubility of time, which is extended into past, present, and to come. Our time is but a small drop, as sand to all the atoms and small particles of which the world is made; but God is an unbounded sea of Being,--“I am that I am,” i.e. an infinite life.
2. God hath life in Himself (Jn 5:26). He hath life by His essence, not by participation. He is a sun to give light and life to all creatures, but receives not light, or life from anything, and therefore He hath an unlimited life; not a drop of life, but a fountain; not a spark of a limited life, but a life transcending all bounds. He hath life in Himself; all creatures have their life in Him, and from Him. He that hath life in himself doth necessarily exist, and could never be made to exist, for then he had not life in himself, but in that which made him to exist, and gave him life. What doth necessarily exist, therefore, exists from eternity; what hath being of itself could never be produced in time, could not want being one moment, because it hath being from its essence, without influence of any efficient cause.
3. If God were not eternal, He were not--
(1) Immutable in His nature;
(2) An infinitely perfect being;
(3) Omnipotent;
(4) The first cause of all.
III. ETERNITY IS ONLY PROPER TO GOD, AND NOT COMMUNICABLE (1Ti 6:16).
All other things receive their being from Him, and can be deprived of their being by Him. All things depend on Him, He of none. All other things are like clothes, which would consume if God preserved them not. Whatsoever is not God, is temporary; whatsoever is eternal, is God.
IV. USES--
1. Of information.
(1) If God be of an eternal duration, then Christ is God (Col 1:16-17; Heb 13:8; Rev 1:8; Jn 16:28; Jn 17:5). As the eternity of God is the ground of all religion, so the eternity of Christ is the ground of the Christian religion. Could our sins be perfectly expiated had He not an eternal divinity to answer for the offences committed against an eternal God? Temporary sufferings had been of little validity, without an infiniteness and eternity in His person to add weight to His passion.
(2) If God be eternal, He knows all things as present.
(3) How bold and foolish is it for a mortal creature to censure the counsels and actions of an eternal God, or be too curious in his inquisitions!
(4) What a folly and boldness is there in sin, since an eternal God is offended thereby!
(5) How dreadful is it to lie under the stroke of an eternal God!
2. Of comfort.
(1) If God be eternal, His covenant will be so.
(2) If God be eternal, He being our God in covenant is an eternal good and possession.
(3) The enjoyment of God will be as fresh and glorious after many ages as it was at first.
(4) If God be eternal, here is a strong ground of comfort against all the distresses of the Church, and the threats of the Church’s enemies. God’s abiding for ever is the plea Jeremiah makes for his return to his forsaken Church (Lam 5:19).
(5) Since God is eternal, He hath as much power as will to be as good as His word. His promises are established upon His eternity, and this perfection is a main ground of trust (Isa 26:4).
EL OLAM KNOWS THE
BEGINNING FROM THE END
The Everlasting God cannot be caught by surprise. Because He is everlasting, He knows what is going to happen at the beginning at the end and everything in between. And many times He tells us what will happen in His prophetic word, so that our faith will be encouraged and we will not be caught by surprise. We can know that no matter what happens, His perfect plan will be accomplished in His perfect time. For example the prophet Micah uses olam in the great prophecy of Jesus' birthplace and tribe of origin...
But as for you, Bethlehem Ephrathah, too little to be among the clans of Judah, from you One will go forth for Me to be ruler in Israel. His goings forth are from long ago, from the days of eternity (olam)." (Micah 5:2 - quoted in Mt 2:6, fulfilled in Lk 2:1-20)
As for you, Bethlehem Ephrathah, seemingly insignificant among the clans of Judah– from you a king will emerge who will rule over Israel on my behalf, one whose origins are in the distant past. (NET Bible version)
Paul explained to the saints at Thessalonica that those who had died in Christ would return with Him and rise in new bodies to be with Him forever (1Thes 4:17-note). And then Paul declared the conclusion to this prophetic truth (the believer's hope - not "hope so" but a "sure thing!")
1 Thessalonians 4:17 NASB95 - Then we who are… | Biblia
Then we who are alive and remain will be caught up together with them in the clouds to meet the Lord in the air, and so we shall always be with...
Aunty Jane
Well-Known Member
Have you ever studied what Jesus was referring to when he spoke of these things?
The “hell” he spoke about was “Gehenna” not ”hades”…..both are translated as “hell” in most Bibles but they are completely different terms with completely different meanings.
”Gehenna” was a reference to the Valley of Hinnom, which was just outside the walls of Jerusalem. It was in this very place that apostate Israel fell to sacrificing their children in the fire to a pagan god. Under God’s command, this valley was turned into the city’s garbage dump with fires that were kept burning day and night by the addition of brimstone (sulfur) to consume the rubbish cast there. The carcasses of dead animals as well as the bodies of executed criminals (not considered worthy of a decent burial) were thrown into Gehenna for disposal. Nothing alive was ever put in there.
Because the Jews believed in physical resurrection, their burial places had their names and family lineage clearly marked, so that when the resurrection took place (as they had no belief in going to heaven or hell) God would remember the ones who were in those tombs. Those without a tomb were considered unworthy of a resurrection. So you see this place was never a place of eternal conscious punishment in actual flames, but a place where the dead remained dead forever. That too was an “eternal punishment”. God does not need or desire to torture people forever…..would a loving God do that?
The Bible teaches resurrection….a restoration of life, not “immortality of the soul” as a continuation of it somewhere else. That notion was adopted later under the influence of Greek religious culture and found its way into both Jewish and Christian beliefs…..it has no basis in Scripture however.
Jesus’ reference to the “flames that never go out” and the “worms that never die” were a reference to what literally happened to what was thrown into Gehenna….what the flames missed, the maggots finished off. It was a pictorial example of the worthlessness of those who transgressed God’s law….they would wind up in Gehenna….with no way open to them to live again. This eternal punishment required no torture.
Not so…..we believe that there are two resurrections that the Bible speaks about….
Rev 20:6….
”Happy and holy is anyone having part in the first resurrection; over these the second death has no authority, but they will be priests of God and of the Christ, and they will rule as kings with him for the 1,000 years.”
What do you notice from that verse?
There is a “first resurrection”, which means that another will follow.
It also says that the ones who experience this resurrection “will be priests of God and of Christ and rule with him for the 1000 years”
They do not attain their priesthood right away, but only after their resurrection which Paul states wouldn’t happen until the time of Christ’s return.
1 Thess 4:13-18….
”13 Moreover, brothers, we do not want you to be ignorant about those who are sleeping in death, so that you may not sorrow as the rest do who have no hope. 14 For if we have faith that Jesus died and rose again, so too God will bring with him those who have fallen asleep in death through Jesus. 15 For this is what we tell you by Jehovah’s word, that we the living who survive to the presence of the Lord will in no way precede those who have fallen asleep in death; 16 because the Lord himself will descend from heaven with a commanding call, with an archangel’s voice and with God’s trumpet, and those who are dead in union with Christ will rise first.“
So, we have an order to the resurrection….Christ’s elect (chosen ones) will be raised to life first in order to take up a role in heaven for which they were called, personally….as “kings and priests” in the heavenly kingdom.
Jesus however, speaks of another resurrection…the general resurrection of the dead where both the righteous and the unrighteous will come forth from their graves to a restoration of life on earth. (John 5:28-29) This is confirmed in Rev 21:2-4….
”I also saw the holy city, New Jerusalem, coming down out of heaven from God and prepared as a bride adorned for her husband. 3 With that I heard a loud voice from the throne say: “Look! The tent of God is with mankind, and he will reside with them, and they will be his people. And God himself will be with them. 4 And he will wipe out every tear from their eyes, and death will be no more, neither will mourning nor outcry nor pain be anymore. The former things have passed away.”
God is with mankind on earth. John sees the heavenly rulership of Christ and his elect coming down to guide earthly subjects back into reconciliation with God, and to restore all that we lost in Eden.
Yes, Christ opened the way as the first human to be raised in a spirit body, to heaven. (1 Peter 3:18; Col 1:18)
His chosen ones would join him at God’s due time. No one went to heaven before Jesus. (John 3:13)
The other thing is humanity has no idea what its like they only know this life.We have no idea what God plans are when its done here.Paul gives a hint when he say one day humans will judge Angels - he is implying one day humans will sit on the counsel of God or even replace Angels.Its is not a ending it is a new beginning for humanity that we know nothing about.
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