When are God's Elect Justified?

[Bob Estey]

We have to obey to stay saved?

You have to obey to have peace of mind.

 

[BlessedPeace]

You have to obey to have peace of mind.

This question pertains to those who insist God's laws no longer apply: Obey what?

 

[Bob Estey]

This question pertains to those who insist God's laws no longer apply: Obey what?

If you take the Ten Commandments and add the two great ones (Matthew 22:34-40), I think you'll have most of the bases covered.

 

[BlessedPeace]

If you take the Ten Commandments and add the two great ones (Matthew 22:34-40), I think you'll have most of the bases covered.

All the laws and the prophet's are reflected in the two great ones.

 

[Bob Estey]

All the laws and the prophet's are reflected in the two great ones.

And the Ten Commandments help define the two great ones.

 

[BlessedPeace]

And the Ten Commandments help define the two great ones.

Precisely.

 

[brightfame52]

Gods elect are also legally Justified at the Cross of Christ, He at that time bare their sins in His own Body on the Tree and put them away,paid their debt.

Isa 53 11

11 He shall see of the travail of his soul, and shall be satisfied: by his knowledge shall my righteous servant justify many; for he shall bear their iniquities.

1 Pet 2:24

24 Who his own self bare our sins in his own body on the tree, that we, being dead to sins, should live unto righteousness: by whose stripes ye were healed.

Being dead to sins is also Justified Rom 6:7

7 For he that is dead[to sins] is freed from sin.

The word freed here is the greek word dikaioō: Perfect tense

1. to render righteous or such he ought to be
2. to show, exhibit, evince, one to be righteous, such as he is and wishes himself to be considered
3. to declare, pronounce, one to be just, righteous, or such as he ought to be

 

[setst777]

Jesus shows us the path. It's up to us to follow that path.

That is true, and that is what all the Scriptures teach - there is no discrepancy between what Lord Jesus instructed to that which the Epistles instruct as "The Faith" of the Gospel.

No one will follow the path (Lord Jesus), except those who truly believe in Jesus, confessing him as their Lord.

Romans 10:9 (WEB) 9 that if you will confess with your mouth that Jesus is Lord, and believe in your heart that God raised him from the dead, you will be saved.

And that is the faith by which God elects to save us and cleanse us from all sin.

1 John 1:7 (WEB) But if we walk in the light, as he is in the light, we have fellowship with one another, and the blood of Jesus Christ, his Son, cleanses us from all sin.

Matthew 28:19-20 Go and make disciples [followers] of all nations, baptizing them in the name of the Father and of the Son and of the Holy Spirit, 20 teaching them to obey all things that I commanded you.

Acts 11:26 (WEB) The disciples were first called Christians in Antioch.

1 John 2:4-6 (WEB) 4 One who says, “I know him,” and doesn’t keep his commandments, is a liar, and the truth isn’t in him. 5 But God’s love has most certainly been perfected in whoever keeps his word. This is how we know that we are in him: 6 he who says he remains in him ought himself also to walk just like he walked.

Hebrews 5:9 Having been made perfect, he became to all who obey him the author of eternal salvation

John 10:27 My sheep listen my voice, and I know them [those who listen], and they [those who listen] {{follow me}}. 28 I give eternal life to them [those who listen to and follow him]. They [those who listen to and follow him] will never perish, and no one will snatch them [those who listen to and follow him] out of my hand.

1 Peter 2:21 (EWEB) 21 For you were called to this, because Christ also suffered for us, leaving you an example, that you should follow {{in his steps}}, 22 who didn’t sin, “neither was deceit found in his mouth.” [Isaiah 53:9]

 

[brightfame52]

2. Justification is the object, and faith is the act, which is conversant with it. Now the object does not depend upon the act, but the act upon the object. Every object is prior to the act, which is conversant with it; unless it be when an act gives being to the object, which cannot be the case here; unless we make faith to be the cause or matter of our justification, which has been already disproved. Faith is the evidence, not the cause of justification; and if it is an evidence, that of which it is an evidence must exist before it. Faith is indeed the evidence of things not seen; but it is not the evidence of things that are not: what the eye is in the body, that faith is in the soul. The eye, by virtue of its visive faculty beholds sensible objects, but does not produce them; and did they not previously exist, could not behold them. We see the sun shining in its brightness, but did it not exist before, it could not be visible to us; the same observation will hold good in ten thousand other instances. Faith is the hand which receives the blessing of justification from the Lord, and righteousness, by which the soul is justified from the God of its salvation; but then this blessing must exist before faith can receive it. If any should think fit to distinguish between the act of justification, and the righteousness of Christ, by which we are justified; and object, That not justification, but the righteousness of Christ, is the object of faith; I reply, Either the righteousness of Christ, as justifying, is the object of faith, or it is not: if it is not, then it is useless, and to be laid aside in the business of justification; if, as justifying, it is the object of faith, what is it else but justification? Christ's righteousness justifying me, is my justification before God, and as such, my faith considers it, and says with the church, Surely, in the Lord have I righteousness and strength. (Isa. 45:24)

 

[brightfame52]

Reasons for Eternal Justification, derived from scripture or scriptural principles. Eternal Justification meaning Gods Elect were actually Justified before God, premised on the Death of Christ, before the foundation of the world. One reason is because Justification is the act of the Eternal God. Notice Rom 8:33

33 Who shall lay any thing to the charge of God's elect? It is God that justifieth.

Deut 33:27

The eternal God is thy refuge, and underneath are the everlasting arms: and he shall thrust out the enemy from before thee; and shall say, Destroy them.

Justification is an act which begins and ends in God and takes place outside of time !

 

[brightfame52]

One reason is because Christ has been from everlasting setup as Mediator between God and His Chosen. Prov 8:23

23 I was set up from everlasting, from the beginning, or ever the earth was.

Mich 5:2

But thou, Bethlehem Ephratah, though thou be little among the thousands of Judah, yet out of thee shall he come forth unto me that is to be ruler in Israel; whose goings forth have been from of old, from everlasting.

1 Tim 2:5

5 For there is one God, and one mediator between God and men, the man Christ Jesus;

Christ was Mediator for men in Adam ! Adam had Christ for his Mediator and the elect in him.

 

[Scott Downey]

Romans 4​

The Promise Granted Through Faith​

13 For the promise that he would be the heir of the world was not to Abraham or to his seed through the law, but through the righteousness of faith. 14 For if those who are of the law are heirs, faith is made void and the promise made of no effect, 15 because the law brings about wrath; for where there is no law there is no transgression.

16 Therefore it is of faith that it might be according to grace, so that the promise might be [d]sure to all the seed, not only to those who are of the law, but also to those who are of the faith of Abraham, who is the father of us all 17 (as it is written, “I have made you a father of many nations”) in the presence of Him whom he believed—God, who gives life to the dead and calls those things which do not exist as though they did; 18 who, contrary to hope, in hope believed, so that he became the father of many nations, according to what was spoken, “So shall your descendants be.” 19 And not being weak in faith, he did not consider his own body, already dead (since he was about a hundred years old), and the deadness of Sarah’s womb. 20 He did not waver at the promise of God through unbelief, but was strengthened in faith, giving glory to God, 21 and being fully convinced that what He had promised He was also able to perform. 22 And therefore “it was accounted to him for righteousness.”

23 Now it was not written for his sake alone that it was imputed to him, 24 but also for us. It shall be imputed to us who believe in Him who raised up Jesus our Lord from the dead, 25 who was delivered up because of our offenses, and was raised because of our justification.

 

[Scott Downey]

That v16 is very important. It is according to GRACE that you have been saved. God's grace given to us (all the seed), His Grace underlies all and it is driven by His mercy towards us, that He foreknew as in a relationship with Himself.

God uses the means of faith, as we believe in HIM, Christ, so our sins are not imputed to us who believe. And that faith is one of God's gifts to the seed of Abraham...

Therefore it is of faith that it might be according to grace, so that the promise might be [d]sure to all the seed,

Then Hebrews 2 says, and ask yourself who are the children??

Bringing Many Sons to Glory​

10 For it was fitting for Him, for whom are all things and by whom are all things, in bringing many sons to glory, to make the captain of their salvation perfect through sufferings. 11 For both He who [g]sanctifies and those who are being sanctified are all of one, for which reason He is not ashamed to call them brethren, 12 saying:

“I will declare Your name to My brethren;
In the midst of the assembly I will sing praise to You.”
13 And again:

“I will put My trust in Him.”
And again:

“Here am I and the children whom God has given Me.”
14 Inasmuch then as the children have partaken of flesh and blood, He Himself likewise shared in the same, that through death He might destroy him who had the power of death, that is, the devil, 15 and release those who through fear of death were all their lifetime subject to bondage. 16 For indeed He does not [h]give aid to angels, but He does [i]give aid to the seed of Abraham. 17 Therefore, in all things He had to be made like His brethren, that He might be a merciful and faithful High Priest in things pertaining to God, to make propitiation for the sins of the people. 18 For in that He Himself has suffered, being [j]tempted, He is able to aid those who are tempted.

Who does God aid to salvation?? Only the seed of Abraham. Refer back now to Romans 4:16...
The promise God has made sure to all the seed...only they are his brethren as God has granted them to believe in Christ.

Did you know your belief was granted to you by God?

Philippians 1:28-30


​

28 and not in any way terrified by your adversaries, which is to them a proof of perdition, but [a]to you of salvation, and that from God. 29 For to you it has been granted on behalf of Christ, not only to believe in Him, but also to suffer for His sake, 30 having the same conflict which you saw in me and now hear is in me.

 

[brightfame52]

Another reason for eternal justification of Gods elect, which is closely akin to His being Mediator, is that He was also made I believe to be a Surety for Gods Elect before the foundation Heb 7:22

22 By so much was Jesus made a surety of a better testament.

That belter testament or covenant is the everlasting covenant which was confirmed as the new covenant in time.

And Hes called the Mediator of the new covenant as well Heb 12:24

And to Jesus the mediator of the new covenant, and to the blood of sprinkling, that speaketh better things than that of Abel.

As such Mediator Surety He became responsible for the sins of the elect before the foundation, hence they themselves never became responsible for their sins, so therefore Justified from them.

 

[brightfame52]

Another reason for eternal justification of Gods elect is that before the world began, according to their being chosen in Christ, they were blessed [in Him] with all spiritual blessings, and justification is a spiritual blessing. Eph 1:3-4

3 Blessed be the God and Father of our Lord Jesus Christ, who hath blessed us with all spiritual blessings in heavenly places in Christ:

4 According as he hath chosen us in him before the foundation of the world, that we should be holy and without blame before him in love:

 

[Eternally Grateful]

I think Jesus said it best

the tax collector went home justified. Because he fell on his face in humility and called out for God to have mercy.

It is when we come to God in faith that we are justified.

 

[Episkopos]

1644 First London Confession of Faith (Particular Baptists)

"III. ... God had in Christ before the foundation of the world, according to the good pleasure of His will, foreordained some men to eternal life through Jesus Christ, to the praise and glory of His grace (Jude 4,6; Rom. 9:11- 13; Prov. 16:4), leaving the rest in their sin to their just condemnation, to the praise of His justice."

"XXVIII. That those which have union with Christ, are justified from all their sins, past
(John 1:7; Heb 10:14; 9:26; 2 Cor. 5:19; Rom. 3:23), present, and to come, by the blood
of Christ; which justification we conceive to be a gracious and free (Acts 13:38, 39; Rom.
5:1; 3:25, 30) acquittance of a guilty, sinful creature, from all sin by God, through the
satisfaction that Christ has made by His death; and this applied in the manifestation of it
through faith." *Faith is the evidence of being justified from all sins at the resurrection

Jesus, "who was delivered up because of our offences, and was raised up because of our being declared righteous. Having been declared righteous, then, by faith, we have peace toward God through our Lord Jesus Christ," (Rom 4:25; 5:1 YLT) *Believers were justified at the cross, and learned of it through or by their faith, which faith gives us peace toward God

"But God proves his love for us in that while we still were sinners Christ died for us. Much more surely then, now that we have been justified by his blood, will we be saved through him from the wrath of God. For if while we were enemies, we were reconciled to God through the death of his Son, much more surely, having been reconciled, will we be saved by his life." (Rom 5:8-10 NRSV) *We were justified and reconciled at the cross, not at our moment of belief

"...but it has now been revealed through the appearing of our Savior Christ Jesus, who abolished death and brought life and immortality to light through the gospel." (2Tim 1:10 NRSV) *The gospel brought the justification to light, brought the evidence of salvation to the mind of the elect by faith

"...and all who dwell on earth will worship it, every one whose name has not been written before the foundation of the world in the book of life of the Lamb that was slain." (Rev 13:8 RSV) *One must have been seen as justified when written in the book of life

A Holy and Sovereign God was under no obligation to save anyone. He by right could save all, some or none, and sinful man cannot presume to judge his fairness. Considering the relationship of faith to justification, is it not fair to believe God saved elect babies dying in infancy, or saving the mentally incompetent, without their believing?

Do we know that there were NO elect among the native Americans who believed in the Great White Spirit and Creator before man and the Bible appeared? How do we know there are elect among babies dying in infancy? There are those who have the law in their hearts -

"When Gentiles, who do not possess the law, do instinctively what the law requires, these, though not having the law, are a law to themselves. They show that what the law requires is written on their hearts, to which their own conscience also bears witness; and their conflicting thoughts will accuse or perhaps excuse them on the day when, according to my gospel, God, through Jesus Christ, will judge the secret thoughts of all." (Rom 2:14-16 NRSV)

The prepositions from Greek to English are too difficult to be of certain or dogmatic assertions about time of justification. I cannot overturn the clear statements of God's word about justification solely by the assumed meaning of a preposition. Therefore I believe the Elect were justified at the Cross of Christ.

The elect are justified by the POWER of the cross...as Paul says...it is no longer I who live. This is by the justification of life...and eternal kind of life that has no sin in it. As we walk in that victory we show forth God's righteousness.

 

[Eternally Grateful]

The elect are justified by the POWER of the cross...as Paul says...it is no longer I who live. This is by the justification of life...and eternal kind of life that has no sin in it. As we walk in that victory we show forth God's righteousness.

So they are justice by the death of Christ or by the way we walk?

 

[Arthur81]

The elect are justified by the POWER of the cross...as Paul says...it is no longer I who live. This is by the justification of life...and eternal kind of life that has no sin in it. As we walk in that victory we show forth God's righteousness.

You are mixing sanctification with justification. And as to sanctification, that is never perfect in a person until the last day:

1Th 5:23-24 LITV And may the God of peace Himself fully sanctify you, and may your whole spirit and soul and body be kept blameless at the coming of our Lord Jesus Christ. 24 Faithful is the One calling you, who also will perform it.

Even the Apostle Paul showed that even he was not sinless in Romans chapter 7.

 

[Episkopos]

You are mixing sanctification with justification. And as to sanctification, that is never perfect in a person until the last day:

This goes directly against the gospel. Jesus died to sanctify us....that we may be partakers of His holiness. So you want a lower standard of justification without holiness. And you no doubt want forgiveness without holiness.

1Th 5:23-24 LITV And may the God of peace Himself fully sanctify you, and may your whole spirit and soul and body be kept blameless at the coming of our Lord Jesus Christ.

So that He finds us in that grace. Paul says...that I may be found IN Him not having my own righteousness. We are kept blameless UNTIL the coming of the Lord....how? By grace through faith. We overcome sin and the devil by the Blood of the Lamb....that sanctifes us INSTANTLY into a walk IN CHrist. IN Him is no sin.

Otherwise it is just a religion that has no power.

24 Faithful is the One calling you, who also will perform it.

And He will if you go to Him...now.

Even the Apostle Paul showed that even he was not sinless in Romans chapter 7.

That is...until He was crucified with Christ into Romans 8.