Why are some interpreters not being honest with the text involving Daniel 9:27?

[covenantee]

Modern day Judaeans are those living in Jerusalem, and they will flee in the masses, could that be in the very near future?

It's my belief that the Jews are going to try grabbing the Muslims holy site in the Al-Aqsa Mosque in Jerusalem to build their Jewish Temple on the dome of the rock, this will ignite World War III as Jerusalem is surrounded by future armies, time will tell?

But what about Matthew 24:16 and those Judaeans who fled before 70 AD?

They didn't believe any false bogus malarkey.

 

[Spiritual Israelite]

Modern day Judaeans are those living in Jerusalem, and they will flee in the masses, could that be in the very near future?

Wouldn't people from all over the world need to flee since the tribulation before His return is a global event? Why did Jesus only say that people in Judea would need to flee if He was talking about a global tribulation occurring before His return?

Luke 21:25 “There will be signs in the sun, moon and stars. On the earth, nations will be in anguish and perplexity at the roaring and tossing of the sea. 26 People will faint from terror, apprehensive of what is coming on the world, for the heavenly bodies will be shaken. 27 At that time they will see the Son of Man coming in a cloud with power and great glory. 28 When these things begin to take place, stand up and lift up your heads, because your redemption is drawing near.”

If you can't see the difference between this and the tribulation Jesus described that only involves Jerusalem and Judea (in Luke 21:20-24, Matthew 24:15-21 and Mark 13:14-19) then I just don't know what to tell you. The local/regional tribulation happened long ago around 70 AD. The global tribulation that Jesus described as occurring just before His return hasn't happened yet.

It's my belief that the Jews are going to try grabbing the Muslims holy site in the Al-Aqsa Mosque in Jerusalem to build their Jewish Temple on the dome of the rock, this will ignite World War III as Jerusalem is surrounded by future armies, time will tell?

Nice made up story there. Your beliefs are based on made up sensationalized nonsense instead of what scripture teaches.

 

[Spiritual Israelite]

Christ's ministry and death was 3.5 years. You say there is no gap and the preaching of the gospel is ongoing until when?

I'm saying the second half of the 70th week consisted of the preaching of the gospel first to Israel. You are aware that the gospel was first preached in Israel before going out to the Gentile nations, aren't you?

 

[Spiritual Israelite]

Spiritual Israelite goes so far as to claim 70AD was the great tribulation, then claims another great tribulation is future

Because that is what Jesus indicated.

This occurred around 70 AD and was great tribulation in and around Jerusalem:

Luke 21:20 “When you see Jerusalem being surrounded by armies, you will know that its desolation is near. 21 Then let those who are in Judea flee to the mountains, let those in the city get out, and let those in the country not enter the city. 22 For this is the time of punishment in fulfillment of all that has been written. 23 How dreadful it will be in those days for pregnant women and nursing mothers! There will be great distress in the land and wrath against this people. 24 They will fall by the sword and will be taken as prisoners to all the nations. Jerusalem will be trampled on by the Gentiles until the times of the Gentiles are fulfilled.

Around the end of the times of the Gentiles is another great tribulation, but this time it's global involving many nations and not just one nation:

Luke 21:25 “There will be signs in the sun, moon and stars. On the earth, nations will be in anguish and perplexity at the roaring and tossing of the sea. 26 People will faint from terror, apprehensive of what is coming on the world, for the heavenly bodies will be shaken. 27 At that time they will see the Son of Man coming in a cloud with power and great glory. 28 When these things begin to take place, stand up and lift up your heads, because your redemption is drawing near.”

Jesus was asked two different questions and they were about two different things. The first one was about things related to the destruction of the temple buildings which He had just previously talked about before they asked their questions. The second one is about things related to His future coming at the end of the age. It is foolish to assume that everything Jesus talked about in the Olivet Discourse is either all fulfilled or all will be fulfilled in the future.

 

[Spiritual Israelite]

Correction: Protestant Historicism in 70AD Fulfillment Is "Jesuit Preterism", And It's Father Is Jesuit "Luis Del Alcasar" (1554-1613)

Alcasar is known for his Vestigatio arcani sensus in Apocalypsi (1614) published after his death, putting forward what would later be called a preterist view of Biblical prophecy

Your hyper-literalist and futurist views originated with the pre-trib dispensationalist teachings of John Nelson Darby in the 1800s.

 

[wooddog]

I'm saying the second half of the 70th week consisted of the preaching of the gospel first to Israel. You are aware that the gospel was first preached in Israel before going out to the Gentile nations, aren't you?

The two witnesses will be preaching will be preaching the gospel right up to their death right front of the little prince on the HOLY place. The jews will reject the new covenant until they see MESSIAH THE PRINCE coming in the clouds, then they will repent and believe. This is what I believe.

 

[Cassandra]

After the stoning of Stephen, Saul converts, and Gospel is preached to the Gentiles. This prophecy is exact. No gaps, 70 weeks and 70 weeks alone. 490 years. This is why Jesus said to Peter to forgive 70 times 7. After that, no more.
The Jewish nation lost the kingdom of God.

The Parable of the Vineyard Owner​

33 “Listen to another parable: There was a landowner, who planted a vineyard, put a fence around it, dug a winepress in it, and built a watchtower. He leased it to tenant farmers and went away. 34 When the time came to harvest fruit, he sent his servants to the farmers to collect his fruit. 35 The farmers took his servants, beat one, killed another, and stoned a third. 36 Again, he sent other servants, more than the first group, and they did the same to them. 37 Finally, he sent his son to them. ‘They will respect my son,’ he said.


38 “But when the tenant farmers saw the son, they said to each other, ‘This is the heir. Come, let’s kill him and take his inheritance.’ 39 So they seized him, threw him out of the vineyard, and killed him. 40 Therefore, when the owner of the vineyard comes, what will he do to those farmers?”


41 “He will completely destroy those terrible men,” they told him, “and lease his vineyard to other farmers who will give him his fruit at the harvest.”


42 Jesus said to them, “Have you never read in the Scriptures:

The stone that the builders rejected
has become the cornerstone.
This is what the Lord has done and it is wonderful in our eyes?

43 Therefore I tell you, the kingdom of God will be taken away from you and given to a people producing its fruit.

 

[Spiritual Israelite]

The two witnesses will be preaching will be preaching the gospel right up to their death right front of the little prince on the HOLY place.

What holy place are you talking about?

The jews will reject the new covenant until they see MESSIAH THE PRINCE coming in the clouds, then they will repent and believe. This is what I believe.

When Jesus comes back it will be too late to repent and believe. The idea of anyone being able to repent and believe after Jesus has descended from heaven at His second coming is not taught in scripture anywhere.

2 Thessalonians 1:6 Seeing it is a righteous thing with God to recompense tribulation to them that trouble you; 7 And to you who are troubled rest with us, when the Lord Jesus shall be revealed from heaven with his mighty angels, 8 In flaming fire taking vengeance on them that know not God, and that obey not the gospel of our Lord Jesus Christ: 9 Who shall be punished with everlasting destruction from the presence of the Lord, and from the glory of his power; 10 When he shall come to be glorified in his saints, and to be admired in all them that believe (because our testimony among you was believed) in that day.

Do you see here any mention of anyone repenting at the time "when the Lord Jesus shall be revealed from heaven"? There isn't. Instead, it says He will be taking vengeance on unbelievers at that point. It is too late for anyone to repent at that point. The time to repent is today! Now! I believe to suggest that Jews can just wait until they see Jesus coming to repent is a horrible teaching.

 

[Truth7t7]

Wouldn't people from all over the world need to flee since the tribulation before His return is a global event? Why did Jesus only say that people in Judea would need to flee if He was talking about a global tribulation occurring before His return?

Luke 21:25 “There will be signs in the sun, moon and stars. On the earth, nations will be in anguish and perplexity at the roaring and tossing of the sea. 26 People will faint from terror, apprehensive of what is coming on the world, for the heavenly bodies will be shaken. 27 At that time they will see the Son of Man coming in a cloud with power and great glory. 28 When these things begin to take place, stand up and lift up your heads, because your redemption is drawing near.”

If you can't see the difference between this and the tribulation Jesus described that only involves Jerusalem and Judea (in Luke 21:20-24, Matthew 24:15-21 and Mark 13:14-19) then I just don't know what to tell you. The local/regional tribulation happened long ago around 70 AD. The global tribulation that Jesus described as occurring just before His return hasn't happened yet.


Nice made up story there. Your beliefs are based on made up sensationalized nonsense instead of what scripture teaches.

Yes you deny that Daniel 12:1 & Matthew 24:21 are the same future event in the "Great Tribulation", your living in denial of biblical truth before your eyes

(Future Great Tribulation, Second Coming, And Resurrection)

Daniel 12:1-2KJV
1 And at that time shall Michael stand up, the great prince which standeth for the children of thy people: and there shall be a time of trouble, such as never was since there was a nation even to that same time: and at that time thy people shall be delivered, every one that shall be found written in the book.
2 And many of them that sleep in the dust of the earth shall awake, some to everlasting life, and some to shame and everlasting contempt.

(Future Great Tribulation, Second Coming, And Resurrection)

Matthew 24:15 & 29-31KJV
21 For then shall be great tribulation, such as was not since the beginning of the world to this time, no, nor ever shall be.

29 Immediately after the tribulation of those days shall the sun be darkened, and the moon shall not give her light, and the stars shall fall from heaven, and the powers of the heavens shall be shaken:
30 And then shall appear the sign of the Son of man in heaven: and then shall all the tribes of the earth mourn, and they shall see the Son of man coming in the clouds of heaven with power and great glory.
31 And he shall send his angels with a great sound of a trumpet, and they shall gather together his elect from the four winds, from one end of heaven to the other.

 

[Truth7t7]

Wouldn't people from all over the world need to flee since the tribulation before His return is a global event? Why did Jesus only say that people in Judea would need to flee if He was talking about a global tribulation occurring before His return?

Luke 21:25 “There will be signs in the sun, moon and stars. On the earth, nations will be in anguish and perplexity at the roaring and tossing of the sea. 26 People will faint from terror, apprehensive of what is coming on the world, for the heavenly bodies will be shaken. 27 At that time they will see the Son of Man coming in a cloud with power and great glory. 28 When these things begin to take place, stand up and lift up your heads, because your redemption is drawing near.”

If you can't see the difference between this and the tribulation Jesus described that only involves Jerusalem and Judea (in Luke 21:20-24, Matthew 24:15-21 and Mark 13:14-19) then I just don't know what to tell you. The local/regional tribulation happened long ago around 70 AD. The global tribulation that Jesus described as occurring just before His return hasn't happened yet.


Nice made up story there. Your beliefs are based on made up sensationalized nonsense instead of what scripture teaches.

You make up a fake "Great Tribulation" in 70AD, and claim there are "Two Great Tribulations" Seen Below, One In 70AD, One Future 1900+ Years And Waiting, A "False Teaching"!

As you falsely believe and teach that there's a 1900+ year gap between the verses in Luke 21:24-25 trying desperately to convince the unaware that this false gap exist, a "False Teaching"!

"The events seen below are all future", there's no 1900+ year gap seen below, its nothing more than mans pride in trying to keep a false teaching alive

(70AD Great Tribulation Verses 20-24)

Luke 21:20-27KJV
20 And when ye shall see Jerusalem compassed with armies, then know that the desolation thereof is nigh.
21 Then let them which are in Judaea flee to the mountains; and let them which are in the midst of it depart out; and let not them that are in the countries enter thereinto.
22 For these be the days of vengeance, that all things which are written may be fulfilled.
23 But woe unto them that are with child, and to them that give suck, in those days! for there shall be great distress in the land, and wrath upon this people.
24 And they shall fall by the edge of the sword, and shall be led away captive into all nations: and Jerusalem shall be trodden down of the Gentiles, until the times of the Gentiles be fulfilled.

There's No 1900+ Year Gap Seen Here Between Verses 24 & 25, your pride has you blinded, as you cling to your false teaching in 70AD fulfillment

(A Future Great Tribulation 1900+ Year Gap Verses 25-27)

25 And there shall be signs in the sun, and in the moon, and in the stars; and upon the earth distress of nations, with perplexity; the sea and the waves roaring;
26 Men's hearts failing them for fear, and for looking after those things which are coming on the earth: for the powers of heaven shall be shaken.
27 And then shall they see the Son of man coming in a cloud with power and great glory.

 

[Truth7t7]

Because that is what Jesus indicated.

This occurred around 70 AD and was great tribulation in and around Jerusalem:

"The events seen below are all future", there's no 1900+ year gap seen below, its nothing more than mans pride in trying to keep a false teaching alive

Spiritual Israelite False Teaching In A 70AD "Great Tribulation" Seen Verses 20-24

Luke 21:20-27KJV
20 And when ye shall see Jerusalem compassed with armies, then know that the desolation thereof is nigh.
21 Then let them which are in Judaea flee to the mountains; and let them which are in the midst of it depart out; and let not them that are in the countries enter thereinto.
22 For these be the days of vengeance, that all things which are written may be fulfilled.
23 But woe unto them that are with child, and to them that give suck, in those days! for there shall be great distress in the land, and wrath upon this people.
24 And they shall fall by the edge of the sword, and shall be led away captive into all nations: and Jerusalem shall be trodden down of the Gentiles, until the times of the Gentiles be fulfilled.

There's No 1900+ Year Gap Seen Here Between Verses 24 & 25, your pride has you blinded, as you cling to your false teaching in 70AD fulfillment

Spiritual Israelite False Teaching In A Future "Great Tribulation" 1900+ Year Gap Verses 25-27)

25 And there shall be signs in the sun, and in the moon, and in the stars; and upon the earth distress of nations, with perplexity; the sea and the waves roaring;
26 Men's hearts failing them for fear, and for looking after those things which are coming on the earth: for the powers of heaven shall be shaken.
27 And then shall they see the Son of man coming in a cloud with power and great glory.

 

[jeffweeder]

Because that is what Jesus indicated.

This occurred around 70 AD and was great tribulation in and around Jerusalem:

Luke 21:20 “When you see Jerusalem being surrounded by armies, you will know that its desolation is near. 21 Then let those who are in Judea flee to the mountains, let those in the city get out, and let those in the country not enter the city. 22 For this is the time of punishment in fulfillment of all that has been written. 23 How dreadful it will be in those days for pregnant women and nursing mothers! There will be great distress in the land and wrath against this people. 24 They will fall by the sword and will be taken as prisoners to all the nations. Jerusalem will be trampled on by the Gentiles until the times of the Gentiles are fulfilled.

Around the end of the times of the Gentiles is another great tribulation, but this time it's global involving many nations and not just one nation:

Luke 21:25 “There will be signs in the sun, moon and stars. On the earth, nations will be in anguish and perplexity at the roaring and tossing of the sea. 26 People will faint from terror, apprehensive of what is coming on the world, for the heavenly bodies will be shaken. 27 At that time they will see the Son of Man coming in a cloud with power and great glory. 28 When these things begin to take place, stand up and lift up your heads, because your redemption is drawing near.”

Jesus was asked two different questions and they were about two different things. The first one was about things related to the destruction of the temple buildings which He had just previously talked about before they asked their questions. The second one is about things related to His future coming at the end of the age. It is foolish to assume that everything Jesus talked about in the Olivet Discourse is either all fulfilled or all will be fulfilled in the future.

Lk 21
5 As some were talking about the temple, that it was decorated with beautiful stones and consecrated offerings [of magnificent gifts of gold which were displayed on the walls and hung in the porticoes], He said,

6 “As for all these things which you see, the time will come when there will not be one stone left on another that will not be torn down.”

7 They asked Him, “Teacher, when will these things happen? And what will be the sign when these things are about to happen?”

8 He said, “Be careful and see to it that you are not misled; for many will come in My name [appropriating for themselves the name Messiah which belongs to Me alone], saying, ‘I am He,’ and, ‘The time is near!’ Do not follow them. 9 When you hear of wars and disturbances [civil unrest, revolts, uprisings], do not panic; for these things must take place first, but the end will not come immediately.”

THese things above =

The temple being destroyed through war with Jerusalem.
The end of the age didn't come immediately, did it?


1st there is great tribulation regarding the land, Temple and people of Israel and later on the whole world.


20 “But when you see Jerusalem surrounded by [hostile] armies, then understand [with confident assurance] that her complete destruction is near.
21 At that time, those who are in Judea must flee to the mountains, and those who are inside the city (Jerusalem) must get out, and those who are [out] in the country must not enter the city; 22 for these are days of vengeance [of rendering full justice or satisfaction], so that all things which are written will be fulfilled. 23 Woe to those women who are pregnant and to those who are nursing babies in those days! For great trouble and anguish will be on the land, and wrath and retribution on this people [Israel]. 24 And they will fall by the edge of the sword, and will be led captive into all nations; and Jerusalem will be trampled underfoot by the Gentiles until the times of the Gentiles are fulfilled (completed).


34 “But be on guard, so that your hearts are not weighed down and depressed with the giddiness of debauchery and the nausea of self-indulgence and the worldly worries of life, and then that day [when the Messiah returns] will not come on you suddenly like a trap; 35 for it will come upon all those who live on the face of all the earth. 36 But keep alert at all times [be attentive and ready], praying that you may have the strength and ability [to be found worthy and] to escape all these things that are going to take place, and to stand in the presence of the Son of Man [at His coming].”

 

[jeffweeder]

You make up a fake "Great Tribulation" in 70AD, and claim there are "Two Great Tribulations" Seen Below, One In 70AD, One Future 1900+ Years And Waiting, A "False Teaching"!

As you falsely believe and teach that there's a 1900+ year gap between the verses in Luke 21:24-25 trying desperately to convince the unaware that this false gap exist, a "False Teaching"!

"The events seen below are all future", there's no 1900+ year gap seen below, its nothing more than mans pride in trying to keep a false teaching alive

(70AD Great Tribulation Verses 20-24)

Luke 21:20-27KJV
20 And when ye shall see Jerusalem compassed with armies, then know that the desolation thereof is nigh.
21 Then let them which are in Judaea flee to the mountains; and let them which are in the midst of it depart out; and let not them that are in the countries enter thereinto.
22 For these be the days of vengeance, that all things which are written may be fulfilled.
23 But woe unto them that are with child, and to them that give suck, in those days! for there shall be great distress in the land, and wrath upon this people.
24 And they shall fall by the edge of the sword, and shall be led away captive into all nations: and Jerusalem shall be trodden down of the Gentiles, until the times of the Gentiles be fulfilled.

So you believe Jesus overlooked the events of AD 70 and was prophesying of another more distant repeat event.? :

 

[TribulationSigns]

Wow. alot of blinds leading the blinds with their misinterpretations. Not getting any closer to the Truth.

 

[Spiritual Israelite]

Yes you deny that Daniel 12:1 & Matthew 24:21 are the same future event in the "Great Tribulation",

Yes, I have already established that several times at this point. I'm glad you are remembering that so that I don't have to remind you.

your living in denial of biblical truth before your eyes

Wrong. I'm just denying your nonsense. You can't expect to be taken seriously when you deny that the following is describing the temple buildings standing when Jesus was on the earth:

Matthew 24:1 And Jesus went out, and departed from the temple: and his disciples came to him for to shew him the buildings of the temple.
2 And Jesus said unto them, See ye not all these things? verily I say unto you, There shall not be left here one stone upon another, that shall not be thrown down.

 

[Spiritual Israelite]

You make up a fake "Great Tribulation" in 70AD

Are you saying you don't believe anything of any significance involving great tribulation of any kind happened in 70 AD? Are you saying that you believe Jerusalem and its temple buildings were not destroyed in 70 AD? Because that is one of the great tribulation events that I'm talking about. You're saying you think that's fake and didn't really happen?

 

[Spiritual Israelite]

"The events seen below are all future", there's no 1900+ year gap seen below, its nothing more than mans pride in trying to keep a false teaching alive

Spiritual Israelite False Teaching In A 70AD "Great Tribulation" Seen Verses 20-24

Luke 21:20-27KJV
20 And when ye shall see Jerusalem compassed with armies, then know that the desolation thereof is nigh.
21 Then let them which are in Judaea flee to the mountains; and let them which are in the midst of it depart out; and let not them that are in the countries enter thereinto.
22 For these be the days of vengeance, that all things which are written may be fulfilled.
23 But woe unto them that are with child, and to them that give suck, in those days! for there shall be great distress in the land, and wrath upon this people.
24 And they shall fall by the edge of the sword, and shall be led away captive into all nations: and Jerusalem shall be trodden down of the Gentiles, until the times of the Gentiles be fulfilled.

Was Jerusalem not surrounded by armies in 70 AD? I believe it was. Did no one in Judea heed Jesus's warning to flee into the mountains back then? I believe they did. Was there "great distress in the land, and wrath upon this people" with "the land" being Jerusalem and "this people" being the Jews back then? I believe there was. Did many fall by the edge of the sword and were many led away captive into all nations around that time? I believe so. If you don't think any of those things happened back then, please give some evidence to show that.

There's No 1900+ Year Gap Seen Here Between Verses 24 & 25, your pride has you blinded, as you cling to your false teaching in 70AD fulfillment

Spiritual Israelite False Teaching In A Future "Great Tribulation" 1900+ Year Gap Verses 25-27)

25 And there shall be signs in the sun, and in the moon, and in the stars; and upon the earth distress of nations, with perplexity; the sea and the waves roaring;
26 Men's hearts failing them for fear, and for looking after those things which are coming on the earth: for the powers of heaven shall be shaken.
27 And then shall they see the Son of man coming in a cloud with power and great glory.

So, the times of the Gentiles never exists in your mind? Your view seems to completely disregard "the times of the Gentiles" that would follow the tribulation that is described in Luke 21:20-24a.

 

[Spiritual Israelite]

Lk 21
5 As some were talking about the temple, that it was decorated with beautiful stones and consecrated offerings [of magnificent gifts of gold which were displayed on the walls and hung in the porticoes], He said,

6 “As for all these things which you see, the time will come when there will not be one stone left on another that will not be torn down.”

7 They asked Him, “Teacher, when will these things happen? And what will be the sign when these things are about to happen?”

8 He said, “Be careful and see to it that you are not misled; for many will come in My name [appropriating for themselves the name Messiah which belongs to Me alone], saying, ‘I am He,’ and, ‘The time is near!’ Do not follow them. 9 When you hear of wars and disturbances [civil unrest, revolts, uprisings], do not panic; for these things must take place first, but the end will not come immediately.”

THese things above =

The temple being destroyed through war with Jerusalem.
The end of the age didn't come immediately, did it?


1st there is great tribulation regarding the land, Temple and people of Israel and later on the whole world.


20 “But when you see Jerusalem surrounded by [hostile] armies, then understand [with confident assurance] that her complete destruction is near.
21 At that time, those who are in Judea must flee to the mountains, and those who are inside the city (Jerusalem) must get out, and those who are [out] in the country must not enter the city; 22 for these are days of vengeance [of rendering full justice or satisfaction], so that all things which are written will be fulfilled. 23 Woe to those women who are pregnant and to those who are nursing babies in those days! For great trouble and anguish will be on the land, and wrath and retribution on this people [Israel]. 24 And they will fall by the edge of the sword, and will be led captive into all nations; and Jerusalem will be trampled underfoot by the Gentiles until the times of the Gentiles are fulfilled (completed).


34 “But be on guard, so that your hearts are not weighed down and depressed with the giddiness of debauchery and the nausea of self-indulgence and the worldly worries of life, and then that day [when the Messiah returns] will not come on you suddenly like a trap; 35 for it will come upon all those who live on the face of all the earth. 36 But keep alert at all times [be attentive and ready], praying that you may have the strength and ability [to be found worthy and] to escape all these things that are going to take place, and to stand in the presence of the Son of Man [at His coming].”

Exactly. There is no indication whatsoever that what is described in verses 34-36 happens at the same time as what is described in verses 21-24. In between the two great tribulation events is what Jesus called "the times of the Gentiles" which people like Truth7t7 are completely ignoring.

 

[Spiritual Israelite]

So you believe Jesus overlooked the events of AD 70 and was prophesying of another more distant repeat event.? :

Apparently, he does. But, why would anyone think that He would do that? That makes no sense. The destruction of Jerusalem and the temple buildings was a very significant event and is not something that Jesus would have refrained from prophesying about at all. Was that the main focus of His Olivet Discourse? No. He talked more about things related to His second coming at the end of the age than He did about that. But, to deny that He said anything at all about what would happen to Jerusalem and the temple is ridiculous.

 

[jeffweeder]

Wow. alot of blinds leading the blinds with their misinterpretations. Not getting any closer to the Truth.

Thats the second time you have posted that after I myself have posted.
Are you trying to tell me something?