A Question for Jehovah's Witnesses

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Wrangler

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But Wallace's point is that these two verses are not ambiguous
I know. He’s flat out wrong. It’s absurd to take these two verses and demand they refer to one person when the fact that they are 2 persons has been positively established over and over again.

John 3:16. Who gave his only begotten son?

Acts 2:36. Who made Jesus both Lord and Christ?

Eph 1:3 Who is the God and Father of Christ?

1 Corinthians 11:3. Who is the head of Christ?

Rev 1:1 Who gave Jesus the Revelation?

There are other countless verses that depict as separate and juxtapose “God” with “Jesus.” Only someone fully committed to a particular doctrine could disregard all this and read into text that does not explicitly say what is claimed.
 

Aunty Jane

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In all the Trinitarian disputes I've seen, this is always the heart of the matter. "3 cannot be 1! 1 cannot be 3!" In humans from the line of Adam, I'd agree. But God is transcendant, and not to be defined according to those whom He created.
That is true, but we have his inspired word to give us the truth…it is the misinterpretation and mistranslation of his words that is the enemy of truth. Beliefs are read into scripture instead of scripture dictating beliefs.

In the very first instance, we need a reason why the Creator would have to become a human when it is impossible for an immortal to die. God could not offer his own immortal life for the mortal life of one of his creations. It negates the principle of redemption. The sinless, mortal life of the man Jesus had to be equivalent to the sinless, mortal life that Adam forfeited, not just for himself, but also for all his children.

Atonement is “at-one-ment”….”one for one”. Only Adam’s equal could be given in exchange for the life he lost due to his disobedience. God sent his son, because he is an immortal God and does not ever need to become a human to rescue humans from their abuse of free will. Jesus was never required to BE God in order to redeem humans….humans invented that scenario. All Jesus needed to be was “sinless”.…it’s that simple.

Before Christ’s mission, Yahweh was the only immortal in existence…..the reason being, that to give free will to an immortal is the same as allowing AI to rule the world…..if they go feral, there is no way to stop them…..it’s also the reason why there is no immortal soul….because you cannot kill them. “Souls” are entirely mortal. (Ezek 18:4) Jesus tells us that the wicked are “destroyed“ in “Gehenna” (Matt 10:28…erroneously translated as “hell”)…they are not tortured, as there is no immortal soul to suffer anything.

All of God’s children have free will and it’s the abuse of that gift that got us into this mess. God has been trying to teach us all the value of obedience, ever since….who’s got that memo to date?
Jesus created everything that was created. That's what the Bible states. Do you find yourself needing to add a few words to that statement to make it true in your eyes? "except himself . . . someone else did that"?
No, I find the answer in other parts of the Bible….in Prov 8:30-31 we find reference to what is called “wisdom personified”. Many things are personified in the Bible, but Jesus is clearly identified as “the wisdom of God”. Scholars recognize this reference as pertaining to Jesus ….the “master workman” at his Father’s side in creation, as the agency “through whom” creation was brought about. (Col 1:15-17; John 1:2-3)

1 Cor 1:24…
”but to those who are the called, both Jews and Greeks, Christ the power of God and the wisdom of God.”
No one personified God’s wisdom like Jesus did.

Was Jesus ever called “the Creator” in any verse of the Bible? He certainly facilitated creation, but he is never called “the Creator”.
John 1:1-3 LITV
1) In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God.
2) He was in the beginning with God.
3) All things came into being through Him, and without Him not even one thing came into being that has come into being.

This is straightforward.
It is, when the erroneous doctrine masquerading as truth, is moved out of the way….
When you read those verses in Greek, something else emerges….

“In the beginning was the Word, (ho logos) and the Word was with God, (ho theos) and the Word was God. (theos, no definite article)
2) He was in the beginning with God.(ho theos)
3) All things came into being through Him, and without Him not even one thing came into being that has come into being.”

So twice in that passage the definite article is used with reference to Yahweh…..but not to “ho logos”.
It was “ho logos” who became flesh, not “ho theos”. (John 1:14)

And twice “the beginning” is mentioned….what is this “the beginning” of? The eternal God had no beginning….but his son did, as Rev 3:14 calls Jesus…”The Amen,the faithful and true Witness, the Beginning of the creation of God (ho theos)…..again in the Greek he is the creation of “ho theos”.
The definite article is never used with reference to Jesus.….only to “his God and Father”.
In so many instances the English translation deliberately omits the definite article because their doctrine demands it.

You see, no one can reply to those clear statements and still maintain the doctrine that is foundational to Christendom…..they know their theology, but not their Bible. The Bible answers all its own questions if you care to put in the effort to ‘find the diamond in the pile of broken glass’.
 

Aunty Jane

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Revelation 22:8-9 KJV
8) And I John saw these things, and heard them. And when I had heard and seen, I fell down to worship before the feet of the angel which shewed me these things.
9) Then saith he unto me, See thou do it not: for I am thy fellowservant, and of thy brethren the prophets, and of them which keep the sayings of this book: worship God.

The angels know this.
They do…..that is why they do not worship “ho logos”….the angels says to worship “ho theos”…which is Yahweh.
The angel said that he was a “fellow servant” of John and of the prophets who taught and guided God’s people throughout their history. Those chosen to rule with Christ are called his “brothers” not his “sons”.

The multitude of “sons of God” in heaven are therefore the “brothers” of those chosen to rule mankind in God’s kingdom. These former humans are chosen as Christ’s brothers….
In Matt 25, in his parable of the “sheep and the goats” the “sheep” ask when they had assisted Christ Jesus personally? He replied…
”Truly I say to you, to the extent that you did it to one of the least of these my brothers, you did it to me.”….and conversely when those designated as “goats“ failed to assist Christ’s brothers, Jesus said…”Truly I say to you, to the extent that you did not do it to one of these least ones, you did not do it to me.’ 46 These will depart into everlasting cutting-off, but the righteous ones into everlasting life.”

We had better know what we believe, and from whom it came……an old lie is still a lie…..nothing can change it into truth, no matter how firmly we believe it. Believing something never made it the truth, without solid evidence.
 

Runningman

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Lol
Watchtower with their neutered powerless dethroned jesus is the problem.
Along with every other cult that denies worshipping Jesus.
Jesus isn't a cultist. John 4 and Jesus' explicit directives to worship the Father only is orthodox Christianity, at least it was in the beginning. That's why you didn't quote anything to the contrary because nothing else exists. lol
 

Runningman

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Nearly all of my "theologically related" Posts, and most of my Threads, and there are a lot of those found here.....only Present The Gift of Salvation, as The Cross of Christ.

Jesus Is Salvation.

How do you know?
Because He is """"the only WAY to the Father..."" John 14:6

And Jesus should know as the WAY there is the Blood and Death of Jesus.

"The Cross of Christ".
No problems here, but we should respect the fact that Jesus got his way, truth, and life from his God and Father. The gift of eternal life, the gospel, etc all originate from the Father.

"ALL who call on the Name of Jesus, by faith, shall be saved".
This isn't a quote in the Bible.
 

Runningman

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Never cease being brave to follow JESUS teachings . I LIKE THAT my friend .
SO HOW come many have . HOW COME they saying things like muslims and other religions be serving the same GOD we do .
HOW COME . HOW COME they are saying and believing there is no need for these false religoins to repent
and to believe ON JESUS AS THE CHRIST . why is the GOSPEL GETTING TROD UNDER FOOT
for a social inclusive one . HUH . cause IT DENIES JESUS THE CHRIST .
HOW COME so many are now running to rainbow jesus . and when i say rainbow
mark my words , IT AINT THE RAINBOW OF GOD .
HOW COME folks are so fast to shut down brave ones who by grace Actually DO CORRECT SIN WTHIN THE CHURCH .
HOW COME so many are so fast to accuse these of not loving , of being judgmental , of being haters
Exactly .
HOW COME so many are now following a love that has come of the world , yet satan and his co workers
are doing all to convince not only the religoins but christendom itself , THIS IS THE LOVE OF GOD .
WHEN IT CLEARLY AINT .
YOU see what does charity REJOICE IN and what DO IT NOT REJOICE IN .
FOLKS FORGET THAT .
CHARITY rejoices ONLY IN THE TRUTH . NOT INQUITY , NOT LIES , not false hope . TRUTH .
SO they can give all their food to the poor , YET SINCE THEY DONT HAVE ACTUAL CHARITY , IT WILL PROFIT THEM NOTHING .
CHARITY WOULD NEVER DENY A WORD OF JESUS CHRIST . yet THEY DO . CHARITY
would never honor or rejoice in a lie , in inquity , YET THEY DO . SOMETHING HAS WENT DEAD WRONG .
SO allow me some parting words .
THERE IS A LOVE , A WAY , WHICH SEEMS SO DARN RIGHT UNTO MEN , YET THE END OF IT BE DEATH .
Satan can say GOD IS LOVE , OH HE CAN QUAOTE ANY SCRIP my friend
BUT BEWARE HIM and HIS MEN , for his version is GONNA CAUSE UNBEIEF and DISOBEDIANCE .
THERE LOVE DOES THIS . OOPS . satan knows how to DECIEVE
and HE and his men can wear more than prada too . THEY CAN WEAR EVEN WOOL . YES EVEN WOOL .
I see that you, too, have discovered that many people hate the truth even though they are often not overt about it. It's often when sin is exposed that they raise issue. Rather than have any sort of Holy Spirit conviction and repent, they want to justify themselves and project blame back onto you or whoever is conveniently located nearby. There are people who will find every reason to blame others because it gives them the excuse, at least in their own mind, the keep their favorite sins.

You may have also noticed that some church organizations do practice all-inclusivity because there is more money in that. They will accept anyone and itch their ears as long as they are giving their money. It actually didn't take long for Christianity to turn into this.

You seem to hint at having awareness that pure Christianity isn't a very easy religion, but it acts as a filter. It was originally intended to filter out the weeds, chaff, and debris and attract only those who are the devoted to the Way, truth, and life Jesus gave to the world from his God. Before, sinning was a big deal and it actually meant something in the church. It was an automatic red flag that someone may not actually be a real Christian. Nowadays, it seems to mostly just be accepted without much fuss.
 
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Wrangler

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That is true, but we have his inspired word to give us the truth…it is the misinterpretation and mistranslation of his words that is the enemy of truth. Beliefs are read into scripture instead of scripture dictating beliefs.
This really deserves its own thread. So much I feel like Satan is our Father:
  1. The word of God is true.
  2. Did God really say (and mean) ...

In another forum, the site administrator has revealed to be anti-Moses, claiming Moses got the nature of God wrong from the start. While I don't understand the perspective, as you say, why not let the words of Scripture speak for themselves?
 

Runningman

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The old 45,000 Christian denominations. I spoke with one of the authors of the Encylopedia. They used a sociality definition for denominations. This exageration makes one look like htey have no idea what they are talking about. Each of the branch offices and congerations will be counted as a seperate denomination by they source.
I got my number from the Center for the Study of Global Christianity of the Gordon Conwell Theological Seminary. According to their FAQ page, they define a denomination like this:

"The most detailed level of our taxonomy of global Christianity is Christian denominations, defined as an organized Christian church, tradition, religious group, community of people, aggregate of worship centre, usually within a specific country, whose component congregations and members are called by the same name in different areas, regarding themselves as an autonomous Christian church distinct from other churches and traditions. Denominations are defined and measured at the country level, creating a large number of separate denominations within Christian families and Christian traditions. For example, the presence of the Catholic Church in the world’s 234 countries results in 234 Catholic “denominations”, though these can be further subdivided by rite (e.g., Byzantine or Latin). The typical way for Christians to count themselves is at the local congregational level and then aggregate these totals at the city, province, state, regional and finally, national levels.
Individual congregations are not counted as “denominations.” We do make note of the fact that many independent congregations are not a part of any denomination. If those churches were to form an independent network with a name, we would consider them a denomination. Using this method, we report 45,000 Christian denominations in the world in 2019."

source: Quick Facts About Global Christianity - Center for the Study of Global Christianity
 

amigo de christo

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I see that you, too, have discovered that many people hate the truth even though they are often not overt about it. It's often when sin is exposed that they raise issue. Rather than have any sort of Holy Spirit conviction and repent, they want to justify themselves and project blame back onto you or whoever is conveniently located nearby. There are people who will find every reason to blame others because it gives them the excuse, at least in their own mind, the keep their favorite sins.

You may have also noticed that some church organizations do practice all-inclusivity because there is more money in that. They will accept anyone and itch their ears as long as they are giving their money. It actually didn't take long for Christianity to turn into this.

You seem to hint at having awareness that pure Christianity isn't a very easy religion, but it acts as a filter. It was originally intended to filter out the weeds, chaff, and debris and attract only those who are the devoted to the Way, truth, and life Jesus gave to the world from his God. Before, sinning was a big deal and it actually meant something in the church. It was an automatic red flag that someone may not actually be a real Christian. Nowadays, it seems to mostly just be accepted without much fuss.
What many do not know is that christanity has been transformed into something else and done
so from within . They also did and are doing this with the other false religoins too .
They are merging them to be as one . To do so fundamental core doctrines must be replaced
but replaced with something that all religoins even the world has in common .
THEY FOUND that common ground and went to work to transform from within chrisanity .
What does this lost world have in common . what do even the false religoins have in common .
Think about it . A WORDLY SENSUAL VIEW of LOVE .
Now this love will make void certain truths . And it will DENY JESUS as the only way to GOD
It will also honor certain sins and the greatest sin of all is even honored , THE SIN OF UNBELIEF
as they now chant that muslilms and others be serving the same GOD we do .
YOU SEE , THE Devil placed it upon the hearts of very power hungry and greedy men
to create a religoin that will unite the world as one .
To do this you must also remove fundamental doctrines . I mean no muslim , no christain , no etc
is ever gonna unite IF they hold to the core tenenats of their doctrine .
So get busy preaching love a lot . make the love you preach seem as though it cometh of GOD , when It dont .
its just a love to unite the lost to accept their sin and their path and just join as one .
FUNDAMENTAL Christain core doctrine was in their way . SO they used
catch phrases like , breaking down barriers , AKA REMOVING DOCTRINE that WONT UNITE
Building bridges , aka Preaching non stop about this version of love .
FINDING COMMON GROUND . aka talking about love a lot and doing some good works to the poor and etc
BUT remember FUNDAMNETNAL DOCTRINE they had to remove . SO that is why the preaching of JESUS
was removed with lil catch phrases like , ONLY USE WORDS when necessary ,
and now its getting worse . They knew what they were doing all along . creating a love by which
ALL religoins and even the world WOULD UNITE as ONE UNDER . ONLY IT AINT THE LOVE OF GOD
and it AINT OF GOD . the devil been busy my friend . real busy .
Judge not became the golden calf and as such LEAVEN TOOK OVER the places .
As they danced around the inclusive love bull, the very love they beleived was of GOD
that came to unite them , HAS TURNED THEIR HEARTS AGAINST THE VERY WORDS OF GOD , thus AGAINST GOD
against CHRIST . they cannot see this . They have no idea another image of GOD and of CHRIST
has long been preached unto them . They have no idea what TRUE CHRISTANITY has lost
and worse that they themselves are STILL LOST .
 

amigo de christo

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I see that you, too, have discovered that many people hate the truth even though they are often not overt about it. It's often when sin is exposed that they raise issue. Rather than have any sort of Holy Spirit conviction and repent, they want to justify themselves and project blame back onto you or whoever is conveniently located nearby. There are people who will find every reason to blame others because it gives them the excuse, at least in their own mind, the keep their favorite sins.

You may have also noticed that some church organizations do practice all-inclusivity because there is more money in that. They will accept anyone and itch their ears as long as they are giving their money. It actually didn't take long for Christianity to turn into this.

You seem to hint at having awareness that pure Christianity isn't a very easy religion, but it acts as a filter. It was originally intended to filter out the weeds, chaff, and debris and attract only those who are the devoted to the Way, truth, and life Jesus gave to the world from his God. Before, sinning was a big deal and it actually meant something in the church. It was an automatic red flag that someone may not actually be a real Christian. Nowadays, it seems to mostly just be accepted without much fuss.
many will say and make the claim that GOD IS LOVE . which is true , but check this out .
HOW do we know they have no LOVE OF GOD .
I mean they often talk about loving your neighbor as yourself . WHICH is TRUE , ONLY they do not love their
neighbor or GOD .
HOW so .
Check this out . walk into the diverse inclusive unity love song churches and you see what they sing .
YOU see what they seem to love , what they seem to accept AND what do they REJECT .
NOW this is key .
You will see SIN upon them . you will at worst see rainbows and the sin be honored
and at the very least its JUDGE NOT and nothing gets corrected .
You will see them fast to hug just anyone , BUT WONT be correcting any sin .
BUT here is what you will see them correct as they reject .
BRING IN BIBLE DOCTRINE that exposes SINS . AND YOU WATCH how they TEETH AT IT AND AT YOU .
this love they think is of GOD , has ODDLY TURNED THEM BIG TIME against HIS OWN WORDS
and calls good what HE calls evil and evil what HE calleth good .
THEY have no idea they are under the spell of a delusion of darkness .
THEY believe they LOVE GOD and that we are the haters . As they holler phrases like GOD IS NOT A BOOK
as they calls even certain scriptures hate speech and twist many more unto their own destruction
and all the while they chant GOD is love to cover their sins and to justify thier sins . THIS AINT LOOKING GOOD .
They will holler love your neighbor , and yet their love ALLOWS SIn UPON THEM ALL . WONT CORRECT SQUAT
WONT EVEN CORRECT THE SIN OF UNBELIEF .
and now a word .
YE shall NOT hate your neighbor in your heart , you shall rebuke , correct him and not allow SIN upon him .
THEIR LOVE ALLOWS SIN
yet ours corrects sin and they call us the haters . talk about a delusion .
 

Behold

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This isn't a quote in the Bible.

Yes it is...

Its this... Romans 10:13

New Living Translation
For “Everyone who calls on the name of the LORD will be saved.”

English Standard Version
For “everyone who calls on the name of the Lord will be saved.”

Berean Standard Bible
for, “Everyone who calls on the name of the Lord will be saved.”

Berean Literal Bible
for, "Whoever shall call upon the name of the Lord will be saved."

King James Bible
For whosoever shall call upon the name of the Lord shall be saved.

New King James Version
For “whoever calls on the name of the LORD shall be saved.”

New American Standard Bible
for “EVERYONE WHO CALLS ON THE NAME OF THE LORD WILL BE SAVED.”

NASB 1995
for “WHOEVER WILL CALL ON THE NAME OF THE LORD WILL BE SAVED.”

NASB 1977
for “WHOEVER WILL CALL UPON THE NAME OF THE LORD WILL BE SAVED.”

Legacy Standard Bible
for “WHOEVER CALLS ON THE NAME OF THE LORD WILL BE SAVED.”

Amplified Bible
For “WHOEVER CALLS ON THE NAME OF THE LORD [in prayer] WILL BE SAVED.”

Christian Standard Bible
For everyone who calls on the name of the Lord will be saved.

Holman Christian Standard Bible
For everyone who calls on the name of the Lord will be saved.

American Standard Version
for, Whosoever shall call upon the name of the Lord shall be saved.

Aramaic Bible in Plain English
“For everyone who will call the name of THE LORD JEHOVAH shall be saved.”

Contemporary English Version
All who call out to the Lord will be saved.

Douay-Rheims Bible
For whosoever shall call upon the name of the Lord, shall be saved.

English Revised Version
for, Whosoever shall call upon the name of the Lord shall be saved.

GOD'S WORD® Translation
So then, "Whoever calls on the name of the Lord will be saved."

Good News Translation
As the scripture says, "Everyone who calls out to the Lord for help will be saved."

International Standard Version
"Everyone who calls on the name of the Lord will be saved."

Literal Standard Version
for “Everyone who, if he may have called on the Name of the LORD, will be saved.”

Majority Standard Bible
for, “Everyone who calls on the name of the Lord will be saved.”

New American Bible
For “everyone who calls on the name of the Lord will be saved.”

NET Bible
For everyone who calls on the name of the Lord will be saved.
 

amigo de christo

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Yes it is...

Its this... Romans 10:13

New Living Translation
For “Everyone who calls on the name of the LORD will be saved.”

English Standard Version
For “everyone who calls on the name of the Lord will be saved.”

Berean Standard Bible
for, “Everyone who calls on the name of the Lord will be saved.”

Berean Literal Bible
for, "Whoever shall call upon the name of the Lord will be saved."

King James Bible
For whosoever shall call upon the name of the Lord shall be saved.

New King James Version
For “whoever calls on the name of the LORD shall be saved.”

New American Standard Bible
for “EVERYONE WHO CALLS ON THE NAME OF THE LORD WILL BE SAVED.”

NASB 1995
for “WHOEVER WILL CALL ON THE NAME OF THE LORD WILL BE SAVED.”

NASB 1977
for “WHOEVER WILL CALL UPON THE NAME OF THE LORD WILL BE SAVED.”

Legacy Standard Bible
for “WHOEVER CALLS ON THE NAME OF THE LORD WILL BE SAVED.”

Amplified Bible
For “WHOEVER CALLS ON THE NAME OF THE LORD [in prayer] WILL BE SAVED.”

Christian Standard Bible
For everyone who calls on the name of the Lord will be saved.

Holman Christian Standard Bible
For everyone who calls on the name of the Lord will be saved.

American Standard Version
for, Whosoever shall call upon the name of the Lord shall be saved.

Aramaic Bible in Plain English
“For everyone who will call the name of THE LORD JEHOVAH shall be saved.”

Contemporary English Version
All who call out to the Lord will be saved.

Douay-Rheims Bible
For whosoever shall call upon the name of the Lord, shall be saved.

English Revised Version
for, Whosoever shall call upon the name of the Lord shall be saved.

GOD'S WORD® Translation
So then, "Whoever calls on the name of the Lord will be saved."

Good News Translation
As the scripture says, "Everyone who calls out to the Lord for help will be saved."

International Standard Version
"Everyone who calls on the name of the Lord will be saved."

Literal Standard Version
for “Everyone who, if he may have called on the Name of the LORD, will be saved.”

Majority Standard Bible
for, “Everyone who calls on the name of the Lord will be saved.”

New American Bible
For “everyone who calls on the name of the Lord will be saved.”

NET Bible
For everyone who calls on the name of the Lord will be saved.
And even as MOSES lifted up the serpent in the wilderness
so too must the SON of man be lifted up
that WHOSOEVER BELEIVETH will not perish but have ETERNAL LIFE .
For GOD so loved the world that he gave HIS only begotten SON
that WHOSOEVER BELIEVES on HIM shall not Perish but have EVERLASTING LIFE .
FOR GOD sent not HIS SON into the world to CONDEMN the world
but that the world through him might be saved .
HE WHO BELIEVES is NOT condemned , OH BUT he who BELIEVETH NOT IS CONDMENED
for he has not BELIEVED on the name of the ONLY BEGOTTEN SON OF GOD
and THIS is CONDMENATION that LIGHT has come into the world but men have loved darkness
rather than light because their deeds were evil
He who doeth evil hates the light and will not come to the LIGHT lest his evil deeds be reproved
HE that doeth TRUTH cometh to the LIGHT . THE GOSPEL is the message of RECONCILATION .
AND FAITH IN JESUS CHRIST ALONE is how one be RECONCILED TO GOD , JUSTIFIED in the SIGHT OF GOD
made the RIGHTEOUSNESS OF GOD . WHO is a liar
but HE who denies JESUS IS THE CHRIST , HE is anti christ .
HE calls GOD a liar for he recieves not the TESTIMONY GOD GAVE OF HIS SON .
we can do this all day my friend . THEY ALL POINTED TO THE DIRE NECSSSITY TO BELIEVE ON JESUS THE CHRIST .
and what else did john make mention of ........
THESE things i write unto you that you may KNOW you have eternal life , that you may BELIEVE ON JESUS THE CHRIST .
WE STICKING TO THE GOSPEL my friend . FOR IT IS THE POWER OF GOD unto those who do BELIEVE .
That if you will believe from the heart that GOD has rose him from the dead
and shall confess him , YE shall BE SAVED . there is no other gospel , no other love , no other hope
no other name or means by which a man can be saved . We wont be heeding those who preach a lie .
 

Marvelloustime

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And even as MOSES lifted up the serpent in the wilderness
so too must the SON of man be lifted up
that WHOSOEVER BELEIVETH will not perish but have ETERNAL LIFE .
For GOD so loved the world that he gave HIS only begotten SON
that WHOSOEVER BELIEVES on HIM shall not Perish but have EVERLASTING LIFE .
FOR GOD sent not HIS SON into the world to CONDEMN the world
but that the world through him might be saved .
HE WHO BELIEVES is NOT condemned , OH BUT he who BELIEVETH NOT IS CONDMENED
for he has not BELIEVED on the name of the ONLY BEGOTTEN SON OF GOD
and THIS is CONDMENATION that LIGHT has come into the world but men have loved darkness
rather than light because their deeds were evil
He who doeth evil hates the light and will not come to the LIGHT lest his evil deeds be reproved
HE that doeth TRUTH cometh to the LIGHT . THE GOSPEL is the message of RECONCILATION .
AND FAITH IN JESUS CHRIST ALONE is how one be RECONCILED TO GOD , JUSTIFIED in the SIGHT OF GOD
made the RIGHTEOUSNESS OF GOD . WHO is a liar
but HE who denies JESUS IS THE CHRIST , HE is anti christ .
HE calls GOD a liar for he recieves not the TESTIMONY GOD GAVE OF HIS SON .
we can do this all day my friend . THEY ALL POINTED TO THE DIRE NECSSSITY TO BELIEVE ON JESUS THE CHRIST .
and what else did john make mention of ........
THESE things i write unto you that you may KNOW you have eternal life , that you may BELIEVE ON JESUS THE CHRIST .
WE STICKING TO THE GOSPEL my friend . FOR IT IS THE POWER OF GOD unto those who do BELIEVE .
That if you will believe from the heart that GOD has rose him from the dead
and shall confess him , YE shall BE SAVED . there is no other gospel , no other love , no other hope
no other name or means by which a man can be saved . We wont be heeding those who preach a lie .
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amigo de christo

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Exactly.. "He/they, who believes not"...

That is the person's CHOICE... and God honors your choice, now and forever.
but do beware my brethren lest there be in any of you an evil heart of unbelief in departing from the Living GOD .
time for some trivia questions my friend .
Do many come and yet endure but for a while . YES .
where they truly of us . NO for had they been they would not have left .
DID the early church remind all believers about the dire need to CONTINUE in CHRIST
and give even warnings about what occurs if one does not . YES THEY DID .
now i know without a doubt that in the end if one comes out , THEN THEY WERE NEVER OF US .
but i also know that THE APOSTELS had the spirit and that SPIRIT within them HAD THEM WARN
and to remind the believers TO CONTINUE IN CHRIST . JUST LIKE JESUS DID WHILE UPON the earth .
The question now is , DO WE TRUST in an acroynm , OR DO WE SIMPLY TRUST IN HE WHO SAVES , JESUS THE CHRIST .
cause by grace I TRUST IN HIM and HIS REMINDERS . as i do with the REMINDERS the SPIRIT gave to the apostels
to give to the church . YOU SEE , i happen to KNOW WHO CAN KEEP US FROM FALLING
and i happen to know what happens to one if they take off from heeding him . and that we DO NEED
all reminders , that we do need to behold always both the goodness and severity of GOD .
What the SPIRIT INSPIRED will always excel that which men try and inspire . and that be a fact .
Now do be encouraged . and lets give ALL reminders to the church . all , not just a few or some . ALL reminders .
 

Aunty Jane

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Yes it is...

Its this... Romans 10:13
Since Rom 10:13 is a quote from Joel 2:32 what does the original Hebrew say there….?

5 And it shall come to pass that whoever shall call in the name of the Lord shall be delivered, for on Mount Zion and in Jerusalem there shall be a deliverance, as the Lord said, and among the survivors whom the Lord invites. הוְהָיָ֗ה כֹּ֧ל אֲשֶׁר־יִקְרָ֛א בְּשֵׁ֥ם יְהֹוָ֖ה יִמָּלֵ֑ט כִּ֠י בְּהַר־צִיּ֨וֹן וּבִירֽוּשָׁלִַ֜ם תִּֽהְיֶ֣ה פְלֵיטָ֗ה כַּֽאֲשֶׁר֙ אָמַ֣ר יְהֹוָ֔ה וּבַ֨שְּׂרִידִ֔ים אֲשֶׁ֥ר יְהֹוָ֖ה קֹרֵֽא:

“The Lord” here is Yahweh ( יְהֹוָ֖ה)…..we are to call on the name of the God of Israel (mentioned twice in that verse) as Jesus did……and the name that he taught his disciples, was lost again by the infiltration of wicked men who corrupted God’s worship in the Christian arrangement, just as the Jews had done before them.

We can see in the above quotation from the Jewish Tanakh, that the Jews disobeyed God’s command to keep his name before his people in every generation, and due to their own unfounded ideas, (and with no command from Yahweh to eliminate his name from their speech) they stopped saying his name and we lost the pronunciation……and the word “Lord” (Adonai) was substituted. They did however retain God’s name in their Scripture, as we see above and in Exodus 3:13-15….

15 And God said further to Moses, "So shall you say to the children of Israel, 'The Lord God of your forefathers, the God of Abraham, the God of Isaac, and the God of Jacob, has sent me to you.' This is My name forever, and this is how I should be mentioned in every generation. טווַיֹּ֩אמֶר֩ ע֨וֹד אֱלֹהִ֜ים אֶל־משֶׁ֗ה כֹּ֣ה תֹאמַר֘ אֶל־בְּנֵ֣י יִשְׂרָאֵל֒ יְהֹוָ֞ה אֱלֹהֵ֣י אֲבֹֽתֵיכֶ֗ם אֱלֹהֵ֨י אַבְרָהָ֜ם אֱלֹהֵ֥י יִצְחָ֛ק וֵֽאלֹהֵ֥י יַֽעֲקֹ֖ב שְׁלָחַ֣נִי אֲלֵיכֶ֑ם זֶה־שְּׁמִ֣י לְעֹלָ֔ם וְזֶ֥ה זִכְרִ֖י לְדֹ֥ר דֹּֽר:

In the Greek Scriptures, the same thing happened…following Jewish tradition, they substituted “Kyrios”(Lord) not only in their speech, but also in their Scripture, and so confusion was caused in determining which “Lord” was being referred to.…..Yahweh or his son. This resulted in the use of the definite article to identify which “theos” (god) was being referenced. (In English translations the definite article is largely ignored, but it is the identifier of the Father, since Jesus is never identified by the definite article.)
Thus the nameless God of Israel and the name of the Lord Jesus was grafted over a Catholic invention and later, with the inclusion of the Holy Spirit, was maintained by all of Christendom as a “godhead”…a word and concept that does not exist in any passage of Scripture.

Jesus said his he came to make his Father’s name known to his disciples…..

John 17:6-8, 26
I have manifested Your name to the men whom You gave Me out of the world; they were Yours and You gave them to Me, and they have kept Your word. Now they have come to know that everything You have given Me is from You; for the words which You gave Me I have given to them; and they received and truly understood that I came forth from You, and they believed that You sent Me. . . . . and I have made Your name known to them, and will make it known, so that the love with which You loved Me may be in them, and I in them.” (NASB1995)

So it is not “calling on the name of Jesus” that saves anyone…..it is calling on the name of his God and Father…the one Jesus prayed to, and asked that “our Father’s” name be “hallowed” (sanctified)….a name that was lost by the Jews so that the devil could get in there and confuse the identity of “the only true God” (John 17:3) in a doctrine that should never have been taught as truth……because it never was.

As confronting as this may be to many people….it is the truth. The apostasy that caused this twisted misconception of the very nature of God was foretold, but Christendom pretends that it never happened….(Matt 13: 24-30; 36-42) If they acknowledged it, their whole belief system would collapse. The “weeds” were not planted recently….and the devil is on the warpath because he knows that his time is short….
 
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The Learner

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That is true, but we have his inspired word to give us the truth…it is the misinterpretation and mistranslation of his words that is the enemy of truth. Beliefs are read into scripture instead of scripture dictating beliefs.

In the very first instance, we need a reason why the Creator would have to become a human when it is impossible for an immortal to die. God could not offer his own immortal life for the mortal life of one of his creations. It negates the principle of redemption. The sinless, mortal life of the man Jesus had to be equivalent to the sinless, mortal life that Adam forfeited, not just for himself, but also for all his children.

Atonement is “at-one-ment”….”one for one”. Only Adam’s equal could be given in exchange for the life he lost due to his disobedience. God sent his son, because he is an immortal God and does not ever need to become a human to rescue humans from their abuse of free will. Jesus was never required to BE God in order to redeem humans….humans invented that scenario. All Jesus needed to be was “sinless”.…it’s that simple.

Before Christ’s mission, Yahweh was the only immortal in existence…..the reason being, that to give free will to an immortal is the same as allowing AI to rule the world…..if they go feral, there is no way to stop them…..it’s also the reason why there is no immortal soul….because you cannot kill them. “Souls” are entirely mortal. (Ezek 18:4) Jesus tells us that the wicked are “destroyed“ in “Gehenna” (Matt 10:28…erroneously translated as “hell”)…they are not tortured, as there is no immortal soul to suffer anything.

All of God’s children have free will and it’s the abuse of that gift that got us into this mess. God has been trying to teach us all the value of obedience, ever since….who’s got that memo to date?

No, I find the answer in other parts of the Bible….in Prov 8:30-31 we find reference to what is called “wisdom personified”. Many things are personified in the Bible, but Jesus is clearly identified as “the wisdom of God”. Scholars recognize this reference as pertaining to Jesus ….the “master workman” at his Father’s side in creation, as the agency “through whom” creation was brought about. (Col 1:15-17; John 1:2-3)

1 Cor 1:24…
”but to those who are the called, both Jews and Greeks, Christ the power of God and the wisdom of God.”
No one personified God’s wisdom like Jesus did.

Was Jesus ever called “the Creator” in any verse of the Bible? He certainly facilitated creation, but he is never called “the Creator”.

It is, when the erroneous doctrine masquerading as truth, is moved out of the way….
When you read those verses in Greek, something else emerges….

“In the beginning was the Word, (ho logos) and the Word was with God, (ho theos) and the Word was God. (theos, no definite article)
2) He was in the beginning with God.(ho theos)
3) All things came into being through Him, and without Him not even one thing came into being that has come into being.”

So twice in that passage the definite article is used with reference to Yahweh…..but not to “ho logos”.
It was “ho logos” who became flesh, not “ho theos”. (John 1:14)

And twice “the beginning” is mentioned….what is this “the beginning” of? The eternal God had no beginning….but his son did, as Rev 3:14 calls Jesus…”The Amen,the faithful and true Witness, the Beginning of the creation of God (ho theos)…..again in the Greek he is the creation of “ho theos”.
The definite article is never used with reference to Jesus.….only to “his God and Father”.
In so many instances the English translation deliberately omits the definite article because their doctrine demands it.

You see, no one can reply to those clear statements and still maintain the doctrine that is foundational to Christendom…..they know their theology, but not their Bible. The Bible answers all its own questions if you care to put in the effort to ‘find the diamond in the pile of broken glass’.
James 2:26