Behold
Well-Known Member
Are you saying that a born again believer who has Christ in them, can't be led by the Holy Spirit?
Many Are Called But Few Chosen = Matthew 22;1-10
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Are you saying that a born again believer who has Christ in them, can't be led by the Holy Spirit?
Ritajanice
Born-Again
Berean Standard Bible
Everyone the Father gives Me will come to Me, and the one who comes to Me I will never drive away.
God says everyone the Father gives me will come to Me....
I can add nothing more to his word above.
Everyone the Father gives Me will come to Me, and the one who comes to Me I will never drive away.
God says everyone the Father gives me will come to Me....
I can add nothing more to his word above.
Behold
Well-Known Member
The verses you posted say that when Christ is Lifted up, "I WILL".. .draw.
He was "lifted up" on the Cross.
So, why are you saying that this is not being said by Jesus, when the verses you posted actually say it?
Ritajanice
Born-Again
Maybe he’s not understanding the rebirth?
I’m not saying he isn’t Born Again...because as a new babe...even I didn’t know that....we all have to grow and mature in Christ to understand this Brother.
Remember we to were Babes in Christ.
Behold
Well-Known Member
Add this to them.
Jesus saId.....>He'll do the same thing..
"if i be lifted up (on the Cross) and He was, then I Will Draw everyone to myself".
Its the same..
God and Christ are 'one"
Both are the Holy Spirit.
Ritajanice
Born-Again
Because....” ALL” doesn’t mean everyone...everyone that the Father draws to the Son..then yes I agree.
Behold
Well-Known Member
Ritajanice
Born-Again
Yes...everyone that the Father gives to the Son./ draws to the Son.
| Audio Crossref Comment Greek Verse (Click for Chapter) New International Version All those the Father gives me will come to me, and whoever comes to me I will never drive away. New Living Translation However, those the Father has given me will come to me, and I will never reject them. |
Behold
Well-Known Member
So, im not certain how "ALL" can't mean "ALL".
Do you think all means, some?
It does not mean "the elect'. As the elect are not ALL.....they are just some.
Alll is everybody.
All of us.
The Cross is for everyone.. .Christ died for everyone.... = ALL.
Compare this verse to John 3:16
"For God so love the WORLD, that He GAVE JESUS"...
To the World , He loves. ... God gave Jesus.
So, "world" is "All".
Its the same.
Ritajanice
Born-Again
I will pray and ask the Holy Spirit for guidance on this....may get back to you later..God Bless my Brother who has taught me so much through the Holy Spirit....Praise God for you..in Jesus Name...Amen!!
Further study for me...the Lord needs to get my head in the right place.
Behold
Well-Known Member
Jesus is revealing that once the Cross is Raised, that ALL men/people will be called to come and Believe.
...Your verse, is Jesus speaking before He died on the Cross.
So, He was not yet Lifted up so that He could DRAW ALL to Him... yet.
See, He was not yet offered to ALL, yet.... in your verse, as He was not yet crucified for All.
Later, when Jesus was on the Cross, dying for the sin of the world..... He was offering Himself to everyone....for everyone sin..
= ALL = World.
John 3:16
2nd Corinthians 5:19
John 3:17
Behold
Well-Known Member
Save that prayer for Bright-Frame.
Truly.
He has so much Calvinism in his heart...
He needs to be delivered.
Ritajanice
Born-Again
I find this very hard to believe, why, because of my own birth, he chose me, he drew me and he birthed me, therefore I can’t receive that all will be called to believe.
For me, it’s only those he chose...and I know that will upset a lot of people....I can only believe what I’ve had relayed to my heart..the Living word of God.
Imo and belief...
We don’t and can’t choose to believe in Jesus..only if the Father draws us to the Son.
Why does he choose ?. @Behold ....he chooses for his own purpose and plan.
| Audio Crossref Comment Greek Verse (Click for Chapter) New International Version For he chose us in him before the creation of the world to be holy and blameless in his sight. In love New Living Translation Even before he made the world, God loved us and chose us in Christ to be holy and without fault in his eyes.
|
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quietthinker
Well-Known Member
I am saying we need to discern the voices. There are our own, those of others, those of the devil and those of the Spirit of God.
We discern by knowing the voice of Jesus.
Ritajanice
Born-Again
Yes...and that comes by Learning to walk in the Spirit...and listen with those spiritual ears and see with those spiritual eyes.
Behold
Well-Known Member
A person can't believe in...... what they dont know anything about.
So, if a person has never heard a word about Jesus in their life....., they can't believe in Him, as there is no way to KNOW what to believe and who to believe in....
So, when someone tells us..about Jesus......or we read about Him, or we watch a movie.....
My oldest living friend, of over 33 yrs, got saved, while watching "Jesus of Nazareth".... on TV, in 1977.
That movie is the Gospel, in video... and she was called to believe, same as you.... same as me.
There is always a "how i heard about Jesus'... "How i heard about the Cross"......moment... in our lives.
And that is what God and Christ use to open your heart.
This is why God sends preachers out into the world.
This is why God told us in Mark 16 to go and tell them....so that they can believe.
This is why Paul says.>"how can they believe, unless they are told, unless they HEAR, the Gospel".
As faith can't come without HEARING....= the story, the gospel.
"faith comes.. by HEARING"... the gospel......the truth about Christ, and the Cross.
You heard it somewhere, at some point in your life, and through that message, God dealt with you, and you took Him, and Christ.
Today, on this earth.....thousand died and went to hell who had heard the same message, ALL THEIR LIFE>.... and knew it was true long ago..., but would not believe...chose not to believe, and they also were called, drawn, led of the Holy Spirit.., as Jesus called them, being lifted up, 2000 yrs ago.
NOW they wish they had chosen Christ by Faith, when they they knew to do it, and didnt.
Too late.
Ritajanice
Born-Again
Of course...I knew all about Jesus...religious education.
Amen!.
The thing is @Behold .....no one can believe in God’s Son , not until God chooses to draw them to himself and open their heart..to believe...we believe with the heart, not the mind...so that his word penetrates their spirit.
Romans 10:10-17
King James Version
10 For with the heart man believeth unto righteousness; and with the mouth confession is made unto salvation.And yes, there is much more to it than that...God brings us to believe in Jesus, I didn’t say he believes for us, Godly sorrow, repentance, etc...
It was God who planted Jesus in my mind and I believed in him, in my heart/ spirit.....why because God opened it to hear and believe.it all came very naturally..as God had planned all this to happen from the beginning.
That’s my way of explaining it.
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Behold
Well-Known Member
The devil's voice in your head, sounds like you talking to yourself.
Temptation to LUST< is his language, that sounds like you in your head.
The Devil's temptations, .. he uses your own thoughts, to talk to you. To lead you into temptation, into some carnal deed.
Jesus, who is in the born again, speaks with revelation and discernment.... with an inner knowing, that isn't a voice.
Its a leading. Its an unction.... and he concludes it with peace.
Someone said.....>"when you feel the hornet inside, that's not God"
That's unrest.
That's anxiety.
That's not the Holy Spirit.
But i will tell you this...also.
When the Holy Spirit is leading you to talk to someone about Jesus, and their need of Salvation......you wont feel any peace.
You will feel, urgency.
That's normal.
Behold
Well-Known Member
Calvinism's teaching, is that God draws some.. who were "predestined" to be saved.
Calvin denies the ALL.... and changes the offer of Jesus to the world, into...>"The Cross is limited to the pre-destined elect"..
Jesus said, that once He is lifted up on the Cross........"i will draw All".
He didn't say....>"i will draw all, and those my Father chooses from the group, i get to keep".
"All" is John 3:16, .. .Jesus is given to the WORLD.... and "ALL who believe". Not "some who are elected".
Its "All who believe in Jesus shall be saved"... not only the some who are called to believe, shall be saved, as that is Calvinism's demonic rewrite of Salvation.
Calvin denies the ALL, Calvin denies John 3:16 and teaches that only the Elect are drawn.
Calvin is a devil, and his teaching is very cunning, because he takes one verse, and rewrites salvation with it...
He takes one other verse and tries to damn a large part of humanity, as = you are not one of the "pre-destined" to be chosen to be saved.
"you are one of the pre-destined to be chosen to burn in the lake of Fire".
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Ritajanice
Born-Again
Does he, I never said that...I said I was predestined to be birthed in the Spirit..
God said he will draw All...and gives them to the Son...Gods All that is.
The elect are drawn..do you deny this?
Online source.
The elect are chosen by the foreknowledge of God and by the sanctifying work of the Holy Spirit. All who have been chosen by God have been foreknown by Him and have been sanctified by the power of God's Spirit. The elect are known for their obedience to the commands of Jesus and their sins are covered in His blood.
Peter-1 1:2
Elect according to the foreknowledge of God the Father, through sanctification of the Spirit, unto obedience and sprinkling of the blood of Jesus Christ: Grace unto you, and peace, be multiplied.Who are the elect to you @Behold ?
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