We’re the two witnesses from the past?

[Truth7t7]

@Truth7t7

Romans 9:28

For he will finish the work, and cut it short in righteousness: because a short work will the Lord make upon the earth.

Read the verse before and after this one! Context is King!

When did God "cut it short in righteousness"?

"Will the Lord make upon the earth"

This is quoted from Isa. 28:22, reference is particularly made to the Jewish "earth" (see Isa 1:2): the common society of Israel. The whole nation would be involved; none would be excluded from the divine judgment that would occur in AD70.

I'm teaching you now 7 - I'm showing you verses which speak to Daniels prophecies which were about to take place in Israel having crucified the Lord Jesus Christ.

Its a chilling section of Romans to study 7.

F2F

Reformed Preterist Eschatology In 70AD Fulfillment Is A False Teaching, Just As Dispensationalism's Pre-Trib Rapture Is A False Teaching, Both Aren't Found In Scripture

 

[Marty fox]

No 70AD seen there, keep looking its not found

The verses you quote are a parallel reading of Matthew 24, Mark 13, Luke 21, and these verses are speaking to a future generation that will witness the future abomination, great tribulation, and Jerusalem being trodden under foot

Pretty hard to have a book written "Luke" in 80-110AD speaking about a 70AD Jerusalem

Wikipedia: Gospel Of Luke
The most probable date for its composition is around AD 80–110, and there is evidence that it was still being revised well into the 2nd century.

• Perkins, Pheme (2009) pp. 250-253. Introduction to the Synoptic Gospels. Eerdmans. ISBN 978-0-8028-6553-3.

The key to saying when these verses are in verse 44.

 

[Truth7t7]

The key to saying when these verses are in verse 44.

Your writing makes no sense, please explain?

I have shown the book of Luke was written in 80-110AD, long after Jerusalems 70AD destruction?

John mentions in Revelation 11:2 the fulfilling of the gentiles when Jerusalem is trodden under foot, this book was written in 96AD long after Jerusalems destruction?

Revelation 11:2KJV
2 But the court which is without the temple leave out, and measure it not; for it is given unto the Gentiles: and the holy city shall they tread under foot forty and two months.

 

[Earburner]

@Truth7t7

Daniel 9:26 And after the sixty-two weeks, an anointed one shall be cut off and shall have nothing. And the people of the prince who is to come shall destroy the city and the sanctuary. Its end shall come with a flood, and to the end there shall be war. Desolations are decreed.

Okay, we need to understand the timeline here! Again continous historic! Christ killed ---> Christ becomes commander & prince of Armies!

It's clear there is a change of roles from "he who is cut off having nothing", Christ being crucified, to now "the people of the Prince" who shall come.

Following the crucifixion of Jesus by "wicked hands" (Acts 2:23) it was determined that the punishment should be made against the "city and the sanctuary" (fact!) which has already been proven in previous posts. They rejected divine mercy "that they who were called to the wedding did not come!"

Such was the attitude of the Jewish nation to the first advent of Messiah the Prince. Consequently, the king (God) being wroth, sent forth "his armies" to destroy the murderers, and burn up their city.

The king was enraged. He sent his army and destroyed those murderers and burned their city. Matthew 22:7

The armies of his parable are the "people of the prince" of Daniel's prophecy: fulfilled in the Roman legions which were sent by Divine
decree in AD 67-70 to destroy Jerusalem and scatter the nation.

The Prince from Heaven led this charge!

God uses Gentile powers to discipline His chosen. Nebuchadnezzar is described as "Yahweh's servant" in Jeremiah 25:9. Cyrus, king of Persia was "His anointed" in Isa 45:1. Similarly the destruction of Jerusalem by the Romans is, from the Divine viewpoint, the coming of the Son of man" as per Matt 24:27. The Lord Jesus being the Prince; the Roman armies were "his people", and executed his will perfectly.

Hence "come shall destroy the city and the sanctuary"

Hope that helps.

F2F

I can say that I agree with 80% of your thoughts. But in Dan. 9:24-27, MOST Christians are "beating a dead horse" and have NOT hooked up with the KJV, to learn WHAT was determined in verse 24, with THAT WHICH was determined and poured upon the desolate, in the latter part of verse 38.

Of the six works of Christ in verse 24,
What was Poured upon the desolate on Pentecost was the Holy Spirit, which is the finished work of Christ, verse 24, His divine nature.
So in essence, it is NOT all historic, but more importantly, very much spiritual also!!
Again, see KJV Acts 2:17-18.

As for any other Bible rendition, other than the KJV, all SPIRITUAL application is lost in them, and have been skewed, corrupted to force the readers into interpreting Daniel 9:24-27 in the historical only.

 

[Truth7t7]

I can say that I agree with 80% of your thoughts. But in Dan. 9:24-27, MOST Christians are "beating a dead horse" and have NOT hooked up with the KJV, to learn WHAT was determined in verse 24, with THAT WHICH was determined and poured upon the desolate, in the latter part of verse 38.

Of the six works of Christ in verse 24,
What was Poured upon the desolate on Pentecost was the Holy Spirit, which is the finished work of Christ, verse 24, His divine nature.
So in essence, it is NOT all historic, but more importantly, very much spiritual also!!
Again, see KJV Acts 2:17-18.

As for any other Bible rendition, other than the KJV, all SPIRITUAL application is lost in them, and have been skewed, corrupted to force the readers into interpreting Daniel 9:24-27 in the historical only.

That to be poured upon the desolate at the consummation is God's cup of wrath as seen below

Revelation 14:10KJV
10 The same shall drink of the wine of the wrath of God, which is poured out without mixture into the cup of his indignation; and he shall be tormented with fire and brimstone in the presence of the holy angels, and in the presence of the Lamb:

Daniel 9:27KJV
27 And he shall confirm the covenant with many for one week: and in the midst of the week he shall cause the sacrifice and the oblation to cease, and for the overspreading of abominations he shall make it desolate, even until the consummation, and that determined shall be poured upon the desolate.

 

[Marty fox]

Your writing makes no sense, please explain?

I have shown the book of Luke was written in 80-110AD, long after Jerusalems 70AD destruction?

John mentions in Revelation 11:2 the fulfilling of the gentiles when Jerusalem is trodden under foot, this book was written in 96AD long after Jerusalems destruction?

Revelation 11:2KJV
2 But the court which is without the temple leave out, and measure it not; for it is given unto the Gentiles: and the holy city shall they tread under foot forty and two months.

It doesn't matter when Luke was written Luke is writing Jesus' story after the advents and I didn't mention revelation so that has no bearing on my comment

So tell me and what do you think verse 44 means? What generation didn't recognize the time of Jesus coming? What generation rejected and killed their God and their Messiah? What generation said that they have no king but Cesar?

Are you really saying that Jesus didn't prove that He was God by prophesying the destruction of the city and temple?

 

[Truth7t7]

It doesn't matter when Luke was written Luke is writing Jesus' story after the advents and I didn't mention revelation so that has no bearing on my comment

So tell me and what do you think verse 44 means? What generation didn't recognize the time of Jesus coming? What generation rejected and killed their God and their Messiah? What generation said that they have no king but Cesar?

Are you really saying that Jesus didn't prove that He was God by prophesying the destruction of the city and temple?

The verses below are speaking of the "Same Future Event" to those who will be present on earth to be eyewitnesses of the "Future" Fulfilling of the Gentiles, The Great Tribulation, and Second Coming of Jesus in the Heavens

Luke 19:44KJV
44 And shall lay thee even with the ground, and thy children within thee; and they shall not leave in thee one stone upon another; because thou knewest not the time of thy visitation.

Luke 21:22-28KJV
22 For these be the days of vengeance, that all things which are written may be fulfilled.
23 But woe unto them that are with child, and to them that give suck, in those days! for there shall be great distress in the land, and wrath upon this people.
24 And they shall fall by the edge of the sword, and shall be led away captive into all nations: and Jerusalem shall be trodden down of the Gentiles, until the times of the Gentiles be fulfilled.
25 And there shall be signs in the sun, and in the moon, and in the stars; and upon the earth distress of nations, with perplexity; the sea and the waves roaring;
26 Men's hearts failing them for fear, and for looking after those things which are coming on the earth: for the powers of heaven shall be shaken.
27 And then shall they see the Son of man coming in a cloud with power and great glory.
28 And when these things begin to come to pass, then look up, and lift up your heads; for your redemption draweth nigh.

 

[ewq1938]

Right, you mean "caught up" with the Lord.
And this is when?

At the second coming.

 

[Timtofly]

Where it states "we shall not all sleep" as to mean, not all will die in the Lord, referring to those alive at his coming.

Context: There were men among the Corinthian brethren who denied the resurrection.

22 For as in Adam all die, so also in Christ shall all be made alive.

You really need to follow Paul's thoughts in that chapter and not pluck one verse which you think supports your wrong teaching.

F2F

1 Corinthians 15:22 is not about physical death or sleep as they called it. We are born into a state of death because of Adam. We are already dead at conception. In Adam we are born dead. In Christ we are born into life.

Paul is contrasting the first birth with the second birth. The second birth is not a resurrection, it is a birth. Even in Christ, we are physically still in Adam's dead corruptible flesh. Only after we shed this flesh will the soul put on God's permanent incorruptible physical body.

They did not miss the physical resurrection, because they had not yet shed Adam's dead flesh.

 

[Timtofly]

Immortality is "put on" or "clothed"

For this corruptible must put on incorruption, and this mortal must put on immortality. 1 Corinth 15.

When something is "put on", it's given (a gift).

Christ was the firstfruits.

F2F

We put on the image of God, the spirit. We are still in death without that part of God's image.

The soul puts on a permanent incorruptible physical body. The body puts on the spirit.

 

[Timtofly]

Though the only one resurrected to eternal life. (he is the firstfruits of them that sleep)


He is the only man to have entered Heaven and likely to that way for a very long time! Earth is the reward of the Saints. Jesus is bringing the Kingdom "of" Heaven when he comes.


No they are dead asleep in the Lord awaiting the resurrection.


Raised to comfort the Lord before his great trail.

Lol The Lord wept over his dead body and he was fully dead!


That is the only true statement I could find in all of that post.


Correct - permanently dead the memory of them is forgotten - no existence whatsoever.

Every part of that person returns to dust.

F2F

No, you have the wrong view of death. Death stopped at the Cross, but the confirmation of the Covenant is still future. The whole body of Christ is currently in Paradise, serving God night and day in the temple of God. That is not a waiting future. That is reality since the Cross.

Only the dead, not part of the redeemed, will be forever dead. You are stuck in the OT, still in Abraham's bosom.

 

[Timtofly]

Still today, are not born again Christians the recipients of the finished work of Christ, that God poured out on all people, to lead them to repentance, so that they also may become "partakers of the divine nature?
Yes indeed!

Not until they are out of Adam's dead corruptible flesh, and in Paradise in God's permanent incorruptible physical body.

We have the Holy Spirit, as interest, until that day of redemption, the soul leaving Adam's dead corruptible flesh.

 

[face2face]

No, you have the wrong view of death. Death stopped at the Cross, but the confirmation of the Covenant is still future. The whole body of Christ is currently in Paradise, serving God night and day in the temple of God. That is not a waiting future. That is reality since the Cross.

Only the dead, not part of the redeemed, will be forever dead. You are stuck in the OT, still in Abraham's bosom.

Supporting quotes please.

 

[face2face]

We put on the image of God, the spirit. We are still in death without that part of God's image.

The soul puts on a permanent incorruptible physical body. The body puts on the spirit.

Again supporting quotes please.

 

[face2face]

1 Corinthians 15:22 is not about physical death or sleep as they called it.

No that's precisely what its about. I can see you hold false teaching on the Spirit and the Soul which is why you are unable to interpret 1 Corinthians 15. To help you unpack the false teaching would take considerable time and as you can see I have my hands full with Truth7t7 at them minute. Happy to help if required.
F2F

 

[face2face]

Reformed Preterist Eschatology In 70AD Fulfillment Is A False Teaching, Just As Dispensationalism's Pre-Trib Rapture Is A False Teaching, Both Aren't Found In Scripture

Bla bla bla - your same copy and paste posts that lack any and all detail.

I've asked you so many questions all of them ignored.

Why the outer court of the Temple in Rev 11:2?

Its not the Temple are you assumed!
More questions on Rev 11 are coming so if you dont start now your theology is only going to deteriorate from here on in.

F2F

 

[face2face]

No 70AD seen there, keep looking its not found

The verses you quote are a parallel reading of Matthew 24, Mark 13, Luke 21, and these verses are speaking to a future generation that will witness the future abomination, great tribulation, and Jerusalem being trodden under foot

Pretty hard to have a book written "Luke" in 80-110AD speaking about a 70AD Jerusalem

Wikipedia: Gospel Of Luke
The most probable date for its composition is around AD 80–110, and there is evidence that it was still being revised well into the 2nd century.

• Perkins, Pheme (2009) pp. 250-253. Introduction to the Synoptic Gospels. Eerdmans. ISBN 978-0-8028-6553-3.

@Marty fox it doesn't matter what you show 7 they are utterly and completely deceived, lacking all comprehension of the warnings of Christ, and the teaching of the Apostles - you will notice they ignored James 5:8 and all the references to the day of slaughter. I mean, go over all the posts with all the references and connections to the fulfillment of Deut prophecies / Daniels also, and for this person - all prophecy is jammed into 3 1/2 years - I know right, imagine that! From the Torah to Revelation its all packed neatly into 3.5 years of history.
It's an incompetence I have never seen in my time in all the forums I've contributed - staggering! Boy, when the Master comes this person will be blind sided!
F2F

 

[Truth7t7]

Bla bla bla - your same copy and paste posts that lack any and all detail.

I've asked you so many questions all of them ignored.

Why the outer court of the Temple in Rev 11:2?

Its not the Temple are you assumed!
More questions on Rev 11 are coming so if you dont start now your theology is only going to deteriorate from here on in.

F2F

I haven't restricted you from your explanation on Revelation 11:2

I have stated several times Luke 21:24 & Revelation 11:2 below will be the same future event

Luke 21:24KJV
24 And they shall fall by the edge of the sword, and shall be led away captive into all nations: and Jerusalem shall be trodden down of the Gentiles, until the times of the Gentiles be fulfilled.

Revelation 11:2KJV
2 But the court which is without the temple leave out, and measure it not; for it is given unto the Gentiles: and the holy city shall they tread under foot forty and two months.

 

[Truth7t7]

@Marty fox it doesn't matter what you show 7 they are utterly and completely deceived, lacking all comprehension of the warnings of Christ, and the teaching of the Apostles -

I say the same of those following the false teachings in reformed preterist historicism in 66-70AD fulfillment

 

[face2face]

@everyone

Do you know why 7 is unable to answer the untold questions piled on them? Because they cannot give a reason of the hope that is in them. This person is a cloud without water.

But do not measure the outer courtyard of the temple; leave it out, because it has been given to the Gentiles, and they will trample on the holy city for forty-two months.

Why is the outer court in focus in this prophecy?

When we get down to the details of the prophecy the futurist has not substance, nowhere to go but to say "its all future" therefore we do not know. It's all an unknown mystery yet to take place. It also means the Lord Jesus Christ left a message only for those proceeding the tribulation and the remaining believers over the past 2000 years are left with what? For the Futurist - left with nothing.

I know I can keep asking 7 about Rev 11:2 until we have used up every MB of data in these servers and still they wont be able to provide a Scriptural explanation to why they shouldn't measure the outer courtyard.

Disappointing.

F2F