What benefit does it produce to make Jesus God

[Peterlag]

Can't recall the verses directly. It does say that there is no one good, not one; that no one seeks after God (all who are mere humans have a sin nature; anyone who does not place God first in all they do is automatically sinful. And no human has ever done that except the sinless one, Jesus who in all moments of his life placed God first and centered his life around Him). And the Levitical sacrifices specify that the sacrifice must be a perfect one and only God can embody perfection.

You need to start interpreting the Bible as Jesus does and not look for specific verses that state exactly what you are trying to say; that is how the Devil can trip you up and can lead your mind down the path of "Well now God never actually said that, did he?" Well, yes, he did; he gave us functioning brains to interpret things objectively. Jesus explains the way to interpret the Bible when he spoke to the Sadducees about the Resurrection and to the Pharisees about what marriage is and how divorce is almost always wrong.

For the Resurrection he says that God says that He is the God of Abraham, Isaac and Jacob; therefore he is not the God of the dead because he would have said I was the God of Abraham, Isaac and Jacob, but since they're dead, well I'm not their God anymore. Because God says he is their God they must be living. Do you see how that is an objective interpretation?

When he talks about marriage, he states how God commanded that a man is to leave his parents and cleave to his wife so that they become one flesh. *Therefore* marriage must be binding and cannot be easily broken. Do you see how this is an objective interpretation and that Jesus does not take a verse that states directly what he was trying to point out (does God actually *say* anywhere in the Bible "Till death do us part?" I do not recall that).

Therefore, this is also how we are to interpret the Bible. There are *many* things not directly stated in the Bible that God is actually saying to us. We have to be able to objectively interpret it (and this is also an objective interpretation because before he says these things, Jesus says, "Have not you read?" He is implying that since we definitely have read these verses, this should be our understanding of them).

Okay let me know if you find a verse that tells us why Jesus should be God.

 

[Peterlag]

John 8
58 Jesus said to them, "Most assuredly, I say to you, before Abraham was, I AM."

It means I am now or I'm the one that counts now.

 

[Peterlag]

I will offer just one.
KJV John 3:16
16 For God so loved the world, that he gave his only begotten Son, that whosoever believeth in him should not perish, but have everlasting life.

You do realize that your above verse says begotten son... right?

 

[Johann]

See you just don't get the question. The Alpha and Omega does not tell why Jesus should be God. It simply says I am God because I'm the beginning and the end. Why do I have a car? And then you might say well, it's really there or it really has 4 tires. I'm looking for why not is the car real.

x SIMILAR TITLES
JEHOVAH JESUS
1. ALPHA AND OMEGA
Rev.21:6-7 I am Alpha and Omega. Rev.22:13,16 I am the Alpha and
Omega..
2. BEGINNING AND THE END
Rev.21:6,7 The beginning and the
end.
Rev.22:13,16 The beginning and the
end..
3. FIRST AND LAST
Is.44:6 I am the first, and I am the
last
And besides me there is God.
Rev.1:17 I am the first and the last.:
Rev 22:13
I am Alpha and Omega, the
beginning and the end, the first and
the last.
4. ALMIGHTY
Gen.17:1 I am the Almighty God.. Rev.1:8…………The Almighty
5. I AM
Ex.3:14 I am that I am. Jn.8:58 Before Abraham was, I am..
6. MIGHTY GOD
Is.10:21 The remnant shall return
even
The remnant of Jacob, unto the
Mighty God.
Is.9:6 The Mighty God
7. KING OF KINGS
1 Tim.6:15 The King of Kings; and
Lord of Lords.
Rev.19:13,16…..And hath on his
vesture
and on his thigh a name written
King of Kings and Lord of Lords
8. SHEPHERD
Ez.34:23 And I will set up one
shepherd over them, and he shall
feed them, even my servant David;
he shall feed them, and he shall be
their shepherd.
Ps.23:1 The Lord is my Shepherd, I
shall not want. .
Jn.10:11 I am the good Shepherd
S - STANDARDS OF RIGHTEOUSNESS

SIMILAR IN HOLINESS, FAITHFULNESS, WISDOM, TRUTH AND LOVE.
O - OBEISANCE AND WORSHIP
JEHOVAH JESUS
1. BENDING OF KNEES
Isa 45:22-23
22Look unto me, and be ye saved,
all the ends of the earth: for I am
God, and there is none else.
23 I have sworn by myself, the word
is gone out of my mouth in
righteousness, and shall not return,
That unto me every knee shall bow,
every tongue shall swear.
Phil 2:9-11
9Wherefore God also hath highly
exalted him, and given him a name
which is above every name:
10That at the name of Jesus every
knee should bow, of things in
heaven, and things in earth, and
things under the earth;
11And that every tongue should
confess that Jesus Christ is Lord,
to the glory of God the Father.
2. ADORATION
Rev 4:1
11Thou art worthy, O Lord, to
receive glory and honour and
power: for thou hast created all
things, and for thy pleasure they
are and were created.
Rev 5:12-13
12Saying with a loud voice,
Worthy is the Lamb that was slain
to receive power, and riches, and
wisdom, and strength, and
honour, and glory, and blessing.
13And every creature which is in
heaven, and on the earth, and
under the earth, and such as are
in the sea, and all that are in them,
heard I saying, Blessing, and
honour, and glory, and power, be
unto him that sitteth upon the
throne, and unto the Lamb for
ever and ever.
3. SERVICE
Jos.24:24 The Lord our God will we
serve, and
Him will we obey.
Col.3:24 For ye serve the Lord
Christ.
4. PROSTRATION
Gen.17:3, Deut.9:18 Rev.1:17, Rev.5:8
5. PRAYER
Ps. 65:2 1 Cor.1:2, Jn.14:14
6. CONFESSION

IKing 8:33
33When thy people Israel be
smitten down before the enemy,
because they have sinned against
thee, and shall turn again to thee,
and confess thy name, and pray,
and make supplication unto thee in
this house:
Rom 10:9
That if thou shalt confess with thy
mouth the Lord Jesus, and shalt
believe in thine heart that God
hath raised him from the dead,
thou shalt be saved.
7. THANKSGIVING
Ne.12:46,
Ps.50:14
1 Tim. 1:12
8. ANGELIC WORSHIP
Neh. 9:6 Thou preservest them all;
and the
Host of heaven worshipped thee.
Heb.1:6 And let all the angels of
God worship Him.
T – TASKS (DEEDS)
SIMILAR UNIQUE DEEDS:
JEHOVAH JESUS
1. FORGIVENESS
Jer.31:34
For I will forgive their iniquity,
And I will remember their sin no
more.
Luke 5:20 Man thy sins are
forgiven thee.
2. CREATION
Gen.1:1
In the beginning God created the
Heaven and the earth
Heb.1:10 Thou Lord in the
beginning hast laid the
foundation of the earth; and the
Heavens are the works of thine
hands.
Col. 1:16 For by Him were all
things created that are in heaven,
and that are in Earth… all things
were created by Him, and for Him
3. JUDGEMENT
Ps 96:13
Before the LORD: for he cometh, for
he cometh to judge the earth: he
shall judge the world with
righteousness, and the people with
his truth.
Jn.5:22 For the Father judgeth no
man,buthath committed all
judgement unto the Son.
4. INDWELLS BELIEVERS
2 Cor 6:16
And what agreement hath the
temple of God with idols? for ye are
Col.1:27 To whom God will make
known
what is riches of the glory of this

the temple of the living God; as
God hath said, I will dwell in them,
and walk in them; and I will be their
God, and they shall be my people.
mystery
among them Gentiles; which is
Christ
in you, the hope of glory.
Gal 2:20
I am crucified with Christ:
nevertheless I live; yet not I, but
Christ liveth in me: and the life
which I now live in the flesh I live
by the faith of the Son of God,
who loved me, and gave himself
for me.
E - ESSENTIAL ATTRIBUTES
JEHOVAH JESUS
1. OMNIPRESENT
Jer 23:24
Can any hide himself in secret places
that I shall not see him? saith the
LORD. Do not I fill heaven and earth?
saith the LORD.
Matt 18:20
For where two or three are
gathered together in my name,
there am I in the midst of them.
2. OMNIPOTENT
Rev.19:6
Alleluia: for the Lord God omnipotent
reigneth.
Mt.28:18 All power is given unto
me in heaven and on earth.
3. OMNISCIENT
Heb 4:13
Neither is there any creature that is
not manifest in his sight: but all
things are naked and opened unto
the eyes of him with whom we have
to do.
Col 2:3
In whom are hid all the treasures
of wisdom and knowledge.
4. UNCHANGING
Mal 3:6
For I am the LORD, I change not;
therefore ye sons of Jacob are not
consumed.
Heb 13:8
Jesus Christ the same yesterday,
and to day, and for ever.
5. ETERNAL/EVERLASTING
Jer.10:10
But the Lord is the true God, he is
the
Living God, and an Everlasting King
Rom.16:26 The Everlasting God.
Isa 9:6
For unto us a child is born, unto
us a son is given: and the
government shall be upon his
shoulder: and his name shall be
called Wonderful, Counsellor,

The mighty God, The everlasting
Father, The Prince of Peace.
Mark 5:2 Jn.1:1,2
6. RIGHTEOUS
Ps 7:9
Oh let the wickedness of the wicked
come to an end; but establish the
just: for the righteous God trieth the
hearts and reins.
Ps 116:5
Gracious is the LORD, and righteous;
yea, our God is merciful.
I Jn 2:1
My little children, these things
write I unto you, that ye sin not.
And if any man sin, we have an
advocate with the Father, Jesus
Christ the righteous:
2 Tim 4:8
Henceforth there is laid up for
me a crown of righteousness,
which the Lord, the righteous
judge, shall give me at that day:
and not to me only, but unto all
them also that love his
appearing.
S - SUBSTANCE
SCRIPTURAL CLAIMS THAT HE IS THE SAME SUBSTANCE/ESSENCE AS THE
FATHER
Heb.1:3 Brightness of his glory and the express image of His person.
Col.1:15 Image of the invisible God.
2.Cor.4:4 Image of God.
Phil.2:6 Form of God
Col.2:9 In Him dwelleth the fullness of the Godhead bodily.
Jn.5:18 Said that God was His Father, making himslef equal with God. (Jesus
is the same substance as the Father)

 

[Peterlag]

Luke 1:46-47
[46]And Mary said, My soul doth magnify the Lord,
[47]And my spirit hath rejoiced in God my Saviour.

Was this before Jesus was born?

 

[Matthias]

@Peterlag

“A human person cannot have done what Jesus of Nazareth did. Only God himself could do that.”

Anonymous

 

[Ronald David Bruno]

No not pre-existance nor does it answer the question as to why should Jesus be God.

I'll just stop trying to convince you, no sense, it's a exercise in futility. Happy trails.

 

[TLHKAJ]

I'll just stop trying to convince you, no sense, it's a exercise in futility. Happy trails.

What's sad is that these people are willfully rejecting the true Jesus Christ of the Bible.

 

[Brakelite]

You do realize that your above verse says begotten son... right?

Of course. Only begotten even. Unique and only SON. That Son came from heaven and became a man in order to die.
Seeing He is the only unique natural born begotten Son of God, what does that make Jesuso if not God? Did God beget a reptile? A flower? An angel? A cow,? Of course not. So what did God beget if not God?

 

[1stCenturyLady]

@Peterlag

I've come late to the party! I really don't know what has been said so far, so I'll just tell you what I've come to believe. Growing up I didn't believe that Jesus was STILL God, but that He once was. That is what I was taught in the SDA denomination 60 years ago. I left it in 1970. I can still remember being shocked to read in Titus that Jesus is still God! I even wrote it on the side of the page.

Titus 1:1-3
Paul, a bondservant of God and an apostle of Jesus Christ, according to the faith of God’s elect and the acknowledgment of the truth which accords with godliness, 2 in hope of eternal life which God, who cannot lie, promised before time began, 3 but has in due time manifested His word through preaching, which was committed to me according to the commandment of God our Savior;

Titus 2:13-14 (this is the verse that I wrote "Jesus is God!" next to).
13 looking for the blessed hope and glorious appearing of our great God and Savior Jesus Christ, 14 who gave Himself for us, that He might redeem us from every lawless deed and purify for Himself His own special people, zealous for good works.

(The Father and Spirit are invisible as all spirit is, so only Jesus can "appear")

Without Jesus being God then it wouldn't mean anything supernatural for us to be born again and have a divine nature free from sin. 2 Peter 1:2-11.

Of course Mary was human and had a sin nature. BUT Jesus was conceived with the seed of God! So in modern terms he was a hybrid, both man and God. And 1 John 3:9 shows us that we humans can also be born again with the same seed of God. That is why it is important that Jesus is God so we can become ONE with God. Read John 17.

In the end when all that is in heaven are those saved being born again and the righteous angels - heaven will be a sinless place, and no more sacrifices will ever be needed again to again cleanse anyone or anything (angels included) from sin. The fallen angels that sinned will never be there again.

Revelation 22:11

 

[amigo de christo]

I concur, few, chosen, remnant, elect is a deathblow to "all inclusive path"
And the Admin is not doing his/her job, everything is spiraling downwards at a tremendous pace, and this door of utterance is closing fast.
Guess we might "include" all foreign religions in the name of "love"

I say in LOVE preach CHRIST to them all . cause no other path or religoin can save .

 

[Enoch111]

What's sad is that these people are willfully rejecting the true Jesus Christ of the Bible.

And there are very serious consequences. The Bible says that the wrath of God abides on those who do not believe.

 

[Mr E]

Who FATHERED JESUS . Joseph didnt . can any other prophet in any age claim such a thing .
Exactly . THE WORD oF GOD and GOD IS HIS WORD truly did become flesh for our sake .
I challenge any and all to review the pages of the bible and WHO has heard of such a thing
Not moses nor any other prophet can make such a claim as though they had no earthly father .
The first adam was created by GOD and was formed of the dirt
but the second adam was neither fathered by man nor formed of dirt , HE WAS since the beginning .
GLORY HALLELUJAH to the LORD OUR GOD . What other prophet , INCLUDING JOHN the baptist his very self
can make such a claim as though they had no earthly father in the act of procreation . LOOK HARD AND LOOK LONG .
But then this is why JOHN himself , WHO JESUS had said was the greatest of all prophets , Said I CANNOT EVEN BEGIN ]
to try and TAKE THE SHOE OF HIM . Too many folks are falling for a ruse . YOU DO REALIZE
that in order to get the religions to join as one they have to break down and eradicate the diety of Christ .
I MEAN IF JESUS TRULY IS THE WORD OF GOD AND GOD HIS WORD . THEN how can other religions ever make a claim
their way is also a way to GOD . WHEN JESUS HIMSELF SAID , ON NO IT AINT .
THEY have to Make JESUS as just a man , just a way and not the ONLY WAY TO GOD .
As for me , I STICK TO THE BIBLE and the biblical JESUS .
IF even an holy angel told john not to bow before it , not to worship it , BUT RATHER WORSHIP ONLY GOD .
Notice it says WORSHIP GOD . AND YET when folks are throwing crowns before JESUS
WHEN even john fell before the feet OF JESUS , NOTICE LONG AND HARD , JESUS DIDNT SEEM TO SAY
get up john and worship only GOD . NOR did JESUS correct the apostel called thomas who even said
Not only MY LORD BUT ALSO MY GOD . FOLKS stop selling out to the lies of men . STOP grabbing hold of the agenda .
AND START LEARNING THE BIBLE FOR YOURSELVES . CAUSE MANY AINT GONNA MAKE IT .

Tell me-- what is a greater miracle? For an old barren woman like Sarai (Abraham's wife) or Elizabeth (Zechariah's wife) to become pregnant, or for a young girl to become pregnant? Young girls (even virgins) get pregnant seemingly by smiling while old woman who are well beyond child-bearing and no longer ovulating some would say-- cannot ever get pregnant. So miracles notwithstanding the former is a greater miracle than the latter example. But God specializes in miracles. Nothing is outside of His capability if it is within His will, so I will stipulate that much. Could he miraculously make a virgin pregnant without the participation of a man? I suppose He could, but that's not how biology works. God doesn't violate His own laws of nature. So to think otherwise is actually selling Him short. It's saying He could not do something other than what you believe He must have done based upon your own limited understanding of scripture, of human history and foremost-- of biology.

If you'd like to start a separate thread on the subject I'd be happy to chime in. To do so here might take the discussion far afield, but there actually is good evidence and solid logic that can be examined and employed to what otherwise is a bit of a conundrum. A mystery and a puzzle.

 

[Blue Dragonfly's]

Let us know when you find a verse that explicitly states Jesus was not God.

Okay let me know if you find a verse that tells us why Jesus should be God.

 

[Mr E]

Says a new ager to another new ager .
some folks on this site dont even believe its necessary to have to believe in JESUS to be saved .
They follow new age , and teachings of its princess orpah wimphrey . As though JESUS has to learn how to become GOD
and worse i bet some of them think we are able to become God . scary stuff eh .
I bet some of us on this site follow the all inclusive path . You know the one that says other religoins
other paths and etc FIND their way to GOD TOO by their lovey lovey and good works .
CORRECTION TIME . IF even cornelious who actually worshipped the GOD of the JEWS
and did many good works , many prayers , any alms to GOD ,
IF even HE who had all his good works and prayers brought up as a memorial before GOD
had to hear the gospel and BELIEVE in order to be saved , I GOT NEWS , EVERYONE DOES .
I will be as a pit bull half starved upon a piece of delicate meat against all false doctrine .
EITHER WE TRULY from the heart believe the one true gospel , and teach that and allow no other false hope ,
OR WAIL on the DAY OF JESUS . At least i tried to warn the peoples .

That's a pathetic attempt. Would you call it guilt by association? I know @MatthewG from his postings at another site and I've continually encouraged him to keep studying, and to keep asking questions. What have you encouraged him to do?

As far as I know he's an earnest young man, even tempered, slow to anger and eager to study the scriptures while letting the Holy Spirit direct his path. Your accusations are hollow at best, perhaps even dishonest as you don't know a thing about me and my relationship with Oprah-- or Orpah as you call her lol... So calm down "amigo."

 

[Mr E]

God communicated HIS FINAL MESSAGE BY THE SON . LETS TRY and REMEMBER That lest men lead us astray .
THUS IF JESUS taught it , said it BELEIVE IT

His son told us to wait on the spirit of truth- that he would ask the Father to send as a helper... to live "in" his followers.

“I will ask the Father, and He will give you another helper, that he may be with you forever; that is the Spirit of truth, whom the world cannot receive, because it does not see Him or know Him, but you know Him because He abides with you and will be in you."

“But when he, the Spirit of truth, comes, He will guide you into all the truth; for he will not speak on his own initiative, but whatever he hears, he will speak; and he will disclose to you what is to come. He will glorify me, for me will take of mine and will disclose it to you. All things that the Father has are mine; therefore I said that he takes of mine and will disclose it to you."

 

[Mr E]

Let us know when you find a verse that explicitly states Jesus was not God.

I'll offer you two or three, and wait for you to reconcile them for us...

Let no one say when he is tempted, “I am being tempted by God”; for God cannot be tempted by evil, and He Himself does not tempt anyone. But each one is tempted when he is carried away and enticed by his own lust. (James 1:13)

Then Jesus was led up by the Spirit into the wilderness to be tempted by the devil. (Matt 4:1)

For we do not have a high priest who cannot sympathize with our weaknesses, but one who has been tempted in all things as we are, yet without sin. (Hebrews 4:15)

 

[Blue Dragonfly's]

His son told us to wait on the spirit of truth- that he would ask the Father to send as a helper... to live "in" his followers.

“I will ask the Father, and He will give you another helper, that he may be with you forever; that is the Spirit of truth, whom the world cannot receive, because it does not see Him or know Him, but you know Him because He abides with you and will be in you."

“But when he, the Spirit of truth, comes, He will guide you into all the truth; for he will not speak on his own initiative, but whatever he hears, he will speak; and he will disclose to you what is to come. He will glorify me, for me will take of mine and will disclose it to you. All things that the Father has are mine; therefore I said that he takes of mine and will disclose it to you."

1John 5

 

[Mr E]

@Peterlag

“A human person cannot have done what Jesus of Nazareth did. Only God himself could do that.”

Anonymous

Matt-- what specifically do you think the quote refers to? What is it that Jesus (a human person) did that only God himself could do? I'm trying to think of something..... everything that comes to mind-- miracles for example, God did. Jesus was just the conduit. No?

 

[Blue Dragonfly's]

I'll offer you two or three, and wait for you to reconcile them for us...

Let no one say when he is tempted, “I am being tempted by God”; for God cannot be tempted by evil, and He Himself does not tempt anyone. But each one is tempted when he is carried away and enticed by his own lust. (James 1:13)

Then Jesus was led up by the Spirit into the wilderness to be tempted by the devil. (Matt 4:1)

For we do not have a high priest who cannot sympathize with our weaknesses, but one who has been tempted in all things as we are, yet without sin. (Hebrews 4:15)

''Us''?
No, those are not verses that explicitly state Jesus was not God.

Explicitly - Adverb, in a way that is clearly expressed, demonstrated, or formulated: